Talk:Kara Thrace/Archive 1

As far as you actually see in the episode 'The Farm' there is only one new abdominal scar on Starbuck. This would suggest that only one of her ovaries has been removed, not two. The podcast may have more precise information, however.

The phrase "CAG Second in Command" is a kind of awkward consturction. Can anybody think of a better way to describe her role? Rocky8311 21:41, October 16, 2005 (EDT)

I don't believe that she actually has a title. She's an instructor and Viper pilot... and a crack shot with a sniper rifle. (How she got that talent is likely a subject of interest...) -- Joe Beaudoin 23:18, 16 October 2005 (EDT)

I agree on all counts. The thing is that we know she's understood to be in charge whenever Apollo is indisposed, but CAG Second in Command just doesn't sound quite right. I just don't know what would sound better Rocky8311 23:27, October 16, 2005 (EDT)

Senior pilot after Capt. Lee Adama? --Peter Farago 23:35, 16 October 2005 (EDT)

Vice-CAG? Philwelch 15:45, 8 December 2005 (EST)

Military wise, she would be the Air Group Executive Officer were she second in command of the pilots. Joemc72 17:34, 18 January 2006 (EST)

Verb Tense for Zak Stuff

I reviewed the standards and conventions page, and it seems like the Zak Adama stuff really deserved the past tense since it occured "prior to the Mini-Series". The example in the second paragraph references Zak's funeral, which seems to be a pretty fitting example to apply here. So does all the pre-mini-series go to past tense, or are we going to 100% present tense (in which case we'd probably need to change the standards and conventions page). --Steelviper 17:28, 18 January 2006 (EST)

We can change the standards if we want (I mean--wewrote tham, after all), but I think it makes sense... As I was editing that, I was already getting confused about tenses and such, and I only really touched the one paragraph. Joemc72 and I already sorted it out on my Talk page. --Day 17:31, 18 January 2006 (EST)

I went ahead and reverted it back. Joemc72 17:32, 18 January 2006 (EST)

SV is correct. Events from the miniseries on are present tense unless confusing. Flashbacks of events prior to miniseries and regular series should be worked as past tense. --Spencerian 09:10, 3 February 2006 (EST)

Paging Dr. Freud

In the miniseries, Thrace doesn't tell Adama she doesn't have a big enough dipstick for his job, but that she's not a big enough dipstick. It's one line, but this is an unintentionally funny rendering of the quote... if you consider all the folks who were against Starbuck being a girl... Below 16:20, 2 February 2006 (EST)

Thrace has authority issues when crossed, yes. Not as cavalier about it as the original Starbuck, but then, this is a darker world. When compelled to, however, Thrace can obviously manage the work, even excel. She's still second CAG, now that Adama has returned to that status, and can effectively lead an attack as CAGs do, title or no. Thrace does have the "dipstick"; but she HATES having to deal with mentalities like Tigh. But she hates being out of the pilot's seat more, which gives her a greater sense of control than anything. I'd have Thrace plan any attack, anytime. And, in keeping with the dipstick metaphor, you can always expect her to be on top in almost anything she does. --Spencerian 09:08, 3 February 2006 (EST)

Grin. I was thinking that an additional dimension to her authority issues was seen in the last few episodes. I think it would be interesting to integrate into this article if possible, but tonight's episode might have some more to say first. We know she had an abusive mother who served in the military, and identifies with her father. The Admiral is a positive father figure to her, but she's disgusted by Tigh, especially his drinking. (Was alcohol her mother's personal tinderbox?) Enter Cain. On the one hand, Cain identifies with Thrace and gives her positive reinforcement: eg Do you always get what you want, I usually do. In my viewing, Sackhoff plays it as being both nervous and touched by Cain's approval. (Her mother had said she'd never account to anything: here's a much higher ranking woman claiming that she's capable of greatness.) Pretty clear that Cain wants to mentor Thrace, and sees a "younger self" in the pilot. At the same time, it's not a stretch to parallel the violent, volatile Cain with Thrace's absent, abusive mother. (Michelle Forbes would be a really interesting Medea.) So Kara is being asked to choose between father figure Adama and mother figure Cain, and shooting Cain may feel like a kind of matricide. Usually when TV shows or movies set up a young character against "two parents," one good, one bad, it's a young man torn between two fathers or father figures (witness "A Bronx Tale," "Platoon," "Star Wars", many others), so it's interesting to see that dynamic with a young woman. One more reason I love watching this show. Below 11:18, 3 February 2006 (EST)

Oh yes; for the past few weeks I've been repeatedly asking on the official site's RDM blog thread if they intentionally wrote it that Starbuck was won over by Cain because it was like her mother giving her the recognition that she never got. Of course, I ask a lot of things there....(I was annoyed when in his recent blog update yesterday A) people sometimes ask questions he's already answered many months ago (like, "Where is Boxey" and "Why don't we see the engine room?"), so B) he didn't realize this (I don't blame him, he's got a lot of work to do) so he wasted a blog entry answering questions that were already answered....except one, btw; apparently, the Presidential election is coming up soon. Probably not by the season 2 finale, obviously, but I got the impression he's playing around with script stuff for it now, and who knows? It might be the season 3 cliffhanger...or at most the season 3 finale. This, of course, would prove that they have indeed jumped several months ahead (once again, how could 2 months pass during Flight of the Phoenix?...but I digress....). --Ricimer 11:46, 3 February 2006 (EST)

How, you ask? Easily. See, all that we saw on the show was actually in fast forward... See, for that month, Bill had decided that everyone was to do everything at one sixth of normal speed... Thus, all that took two months. I thought that was obvious. *wink* --Day 03:01, 4 February 2006 (EST)

Scar

What's with the "Kara is CAG in Scar" business? It looked like Apollo was still in charge to me. --Redwall 00:27, 4 February 2006 (EST)

Kara was responsible for briefings and I'm pretty sure I heard her referred to as CAG a few times in the episode. --Ltcrashdown 00:29, 4 February 2006 (EST)

Negative, Lieutenant. Kat said to Kara, "The CAG wants us spread out so we can cover more ground. It's right here in the briefings." I'm pretty sure that's accurate, anyway. Someone check me. Anyway, I thought it was clear she was talking about Lee. Now... Why was she doing all the briefings? I have no idea... I thought for a bit that maybe Lee was on Pegasus doing some kind of fleet-wide-CAG duties, but Peggie was off protecting the Fleet, so he'd probably not be jumping back and forth to almost have sex with Kara and all that. --Day 02:56, 4 February 2006 (EST)

Because Lee has seniority over Kara (both are Captains, but he's been one longer, etc) he is in charge of their whole widescale operation. I mean, the guy can't be awake 24 horus a day and be everywhere at once. He needs to delegate duties now and again like this. --Ricimer 02:59, 4 February 2006 (EST)

Serial Number

It's partially visible on the dogtag she gave Anders in "Downloaded": ?? 462753 - the two question marks would be letters, and I think the second one is a T, but Lucy Lawless's hand is covering the first. --Peter Farago 14:30, 26 February 2006 (EST)

I found that Galacticastation has a great screencape here of her ID tag. Can you guys tell what it is? It's not a T, it's....I can't tell if it says "ser" for "service number" (thus, not actually part of of the number), or "3er"...which seems odd as this is lowercase.--The Merovingian ^{(C - E)} 19:03, 21 June 2006 (CDT)

My first impression is that it is "ser" for serial or service number for the reason it is not together with the number. --FrankieG 19:36, 21 June 2006 (CDT)

Yeah, but Helo has a "PK" prefix to his serial number and Boomer had a "T" prefix. --The Merovingian ^{(C - E)} 20:07, 21 June 2006 (CDT)

Just a note, in "Collaborators" we see the full shot on her id tags during her conversation with Anders. It is prefixed by "ser" (sans quotes). If anyone can get a screencap to confirm, that'd be nice. -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate} 12:32, 3 November 2006 (EST)

It says "ser 462753". Screencap here: [1] --Serenity 12:40, 3 November 2006 (EST)

Thought so. Thanks Serenity. -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate} 12:45, 3 November 2006 (EST)

Major Pre-Season 3 Revision

As with the central characters William Adama, Laura Roslin, and Gaius Baltar, I've heavily concised this article, removing extraneous episode information, to prepare it for season 3 information. --Spencerian 11:37, 4 October 2006 (CDT)

I suggest marking this article for cleanup and revision. Kara's biography is still a bit too long and quite messy - it's actually one big unclear stream of facts. I think it should be divided into a few parts, significant and dividing episodes being "Kobol's Last Gleaming", "Home", "Lay Down Your Burdens" and "Collaborators". -- Spike 03:42, 3 November 2006 (EST)

I agree to the cleanup and revision of this article, particularly the content added since season 3, as it is inconsistently written. (I've tried to clean it up, but a rewrite is in order for tone issues.) -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate} 12:29, 3 November 2006 (EST)

Socrata Thrace?

I've removed this reference because the reference was far too vague; the reference pertains to Thrace's mother, "Socrata".

Socrata (revealed in TV Guide Magazine)

If anyone can be specific as to the reference, including but not limited to page number, issue number, publication date, et al, please feel free to add it back in. -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate} 19:49, 19 October 2006 (CDT)

Done and done. I refrained from the context, though, because what little there is I fear maybe spoilery. --Mars 07:34, 11 December 2006 (CST)

Kara Thrace DEAD?

Now I'm disappointed in Battlestar Galactica. Starbuck was killed off Sunday night or at least we are led to believe she is dead. I like to think there is more to this than what was shown.--Avazina 20:21, 6 March 2007 (CST)

She is definitely dead, but that means nothing in fiction. You're probably right. Don't feel too disappointed; the classical heroes of Greek mythology suffered and died often to fulfill their missions. We're very used to our western heroes always riding off into the sunset to fight another day. Some day the sun will no longer rise. There was a bit in the episode that suggests that Kara is visiting the space between life and death; we'll see. --Spencerian 20:47, 6 March 2007 (CST)

Don't worry, she's merely ascended to another plane of existence. She'll be back next season as an Ancient. I mean, Final Five. Wow, deja vu Atlantis. --David Templar 12:49, 7 March 2007 (CST)

There's two reasons I'm not accepting her as dead. First, there was heavy foreshadowing in Rapture and Maelstrom hinting that she may be a Cylon. Second, she did not die the way the hero with an important destiny is supposed to. If she died in Resurrection Ship, Scar or The Passage I'd accept it. If she got captured by the Cylons and died trying to escape I'd accept it. If she got captured by the Cylons, decided she had no hope of escape or rescue and killed herself in a final act of defiance against Leoben I'd accept it. I won't accept this until the final five are revealed. -- Gordon Ecker 17:19, 7 March 2007 (CST)

I stand by my idea that she'll be the first of the RDM series' Beings of Light. --BklynBruzer 11:27, 8 March 2007 (CST)

Didn't she say something like episodes 13 and 19 will be very important for her character? --Mercifull ^{(Talk/Contribs)} 12:53, 8 March 2007 (CST)

Eick said that 16 (Maelstrom) and 19 (Crossroads Pt. II) will have a lot of revelations on Lee and Kara's romance. --BklynBruzer 14:50, 8 March 2007 (CST)

I think that Starbuck will be back, but not Katee Sackhoff. --FrankieG 15:19, 8 March 2007 (CST)

Interesting idea... how do you think they'd implement it? (If it were to happen, that is.) --BklynBruzer 15:25, 8 March 2007 (CST)

I think the two most likely possibilities are that Lee or Anders finds a note or letter among Kara's belongings, or that Kara is revealed to be a Cylon. I don't think they'll recast her because it's a tacky and overused soap opera and pulp sci-fi cliche. -- Gordon Ecker 02:00, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

Kara cant be a cylon because she was a child and Cylons do not make copies of already or once living people. --Mercifull ^{(Talk/Contribs)} 06:54, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

Kara remembers being a child. Baltar remembers being a child too, that doesn't disqualify him, and Boomer also probably has false childhood memories. And Socrata could be another Cylon, or a hallucination, there's no proof that anyone other than Kara saw her. I'm not saying she's a Cylon, I'm just saying that the possibility hasn't been eliminated. -- Gordon Ecker 20:46, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

AFAIK, Socrata served in the 1st war. --BklynBruzer 21:52, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

Yes, Socrata served in the first war. -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate} 22:22, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

According to Kara's own memories her mother was a veteran of the first war, I'm not aware of any third-party corroboration, and it's an established fact that Cylon sleeper agents have false memories. -- Gordon Ecker 00:38, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

Socrata received some kind of medal for service in the war. --BklynBruzer 05:59, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

And Boomer received elephant sculptures from her parents when she went to Fleet Academy. --Catrope^{(Talk to me or e-mail me)} 06:50, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

There's a difference. There must be records in military archives of Socrata's medal (If any archives still exist, that is). Records that date back to the first war. The Cylons weren't infiltrating then. --BklynBruzer 08:51, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

Who saw or heard of Socrata and had both the motivation and the opportunity to check the military records? We know that Boomer managed to get past any background checks and identity verification the colonial military may have used. We also know that colonial computer security was extremely lax during the fall of the twelve colonies. -- Gordon Ecker 19:06, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

One possibility is that Thrace (in a past life as the Lord of Kobol, Aurora) helped build the Temple of Five, knew what the Earth hologram was in "Home, Part II" because she experienced it before, and that, while we may not see her again, bodily, Thrace will be the guiding force (through artifacts and other finds) that will be reflected in not-too-subtle messages on the path, leaving clues as to the clue's author (Thrace). Perhaps Kara Thrace, not Laura Roslin, is the "dying leader" in the Pythian Prophecy. Just a wild speculation, but it fits with some clues, particularly the Eye. --Spencerian 07:40, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

I still think Starbuck is the first of the RDM Beings of Light. --BklynBruzer 06:01, 14 March 2007 (CDT)

---Bruzer you know part of my theory but for everyone here I'll post it as well. I personaly belive it will come down to Starbuck being a "Jesus" figure from a Lord of Kobol I'm not 100% sure how the writers will make this happen but I think what we saw in that ep was her basically going to meet "daddy". The speculation about her being one of the final 5 isn't true, she is meant for much more then that. I also think in addition to the final 5 we will see the Lords of Kobol on Sunday, this will be the biggest shock of the year as well. You know how the writers like to take us, make us expect to be surprised one way but shock us with something new in the finales. We may even see Baltar be found not guilty, on a side note I think he's the same as Starbuck here but his "daddy" is who I will call Hades, the Fallen Lord who became the Cylon god. --Hentai Jeff 05:49, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

The Destiny

Not wanting to separate this into its own article, and knowing that this article may not grow for a while (if ever), I added some sourced speculation on Thrace's destiny based on series information in an attempt to tie it together. Hopefully it may enlighten some readers as to the sum data on what is known and lead some insight for the character's actions in the future (if any). Ron Moore does note that the character's "destiny" was not merely to die in a Viper, so this likelihood of something about the character being revealed in season 4 is a probability. --Spencerian 15:37, 16 March 2007 (CDT)

As I have said. BEING. OF. FRAKKING. LIGHT. --BklynBruzer 20:57, 16 March 2007 (CDT)