Editing Talk:Orange passenger cruiser/Archive 1

new page for Sagitarrian Spaceways. what you guys think. can you add more info on this ship realting back to the other three models i have listed on the page - Lgamser--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 17:47, 9 May 2006 (CDT)

:I'm sorry if I didn't know, but what's youre source for all of this passenger liner info? Some Zoic thing?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 08:32, 9 May 2006 (CDT)

::Thanks for the contribution. However, I concur with Merv. A source is required. Further, since there is so little information on these ships and because they are practically identical, this article should probably be merged with the [[Intersun Passenger Cruiser]] article. The only ship of this model that has been cited is the Olympic Carrier, which has its own separate page. Just let us know if your source. Also, Lgamser, you can sign your talk entries with four ~ (tildes). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:50, 9 May 2006 (CDT)

:::Not to pile on, but I agree with the above. Source or speedy delete. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 15:49, 9 May 2006 (CDT)

::::I did create this post to make some sense of how th hierchy of ships there are. Images of this ship HAVE BEEN produced by the Zioc Studios, and have have been a mockup ship to use in backgroud shots, apart from pan galactic and gemenon liner 1701. I was wanting to make the point where you have edited my page for intersun passanger liner, Intersun is the manufacture of ships (like in real world Boeing or Airbus), now then boeing license out the design to other shipliners out to the fleet (Pan galactic, Gemon Liners, and Saggittaron spaceways). 
These liners are not the names of the ships, these are the shipliners of the the particular colony. these shipliners are like the real world Qantas, British Airlines, VirginBlue, etc.
The intersun name is of importance because of its model. This is a STANDARD MODEL. and standard models are of the space configuration between shipliners who buy/make them from license from Intersun.

This is all i can assume. But if the Sagittaron Spaceways images didn't have any images of the ships (to verify its geniune) that was made by Zioc Studio for use in the Fleet, than i would totally agree with you by deleting this thread. But there are images of this ships, which there are (which i have produced), I see an importance of this ship.
--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 17:36, 9 May 2006 (CDT)


:::: Another thing is that this spaceliner has been listed by someone other than myself in the ''[[The Fleet (RDM)]]''. So this is of some speculation. I can merely be seem of extending that name to a new page about the ship to prove with images of the ship that it does exist.--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 17:46, 9 May 2006 (CDT)

Another thing is do a google search apon the ship, you will find that there is quite a lot of information on this ship on various sites.--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 17:47, 9 May 2006 (CDT)


I'm sorry but I cannot understand what you just said.  Other sites?  Can you give an example?  Maybe you saw a fanfic and are mistaken.  Where specifically did you hear the name "Sagitarrian Spaceways"?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 21:16, 9 May 2006 (CDT)
::Correction:  "Sagitaron Spaceways" was added to the Fleet list last month by Spencerian:  can we have a screencap or something to confirm this?  I'm confused.  ---->I don't mean just for this, Lgamser, but where did you get the names for all of these other ships?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 21:19, 9 May 2006 (CDT)

I have put a screen cap on the actual article, unless someone has deleted those. I downloaded a 2.4mb bitmap of the ship but couldnt upload it. so i use a smaller version of the ship. This name "Sagitarrian Spaceways" is sighted on the ship across the top, like the Pan galactic and olympic carrier. I cant remember exactly where i got it from, but it must of have been a site http://rpg.bsgfandom.net/, and click on the fleet buttonand scroll down to sagitarrian liner. this site also displays pictures of the pan galactic and gemon liners.

That is of course on example. and what do you mean  y other ships, all of the ships that i listed under ''[[Intersun Passenger Cruiser]]'' already exist, i was only putting them under a centrel article to reference, from its ship, as they all have the same body and look the same.--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 00:13, 10 May 2006 (CDT)

Also on the article it states that it is a PRESUMED ship of the fleet, presumed by the means of the images that have been provided. We can only presume that this ship DOES exist, only to the geniune image of it.

"Correction:  "Sagitaron Spaceways" was added to the Fleet list last month by Spencerian." - on the ship it is spelt Sagitarrian Spaceways, even though Spencerian did get it wrong when he first added it to the fleet list.--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 00:22, 10 May 2006 (CDT)

::I am sorry, but the link you provided to "rpj.bsgfandom.net", is for an online RPG game someone made.  I don't think that many of the ship names in there are canonical in any way; you might want to re-evaluate whether they should be added into here.  Thoughts by anyone else?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 00:56, 10 May 2006 (CDT)

:::I'd like to see the original Zoic source. This kind of recoloring work is very easy to do in photoshop. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:12, 10 May 2006 (CDT)



== Article Deletion Imminent ==

I'm sorry, but the link and related information suggests that this article is fan fiction that comes from the Galactica RPG. This is not a canonical source, and I recommend we delete this article. I can find no mention of this spaceway in official sources. I will mark this page for deletion and will remove it within 24 hours unless a canonical source is identified. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:10, 10 May 2006 (CDT)

:What we would need would be a citation from an [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad#Acceptable Sources|acceptable source]], and I couldn't find anything (during a cursory search). If an acceptable source can be produced (within Spencerian's time guidelines) I would argue for its inclusion, otherwise it should probably go. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:22, 10 May 2006 (CDT)

::Screencap provided: 

[[Image:Bsg-01-48-46.PNG|thumb|Sagitarrian Spaceways Passenger Liner on Mini Series(1:48:46) © Zoic Studios]]

Sorry, this is a large image in size but i couldnt put it down any further without loosing detail. please read the notes on the image page.

This was taken at 1:48:46 on the mini series
--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 07:27, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

:::The screencap provided is pretty compelling. However, I'd be more inclined to keep the screencap provided (properly jpeg'd and tagged) than the Zoic stuff (in that the Zoic stuff is kind of theoretical, where the screencap is unquestionably canon). Compliments on providing the timestamp as well. That's something few of our screencaps have (yet).--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:37, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

::::This should work. However, the name is not canon so, given that we haven't anything else, we can use it as a descriptive term. I will strike the RPG game detail, since that data has not aired. This article should still be merged, however, as there is too little information for each of these almost-identical cruisers. Zoic stuff is non-canon unless aired or authenticated by RDM and officials, so it must go too. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 08:41, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

::::One note: Is that spelling of "Sagittarian" correct? Also, can we verify that this was of Sagittarian registry? Do we only have the Zoic reference to go on? Lgamser, could you give us the link/source where you initially found the term "Sagittarian Spaceways?" --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:06, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

:::::Indeed. All the screencap tells us is that there exists an orange-painted variant of the passenger liner, not who operates it or what it's model number is. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 16:10, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

::::::We are in agreement.  I'm theorizing that perhaps the RPG gamers made up names and backstories for the various different-colored versions of the same generic passenger liner design (unless someone can get a better screencap with the name listed on it visibly).  --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 17:03, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

==Investigation==
Google reveals us as the top match for "Sagittarian Spaceways" (which is troubling). The second match, which appears to be the source of all this, is [http://www.battlestarhelios.com/bsg/ships.php Battlestar Helios].

The boilerplate at the bottom of the page linked above reads: 
<blockquote>Some of the images used on this page came from Galactica2003 
Others were rendered by me using 3D Studio Max.</blockquote>

I move that the renders be removed from our site and this page (based on unsourced content) be deleted. The screen capture of the orange liner can be moved to the intersun page. This page can be re-created if an appropriate source can be found that is clearly not a fan-rendering. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 11 May 2006 (CDT)


There are many ships in the Fleet that are currently not named that we have visibly seen; they don't get articles if they're not named, or if they're not prominently shown in an episode like the tanker in "Home, part I".  If the only information we have is that there is an orange ship somewhere in the Fleet, this does not justify having an article at all.  Therefore, I agree with Peter's idea that we should just take any relevant stuff out of this and delete the article. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 21:14, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

:If dilligent research on our part can help dispel fanon bullshit, then it actually serves a useful purpose to keep it around in its much-reduced state. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:08, 11 May 2006 (CDT)

::I actually agree, but this is one of those cases where...to be honest, I'm not sure if this "Galactica RPG" site is very popular, and having articles for the purpose of dispelling stuff a minor site uses just gives them more publicity, spreading the BS further than it ever would have without it.  --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] <sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]])</sup> 23:00, 11 May 2006 (CDT)


Well how about, if we can all agree on it. Just keep the article of Orange Passenger Cruiser. If I do get some more solid information about this ship i will give it, or if anyone does want to search for anything regarding this ship, there quite welcome to. I will endeavour to keep getting more information about this ship.
But i want to know why someone removed "Gemenon Liner 1701" from the Intersun Passenger Cruiser list of other shipliners, as it it in the screenshot on the Gemenon Liner 1701 IS of same model shape. and by the name on the ship is "Gemon Liners". But someone will have to edit the name of the ship that they put on the Fleet List.
--[[User:Lgamser|Lgamser]] 04:06, 12 May 2006 (CDT)