Editing Talk:Fragged/Archive 1

== Information for episodes (used prior to airing on 29 July 2005) == 

This might be interesting to look at (involves Fragged, Resistance, Farm), but I'm too tired to write up any of this:

http://mboard.scifi.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=887342&an=0&page=0&gonew=1#UNREAD

[[User:Kuralyov|Kuralyov]] 17:01, 9 May 2005 (EDT)

== "Apollo can fly a Raptor" comment ==

Quote: "Apollo can fly a Raptor"

Look again. He's sitting on the right, while it's well-established (see eg. Kobol's last gleaming pt. 1) that the pilot's seat is on the left (both as seen from the front).

[[User:WouterCoene|WouterCoene]] 04:07, 31 Jul 2005 (CEST)

: WouterCoene is correct. Lee is sitting in the passenger seat, which is the seat on the port side of the Raptor. (Or the "front", were we to look into the Raptor from its front.) -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 22:57, 30 Jul 2005 (EDT)

:: But look to the mini-series when Sharon leave Helo! Sharon seats on that right seat where Lee is sitting in this episode. Well, then, if pilot seat is the Left one (when looking from the front), how could Sharon leave Caprica in mini-series? or the young boy was flying that raptor? :-) -- Lordhp <lordhp (at) centrum (dot) cz> - 1.7.2005 18:20 GMT+1

::: Actually, having reviewed the footage from both the mini and [[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]], the cockpit controls on the port side of the raptor  are also pilot controls.  (See the part where Crashdown tries to contorl the descent of [[Raptor 1]] in the fourth or fifth act.) However, I believe that the primary controls seem to be seated at the starboard side. (as evidenced throughout the season) -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 16:00, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)

:::: The raptor layout seems similar to that of many modern helicopters and commercial airliners.  There are flight controls on both sides of the cockpit.  In the mini-series and in most subsequent episodes, the pilot of the raptor is seen on the, from the pilots view, right side of the cockpit.  A notable exception to this was from the mini-series. Boomer is seen leaving Caprica piloting from the left side.  This seems to be for dramatic license.  Boomer's position in the cockpit was necessary to allow her parting look with Helo.  These controls were used again in [[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]] when the pilot of Raptor Baltar and Tyrol were riding in was killed.  Crashdown took control of the ship and piloted it from the left seat.  

::::As for the specifics of whether or not Lee Adama is capable of piloting a raptor, I suspect it's likely even though it has not yet been shown.  Stepping away from the 'mechanics' of flying, it is likely out of convenience that we'll see pilots like Starbuck, Apollo and possibly even Helo pilot a Raptor quite simply because of the precedent from the original series.  Apollo and his fellows were seen piloting shuttles on numerous occasions with the [[The Young Lords]] being an example.   Perhaps a more relevant example would be Commander Adama's piloting of a Raptor in [[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]] when he retrieves Ellen Tigh and brings her to the Galactica.  There has been very little portrayed regarding Adama's duties prior to commanding the Galactica so its possible he learned another way.  We do know that he was a Viper pilot and would've received similar training to Apollo's.  It seems likely that this training would allow for the piloting of a raptor.--[[User:Feldspar|Feldspar]] 18:41, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)

:::::FWIW, I imagine that piloting a Raptor on limousine duty is a very different task than taking one into combat. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:31, 4 Aug 2005 (EDT)
:::::Well, [[Resistance]] settles it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:59, 6 Aug 2005 (EDT)

== Disassembling what?  Large unidentified Cylon craft ==

''After holding a funeral for Socinus and Tarn, the ground crew stranded on Kobol discover that the Cylons are cannibalizing the parts of the downed Raptor craft, and are using the parts to build an anti-aircraft battery.''

That is definitely not a Raptor.  You can see on the front right portion a Cylon brain cockpit, in a similar position where it would be on a [[Heavy Raider]].  However I don't remember a Heavy Raider having those pointy pylon things up front.  From the relative size of the Centurion walking next to it, this ship could be even bigger than a Heavy Raider.  My guess it is those large unidentified Cylon craft seen outside the Basestar in KLG2 when Boomer's Raptor arrives.  If you watch it frame by frame, you can vaguely see those pointy protrusions up front.  Except for those two pointy things it kind of looks like a flying Washington Monument, with two blue flame engines burning in the back.
--[[User:Laven|Laven]] 02:12, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)

Then just edit the line. Seriously, you didn't need to make a big fuss over it. It's just a show.--[[User:Crazyrabbits|Crazyrabbits]] 03:17, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)

The draidus dish was salvaged from the nose cone of the Rapror, Tyrol speculated as much when he saw the dish.  The ship shown need not be the raptor.  Clearly the cylons had to get to the planet somehow after the base start exploded (I doubt even a Centurion is resilient enough to do a re-entry).  If their ship was only for transport (a light raider or cargo ship) and didn't have ship to ship missiles canabalizing the raptor makes sense.  Remember, the raptor also crashed in a relatively open area and the missile stands were in the forest, so the Centurions landed at the downed raptor, riped off the interesting stuff, flew into the forest, and begam assembly. --[[User:Shemnon|Shemnon]] 16:01, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)

I highly doubt missiles containing volatile fuel and an explosive warhead would survive the Raptor fire and explosion that we saw during KLG2.  I give reasons in [[Unidentified Cylon Craft]] why the ship seen on the planet is likely to be the one dismantled, and different from a [[Heavy Raider]].  We may never know the "truth" unless RDM says something in the forthcoming podcast or season 2 DVD. =( 
--[[User:Laven|Laven]] 20:25, 4 Aug 2005 (EDT)

"It looks like a DRADIS dish... at least the Cylon version of a Dradis dish.  It was probably salvaged from the nosecone of the ship." said Tyrol as they look at the dish during [[Fragged].
--[[User:Laven|Laven]] 21:34, 5 Aug 2005 (EDT)

== Deleting Justified Interpretation is Vandalism ==

User at 24.47.156.127 needs to get a grip on their editing. You do not own the sole opinion or interpretation on why Roslin experiences the ringing sensation. I will add my edit back to the page. BSG Wiki allows source-derived POV because of what it is; we are not Wikipedia. If you don't believe what is added there, add a counterpoint, but don't delete my comments again. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:44, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)

: While I won't go as so far as to say this is an act of vandalism, I concur with this.  Interpretations are permitted within reasonable bounds and fans are encouraged to analyze and come to their own assumptions.  All POVs, within reason, are encouraged, as so long as each POV is treated equally and fairly. ''Now'', as for the vandalism piece, if this happens multiple times without justification, then it ''is'' considered vandalism and will be treated with a ban of 24 to 48 hours. (All depending on the evidence at hand, of course.) I have yet to instate a rule similar to Wikipedia's [[Wikipedia:3RR|3 Revert Rule]], but I will institue one should it become necessary -- I just hope it ''never'', ''ever'' comes to that. Thanks for your attention.  So say we all. -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 16:43, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)

== Delusion or delirium? ==

I notice Roslin is said to have delusion and/or delirium.  I haven't seen the episode, but I wonder whether she actually experienced both states.  For comparison, delusion refers to a false belief [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delusion] (often stubbornly held despite evidence to the contrary, e.g. "Earth is flat"), whereas delirium is a disturbance in consciousness, which tends to fluctuate over time [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delirium].  The latter is often seen among elderly hospitalized patients.  An illusion, on the other hand, is a misinterpretation of actual sensory inputs.  [[User:67.80.186.103|67.80.186.103]] 20:47, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)
:Based on your comments, I'm inclined to conclude Roslin was delirious due to the medication and withdrawal. It seems Chamalla has a heightened and several unknown effects in use or withdrawal. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:39, 4 Aug 2005 (EDT)
@@ Line 25: / Line 25: @@
 ::::As for the specifics of whether or not Lee Adama is capable of piloting a raptor, I suspect it's likely even though it has not yet been shown.  Stepping away from the 'mechanics' of flying, it is likely out of convenience that we'll see pilots like Starbuck, Apollo and possibly even Helo pilot a Raptor quite simply because of the precedent from the original series.  Apollo and his fellows were seen piloting shuttles on numerous occasions with the [[The Young Lords]] being an example.   Perhaps a more relevant example would be Commander Adama's piloting of a Raptor in [[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]] when he retrieves Ellen Tigh and brings her to the Galactica.  There has been very little portrayed regarding Adama's duties prior to commanding the Galactica so its possible he learned another way.  We do know that he was a Viper pilot and would've received similar training to Apollo's.  It seems likely that this training would allow for the piloting of a raptor.--[[User:Feldspar|Feldspar]] 18:41, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)
-:::::FWIW, I imagine that piloting a Raptor on limousine duty is a very different task than taking one into combat. --[[User:April Arcus|April Arcus]] 01:31, 4 Aug 2005 (EDT)
+:::::FWIW, I imagine that piloting a Raptor on limousine duty is a very different task than taking one into combat. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:31, 4 Aug 2005 (EDT)
-:::::Well, [[Resistance]] settles it. --[[User:April Arcus|April Arcus]] 01:59, 6 Aug 2005 (EDT)
+:::::Well, [[Resistance]] settles it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:59, 6 Aug 2005 (EDT)
 == Disassembling what?  Large unidentified Cylon craft ==
@@ Line 55: / Line 55: @@
 I notice Roslin is said to have delusion and/or delirium.  I haven't seen the episode, but I wonder whether she actually experienced both states.  For comparison, delusion refers to a false belief [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delusion] (often stubbornly held despite evidence to the contrary, e.g. "Earth is flat"), whereas delirium is a disturbance in consciousness, which tends to fluctuate over time [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delirium].  The latter is often seen among elderly hospitalized patients.  An illusion, on the other hand, is a misinterpretation of actual sensory inputs.  [[User:67.80.186.103|67.80.186.103]] 20:47, 3 Aug 2005 (EDT)
 :Based on your comments, I'm inclined to conclude Roslin was delirious due to the medication and withdrawal. It seems Chamalla has a heightened and several unknown effects in use or withdrawal. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:39, 4 Aug 2005 (EDT)
-== Screencap for Episode Data Template ==
-It appears we need a screen capture for this page. I would nominate a good shot of Crashdown pointing a gun at Cally (something along [http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/S2/203/bscap341.htm these] lines), but there may better shots to be had. I was just going off of memory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 16:45, 9 January 2006 (EST)
-== Raptor shortage? ==
-In the "[[Fragged#Questions|Questions]]" section, it is asked, "Is fielding all six [Raptors] for any extended time period beyond the ship's ability? Have Galactica's Raptors been in chronically poor condition?"
-There appears to have been a temporary inability to secure working Raptors. Remember that the group stranded on Kobol included the Chief and four members of his crew: Cally, Seelix, Tarn and Socinus. Since spacecraft need maintenance, five missing knuckledraggers would probably affect availability at least temporarily. [[User:Dogger55|Dogger55]] 07:14, 29 June 2011 (EDT)