Editing Talk:Blood and Chrome/Archive 1

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== Title ==

Is there any particular reason the title is "Blood and Chrome" with "Blood & Chrome" as a redirect? All press information has used "Blood & Chrome" as the spelling, which says to me that it should be the other way around. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:54, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

: The ampersand is a bit of a technical issue in the URL, which is why we're using "Blood and Chrome" for right now. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 18:04, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

:: Ah. I hope that it gets fixed. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 05:24, 31 August 2010 (UTC)

== Placeholder image? ==

Until the powers that be release a title card or promotional photo for ''Blood and Chrome'', could we use the [[Cylon Centurion Model 0005]] closeup as a placeholder?  The image seems to be generic enough to represent any Cylon War-era story.  More importantly, we need something for the "Next Aired Episode" box on the main page.  -- [[User:BlueResistance|BlueResistance]] 12:58, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

: That works. ;-) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 13:15, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

:: Actually, having thought about it, it would probably suit us to use one of the production art images that are available online. Even if they're just rough art, it's more representative of the production than the Cylon Centurion from "Razor." -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 20:54, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

:::this might be a little silly, but i did a quick logo for the show, that we could possibly use, obviously it's not offiicial. [[User:Pst001|Pst001]] 03:29, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

http://i410.photobucket.com/albums/pp185/i_em_no_cylon/BloodChromelogo1.jpg

:::: We use officially released photography and art whenever possible. Since the concept art is released, let's choose one of those images and use that. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 13:14, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

== Tag for Blood & Chrome ==

We don't have a tag for Blood & Chrome, yet, do we? What's it gonna be? BAC? -- [[User:Pedda|Pedda]] 17:32, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
: I'm thinking either BC or BAC. More suggestions and discussion are welcome. :) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 22:57, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
:: BC sounds to me more like a calendric acronym, whereas BAC sounds more fannish. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 23:22, 11 January 2011 (UTC)
:::B&C? [[User:Pst001|Pst001]]
::: Can't really use the ampersand. I'm leaning toward BAC.  -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 21:59, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
::::I'm also cool with BAC (to the Future).--[[User:DrWho42|DrWho42]] 01:30, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
:::::BAC, It stays consistant with the other 3 letter tags-- [[User:Quig|Quig]] 22:47, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
::::::So BAC it is? -- [[User:Pedda|Pedda]] 23:46, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
:::::::Yes, BAC it is. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 00:12, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
::::::::Does the ampersand issue still arise if you use the code (I forget what it is, I think it's the HTML code) for it? Just curious... I haven't heard of wiki's having issues with this (but then you all may be doing something different here).

==Character Names==
I am not exactly sure which source was used (to list names on this wiki), but I read an article a few minutes ago, and it said that [[Lili Bordan]]'s character is ''Beka'' Kelly (As opposed to Becca).  While I know that wiki's tend to have users "be bold" I thought I would mention this in case "Becca" was confirmed through a more official source. --[[User:Typhoeus|Typhoeus]] 20:14, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

== Summary ==

Will you make a new page called "Blood and Chrome (Pilot)" or simply write the plot into the Plot area of this page? --[[User:Enabran|Enabran]] 16:17, 20 December 2012 (EST)

: I guess the best way to do it would be, to rename the current page at [[Blood and Chrome]] to [[Blood and Chrome (series)]]. And have a new page for the pilot at [[Blood and Chrome (pilot)]]. -- [[User:CylonU87|CylonU87]] <sup>[[User talk:CylonU87|I don't feel like a copy.]]</sup> 00:33, 21 December 2012 (EST)
:: Actually, it's not a series yet. For now, it's more like ''[[Razor]]''; a webseries, and a soon-to-come TV-movie. --[[User:LIMAFOX76|LIMAFOX76]] 01:23, 21 December 2012 (EST)
::: You could keep it as one entire page, since it hasn't gone to series. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 10:51, 21 December 2012 (EST)

:::: is there a chance, that it will go to series? --[[User:Enabran|Enabran]] 13:14, 21 December 2012 (EST)

:::: It's up in the air. For now, let's work on the present fact that that this is the only thing we see from B&C, and act accordingly. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 13:26, 21 December 2012 (EST)

::: And what about a page called "Blood and Chrome (Movie)"? If we put all infos (Summary, Notes, Analysis, Questions etc) in this page it maybe becomes confused. --[[User:Enabran|Enabran]] 14:31, 21 December 2012 (EST)

:::: Why would it be confusing?  It probably wouldn't be much longer than "[[The Plan]]" or "Razor" once it's finished, since the total run time is about the same as those movies.  Besides, a good deal of the production history information on the page was added piece by piece over the nearly two years, with little attention given to organizing or prioritizing or consolidating it, so it's a bit of a mess now.  I'm sure that once it's cleaned up, though, it will be noticeably shorter. -- [[User:BlueResistance|BlueResistance]] 19:05, 21 December 2012 (EST)

::::: I agree. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 19:32, 21 December 2012 (EST)

:::::: I do agree too. I think, as BlueResistance said earlier, we just have to keep and clean this page. And if, I said if, there is a TV series, to create a BAC (pilot) page in which we put the plot, and we rename this one with adding "(series)". --[[User:LIMAFOX76|LIMAFOX76]] 02:07, 22 December 2012 (EST)

:::::::Ok when we rearrange the Themes to:1 Overview 2 Summary 3 other stuff... it will be good and the important things for the reader (the Plot) will be on the top of the page). One more thing: "Razor" and "The plan" uses  "Episode Data" and this Page uses "Series Data". Shall we change this for now? And where would you list this movie in the "Template:Episode list"? to "DVD Movies and Features" or to "Webisodes" (for now it seems to be both...) --[[User:Enabran|Enabran]] 04:23, 22 December 2012 (EST)

:::::::: It should use the Episode Data template, for now. It's more of a DVD movie than it is a webisode, so it should be put under that. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 15:45, 22 December 2012 (EST)

== Series Continuity ==

I  don't know about anyone else, but I am seeing some major continuity gaps between B&C and the rest of TRS continuity. Is B&C separate, or part of the same continuity line? By the way, I am not just talking about different actors. For example, in the Miniseries, they say that Adama flew a Mark II Viper, but in B&C he flew a Mark III. Anyone else seeing these, or is it just me? {{unsigned|Litgeek306}}

: No more disconnected than the Reimagined Series (or even the sub-par ''Caprica'') itself was. Actually, B&C better in some ways when it comes to logic and continuity. As for the Mark II, he would fly that later on. Like any pilot worth his weight in gold, he would pilot multiple ships... and given how badly he destroys pretty much every ship he flies, it's no wonder that he would be given an older Viper. ;-) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 21:55, 23 December 2012 (EST)

::The question I have is that Adama takes out several Cylons and Raiders in this series, but in the ''Razor'' flashbacks, which take place a few years later, he says he's never flown a combat mission. Huh? —[[User:Josiah Rowe|Josiah Rowe]] 01:27, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

:: Yes! Thank you! I'm not the only one who picked up on this stuff. It's almost as if B&C is a giant retcon of the Razor Flashbacks. Which is kinda crappy, IMO. - [[user:Frylock86|Frylock]] 07:02, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

:::Since the film is set two years into the war there is plenty of time to sort out the Mk II(I) problem. It is likely that the Mk III is largely withdrawn from service due to it being more advanced then the Mk II and thus vulnerable to a large Cylon offensive that takes advantage of growing Colonial over-confidence in how secure their computer systems are (this ties into a couple comments Adama made such as during the mini-series when he says no to a network). As for the Razor flash-backs; it only contradicts the first webisode (possibly the second). However, that was not included in the film (nor the extended version), and since it contradicted comments Adama had made implying/saying that he had extensive combat experience in the war in the series proper it makes scene that they would discount it. [[User:Phalanx-a-pedian|Phalanx-a-pedian]] 11:18, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

:::::The film is set 10 years into the War. Two years before the Armistice. - [[User:Frylock86|Frylock]] 06:54PM, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

::::::Oops! I knew that, twas just a typo. [[User:Phalanx-a-pedian|Phalanx]] 20:25, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

:::: The reverse of this discussion is true: The "Razor Flashbacks" are the offender here, as it was largely implied (and stated outright at various points in the series) that Adama did serve during the last years of the war; the fact that Tyrol and his deck gang were able to recover and restore a Viper that (if you believe the "Razor Flashbacks") was basically destroyed into various pieces of unrecoverable scrap is proof of that. B&C simply establishes that Adama was a pilot during the war who had various missions under his belt and, as Phalanx-a-pedian rightfully points out, the statements made by Adama during the flashbacks were not included in either the uncut version or the TV version of "Razor," and were offered separately more as footnotes. (Also, as they are more "Flashbacks" where Adama recounts his experience, you can allow for the inconsistencies in his memory.)  -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 11:54, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

::::: I think we should probably just treat the Razor Flashbacks (well, episodes 1 and 2, which didn't make it into the movie) like any other deleted scene, with the "canon until contradicted" rule-of-thumb. Like Joe and Phalanx say, there's a lot that didn't make sense even when they were new, even beyond Adama only flying one combat mission in the entire war. The thing I'm getting at is there are some articles that insist on shoehorning every detail of them into continuity (the Galactica and Raptor articles are the big offenders, insisting that they both got their BSG-era configuration by the last day of the war and then remained unchanged for the next 40 years), even though those are mostly just consequences of showing the Cylon War as a brief sidebar to a modern story and not as a feature that could afford to design retro-Raptors and redress the hangar set. -- [[User:David cgc|David cgc]] 16:38, 20 March 2013 (EDT)

== Great Article on VFX ==

This article is very good at revealing what it took to get B&C to production, and dispels that $2 million budget rumor — it was more than that: http://www.fxguide.com/featured/blood-chrome-a-possible-vfx-future/ -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] <sup>[[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]]</sup> 12:08, 2 January 2013 (EST)


== Summary (taken from Wikipedia) ==

"Episode 1" 	November 9, 2012

Talented but cocky pilot William Adama graduates from the Academy and signs up to join the crew of the newly built Galactica. Much to his disappointment, he is assigned not to a Viper fighter but to a Raptor transport ship named the Wild Weasel. He meets his surly co-pilot Coker Fasjovik, who is cynical and interested only in leaving the military, as his tour of duty ends in eight weeks. Coker finds Adama's eagerness irritating and nicknames him "Husker". Galactica's CO, Commander Silas Nash, briefs the two on their first mission together, a routine "milk run" sending cargo to the Scorpia Fleet Shipyards and returning with supplies for the Galactica. It is a four-day trip during which they are to avoid enemy contact of any kind. 

"Episode 2" 	November 9, 2012

While preparing the Wild Weasel for the mission, Adama and Coker find out that their cargo isn't supplies but a civilian software engineer, Dr. Beka Kelly. They depart, but upon leaving Galactica's DRADIS range, Dr. Kelly hands them new orders from the Admiralty. They are to rendezvous with the Archeron, a Colonial heavy cruiser, in an area bordering Cylon space. They are also to take all further orders from Dr. Kelly. As they travel to their destination, Dr. Kelly reveals that she worked for Graystone Industries, designing the upgrade for the Cylons' MCP "brain" chip. When they reach the rendezvous point, they discover that the Archeron was ambushed and destroyed. A pair of Cylon raiders appear and attack the Raptor. 

"Episode 3" 	November 16, 2012

Thanks to Adama's risky but excellent piloting, the Wild Weasel narrowly escapes the Cylon raider. Despite Coker's desire to head home, Dr. Kelly has them break radio silence to send a transmission; they receive an immediate response with yet another set of coordinates. En route Dr. Kelly tells Adama that she was married to famed marine Ezra Barzel (from the Hebrew prophet Ezra and the Hebrew word for "Iron"), who inspired many young people to join the Academy. They arrive at the coordinates to find a fleet of "ghost ships", Colonial vessels assumed to have been destroyed in battle that are now camped out hiding in Cylon territory. 

"Episode 4" 	November 16, 2012

The commander of one of the ghost ships - an older Orion-class battlestar[16] called Osiris - assembles a small fleet for a mission. They will bring Dr. Kelly to embedded Colonial operatives on Djerba, a former winter resort planet located in Cylon territory that holds Dr. Kelly's objective. Dr. Kelly requests that Adama and Coker continue to escort her in the Wild Weasel. Coker overhears the commander say that the mission's personnel must be volunteers (i.e. it is a suicide mission); he is not pleased. On the launch deck, Coker runs into his old friend Lt. Jim Kirby, who was presumed dead after his ship was badly damaged in battle. Kirby asks Coker whether his wife has remarried, and Coker informs him that she has not and is raising their son. Kirby is overjoyed to learn that he has a child. As the mission fleet departs, Commander Ozar of the Osiris tells the crew that the fate of the war depends on Dr. Kelly reaching her objective. Just after the fleet jumps into Djerba's orbit, a Cylon Basestar appears. 

"Episode 5" 	November 23, 2012

The basestar and the Osiris exchange fire as the Wild Weasel and its Viper escorts, one of whom is Kirby, fly toward Djerba. They are pursued by three Cylon raiders which the Colonials manage to destroy, though Kirby deserts midway through the battle to go home to see his family. (This desertion did not occur in the televised movie.) Meanwhile, the Osiris is heavily outnumbered by the Cylon basestar and raiders. When its nuclear weapons jam, the commander decides to fly it into the basestar and manually detonate the weapons, destroying both the Cylon ships and the Osiris. The Wild Weasel crash-lands onto the surface of Djerba.
 
"Episode 6" 	November 23, 2012

Adama, Coker and Dr. Kelly abandon the Wild Weasel and trek through Djerba's harsh wind and snow, following a signal with Dr. Kelly's communicator. They track the signal to a huge cave, where they discover their escort unit dead from mysterious non-artillery wounds. Suddenly the cave floor collapses and plunges them into a dark underground chamber. Strange noises surround them and a large snake-like creature lunges out and bites Coker. As Coker struggles to contain the monster, a man rappels into the chamber and kills the snake. He introduces himself as Tech Sgt. Xander Toth, the only surviving escort. He explains that the snakes, which killed his unit, were created by Cylons doing half animal/half machine experiments. Toth has been alone in the cave for some time and is slightly mentally unstable, prone to unpredictable aggressive outbursts. Nevertheless, he has scouted a route to Dr. Kelly's objective. They leave the cave and stop at a cliff overlooking a seemingly abandoned resort compound. 

"Episode 7" 	November 30, 2012

Toth takes Adama, Coker and Dr. Kelly into the abandoned resort, where Toth says the Cylons previously stored "spare parts". He has rigged the perimeter with mines and set up a generator inside to keep heat running. Dr. Kelly later confides to Adama that her husband's status as a war hero was completely fabricated by the Colonial army. He did not singlehandedly defeat a Cylon platoon; rather, his exploratory mission was felled by friendly fire. She emphasizes that the war must end, with which Adama agrees before tenderly touching her. She tells him that "you will regret this", and they sleep together. Shortly after, Adama finds Coker deftly playing a grand piano, and Coker quickly surmises what has happened between Adama and Dr. Kelly. Just as he begins telling Adama that Dr. Kelly's objective is more than it seems, one of Toth's mines explodes and Cylon Centurions approach the compound. 

"Episode 8" 	November 30, 2012

Adama and Coker search the compound for Dr. Kelly, who disappeared when the Cylons arrived. Toth is shot multiple times by a centurion; his fate remains unknown. Meanwhile, Dr. Kelly stumbles into a cold storage room filled with human body parts - likely the "spares" Toth mentioned in the previous episode. She hides inside from a Centurion, who finds her when she exhales loudly. Instead of killing her, the Centurion scans at length a microchip dog tag she wears around her neck. Adama and Coker burst in and Coker shoots the Centurion. The Centurion crashes to the floor and emits a high-frequency wail, which Dr. Kelly explains as screaming - the Cylons can feel pain. Coker puts the Centurion out of its misery and the three set off to look for Toth. 

"Episode 9" 	December 7, 2012

When Coker wants to send a rescue signal for the mortally wounded Toth, Adama and Dr. Kelly instead insist that they press on toward Dr. Kelly's objective. Coker demands to know Dr. Kelly's mission, and she finally explains that she will upload a virus to the Cylons' communications array. Once they find the array, Dr. Kelly begins her upload, but Coker shoots her and disarms Adama when he sees a Battlestar on the communications screen - Dr. Kelly is transmitting information about the ghost fleet to the Cylons. She shoots Coker several times and justifies her betrayal: she believes that the war will only end when humans negotiate with the Cylons, who she thinks value life more than humans do. Accepting that Dr. Kelly is a traitor, Adama destroys the communications unit. He drags a badly wounded Coker out of the array, leaving Dr. Kelly behind. 

"Episode 10" 	December 7, 2012

As Adama and Coker wait for a rescue to take them back to Galactica, Coker shows Adama a picture of his wife before passing out - perhaps dying. In the communications array, a quasi-humanoid Cylon (voiced by "Cylon Number Six", Tricia Helfer) tells Dr. Kelly that her enlightened view of Cylons does not change their hatred of her, then snaps her neck. Back on Galactica, Commander Nash explains that the seemingly failed mission actually went as planned. Colonial command had anticipated Dr. Kelly's betrayal, and by the time the Cylons followed the communication, the ghost fleet was long gone and was able to destroy multiple defenseless Cylon bases. Nash tells Adama the casualties of the Osiris were worth the victory, and successes like these keep civilians supporting the war effort. Disillusioned, Adama signs off on a prettified account of the mission. He was then offered his own Viper. A recovered Coker surprises Adama before he goes to his ship, which displays his newly-chosen call sign: "Husker", an apparent tribute to Coker. Adama joins his fellow pilots, ready to continue the fight.

:Enabran, why did you put this here? -- [[User:BlueResistance|BlueResistance]] 14:03, 29 June 2013 (EDT)

:: Because there are parts of the story missing and I do not have the time to edit and interlink this text here. My working station is the german Wiki. But I think it is a good way for you to start editing it from here and put it on the mainpage later when all work is done. -- [[User:Enabran|Enabran]] 14:45, 29 June 2013 (EDT)

:::No, this really isn't such a good way to go about it, since your reason for doing this isn't immediately obvious.  Besides, someone might just copy and paste the unedited Wikipedia text directly onto the main page without rewriting it for our wiki.  If you want to recruit help in writing a summary, then you should probably do it in a more direct way--put out an announcement.  Otherwise, you should wait for another user to see the missing summary and be interested enough in writing it on her/his own, or you can do it yourself later in the future when you have more time.  Believe me, if it's empty for a while longer, it won't be a big deal, so it can wait.  Summaries for many ''Caprica'' episodes have been neglected for a longer time (since October-November 2010) than the ''Blood and Chrome'' summary (since December 2012). -- [[User:BlueResistance|BlueResistance]] 15:54, 29 June 2013 (EDT)