Toggle menu
Toggle preferences menu
Toggle personal menu
Not logged in
Your IP address will be publicly visible if you make any edits.

Talk:Humanoid Cylon/Archive4: Difference between revisions

Discussion page of Humanoid Cylon/Archive4
Latest comment: 13 years ago by Joe Beaudoin Jr. in topic Zoe
Serenity (talk | contribs)
Joe Beaudoin Jr. (talk | contribs)
m Text replacement - "Peter Farago" to "April Arcus"
 
(31 intermediate revisions by 17 users not shown)
Line 7: Line 7:
{{ArchiveTOC}}
{{ArchiveTOC}}


== Number of Cylons ==
== The Final Cylon, Conception and Prophecy ==


Sorry if this is already in the article (I couldn't see a reference to it) but I think there are an equal number of each Cylon model.
:"The missing 3 will give you the five who come from the home of the thirteenth"


Spoilers for season 4, episode 2 follow:
The human/cylon child hera obviously has a central role in the series. This is evidenced by her prescence in the opera house, 6 and baltar's delusion that the child is theirs, and the desire of both the human's and the cylons to retain possession of the child. Ill avoid discussing the the childs intended representation as the next evolutionary step in mankinds developement in order to emphasize a few overlooked facts. Conception has eluded the cylons until hera's birth. They can build machines, but they cannot create life. This leaves them unable to fufill the Cylon God's law to be fruitfull and multiply, i.e. procreate. If they cannot concieve they remain outside their god's will.


Since there is a deadlock with the vote between the 7 Cylon models, we can infer that there are as many Ones, Fours, and Fives as there are Twos, Sixes, and Eights.  
::A.  HERA - is the product of a female cylon (sharon) and a male human (helo) thus estalishing that conception is possiblewith a couple composed of these constituient parts.
::B. NICK- is the product of a male cylon (tyrol) and a female human (cally) validating this type of conception is possible.
::C.  BABY6 - is the product of a male cylon and a female cylon the last remaining combination and supposedly not possible. (is it tighs love for ellen  a human that enables this conception ?)


Either there are an equal number of the pro/anti-lobotomy Cylons models _just_ on the baseships concerned with the Raiders (since it would be unlikely for _all_ the Cylons to vote, but this implies that there is a 'rule' against, say, a Six trying to find an equivalent to Boomer on another baseship), or _all_ Cylons voted and there are an equal number the pro/anti models.
However, back to the puzzle the missing 3 (Hera , Nick, Baby6) are 3 misssing babies will give you the five; so there must be a relationship here to the final five


I think it's safe to infer that if there are equal numbers of pro/anti models, then there are equal numbers of each Cylon model on each baseship (this implies you can't have 'outside' voters), though I don't think it too much of a stretch to say there are an equal number of Cylon models.
TIGH....parent
[[User:FredTheDeadHead|FredTheDeadHead]] 10:58, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
TYROL......parent
:That's not how the voting process works. First they vote within their models to determine the total vote for one model, then that vote is tallied with the votes of the other models. It's not that each individual ''copy'' has one vote towards the end result, but only towards the ''model''. The copies can only influence how their model votes in the final vote. Sort of like the US electoral college. -- [[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 11:08, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Tory....hid baby hera at roslins direction
::I'm not sure I understand your explanation, and I'm a Limey so I don't understand US politics too well. In 'Six of One' a Cavil says that Boomer has "voted to reconfigure", so each copy has a vote to spend. Do you mean that each copies vote goes toward determining the model's consensus, rather than the decisions? So Boomer's vote would put the Eight's in a state of contention, so they have no vote since there isn't a consensus? [[User:FredTheDeadHead|FredTheDeadHead]] 12:50, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Sam.......I could use help on him
:::Boomer goes against her model's wishes. The other Eights voted ''no'', but Boomer goes against that and votes ''yes''. That's why the others make such a fuss about her decision. That there is only one vote per model in the final vote, which in turn is determined by another voting process within each model was previously established during the New Caprica arc. -- [[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 13:15, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
 
::::Do you have some specifics about the New Caprica vote? I must admit I find what happened unclear. What I read was that all the copies of a model have always been unanimous, but Boomer broke that rule.  Though Sharon/Athena obviously is an even bigger break of the rules than Boomer, so I am not sure why she was so shocking.--[[User:Bradtem|Bradtem]] 21:44, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
which leaves only 1 who has to be related in some way to the hybrid babies.....and which im keeping to myself....the baby's are the clue see if you can piece it together {{unsigned|Richnpoor}}
:::::In "Precipice" they take a vote about cracking down in the insurgency. Every model present says "'''We''' agree", and at one point Caprica-Six says to another Six "Most of us do, anyway". So it isn't unanimous there. As they are individuals with sometimes different views, that probably isn't practical either. For me, the issue is that Boomer votes against her model line. More Eights votes against reconfiguration, but she - as the apparent spokesperson - says yes. Though why they don't just use the total vote if they know it, isn't that clear with this interpretation, but that Boomer's vote would supersede all the other Eights' votes doesn't make sense either. Unless she somehow has the power to speak for all Eights. And that's also what we have noted on [[Precipice#Analysis]] -- [[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 22:10, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
 
== Mechanical humanoid Cylons ==
How should we handle the mechanical humanoid Cylons from Caprica? Should we create a separate article for them, or should we give them a section in this article? -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 22:22, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
:An own article might be warranted. We'll see when it airs. I don't think we should put them together with the modern humanoid Cylons. From what I read so far, they are more like machines, possibly with some biological components. But not ''humanoid''. -- [[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:26, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
::[[Zoe Graystone|Zoe-R]] looks completely human in the Caprica trailer. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 01:44, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 
== Final Five ==
Should the Final Five section of the article be edited to match the layout of the Significant Seven part? To me personally it makes sense, simply for neatness and a better flow for the article. My proposed change is that each Final Five Cylon would have a subheading, picture and short blurb ala the Significant Seven. Instead of having the current subheading "The Final Cylon Model" we'd have "Samuel Anders", "Tory Foster", "Ellen Tigh", "Saul Tigh" and "Galen Tyrol" (I've went by alphabetical surname). Thoughts? -- [[User:Joveus|Joveus]] 08:37, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
:I couldn't agree more. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 14:45, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
::Well I've made the changes. I've also removed the "Thirteenth Cylon" bit because nothing has really been said about it in the series. However I think that might turn up on "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" tonight so maybe it'll come back. The article is 40kb now, and apparantly some browsers have difficulty supporting over 32kb. -- [[User:Joveus|Joveus]] 07:59, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
 
 
I removed the sentence ''"Their bodies at the time of the First Cylon War and the Fall of the Twelve Colonies are not their original bodies, which were destroyed by the nuclear warfare on Earth."'' as [[The Plan]] reveals this to be false. --[[User:Lord Wolfe|Lord Wolfe]] 03:54, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
:No, it doesn't. Were you thinking the bodies in the tanks were their originals? They aren't. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 05:25, 25 January 2011 (UTC)
 
== Significant Eight and Final Five? ==
 
Personally, I always thought "Significant Seven" and "Final Five" were a little too cute, and changing it to "Significant Eight" is simply grating. Now that we know the full difference between the two sets, maybe we can use more appropriate descriptors, say, "Colonial Cylons" for the Seven/Eight, and "Terran Cylons" for the Five. -- [[User:David cgc|David cgc]] 13:01, 15 February 2009 (UTC)
*"Significant Seven" is a term coined by RDM himself. Apparently that's what the writers call them. -- [[User:Troyian|Troyian]] 13:57, 15 February 2009 (UTC)
:Indeed, but Significant Eight is a silly term now that they've added another.  They are the humanoid Cylons made by the final five if you want to get descriptive, or the ones made near the twelve colonies. Can't call them "The Eight" as that might mean that model.--[[User:Bradtem|bradtem]] 04:58, 16 February 2009 (UTC)
**I think we should keep the titles "Significant Seven" and "Final Five", and just mention the Daniel & the Sevens within the section of the Significant Seven regardless of the fact that there are techincally eight. The fact is that they AREN'T the "significant eight", as only seven of them are significant, and although we should definitely reference the Daniels they are, at least as a model and probably even the one, not present in the story or in the Cylon society at all. -[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 04:37, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
:::Is catchy alliteration that much more important than accuracy? I say go with "The Eight", or maybe "Colonial Cylons" (the Eight) vs. "Earth Cylons" or "Terran Cylons" (the Five). --[[User:April Arcus|April Arcus]] 07:16, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
:Significant Seven is a semi-official nickname and Significant Eight is the most logical extrapolation to cover eight models, so I vote for Significant Eight most definitively. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 07:43, 18 February 2009 (UTC)
:The Significant Seven are the cylons covered by Baltar/Sixes conversation on the base ship after New Caprica. Daniel can not be counted as part of the significant SEVEN. Daniel's place in the continuity is minimal but great enough to be just called the 7th or plain Daniel.
 
== Zoe ==
 
Shouldn't Zoe Graystone be mentioned here somewhere? [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 23:24, 26 February 2011 (UTC)
 
: No, because she's not a humanoid Cylon. Technically, she's not even a skin-job, she's more of an android with biological components. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 00:03, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
:: She can be mentioned in a development-history kind of sense. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 01:12, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
::: Yeah, that's what I meant. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]]
::: I guess it could be mentioned in that light. Note that the technology needed to create the skinjobs was from the Final Five / 13th Colony, not really developed from Caprica. (They attempted to do it on their own, but ended up with the hybrids.) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 17:48, 27 February 2011 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 01:53, 11 April 2020


The Final Cylon, Conception and Prophecy

"The missing 3 will give you the five who come from the home of the thirteenth"

The human/cylon child hera obviously has a central role in the series. This is evidenced by her prescence in the opera house, 6 and baltar's delusion that the child is theirs, and the desire of both the human's and the cylons to retain possession of the child. Ill avoid discussing the the childs intended representation as the next evolutionary step in mankinds developement in order to emphasize a few overlooked facts. Conception has eluded the cylons until hera's birth. They can build machines, but they cannot create life. This leaves them unable to fufill the Cylon God's law to be fruitfull and multiply, i.e. procreate. If they cannot concieve they remain outside their god's will.

A. HERA - is the product of a female cylon (sharon) and a male human (helo) thus estalishing that conception is possiblewith a couple composed of these constituient parts.
B. NICK- is the product of a male cylon (tyrol) and a female human (cally) validating this type of conception is possible.
C. BABY6 - is the product of a male cylon and a female cylon the last remaining combination and supposedly not possible. (is it tighs love for ellen a human that enables this conception ?)

However, back to the puzzle the missing 3 (Hera , Nick, Baby6) are 3 misssing babies will give you the five; so there must be a relationship here to the final five

TIGH....parent TYROL......parent Tory....hid baby hera at roslins direction Sam.......I could use help on him

which leaves only 1 who has to be related in some way to the hybrid babies.....and which im keeping to myself....the baby's are the clue see if you can piece it together —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Richnpoor (talk • contribs).

Mechanical humanoid Cylons

How should we handle the mechanical humanoid Cylons from Caprica? Should we create a separate article for them, or should we give them a section in this article? -- Gordon Ecker 22:22, 25 August 2008 (UTC)Reply

An own article might be warranted. We'll see when it airs. I don't think we should put them together with the modern humanoid Cylons. From what I read so far, they are more like machines, possibly with some biological components. But not humanoid. -- Serenity 15:26, 26 August 2008 (UTC)Reply
Zoe-R looks completely human in the Caprica trailer. -- Gordon Ecker 01:44, 27 August 2008 (UTC)Reply

Final Five

Should the Final Five section of the article be edited to match the layout of the Significant Seven part? To me personally it makes sense, simply for neatness and a better flow for the article. My proposed change is that each Final Five Cylon would have a subheading, picture and short blurb ala the Significant Seven. Instead of having the current subheading "The Final Cylon Model" we'd have "Samuel Anders", "Tory Foster", "Ellen Tigh", "Saul Tigh" and "Galen Tyrol" (I've went by alphabetical surname). Thoughts? -- Joveus 08:37, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Reply

I couldn't agree more. -- Noneofyourbusiness 14:45, 22 January 2009 (UTC)Reply
Well I've made the changes. I've also removed the "Thirteenth Cylon" bit because nothing has really been said about it in the series. However I think that might turn up on "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" tonight so maybe it'll come back. The article is 40kb now, and apparantly some browsers have difficulty supporting over 32kb. -- Joveus 07:59, 23 January 2009 (UTC)Reply


I removed the sentence "Their bodies at the time of the First Cylon War and the Fall of the Twelve Colonies are not their original bodies, which were destroyed by the nuclear warfare on Earth." as The Plan reveals this to be false. --Lord Wolfe 03:54, 25 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

No, it doesn't. Were you thinking the bodies in the tanks were their originals? They aren't. -- Noneofyourbusiness 05:25, 25 January 2011 (UTC)Reply

Significant Eight and Final Five?

Personally, I always thought "Significant Seven" and "Final Five" were a little too cute, and changing it to "Significant Eight" is simply grating. Now that we know the full difference between the two sets, maybe we can use more appropriate descriptors, say, "Colonial Cylons" for the Seven/Eight, and "Terran Cylons" for the Five. -- David cgc 13:01, 15 February 2009 (UTC)Reply

Indeed, but Significant Eight is a silly term now that they've added another. They are the humanoid Cylons made by the final five if you want to get descriptive, or the ones made near the twelve colonies. Can't call them "The Eight" as that might mean that model.--bradtem 04:58, 16 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
    • I think we should keep the titles "Significant Seven" and "Final Five", and just mention the Daniel & the Sevens within the section of the Significant Seven regardless of the fact that there are techincally eight. The fact is that they AREN'T the "significant eight", as only seven of them are significant, and although we should definitely reference the Daniels they are, at least as a model and probably even the one, not present in the story or in the Cylon society at all. -Sauron18 04:37, 18 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Is catchy alliteration that much more important than accuracy? I say go with "The Eight", or maybe "Colonial Cylons" (the Eight) vs. "Earth Cylons" or "Terran Cylons" (the Five). --April Arcus 07:16, 18 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
Significant Seven is a semi-official nickname and Significant Eight is the most logical extrapolation to cover eight models, so I vote for Significant Eight most definitively. -- Noneofyourbusiness 07:43, 18 February 2009 (UTC)Reply
The Significant Seven are the cylons covered by Baltar/Sixes conversation on the base ship after New Caprica. Daniel can not be counted as part of the significant SEVEN. Daniel's place in the continuity is minimal but great enough to be just called the 7th or plain Daniel.

Zoe

Shouldn't Zoe Graystone be mentioned here somewhere? Ausir 23:24, 26 February 2011 (UTC)Reply

No, because she's not a humanoid Cylon. Technically, she's not even a skin-job, she's more of an android with biological components. -- Joe Beaudoin So say we all - Donate 00:03, 27 February 2011 (UTC)Reply
She can be mentioned in a development-history kind of sense. -- Noneofyourbusiness 01:12, 27 February 2011 (UTC)Reply
Yeah, that's what I meant. Ausir
I guess it could be mentioned in that light. Note that the technology needed to create the skinjobs was from the Final Five / 13th Colony, not really developed from Caprica. (They attempted to do it on their own, but ended up with the hybrids.) -- Joe Beaudoin So say we all - Donate 17:48, 27 February 2011 (UTC)Reply