Editing Talk:Wedge-shaped vessel/Archive 1

== Defender? ==
While it can't be questioned that the ship pictured was on the screen, are there any canonical sources as to the name/role/etc. of that ship? The link to a list of almost entirely non-canonical, fan-made ship designs doesn't really help the case for this ship. As it stands it's one of many ships that has appeared on screen but has no real name, description, or purpose that has been detailed either onscreen or by other canonical sources. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:23, 9 November 2006 (CST)

:The article needs to be reworded obviously, but it could be salvaged. The ship does exist and can be documented with a screenshot. Then a note can clearly explain that the name and its possible military origin (likely retrofitted for civilian use tho) is fan-derived. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:35, 9 November 2006 (CST)

: Aside from the screenshot, everything else seems to be fanon, which needs to be spaced. Also, it would probalby be better to document this ship under [[The Fleet (RDM)]] article. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 10:52, 9 November 2006 (CST)

::I would rather call it something else just to remove its connection from fandom. The similarities of the ship on the website and the screenshot are nice, but the screenshot does not make the fan's rendering or its description canonical. If the ship was inspired by it, we can give it credit once we confirm that source, but the fan's description goes against the storyline: ''Galactica'' is the ONLY military ship left of the original Colonial Fleet; nothing else is left for defense. I would rather add it to The Fleet article with a reference footnote to the web site nothing the similarity. Otherwise we get into intellectual property and copyright issues as well as fan fiction problems. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:05, 9 November 2006 (CST)
:::It works if you assume that it was a former military ship that was decomissioned and retrofitted for civilian use (like stripped of all weapons and dedictated military technology). And the design does look vaguely military. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:16, 9 November 2006 (CST)

Noted Changes from the Original Series 
The basic story is still present: robotic Cylons surprisingly attack the Colonies resulting in a holocaust, thus forcing a "rag-tag, fugitive fleet" to coalesce around the last surviving battlestar, Galactica, to seek a mythical 13th Colony where refugees hope to find shelter from the Cylons. battlestars needs some kind of military support ship,last surviving battlestar is galactica.But galactica is not only military ship in the fleet.--[[User:mustah]]
:Does not compute. Another military vessel would and should have been mentioned by now. Of course a fully equipped battlestar group does have support vessels (also mentioned in "Pegasus"), but ''Galactica'' was about to be decomissioned and alone at the time of the attack. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 14:20, 9 November 2006 (CST)

If this ship does indeed exist then the article name shoudl be either ''Defender'' or ''Defender-class Vessel'' or something like that --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 14:25, 9 November 2006 (CST)

in battlestar galactica pilot film, scene before civilian fleet jump to ragnar anchorage i see three viper this show military vessel capable support and pod for vipers.before ftl jump after cylon fire in the front line i see defender {{unsigned|Mustah}}

:All -- this is all [[Battlestar Wiki:Fanwanking|fanwanking]] right now. Aside from the photo, we really know nothing. Given the very limited military options, if Adama had a Colonial Fleet support craft that could be used, he ''would'' have used it given his very few options, if it mattered. ''Galactica'' and ''Pegasus'' were the ONLY ''military'' ships in the fleet; there is no official info that contradicts this. There is no credible official source for this vessel other than its photo. As a descriptive name, I'd rather not use "Defender" in the name as it speculates without sourcing that it is a military vessel. "Wedge-style vessel" is fine, for example, until/if we get more data. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 19:15, 9 November 2006 (CST)

::I concur with Spencerian on this. Let's make a note of this ship as a "Wedge-style vessel", since "Colonial defender" strikes me as militaristic. Also, this article should be deleted, but the pic and the note should be added to [[The Fleet (RDM)]] page, as I've previously suggested. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 22:42, 9 November 2006 (CST)

::I spent a large chunk of time researching this vessel when I was doing a total conversion of Coxxen's low polymodels from 3DS to Blender native format when I saw the model had KEW turrets on it.  Here is what I've been able to piece together: The design is by Todd "The Hobb" Boyce and originally modelled in Truespace by Steve Wilson and did show up, minus the landing bay, in the series.  While no offical word from producers, that I could find, this is a Defender.  It is fan created ship that ended up in the series. Whether for legal reasons they had to alter the design and have not identified the ship, since someone else did design it first, I can't say, but from a 3D CGI perspective...that's the or at least a defender. [[User:Unimatrix|Unimatrix]] 00:55, 14 November 2006 (CST)

:::What sources have you used in your research to support your claims? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 21:39, 14 November 2006 (CST)
::::I would be interested in your research too. Have you spoken to any of the RDM series technical team for example? While the image from the season 2 finale image does indeed ''look'' very much like the defender from that angle, the name is completely fanon as is it's purpose in the fleet. It would be nice to flesh out this article though but we cant call it the Defender for various reasons.
::::#It might simply be a homage to the guy who designed it, much like the serenity and enterprise in the Miniseries
::::#It is most definitly not a military vessel as described. Galactica is the only one left now that pegasus has gone
::::#The name is fanon created by the artist who originally designed the ship
::::Now i'm completely fanwanking here but given the size of the engines in comparison to the rest of the vessel could it be safe to say that this ship is more likely to be a freighter than passenger cruiser (authough it may have been converted) and thus could be named ''Wedge-shaped Freighter '' or ''Vessel'' until given a canon name by the producers. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 04:10, 15 November 2006 (CST)
:::::[[Wedge-shaped vessel|How does this look?]] Its a quick mockup of how the pace could look with more decent content instead of all fanon. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 04:35, 15 November 2006 (CST)
::::::MUCH better. Just need a cite to backup the "only military ship" thing. But I'm pretty sure I remember somebody saying that somewhere. That may be something Brad mentioned in OC, if nothing else. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:18, 15 November 2006 (CST)
:::::::I like the article in general (although you just ''know'' that I'm going to revise it). "Wedge-shaped vessel" is a nice, non-pronoun title. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 08:28, 15 November 2006 (CST)
:::::::Indeed. Extremely better than what is here now. I suggest you move the page to "[[Wedge-shaped vessel]]" and import the content you have in the above subpage there. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 08:44, 15 November 2006 (CST)
::::::::Moved. Still needs some work tho, so ill add a cleanup tag to it. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 09:37, 15 November 2006 (CST)
::::::::I found the [[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive03#RE: Military Ships|bit that Bradley said about it]] in the OC archives too. "If other ships have survived, military or otherwise, we haven't yet made contact with them" Needs to be added as a "source" perhaps? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 09:49, 15 November 2006 (CST)
@@ Line 15: / Line 15: @@
 If this ship does indeed exist then the article name shoudl be either ''Defender'' or ''Defender-class Vessel'' or something like that --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 14:25, 9 November 2006 (CST)
-in battlestar galactica pilot film, scene before civilian fleet jump to ragnar anchorage i see three viper this show military vessel capable support and pod for vipers.before ftl jump after cylon fire in the front line i see defender {{unsigned|Mustah}}16 November 2005 after fake Hera's death ,when fake hera dust flying in space. Under space park you can Wedge-shaped vessel --[[User:mustah|mustah]]
+in battlestar galactica pilot film, scene before civilian fleet jump to ragnar anchorage i see three viper this show military vessel capable support and pod for vipers.before ftl jump after cylon fire in the front line i see defender {{unsigned|Mustah}}
-:Here's the a [http://bsgmedia.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=173&pos=480 screenshot] mentioned scene. I'll look through media and see if we have it uploaded here already. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:59, 16 November 2006 (CST)
 :All -- this is all [[Battlestar Wiki:Fanwanking|fanwanking]] right now. Aside from the photo, we really know nothing. Given the very limited military options, if Adama had a Colonial Fleet support craft that could be used, he ''would'' have used it given his very few options, if it mattered. ''Galactica'' and ''Pegasus'' were the ONLY ''military'' ships in the fleet; there is no official info that contradicts this. There is no credible official source for this vessel other than its photo. As a descriptive name, I'd rather not use "Defender" in the name as it speculates without sourcing that it is a military vessel. "Wedge-style vessel" is fine, for example, until/if we get more data. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 19:15, 9 November 2006 (CST)
@@ Line 35: / Line 34: @@
 :::::::Indeed. Extremely better than what is here now. I suggest you move the page to "[[Wedge-shaped vessel]]" and import the content you have in the above subpage there. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 08:44, 15 November 2006 (CST)
 ::::::::Moved. Still needs some work tho, so ill add a cleanup tag to it. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 09:37, 15 November 2006 (CST)
-::::::::I found the [[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive3#RE: Military Ships|bit that Bradley said about it]] in the OC archives too. "If other ships have survived, military or otherwise, we haven't yet made contact with them" Needs to be added as a "source" perhaps? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 09:49, 15 November 2006 (CST)
+::::::::I found the [[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive03#RE: Military Ships|bit that Bradley said about it]] in the OC archives too. "If other ships have survived, military or otherwise, we haven't yet made contact with them" Needs to be added as a "source" perhaps? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] <sup>([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])</sup> 09:49, 15 November 2006 (CST)
-:We ahd a little discussion over the user adding it at Wikipedia, [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:List_of_miscellaneous_ships_in_Battlestar_Galactica_%282004%29 here]. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 15:44, 16 November 2006 (CST)
-== Adriatic? ==
-I have a feeling this is the ''[[Adriatic]]''.--[[User:CoreyDanian|CoreyDanian]] 12.52 15 Friday June 2007
-: Any particular reason for that? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [http://www.sanctuarywiki.org Sanctuary Wiki &mdash; ''New'']</sup> 21:56, 14 June 2007 (CDT)
-::Look on [[The Passage]] and you'll probibly see why? The one seen behind [[Space Park]] isn't seen in at the algae planet. While it does appear in further episode, this may be the second one seen just to the left of the screen if you see it on the computer.--[[User:CoreyDanian|CoreyDanian]] 9/29 Monday April 2008 CST
-== ''Serenity'' appearance ==
-Can someone provide a screenshot or time index for reference? Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [http://www.sanctuarywiki.org Sanctuary Wiki &mdash; ''New'']</sup> 17:04, 28 October 2007 (CDT)
-I was going to upload some screencaps for reference, but my computer's in a bad mood, so I'll do it sometime later. The ship appears in the battle between the Reavers and the Alliance at the following times: 01:20:12(top left), 01:20:55 and 01:23:09(right hand side). --[[User:Pearse|Pearse]] 17:26, 28 October 2007 (CDT)
-I can confirm this, I looked through the entire battle frame for frame, because I'd been told there was a Battlestar hidden in it, to no avail, but I did definitely see the Defender at around 1:23:10. [[User:YIIMM|YIIMM]] 16:39, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
-==Proposal to re-name page==
-Since this background vessel is a little bit more detailed now, and since it would fit in with other ship type pages, I wanted to see if the consensus would agree that this article would be better if named "Defender type" or "Wedge type", instead of the current "Wedge-Shaped Vessel".
--- [[user:Frylock86|Frylock86]] 5/6/13 12:35 PM EST