Talk:Stallion/Archive 1

Origin

Sometimes I just read the transcripts and find stuff that none of us had associated before. Same was true for the Case Orange article. I would make an interesting detective where it not for (1) the fact that the name "Spencer" (in a version) is already taken as a cool P.I. name, (2) my own impatience would likely end up creating more murders than I would solve. --Spencerian 16:03, 8 February 2006 (EST)

I'm no gun expert, but does anyone else think this looks exactly like the four barreled handgun that Persephone (mmmmmm...) blew away Cain with (using a silver bullet) in The Matrix: Reloaded?--The Merovingian 16:49, 8 February 2006 (EST)

Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner! Good call, Merovingian. --Steelviper 16:57, 8 February 2006 (EST)

Damn. I think you're right, if memory recalls. Excellent eye, Merv. :) --Spencerian 16:58, 8 February 2006 (EST)

Am I the only one who finds the weapon choices/sanskrit soundtracks/etc. of "The Matrix" to be completely irrelevant to the Battlestar Wiki? In this case, I'm sure there are many other films which use the same gun. --April Arcus 17:24, 8 February 2006 (EST)

"Am I the only one..." No, you're not. But I must admit to something of a bias here: I absolutely hate Reloaded. Enough that I still refuse to see Revolutions. --Redwall 18:32, 8 February 2006 (EST)

Farago, it's a good Trivia note. That's why this information is put in a "notes" section of the article. We have already established this. That said, I liked Matrix Reloaded. I heard all of the buzz beforehand of "Matrix Reloaded stinks!", but I watched it and went, "yeah, one or two things weren't that good (obvious CGI, etc) but it was actually pretty good (the highway fight, etc)". Everyone always says "Reloaded was bad!" as kind of a knee-jerk reaction. Revolutions, on the other hand, had a lot of problems with it. My biggest problem with it was the last Oracle/Neo scene where Neo asks all of the big questions we've had in the audience (why am I here? How did I get Real WOrld powers?) etc. And all she basically says is "because you are the one". The Trinity death scene was also really lousy. Mind you, I can understand killing her off (so Neo will be ready to sacrfifice himself completly), but the execution of the scene was pretty bad. --The Merovingian 23:29, 8 February 2006 (EST)

There are some parallels in Battlestar and notable cross-references to other shows. I fail to completely see why "Matrix" related stuff gets some people in a bind. I don't have an issue when Star Trek is brought up (which, with maybe the exception of the Borg and RDM, has very little comparison to much in BSG). The man-machine theme is a strong motif in SF and has made a LOT of money. What references to non-Star Trek shows hasn't been overdone here or any other page. I don't believe I or Merv have "gone crazy" in noting such connections where they are appropriate, and explaining why they are. I found the Blade Runner connection (suitable for two reasons: the gun and Olmos). The Matrix connection was a tagalong but also had relevance. The sanskit references (off-topic here) are in the right place in the appropriate TC article, but it seems that any trivial connection in this wiki to the Matrix saga (unlike similar connections to "Firefly", "Silent Running," "Blakes 7", "The Prisoner," "Star Trek," "Star Wars", et al) seems poo-pooed without cause. As a wikipedian, we should care more for accuracy and breadth than personal taste. As you might have guessed, I'm a bit annoyed about this each time it comes up. It's not like there's an entire page here trying vainly and ridiculously to compare and contrast BSG to this (or any other show or series) other than TOS. But we're SF people. The show's producers like to play with SF connections. We should be no different here as long the item is relevant, short, and specific. --Spencerian 10:50, 9 February 2006 (EST)

Firstly "Star Trek", "Good vs. Evil" and "Carnivale" are in a unique position, since they are all shows Moore has worked on prior to creating the new BSG. Likewise, the doctrine and practice of the Church of Latter-Day Saints is relevant to Glen Larson in a way that the Catholic church is patently not; Silent Running is relevant to John Dykstra; Firefly is relevant to Zoic; and Blade Runner is relevant to Edward James Olmos.

Secondly, many of the seeming extraneous references to other movies and shows ("is 'number six' a Prisoner reference?" for example) are informed speculation, whereas the notes on this article are mere coincidences, and not very interesting ones at that.

It's true that I have no great love for The Matrix series, and that I may react more strongly to it than I would to another reference, but in principle I think we should have a better reason for noting coincidences such as this than we do here. If, for example, EJO's character in Blade Runner were threatened or shot with one of these guns, just as he later was in BSG, that would be amusing enough to note, but if the only connection is that one of his co-stars employed the weapon, then it's not worth commenting on. --April Arcus 11:35, 9 February 2006 (EST)

Like Wikipedia, what's the harm in more trivia? It's not totally irrelevant: it's cinematic trivia, etc. and I think our current model is working just fine. That said, I have the Official Companion and it actually confirms that Number Six is an homage to the Prisoner. I forgot to put that up.--The Merovingian 14:01, 9 February 2006 (EST)