Battlestar Wiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:The Eye of Jupiter/Archive3

2006-12-25T05:49:19Z

Vladimir: Playing with the date?

I wonder if it has to do with that big red spot... *rollseyes* --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:48, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

I'm more reminded of that Writer's Podcast thing, you know when they're saying "How many more times are we going to find an artifact like the Arrow of Apollo and have to search for them all? That feels like going back to the well too many times, I mean what are we going to say, "Athena has 10 sacred toenail clipping scattered across space, you have to find them all...?" :) --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 18:49, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
:i'm thinking along the lines of some jewelry. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:57, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

::It sounds like a good plotline actually. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 19:05, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
:::Merv - you just made me spill forth mein coca cola whilst reading the section about the sacred toenail clippings - thats too much for 3am on a sunday morning! Still, plot looks good, just wish Season 3 would hurry up and AIR dammit! :) --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 21:08, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
::::No, really, they make a joke about "Athena's toenail clippings" in that writer's podcast thing. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:12, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

I have a few possible meanings for 'eye of Jupiter' --[[User:starryniteynite|starryniteynite]]

1) Relatively obscure name for NGC 3242, a planetary nebula (A ring of illuminated gas expanding out from a sun-like star that's exhausted its fuel, and has lost its outer layers) a few thousand light years from Earth. Most astronomers call this 'the Ghost of Jupiter' instead, though some Hubble images have used this name. Its not a very unique PN (tho it has some gas streamers we can't quite explain), but it could be used as a navigational marker like M8 (the lagoon nebula). It is a very pretty nebula :)

2) "Eye of Jupiter" was the Greek/Roman name for the sun, which lead to today's 'all seeing eye' symbol of the free masons and on the pyramid in US currency

3)Adama=Zeus=Jupiter...yes, they tend to use Greek vs. Roman names, but the titles are not always consistent with this convention, and we have also seen evidence for non Greek mythological names (Isis, for example). The rest of it could be wordplay too...'eye' might refer to someone acting as Adama's eyes, rather than his eyes literally (just as 'The captain's hand refereed to Lee acting as Gardner's XO, or his hand, rather than some captain's literal hand)

4)A reference to Jupiter's big red spot, a huge hurricane-like storm on the planet's surface. Just like the "bastille Day" title, this could reference something in the episode, but not directly...they might travel through a similar storm. This has actually been done before in the miniseries, when Galactica travels into the storm at Ragnar

5) The tried and true, ancient object meaning...just like the arrow of Apollo directly references a character, but has no link to the character himself, this could just be a pretty piece of bling..

Personally, I would love #1, but only because it'd make me 2/2 for BSG objects in my thesis and I'm a total, unabashed geek. I think its probably #2, however, and they find some sort of navigational means of finding Earth (like a picture of Earth w/ distances& directions to three pulsars or very unique objects

== Duelling Sharons ==

So did anyone else get a sense of animosity/jealousy between the two Sharons? While it seems that Boomer has accepted her place amongst the Cylons and no longer considers herself a part of the humans, it also seems that she's a bit jealous of Athena's "taking her place", if you could call it that. Likewise, it also seemed that aside from her duties as a Colonial officer, Athena's refusal to let Boomer in with Adama was also somewhat out of personal distrust, ironically the same distrust of the Cylons that her fellow Colonial colleagues have.

Also, while Boomer told Athena about Hera's condition out of possible concern of the child (possible strain of humanity left in her? Cylon imperative? Or something else?), seems to me that Boomer enjoyed bursting her "sister"'s bubble on that. Talk about sibling rivalry there.

It'll be interesting to see if there will be any further Sharon vs. Sharon confrontations in the series.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 23:55, 15 December 2006 (CST)

:It was a very, very interesting dynamic. In any other show, we would have had a knock-down dragout "catfight." You hit the nail on the head. This episode was prime stuff. And, we on the wiki should be commended: our ''Galactica'' nuke count is right on the money! (Either that, or the show is using ''us'' as a source! :) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 00:20, 16 December 2006 (CST)

::Does that mean we can finally change the "Class-D Nuclear Warhead" to something completely different, since their nukes ''aren't'' Class-D? :P --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:42, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Image==
Let's find an image that actually occurs in this episode. Maybe the wide shot of Tyrol in the temple? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 02:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)

Heh which one? to me it seems the Chief was a bit wide in ALL shots ; how could he gain weight while the fleet was starving? the chief definitely deserves the Lee Adama Fat-Ass trophy --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 03:10, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:Maybe it was Chief, and not Dr. Cottle, that got all of Kat's energy bars from the last ep.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 12:25, 16 December 2006 (CST)

So... is someone with the means actually going to replace the image with one relevant to this episode? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 21:12, 20 December 2006 (CST)

:Silly joking aside, I agree that the picture should be replaced. I'd do it, but I don't have a good screencap --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:34, 23 December 2006 (CST)

:I happen to have the episode, so, it's done. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:57, 23 December 2006 (CST)

==Did Starbuck survive?==
Horray for the carelessness of adverts! Within ten minutes we knew the answer to that one. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:14, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Aside from that, it's going to continue the cycle of Soap Opera unease there, if Dee's the one sent to go get Starbuck back. Can't wait to see the uncomfortable stares on that one, especially if (as I suspect) Dee set up Starbuck to be the "eye in the sky" '''hoping''' the Cylons would shoot her down.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 11:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Who else was supposed to fly the mission? Looks like Lee and Kara are the only two qualified pilots on the ground and Lee is needed in overall command. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:34, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Too good to be true==
When we Baltar's voice over ''Galactica'''s speaker, the closed caption actually identifies him as "Cylon over speaker". I know that's not really meant to be taken as anything, but with all the speculation, it seems like a shining goof, or maybe even someone taking a good piss out of the [[Baltar as Cylon speculation|whole thing]]. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:14, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Nuking the Planet==

Does anyone else think that the nuclear missiles have the ability to be detonated remotely, before they reach their target? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:44, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Not to mention abort code transmissions, etc. Makes you wonder if the missiles were set for "one shot, one kill" mode, where they could not be recalled.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 11:39, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Or perhaps the missiles can be aborted, until they reach a critical flight time. Could make for a ''very'' tense moment or two. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:51, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:Is it just me or didn't he actually give the order to fire. He said "release of nuclear weapons is now authorized". That might sound strange, but I took that to be a preliminary order to firing. For example that now even Tigh would be able to launch them on his say --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:03, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::No, you're correct on that; essentially all they were doing was opening the "barn doors". I was discussing the hypotheticals of the missiles, if they should be launched in the next ep.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 19:33, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:::Aye, we're just jumping the gun a little, and discussing possibles ways out of it, if Adama does indeed decide to launch :) --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 02:17, 21 December 2006 (CST)

::::Am I the only one who thinks he might be targeting the nukes for the Raiders on their way to the surface? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:53, 21 December 2006 (CST)

== WTF moment ==

I was on the [[Karl Agathon]] page, updating it for this ep's news, when I came across [[:Image:Valley_of_Darkness-Starbuck_Helo.jpg|this old picture]]. Considering how Kara's painting looks and that she's religious (though not indoctrinated in any sort of clerical form, unlike Chief Tyrol's parentage), does anyone think that (in hindsight), this may have been a hint to the Eye itself?--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 12:37, 16 December 2006 (CST)
: It actually makes a lot of sense... Taking Zeus to mean Admiral Adama, and that Kara Thrace is the go-to pilot for reconnaissance missions, AND the paintings on the walls, we have a plausible theory in the works! —The preceding '''unsigned''' comment was added by {{User|Alcibiades}}.
: Are you kidding me?! They set this episode up a year ago! --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 19:39, 16 December 2006 (CST)
: I find it pretty hard to believe too, but that painting ''really really really'' looks like the art in the temple. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 20:41, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Maybe they though it would be a nice idea to take that painting, put it in the Temple more than a season later, and see if we notice. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:20, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::It's a painting in her room and part of the column in the temple. :) --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:31, 19 December 2006 (CST)
: So Starbuck is an artist. She paints The Eye of Jupiter. Is it a known symbol or is this the first time anyone else has seen it? If it's not well-known, what does that say about Starbuck? Doesn't it make her prescient? Maybe her true calling is as an oracle. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:29, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::I'm with Catrope here. If I'm remembering my "Valley Of Darkness" podcast correctly, Tahmoh and Katee painted the apartment themselves, without any direction from Ron or the rest of the show crew. It's quite possible that someone noticed that particular pattern and decided to make it significant. And, hey, maybe she ''is'' an Oracle who just hasn't realized that she has the gift. Give the girl some chamalla and see what she can do. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Starbuck found a spiritual calling to fill the enormous gaps in her soul that she tries to fill with sex, booze, speed, duty, and violence. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 13:33, 19 December 2006 (CST)
:A friend of mine told me he though the painting and the decoration looked a lot like a star or an explosion, and then brought up the word "supernova". Could this picture be some sort of reference to the star going supernova? (I must admit I'm contradicting myself here, because I said earlier I thought the similarity to be some sort of an inside joke. Of course it's possible that Sackhoff&Penikett accidentally painted something that looked like an explosion, and that's why the writers chose that particular painting.) --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:36, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== 18 Casualties & Relevance to "The Passage" ==

If 18 people were lost from '''The Passage''' episode, that means that 17 (at most) were aboard those two lost civilian ships, right? I'm only bringing this up to clarify what transpired — from that, and what we saw, the Raptors would pair up with a civilian ship, and that ship's passenger complement would be transferred onto ''Galactica'' (more heavily shielded, combat FTL drive) for the ferry run through the cluster. The civilian ship would then be crewed by an absolute bare minimum number of crewers. Then, when the group reached the other side of the cluster, the passengers would be transported back to their ships (if they survived the passage), the ships would remain at "Algae-planet", and ''Galactica'' would turn around and go back to the original side to repeat the cycle over again for a new group of civilian ships?

Am I reading/viewing this right? -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 13:53, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:The ships were manned by skeleton crews. That was even mentioned in "The Passage" --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 14:01, 16 December 2006 (CST)

: Don't forget that 14 days have transpired. there could have been more births in the fleet. I just came up with the difference from the two episodes--[[User:Quig|Quig]] 16:10, 16 December 2006 (CST)

== Humanoid Cylons recognize each other on sight ==

While back on New Craprica, Number 3 knew right away that it was Sharon Agathon. Of course, who else would be trying to remove the ship's launch keys?

This episode, we see that Athena knew on sight that this Number Eight was Boomer. Interesting.

Can Cylons tell on sight which of the copies they are? It's already established that the bulletheads can't.

Note in last weeks episode, Baltar was able to pick The D'anna number three out of the hallway on sight, even though there is an identically dressed number three in the same hallway. [[User:Belay-down-your-burdens|Belay-down-your-burdens]] 16:50, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Those two instances do prove that they do recognize one another, which was hinted at in the "[[Cylon Agent]]" page. I guess now it's more than a hint. --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 16:54, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Names of marines==
Has anyone heard (or seen in close captions) the names of the marines that were with Starbuck and Dualla? I know one of them is [[Fischer]], but the other three? I heard something like: Criggs, Verek, Ditko. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 17:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:According to the caption, it's Griggs and Varrick; the spelling/pronouncation of the third lad is anyone else's guess. For some reason, the closed caption for this episode doesn't pick up everything for me. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:48, 17 December 2006 (CST)

::OK, we know that it's [[Fischer]], [[Griggs]], [[Varrick]], [[Henick]] and [[Ditko]]. Since after she says "Henick and Ditko" the camera centers first on the black guy and then on the bald guy, can we assume that the first one is Henick and the latter one is Ditko, and the one in a hat is Griggs? It's conjectural, but looks reasonable to me and it would be nice to add pictures to their articles. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 14:46, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Location of the Eye? ==

At the end of the episode, Tyrol says something about "the sky will open, and the eye will be revealed." Did that make anyone else think of the star going nova? -- [[User:Benabik|Benabik]] 22:15, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Good idea, but is it possible that such a "blowup" could be predicted in the sacred scrolls thousands of years ago? -- [[User:SuperMMX|SuperMMX]] 01:15, 17 December 2006 (CST)
::Why not? A race of humans capable of traveling from Kobol to Earth probably knows at least as much about stellar evolution as the Colonials [[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 07:39, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:: The [[Sacred Scrolls]] have so far contained information about [[Laura Roslin]] being sick, [[Sharon Agathon]] helping them to find the [[Tomb of Athena]], and more... In addition to various prophetic dreams... Sure, they could have predicted it. -- [[User:Benabik|Benabik]] 11:26, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:When Tyrol commented about blowing up the Temple, I already thought "What if the Eye is INSIDE the pillar and they have to blow it up to get it out?" But surely an explosion destroying the entire system would destroy the Eye as well? And if it didn't, the Eye would not be easy to find between the debris of an entire planet. But blowing up a pillar doesn't exactly qualify as "the sky will open"... Maybe it refers to blowing up the roof or something like that... --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:04, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:: Note the shaft of light streaming across the central pillar in the final scenes of the episode. Perhaps something will be revealed when it becomes centered upon the prominent symbol seen there. --[[User:Spidey3|Spidey3]] 12:29, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::That was the way my mind was working. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:39, 18 December 2006 (CST)

== Boomer in the brig? ==

Did Boomer get thrown in the galactica brig once Athena pointed her out? Was she allowed to return to the Basestars? [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 01:49, 17 December 2006 (CST)

I doubt it because they probably would have it done right there rather than holding her outside first. I'm sure they let her leave with the others and advised her not to let the door hit on the arse on the way out. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:46, 17 December 2006 (CST)

:Besides, the least thing they need on ''Galactica'' right now would be Boomer to break out of the brig, throw on a uniform and have a "Guess the Sharon" contest. Aside from that, I expect that kind of trite plotwork I just mentioned from lesser sci-fi series, not this one.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 19:37, 18 December 2006 (CST)

== Summary ==

We really need a longer summary up there, the only point it currently mentions is kind of random -_- --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:58, 17 December 2006 (CST)

== D'anna's search for the five vs. the Temple of Five ==

I haven't seen much discussion on the connection between "the five" Cylons and the Temple of the Five. Since the Temple was built by the 13th tribe, a connection doesn't seem likely in a conventional linear timeline; but like the painting in Starbuck's apartment, it's hard to dismiss as a mere coincidence.

Such a connection does, however, clear up some verisimilitude issues for me – namely, the rate at which the Cylon's biological technology advanced in relation to both Cylon and Colonial conventional technology.

In less than 40 years' time, the Cylons were able to develop the Cylon Agents – and in such a way that made indiscernable from humans – and all of the ressurection technology that went with it. Meanwhile, their conventional, mechanical technology hasn't made nearly the same leaps. And Colonial technology hasn't advanced much at all. Pegasus was a much more formidable vessel than Galactica, but only in terms of size and firepower. Technologically speaking, they weren't that dissimilar. Everyone's still using nuclear missles as their most advanced form of weaponry.

Clearly, the Cylons have had a little help. Now, with dual references to a group of five that must not be named, we're starting to get an idea of from where that help may have come.

I'm not sure how that jibes with the Cylon's monotheistic religion (also established within those 40 years), versus the Colonies' polytheism, but I'm sure Mr.Moore has it worked out.

How great it is to have a show with a fleshed out story line already established, as opposed to the "make it up as we go" approach to shows like Star Trek (all incarnations), X-Files and Lost over our last 40 years. {{unsigned|Tylonius}}

:To ''Battlestar's'' credit, it did take a while to flesh out the story from a viewer's perspective, but what we know is quite intriguing. Their God and the Colonial gods may be one and the same, and may change how the Cylons treat the Colonials and vice versa. I don't think the five faces will be all shown, but we might see one. And yes, it is good to enjoy a show that makes a greater effort to maintain a consistent storyline. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:01, 18 December 2006 (CST)

::Time may not be an issue. Remember the Colonial Scriptures are full of prophecies, it wouldn't be too farfetched to assume that the Temple of Five could've been constructed for something before it happened, for the purpose of making it happen in due time.

::The Five could do whatever releated them to the temple much like Roslin is directly related to finding the tomb Athena, even though she lived thousands of years after everything else was set.

::This is all speculation, of course, but oh well....--[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 13:59, 19 December 2006 (CST)

:::The Final Five are directly connected to the Temple of Five: http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2006/12/one_of_the_cent.html -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 16:16, 20 December 2006 (CST)

::::“Essentially the Temple of the Five is directly connected to the five Cylons we have not seen.” - RDM
::::I've been thinking about the ambiguous ''sins'' the [[Hybrid]] mentions, that appear to be in regards to the Five. My working theory is that the five priests who served "The One Who Cannot Be..." and the Five Cylon Models who served the Cylon God both committed the ''sin'' of Rebellion, and that both dieties they rebelled against are one and the same. I also (big leap now), think that Model One is among the Rebel Five. Being rebel ''Angels of God'' (as Virtual-Six refers to herself), that would make One the RDM-equivalent to TOS-Lucifer, now wouldn't it? Chief and first of the (from the cylon perspective) "fallen" angels (as opposed to speculation that One ''is'' the Cylon God) --[[User:Viperetto13|Viperetto13]] 02:16, 23 December 2006 (CST)

== Human Nicknames ==
I cropped the following from the episode summary. Nothing against either point, just taking it off until somebody can figure out how to reconcile it into a single level deep bullet point (or points).
Cropped text:
*This is the first time the Cylons use "human" names on the basestar when not speaking to Baltar. D'Anna is named by Caprica-Six and another Number Three. Cavil's name is used by D'Anna.
**It is possible that these names are nicknames for the Cylons who've been amongst the humans (much like Caprica-Six), but it could also be the writers weaseling out of coming up with numbers for Cavil, [[Leoben Conoy|Leoben]] and [[Simon]]. In ''[[The Passage]]'', D'Anna even mentions having a discussion with "one of the Simons".
Thanks. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:51, 18 December 2006 (CST)

Err how about:
*This episode marks the first time the Cylons use "human" names when not speaking to Baltar: Caprica-Six and another Three call D'Anna by her human name, who in turn uses Cavil's name. These could be nicknames for Cylons who've been living among humans (cf. [[Caprica-Six]]).
*Once again, the writers have dodged the issue of [[Cavil]]'s, [[Leoben Conoy|Leoben]]'s and [[Simon]]'s numbers. In "[[Torn]]", Caprica-Six says "The ones you know as Leoben...", in "[[The Passage]]" Number Three mentions having a discussion with "one of the Simons" and in this episode a Three simply calls one of the Cavils "Cavil".

Please correct my style here, I didn't know exactly how to quote/paraphrase things like "one of the Simons" etc. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:12, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:One bullet point might be enough if the second part is connected with a word like "thus". However we shouldn't use "weasling". It sounds too negative and critical where criticism isn't really needed. Maybe something like "dodging the issue" or "circumventing"? That means the same and isn't as POV.
:Btw: episode names aren't italicized, but put in quotation marks --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:12, 18 December 2006 (CST)

Edit first post, episode titles quoted instead of italicized, second bullet point reprashed and "weaseling" changed to "dodged".
I don't think joining the bullet points with "this" between them is going to make this any clearer. I also don't think it's necessary, as both points may be related but analyse different things (the remaining numbers vs. Cylon naming convention). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:28, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:I think the writers are working with established names for convenience. They may not want to create a number yet to not confuse some viewers or there may be a grand scheme of introducing more numbers later in the season or another season that involves the 5 unknown cylon models. They could be maintaining flexibility for themselves in this case. They also know that the people who care the most are us die-hard fans and they can drag us through the mud without giving us more info, but I don't think so with as generous and courteous as Ngarenn is on BW:OC.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 11:10, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::It wouldn't be too hard to introduce a new number though. We've heard plenty of statements like "We Threes think we can't take the risk.", ideal statements to introduce new numbers with. Of course these numbers aren't a big deal, but die-hard fans tend to like to know these details. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 11:37, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::True. Though the more detail the introduce, the more chances they have to get it wrong. Even with the few model numbers we have revealed RDM sometimes has [[Podcast:The_Passage#Act_1|difficulty keeping them straight]], confusing the Eight's (Sharons) with the Three's (D'annas). Either way, we'll be here, documenting. I sometimes wonder if we're (the die-hard detail documenters) aren't his worst nightmares (if we even bothers thinking about us). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:52, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::::I always thought it was a nice nod to buckaroo banzai where all the villains had the same first name. [[User:Azselendor|Azselendor]] 22:05, 18 December 2006 (CST)

== Question on article ==

*When did [[Sharon Valerii|Boomer]] go over to the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons']] way of thinking? In this episode she clearly doesn't seem to think of herself as human anymore like she did in "[[Downloaded]]."
:I had assumed that by LDYB, II that the Cylons had gone over to Boomer and Caprica-Six's way of thinking, hence their (C-six and Boomer) sudden rise to power as well as the sudden Cylon cease-fire. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:24, 19 December 2006 (CST)

== Hera ==

I cannot believe that Adm. Adama has apparently no idea what happened to Hera. He was involved in this discussion in [[Downloaded]]. He should knew that Hera and her foster mother moved to [[New Caprica]]. I am very surprised that he became so angry after Roslin told him that she kept the child in her school. --[[User:Akagi|Akagi]] 17:21, 19 December 2006 (CST)
:Adama and Roslin only agreed in "[[Downloaded]]" that Sharon cannot be allowesd raise the baby. Maybe he assumed/was told that Hera was killed by Cottle? [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 17:34, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::That they concluded at the discussion that the child should be killed would fit with this episode events and Baltars look at the end of "Downloaded" when being chided by his internal six. However that option was mentioned onscreen and the entire tone of the conversation at that point makes it seem somewhat unlikely that this would been the final decision. Given that Baltar was never in on the adoption-plot (he apparently didn't know Hera was alive on New Caprica) and we now know Adama didn't know about it either the discussion outcome must have been either to kill the child or to postpone the decision (with Heras apparent death solving the problem). I'm quite willing to buy that Adama believed the child had died a natural death, given that complication in a hybrid between man and machine were to exspected. But I have troubles with Roslin doing it all behind Adamas back (why did she have to do that?) and Adama not making a decision whatever immediately (in Downloaded). [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 17:40, 21 December 2006 (CST)

== Recent Summary Reorganization Problems ==

I'm normally OK about reorganization of a summary, but the recent one handled by SgtPayne creates more work and confusion. Links previously added are missing, conventions once there are missing, and the narrative flow of the summary is extremely confusing. Normally we can break up events by location (events on Galactica, basestars, planets) because they are mostly separate events that don't directly connect, but this episode has both Cylons and Colonial events occurring in response to each other and in "real-time." I am ''this close'' to rolling back the summary and adding edits made afterwards to restore both narrative flow and conventions, but I wanted comments from others first. As an admin I would just roll it back because of all the wikilinking and convention breakage, but it's more than that. Comments? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:36, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:This is one that I might suggest we do "Act" reporting summary. So the events are intertwined. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:56, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::::I believe that's exactly what the summary contained before that infamous edit: a chronological report of the events in this episode. Since everything and everyone interacts with eachother and is at the same place, that would be a logical choice. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:03, 20 December 2006 (CST) (I hate edit conflicts)
:I haven't checked it for style and links, but I agree that the summary should be chronological. Splitting up the locations is fine if they aren't related. But as you said, here they are heavily interwined and dependent on each other --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:57, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:'''Revert.''' It looked better the way it was. The new split makes for a very confusing read. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 11:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)

I have reverted the article and restored relevant edits made after that reorganization. One persistant edit that I keep changing involves the "shaft of light" in the Temple as Tyrol is inspecting the symbology in the Temple. That "shaft" is Tyrol's flashlight beam. While that direct light ''might'' do something unexpected as it approaches the central target-shaped symbol, it's not coming from some mystic source within the structure. I've clarified this in the article. Contributors are always free to edit it, but its fairly clear, so analysis should be used to interpret what it might do. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:48, 20 December 2006 (CST)

In light of the recent reversion, I should drop my two cents in regarding the "reorganization". When I first read the article, I felt that it was too "narrative" rather than "summary", which is what the section suggests. The consolidation was an attempt to make the information as concise as possible. I also attempted to keep as many reference links as necessary. In regards to the location split, this was done in line with previous articles, which had definitive locations. My apologies if it confused readers, but it should be said that summaries are just that, and should not be play-by-play accounts of the episode. --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 12:18, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:The location split you introduced is good practice when there are multiple storylines that do not interfere with eachother. A nice example of that is "[[You Can't Go Home Again]]". In most episodes this is the case (end s1-begin s2 even had 3 or 4 separate storylines), but in this particular episode the three locations affect eachother so greatly that the split you introduced makes for extemely confusing reading: a bullet point in the basestar story references events told in the Galactica part, and viceverse. (Let's not even start about the Algae Planet part). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:45, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::You bring up a good point. In trying to put it together, there were some areas where I wasn't sure where to put it. On the whole, I was looking to clean it up a bit. Trying to read it line-for-line blurs out after a while... --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 14:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:::I've broken up the summary into acts. It seems to solve both problems. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 18:24, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::::aye. nice job. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:34, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:::::I concur. It definitely cleans up the look of the page. --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 22:55, 20 December 2006 (CST)

==Missile Tubes==
Where exactly are they and shouldnt that be an article in "Galactica Areas" Snorkel378

== More Nested Analysis ==
*The [[tylium]] planned for the mines could only come from their single Raptor. This supports the [[Substances in the Re-imagined Series#The Tylium Question|high energy yield of the fuel]] that, at the same time, would not sacrifice the Raptor's flight ability.
**It's also possible that the tylium used was fuel stored at the camp to power its generators and/or refuel the Raptors and other ships involved in the harvest.
Please resolve these into either one or two single-level bullets, then re-add to the article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:56, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:Done. I also updated the nuke count in this section. Admiral Adama orders launch tubes four through ten loaded, which means he's prepared seven nuclear warheads, not six. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 09:05, 22 December 2006 (CST)
::Nicely done. Thanks! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:51, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Playing with the date? ==

In Kobol's Last Gleaming, they stated the ruins on Kobol were 2000 years old, "around the time of the exodus of the 13 tribes". When they found the beacon at the Lion's Head Nebula, they said it was 3000 years old, and now they're saying the Temple of Five is at least 4000 years old. Each time they give a new date a thousand years earlier, it seems to still coincide with the exodus date of the thirteenth tribe.

Am I the only one noticing this inconsistancy?

Sacred Scrolls

2006-12-20T04:41:06Z

Vladimir: /* General Questions */

{{cleanup}}

[[Image:Pythia.jpg|right|thumb|A portion of the Sacred Scrolls, specifically, a portion of the Book of [[Pythia]].]]
The '''Sacred Scrolls''' are a set of writings the form the basis of [[Religion in the Twelve Colonies|Colonial religion]], a polytheistic faith resembling the legends of ancient Greece. The scrolls record much of the alleged history of humanity, including life on [[Kobol]] before the great exodus, and the legend of [[Earth]]. Portions of the scrolls are used in religious ceremonies, such as the Service of the Dead ([[Miniseries]], [[Act of Contrition]]).

Most notable among the Sacred Scrolls is the Book of Pythia, also referred to as the Pythian Prophecy. Written 3,600 years ago by the oracle [[Pythia]], they are believed by some to foretell the current exodus from the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]].

==Contents==
The contents of the Sacred Scrolls have only been revealed to us in glimpses, through brief quotes, paraphrases and explanations throughout the series. This section serves to catalog those snippets, and is followed by more detailed analysis.

===The Book of [[Pythia]]===
:'''Roslin:''' Who is Pythia? '''Elosha:''' One of the [[oracle]]s in the Sacred Scrolls. 3,600 years ago. Pythia wrote about the exile and rebirth of the human race. ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

====The Cycle of Time====
:'''Leoben:''' ''"All this has happened before, and all of it will happen again."'' ([[Flesh and Bone]])

:'''Six:''' ''"All this has happened before, and all this will happen again."'' ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

:'''Roslin:''' If you believe in the gods, then you believe in the cycle of time that we are all playing our parts in a story that is told again, and again, and again throughout eternity. ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]])

====The Dying Leader====
:'''Elosha:''' ''"And the lords anointed a leader to guide the Caravan of the Heavens to their new homeland."'' ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

:'''Elosha:''' She also wrote that the new leader suffered a wasting disease and would not live to enter the new land. ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

:'''Roslin:''' The scriptures tell us a dying leader lead humanity to the promised land. ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]])

====A Vision of Serpents====
:'''Elosha:''' ''"And unto the leader they gave a vision of serpents numbering two and ten, as a sign of things to come."'' ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

====The Serpents Lead the People Into Battle?====
:'''Six:''' ''"Led by serpents numbering two and ten..."'' (fragment) ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

====A Confrontation at the Home of the Gods====
:'''Six:''' ''"Though the outcome favored the few, it led to a confrontation at the home of the gods."'' ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]])

====The Lower Demon====
:'''Elosha:''' The scrolls of Pythia do speak of a [[Sharon Agathon|lower demon]], who helped the people in a time of crisis. ([[Home, Part I]])

====The Blaze and the High Road====
:'''Elosha:''' ''"And the blaze pursued them, and the people of Kobol had a choice. To board the great ship, or take the high road through the rocky ridge."'' 
:'''Valerii (continuing):''' ''"And the body of each tribe's leader was offered to the gods in the [[tomb of Athena]]."'' And the great ship was the [[galleon]] that departed from here, where we're standing. And it took the founders of the thirteen colonies to their destiny. And those that didn't board the galleon took the high road, a rocky ridge that lead to the tomb. ([[Home, Part I]])

:'''Elosha:''' The path is supposed to be marked by gravestones. ([[Home, Part I]])

====The Gates of Hera====
:'''Valerii:''' That's the spot where your god supposedly stood and watched Athena throw herself down onto the rocks below, out of despair over the Exodus of the thirteen tribes. Athena's tomb, whoever or whatever she really was, is probably up there. ([[Home, Part II]])

====The Arrow of Apollo====
:'''Roslin:''' ''"And the Arrow of Apollo will open the Tomb of Athena."'' ([[Home, Part II]])

:'''Elosha:''' The scriptures tell us that Kobol points the way to Earth. ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]])

:'''Roslin:''' According to the scriptures, if we had the arrow of Apollo we could take it down to Kobol and we could use it to open the tomb of Athena and find our way to Earth. ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]])

====Kobol and the Blood Price====
:'''Adama:''' ''"And [[Zeus, Lord of Kobol|Zeus]] warned the leaders of the twelve tribes that any return to Kobol would exact a price in blood."'' ([[Home, Part II]])

===History===

====Pre-Exodus====
:'''Elosha:''' This place is Kobol... birthplace of mankind, where the gods and men lived in paradise until the exodus of the thirteen tribes. ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]])

====The Exodus====
:'''Elosha:''' How old are the ruins? '''[[Billy Keikeya]]:''' Well, we won't know for sure until we send a ground team, but the initial estimates have it on the order of approximately 2,000 years. '''Elosha:''' That's around the time the thirteen tribes first left Kobol. ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]])

====The Thirteenth Tribe on Earth====
:'''Starbuck:''' The scriptures say that when the thirteenth tribe landed on Earth, they looked up into the heavens and they saw their twelve brothers. ([[Home, Part II]])

===Other verses from the Sacred Scrolls===
*'''Adama:''' "Life here began out there." These are the first words of the Sacred Scrolls… ([[Miniseries]])
*During a [[Salt Line Ceremony]] on ''Galactica'': "Their enemies will divide them. Their colonies broken in the fiery chasm of space. Their shining days renounced by a multitude of dark sacrifices. Yet still they will remain always together" ([[Exodus, Part I]]).

===Sayings===
:'''Commander Adama:''' ''"The gods shall lift those who lift each other."'' ([[Home, Part II]])
:'''[[Cavil]]:''' ''"The gods lift up those who lift each other."'' ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]])
:'''[[Duck]]:''' ''"The gods help those who help themselves."'' ([[Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance|The Resistance]])

These sayings are similar to the [[Wikipedia:Algernon Sydney|Algernon Sydney]] quote "God helps those who help themselves".

==Notes==

The Cycle of Time is apparently a key component of Colonial theology. The notion of a circular progression of time (also known as [[Wikipedia:Eternal return|eternal return]] or eternal recurrence) is foreign to the ancient Greek religion of which Colonial religion are largely based, but it is a common theme in other religions. Some Hindus believe in an endless cycle of ages called [[Wikipedia:Yuga|Yugas]]. The ancient [[Wikipedia:Maya|Maya]] people, as well as the [[Wikipedia:Inca|Incas]] and [[Wikipedia:Aztec|Aztecs]] also believed in the circular nature of time. In philosophy, the [[Wikipedia:Stoics|Stoics]], a movement originating in ancient Greece, held the doctrine. In the nineteenth century, the doctrine appears in the writings of [[Wikipedia:Friedrich Nietzsche|Friedrich Nietzsche]] as a method of life-affirmation.

The book of Pythia, which contains or is identical to the Pythian Prophecy, was written 1,600 years before the exodus of the thirteen tribes from Kobol, and yet it apparently contains a detailed narrative of the events of the Exodus, and continues to be interpreted as a source of prophecy 2,000 years after its prophecies have (apparently) already been fulfilled. We may thus interpret the entire text as a prophecy, since the events it describes can be firmly dated to a point well after its text was written.

==Analysis==

===Correspondences===
Assuming the events following the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies]] are a repetition of the events predicted by Pythia, and which came to pass centuries later, we can make use of the prophecy by first constructing a coherent historical narrative from them and then looking for correspondences with the events of the series.

*The Lower Demon is [[Sharon Valerii (Caprica copy)|the Caprica copy of Sharon Valerii]]
*The Dying Leader is President [[Laura Roslin]]
*The "serpents numbering two and ten" are the [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]]s of Strike Force Two in the [[Battle for the Tylium Asteroid]].
*The fleet defended by the [[Battlestar (RDM)|Battlestar]] ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' is the "Caravan of the Heavens".
*The "price in blood" has been paid by various people including [[Crashdown]] and [[Elosha]].

===The "One Exodus" Interpretation===
This interpretation assumes that the timeline is recurring on a scale of 1,600 to 2,000 years, and the exodus from Kobol is directly parellel to the exodus from the Twelve Colonies. It also makes some correspondences in addition to those above:

*The "Blaze" identified by Sharon Valerii is an earlier parallel to the cylon attack. The hostile force is the "jealous God", the Lord of Kobol that tried to elevate himself over the others.
*The Home of the Gods is [[Kobol]], and the people of [[Kobol]] are the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]], in a somewhat metaphorical sense.

The timeline would procede thus:

#The people of Kobol lived in divine utopia with their gods.
#A hostile force - of which "the blaze" and the "lower demon" were parts - moves against the people of Kobol.
#The gods appoint a leader afflicted with a wasting disease to lead a "caravan of the heavens".
#The leader, with the aid of twelve "serpents", wins a perilous battle.
#The people make their way to the "home of the gods".
#Athena despairs and commits suicide.
#The leaders of the people are taken to the Tomb of Athena to be sacrificed to the remaining gods.
#The body of the people depart in a "[[galleon]]" for the colonies.
#Instructions are left to open the Tomb of Athena.
#Zeus warns against a return to Kobol.
#The twelve tribes settle on the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]]. The thirteen tribe settles on [[Earth]].

====Questions and Predictions====
*Can [[Earth]] be at once the "promised land" in this iteration and the last?
*Can we expect the deaths of the leaders of the tribes (the [[Quorum of Twelve]]?) to propitiate the Gods?

This history is admittedly not especially coherent, but suggests the possibility of predicting at least some unfulfilled pieces of scripture. Another interpretation which deals with the repetition of historical events on a larger scale is offered below.

===The "Three Exodi" Interpretation===
This interpretation does not assume that the flight from the [[Twelve Colonies]] mirror the original exodus from [[Kobol]]. Instead, it assumes that these two exodi are part of the same event-continuum and posits a third, implied, exodus. Like the "One Exodus" interpretation, this one assumes that Pythia's prophecies have and will come true. Below is the proposed order of events for Pythia's prophecies:

#The people of Kobol live in divine utopia with their Gods.
#The "blaze" moves against the people of Kobol.
#The body of the people depart in a "[[galleon]]" for the colonies (the four inset items are roughly concurrent).
#*Athena despairs and commits suicide.
#*The leaders of the people are taken to the Tomb of Athena to be sacrificed to the remaining gods.
#*Instructions are left to open the Tomb of Athena.
#*Zeus warns against a return to Kobol.
#The twelve tribes settle on the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]]. The thirteenth tribe settles on [[Earth]].
#The Cylons decimate the Twelve Colonies (Whether this is prophesied is unknown, but this clearly happened).
#The gods appoint a leader afflicted with a wasting disease to lead a "caravan of the heavens".
#The leader, with the aid of twelve "serpents", wins a perilous battle.
#The people make their way to the "home of the gods".
#A "lower demon" helps the people of Kobol find the Tomb of Athena.

Note, too, that this is only a part of the story according to the "Three Exodi" interpretation. It assumes that passages not yet revealed in the series outline (however vaguely) the finding of Earth and some time spent there, and then an event that spurs a migration back to Kobol. In this interpretation, the people of Kobol are actually the remnants of [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|the Twelve Colonies]], both their descendants and their ancestors. From there, the cycle starts again. The cycle is much longer in this interpretation (roughly 4,000 years, as opposed to roughly 1,600-2,000 years)

It is helpful to think of no particular part as the beginning. This is how the pictures of the constellations (only visible from Earth) would be accessible to the people of Kobol "before" any of them had been to Earth. It also explains how the Scrolls can speak about the fate of the Thirteenth Colony and yet be in the possession of people from the Twelve Colonies. In fact, when Pythia was writing about the events in the show, she might have been recording fairly-recent history, rather that far-future prophesy. The vagueness would be mostly due to nearly 4,000 years of linguistic drift, rather than due to the mists of prophecy.

Basically, this interpretation asserts a roughly 3,600-4,000 year cycle which can be illustrated by this crude flow-chart:<br\>
Kobol > Colonies, Colonies > Earth, Earth > Kobol

One description of this theory is as follows:

According to the ancient scriptures of Pythia (which say: “All this has happened before. All this will happen again.”), humanity undergoes a cycle of civilisation, in which humanity advances technologically, but from this seed of advancement and power grows evil and corruption that sows humanities own roots of destruction. Pythia tells how the civilisation of humanity periodically rises and falls, and often has to start over again.

When this need arises, the remnants of the civilisation of the established 12 tribes of humanity might have to return to the last ancestral home of their forefathers, in order to locate the directions to the 13th tribe which left Kobol before the other 12 tribes, which could be seen as a backup pocket of humanity to be located and germinated technologically if the main civilisation should fall.

This 13th pocket of humanity, (Earth), probably develops much slower technologically than the rest of their brother tribes, and so once found by the remnants of the other fallen 12 tribes (the fleet) would probably see these spaceships, technologies and the people aboard them as superhuman, godlike even.

As in history, when civilisations accelerate too fast in technology, they can become unstable, and dangerous, paranoid with conflicting nations or even within themselves, and so the fleet (those from the “caravan of the heavens”), not wanting to cause panic and deterioration of Earth's society, would probably call upon Earth’s religious beliefs system to explain their presence and technology.

Those from the space fleet would declare to the people of Earth that yes, they are indeed the gods the people of Earth have been worshipping, (which would be the same as the fleet's too, since the belief systems stem from the same root), and that they (the fleet), who would probably call themselves Lords not gods, have come to take the people of earth to live in harmony with them, to the land of the gods.

At some point, the fleet would realise how this cyclic order of civilisation occurs, and their part in it, and so the fleet would take the last pocket of humanity with them to start live elsewhere, on a planet somewhere distant from earth, rich in natural resources to be potentially exploited and mined later, which leaders of the fleet’s Quorum of Twelve (having to call themselves “Lords”) would call Kobol. The Lords of Kobol take them there to rekindle the civilisation (in the eyes of the remnants of the previous 12 tribes), and in the eyes of the people of the 13th tribes, to live in the city and land of the gods.

In this new land, a few cities would be first built by the Lords of Kobol for the people of earth to live in, and the advanced technology of the fleet could be kept out of reach from the main population of the new planet of Kobol until a later time. Maybe one ship would be situated at the top of a mountain, possibly called Olympus, (keeping with religious doctrine as the home of the gods) as a link between the primitive civilisation on the planet surface and the ships still in the planets orbit protecting the planet.

No doubt some people higher up in the old Earth’s (new Kobolian’s) society (politicians, possibly believers in faith), would be told the truth, to integrate Earth’s leaders in the affairs of running the planet and developing technology publicly on Kobol. Also, the remnants of at least the civilians from the old fleet would wish to leave the fleets’ ships and live with the new budding civilisation, emerging in the new civilisation as a new set of 12 tribes which people from earth would integrate themselves into, continuing the cycle of the civilisation of the tribes of Kobol.
Eventually, as the civilisations structure, political cohesion and publicly known technology increases on Kobol, more and more power would get relinquished to the new leaders of the 12 tribes on Kobol, and less power is held by the old leaders (Lords of Kobol), seated at Olympus. Technology would increase on Kobol to a point where by it’s possible once again for public space exploration.

In terms of what the Lords of Kobol have now become, at this stage in Kobol’s development, they would have almost died out as a race of humans, having integrated into Kobol’s new civilisation of 12 tribes, and would have dismantled all of the ships and technological facilities they didn’t need any more (like the old fleet) as to hide their true nature from the budding new tribes. They would have withdrawn from society almost, communicating through trusted religious and political tribe leaders, and as a community would hold a skeleton command, guiding the tribes until they are ready once again to leave Kobol and control their own destiny.

The Lords of Kobol, once their new growing civilisation of 12 tribes is ready, would make preparations to carry on the cycle of demographic movement and would secretly (hidden from the public knowledge of Kobol) assemble a 13th tribe, which contained a diverse selection of people from all the 12 tribes in Kobol. The Lords of Kobol would take this small, backup pocket civilisation to another safe, habitable planet, settle them there, plot 12 new constellations from the sky seen from that planet to use as a clue as to how to get to this pocket civilisation from Kobol, should the need ever arise to find them. The Lords of Kobol would leave a recognisable astronomical phenomenon amongst the clues that would be recognised easily by a well travelled space race, to point them in the right direction to Earth.

At the same time, the Lords of Kobol would make some reason for their children civilisation to have to leave from Kobol. This would be either a natural disaster or something else like stressing to the new civilisation of tribes that it is time they found their own place in the galaxy, and this would lead the now established new 12 tribes of Kobol to start making preparations for an exodus to a new land, either found by the Lords of Kobol or themselves. Some of the community of people descended and living still with the Lords of Kobol might not want this cycle to continue, might want the people of Kobol to know the truth, which might instigate conflict amongst the “gods”, and this war might trigger the 12 tribes to leave of their own accord.

The people of Kobol would have been kept naive to the Lords of Kobol’s true identity (as that of a previous race of colonies of Kobol), but would have advanced by this point to an understanding of the technology of space travel. The new tribes are instructed/ would have each incorporated patterns (made from the constellations seen as from Earth) into each of the new 12 tribes’ flags (as a hidden clue unknown to most in the tribes) born from the 12 tribes of Kobol, as they leave Kobol to spread the wings of a new civilisation of humanity in the galaxy.

What remains of the race of the Lords of Kobol? One can only speculate. They would probably have dissolved completely, integrating themselves fully into the Twelve Colonies setting out from Kobol, or followed them, keeping a distance but developing so far ahead technologically as to be able to communicate unconsciously with people in the new colonies, through thought somehow. It would explain how prominent figures in both series were able to know events and insights which are unexplainable otherwise, but the only way of knowing what happened is to wait and see.

===The Form of the Scrolls===

The Sacred Scrolls have been seen as an actual, ornate scroll (similar to a [[Wikipedia:Torah|torah]], as shown in the [[Miniseries]]), as well as a book (Both Adama and Roslin read what appear to be identically-created books in "[[Home, Part II]]").

The total volume of the Scrolls has not been revealed, so it is possible (albeit improbable) that the scroll that [[Elosha]] holds in the [[Miniseries]] as she swears in President Roslin and holds during the Service for the Dead may make up only a portion of the total texts, or key readings from the works. A shortened volume may not be different from the Roman Catholic Church's use of [[Wikipedia:Missal|missals]]: A specialized volume containing prayers and readings specific to a celebrant's use during [[temple]] ceremonies, Services for the Dead, weddings, [[dedication ceremony|dedication ceremonies]] and the like.

Much of the Scrolls appear to be handwritten. While the technology of the Twelve Colonies obviously support electronic printing and reproduction, it may be that the most authentic copies of the sacred texts are either authentic reproductions from a handwritten copy, or genuine handwritten copies. This practice may be for reasons of authenticity, custom, or aesthetics. The practice is similar to the work and purposes of the [[Wikipedia:Scribes|scribes]] before the invention of the printing press in real-Earth history. For comparison, an extreme example of the tradition of handwritten sacred texts in real-Earth history are the [[Wikipedia:Sefer Torah|sefer Torahs]].

===The Service of the Dead===

The final rites to the dead offered by [[Elosha]] at the end of the of Miniseries are Sanskrit verses from the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad. Roughly translated, the verse says, "Lead us from the Untruth to the Truth, from Darkness to Light, from Death to Immortality."

===General Questions===

*Are the [[Lords of Kobol]] still an agentive force in this iteration of the cycle?
*Who were the Lords of Kobol? The Caprica Valerii does not deny their existence, and the Tomb of Athena strongly attests to her life and death, but she does not believe they were gods. They were evidently distraught at the calamity which befell their people. Who was responsible for it, and why were the gods powerless to intervene?
*Which god was the "jealous god" that sought to be raised above the others? Is he the same person as the Cylon's one true [[god]]?
*Was Kobol the original home of the [[Lords of Kobol]], or did they originate from some other place?
*Did the people of the Colonies leave Kobol with the assistance of the gods, or under their own power? That is, did the tribes build the [[Galleon]] or other ships, or were they furnished by the gods?
*What was the nature of the "[[Galleon]]?" Was it a large [[Sublight Propulsion|sublight]] colony ship? Did it have an [[FTL]] drive?
*If Roslin is now cured of cancer, can she still be the leader of the Pythian prophecy?
**Official sources suggested that Roslin's cancer cure in "[[Epiphanies]]" may not necessarily be a permanent matter, so the prophecy may still hold true.
*Is it possible that the dying leader may be referring to someone besides Roslin? It could be Admiral Adama as at the beginning of the Miniseries, they displayed a man who was "wasting away" before the Cylons attacked. He could be possibily another route for the writers to go through as having Adama not being able to enter the land that he and Roslin are leading the fleet to.
*In "[[The Eye of Jupiter]]", the [[Hybrid]] is looking directly at [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] while repeating the words "sins revealed... only to the chosen one", refering to. Plus, he did much of the work mapping out the location of the Lion's Head Nebula. Could this indicate that Baltar may be actually responsible for showing the path to Earth, thus fulfilling the role of "the leader"? Given his situation of being distrusted and hated by both cylon and human, it would appear unlikely that he would survive to reach earth.
*{{spoilli|Since spoilers have revealed that the entire Three model is slated to be boxed, could one or of the Threes we've seen be considered "dying leaders"? Is it possible that they, and not Roslin, will be instrumental in leading the humans as well as the Cylons to Earth?}}

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Colonial]]
[[Category:Colonial Religion]]
[[Category:Colonial Religion (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

{{featured article candidate}}

Talk:Cylon Shooter/Archive 1

2006-12-08T08:16:48Z

Vladimir: /* How is it? */

Very funny, and even germane. Nice one. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:19, 21 June 2006 (CDT)

: I concur and also note my shame for not remembering this. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 14:10, 21 June 2006 (CDT)
::Somehow, I don't remember seeing this segment when I watched The Lowdown on DVD. Guess I'll have to watch it again! Thanks for the recipe. We usually drink during the show anyway, and this'll be fun to try. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 16:28, 29 November 2006 (CST)

== Other Recipe ==

The reference for the rum-based version links to the vodka version. Perhaps it has since changed? In any case, I object to the rum-based drink as fanon. :p --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 14:55, 21 June 2006 (CDT)
:Oops fixed ^_^ --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 05:53, 23 June 2006 (CDT)

== How is it? ==

Has anyone had the Cylon Shooter as outlined in this article and is it any good? I am seeking the grocer tomorrow to obtain the ingredients so my friends and I may enjoy the show the right way.--[[User:Vladimir|Vladimir]] 02:16, 8 December 2006 (CST)

Talk:Cylon Shooter/Archive 1

2006-12-08T08:16:28Z

Vladimir: How is it?

User:Vladimir

2006-11-24T13:03:06Z

Vladimir:

{{User Data|
|name= Ryan Sonnenberg
|email = rsonnenberg[AT]switzerlan.org
|aim = nameversion2
|age= 18
|location = Bumfuckville, PA
|callsign = Vladimir
|marital status= Single
|occupation= Web Developer
|countrycode= US
}}

Talk:Leah Cairns/Archive 1

2006-11-15T07:00:45Z

Vladimir:

== Photo ==
The current photo's quality is bad. Maybe this is because a smaller image is stretched to fit the info box. Anyway, her IMDb account and other sites provide better photography. Please. --[[User:Pedda|Pedda]] 10:40, 29 August 2006 (CDT)
: Uploaded a new photo, larger resolution. --[[User:Vladimir|Vladimir]] 01:00, 15 November 2006 (CST)

Talk:Torn/Archive2

2006-11-08T19:34:52Z

Vladimir: /* Origin of the virus */

==Summary Split?==
We've taken to splitting the episode summaries between the Fleet and Baltar. Am I alone in thinking this isn't the best method? I'd prefer the summary going through the events of the episode chronologically. Especially now that the two storylines are beginning to converge. It was fine in Collaborators, where the two threads didn't effect each other. But now, someone reading the summary encounters a mention of the dead basestar at the end of the Galactica summary before getting to any of the details in the Cylon summary. -- [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 00:00, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:Personally I think it's fine. It depends on how much interaction there is between the two story lines in the next episode. If they signicantly interact, then this summary may require change, but for now I think it's ok.--[[User:Cohnee|Cohnee]] 06:14, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:Actually, we've been describing each story line separately since "[[33]]". It really makes the story lines easier to keep track of for both the viewer and the editors. However, if there's a better way, I would be interested in a discussion of it. What method or methods would you suggest? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:18, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:: I think it's a fine format in most cases. It certainly worked for Collaborators, and it worked well for the Helo arc of Season One. However, in those instances, the main plot and the sides-story didn't interact, so knowing how the Galactica side of the episode pans out before you read what happened to Helo, it isn't a problem. But here we have the Galactica storyline ending with something that was explained in the Cylon storyline. I guess I'm just concerned that some reading it without having seen the episode would be very confused. Something as simple as putting the Cylon half of the summary first I think would clear up any potential confusion, especially considering that nothing in the Galactica story effects the Cylon story. -- [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 11:56, 8 November 2006 (CST)

== Promotional pictures ==

Look at these pictures: 
http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/pic/000kthzq/g248 
http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/pic/000kw117/g248 
Where do they come from? I don't remember such scene in "Torn"... -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 01:51, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:P.s. All promo images are also on the wiki. As for those images, when I was uploading new promo images tonight, I noticed those, and I was like... "I never saw them.". if they show up in another episode, I will recategorize them in the media wiki. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 01:53, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:They may have come from a deleted scene as well. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:07, 8 November 2006 (CST)
::They might have been moved to the next episode "A Measure of Salvation" --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:13, 8 November 2006 (CST)

:: Can anyone identify the patch on Baltar's flight suit? It looks like it has a picture of an old style Raider on it. http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/pic/000ksya5/g248 -- [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 11:59, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:::That's the [http://bsgmedia.org/gallery/albums/s1waterpromos/normal_BSG04EP_7727CS.JPG standard Raptor patch]. That's the Raptor squadron that Sharon belongs to. We maybe ought to crop some of the patches off uniforms and have a patches and insignias section of the uniforms page. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:06, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:::: Hmm. Odd I never noticed that before. Seen like something I would've seen before. I thought maybe it was squandron, like Primus or The Vigilantes. An article on patches would be interesting. -- [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:24, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:::::Oh, no. I think you're right. I think that's exactly what it is. I was just saying that was a "normal" squadron patch for a Raptor (as in we've seen it before). If you would be willing to wade through the promo photos and screencaps ([http://bsgmedia.org/gallery/index.php some here as well]) to identify pictures with good patch shots in them, I'd be willing to crop down to the patches and upload them and help start either a new section on [[Uniforms (RDM)]] or a subarticle of that page. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:37, 8 November 2006 (CST)

== Questions? ==
I have no idea how to phrase it or if i remember correctly, but didn't Sharon (athena) start talking incoherently when they jump to the Lions Head? Is she infected? We don't see them jump back... [[User:Puneypunk|Puneypunk]] 06:26, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:No. She wasn't infected. She was shocked at what she saw and quoted scripture. She said "When god's anger awakens, even the mighty shall fall" --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:10, 8 November 2006 (CST)

== Helo as XO ==
Surely if he was the XO, Adama would of promoted him to at least Major, if not Colonel, by now? I'm not disputing that Helo is acting as Adama's "eyes and ears" but I'm surpirsed that he is being described as XO.--[[User:Cohnee|Cohnee]] 06:39, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:Rank isn't everything. An officer can also "outrank" someone with a nominally higher rank just by position. Adama probably still plans for Tigh to return some day and has Helo as interim solution. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:09, 8 November 2006 (CST)
::It's quite possible that Helo hasn't been promoted because he hasn't met the minimum time-in-grade for a full Lieutenant yet. Kat's quick rise from Ensign to Lieutenant seems to contradict this, however. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 11:06, 8 November 2006 (CST)
:::To me, his job seems to be something of a cross between Gaeta's former position and Tigh's. It may be that he fell into his current roll while Galactica was understaffed and it has yet to be formalised or revised back to a more standard one. We have seen that the crew is still readjusting to some extent and I wouldn't be surprised if there are still some adjustments yet to be made. --[[User:Ryan H|Ryan H]] 12:35, 8 November 2006 (CST)

== Origin of the virus ==
Far to speculative to put on the main page, but could the virus have been planted by the other 5 models? Perhaps a split occurred within the Cylons soon after they took human form, and the other 5 have decided to strike at the ones that we know.
If indeed the virus is a hybrid biological / technological nature as surmised in the Questions, it would support the theory of other Cylons having created it. --[[User:Zeratul|Zeratul]] 13:29, 8 November 2006 (CST)
::Well, if it was placed by the other 5, then it may be logical to asume that the other 5 went off in search of and, possibly, found earth, leaving this "viral pod" behind to ward off the 7. Unfortunately its all wild speculation at this point. --[[User:Vladimir|Vladimir]] 13:34, 8 November 2006 (CST)

Exodus, Part II

2006-11-03T20:49:46Z

Vladimir: /* Analysis */

{{cleanup}}

{{Episode Data
| title= Exodus, Part II
| image=TighAdamaReunion.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 4
| guests= [[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
| writer= [[Bradley Thompson]] [[David Weddle]]
| story=
| director= [[Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
| production= 304
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-20
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population=
| prev= [[Exodus, Part I]]
| next= [[Collaborators]]
| podcast= Y
}}

== Overview ==

:''Commander [[Lee Adama]] of the battlestar ''[[Pegasus (RDM)| Pegasus]]'' has serious doubts about the success of the [[New Caprica]] rescue mission by ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]''. On New Caprica, [[Saul Tigh]] decides the consequences for his [[Ellen Tigh |wife's]] betrayal of [[The Resistance | the Resistance]]. Aboard ''Galactica'', Admiral [[William Adama]] executes a dramatic rescue plan.''

== Summary ==

*On ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'', [[Lee Adama]] and [[Anastasia Dualla|Dualla]] talk of ''[[Galactica]]'s'' mission. Adama worries that Admiral Adama's mission will fail, and about his impending responsibilities as leader of [[The Fleet]]. Dee notes that Lee has given up hope on his father, but expresses her faith in her husband.
*On New Caprica, [[Samuel Anders]] confronts [[Saul Tigh]] about [[Ellen Tigh|his wife Ellen's]] betrayal and tells him that either Tigh "takes care" of Ellen, or someone less sympathetic will do so.
*Ellen Tigh explains her recent actions, that she would do absolutely anything to save Saul, including betraying the resistance. Tigh consoles her and provides her a drink when she asks. She falls unconscious, her drink having been poisoned by her husband. He says that he loves her, rests his head on her corpse, and weeps.
*On ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Gaius Baltar]] tells the Cylons that they have failed in their experiment and suggests the Cylons simply leave. A [[Number Three|Three]] voices the concern that one day the descendants of mankind might exact vengeance upon the Cylons, should they be left to their own devices.
[[Image:Saulellen.jpg|Saul handing Ellen her poisoned drink.|thumb]]

*[[Felix Gaeta|Gaeta]] suddenly looks up, noticing dozens of explosions can outside the window, signalling the beginning of the [[Battle of New Caprica]].
*Anders and the resistance team has set a series of explosions, mimicing a Fleet attack and causing confusion among the [[cylons]]. [[Tory Foster]] commands a team of section leaders in the evacuation and orders [[Maya]] to head for her ship with [[Hera|Isis]].
*Anders and a large group of resistance fighters retrieve weapons from beneath the [[Pyramid (RDM)|Pyramid]] court to rescue the detainees in the [[New Caprica Detention Center|detention center]].
*In space above New Caprica, ''Galactica'' deploys a squadron of Raptors and Vipers. The Raptors launch [[swallow]]s to mimic the EM signature of two Colonial battlestars. The Cylons pick them up and fall for the ruse, moving two basestars with their Raiders away from the planet.
*When [[Leoben Conoy]] leaves the residence inside the Detention Center to aid with the fighting, he keeps [[Kara Thrace]] inside. She assaults him and tries to escape, but he knocks her unconscious.
*[[Tom Zarek]] tasks [[James Lyman|Jammer]] to protect [[Laura Roslin]] as she makes her way to ''Colonial One''.
*At the entrance to the shipyard, where the Cylons keep the grounded Colonial vessels, a team under Tigh and [[Galen Tyrol]] are pinned down by [[Cylon Centurion]]s.
*The Cylons detect the decoy drones, but ''Galactica'' jumps into the planet's upper atmosphere and plunges rapidly towards the planet. Mid-descent, ''Galactica'' launches its Vipers. Before colliding with the ground, the ship jumps back into space. The Vipers begin to attack targets on the ground and clear the way.
*As others are freed from the Detention Center, Anders finds his unconscious wife and carries her away, but when Thrace awakens, she goes back to retrieve [[Kacey]].
*The battle is turning against ''Galactica''. Her FTL drives are down, weapons are offline and there is heavy structural damage from the atmospheric entry. Four Cylon basestars are closing in and the battlestar is soon bombarded from all sides with no hope of survival. At that moment ''Pegasus'' joins the battle, Lee Adama having disobeyed his father's orders. He opens fire with the forward batteries and destroys one basestar in the opening salvo.
*The Cylons realize that they have lost and decide to evacuate the planet. [[Number Three]] volunteers to stay behind and set off the nuclear weapon that was left in the city for such a contingency. She offers Baltar a place with the Cylons and leaves.
*The Colonial ships initiate intra-atmosphere [[FTL|jumps]] from New Caprica as soon as they become airborne.
*''Pegasus'' is heavily bombarded by missiles, having left all of her Vipers back with the rest of the civilian Fleet. Admiral Adama realizes that his son has planned a one-way mission for ''Pegasus'', and orders recall of ''Galactica's'' fighters.
*On ''Colonial One'', [[Felix Gaeta]] holds Baltar at gunpoint, and accuses of having betrayed humanity. Gaeta admits his guilt in idealistically believing in Baltar, but has realized, in the end, that Baltar was only thinking about himself. Baltar admits his own guilt and begs Gaeta to shoot him. Gaeta relents, however, giving Baltar a final chance to redeem himself: stop Three from setting off the nuclear bomb.
*With ''Pegasus'' dying, Lee Adama orders everyone to abandon ship. He sets the ship [[CBDR]] with a basestar as the last of the crew leaves in Raptors. ''Pegasus’'' collides with a basestar, destroying it; the remains of ''Pegasus’'' starboard [[flight pod]] collides with and destroys yet another basestar.
*Kara Thrace retrieves Kacey, but Conoy has returned and confronts her. She appears to give in to his demands, says "I love you," and kisses him. However, Thrace uses the diversion to stab him. She picks up Kacey and leaves with Anders.
*Three searches [[Dodona Selloi]]'s tent, but the [[oracle]] has left. Outside, [[Caprica-Six]] and Baltar find Hera next to [[Maya]]'s body, still alive. Three arrives, asks to hold the child, and leaves with her. [[Caprica-Six]] says Three no longer intends to detonate the nuke, then leaves the planet with Baltar.
*Laura Roslin and a group of resistance fighters enter the now abandoned ''Colonial One'' and are the last ship to leave the planet.
*On ''Galactica'', many people are reunited as Tyrol immediately takes charge of ushering the incoming refugees. When Thrace shows Kacey to Tyrol, another woman walks by and recognizes the girl as her daughter, whom the Cylons had taken away. The mother thanks Thrace for rescuing Kacey. Thrace is shocked by the revelation that Kacey is not her daughter after all, but gives her up.
*Admiral Adama welcomes Tigh back aboard, and tells him he brought everyone back. Tigh quietly replies, "[[Ellen Tigh|Not all of them]]." The colonists in ''Galactica's'' [[hangar deck]] begin chanting "A-dam-a, A-dam-a..." and carry the admiral on their shoulders. Adama turns to see Tigh wandering off, numbed with grief.
*Tory Foster tells Roslin that neither Maya nor Hera can be found, and it seems likely neither made it off the planet. Foster apologizes, but Roslin muses that this was part of something bigger than them.
*Admiral Adama shaves off his mustache and returns to a fully staffed [[CIC]], aboard the now very loud, bustling corridors of ''Galactica''.

== Questions ==

*With Baltar missing at the conclusion of this episode, who will become the President of the Twelve Colonies? ([[Collaborators|Answer]])
*What will be the final disposition of the ''Pegasus'' officers, and the former military personnel who have returned from New Caprica? ([[Collaborators|Answer]])
*Did Ellen Tigh know or suspect that the drink was poisoned?
*What consequences will Ellen Tigh's death have for her husband? Will Saul Tigh return to his old alcoholic habits? (Answer<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2006/10/battlestar_gala.html|title=Chicago Tribune|date=2006-10-02|accessdate=2006-10-29|last=|first=|format=|language=en}}</ref>)
*What equipment and people were left behind on [[New Caprica]]?
*Will Gaeta be the target of persecution or assassination as a collaborator? Or will people believe in him when he is found out to be the secret informant? ([[Collaborators|Answer]])
*Will [[Cally Tyrol]] identify Jammer as the NCP officer who released her, based on his voice? ([[Collaborators|Answer]])
*Why did Kara Thrace wait to stab Leoben until they kissed?
*What about the Cylons, such as Leoben, who were killed during the insurection? If they were dependant on a resurrection facility on New Caprica, is said facility still operational? If not, is there a resurrection ship in range? ([[Collaborators|Possible answer.]])
*What, besides ''Galactica'' and her crew, was gained by the sacrifice of ''Pegasus''?
* Now that ''Galactica'' is carrying the Viper squadrons from both battlestars, will the starboard flight pod be returned to service?
* What are the Cylons plans for Gaius Baltar? 
* Now that Hera is in the custody of the Cylons, what are their plans for her?
* How does Internal Six know that the baby [[Maya]] had was Hera?
* Where is [[Sharon Valerii (Caprica copy)|Boomer]]?
* How many ships are in the Fleet as of the [[Battle of New Caprica]]? Also, in light of the exodus, what of consumables and other resources needed to sustain the Fleet? Were these loaded into ships already as part of the escape plan?
* The woman who claimed to be [[Kacey]]'s mother, was she really her mother or is [[Kacey]] really [[Starbucks]] kid? If Kacey is really Starbuck's kid, then does that mean Kacey's "mother" is a Cylon agent?

== Analysis ==

*There is a major plot hole concerning the continuity of the story from Exodus, Part I. In Part I, D'Anna sees Caprica-Sharon in the detention center and is shot by her. Yet in Part II, D'Anna is in Colonial One, apparently unharmed, and has not alerted the Cylons to Sharon's presence.
**That is a different D'Anna. You'll note the D'Anna in Colonial One before the attack is wearing all black, whereas the D'Anna that encountered Sharon typically wears lighter colors. The two D'Annas are seen together in The Occupation.
***This is NOT a different D'Anna. This is the same D'Anna that dreamt about Hera and relayed this information to Sharon Agathon, and later carried Hera in her arms as her dreams foretold. The plot hole stands.
****Some time had passed once the fleet received news that Sharon retrieved the command codes. D'Anna might have been released/resurrected within that time span. We are not told whether she had informed the Cylon leadership of Sharon's presence.
*****It is questionable whether Biers could have bled to death from being shot in the kneecaps/legs since Sharon had stated she didn't intend to kill her; if Biers was released, not only would she have been unable to walk, but she would almost certainly have been questioned by those that found her.
******D'Anna would likely have committed "suicide" to free herself of the knee injuries. She probably did tell the others about Sharon, but it was too late to do anything about her at that point.
*******One might also note that Cylons sometimes exhibit inhuman characteristics, such a Leoben breaking free from his chains ([[Flesh and Bone]]). It may be that they can heal or regenerate in some instances.
****It's been established that different Cylon models usually vote the same way when reaching a consensus. It's entirely possible that one Number Three discussed her dreams with her "sisters", one of which discovered Sharon in the “safety deposit box room”.

*Either the scenes aren't in order or Baltar is not aware of what is going on. In the Gaeta-Baltar scene, Baltar says, "The Cylons have a nuke in this complex. Nobody, and I mean nobody, is getting off this planet alive unless I stop D'Anna." But this is after most of the civilian ships have already jumped.

*Further, until Hera is discovered by Baltar, Three is still looking to set off the nuke -- even though it is clear that the colonists are all long gone.
**It's possible Three wasn't seeking to set off the nuke, but said she was as a ruse to go seek answers about her premonitions concerning Hera.
*** Any nuke held by the Cylons would likely be stored somewhere inside the guarded Cylon perimeter. It appears that this Three made a beeline to the Oracle, and was upset that she was not there. While going through the tent, knocking things over, she is quoted as saying "frackking liar!".
*It is hard to believe that the Cylons were not keeping closer tabs on the whereabouts of the launch keys -- no alarms, etc -- and didn't notice they were gone until the attack started.
*In general, the Cylons seem to have left the planet implausibly underguarded. Considering the strategic nature of the site, as well as the well-known fact that two battlestars remained at large, one would have expected the Cylons to have an overwhelming amount of protection for the planet -- perhaps dozens of basestars.
**It has been established beforehand that the Cylons are overstretched with the occupation. This could account for the lack of protection. At any rate, four basestars against two battlestars is hardly an even match, let alone two half-strength battlestars.
***A Basestar does not seem to be a 1 to 1 match for a Battlestar. They lack offensive and defensive gun batteries, the ability to maneuver quickly, and have a critical design flaw that is easily exploited (central hub holding the six arms together). Basestars depend on missiles and large numbers of Raiders. Adama felt that the Galactica, even barely manned, could hold up to two Cylon Basestars.
****Additionally, RDM has mentioned in his podcasts that the Cylons do have major operations elsewhere hinting at future storylines in the season. It is possible that the Cylon higher command made a strategic decision to guard the planet with what they deemed the minimal required number of basestars to defend against 2 battlestars.
*****One may also be prone to over estimating the number of Basestars the Cylons have. When preparing the attack on the twelve colonies, the Cylons knew that they had surprise and the backdoor computer virus on their side. As such they may not have produced a very large number of basestars (perhaps not even enough to match the number of battlestars the Colonies had). Furthermore, the knowledge that the colonials were ignorant of the location of the Cylon homeworld may have also played a part in them having a smaller fleet. If, for some reason, the attack failed, the cylons could simply retreat and bide their time before trying again. After all, when one is sure he can render his enemy defenseless, there's no real need to produce a pointlessly large army.
*With the former crew of ''Pegasus'' onboard ''Galactica'' now, the ship has something close to its standard crew size. (''Galactica's'' crew was deduced to be 2,693 in the episode "[[Water]]", and ''Pegasus's'' was introduced with a crew count of 1,752 in "[[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]" (see [[Crew tally]]). William Adama notes that over half of the crew has settled on [[New Caprica]] in "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]", and Lee confirms that both ships are at half-strength in "[[Occupation]]".) Military operations should be much smoother now, and repairs to the ship in general are more feasible.
**However, many repairs, such as structural, will require shipyard or dockyard facilities equiped with replacement parts and heavy repair machinery required for such repairs, and these facilities are no longer available. The ''Galactica'' may never again be the fighting force that it once was.
*While the combination of the ''Pegasus'' and ''Galactica'' air groups give the latter battlestar a full-strength fighter wing, the Fleet has suffered the loss of its most advanced and best-armed warship. With it also went the capability to build replacement Vipers, unless one of the civilian ships can be converted for such a purpose. Defensively, the Fleet is pretty much back to the position it was in when it left the Colonies.
**However, the Galactica did take significant structural damage during the conflict, therefore, it currently isn't in the same state of battle readiness as it was at the time it left the Colonies.
*It appears during the whole conflict in atmospheric combat that the Raiders were spending most of their time running from the Vipers. This may be due to the fact that Colonial Vipers have a far superior atmospheric design where Raiders are optimized for space operations. The Viper has a stabilizing vertical wing which aids the pilot in manuevering through the atmosphere just like all real-life combat aircraft. The Raider lacks this stabilizer wing much reducing their effectiveness in aeronautic combat and manuevering thrusters are not as effective in air as in space due to resistance. This made the tactic of depositing the ''Galactica's'' Vipers into a solely air-support role for evacuating ships very effective once the Space-borne Raiders were decoyed away from the planet so that the ''Galactica'' only had to face the Basestars, not the Raiders.
**The lack of a stabilising fin might not impede the Raider's atmospheric performance, as there are certainly ways of compensating for it (see, e.g., the B-2 'Spirit'). And with several months of occupation (during which we see Raiders making fly-bys), the Raiders should have had more than enough time to become familiar with the quirks of atmospheric manoeuvring.
***However, the B-2 'Spirit' is a bomber and not a combat fighter and there is no example of a successful combat fighter without a stabilizing wing (or wings) on the tail. Compensating for atmospheric forces would make flight exceptionally difficult for craft designed primarily for spaceflight.
***Additionally, the Raider is visibly not built to be an aerodynamic craft. One would imagine even having raiders flying over the colony is purely artistic license since an aircraft of that design would mostly like not fly very well or even at all in an atmosphere.
*''Pegasus'' seemed to fulfill its role just like the [[Pegasus (TOS)|original ''Pegasus'']], as it fought to the end to defeat two basetars and allowed ''Galactica'' along with the last of the fleet to escape from the Cylons.

== Notes ==
* "[[Exodus, Part II]]" was awarded the [[Awards and Honors|IGN.com Editor's choice award]], following a review in which it recieved a rating of 9/10. This marks the second of such awards presented for the third season, the first of which was awarded for the season premiere [[Occupation]].
* There is also a TOS comic named ''[[Exodus!]]''
* The two parts of "Exodus" were originally planned as one episode. However, it was quickly realized that the story was far too large for one episode and it was split in two. This happened before with "[[Scattered]]", "[[Valley of Darkness]]" and "[[Resurrection Ship, Part I|Resurrection Ship]]." It also helped save money because the construction of New Caprica, the extensive location shooting, the number of actors, as well as the special effects for "Exodus, Part II" were very expensive and the production was over budget.
* Apparently the viper Mk.VIIs deployed by Galactica in this episode have a yellow engine-glow instead of their usual blue. This may be a visual-effects gaffe or the engines might have been affected by the nebular gas or by using a different type of fuel or engine.
* The moment where Lee pauses to look back at the ''Pegasus'' CIC and says "thank you" references a parallel moment in the [http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Ds9 Deep Space Nine] episode [http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/The_Changing_Face_of_Evil "The Changing Face of Evil"], in which, after the doomed Defiant is ordered evacuated, Captain Sisko takes a long look back at his ruined bridge. As with the ''Pegasus'', in the next shot, the ship is destroyed. Bradley Thompson and David Weddle, who wrote "Exodus, Part II", were staff writers on DS9.
*This episode marks the destruction of the ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]''
*Kate Vernon on the SciFi Forums<ref>http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2250922&st=64</ref> stated that Ellen Tigh knew about the poison in her drink.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

*''Discussing the failure of the occupation:''
:'''Number Three''': What would you have us do, Gaius?
:'''Gaius Baltar''': Leave. Pack up your centurions, and go. Please. Go.
:'''Number Three''': And then what? What would you do if we really just left you here? You'd live out your lives in peace and never trouble yourselves with thoughts of us again? Or would you raise your children with stories of the Cylon, the mechanical slaves who once did your bidding, only to turn against you? Killers who committed genocide against your race, the occupiers of this city until we just ran away? Would you tell them to tell the story to their children, and to their childrens' children, and nurse a dream of vengeance down through the years so that one day they could just go out into the stars and hunt the Cylon once more?
:'''Gaius Baltar''': Blood for blood ...has to stop one day.

*''Roslin heads to Colonial One:''
:'''Roslin''': My ship's up there.
:'''Zarek''': You sure have a sense of the dramatic.

*''Adama comes to accept ''Galactica'''s end:''
:'''Admiral Adama:''' Then that's it. It's been an honor.

*''After Hearing Pegasus Has Joined Galactica
:'''Admiral William Adama''': Damn You, Lee ...Thank You, Lee.

*''The Pegasus is evacuated before its destruction:''
:'''Dualla:''' Alright, people, let's move. Out! Let's go. (To Lee): You too, Commander.
:'''Commander Lee Adama:''' Yes, sir. (Begins to leave, then stops and looks around at Pegasus): Thank you.

*''As the two Adamas reunite after the battle:''
:'''Admiral William Adama''': I guess you didn't understand my orders.
:'''Commander Lee Adama''': I never could read your handwriting.

*''Adama welcomes Col. Tigh back to ''Galactica:''
:'''Adama:''' You did it, Saul. You brought them back.
:'''Tigh:''' Not all of them.

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==
*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon|Karl "Helo" Agathon]]
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Henderson Tyrol|Cally Tyrol]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]]
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Rick Worthy]] as [[Simon]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]
*[[Matthew Bennett]] as [[Number Five]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Luciana Carro]] as Lt. [[Louanne Katraine|Louanne "Kat" Katraine]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Bradley Thompson]]
[[Category:Episodes written by David Weddle]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
[[Category:RDM]]

[[de:Exodus, Part II]]

Collaborators

2006-10-25T08:11:05Z

Vladimir: /* Questions */

{{spoiler}}

{{Episode Data
| title= Collaborators
| image=JammerCollaborators.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 5
| guests=
| writer= [[Mark Verheiden]]
| story=
| director= [[Michael Rymer]]
| production= 305
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-27
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population= ?
| prev= [[Exodus, Part II]]
| next= [[Torn]]
}}

== Overview ==
:''[[The Circle]], a secret tribunal on Galactica, decides the fate of [[Jammer]] and other Colonials who aided the Cylons during the occupation of New Caprica. <ref>{{cite web|url=http://www.tvguide.com/detail/tv-show.aspx?episodeid=5893766&tvobjectid=191395&more=ucepisodelist |title=Episode Guide Collaborators }}</ref>''

== Summary ==

== Questions ==
*Will [[James Lyman|Jammer's]] fate be decided in this episode as referenced in [[Ronald D. Moore]]'s podcast for [[Exodus, Part I]]?
*What, if any, crimes will [[Felix Gaeta]] have to answer for the now-deposed [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] administration, or will his later role as informant for the resistance shield him?
*Given the size of the human population, would the Circle go so far as to execute some of their own people?
*How/Will Roslin return to the office of the President?

== Analysis ==

== Notes ==
According to an [http://community.tvguide.com/thread.jspa?threadID=700002601 interview] with David Eick, this episode will introduce the Cylon culture aboard a [[basestar]].
== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Mark Verheiden]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Michael Rymer]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Frak

2005-10-25T23:05:37Z

Vladimir: /* Usage */

Frak is an expletive analogous to the English word ''[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuck fuck]''.

== Usage ==
It is used much like its English counterpart, i.e. "Frakkin' rats."/"Fuckin' rats."

It is a multipurpose and adaptable term, for it is capable of being used as a term describing the act of sex (ex: [[Tyrol]] just frakked [[Boomer|Sharon]]!) or can be used to denote one's hatred of something (ex: Frakkin' [[Cylons]]).

In the original series, it was spelled "[[frack]]."

*In [[Home, Part II]], Doc Cottle, while examining Baltar, can be heard using "fuck" rather than the canon term "frak".

[[Category:A to Z]] [[Category: Profanity]] [[Category:RDM]]

Carom

2005-10-13T04:18:00Z

Vladimir:

Term used, in conjunction with a three digit number, to describe the location of a [[Dradis Contact]]. "Carom" describes the contact's position on an incremented disc perpendicular to the ecliptic. For example:

"Dradis Contact! [[Cylon Basestar]], bearing 187, carom 221!"

This would indicate a Cylon Basestar 187 incremements to starboard, then 221 increments up froim the ecliptic. Note that, while this system is exactly the same system as used in other sci-fi shows such as "Star Trek ("carom" replaced with "mark"), the contacts in Battlestar Galactica have been located with numbers greater than 360, so it is assumed that some incrementation other than degrees is used.

*Note that in the mini-series, the term "mark" was used, however it changed to Carom in season 1.

[[Category: A to Z]] [[Category: RDM]] [[Category: Terminology]]

Life Forms of the Twelve Colonies

2005-09-20T03:24:32Z

Vladimir: /* Plants */

{{Twelve Colonies Series}}
This article is a list of fictional and real animals and plants mentioned in the [[re-imagined]] series as existing on [[the Twelve Colonies]]. For the most part, the colonies appear to have the same organisms as present-day earth, with the exceptions noted below.

In keeping with the [[naturalistic science fiction]] concepts that [[Ron D. Moore]] uses to model the series, it is unlikely that we may see any life forms outside of those found on any of the Earth-like planets of the Twelve Colonies.

==Fictional==
===Plants===
*[[Fumarella leaf]]
:'''Baltar:''' A parting gift: hand-rolled from some of the finest Fumarella leaf on Caprica. It's also one of the last left in the universe. ([[Water]])
:''An homage to the [[TOS|original series]], in which [[Starbuck (TOS)|Starbuck]]'s [[Wikipedia:Cigar|cigars]] are referred to as "[[Fumarello|fumarellos]]". This plant may be similar or identical to [[Wikipedia:Tobacco|tobacco]].''
*[[Chamalla]]
:'''Roslin:''' I would like to explore alternative treatment. [...] Have you ever heard of Chamalla extract? ([[Act of Contrition]])
:''Resembles (somewhat) herbal [[Wikipedia:Cannabinoids|cannabinoids]] and [[Wikipedia:Opioids|opioids]] in its pain-killing and hallucinogenic effects, which are found in the plant [[Wikipedia:Cannabis|cannabis]] and the [[Wikipedia:Opium Poppy|opium poppy]], respectively.''

==Real==
===Animals===
====Mammals====
*[[Wikipedia:Cat|Cat]]
:'''Adama:''' ...then grab your gun and bring in the cat. ([[Mini-Series]])
*[[Wikipedia:Rat|Rat]]
:'''Helo:''' Frakkin' rats! ([[Bastille Day]])
*[[Wikipedia:Dog|Dog]]
:'''Cally:''' "She said the engine powerup sequence began by squeezing something that looks like a red ligament with blue veins on the right side coming out of a sack of gooey fluid, shaped like a... dog." ([[Six Degrees of Separation]])
*[[Wikipedia:Horse|Horse]]
:'''Tyrol:''' "Take it for a ride. Treat it like a horse." ([[Six Degrees of Separation]])
:'''Tyrol:''' "If it were a horse, I'd shoot it." ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])
*[[Wikipedia:Goat|Goat]]
:'''Starbuck:''' "A horse. Why not a goat? I mean, that's good, right? Think of it as a goat." ([[Six Degrees of Separation]])

====Birds====
*[[Wikipedia:Bird of prey|Birds of Prey]]
:''While the animals have never been specifically mentioned, it's reasonable to assume the [[Raptor]] is named after them.''
*[[Wikipedia:Chicken|Chicken]]
:Cami: We're going out for dinner, and I'm having chicken pie, and then we're going home, and then Daddy's going to read to me, and then I'm going to bed. ([[Mini-series]])
*[[Wikipedia:Parakeet|Parakeet]]
:'''Jammer:''' I don't care if they put a giant parakeet in here. If the colonel says build a cell, we build a cell. ([[Resistance]])
*[[Wikipedia:Ostrich|Ostrich]]
:'''Jammer:''' "You just want to bury your heads in the sands like Ostriches."
*[[Wikipedia:Blackbird|Blackbird]]
:''Namesake of the [[Blackbird]] experimental stealth fighter ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])''

====Reptiles====
*[[Wikipedia:Viper|Viper]]
:''While the animal has never been specifically mentioned, it's reasonable to assume the [[Viper]] is named after it, and Roslin saw halucinatory vipers.''
*[[Wikipedia:Python|Python]]
:'''Adama:''' "Betrayal has such a powerful grip on the mind. It's almost like a python. You can squeeze out the thought, suffocate all other emotion until everything is dead except for the rage." ([[Home, Part I]])

====Fish====
*[[Wikipedia:Salmon|Salmon]]
:'''Baltar:''' There was an off-road bridge, over the Euclid river. I used to go there, when I was a boy. Watch the fish try and swim upstream. They were mesmerizing. ([[Home, Part I]])
:''What Baltar describes, without naming, are [[Wikipedia:Anadromous|anadromous]] fish - almost certainly a type of salmon.

===Plants===
*[[Wikipedia:Apple|Apple]]
:'''Roslin:''' I need you to send my ID code on the exact same frequency: D, as in dog, dash, 456, dash, 345, dash, A as in apple. ([[mini-series]])
*[[Wikipedia:Blueberry|Blueberry]]
:'''Starbuck:''' You look like a blueberry. ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])
*[[Wikipedia:Coffea|Coffea]]
:'''Gaeta:''' Seven other container ships are refusing to release their supplies. Food, medicine, even coffee. ([[Resistance]])
*[[Wikipedia:Licorice|Licorice]]
:'''Roslin:''' Chamalla and Licorice. Would you like some? ([[Resistance]])
*[[Wikipedia:Walnut|Walnut]]
:''Adama cracks walnuts while going over potential CAGs in the episode "([[Home, Part I]])"''

[[Category: A to Z]] [[Category: Colonial Society]] [[Category: RDM]]

Zeus

2005-08-28T05:50:44Z

Vladimir: /* Colonial Mythology */

[[Image:Goldzeus.jpg|thumb|Statue of Zeus]]
== Colonial Mythology ==

Zeus is the first Lord of Kobol ([[Bastille Day]]), from whom all other [[Lords of Kobol|Lords]] apparently sprung. He is father to [[Apollo]] ([[33]],[[The Hand of God]]) and, quite likely, to [[Athena]] as well. ([[The Hand of God]]).

Zeus mirrors the [[Olympian Pantheon]] from [[Earth]].

[[Tom Zarek]] plays on [[Adama, Lee|Lee Adama's]] callsign [[Apollo]] in [[Bastille Day]] by referring to [[William Adama|Commander Adama]] as "Zeus." The allusion was repeated in [[The Farm]].

According to [[Pythia]], Zeus was the one who warned the 12 tribes that any return to [[Kobol]] would be paid for in blood.

== Greek Mythology ==

Zeus Kroniōn (descendant of Cronus), or simply Zeús or Zdeús (Greek Ζεύς) or Dias (Greek Δίας) ("divine king") is the leader of the gods and god of the sky and thunder in Greek mythology. Typically symbolized as a bearded able-bodied man who can strike down people with lighting bolts he hurls. As demonstrated in the Greek Mythos (and mirrored in Colonial religion), he fathered many of the heroes and heroines (see the external links section) and was featured in many of their stories. Though he was the god of the sky and thunder, he was also the most supreme cultural artifact; in some senses, he was the embodiment of Greek religious beliefs and the archetypal Greek deity.

The various titles applied to Zeus emphasized different aspects of his wide-ranging authority:

* Olympios emphasized Zeus's kingship over both the gods and the Panhellenic festival at Olympia.
* A related title was Panhellenios, ('Zeus of all the Hellenes') to whom Aeacus' famous temple on Aegina was dedicated.
* As Xenios, Zeus was the patron of hospitality and guests, ready to avenge any wrong done to a stranger.
* As Horkios, he was the keeper of oaths. Liars who were exposed were made to dedicate a statue to Zeus, often at the sanctuary of Olympia.
* As Agoraios, Zeus watched over business at the agora, and punished dishonest traders.

== External Link ==

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeus Zeus (Wikipedia)]

--[[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 21:00, 29 Jan 2005 (EST)

Red Line

2005-05-16T02:36:20Z

Vladimir:

The maximum radius of an imaginary sphere enclosing a vessel which denotes the maximum safe limit for an [[FTL]] jump.

Jump limits are most likely the result of a combination of factors including:

* The power available to a vessel to maintain a stable wormhole
* Local graviational forces (such as nearby planets, etc.) which must be compensated for at either end of the jump
* The overall mass of the vessel itself
* The accuracy and detail of data concerning the emergence zone at the far end of the jump.

The Red Line would appear to be defined within the overall safe operational tolerancies of Colonial FTL technology, given that it can be exceeded if required. However, the potential for damage to, or complete disabling of, jump drive systems (such as the [[Drive Coils|drive coils]]) is unclear.

When attempting to escape the Cylons after their devastating [[Cylon Attack|attack]] on the Twelve Colonies, and with the future of 50,000 survivors on his hands, [[Adama, William|Commander Adama]] orders a jump "beyond the red line" to the [[Promar Sector]]. Even the nature of Colonial technology and vessels, it is possible this particular limit reflected the overall capabilities of the fleet as a whole, and may not represent the maximum distance over which the ''[[Galactica]]'' herself might be capable of jumping.

The Red Line may also refer to an imaginary line drawn around all space that the colonials had charted. When [[Adama, William|Commander Adama]] orders the jump to the [[Promar Sector]], it is supposively beyond the red line, likely indicating the border between charted and uncharted space.

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:RDM]]
[[Category:Terminology]]

Viper (TRS)

2005-05-06T02:19:49Z

Vladimir: /* Notes */

==[[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Re-imagined Viper]]==

=== Overview ===

[[Image:Bsg-viper-1.jpg|thumb|Viper Mk II (credit: Gabriel C. Koerner)]]

The Viper is the Colonial Defence Force's primary space superiority fighter / attack craft. Capable of atmospheric flight, the Viper is a single-seat craft mounting two kinetic energy weapons ([[KEW]]s), as well as having hardpoints beneath the wings for mounting missiles, munitions pods and other ordnance ([[The Hand of God]]).

The Viper was originally introduced into Colonial service shortly before the outbreak of the [[Cylon War]]. However, it was the Mark II variant, designed specifically for use with the new Colonial [[Battlestar]]s that is best remembered.

The Mark II served with distinction throughout the Cylon War, proving a capable fighting vehicle that won renown across the 12 colonies and is regarded as one of the reasons the Colonials did not suffer defeat at the hands of the Cylons.

The Mark II remained in service after the end of the war, but was subsequently superceded by newer models. At the time of the renewed Cylon attack on the 12 Colonies, the Mark VII was the front-line variant of the Viper design, retaining the Mark II general layout but using fully networked systems providing superior battle management and fight information for the pilot.

Ironically, it was the incorporation of the new integrated systems that prevented the majority of Mark VIIs from being effective during the Cylon attack: as with the majority of Colonial Fleet, the Mark VII suffered fatal computer glitches on contact with Cylon forces. Thanks to Six's relationship with Baltar, the navigational software in standard use onboard the majority of Colonial Fleet vessels had backdoors that allowed the Cylons to infiltrate a vessel's network by wireless signals and disable its power systems. While the problem could be overcome by removing the navigational upgrade comprimised by the Cylons, this information was not discovered in time to be of major benefit to the surprised and hard-pressed Colonial forces. Galactica herself never had the upgrade installed, on the order of Commander Adama ([[Mini-Series]]). Since Galactica's systems are not networked, it is unclear as to what affect if any the comprimised navigational system would have had on her.

==== Atmospheric Operations ====
The Viper is designed for atmospheric as well as space-based operations. However, Vipers consume more fuel during atmospheric operations than in the vacuum of space: once in an atmosphere, the engines must run continuously to retain airflow over the wing lifting surfaces. Depending on the composition of the atmosphere itself, this can place severe strain on the Viper's engines ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]).

Due to their wing configuration, Vipers may also suffer from poor handling at low speeds within an atmosphere.

==== Life Support ====
Viper cockpits are pressurised and heated, but they are flown with the pilot wearing a flight suit that is capable of providing full life support should ejection be required ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). The life support systems are built-in to the back of the pilot's seat itself, together with the flight harness. Following an ejection, the back of the seat separates automatically, effectively becoming a backpack for the pilot ([[Act of Contrition]]).

Should ejection take place within an atmosphere, the life support backpack / seat back also incorporates a parachute.

=== Technical Specifications ===

[[Image:Bsg-viper7-1.jpg|thumb|Viper MkVII (credit: Sci-Fi Channel)]]

==== Dimensions ====
Mark II
*Length: (approx) 25ft
*Wingspan: (approx) 12ft

Mark VII
*Length: (approx) 28ft
*Wingspan: (approx) 14ft

==== Propulsion ====
*Both: 3x sublight engines mounted aft; 2x reverse thrust motors; [[RCS]] points
*Mark VII: Angular exhaust nozzle design suggest possible thrust-vectoring.

==== Aramaments ====
*Mark II: 2x forward-firing kenetic energy weapons ([[KEW]]) mounted in the wing roots
*Mark VII: 3x forward-firing kenetic energy weapons (KEW); 2 mounted towards the outboard sections of the wings; 1 mounted in the vertical stabiliser
*Both: Weapon hardpoints for mounting missiles / munitions pods, etc. under the wings

==== Crew ====
*Pilot

==== Notes ====

Since the Galactica only had 20 Viper Mark II's aboard, they needed as many fighters as possible, thus the remaining Mark VII's were refitted and stripped of their advanced computer systems. However, since this is not how the Mark VII was designed, it makes the craft increasingly difficult to handle and can only be flown by the most experienced pilots ([[Apollo]]).

=== Layout ===

The Viper is a long, sleek vehicle that can be spilt into two parts, fore and aft.

*Fore section: comprises the nose back to the cockpit. This contains the forward RCS systems for manoeuvring the craft; the forward landing gear; the main avionics and sensor packages, plus the single-seat cockpit itself
*Stern section: comprises the main engines, fuel tanks, wings and vertial stabiliser. The wings themselves contain the kinetic energy weapons ("guns") and their munitions storage and feeds. Harpoints beneath the wings allow missiles, munitions pods and other items to be rack-mounted ([[The Hand of God]]). The wings roots contain the main landing gear. This section of a Viper also contains a number of RCS manoeuvring packs.

The stern section of a Viper is distinctive because of the offset "intakes" mounted just behind the cockpit. The port / starboard "intake" nacelles incorporate small but powerful reverse thrust engines that can quickly counter a Viper's forward momentum in an emergency ([[The Hand of God]]).

==[[TOS Battlestar Galactica|Original Series Viper]]==
[[Image:bsg-viper-tos.jpg|thumb|Starhound Viper (credit: Universal / ABC)]]

The Colonial Starhound Viper was the primary space superiority fighter / attack craft deployed by the Colonials. Capable of atmospheric flight, it was a single-seat craft mounting two laser-torpedo guns as standard, as well as having hardpoints for mounting missiles.

The Viper was originally introduced into Colonial service during the 1,000 yahren war with the Cylons, and was a far superior craft to the [[Cylon Raider#Original Series Raider|Cylon Raider]].

Propulsion was said to be provided by a hybrid tylium / fusion reactor powering three ion engines with a "turbo-boost" facility for very rapid acceleration. For atmospheric flight, the engines are additionally supplied with atmospheric gases as combustibles to conserve on-board fuel supplies. The viper cockpit is fully pressurised, and in the event of catastrophic system damage, the entire module can detach and eject away from the damaged Viper.

==== Dimensions ====
*Length: (approx) 28.5ft
*Wingspan: (approx) 12.5ft

==== Propulsion ====
*3x ion engines mounted aft

==== Aramaments ====
*2 x forward-firing laser-torpedo guns
*4 x two-hundred kiloton Solonite missiles
*2 x thirty megaton Solonite bombs

====Crew====
* Pilot

===Layout===
[[Image:tos-viper-cut.jpg|thumb|Starhound Viper Cutaway (credit: Mike McAdams)]]
The Viper is a long, sleek vehicle that can be spilt into two parts, fore and aft.

* Fore section: comprises the nose back to the cockpit. This contains the targeting dish and sensor array, the forward landing gear; the main avionics and sensor packages, plus the cockpit module
* Stern section: comprises the main engines, reactor systems, turbo-boost injection systems, fuel tanks, wings and vertial stabiliser. The wings themselves contain the laser-torpedo guns and their power packs. Harpoints beneath the wings allow missiles, munitions pods and other items to be rack-mounted.

--[[User:Ernestborg9|Colonial Archivist]] 20:07, 1 Feb 2005 (EST)

==Video Game Variants==
Within the [[Video Game]], three variants of Viper are available: the Mark I, which is designed to be an earlier version of the [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|original series]] Viper; the Mark II, which is largely based on the original series Viper, and the Mark III, which is described as "superior to the Mark II in every respect".

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Colonial Craft]]
[[Category:Colonial Craft (TOS)]]
[[Category:Colonial Military]]
[[Category:Colonial Military (TOS)]]
[[Category:RDM]]
[[Category:TOS]]
[[Category:Video Game Ships]]

Viper (TRS)

2005-05-05T02:27:13Z

Vladimir: /* Re-imagined Viper */

==[[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Re-imagined Viper]]==

=== Overview ===

[[Image:Bsg-viper-1.jpg|thumb|Viper Mk II (credit: Gabriel C. Koerner)]]

The Viper is the Colonial Defence Force's primary space superiority fighter / attack craft. Capable of atmospheric flight, the Viper is a single-seat craft mounting two kinetic energy weapons ([[KEW]]s), as well as having hardpoints beneath the wings for mounting missiles, munitions pods and other ordnance ([[The Hand of God]]).

The Viper was originally introduced into Colonial service shortly before the outbreak of the [[Cylon War]]. However, it was the Mark II variant, designed specifically for use with the new Colonial [[Battlestar]]s that is best remembered.

The Mark II served with distinction throughout the Cylon War, proving a capable fighting vehicle that won renown across the 12 colonies and is regarded as one of the reasons the Colonials did not suffer defeat at the hands of the Cylons.

The Mark II remained in service after the end of the war, but was subsequently superceded by newer models. At the time of the renewed Cylon attack on the 12 Colonies, the Mark VII was the front-line variant of the Viper design, retaining the Mark II general layout but using fully networked systems providing superior battle management and fight information for the pilot.

Ironically, it was the incorporation of the new integrated systems that prevented the majority of Mark VIIs from being effective during the Cylon attack: as with the majority of Colonial Fleet, the Mark VII suffered fatal computer glitches on contact with Cylon forces. Thanks to Six's relationship with Baltar, the navigational software in standard use onboard the majority of Colonial Fleet vessels had backdoors that allowed the Cylons to infiltrate a vessel's network by wireless signals and disable its power systems. While the problem could be overcome by removing the navigational upgrade comprimised by the Cylons, this information was not discovered in time to be of major benefit to the surprised and hard-pressed Colonial forces. Galactica herself never had the upgrade installed, on the order of Commander Adama ([[Mini-Series]]). Since Galactica's systems are not networked, it is unclear as to what affect if any the comprimised navigational system would have had on her.

Since the Galactica only had 20 Viper Mark II's aboard, they needed as many fighters as possible, thus the remaining Mark VII's were refitted and stripped of their advanced computer systems. However, since this is not how the Mark VII was designed, it makes the craft increasingly difficult to handle and can only be flown by the most experienced pilots ([[Apollo]]).

==== Atmospheric Operations ====
The Viper is designed for atmospheric as well as space-based operations. However, Vipers consume more fuel during atmospheric operations than in the vacuum of space: once in an atmosphere, the engines must run continuously to retain airflow over the wing lifting surfaces. Depending on the composition of the atmosphere itself, this can place severe strain on the Viper's engines ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]).

Due to their wing configuration, Vipers may also suffer from poor handling at low speeds within an atmosphere.

==== Life Support ====
Viper cockpits are pressurised and heated, but they are flown with the pilot wearing a flight suit that is capable of providing full life support should ejection be required ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). The life support systems are built-in to the back of the pilot's seat itself, together with the flight harness. Following an ejection, the back of the seat separates automatically, effectively becoming a backpack for the pilot ([[Act of Contrition]]).

Should ejection take place within an atmosphere, the life support backpack / seat back also incorporates a parachute.

=== Technical Specifications ===

[[Image:Bsg-viper7-1.jpg|thumb|Viper MkVII (credit: Sci-Fi Channel)]]

==== Dimensions ====
Mark II
*Length: (approx) 25ft
*Wingspan: (approx) 12ft

Mark VII
*Length: (approx) 28ft
*Wingspan: (approx) 14ft

==== Propulsion ====
*Both: 3x sublight engines mounted aft; 2x reverse thrust motors; [[RCS]] points
*Mark VII: Angular exhaust nozzle design suggest possible thrust-vectoring.

==== Aramaments ====
*Mark II: 2x forward-firing kenetic energy weapons ([[KEW]]) mounted in the wing roots
*Mark VII: 3x forward-firing kenetic energy weapons (KEW); 2 mounted towards the outboard sections of the wings; 1 mounted in the vertical stabiliser
*Both: Weapon hardpoints for mounting missiles / munitions pods, etc. under the wings

==== Crew ====
*Pilot

==== Notes ====

=== Layout ===

The Viper is a long, sleek vehicle that can be spilt into two parts, fore and aft.

*Fore section: comprises the nose back to the cockpit. This contains the forward RCS systems for manoeuvring the craft; the forward landing gear; the main avionics and sensor packages, plus the single-seat cockpit itself
*Stern section: comprises the main engines, fuel tanks, wings and vertial stabiliser. The wings themselves contain the kinetic energy weapons ("guns") and their munitions storage and feeds. Harpoints beneath the wings allow missiles, munitions pods and other items to be rack-mounted ([[The Hand of God]]). The wings roots contain the main landing gear. This section of a Viper also contains a number of RCS manoeuvring packs.

The stern section of a Viper is distinctive because of the offset "intakes" mounted just behind the cockpit. The port / starboard "intake" nacelles incorporate small but powerful reverse thrust engines that can quickly counter a Viper's forward momentum in an emergency ([[The Hand of God]]).

==[[TOS Battlestar Galactica|Original Series Viper]]==
[[Image:bsg-viper-tos.jpg|thumb|Starhound Viper (credit: Universal / ABC)]]

The Colonial Starhound Viper was the primary space superiority fighter / attack craft deployed by the Colonials. Capable of atmospheric flight, it was a single-seat craft mounting two laser-torpedo guns as standard, as well as having hardpoints for mounting missiles.

The Viper was originally introduced into Colonial service during the 1,000 yahren war with the Cylons, and was a far superior craft to the [[Cylon Raider#Original Series Raider|Cylon Raider]].

Propulsion was said to be provided by a hybrid tylium / fusion reactor powering three ion engines with a "turbo-boost" facility for very rapid acceleration. For atmospheric flight, the engines are additionally supplied with atmospheric gases as combustibles to conserve on-board fuel supplies. The viper cockpit is fully pressurised, and in the event of catastrophic system damage, the entire module can detach and eject away from the damaged Viper.

==== Dimensions ====
*Length: (approx) 28.5ft
*Wingspan: (approx) 12.5ft

==== Propulsion ====
*3x ion engines mounted aft

==== Aramaments ====
*2 x forward-firing laser-torpedo guns
*4 x two-hundred kiloton Solonite missiles
*2 x thirty megaton Solonite bombs

====Crew====
* Pilot

===Layout===
[[Image:tos-viper-cut.jpg|thumb|Starhound Viper Cutaway (credit: Mike McAdams)]]
The Viper is a long, sleek vehicle that can be spilt into two parts, fore and aft.

* Fore section: comprises the nose back to the cockpit. This contains the targeting dish and sensor array, the forward landing gear; the main avionics and sensor packages, plus the cockpit module
* Stern section: comprises the main engines, reactor systems, turbo-boost injection systems, fuel tanks, wings and vertial stabiliser. The wings themselves contain the laser-torpedo guns and their power packs. Harpoints beneath the wings allow missiles, munitions pods and other items to be rack-mounted.

--[[User:Ernestborg9|Colonial Archivist]] 20:07, 1 Feb 2005 (EST)

==Video Game Variants==
Within the [[Video Game]], three variants of Viper are available: the Mark I, which is designed to be an earlier version of the [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|original series]] Viper; the Mark II, which is largely based on the original series Viper, and the Mark III, which is described as "superior to the Mark II in every respect".

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Colonial Craft]]
[[Category:Colonial Craft (TOS)]]
[[Category:Colonial Military]]
[[Category:Colonial Military (TOS)]]
[[Category:RDM]]
[[Category:TOS]]
[[Category:Video Game Ships]]