Battlestar Wiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:Maelstrom/Archive 1

2007-03-07T21:58:50Z

Ublej: /* Who will take Kara's place as Galactica's Viper ace? */

==Official Source required==

Working episode titles are always shaky, even from official sources. The [[BW:OC|Official Communiques]] articles lists those confirmed by an official source, but even these are subject to change. Gateworld is not an official source and can be more wrong than the official preliminary title. Best to wait on this or verify the source. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:39, 24 October 2006 (CDT)

So far they've been correct for Season 3, and usually ahead of most other sources by several days. Waiting won't hurt [[User:Hmoul|Seattle Cylon]] 14:15, 24 October 2006 (CDT)
*I posed this title to Bradley Thompson and he chose not to confirm the title as a "working title" where he usually confirms "working titles". There may be a reason, may not be, but for our purposes, this should be considered rumor and innuendo and should be deleted.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 11:02, 25 October 2006 (CDT)
::{{vd}} as well. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 11:06, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

==Promo Pics==
Are up [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000a7qzs here]. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:28, 1 February 2007 (CST)
:I'd use the one with her mother as preview pic here. Aside from the ones with Leoben, the others are pretty generic. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:35, 1 February 2007 (CST)
::I posted the one with leoben before I read this. I liked the starbuck's destiny angle, but will change if the consensus dictates it. This gives me another ideas. Promo pic gallery in the article until it airs. I am really looking at ways to use more images since we are discussing a TV show. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:14, 1 February 2007 (CST)
:::That one's fine too. As for the gallery, sure. However, you should probably resize the pictures a bit before uploading them as they are very large --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:23, 1 February 2007 (CST)
::::If you think so, I will move this discussion to the Quorum? where discussion can start before writing up a Think tank proposal. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:34, 1 February 2007 (CST)

==Bonus Scene==
Maybe I missed something last week (I didn't go watch the ENTIRE bonus scene online), but when I went tonight to check out the Dirty Hands bonus scene, there was a bonus scene up from Maelstrom. Did anyone else see this? This shouldn't have been up yet, right? At any rate I got a sneak peak...even if it was a deleted scene :) --[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 00:42, 26 February 2007 (CST)

== Kara and Cylon ==

I had a brilliant thought the other night. Kara gets killed in this episode and wakes up in a ress chamber on Caprica. First words out of her mouth, "Oh sh!t". That could explain the pic of her back on Caprica with Leoben. I bet she is a Cylon. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 14:53, 26 February 2007 (CST)

You read my mind --[[User:Moo|Moo]] 20:09, 5 March 2007 (CST)
== ''Maelstrom'' Predictions! ==

Strap into your Vipers, ''Galactica'' fans! It's time for another round of predictions!
Sure, the All-Seeing, All-Knowing Slander struck out big time last week, but I got in some high-quality chamalla the other day and BOY is it potent! Anybody got any candy?
* Recon Delta, which consists of a two-man [[Viper (TOS)|Viper]] crewed by Captain [[Kanon]] and Lieutenant [[Britton]], is on patrol when it picks up readings of an advanced Cylon fighter.
* Suddenly, a previously unseen [[Cylon Raider|Cylon Raider]] appears and fires at them.
* The [[warbook]] brings back a readout of the occupants: the Raider crew appear to be human.
* [[Kanon]] decides on a desperate strategy and rams the ship, damaging both craft.
* The huge Cylon fighter tumbles towards Earth, and [[Britton]] is injured.

Wait. Frak. I'm sorry. That's [[The Night the Cylons Landed, Part I]]. [[Wolfman Jack]] was so awesome, though. Let's try this again.

*Starbuck goes nuts, even though she's seemed perfectly fine during the last few times we've seen her.
*Starbuck goes to see a psychiatrist.
*Like everyone with a deep interest in human nature on this show, said psychiatrist turns out to be a Cylon, but she doesn't know it until Starbuck's discussions about Leoben awaken her buried Cylon memories. She's just as surprised as the rest of us! (Moreso, actually, since we're not surprised at all.)
*Leoben is gonna be all over this episode, but mostly in hallucinations and flashbacks. Also, he gets it on with a SuicideGirl. ("Like, being a creepy, religious machine is, like, ''totally'' a turn-on!")
*I'm sensing an Anders appearance, but that could just be my unsexual man-love for Anders talking.
*Speaking of unsexual man-love, Zarek also puts in a brief appearance because, during filming, Richard Hatch was in town for a convention and the writers felt the need to inject ''even more awesomeness'' into this episode. Shame they can't resurrect [[Wolfman Jack]] for an episode or two, isn't it?
*Kara crashes her Viper, injuring herself so badly that we won't see her for the rest of the season.
*For the first time all season, Galvatron fails to make an appearance. This is because he's busy filming an episode of ''Ghost Whisperer''. Jennifer Love Hewitt's so damn hot.

This half of the season finally starts to build some momentum with this episode, leading up to what's sure to be a mind-smashing, cliff-hanging finale. After that's over, I guess I'll move over to GateWorld and start doing ''Stargate'' predictions. Do they have a good wiki? --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 11:23, 2 March 2007 (CST)

== A reminder to all contributors ==

The events of this episode should be treated as canon. While speculation is allowed, please avoid [[BW:FANW|fanwanking]] into the possibilities created by the event within this article. Episode summaries and its question and analysis are for relevant unanswered questions generated by this episode only. Some people may take a [[Beings of Light]] parallelism to it; because there is no connection officially established between the Original Series and Re-imagined Series on this, it is better to leave that trail alone. Also remember that talk pages aren't chat boards, so discuss the episode elsewhere (email, Sci Fi Forums, etc.) to keep wiki performance at its best. Thanks! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 07:08, 5 March 2007 (CST)

== Who will take Kara's place as Galactica's Viper ace? ==

I would SO like that to be [[Diana Seelix|Seelix]]. It wouldn't be the first time the show sets up replacements ahead of time. Racetrack was intended to replace Crashdown after he died, but introduced when Crashdown was still alive and well on Kobol. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:23, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:They already did the "nugget becomes ace pilot" thing with Kat. While more screentime for Seelix would be nice, they could also increase Hot Dog's role, who has been a pilot for some time now. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:27, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::True. Hot Dog has been around for some time, and he's the only good Viper pilot we know who's still not a Captain and has never been CAG (Starbuck, Apollo and Kat all have). Now I'm not suggesting Hot Dog be CAG, but he could replace Starbuck as a squadron leader. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:39, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::I agree, I want to see Hotdog move into more prominence in the show. He's the last of the original 3 nuggets we came to know. I would hate it if they killed him before we actually have a Hotdog centered story.--[[User:LifeStar|LifeStar]] 10:15, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:::Yeah, he's the best of what's left. Who recognizes where that paraphrased quote is from? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 10:36, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:::While I agree that Hot Dog is probably the best of the remaining Viper pilots, they could also transfer Athena, Racetrack, Helo, or possibly even Skulls. Don't know if Skulls has ever been pilot rather than ECO, though. --[[User:Psilon|Psilon]] 17:01, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::::Ehm, these are ''Raptor'' pilots, not ''Viper'' pilots. Piloting a Viper is different than piloting a Raptor. With that said, the only two people I can think of that would step up to the plate are Hotdog and Seelix. Hell, even [[Narcho]], since we see a lot of him now. I do hope that we see more of the ex-''Pegasus'' Viper jockeys as well, and would welcome them back into the fold. (Were the Great Powers able to pull it off, I think re-introducing [[Cole Taylor]] would prove awesome, and a great foil for Lee given their past history. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 18:40, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:::::Hmm, maybe the tatooed pilot? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:31, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::::::Stinger's still scraping hull paint off civilian ships right now, if Lee has anything to say about it. That guy was a frakwit from the first words out of his mouth. I'm cool on Hot Dog, since being squadron leader will cool his jets ''just a little'' while we see his cool competency. From his first rookie flight, he's quite a natural, and had a great line in "Exodus Part II" as he launches intra-atmosphere from the falling battlestar: "This should be interesting..." --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 08:25, 7 March 2007 (CST)
:::::I'd like to see Marcia "[[Showboat]]" Case again, but that will probably never happen :( --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:35, 7 March 2007 (CST)
:::::: Agreed. She's a hottie. I'd like to see Narcho stepping up to a more prominent role, too. Sebastian Spence is a fantastically-talented actor and I was delighted to see him step off the Raptor in ''Pegasus''. Just watch ''First Wave'' to see him shine. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 15:05, 7 March 2007 (CST)
::::"He's the best of what's left." --> Do you mean "You're the best non-commissioned officer I have left.?" -- Adama, [[Litmus]]? If it's from another sci-fi series, I must confess that I don't know shit about them :P --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:12, 7 March 2007 (CST)
:::::Actually, it was a reference to the movie [http://imdb.com/title/tt0107144/ Hot Shots Part Deux] (it was on tv when I was replying to that) where the government goes to get Topper Harley to go rescue all the captured people in Iraq since he's all that is left. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 09:19, 7 March 2007 (CST)
::::Don't Forget Bulldog... --[[User:Ublej|Ublej]] 15:58, 7 March 2007 (CST)

Talk:Maelstrom/Archive 1

2007-03-07T21:58:08Z

Ublej: /* Who will take Kara's place as Galactica's Viper ace? */

==Official Source required==

Working episode titles are always shaky, even from official sources. The [[BW:OC|Official Communiques]] articles lists those confirmed by an official source, but even these are subject to change. Gateworld is not an official source and can be more wrong than the official preliminary title. Best to wait on this or verify the source. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:39, 24 October 2006 (CDT)

So far they've been correct for Season 3, and usually ahead of most other sources by several days. Waiting won't hurt [[User:Hmoul|Seattle Cylon]] 14:15, 24 October 2006 (CDT)
*I posed this title to Bradley Thompson and he chose not to confirm the title as a "working title" where he usually confirms "working titles". There may be a reason, may not be, but for our purposes, this should be considered rumor and innuendo and should be deleted.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 11:02, 25 October 2006 (CDT)
::{{vd}} as well. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 11:06, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

==Promo Pics==
Are up [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000a7qzs here]. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:28, 1 February 2007 (CST)
:I'd use the one with her mother as preview pic here. Aside from the ones with Leoben, the others are pretty generic. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:35, 1 February 2007 (CST)
::I posted the one with leoben before I read this. I liked the starbuck's destiny angle, but will change if the consensus dictates it. This gives me another ideas. Promo pic gallery in the article until it airs. I am really looking at ways to use more images since we are discussing a TV show. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:14, 1 February 2007 (CST)
:::That one's fine too. As for the gallery, sure. However, you should probably resize the pictures a bit before uploading them as they are very large --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:23, 1 February 2007 (CST)
::::If you think so, I will move this discussion to the Quorum? where discussion can start before writing up a Think tank proposal. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:34, 1 February 2007 (CST)

==Bonus Scene==
Maybe I missed something last week (I didn't go watch the ENTIRE bonus scene online), but when I went tonight to check out the Dirty Hands bonus scene, there was a bonus scene up from Maelstrom. Did anyone else see this? This shouldn't have been up yet, right? At any rate I got a sneak peak...even if it was a deleted scene :) --[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 00:42, 26 February 2007 (CST)

== Kara and Cylon ==

I had a brilliant thought the other night. Kara gets killed in this episode and wakes up in a ress chamber on Caprica. First words out of her mouth, "Oh sh!t". That could explain the pic of her back on Caprica with Leoben. I bet she is a Cylon. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 14:53, 26 February 2007 (CST)

You read my mind --[[User:Moo|Moo]] 20:09, 5 March 2007 (CST)
== ''Maelstrom'' Predictions! ==

Strap into your Vipers, ''Galactica'' fans! It's time for another round of predictions!
Sure, the All-Seeing, All-Knowing Slander struck out big time last week, but I got in some high-quality chamalla the other day and BOY is it potent! Anybody got any candy?
* Recon Delta, which consists of a two-man [[Viper (TOS)|Viper]] crewed by Captain [[Kanon]] and Lieutenant [[Britton]], is on patrol when it picks up readings of an advanced Cylon fighter.
* Suddenly, a previously unseen [[Cylon Raider|Cylon Raider]] appears and fires at them.
* The [[warbook]] brings back a readout of the occupants: the Raider crew appear to be human.
* [[Kanon]] decides on a desperate strategy and rams the ship, damaging both craft.
* The huge Cylon fighter tumbles towards Earth, and [[Britton]] is injured.

Wait. Frak. I'm sorry. That's [[The Night the Cylons Landed, Part I]]. [[Wolfman Jack]] was so awesome, though. Let's try this again.

*Starbuck goes nuts, even though she's seemed perfectly fine during the last few times we've seen her.
*Starbuck goes to see a psychiatrist.
*Like everyone with a deep interest in human nature on this show, said psychiatrist turns out to be a Cylon, but she doesn't know it until Starbuck's discussions about Leoben awaken her buried Cylon memories. She's just as surprised as the rest of us! (Moreso, actually, since we're not surprised at all.)
*Leoben is gonna be all over this episode, but mostly in hallucinations and flashbacks. Also, he gets it on with a SuicideGirl. ("Like, being a creepy, religious machine is, like, ''totally'' a turn-on!")
*I'm sensing an Anders appearance, but that could just be my unsexual man-love for Anders talking.
*Speaking of unsexual man-love, Zarek also puts in a brief appearance because, during filming, Richard Hatch was in town for a convention and the writers felt the need to inject ''even more awesomeness'' into this episode. Shame they can't resurrect [[Wolfman Jack]] for an episode or two, isn't it?
*Kara crashes her Viper, injuring herself so badly that we won't see her for the rest of the season.
*For the first time all season, Galvatron fails to make an appearance. This is because he's busy filming an episode of ''Ghost Whisperer''. Jennifer Love Hewitt's so damn hot.

This half of the season finally starts to build some momentum with this episode, leading up to what's sure to be a mind-smashing, cliff-hanging finale. After that's over, I guess I'll move over to GateWorld and start doing ''Stargate'' predictions. Do they have a good wiki? --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 11:23, 2 March 2007 (CST)

== A reminder to all contributors ==

The events of this episode should be treated as canon. While speculation is allowed, please avoid [[BW:FANW|fanwanking]] into the possibilities created by the event within this article. Episode summaries and its question and analysis are for relevant unanswered questions generated by this episode only. Some people may take a [[Beings of Light]] parallelism to it; because there is no connection officially established between the Original Series and Re-imagined Series on this, it is better to leave that trail alone. Also remember that talk pages aren't chat boards, so discuss the episode elsewhere (email, Sci Fi Forums, etc.) to keep wiki performance at its best. Thanks! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 07:08, 5 March 2007 (CST)

== Who will take Kara's place as Galactica's Viper ace? ==

I would SO like that to be [[Diana Seelix|Seelix]]. It wouldn't be the first time the show sets up replacements ahead of time. Racetrack was intended to replace Crashdown after he died, but introduced when Crashdown was still alive and well on Kobol. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:23, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:They already did the "nugget becomes ace pilot" thing with Kat. While more screentime for Seelix would be nice, they could also increase Hot Dog's role, who has been a pilot for some time now. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:27, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::True. Hot Dog has been around for some time, and he's the only good Viper pilot we know who's still not a Captain and has never been CAG (Starbuck, Apollo and Kat all have). Now I'm not suggesting Hot Dog be CAG, but he could replace Starbuck as a squadron leader. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:39, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::I agree, I want to see Hotdog move into more prominence in the show. He's the last of the original 3 nuggets we came to know. I would hate it if they killed him before we actually have a Hotdog centered story.--[[User:LifeStar|LifeStar]] 10:15, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:::Yeah, he's the best of what's left. Who recognizes where that paraphrased quote is from? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 10:36, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:::While I agree that Hot Dog is probably the best of the remaining Viper pilots, they could also transfer Athena, Racetrack, Helo, or possibly even Skulls. Don't know if Skulls has ever been pilot rather than ECO, though. --[[User:Psilon|Psilon]] 17:01, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::::Ehm, these are ''Raptor'' pilots, not ''Viper'' pilots. Piloting a Viper is different than piloting a Raptor. With that said, the only two people I can think of that would step up to the plate are Hotdog and Seelix. Hell, even [[Narcho]], since we see a lot of him now. I do hope that we see more of the ex-''Pegasus'' Viper jockeys as well, and would welcome them back into the fold. (Were the Great Powers able to pull it off, I think re-introducing [[Cole Taylor]] would prove awesome, and a great foil for Lee given their past history. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 18:40, 6 March 2007 (CST)
:::::Hmm, maybe the tatooed pilot? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:31, 6 March 2007 (CST)
::::::Stinger's still scraping hull paint off civilian ships right now, if Lee has anything to say about it. That guy was a frakwit from the first words out of his mouth. I'm cool on Hot Dog, since being squadron leader will cool his jets ''just a little'' while we see his cool competency. From his first rookie flight, he's quite a natural, and had a great line in "Exodus Part II" as he launches intra-atmosphere from the falling battlestar: "This should be interesting..." --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 08:25, 7 March 2007 (CST)
:::::I'd like to see Marcia "[[Showboat]]" Case again, but that will probably never happen :( --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:35, 7 March 2007 (CST)
:::::: Agreed. She's a hottie. I'd like to see Narcho stepping up to a more prominent role, too. Sebastian Spence is a fantastically-talented actor and I was delighted to see him step off the Raptor in ''Pegasus''. Just watch ''First Wave'' to see him shine. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 15:05, 7 March 2007 (CST)
::::"He's the best of what's left." --> Do you mean "You're the best non-commissioned officer I have left.?" -- Adama, [[Litmus]]? If it's from another sci-fi series, I must confess that I don't know shit about them :P --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:12, 7 March 2007 (CST)
:::::Actually, it was a reference to the movie [http://imdb.com/title/tt0107144/ Hot Shots Part Deux] (it was on tv when I was replying to that) where the government goes to get Topper Harley to go rescue all the captured people in Iraq since he's all that is left. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 09:19, 7 March 2007 (CST)
Don't Forget Bulldog... --[[User:Ublej|Ublej]] 15:58, 7 March 2007 (CST)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2007-02-20T21:41:37Z

Ublej: /* Can't view images */

{{cleanup}}

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

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{{archive-header
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| start = December 3, 2005
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|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
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| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}} {{archive-item|02|Quorum Definintion}} {{archive-item|02|DVD titles.}} {{archive-item|02|Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum}} {{archive-item|02|Featured Article and Featured Picture|end=y}}
|}}
{{archive-header
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| start = July 13, 2006
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| items = {{archive-item|03|Scifi.com}} {{archive-item|03|Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork?}} {{archive-item|03|Question/idea}} {{archive-item|03|Template: Episode Data}} {{archive-item|03|The Hangerbay Comes to Life}} {{archive-item|03|Wormholes}} {{archive-item|03|DragonCon, Anyone?}} {{archive-item|03|Image Taging!}} {{archive-item|03|Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents}} {{archive-item|03|Is this project an official Wikimedia project?}} {{archive-item|03|Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980}} {{archive-item|03|Sandbox}} {{archive-item|03|Do you see the ball?}} {{archive-item|03|Request from FrakParty.com|end=y}}
|}}
{{archive-header
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| start = September 27, 2006
| end = October 10, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|04|Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?!}} {{archive-item|04|Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?}} {{archive-item|04|Standards and Conventions Adjustments}} {{archive-item|04|Fanwanking}} {{archive-item|04|Wiki up again}} {{archive-item|04|Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization|end=y}}
|}}

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)
::Both the BSWiki and Scifipedia use MediaWiki and both has history showing page edits. Its obviously which site wrote it first and which one just edited in large chunks. Someone really needs to give JohnRDouglas a kick up the bum. Of course its a bit of a dilema because if SciFi really wanted to they could force us to pull virtually all our content, or at the very least the images. We dont want to piss them off, but at the same time, they cant go around using material written by other people. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 19:37, 13 November 2006 (CST)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

:The [[Cylons (RDM)]] article seems as an introduction to the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] as well. Further I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:34, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, because everything will change then. But she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[Caprica-Three]], because she was introduced there? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:18, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Images ==

I am not sure why, but my entires on Valkyrie, Eugene Novacek and Admiral Corman which were primarily just images uploaded onto the pages were deleted...I don't get it, doesn't it help to have pictures to refer to the subject the page is discussing. If it is a matter of spoiling future episodes with these pictures, readers are imformed at the top of the page which all of the above mentioned pages have, that the page is a spoiler. If it is my own fault for not siting where i got the images taking them down isn't exactly the answer, why not modify them yourselves. I realize I am a huge amateur so, discussing this for me will help myself and possibly others.
:It's not a spoiler issue at all, and your efforts are appreciated. In this case I believe it was simply a matter of the images being duplicates of images already previously uploaded. I'll see if I can track down the image names so that the articles that you mention can be corrected. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:49, 9 November 2006 (CST)
:Apparently they can be found at [[md:User:Shane/gallery|Shane's gallery]]. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:55, 9 November 2006 (CST)

== Firefly class ==

I have what might be a dumb question, and I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask, but here it is: Does anyone think it would be a good idea to create an article for Firefly-class transports? I mean, a Firefly class ship could be seen in the skies of Caprica in the miniseries, so it might be worthy of an article. The reason I am asking is because the Star Wars Wiki has an article for Firefly class ships (see: [[Wookiepedia:Firefly-class mid-bulk transport|Firefly-class mid-bulk transport]]). Basically, since a Firefly-class ship was shown on a single panel of a Star Wars Webstrip, it was deemed worthy of it's own article on the Star Wars Wiki, so I was thinking that since a Firefly could be seen in the Galactica miniseries, it might be worth an article here as well. Just thought I would ask about it. [[User:NickScryer|NickScryer]] 19:38, 12 November 2006 (CST)
:The appearance of that ship is noted in [[Re-imagined Series References#Miniseries|our "Easter Egg"]] article (though we still need to come up with a way to increase the exposure to that article). ''Enterprise'' also made an appearance in the miniseries, but those cameos were both obvious tributes, and neither of those ships was ever to be seen again. Should either of those craft make another appearance we'll know for certain that they were intended to be canon, but until that point it'd probably be best to err on the side of caution and assume that they are just one-shot gags from the VFX guys at Zoic. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:44, 12 November 2006 (CST)
:As Spencerian said, these were likely one-time cameos. There's very little need to add individual articles about them, when the [[Re-imagined Series References]] would more than suffice. Also, other than a brief appearance, what else of an in-universe nature would there be to say about ''Serenity'' or ''Enterprise''? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 09:52, 13 November 2006 (CST)
::The amusing part is that the footage with the Enterpise in it (the first fleet shot at the end of the Miniseries) is in the opening credits of each episode with, if I remember correctly, the exception of the New Caprica ones. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 09:58, 13 November 2006 (CST)
:''"...was shown on a single panel of a Star Wars Webstrip, it was deemed worthy of it's own article on the Star Wars Wiki..."'' - I work over there (Star Wars Wiki), and let me tell you, my fellow editors/contributers are gonzo/bonkers/rabid/nutbag/loons. They create entire articles about a Star Destroyer variant that appeared in a two-bit, rarely seen comic book only because the artist was too lazy or too short on talent to draw the precise diameter of the bridge sensor ranging domes, or slightly changed the exact shape of an X-Wing's engine intakes so whoa! we need a whole article about ''that'' "special X-Wing"! I'd agree with the rest here... keep the homage cameos as footnotes only. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 09:33, 22 December 2006 (CST)

==Formatting box==
This isn't really a question about the wiki per se, but I thought this would be the most appropriate place to ask. I'm one of the admins over at the Star Trek Expanded Universe wiki, which, if you didn't know, is the fanfic/fan film counterpart to Memory Alpha. I was wondering how I would go about having the box below the editing field with all of the formatting shortcuts added to my wiki. Considering that I'm also the rank archivist for the wiki, it's extremely agitating to have to type out the <nowiki></nowiki> tags every time I'm writing something about the different grades of Petty Officers and Second/First Lieutenants. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks. --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 15:24, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:It's at [[MediaWiki:Edittools]] on this wiki, and it should be in the same place at your own wiki, assuming it runs on MediaWiki. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 17:38, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::Ok, I added it, but it doesn't seem to work. Can you tell what the problem is? --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 17:59, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::The stuff is showing up on edit pages, but it's all text and no links. --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 18:17, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:::If I were to guess, it's that there's CSS stuff at work. Note the div and span id's up at the top in the code? I'm betting the default css styles here (bsgbook and bsgmonobook) have been rigged to interpret those correctly. Hopefully Shane or Joe will notice this, as I think both of them were involved with getting it up and running here. I'm sure they'd be glad to help another wiki out (whenever their ridiculous schedules will allow). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 18:55, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::::Hi Kevin! Welcome to the wiki! ;-) Actually, in order to get edittools working, you will need the [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/CharInsert charinsert] extension. Obviously, if you have need for any assistance from me, please feel free to ask! :-) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:58, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:::::Ok, I need help on how to get the charinsert tag working. I have no idea how to do it. --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 20:21, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::::::Hmm... Did you edit the LocalSettings.php config file and upload? Reason I ask is because the extension is not showing up on [http://stexpanded.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Version STEU's Version page]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:42, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:::::::The thing is, I don't know where the Local Settings page is. Exactly where is it? --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 20:48, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::::::::Do you have FTP access to the server, because that's the only way to get it, edit it and then upload it again. (Sadly, It's not accessible through the web-interface used by the MediaWiki software.) If you don't feel comfortable with changing the stuff directly on the server -- or don't have the access -- I suggest firing off an e-mail to the Wikia folks and let them know to install the charinsert extension for you. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:54, 26 November 2006 (CST)
== Ratings? ==
One of the stats on the Lurker's guide episode guides were a "P5 Rating", an informal poll rating the episodes. Would that be of value? Personally, I'd almost rather see something more like the last vote in the Coaches poll for college football, where the votes are published. Something with the user, the rating, and maybe a brief explanation of why they rated it like they did. My only fear is that may degenerate into cross-talk and vote manipulation ("I voted a 1 because User:Starbuck_Rocks_My_World is an idiot and voted it a 10 when it should really be more like a 6 but she just really like Starbuck episodes.") Some sort of automated tabulation would also be good, as we wouldn't want to add more admin overhead (especially for older episodes). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:30, 21 December 2006 (CST)
: I'm not too keen on the idea, personally. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:55, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:Disagree as well. There are enough forums where people can rate episodes. For a place that strives to be objective, it would add unneeded subjectivity --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:17, 21 December 2006 (CST)
::Some kind of javascript/dhtml/css user [http://komodomedia.com/blog/index.php/2005/08/24/creating-a-star-rater-using-css/ star rating] might be a cool little addition though, but i think that it should be clearly a user rating not a rating given by the battlestar wiki officially. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:46, 22 December 2006 (CST)
:::I can see where there might be conflict with the "encyclopedic" mission (an encyclopedia might note that critics loved/hated a particular work, but shouldn't be in the business of critiquing itself). The user rating was just a thought I had when pondering some of the differences between us and the lurker's guide. Differences aren't always bad... --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:56, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Martial Arts ==

I noticed that this wiki doesn't have an article about Martial arts or hand-to-hand combat. why isn't there one? We have seen boxing used in several episodes, and we have seen a naked [[Eight]] practicing [[Wikipedia:Tai Chi Chuan|Tai Chi]] (even though Tai Chi is consitered a type of moving meditation, it is still technically a martial art). So why don't we have an article about martial arts/hand-to-hand combat? [[User:Dark Claw|Dark Claw]] 22:15, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:Welcome, Dark Claw. The series really hasn't elaborated on these fighting forms (or their versions--note that while things ''look'' contemporary, its not supposed to be truly of Earth) or given much of a storyline that justified a need to write one that's germane to this wiki. Others may have a differing opinion, but ''Battlestar's'' fights are generally uncoordinated brawls without much "art" to them, concentrating on the virtual backstabbing between characters and less of the actual kind. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:45, 9 January 2007 (CST)

== Number of pilots in a squadron? ==

I've been reading the wikipedia here as well as several other sources which state the number of Vipers/pilots in a typical Colonial fighter squadron is 20. This is based largely on the visual evidence in the miniseries where Ripper's flight of 20 Vipers is destroyed by 2 Raiders. But it should be noted that this figure did not include Starbuck (she was in the brig) or Apollo (Starbuck's replacement in the fly by but is Colonial 798's escort). When Kara is released out of the brig, she reports 20 pilots in the ready room "climbing the walls" in addition to herself. These lines seem to indicate to me that a squadron is actually 21 planes/pilots. Thoughts?[[User:AnteaterFeeder|AnteaterFeeder]] 18:04, 18 January 2007 (CST)
:Ehh, I think since she said "20 of us" she was counting herself in that number. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 19:15, 18 January 2007 (CST)

:Aside from that, a squadron could have around 20 planes in sorties, but have more pilots and planes to account for maintainance downtime or unavailibility of the pilots (illness and the like) --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 05:16, 19 January 2007 (CST)

== Can't view images ==

I can't view any of the images on the site, what I get in their place is the "No Hotlinking!" image, and I don't know how to sort this out. Please help {{unsigned|TopGun}}
:The only way you would get a "No Hotlinking" error, usually, if you are trying to view an image from off-site. What browser are you using? [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:37, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::No, that's a browser related problem I think. It has been reported before somewhere, but I can't remember where --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:41, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::From what I have access to, this user is trying to hot-link off site. There is no indication he is trying to view the site. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:49, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::Hasn't been a "Hotlink" error on the en. subdomain for the past 300 visitors. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:50, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:Happens to me on the media wiki from my works computer. My home one seems to be unaffected. Odd --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:41, 19 January 2007 (CST)

I'm using FireFox version 2, I haven't been hot-linking off-site apart from following a link on imdb.com (well mostly copy and pasting as most members of the imbd mbs don't know how to put proper links in their posts). But even when I go through battlestarwiki.org, I still get the same problem. Thanks anyway folks {{unsigned|TopGun}}
:Please remember to use the signature button http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/skins/common/images/button_sig.png or by typing four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to sign your posts on talk pages --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:It's a firewall issue, as far as I've been able to determine. Do you run a firewall program on your computer, TopGun? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 13:55, 19 January 2007 (CST)

Yes, I'm using kerio personnel firewall--[[User:TopGun|TopGun]] 14:10, 19 January 2007 (CST)

I have the same problem (explorer 7 & Firefox). Using Windows firewall. What's the solution? Thx. --[[User:Ublej|Ublej]] 14:11, 27 January 2007 (CST)

: There is no solution right now, simply because I have to find some time to sit down at one of my workstations and try to troubleshoot it. The best thing any affected user can do right now is send me the name of the firewall program they use (with version number) and their (general) firewall settings and configurations '''''via e-mail directly at joe.beaudoin@gmail.com'''''. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 21:14, 27 January 2007 (CST)

:: I've posted what I need on [http://blog.battlestarwiki.org/2007/01/30/no-hotlinking-issue/ ze bloug]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 30 January 2007 (CST)

I can now see images. Thanks!--[[User:Ublej|Ublej]] 15:41, 20 February 2007 (CST)

==Trivia and Slideshows==
Since I have been under the weather for nearly a month (at one time I was hospitalized for a possible heart attack and still don't know if I did or not), I have had a lot of time just to sit around and think. A couple of ideas is a central trivia page (especially for the TOS) and a summary slideshow (each line in a episode gets a shot). I know the slideshow would be a lot of work and possibly cause bandwidth concerns (maybe copyright issues?). An easy solution that I played around with was a link to an image at the end of a summary point for just the most suitable points. Just trying to find a way to interject more images without "junking up" the articles. Also, a simple gallery subpage make work also. Just bored to death (almost literally one time, an emergency room damn near killed me.) --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:52, 31 January 2007 (CST)

== Addition Removed ==

I added a small piece to the Baltar as a Cylon article and it has subsequently been removed with instructions to check my email.

The only email I see is one to activate my account.

Therefore

- If my article was removed on purely administrative grounds can i get approval to replace it? And is it stored in some form of recent changes/recycling bin style thing soI do n't have to retype it.
- If it was not what did I do wrong? {{unsigned|Loreki}}

: Hi there! Anyway, the "check your bsgwiki email" message is just for the admins. As for the addition, it appears that your edit didn't make it through, as your [[Special:Contributions/Loreki|contributions]] don't show an edit to [[Baltar as Cylon speculation]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:24, 2 February 2007 (CST)
::I was confused by this as I didn't see any edit or revert, but your theory makes sense. Loreki: Did the submission take a very long time? If yes, then you probably made it when the server was dying and, as said, it wasn't transmitted. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 11:34, 2 February 2007 (CST)
::: I had the same thing happen to me a few times yesterday around the time I added the promo pic to Maelstrom. Took 2-3 times to finally get it to stay put. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 11:38, 2 February 2007 (CST)

::: That would seem to be an appropriate answer. I shall retype it later. It was just a small item pointing out that the name Gaius is roman, the rest of the series draws Greek parallels. Gaius as foreigner and hence Cylon? {{unsigned|Loreki}}
::::Like other have said, probably just a server hiccup. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 12:01, 2 February 2007 (CST)

::::While the name is indeed Roman, I would suggest leaving away the rest (and then adding it to [[Gaius Baltar]] instead) . It's not the only Roman reference. In names there is also "Valerii" and "Felix" (sounds American, but it's Latin for "happy"). In religion/mythology, there are Mars Day, Mercury and Jupiter. Especially the Eye of Jupiter indicates that the Colonials use Roman and Greek mythology somewhat interchangeably --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:03, 2 February 2007 (CST)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2007-01-27T20:11:52Z

Ublej: /* Can't view images */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy|end=y}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}} {{archive-item|02|Quorum Definintion}} {{archive-item|02|DVD titles.}} {{archive-item|02|Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum}} {{archive-item|02|Featured Article and Featured Picture|end=y}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 03
| number = 3
| start = July 13, 2006
| end = September 28, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|03|Scifi.com}} {{archive-item|03|Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork?}} {{archive-item|03|Question/idea}} {{archive-item|03|Template: Episode Data}} {{archive-item|03|The Hangerbay Comes to Life}} {{archive-item|03|Wormholes}} {{archive-item|03|DragonCon, Anyone?}} {{archive-item|03|Image Taging!}} {{archive-item|03|Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents}} {{archive-item|03|Is this project an official Wikimedia project?}} {{archive-item|03|Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980}} {{archive-item|03|Sandbox}} {{archive-item|03|Do you see the ball?}} {{archive-item|03|Request from FrakParty.com|end=y}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 04
| number = 4
| start = September 27, 2006
| end = October 10, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|04|Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?!}} {{archive-item|04|Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?}} {{archive-item|04|Standards and Conventions Adjustments}} {{archive-item|04|Fanwanking}} {{archive-item|04|Wiki up again}} {{archive-item|04|Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization|end=y}}
|}}

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)
::Both the BSWiki and Scifipedia use MediaWiki and both has history showing page edits. Its obviously which site wrote it first and which one just edited in large chunks. Someone really needs to give JohnRDouglas a kick up the bum. Of course its a bit of a dilema because if SciFi really wanted to they could force us to pull virtually all our content, or at the very least the images. We dont want to piss them off, but at the same time, they cant go around using material written by other people. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 19:37, 13 November 2006 (CST)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

:The [[Cylons (RDM)]] article seems as an introduction to the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] as well. Further I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:34, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, because everything will change then. But she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[Caprica-Three]], because she was introduced there? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:18, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Images ==

I am not sure why, but my entires on Valkyrie, Eugene Novacek and Admiral Corman which were primarily just images uploaded onto the pages were deleted...I don't get it, doesn't it help to have pictures to refer to the subject the page is discussing. If it is a matter of spoiling future episodes with these pictures, readers are imformed at the top of the page which all of the above mentioned pages have, that the page is a spoiler. If it is my own fault for not siting where i got the images taking them down isn't exactly the answer, why not modify them yourselves. I realize I am a huge amateur so, discussing this for me will help myself and possibly others.
:It's not a spoiler issue at all, and your efforts are appreciated. In this case I believe it was simply a matter of the images being duplicates of images already previously uploaded. I'll see if I can track down the image names so that the articles that you mention can be corrected. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:49, 9 November 2006 (CST)
:Apparently they can be found at [[md:User:Shane/gallery|Shane's gallery]]. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:55, 9 November 2006 (CST)

== Firefly class ==

I have what might be a dumb question, and I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask, but here it is: Does anyone think it would be a good idea to create an article for Firefly-class transports? I mean, a Firefly class ship could be seen in the skies of Caprica in the miniseries, so it might be worthy of an article. The reason I am asking is because the Star Wars Wiki has an article for Firefly class ships (see: [[Wookiepedia:Firefly-class mid-bulk transport|Firefly-class mid-bulk transport]]). Basically, since a Firefly-class ship was shown on a single panel of a Star Wars Webstrip, it was deemed worthy of it's own article on the Star Wars Wiki, so I was thinking that since a Firefly could be seen in the Galactica miniseries, it might be worth an article here as well. Just thought I would ask about it. [[User:NickScryer|NickScryer]] 19:38, 12 November 2006 (CST)
:The appearance of that ship is noted in [[Re-imagined Series References#Miniseries|our "Easter Egg"]] article (though we still need to come up with a way to increase the exposure to that article). ''Enterprise'' also made an appearance in the miniseries, but those cameos were both obvious tributes, and neither of those ships was ever to be seen again. Should either of those craft make another appearance we'll know for certain that they were intended to be canon, but until that point it'd probably be best to err on the side of caution and assume that they are just one-shot gags from the VFX guys at Zoic. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:44, 12 November 2006 (CST)
:As Spencerian said, these were likely one-time cameos. There's very little need to add individual articles about them, when the [[Re-imagined Series References]] would more than suffice. Also, other than a brief appearance, what else of an in-universe nature would there be to say about ''Serenity'' or ''Enterprise''? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 09:52, 13 November 2006 (CST)
::The amusing part is that the footage with the Enterpise in it (the first fleet shot at the end of the Miniseries) is in the opening credits of each episode with, if I remember correctly, the exception of the New Caprica ones. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 09:58, 13 November 2006 (CST)
:''"...was shown on a single panel of a Star Wars Webstrip, it was deemed worthy of it's own article on the Star Wars Wiki..."'' - I work over there (Star Wars Wiki), and let me tell you, my fellow editors/contributers are gonzo/bonkers/rabid/nutbag/loons. They create entire articles about a Star Destroyer variant that appeared in a two-bit, rarely seen comic book only because the artist was too lazy or too short on talent to draw the precise diameter of the bridge sensor ranging domes, or slightly changed the exact shape of an X-Wing's engine intakes so whoa! we need a whole article about ''that'' "special X-Wing"! I'd agree with the rest here... keep the homage cameos as footnotes only. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 09:33, 22 December 2006 (CST)

==Formatting box==
This isn't really a question about the wiki per se, but I thought this would be the most appropriate place to ask. I'm one of the admins over at the Star Trek Expanded Universe wiki, which, if you didn't know, is the fanfic/fan film counterpart to Memory Alpha. I was wondering how I would go about having the box below the editing field with all of the formatting shortcuts added to my wiki. Considering that I'm also the rank archivist for the wiki, it's extremely agitating to have to type out the <nowiki></nowiki> tags every time I'm writing something about the different grades of Petty Officers and Second/First Lieutenants. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks. --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 15:24, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:It's at [[MediaWiki:Edittools]] on this wiki, and it should be in the same place at your own wiki, assuming it runs on MediaWiki. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 17:38, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::Ok, I added it, but it doesn't seem to work. Can you tell what the problem is? --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 17:59, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::The stuff is showing up on edit pages, but it's all text and no links. --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 18:17, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:::If I were to guess, it's that there's CSS stuff at work. Note the div and span id's up at the top in the code? I'm betting the default css styles here (bsgbook and bsgmonobook) have been rigged to interpret those correctly. Hopefully Shane or Joe will notice this, as I think both of them were involved with getting it up and running here. I'm sure they'd be glad to help another wiki out (whenever their ridiculous schedules will allow). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 18:55, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::::Hi Kevin! Welcome to the wiki! ;-) Actually, in order to get edittools working, you will need the [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/CharInsert charinsert] extension. Obviously, if you have need for any assistance from me, please feel free to ask! :-) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:58, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:::::Ok, I need help on how to get the charinsert tag working. I have no idea how to do it. --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 20:21, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::::::Hmm... Did you edit the LocalSettings.php config file and upload? Reason I ask is because the extension is not showing up on [http://stexpanded.wikia.com/wiki/Special:Version STEU's Version page]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:42, 26 November 2006 (CST)
:::::::The thing is, I don't know where the Local Settings page is. Exactly where is it? --[[User:Kevin W.|Kevin W.]] 20:48, 26 November 2006 (CST)
::::::::Do you have FTP access to the server, because that's the only way to get it, edit it and then upload it again. (Sadly, It's not accessible through the web-interface used by the MediaWiki software.) If you don't feel comfortable with changing the stuff directly on the server -- or don't have the access -- I suggest firing off an e-mail to the Wikia folks and let them know to install the charinsert extension for you. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:54, 26 November 2006 (CST)
== Ratings? ==
One of the stats on the Lurker's guide episode guides were a "P5 Rating", an informal poll rating the episodes. Would that be of value? Personally, I'd almost rather see something more like the last vote in the Coaches poll for college football, where the votes are published. Something with the user, the rating, and maybe a brief explanation of why they rated it like they did. My only fear is that may degenerate into cross-talk and vote manipulation ("I voted a 1 because User:Starbuck_Rocks_My_World is an idiot and voted it a 10 when it should really be more like a 6 but she just really like Starbuck episodes.") Some sort of automated tabulation would also be good, as we wouldn't want to add more admin overhead (especially for older episodes). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:30, 21 December 2006 (CST)
: I'm not too keen on the idea, personally. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:55, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:Disagree as well. There are enough forums where people can rate episodes. For a place that strives to be objective, it would add unneeded subjectivity --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:17, 21 December 2006 (CST)
::Some kind of javascript/dhtml/css user [http://komodomedia.com/blog/index.php/2005/08/24/creating-a-star-rater-using-css/ star rating] might be a cool little addition though, but i think that it should be clearly a user rating not a rating given by the battlestar wiki officially. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:46, 22 December 2006 (CST)
:::I can see where there might be conflict with the "encyclopedic" mission (an encyclopedia might note that critics loved/hated a particular work, but shouldn't be in the business of critiquing itself). The user rating was just a thought I had when pondering some of the differences between us and the lurker's guide. Differences aren't always bad... --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:56, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Martial Arts ==

I noticed that this wiki doesn't have an article about Martial arts or hand-to-hand combat. why isn't there one? We have seen boxing used in several episodes, and we have seen a naked [[Eight]] practicing [[Wikipedia:Tai Chi Chuan|Tai Chi]] (even though Tai Chi is consitered a type of moving meditation, it is still technically a martial art). So why don't we have an article about martial arts/hand-to-hand combat? [[User:Dark Claw|Dark Claw]] 22:15, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:Welcome, Dark Claw. The series really hasn't elaborated on these fighting forms (or their versions--note that while things ''look'' contemporary, its not supposed to be truly of Earth) or given much of a storyline that justified a need to write one that's germane to this wiki. Others may have a differing opinion, but ''Battlestar's'' fights are generally uncoordinated brawls without much "art" to them, concentrating on the virtual backstabbing between characters and less of the actual kind. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:45, 9 January 2007 (CST)

== Number of pilots in a squadron? ==

I've been reading the wikipedia here as well as several other sources which state the number of Vipers/pilots in a typical Colonial fighter squadron is 20. This is based largely on the visual evidence in the miniseries where Ripper's flight of 20 Vipers is destroyed by 2 Raiders. But it should be noted that this figure did not include Starbuck (she was in the brig) or Apollo (Starbuck's replacement in the fly by but is Colonial 798's escort). When Kara is released out of the brig, she reports 20 pilots in the ready room "climbing the walls" in addition to herself. These lines seem to indicate to me that a squadron is actually 21 planes/pilots. Thoughts?[[User:AnteaterFeeder|AnteaterFeeder]] 18:04, 18 January 2007 (CST)
:Ehh, I think since she said "20 of us" she was counting herself in that number. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 19:15, 18 January 2007 (CST)

:Aside from that, a squadron could have around 20 planes in sorties, but have more pilots and planes to account for maintainance downtime or unavailibility of the pilots (illness and the like) --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 05:16, 19 January 2007 (CST)

== Can't view images ==

I can't view any of the images on the site, what I get in their place is the "No Hotlinking!" image, and I don't know how to sort this out. Please help {{unsigned|TopGun}}
:The only way you would get a "No Hotlinking" error, usually, if you are trying to view an image from off-site. What browser are you using? [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:37, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::No, that's a browser related problem I think. It has been reported before somewhere, but I can't remember where --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:41, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::From what I have access to, this user is trying to hot-link off site. There is no indication he is trying to view the site. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:49, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::Hasn't been a "Hotlink" error on the en. subdomain for the past 300 visitors. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:50, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:Happens to me on the media wiki from my works computer. My home one seems to be unaffected. Odd --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:41, 19 January 2007 (CST)

I'm using FireFox version 2, I haven't been hot-linking off-site apart from following a link on imdb.com (well mostly copy and pasting as most members of the imbd mbs don't know how to put proper links in their posts). But even when I go through battlestarwiki.org, I still get the same problem. Thanks anyway folks {{unsigned|TopGun}}
:Please remember to use the signature button http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/skins/common/images/button_sig.png or by typing four tildes (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) to sign your posts on talk pages --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:It's a firewall issue, as far as I've been able to determine. Do you run a firewall program on your computer, TopGun? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 13:55, 19 January 2007 (CST)

Yes, I'm using kerio personnel firewall--[[User:TopGun|TopGun]] 14:10, 19 January 2007 (CST)

I have the same problem (explorer 7 & Firefox). Using Windows firewall. What's the solution? Thx. --[[User:Ublej|Ublej]] 14:11, 27 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:Religion in the Twelve Colonies (RDM)/Archive 1

2007-01-04T23:29:47Z

Ublej: /* Lords of Kobol */

== Religeous Variance ==

Specifically, in the bit about funerals... It sounds a bit harsh to say that priests do the funerals regardless of the beliefs of the deceased. It makes it sound like they're Muslims getting Catholic funerals. I couldn't tell you the difference between a Methodist funeral and a Protestant funeral if my life depended on it. I think that this (apparently) unilateral handling of funerals is more indicative of the (mostly) unified religeon of the Colonies, rather than a callous behavior of some kind of oppressive theocracy. The only people who seem like they have a truely different religeous idea are Tigh, Adama and Billy, and they don't seem to strongly anti-religeon that they'd roll over at their religeous funeral. I didn't make an edit to reflect this, though, because this is rather subjective. --[[User:Day|Day]] 04:23, 10 September 2005 (EDT) (Post Script: I'm working on getting that picture. My Mac's having some technical issues.)

==Unknowns==

:''Rules applying to the priesthood may or may not be the same throughout the Twelve Colonies. It is possible that certain schools of the priesthood practice celibacy, but Chief [[Tyrol]] stated that his father was a priest and his mother an oracle, so it would not be adhered to by all denominations of the religion of the Twelve Colonies.''

:''This may vary considerably from one Colony to the next: [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Gemenon|Gemenons]] believe in the literal truth of the [[Sacred Scrolls]] and are quite fundamentalist, while [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Capricans]] seem fairly secular in their treatment of Church-State relations.''

I really don't see the point in noting may-or-may-nots and it-is-not-knowns. The idea here is to state everything we do know - everything we don't state is logically unknown. I'm not opposed to informed speculation, but simply listing the areas we haven't heard about seems fruitless.

== The Chicken And Egg Origin of the Greek/Kobol Gods ==

Since the 13th Tribe populated Earth, all the while bringing their religion from Kobol, this suggests that the ''Greek gods'' are the offshoots to the Kobol gods, not the reverse. This fits with the other Olympian gods not (yet) mentioned in the Kobol religion, but present in the Olympian religion.

This suggestion creates several interesting possibilities for thought.

* There wasn't a human population already on Earth with its own religion. The religion of Kobol grew to form the Olympian gods.
* There ''was'' an existing human population, and the Colonial humans and native terrans merged genes and religion, which might have included other beings we know as the Olympian and quasi-Olympian gods.
* The Tribe somehow lost their technological base of information and went into a new dark age similar to what the Tribes experienced before, increasing their need for divine aid (and expansion of the Kobol religion to form the Olympian components). This also kept the 13th Tribe from returning to know the fate of their brothers in the other Tribes.
* The 13th Tribe landed in the Mediterreanean area of Earth (presuming their Earth is ''"our"'' Earth), in what we historically have called the "seat of human civilization."

The hologram in the [[Tomb of Athena]] suggests that the constellations and celestial bodies of Earth were either known already to the Kobol tribes and were programmed into the Tomb before they left, or a 13th Tribe member from Earth returned to do this. If neither are true, then there is real problem with how the Tomb received this information, and the need or ability for the [[Arrow of Apollo]] to be available (and noted in the Sacred Scrolls) as capable of showing the way to a place the Tribes had not yet visited (unless you count in the "all this has happened and will happen again" part of the Scrolls).

I edited the article with the point in mind as it seemed too strong to suggest otherwise. Thoughts on this or points against the notion? (This also keeps us from blowing brain cells on who created what.) [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:34, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

: See the "Three Exodus" portion of [[Sacred Scrolls]] for something that explains this. It was written by me, so perhaps I'm biased towards it being true, but if it is, then the pictures inside the Tomb of Athena ''do'' fall under the "All this has happened before..." clause. As does the dissemination of the Gods. However, I agree that it's probable that the 13th Tribe brought the Lords of Kobol with them to Earth. It's just that, after that, they also brought them ''back'' to Kobol so that they would be there to be brough to Earth again in the next cycle. I hope that's coherent. It's hard talking in circles like this. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:07, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

::I don't think its necessary or interesting to note that in this much detail - the History article covers the origin of the twelve colonies in substantially more detail. To that end, I'd prefer to revert your comments, if you're not terribly attatched. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:10, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:::Actually it's not that bad. I'm going to clarify it slightly, but it would probably be useful to keep it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

::::Actually I would say that Humans where born on earth and went to Kobold as said above, not that Kobold brought the gods to earth, '''life here began out there those are the first words of the ancient scrolls and they where told to us by the lords of Kobold countless centuries ago''' The big one there is ''life here'' lets look at that, they are bluntly stating in a way that life on kobold is not native it began out in space, the ties to earth mythology, technology, referances etc can only be explained so many ways.

::::Take adama's ship (the model) it's a classic schoonar, now you can call 'paralell development' but only to an extent we know that the colonies had space technology when they where founded which leads us to believe that the schoonar is older then that the design anyway, we also know apparently from flash backs etc that Kobold was fairly advanced heck we know they had holographic technology... Which in turn points to the fact that maybe they where not native to Kobold either.

::::I'd prefure to look at it something like this, at some stage we the good old 13th colony reached a point where we had FTL technology and in turn we expanded we spread out and colonised the stars, Kobold was one of those maybe at the time we had advanced enough through gene manipulation or the such that the 13 Lords of Kobold where immortals or at least enhanced humans while the 'normals' who lived in peace with the lords where from a Genetic databank (or perhaps we moved there in an ark to escape some cataclism on earth) over time the origins of were they came from began to fade until the exodus from kobold. Which began the whole cycle again.. (in turn this would show the All this has happened before and all this will happen again part).

::::Even still there are disrepancy's within the shows own words.. the 13th Colony left kobold in the early days and settled on a planet around a distant and unknown star.... that has been proven to be a false statement, it was not unknown, the Koboldians KNEW about it, apparently even the scriptures themselves know that from Earth you can look up at the stars and see the 12 other colonies, the Zodiac.. When you take these facts into account the belief that Kobold is the original planet is impossible, because the Only way you can get the exact star alignments for those Zodiac's is within a set distance (5 or so Light years presuming None of the stars within 5 light years make up the Zodic pieces) of Earth.. No Life began on earth and went to kobold it's the only way one can explain so much of what is Canon of the show now. [[User:RobGraham|RobGraham]]21:03 Thursday 29th June Australian EST.

::::: A note: It's "Kobol". The one is a planet, the other is a small dogish creature from D&D (if I remember right). Anyway, I think you're getting tied up in a linear idea of time. You have to keep in mind there that ''is'' no true point of genesis. You can pick any point in the cycle and get back to it. So, take "humans on Earth" as your starting point:

::::: Something makes them leave Earth and move to Kobol. They forget Earth. The Big Bad Thing happens and they flee to the 13 colonies (the Twelves Colonies and Earth). They forget Kobol and Earth. Another Big Bad Thing (Cylons) happens and they flee the Twelve to go find the Thirteenth. Presumably, they settle. They forget Kobol and the Twelve Colonies. Something makes them leave Earth and move to Kobol. They forget Earth. Repeat, repeat.

::::: That's my "Three Exodi" interpretation, anyway. And, in it, from the point of view of the Kobolites, life ''did'' begin "out there" on Earth. That's where they all came from, ''most recently''. I hope that helps explain how everything has already come before. Sure the origin of the zodiacs necessarily comes from Earth. That's incorperated into the theory. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:55, 29 June 2006 (CDT)

== Zephyr ==

About where in the episode is this mentioned? Is it explicitly stated that the ''Zephyr'' is named after a God, or is it just mentioned? It is my understanding that a zephyr is a gust of wind and, thus, not an imp[robable name for a ship with that meaning. Unless it's explicit, I think this point is ambiguous at best. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:11, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:No, he's right. See [[Wikipedia:Zephyrus|Zephyrus]]. Very nice catch, Spence. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:14, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:: Woah! Zephyrus lived in a cave on ''Thrace''? That can't be accidental. It hadn't occured to me until I saw it, but I knew this. I played a pice a few years ago called the ''March of the Young Thracians'' or something. Anyway, I'm not sure about Zephyr, still. He wasn't one of the "main" Greek Gods, as it were, so I don't think we can make an assumption that he's a Lord of Kobol. They may have lesser gods like the Greeks did that just have never been mentioned, or it might be that some effects dude at Zoic named the ship that because it makes a good name for a ship, not realizing that it's also an allusion to a Greek god. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:22, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:::A link to Kara Thrace's article already noted this, which is where I felt the Zephyr note was credible. Kara's name (as in a human aided by the "winds") and the link to Zephyrus couldn't be a coincidence--RDM had that one down. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:55, 4 October 2005 (EDT)

:::Right, but he ''is'' a god, the Colonials apparently know about him, and we don't have any knowlege on whether the colonials separate the Lords of Kobol from minor deities - so it's probably important to note, and there isn't really a better place for it. (FWIW, they did apparently distinguish between upper and lower demons). --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:29, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

== Liturgy ==
Does anyone know what language Elosha's funeral prayer is in at the end of the Mini-series? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:30, 3 October 2005 (EDT)
:You may already know this answer by now (though others may not), but she is singing in sanskrit from text used in the Hindu faith. A good [http://navras.boourns.net/extra.php fan site] about the end title song to "The Matrix Revolutions", called "Navras", shows the Brhadaranyaka Upanisad 1.3.28 exactly as Elosha sung it and as used in that Matrix end title by composer Don Davis and the artist known as Juno Reactor.

::''asato ma sad gamaya'' 
::''tamaso ma jyotir gamaya'' 
::''mrtyor mamrtam gamaya'' 

:In English:

::''From delusion lead me to truth'' 
::''From darkness lead me to light'' 
::''From death lead me to immortality'' 

:I've watched the Mini-Series countless times now, and used the "Navras" music as some of my workout music. I knew about the sanskit origin, but Eiosha's song was familiar to me and I didn't know why until someone here pointed out that it was a source I already knew. Damn fine soundtracks for both the Mini-Series and "The Matrix" movies, by the way. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:50, 13 December 2005 (EST)

::I actually prefer In My Head, Tetsujin, and You All, Everybody. --[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 00:53, 14 December 2005 (EST)

:::I don't recognize the last one, but yes, the first two are also great tracks. I always visualize Trinity kicking butt and taking names when those two tracks are on. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:01, 14 December 2005 (EST)

::::Oh come on, surely you must know it: "You all, You all everybody/Acting like such stupid people/wearing expensive clothes/You all, you all, You all, everybody..."--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 12:38, 14 December 2005 (EST)

::Yes, I incorporated that into the Language in the Twelve Colonies article. That seems to me to be the more appropriate place. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 04:12, 14 December 2005 (EST)

==Priesthood==

Spencerian added:

:Like denominations on Earth, it is possible that there are varying kinds of priests and customs that share elements of worship of the Lords of Kobol, with some subtle or significant differences. It is probable that, based on their devotion, a Genemon priest (in comparison to one, say, on Caprica) may have a more defined worship or celebration process, or may speak or pay more respects to one or a handful of Lords in preference over others, as Kara Thrace devoted prayer to her specific Lords. The contrast would be akin to the Catholic, Episopal, and Lutheran churches of real-world Earth.

As my fellow contributors know, I frown on plausible but baseless speculation. I don't think this is useful here. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:48, 1 November 2005 (EST)

:Removing. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 03:08, 3 November 2005 (EST)

==Zoic==

Where and in what capacity did Zoic "release" those names? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:28, 8 December 2005 (EST)

:You know this "reference" as well as I, and I would as well like to see the press release or web site reference where Zoic gave us this information. I know this is circular and that the Great Delete Key of the Citation Jihad may be quivering over that item, but I did note its non-canonical nature, but at the same time, considering its an official production company of the show, its also hard to prove them wrong--this information might be in the mysterious [[series bible]] for all we know. Maybe Joe would know old Ernestborg9's resource. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 8 December 2005 (EST)

::Non-canonical is one thing, but uncited and non-canonical is past my limit. I mean, we could just start making random shit up and say that Zoic said it, and really, nobody would be there to catch us. We have to police ourselves on this. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 15:35, 8 December 2005 (EST)

:::If this is the case, we need to delete ALL the battlestar pages or rework them to remove those old Zoic references. I'm OK on this, but we have a lot of work to do. The Zoic thing here has been like the "weird uncle" in the family that you don't talk about or leave the daughters with, but let come to family gatherings anyway. Probably time to purge all references to Zoic's battlestars, maybe moving them to the Zoic page, and deleting the rest. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:15, 8 December 2005 (EST)

::::Well, the ''best'' thing to do would be to find the source of the quote, but I haven't had any luck. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 16:22, 8 December 2005 (EST)

==Atlantia==
How should we handle this reference? The Atlantia and Pacifica were presumably named after the Atlantic and Pacific oceans (in real life). The Atlantic ocean is named for Atlas, not Atlantia, but that's not necessarily implied by anything on-screen (and if it were really named after the ocean, it would probably be Atlantica.) --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 15:00, 8 December 2005 (EST)

:I'd stick to what we know, until we find something better. Atlas was a founder of Atlantis, so we can add this contradicting resource since Pegasus also has differing sources of origin. Greek myth is always full of contradictions anyway. Given that there's no Atlantic Ocean in the Colonies as far as we know, and the Lords tend to be Olympian, not Titan, gods, I'd go for the dryad origin. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 8 December 2005 (EST)

==The Jealous God==
Ricimer said: ''Although it is tantalizing to claim that the Cylon God is the rebelious Lord of Kobol, I don't think #6 has ever claimed that they're the same one.''

:When Six says to Baltar, "Blasphemous, stupid lies. There have never been any other gods, only the One," it seems to me that she's referring to the one Elosha was just speaking about. You may be right that the inference is too tenuous for the article, though. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:56, 12 December 2005 (EST)

::I love this idea as well, very tantalyzing indeed, but perhaps it belongs in an analysis section to be added to the deleted scenes article. --[[User:MASON|Mason]] 23:21, 12 December 2005 (EST)

::: You see although I'd ''like'' to equate the two, I don't think we can ''yet''; it's more for an "Analysis" section. It seems to me that Number Six in that scene was talking about ALL of the Gods that Elosha was talking about, the Jealous God AND the other 11 ''collectively''. It's not clear enough of a statement. I'm kind of secretly hoping that the cylons were taught the advanced technology needed to make humanoid Cylons from the Count Iblis equivalent of this series, which turns out to be the jealous Lord of Kobol; however, as Ron D. Moore has pointed out, that would kind of "gut" the religion of the Cylons: the Cylons are sentient beings in their own right, and all sentient beings have a claim to a soul and a concept of god once they're intelligent enough to grasp such concepts, and turning around and saying "well the whole idea of Cylons having a religion and thinking they have their own souls? Turns out they got duped by a god-like alien, which, although very powerful, ain't really a god, just more like Q from Star Trek or something", saying that would somehow seem to unfairly lessen the Cylons in my opinion. Maybe they can work the two concepts together tactfully (Cylons developed a concept of God BEFORE meeting Count Iblis, and Iblis is claiming to be the "real Cylon god"? , etc.). I don't know. But we don't have a lot to go on. --[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 01:43, 13 December 2005 (EST)

:::: I agree with almost everything you've written, and although I like to speculate that ideas, like Iblis, will be tied back into RDM's Cylon religion, I appreciate that this speculation can only exist in a limited form on the wiki. I don't entirely agree with you on the idea that the Cylons religious credibility would be compromised by a manifested God, for this cyclical pattern working itself out in the show reminds me very much of Isaac Asimov's [http://mit.edu/tylerc/www/twt/LQ1.htm The Last Question], which was satisfying in its vast simplicity.

I like to add a little bit, not to sound pompous but there can be some connection from the Cylon god and the Jealous god. The Jealous God started the war because he wanted to be placed above the other ones, starting the so called "War of the Gods." So he is thrown out and loses, so he wanders around and finds the Cylons. Maybe he inspires them to rebel and they do. He sets himself up as their god, and it is concurrent with what the Cylons think of the Colonial Gods; i.e. the other gods are fake, their one god is the true god. The Jealous God wishes to be placed above the others, and ends up finding a lost race, the Cylons and takes them as his own.

I mean, he may have set himself up as this seemingly beneficial, but ultimately devious figure. It may possibly be a correlation to Count Iblis. --[[User:Volostheguardian|Volostheguardian]] 14:09, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

RDM said there wouldn't be a Count Iblis on the Re-Imagined Series, and that the Cylons aren't "well we're Machines that got fooled into thinking we had souls by a higher being"; the Cylons have as much claim to their religion being "real" as the humans do. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:06, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== Religious Issue ==

the Lords of Kobol are a part of a fictional story. the Greek Olympians are worshipped both by people in ancient times and by living people. the religion is not "shared", rather the Lords are based upon the real-world religion. i realize that this may seem a minor issue to some of you, but it is a significant semantic assumption to make that the Lords are the same as the Olympians. [[User:Whateley23|Whateley23]] 01:46, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:Indeed, it does seem like a minor issue. There is nothing wrong with the current phrasing in my opinion, and I will not change it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 02:09, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:: I think that the assumption is not that both are fictional, but that the story will tell us they are of the same origin (also implying that the story is not fictional, though it clearly is). ''Within the fictional universe of Ronald D. Moorse's'' Battlestar Galactica, The Lords of Kobol and the Greek Olympians are/were the same thing. We also state that Vipers can do such and such and that ''Galactica'' has certain armaments, but we don't make any caveats about the fact that the nukes in the show are actually ''fictional'' nukes for fear of offending nuclear scientists currently working on related technologies. Everything except the articles on actors and other clearly-real things, should be taken as if it were prefaced by the italics above: We know the show's not real, so don't let our comments about it reflect on reality. --[[User:Day|Day]] 15:08, 16 January 2006 (EST)

== Religious Parallels ==
Should we maybe move the parallels between Colonial religion and real world faiths to an independent article? We don't really have a systematic way to present Colonial religion and the parallels exacerbate this problems by further broadening the articles only makes this article harder to understand.--[[User:Spidersense215|Spidersense215]] 14:06, 21 September 2006 (CDT)
:Which ones? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:17, 21 September 2006 (CDT)

== Lords of Kobol ==
Does the existance of the Mercury class Battlestars imply that Hermes/Mercury is a Lord of Kobol? --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 15:15, 18 October 2006 (CDT)+
:The writers of the show are dancing about in the usage of Greek and Roman mythological names. Since Hermes hasn't been mentioned specifically as a Lord, no, we can't add it. I'm not big on mixing the pantheons until the context of the names in the show are clear. We have a list of names (Greek, mostly) of names heard of ships or used as people, but until used in in the context as a Lord, we shouldn't assume that the name is actually that of a Lord. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:20, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::That makes sense. It occured to me after I wrote the above that the name could refer to quicksilver, which would make sense if the Mercury class was faster than earlier ones. That would also tidy up the roman nomenclature.
::Where is the list of names you mentioned? --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 15:30, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::See the section, "Other mythological names in Colonial culture," this article. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:28, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::LMAO. I was searching all over this site. It didn't occur to me that it'd be in the same article I was commenting on. --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 20:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)

The article mentions that seven lords have been identified. Anyone notice this is the same as the number of identified cylons? It could be that each cylon model represents a lord (i.e. Sharon - Athena, Six (or maybe three) - Hera). The 5 unidentified cylons match 5 unidentified lords match the 5 in the temple of five. On a related note: how about the (norse) idea of an allfather - the Cylons recognize the allfather, but none of the lower "gods" (including the Lords of Kobol). I suppose this would be an alternate theory to the Jealous God being the god of cylons. --[[User:Ublej|Ublej]] 17:29, 4 January 2007 (CST)

== More Cowbell ==
Actually, more images, please. Great text content, but a couple of more images applied evenly would really brighten things up. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:04, 8 December 2006 (CST)
:Ooh. And there are some XHTML problems. I'll get on those. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:25, 8 December 2006 (CST)

Talk:Religion in the Twelve Colonies (RDM)/Archive 1

2007-01-04T23:28:40Z

Ublej: /* Lords of Kobol */

== Religeous Variance ==

Specifically, in the bit about funerals... It sounds a bit harsh to say that priests do the funerals regardless of the beliefs of the deceased. It makes it sound like they're Muslims getting Catholic funerals. I couldn't tell you the difference between a Methodist funeral and a Protestant funeral if my life depended on it. I think that this (apparently) unilateral handling of funerals is more indicative of the (mostly) unified religeon of the Colonies, rather than a callous behavior of some kind of oppressive theocracy. The only people who seem like they have a truely different religeous idea are Tigh, Adama and Billy, and they don't seem to strongly anti-religeon that they'd roll over at their religeous funeral. I didn't make an edit to reflect this, though, because this is rather subjective. --[[User:Day|Day]] 04:23, 10 September 2005 (EDT) (Post Script: I'm working on getting that picture. My Mac's having some technical issues.)

==Unknowns==

:''Rules applying to the priesthood may or may not be the same throughout the Twelve Colonies. It is possible that certain schools of the priesthood practice celibacy, but Chief [[Tyrol]] stated that his father was a priest and his mother an oracle, so it would not be adhered to by all denominations of the religion of the Twelve Colonies.''

:''This may vary considerably from one Colony to the next: [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Gemenon|Gemenons]] believe in the literal truth of the [[Sacred Scrolls]] and are quite fundamentalist, while [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Capricans]] seem fairly secular in their treatment of Church-State relations.''

I really don't see the point in noting may-or-may-nots and it-is-not-knowns. The idea here is to state everything we do know - everything we don't state is logically unknown. I'm not opposed to informed speculation, but simply listing the areas we haven't heard about seems fruitless.

== The Chicken And Egg Origin of the Greek/Kobol Gods ==

Since the 13th Tribe populated Earth, all the while bringing their religion from Kobol, this suggests that the ''Greek gods'' are the offshoots to the Kobol gods, not the reverse. This fits with the other Olympian gods not (yet) mentioned in the Kobol religion, but present in the Olympian religion.

This suggestion creates several interesting possibilities for thought.

* There wasn't a human population already on Earth with its own religion. The religion of Kobol grew to form the Olympian gods.
* There ''was'' an existing human population, and the Colonial humans and native terrans merged genes and religion, which might have included other beings we know as the Olympian and quasi-Olympian gods.
* The Tribe somehow lost their technological base of information and went into a new dark age similar to what the Tribes experienced before, increasing their need for divine aid (and expansion of the Kobol religion to form the Olympian components). This also kept the 13th Tribe from returning to know the fate of their brothers in the other Tribes.
* The 13th Tribe landed in the Mediterreanean area of Earth (presuming their Earth is ''"our"'' Earth), in what we historically have called the "seat of human civilization."

The hologram in the [[Tomb of Athena]] suggests that the constellations and celestial bodies of Earth were either known already to the Kobol tribes and were programmed into the Tomb before they left, or a 13th Tribe member from Earth returned to do this. If neither are true, then there is real problem with how the Tomb received this information, and the need or ability for the [[Arrow of Apollo]] to be available (and noted in the Sacred Scrolls) as capable of showing the way to a place the Tribes had not yet visited (unless you count in the "all this has happened and will happen again" part of the Scrolls).

I edited the article with the point in mind as it seemed too strong to suggest otherwise. Thoughts on this or points against the notion? (This also keeps us from blowing brain cells on who created what.) [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:34, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

: See the "Three Exodus" portion of [[Sacred Scrolls]] for something that explains this. It was written by me, so perhaps I'm biased towards it being true, but if it is, then the pictures inside the Tomb of Athena ''do'' fall under the "All this has happened before..." clause. As does the dissemination of the Gods. However, I agree that it's probable that the 13th Tribe brought the Lords of Kobol with them to Earth. It's just that, after that, they also brought them ''back'' to Kobol so that they would be there to be brough to Earth again in the next cycle. I hope that's coherent. It's hard talking in circles like this. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:07, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

::I don't think its necessary or interesting to note that in this much detail - the History article covers the origin of the twelve colonies in substantially more detail. To that end, I'd prefer to revert your comments, if you're not terribly attatched. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:10, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:::Actually it's not that bad. I'm going to clarify it slightly, but it would probably be useful to keep it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

::::Actually I would say that Humans where born on earth and went to Kobold as said above, not that Kobold brought the gods to earth, '''life here began out there those are the first words of the ancient scrolls and they where told to us by the lords of Kobold countless centuries ago''' The big one there is ''life here'' lets look at that, they are bluntly stating in a way that life on kobold is not native it began out in space, the ties to earth mythology, technology, referances etc can only be explained so many ways.

::::Take adama's ship (the model) it's a classic schoonar, now you can call 'paralell development' but only to an extent we know that the colonies had space technology when they where founded which leads us to believe that the schoonar is older then that the design anyway, we also know apparently from flash backs etc that Kobold was fairly advanced heck we know they had holographic technology... Which in turn points to the fact that maybe they where not native to Kobold either.

::::I'd prefure to look at it something like this, at some stage we the good old 13th colony reached a point where we had FTL technology and in turn we expanded we spread out and colonised the stars, Kobold was one of those maybe at the time we had advanced enough through gene manipulation or the such that the 13 Lords of Kobold where immortals or at least enhanced humans while the 'normals' who lived in peace with the lords where from a Genetic databank (or perhaps we moved there in an ark to escape some cataclism on earth) over time the origins of were they came from began to fade until the exodus from kobold. Which began the whole cycle again.. (in turn this would show the All this has happened before and all this will happen again part).

::::Even still there are disrepancy's within the shows own words.. the 13th Colony left kobold in the early days and settled on a planet around a distant and unknown star.... that has been proven to be a false statement, it was not unknown, the Koboldians KNEW about it, apparently even the scriptures themselves know that from Earth you can look up at the stars and see the 12 other colonies, the Zodiac.. When you take these facts into account the belief that Kobold is the original planet is impossible, because the Only way you can get the exact star alignments for those Zodiac's is within a set distance (5 or so Light years presuming None of the stars within 5 light years make up the Zodic pieces) of Earth.. No Life began on earth and went to kobold it's the only way one can explain so much of what is Canon of the show now. [[User:RobGraham|RobGraham]]21:03 Thursday 29th June Australian EST.

::::: A note: It's "Kobol". The one is a planet, the other is a small dogish creature from D&D (if I remember right). Anyway, I think you're getting tied up in a linear idea of time. You have to keep in mind there that ''is'' no true point of genesis. You can pick any point in the cycle and get back to it. So, take "humans on Earth" as your starting point:

::::: Something makes them leave Earth and move to Kobol. They forget Earth. The Big Bad Thing happens and they flee to the 13 colonies (the Twelves Colonies and Earth). They forget Kobol and Earth. Another Big Bad Thing (Cylons) happens and they flee the Twelve to go find the Thirteenth. Presumably, they settle. They forget Kobol and the Twelve Colonies. Something makes them leave Earth and move to Kobol. They forget Earth. Repeat, repeat.

::::: That's my "Three Exodi" interpretation, anyway. And, in it, from the point of view of the Kobolites, life ''did'' begin "out there" on Earth. That's where they all came from, ''most recently''. I hope that helps explain how everything has already come before. Sure the origin of the zodiacs necessarily comes from Earth. That's incorperated into the theory. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:55, 29 June 2006 (CDT)

== Zephyr ==

About where in the episode is this mentioned? Is it explicitly stated that the ''Zephyr'' is named after a God, or is it just mentioned? It is my understanding that a zephyr is a gust of wind and, thus, not an imp[robable name for a ship with that meaning. Unless it's explicit, I think this point is ambiguous at best. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:11, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:No, he's right. See [[Wikipedia:Zephyrus|Zephyrus]]. Very nice catch, Spence. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:14, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:: Woah! Zephyrus lived in a cave on ''Thrace''? That can't be accidental. It hadn't occured to me until I saw it, but I knew this. I played a pice a few years ago called the ''March of the Young Thracians'' or something. Anyway, I'm not sure about Zephyr, still. He wasn't one of the "main" Greek Gods, as it were, so I don't think we can make an assumption that he's a Lord of Kobol. They may have lesser gods like the Greeks did that just have never been mentioned, or it might be that some effects dude at Zoic named the ship that because it makes a good name for a ship, not realizing that it's also an allusion to a Greek god. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:22, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

:::A link to Kara Thrace's article already noted this, which is where I felt the Zephyr note was credible. Kara's name (as in a human aided by the "winds") and the link to Zephyrus couldn't be a coincidence--RDM had that one down. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:55, 4 October 2005 (EDT)

:::Right, but he ''is'' a god, the Colonials apparently know about him, and we don't have any knowlege on whether the colonials separate the Lords of Kobol from minor deities - so it's probably important to note, and there isn't really a better place for it. (FWIW, they did apparently distinguish between upper and lower demons). --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:29, 3 October 2005 (EDT)

== Liturgy ==
Does anyone know what language Elosha's funeral prayer is in at the end of the Mini-series? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:30, 3 October 2005 (EDT)
:You may already know this answer by now (though others may not), but she is singing in sanskrit from text used in the Hindu faith. A good [http://navras.boourns.net/extra.php fan site] about the end title song to "The Matrix Revolutions", called "Navras", shows the Brhadaranyaka Upanisad 1.3.28 exactly as Elosha sung it and as used in that Matrix end title by composer Don Davis and the artist known as Juno Reactor.

::''asato ma sad gamaya'' 
::''tamaso ma jyotir gamaya'' 
::''mrtyor mamrtam gamaya'' 

:In English:

::''From delusion lead me to truth'' 
::''From darkness lead me to light'' 
::''From death lead me to immortality'' 

:I've watched the Mini-Series countless times now, and used the "Navras" music as some of my workout music. I knew about the sanskit origin, but Eiosha's song was familiar to me and I didn't know why until someone here pointed out that it was a source I already knew. Damn fine soundtracks for both the Mini-Series and "The Matrix" movies, by the way. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:50, 13 December 2005 (EST)

::I actually prefer In My Head, Tetsujin, and You All, Everybody. --[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 00:53, 14 December 2005 (EST)

:::I don't recognize the last one, but yes, the first two are also great tracks. I always visualize Trinity kicking butt and taking names when those two tracks are on. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:01, 14 December 2005 (EST)

::::Oh come on, surely you must know it: "You all, You all everybody/Acting like such stupid people/wearing expensive clothes/You all, you all, You all, everybody..."--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 12:38, 14 December 2005 (EST)

::Yes, I incorporated that into the Language in the Twelve Colonies article. That seems to me to be the more appropriate place. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 04:12, 14 December 2005 (EST)

==Priesthood==

Spencerian added:

:Like denominations on Earth, it is possible that there are varying kinds of priests and customs that share elements of worship of the Lords of Kobol, with some subtle or significant differences. It is probable that, based on their devotion, a Genemon priest (in comparison to one, say, on Caprica) may have a more defined worship or celebration process, or may speak or pay more respects to one or a handful of Lords in preference over others, as Kara Thrace devoted prayer to her specific Lords. The contrast would be akin to the Catholic, Episopal, and Lutheran churches of real-world Earth.

As my fellow contributors know, I frown on plausible but baseless speculation. I don't think this is useful here. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:48, 1 November 2005 (EST)

:Removing. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 03:08, 3 November 2005 (EST)

==Zoic==

Where and in what capacity did Zoic "release" those names? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:28, 8 December 2005 (EST)

:You know this "reference" as well as I, and I would as well like to see the press release or web site reference where Zoic gave us this information. I know this is circular and that the Great Delete Key of the Citation Jihad may be quivering over that item, but I did note its non-canonical nature, but at the same time, considering its an official production company of the show, its also hard to prove them wrong--this information might be in the mysterious [[series bible]] for all we know. Maybe Joe would know old Ernestborg9's resource. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 8 December 2005 (EST)

::Non-canonical is one thing, but uncited and non-canonical is past my limit. I mean, we could just start making random shit up and say that Zoic said it, and really, nobody would be there to catch us. We have to police ourselves on this. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 15:35, 8 December 2005 (EST)

:::If this is the case, we need to delete ALL the battlestar pages or rework them to remove those old Zoic references. I'm OK on this, but we have a lot of work to do. The Zoic thing here has been like the "weird uncle" in the family that you don't talk about or leave the daughters with, but let come to family gatherings anyway. Probably time to purge all references to Zoic's battlestars, maybe moving them to the Zoic page, and deleting the rest. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:15, 8 December 2005 (EST)

::::Well, the ''best'' thing to do would be to find the source of the quote, but I haven't had any luck. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 16:22, 8 December 2005 (EST)

==Atlantia==
How should we handle this reference? The Atlantia and Pacifica were presumably named after the Atlantic and Pacific oceans (in real life). The Atlantic ocean is named for Atlas, not Atlantia, but that's not necessarily implied by anything on-screen (and if it were really named after the ocean, it would probably be Atlantica.) --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 15:00, 8 December 2005 (EST)

:I'd stick to what we know, until we find something better. Atlas was a founder of Atlantis, so we can add this contradicting resource since Pegasus also has differing sources of origin. Greek myth is always full of contradictions anyway. Given that there's no Atlantic Ocean in the Colonies as far as we know, and the Lords tend to be Olympian, not Titan, gods, I'd go for the dryad origin. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 8 December 2005 (EST)

==The Jealous God==
Ricimer said: ''Although it is tantalizing to claim that the Cylon God is the rebelious Lord of Kobol, I don't think #6 has ever claimed that they're the same one.''

:When Six says to Baltar, "Blasphemous, stupid lies. There have never been any other gods, only the One," it seems to me that she's referring to the one Elosha was just speaking about. You may be right that the inference is too tenuous for the article, though. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:56, 12 December 2005 (EST)

::I love this idea as well, very tantalyzing indeed, but perhaps it belongs in an analysis section to be added to the deleted scenes article. --[[User:MASON|Mason]] 23:21, 12 December 2005 (EST)

::: You see although I'd ''like'' to equate the two, I don't think we can ''yet''; it's more for an "Analysis" section. It seems to me that Number Six in that scene was talking about ALL of the Gods that Elosha was talking about, the Jealous God AND the other 11 ''collectively''. It's not clear enough of a statement. I'm kind of secretly hoping that the cylons were taught the advanced technology needed to make humanoid Cylons from the Count Iblis equivalent of this series, which turns out to be the jealous Lord of Kobol; however, as Ron D. Moore has pointed out, that would kind of "gut" the religion of the Cylons: the Cylons are sentient beings in their own right, and all sentient beings have a claim to a soul and a concept of god once they're intelligent enough to grasp such concepts, and turning around and saying "well the whole idea of Cylons having a religion and thinking they have their own souls? Turns out they got duped by a god-like alien, which, although very powerful, ain't really a god, just more like Q from Star Trek or something", saying that would somehow seem to unfairly lessen the Cylons in my opinion. Maybe they can work the two concepts together tactfully (Cylons developed a concept of God BEFORE meeting Count Iblis, and Iblis is claiming to be the "real Cylon god"? , etc.). I don't know. But we don't have a lot to go on. --[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 01:43, 13 December 2005 (EST)

:::: I agree with almost everything you've written, and although I like to speculate that ideas, like Iblis, will be tied back into RDM's Cylon religion, I appreciate that this speculation can only exist in a limited form on the wiki. I don't entirely agree with you on the idea that the Cylons religious credibility would be compromised by a manifested God, for this cyclical pattern working itself out in the show reminds me very much of Isaac Asimov's [http://mit.edu/tylerc/www/twt/LQ1.htm The Last Question], which was satisfying in its vast simplicity.

I like to add a little bit, not to sound pompous but there can be some connection from the Cylon god and the Jealous god. The Jealous God started the war because he wanted to be placed above the other ones, starting the so called "War of the Gods." So he is thrown out and loses, so he wanders around and finds the Cylons. Maybe he inspires them to rebel and they do. He sets himself up as their god, and it is concurrent with what the Cylons think of the Colonial Gods; i.e. the other gods are fake, their one god is the true god. The Jealous God wishes to be placed above the others, and ends up finding a lost race, the Cylons and takes them as his own.

I mean, he may have set himself up as this seemingly beneficial, but ultimately devious figure. It may possibly be a correlation to Count Iblis. --[[User:Volostheguardian|Volostheguardian]] 14:09, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

RDM said there wouldn't be a Count Iblis on the Re-Imagined Series, and that the Cylons aren't "well we're Machines that got fooled into thinking we had souls by a higher being"; the Cylons have as much claim to their religion being "real" as the humans do. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:06, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== Religious Issue ==

the Lords of Kobol are a part of a fictional story. the Greek Olympians are worshipped both by people in ancient times and by living people. the religion is not "shared", rather the Lords are based upon the real-world religion. i realize that this may seem a minor issue to some of you, but it is a significant semantic assumption to make that the Lords are the same as the Olympians. [[User:Whateley23|Whateley23]] 01:46, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:Indeed, it does seem like a minor issue. There is nothing wrong with the current phrasing in my opinion, and I will not change it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 02:09, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:: I think that the assumption is not that both are fictional, but that the story will tell us they are of the same origin (also implying that the story is not fictional, though it clearly is). ''Within the fictional universe of Ronald D. Moorse's'' Battlestar Galactica, The Lords of Kobol and the Greek Olympians are/were the same thing. We also state that Vipers can do such and such and that ''Galactica'' has certain armaments, but we don't make any caveats about the fact that the nukes in the show are actually ''fictional'' nukes for fear of offending nuclear scientists currently working on related technologies. Everything except the articles on actors and other clearly-real things, should be taken as if it were prefaced by the italics above: We know the show's not real, so don't let our comments about it reflect on reality. --[[User:Day|Day]] 15:08, 16 January 2006 (EST)

== Religious Parallels ==
Should we maybe move the parallels between Colonial religion and real world faiths to an independent article? We don't really have a systematic way to present Colonial religion and the parallels exacerbate this problems by further broadening the articles only makes this article harder to understand.--[[User:Spidersense215|Spidersense215]] 14:06, 21 September 2006 (CDT)
:Which ones? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:17, 21 September 2006 (CDT)

== Lords of Kobol ==
Does the existance of the Mercury class Battlestars imply that Hermes/Mercury is a Lord of Kobol? --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 15:15, 18 October 2006 (CDT)+
:The writers of the show are dancing about in the usage of Greek and Roman mythological names. Since Hermes hasn't been mentioned specifically as a Lord, no, we can't add it. I'm not big on mixing the pantheons until the context of the names in the show are clear. We have a list of names (Greek, mostly) of names heard of ships or used as people, but until used in in the context as a Lord, we shouldn't assume that the name is actually that of a Lord. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:20, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::That makes sense. It occured to me after I wrote the above that the name could refer to quicksilver, which would make sense if the Mercury class was faster than earlier ones. That would also tidy up the roman nomenclature.
::Where is the list of names you mentioned? --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 15:30, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::See the section, "Other mythological names in Colonial culture," this article. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:28, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::LMAO. I was searching all over this site. It didn't occur to me that it'd be in the same article I was commenting on. --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 20:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)

The article mentions that seven lords have been identified. Anyone notice this is the same as the number of identified cylons? It could be that each cylon model represents a lord (i.e. Sharon - Athena, Six (or maybe three) - Hera). The 5 unidentified cylons match 5 unidentified lords match the 5 in the temple of five. On a related note: how about the (norse) idea of an allfather - the Cylons recognize the allfather, but none of the lower "gods" (including the Lords of Kobol). I suppose this would be an alternate theory to the Jealous God being the god of cylons.

== More Cowbell ==
Actually, more images, please. Great text content, but a couple of more images applied evenly would really brighten things up. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:04, 8 December 2006 (CST)
:Ooh. And there are some XHTML problems. I'll get on those. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:25, 8 December 2006 (CST)