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Final Five

2008-06-18T01:56:17Z

Tirkon: /* Four Revealed, and their nature */

[[Image:TheFinalFive.JPG|right|thumb|300px|The Final Five in the Kobol Opera House]]
The term "'''Final Five'''" collectively describes five of the twelve [[Humanoid Cylon|humanoid Cylon models]] whose identity, knowledge, or existence has been deliberately or accidentally lost to seven of the humanoid Cylon models.

[[Caprica-Six]], when asked by [[Gaius Baltar]] about the five missing models he has not seen on the [[Basestar (RDM)|baseship]] he lives on or on [[New Caprica]], curtly replies that the others do not talk about the subject ([[Torn]]). Later she states that she is ''programmed'' not to think of them ([[He That Believeth In Me]]). A [[Hybrid]] refers to "the five who come from the home of the 13th", which makes Kara Thrace and her associates conclude the Final Five have been to [[Earth (RDM)|Earth]] ([[Faith]]).

==The Unauthorized Quest for the Five==
A [[Number Three]] copy, whom Gaius Baltar calls by her human alias, [[D'Anna Biers]], repeatedly commits suicide to get glimpses of five white-cloaked beings that she believes are images of the Final Five. She attempts to draw what she has seen, but has difficulty in doing so ([[Hero]]).

One detailed sketch which she briefly shows to Baltar depicts her personal artistic rendering of the faces of the Five ([[The Passage]]). The sketch is meant to depict [[Saul Tigh]], [[Galen Tyrol]], [[Samuel Anders]], [[Tory Foster]] and the twelfth and final Cylon. ([[Crossroads, Part II]]).

[[Image:FFSketches.jpg|thumb|left|Sketches of the Five.]]
Baltar's ability to see a virtual doppelganger of Caprica-Six (as well as enjoying her company in various pleasant environments) lead him to suggest that he might be using a Cylon technique known as [[projection]]. This suspicion, in turn, makes Baltar begin a personal inquiry into his own nature after allying himself with D'Anna-Three.

The two eventually make their way to the [[algae planet]], where a Colonial structure, the fabled [[Temple of Five]], awaits with possible answers ("[[The Passage]]", "[[The Eye of Jupiter]]"). When the system's dying star goes nova, a ray of light is generated by the mechanisms of the temple. Number Three steps into the light and suddenly finds herself back in the [[Opera House]] and before the same image of the Five, not persistent. Upon seeing their faces she recognizes one of them in particular, saying in surprise "You... forgive me... I had no idea." She is then pulled back to reality and collapses in Baltar's arms, apparently suffering the effects of a brain hemorrhage. She tells Baltar, "You were right," but dies before answering about what, or telling him what she saw. She tells the [[Cavil]] who greets her in the tank that there are five other Cylons, and he will see them some day ([[Rapture]]).

Later, she shows that she is aware of the identities of the four revealed Cylons, but does not immediately identify the fifth, claiming the final Cylon is not among the population of the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Colonial Fleet]] ([[Revelations]]).

==Awareness of the Five by other seven Cylons==

Caprica-Six indicates that the Cylons do not speak of the Five, but she knows how many there are. She later tells Roslin that she is actually "programmed not to think of them." [[D'Anna Biers]] also indicates to Baltar that they do not discuss the Five. A [[Cavil]] realizes in the [[Temple of Five]] that Biers is attempting to see the Final Five, and not simply seeking [[Earth (RDM)|Earth]]. He tells her "That can't happen" and points a gun at her to stop her, but is shot by Baltar. Later, a Cavil explains that because of her obsession her entire line will be [[boxing|boxed]] ([[Rapture]]).

A [[Leoben Conoy]] claims that "Adama is a Cylon" though neither Adama is one of the other six Cylons he should know. If an Adama were a member of the final five, Leoben should not, in theory, know this. However, it is commonly believed that he is lying ([[Flesh and Bone]]).

The [[Sharon Valerii|Boomer]] copy of Number Eight, interrogated by Baltar, declares there are eight Cylons in the Fleet. Given that these Seven do not interact (or are unwilling to interact) with the Five at the time, the number that Boomer gives is likely other copies of the Seven in disguise. (This tendency to disguise is confirmed through [[Shelly Godfrey]], [[Gina Inviere]] and an unnamed Number Six with black hair found on a stricken baseship in "[[Torn]]"). Also supporting this is the scene where number Three and Sharon Valerii discover Samuel Anders and refer to him as human in the episode "[[Downloaded]]". A later episode, "[[Rapture]]", shows a Three recognizing one of the faces of the Five, confirming the lack of information to the Seven on the Five's identities.

Both [[Caprica Six]] and Sharon Agathon share a dream vision in which the glowing, white-robed figures of the Five are shown in the [[Opera House]] ([[Crossroads, Part II]]). After their activation, Caprica-Six, aboard ''Galactica'', has a sense that the Final Five are near ([[He That Believeth In Me]]), but fails to recognize Tigh even when directly confronted by him ([[Escape Velocity]]).

There are cases of the Seven and the Five committing violence to each other, including:
* D'Anna Biers attacks Anders on Caprica ([[Downloaded]]).
* Tyrol executes two copies of [[Number One|Cavil]] ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]).
* Tigh's right eye is taken out by a Number Five ("[[Occupation]]", [[List of Deleted Scenes - Season 3 (RDM)#Occupation|deleted scene]]).
* Tigh, Anders, and Tyrol lead a violent resistance movement against the Seven on New Caprica, killing many (''[[Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance]]'', "Occupation" through "[[Exodus, Part II]]").
* Anders attacks a Two ([[The Road Less Traveled]]).
* Anders threatens to kill a copy of [[Number Six]] after she kills [[Jean Barolay]] ([[Faith]]).

While [[Cylon Centurion|Centurions]] are programmed to recognize and obey [[humanoid Cylon]]s, on a number of occasions they shoot at members of the Five, prior to their activation, including Tyrol on Kobol, Anders both on Caprica and outside the Temple of Five, and most members during the escape from [[New Caprica]].

This seems to change after their "activation", as during the [[Battle of the Ionian Nebula]], a Cylon Raider makes eye contact with [[Samuel Anders|Anders]] in a Viper, causing a brief red flash from Anders' eye. Immediately, the Raider breaks off its attack, and the entire Cylon fleet retreats ([[He That Believeth In Me]]), after responding this IFF procedure. However, this display of free will and the prospect of making contact with the Five, creates a [[Cylon civil war|schism]] between the other six Cylons, who violently disagree over the appropriate course of action ([[Six of One]]).

When [[D'Anna Biers]] is unboxed by the [[Number One|Ones]] and rescued by the human-Cylon alliance, she initially keeps her knowledge about the Five's identities a secret in an attempt to secure her safety should the alliance collapse ([[The Hub]]). When she resumes her position as the ''de facto'' leader of the Cylon rebels she reveals to President Roslin and Admiral Adama that there are only ''four'' Cylons in their fleet, and does not elaborate on the status of the fifth. She then holds the humans aboard her basestar, including Roslin and [[Gaius Baltar]], hostage in an attempt to force the four out of hiding. Tory Foster willingly goes to the basestar, and Biers introduces her to her new Cylon "brothers" and "sisters". In the ensuing stand off, President [[Lee Adama]] attempts to force her to release her hostages by threatening to execute Tigh, Tyrol, and Anders and in doing so publicly announces their identities to the other Cylons on the basestar ([[Revelations]]).

==Four Revealed, and their nature==

[[Image:Four Revealed.jpg|thumb|Four of the Final Five from left to right: [[Galen Tyrol]], [[Tory Foster]], [[Samuel Anders]] and [[Saul Tigh]].]]

As the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]] draws closer to the [[Ionian nebula]], four people begin hearing an [[The Music|unusual melody]]: these four are Colonel [[Saul Tigh]], Chief [[Galen Tyrol]], Ensign [[Samuel Anders]] and presidential aide [[Tory Foster]] ([[Crossroads, Part I]]). Tyrol and Anders say that the song seems like something from their childhoods, while Tigh becomes progressively more disturbed as he begins to hear the music everywhere on ''Galactica''. Foster becomes noticeably distracted, irritable, and unkempt, claiming to have not been sleeping well. When the fleet finally arrives at the Ionian Nebula the song becomes clear to the four who can hear it and they begin to stalk the halls of ''Galactica'' muttering its mysterious lyrics. Eventually, the four arrive at ''Galactica''’s gym and upon seeing each other the truth becomes clear to them; they are Cylons, four of the Final Five. When they learn the truth, they decide to remain loyal to the Colonial Fleet, because they were humans for as long as they can remember, and cling to what they know to make sense of their lives. Moreover, Tigh sees himself as a soldier first and wants to hold up his oath.

After activation, the four revealed Cylons are unaware of any thoughts like Boomer's [[Sharon Valerii#Acts of sabotage|Cylon directives]] other than that they are Cylons. In a sense they know less than the audience and the Significant Seven, who at least know that the Final Five are fundamentally different models.<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=ffdifferent|timestamp=19:05|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref> Tigh and Anders painfully and confusedly recite events from their lives which make little sense in the context of their newly revealed nature. With particular pain, Tigh asks "My gods, what about Ellen?" His personal execution of his wife for being a Cylon collaborator, and his pain over it, have been a major theme in the episode.

The nature of these Cylons is clearly different from the other seven. In particular, Colonel Tigh's friendship with William Adama stretches back to shortly after the end of the first Cylon War and in an interview<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm|title=Post-Gazette Moore interview}}</ref> Ron Moore stated that Tigh "fought in two wars." ([[Crossroads, Part II]])

These Cylons also seem to be susceptible to human infirmities: Tigh's ongoing battles with alcoholism, Tyrol suffering from decompression sickness - although to a lesser extent than his wife ([[A Day in the Life]]), and Anders contracting pneumonia ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]), though he is able to make a full recovery without treatment ([[Occupation]]). However, since the Final Five possess at least some of the Cylons' superhuman strength, they likely possess other physical Cylon traits as well ([[The Ties That Bind]]).

As the Seven do not hold (or appear to desire) knowledge of the Five, and with their special nature, their ability to [[Resurrection (RDM)|resurrect]] and the existence of multiple copies for any of the Five are uncertain based on aired events and official responses.<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://www.syfyportal.com/news423878.html|title=Things Get Ugly In 'Battlestar' Season 4|date=Jul-10-2007|accessdate=Jul-13-2007|}}</ref> [[Caprica-Six]] describes being "programmed" not to think of the Five ([[He That Believeth In Me]]) and it is unknown whether the Five and Seven ever co-existed in the same location.

Obviously the Final Five are able to procreate a child with one of the [[Significant Seven]], because [[Caprica Six]] is pregnant from [[Saul Tigh]] ([[Sine Qua Non]]), whereas the Significant Seven are not able to do this alone.

===Connections between the Colonial gods and Cylon god===
*The Temple of Five was built over 4,000 years prior to the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies]], long before the Cylons existed. The [[Thirteenth Tribe (RDM)|Thirteenth Tribe]] would, logically, have no knowledge of these automatons in the strictest sense. However, the Thirteenth Tribe has significant prophetic insight, as shown in the works of [[Pythia]]. According to Colonial scriptures, "Five pillars of the temple were fashioned after the five priests devoted to the one whose name cannot be spoken". This may have been another Lord of Kobol, given that on a deleted scene [[Elosha]] noted that the fall of [[Kobol (RDM)|Kobol]] and its civilization was due in part to a "jealous god".
*On [[New Caprica]], Number Three meets [[Dodona Selloi]], a human [[oracle]], who relays a message from Three's God, despite the oracle's association with the Lords of Kobol.
*With this information, there is a strong, but unexplained correlation or connection with the the Cylon God and the [[Religion in the Twelve Colonies (RDM)#The Lords of Kobol|Lords of Kobol]].

===Kara Thrace, The Eye of Jupiter, and the First Hybrid===
*The Eye of Jupiter storyline introduced an association between Kara Thrace, a human that [[Eye of Jupiter|"doodled" a circular image as a child]] with no prior derivation (her old apartment on [[Caprica (RDM)|Caprica]] has a painting of the image from the episode, "[[Valley of Darkness]]"), and the mandalas or icons of the eye that decorated a temple built 4,000 years before her birth. No further information is revealed other than the prophecy from [[Leoben Conoy]], who told Thrace of an [[The Destiny|unexplained "destiny"]] ([[Flesh and Bone]]).
*The [[first Hybrid]] gives a monologue about his knowledge of the Final Five in the extended version of "[[Razor]]". It states:

:"Soon there will be four, glorious in awakening, struggling with the knowledge of their true selves. The pain of revelation bringing new clarity and in the midst of confusion, he will find her. Enemies brought together by impossible longing. Enemies now joined as one. The way forward at once unthinkable, yet inevitable. And the fifth, still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering."

:Its description predicts the internal revelation that four of the Five would experience in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]". The fifth and final Cylon remains hidden, longing to be forgiven for some type of trespass, but will experience suffering in the process.

*The first Hybrid also mentions Kara Thrace to [[Kendra Shaw]], claiming, "She is the herald of the apocalypse, the harbinger of death..." as the end of the human race. He warns Shaw that the humans should not follow her ([[Razor]]). However, the Hybrid never confirms Thrace's nature. More than a year later, another [[Hybrid]] claims that Thrace will lead humanity to its end ([[Faith]]).

===Illusion or Truth===
*The Threes' hunt for and see visions of the Five, which leads to the other Cylons themselves [[boxing]] the entire line of Threes after her discovery, but whether this is done to suppress the notion or actual information of the final five or to relieve the other Cylons of an aberrant model is unclear.
**As of "[[The Hub]]" the single re-activated D'Anna is the only one who knows the identity of all five models, information she is keeping for use as a bargaining chip.
*Later, in dream visions of the [[Opera House]] shared by [[Laura Roslin]], [[Sharon Agathon]] and [[Caprica-Six]], the same 5 glowing figures seen by Three appear, along with the same chamber with six drapes, this time empty. Six sees them for a more prolonged period in a second vision.
*As the [[Temple of Five]] was apparently built for human usage, the Temple may have only allowed the transitional visions that the Threes see to be more persistent and clear. It may never be revealed what Baltar (or another human) would have seen. While Baltar believed Three and actively participated in her quest, both his virtual Six and a [[Hybrid]] noted that he, not Three, was intended to use the Temple's imaging mechanism as the "chosen one". The human association and significance of the [[five priests]], [[The One Whose Name Cannot Be Spoken|the god they worshiped]], and their connections with the Cylons, Kara Thrace and Baltar are not yet explained.

==Notes==
* The podcast for "[[Rapture]]" confirms that the final five Cylons have not been [[boxing|boxed]] <ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Rapture|act=4|id=firstboxing|timestamp=41:47|totalrunning=}}</ref>.
* During a Q&A session on the official Sci Fi channel ''Battlestar Galactica'' forum Ronald D. Moore notes that he already knows who the last Cylon is, and that he's already left clues as to who it is<ref>[http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2270103&st=0&p=3041263&#entry3041263 20 Answers - SCI FI FORUMS] Retrieved 03-27-2007</ref>.
* Despite the revelation of all of the Significant Seven's model numbers in "[[Six of One]]", [[Ron D. Moore]] confirmed that the Final Five '''do not''' have model numbers like the [[Significant Seven]].<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://www.thefutoncritic.com/rant.aspx?id=20080611|title=Rants & Reviews - Live at the "Battlestar Galactica" Midseason Finale Premiere|date=11 June 2008|accessdate=13 June 2008|last=Sullivan|first=Brian Ford|format=|language=}}</ref>

{{WikiFrakr|Fantastic Four}}

==References==
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[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Colonial Religion]]
[[Category:Colonial Religion (RDM)]]
[[Category:Cylon Religion (RDM)]]
[[Category:Cylons]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)]]
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[[de:Final Five]]
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Humanoid Cylon speculation

2008-06-18T01:26:38Z

Tirkon: /* General factors for consideration */

{{plausible speculation}}
The [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon]] evolution into twelve distinct [[Humanoid Cylon|humanoid models]] introduced a serious problem for the remnants of humanity in the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]]. Early into the search for [[Earth]], it seemed that anyone could be a Cylon, raising doubt and suspicion within the human populace ("[[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]").

Fans of the show are rife with speculation about who could be a Cylon infiltrator in the Fleet. Viewers were introduced to the "[[Significant Seven]]" over the course of the miniseries and the first two season, but the nature of each of these characters was revealed shortly after that character's introduction.

In season three the speculation by both characters and fans turned to the [[Final Five]], enigmatic, almost-mystical figures who seem to have a [[The Temple of Five|link]] to ancient Colonial history. The nature of the five, according to [[Ron D. Moore|Moore]], is "fundamentally different" from the other seven models<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=ffdifferent|timestamp=19:05|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>.

At the conclusion of "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" four recurring characters are revealed to be Cylons. The revelation that long standing characters such as Colonel [[Saul Tigh|Tigh]] and Chief [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] are Cylons blows the field wide open; if they could be "[[toaster]]s," then ''anyone'' could be the last Cylon. In particular, Tigh has a long and well-documented character history dating back to the first [[Cylon War]].

This article details [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad#Derived content|plausible speculation]] on which of the central and supporting characters in ''[[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Battlestar Galactica]]'' could be the final one.

==Clues from Official Sources==
During a Q&A session on the official Sci Fi channel Battlestar Galactica forum Ronald D. Moore notes that he already knows who the last Cylon is, and that he's already left clues as to who it is<ref>[http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2270103&st=0&p=3041263&#entry3041263 20 Answers - SCI FI FORUMS] Retrieved 03-27-2007</ref>.

[[Bradley Thompson]] was asked when the writers knew the identity of the final five:
:"Four of the five were recent. If memory serves, the fifth (which may change) we've been kicking around since about the end of Season One."<ref>[[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive8#Identity of the Final Five|BW:OC#Identity of the Final Five]]</ref>

==General factors for consideration==
In terms of narrative, to prevent an anti-climax it seems likely that the final Cylon would probably need to be a more prominent character than those of the Four. This centers the spotlight in the central "human" characters ([[Roslin]], [[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]], [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] and [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]]). However, there is still an entire season for characters to develop and gain significance with viewers.

With the Final Five being "fundamentally different" from the Seven, extrapolating any characteristics we learned of Cylons from the Seven (including physiology, loyalty or self-awareness) is of questionable validity.

Colonel Tigh has a well documented history stretching back at least to the first Cylon War. Also considering the [[Temple of Five]] it seems Final Five Cylons somehow significantly pre-date the Seven.

It has been seen that Cylons can start families, however it is unclear how the Five came to exist. Having known natural parents would ''seem'' to preclude one being any more than half-Cylon.

Of the 11 so far there have been only four female models. The final Cylon being female would serve to equalize this gender bias.

The [[first Hybrid]] gives a monologue about his knowledge of the Final Five in the extended version of "[[Razor]]". It states that "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering."

With the exception of [[Karl Agathon]] and [[Cally Tyrol]], who are confirmed to have half-Cylon, half-human children<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=hybridnick|timestamp=22:41|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>, any "human" character could be a Cylon.

In [[Revelations]], [[D'Anna Biers]], the [[Number Three]] who saw the [[Final Five]], mentions that there are only four of them in the fleet. If this is true, quite a few speculations in this article are wrong and every person mentioned here is unsuspicious. Assumed that the person is already known, possibly missed persons or such pronounced so dead could be the Final One, known by the Cylons as Tirkon, i.e. [[Louanne Katraine]], [[Ellen Tigh]], [[Helena Cain]], Admiral Adamas wife or President Adar. Ellen Tigh could be plausible, because her husband [[Saul Tigh]] saw her in the captured [[Caprica-Six]] ([[Escape Velocity]]). Possibly Ellens consciousness was downloaded or at least connected to her.

==Main Characters==

===[[Laura Roslin]]===
[[Image:Laura_Roslin_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
The colonies' president has been unquestionably a boon to humanity's search for earth, indeed the two times she has been removed from office have been the two greatest setbacks in the journey.

Roslin has also experienced prophetic dreams and visions (those induced by [[chamalla]], and a dream she shared with the Cylons [[Caprica Six]] and [[Sharon Agathon]]). She fits very well the profile of the [[Sacred Scrolls|scroll's]] dying leader, the scrolls also having links to other more mystical elements of the series, including the [[Temple of Five]]. Additionally, Roslin was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

However her dying nature, from an aggressive form of breast cancer is also the biggest cause to doubt Roslin being a Cylon. It is unknown whether the Final Five can succumb to cancer, but Cylons seem to be generally tougher than humans. Baltar's cure in "[[Epiphanies]]" was probably designed based on the assumption that Roslin's physiology is human.

===[[William Adama]]===
[[Image:William_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
If William Adama were revealed to be a Cylon, it would be one of the biggest shocks the series could produce. Overall Adama appears to epitomize a very human set of strengths and weaknesses. Nevertheless, he does experience hallucinations in the fifth [[Razor Flashback]], although he sees and hears people in his environment instead of seeing himself in a different one. The experience could also be explained by stress or other factors, however. Adama was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

The Adama family is well documented. His father, [[Joseph Adama]], was known to [[Romo Lampkin]]. The proposed spin-off ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'', will feature the history of the Adama family, including a young William. This may be difficult to square with any revelation about William Adama being a Cylon.

{{spoiltext|A robotic duplicate of William Adama's sibling [[Tamara Adama]] is one of the first Cylons ([[Caprica|Caprica (series)]]). It is not implausible that William Adama could be a similar construct, although the forms of the Cylon prototypes are unknown and unlikely to be humanoid}}
William Adama experiences guilt for actions he believe may have triggered the war ([[Hero]]). This could be the "hungering for redemption" that the [[First Hybrid]] talks about (see above).

===[[Lee Adama]]===
[[Image:Lee_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
Could Lee's chronic angst be partly due to guilt at his Cylon nature? Was the [[Leoben]] who said "Adama's a Cylon" ([[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]) referring to Lee? (note: the writers hadn't decided on the identity of the final Cylon at that point). He might project in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", although this is more likely an oxygen deprivation induced hallucination.

In his defense, Lee is also a member of the well-documented Adama family. A "switched at birth" scenario could explain this.

Lee is characterised by near chronic angst for various reasons. Could he be the one "hungering for redemption"?

Lee is told that he is "a son trying to flee his father's shadow" by [[Romo Lampkin]]. This conceivably could link with the description of the final Cylon as "still in shadow, drawn toward the light."

Lee was in the fleet when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in it ([[Revelations]]).

===[[Gaius Baltar]]===
[[Image:Gaius_Baltar_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
{{mainarticle|Baltar as Cylon speculation}}
Baltar's vast intelligence, weak character and lack of loyalty to anyone but himself have made him ultimately humanity's (unwitting) betrayer. Baltar himself longs to be a Cylon as this would absolve himself, however comes to the conclusion that he is human after all. Baltar certainly has a lot to be guilty about, whether he has enough of a conscience to be truly "hungering for redemption" is questionable, however his confession to Roslin seems to indicate that this is the case ([[The Hub]]).

There are good reasons to suspect Baltar. He exhibits vast intelligence that may be superhuman in nature. His [[Virtual Six]], her precognitive abilities, and the apparently projected environments they often co-experience are suspicious, as well as the fact that both Virtual Six and later the [[Hybrid]] tell him that he is "chosen". Additionally, Baltar was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

In [[Caprica Six]]'s final vision in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" she sees the hooded figures of the final five staring at her from the upper level. Baltar is standing next to her in the vision as well.

===[[Kara Thrace]]===
[[Image:Kara_Thrace.jpg|right|90px]]
{{seealso|The Destiny}}
Kara Thrace's path towards her destiny has involved many strange, perhaps supernatural events. Whether this destiny involves her being a Cylon is a matter of speculation (indeed members of the [[Significant Seven]], who do not know who the final five are, tell Starbuck she has this destiny), but it is certain Thrace is ''something'' special.

Certainly Thrace exhibits phenomenal natural skill as a pilot, and manages to learn to fly a [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Raider]] exceptionally quickly ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). From childhood, Thrace has been drawing the mandala from the [[Temple of Five]]. However she was also physically abused as a child and still carries the scars; Cylons seem to be more robust than humans and possibly may not carry such long-term injuries. The same may be said of the knee injury which put a stop to Thrace's [[Pyramid (RDM)|Pyramid]] playing ambitions.

Most strikingly, the ace pilot apparently dies in "[[Maelstrom]]" but returns ([[Resurrection (RDM)|resurrected]]?) in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]". Furthermore, not being on ''Galactica'' at the time, Thrace is the only major "human" character who has a reason for not reacting to the [[The Music|music]] which, to the "four", reverberates around the ship. However the final Cylon may, for some reason, not have heard it, or may have ignored it.

Thrace has engaged in combat with [[Raider (RDM)|Raiders]] on many occasions without any incident similar to the one which occured between Anders and the Raider during the [[Battle of the Ionian Nebula]], however it is possible that the Raider was only able to identify Anders because he had already been "activated".

[[Katee Sackhoff]] was apparently told she is not a Cylon<ref>[http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8547/redeye3copyci7.jpg See this magazine cutting.]</ref>.

{{spoilli|According to [http://roadrunnerdm.livejournal.com/84288.html this source] as of "[[Sometimes a Great Notion]]", Kara Thrace believes herself to be a Cylon, whilst Katee Sackhoff believes otherwise.}}

===None of the above?===

The January 2008 edition of [[w:Entertainment Weekly|Entertainment Weekly]] showcases a two-page photo of the cast for [[Season Four]] posed in a manner similar to Leonardo DaVinci's ''[[w:The Last Supper (Leonardo)|The Last Supper]]'' with an explanation of each character's pose/position provided by Ron Moore. Near the far left of the table a space is left vacant and a cup sits on the table marking the absent character's intended place. Moore tells EW that "We have not yet revealed the final [unknown] Cylon." and when asked if there was a possibility that the final Cylon was indeed ''not'' seated at the table Moore notes "You ferreted that out pretty slyly. I didn't really want to give that away."<ref>{{cite_news|first=|last=|url=http://community.livejournal.com/battlestar_blog/814818.html#cutid1|title=What does this picture mean? Try to crack the 'BSG' code.|publisher=Entertainment Weekly|page=40, 41|date=January 11, 2008|accessdate=English|language=}}</ref> William Adama, Laura Roslin, Lee Adama, Gaius Baltar, and Kara Thrace are all present in the picture, as are [[Final Five]] Cylons Saul Tigh, Galen Tyrol, and Samuel Anders.

However, the importance of this photo is seriously put to question given [[Aaron Douglas]]' comments on the photo. According to the actor, he was unsure that Moore had anything to do with the photo, given that Moore was not present for the shoot. Additionally, the photo shoot had at least six different setups and the actors had changed places during the photo shoot, thus contending that there is no hidden meaning for the photo.<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://community.livejournal.com/aarondouglas/55289.html|title=The Chief's Deck: BSG Last Supper Photo|date=8 January 2008|accessdate=9 January 2009|last=|first=|format=|language=}}</ref>

==Others==

===[[Tom Zarek]]===

[[Image:Zarek.jpg|right|90px]]
Based upon the mutterings of the Hybrid in "Razor", as well as Ron Moore's claim that he has already left clues to the final Cylon, one could assume Tom Zarek is the last Cylon to be found.

Tom Zarek likes to move from second-line positions, is not big on being in charge but always craving to be noticed and understood, is constantly trying to make people understand why he did the things he spent time in jail for, and has the "cleanest" past (no known relatives, etc.). His criminal background and political ambitions fit with someone "hungering for redemption."

===[[Virtual beings]]===

The virtual beings (possibly including the [[virtual Leoben]]) may actually be a single entity, the final Cylon being more spiritual than corporal. Virtual Six claims to be an angel from the Cylon God, which could be roughly correlated with the "the five priests devoted to the one whose name cannot be spoken" from [[Pythia]]. The overall actions of these beings seem to be neither pro-Cylon or pro-human, which fits with the Final five being a third party in the dynamic of the battle.

None of the other final five have shown similar characteristics to this, and there is no particular reason to suggest the final Cylon is greatly different from his or her four "siblings". When Number Three sees her vision of the final five in the [[Opera House]] (a vision repeated for other characters, thus not simply in her mind) they are five humanoid figures in white robes, at least one of which is known to her.

===More Esoteric ideas===

*The last Cylon is on [[Earth (RDM)|Earth]] or the entire population of Earth are copies of the final Cylon. In "[[Faith]]" the Hybrid does say that the Final Five have been to Earth.
*The final Cylon is dead.
*The final Cylon is a deceased character known to the audience.
*[[God (RDM)|God]], or some other divine entity.
*A single, somehow distinct, copy of a known Cylon.
*A character to be featured in ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'' such as [[Zoe Graystone]] or [[Tamara Adama]].
*The final Cylon is not yet born: it is the child of Tigh and Caprica Six. This would be in line with what the First hybrid said: "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering." It is still lingering in the womb, waiting to be born.

==References==
<references/>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Cylons]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Humanoid Cylon speculation

2008-06-18T01:16:19Z

Tirkon: /* General factors for consideration */

{{plausible speculation}}
The [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon]] evolution into twelve distinct [[Humanoid Cylon|humanoid models]] introduced a serious problem for the remnants of humanity in the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]]. Early into the search for [[Earth]], it seemed that anyone could be a Cylon, raising doubt and suspicion within the human populace ("[[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]").

Fans of the show are rife with speculation about who could be a Cylon infiltrator in the Fleet. Viewers were introduced to the "[[Significant Seven]]" over the course of the miniseries and the first two season, but the nature of each of these characters was revealed shortly after that character's introduction.

In season three the speculation by both characters and fans turned to the [[Final Five]], enigmatic, almost-mystical figures who seem to have a [[The Temple of Five|link]] to ancient Colonial history. The nature of the five, according to [[Ron D. Moore|Moore]], is "fundamentally different" from the other seven models<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=ffdifferent|timestamp=19:05|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>.

At the conclusion of "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" four recurring characters are revealed to be Cylons. The revelation that long standing characters such as Colonel [[Saul Tigh|Tigh]] and Chief [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] are Cylons blows the field wide open; if they could be "[[toaster]]s," then ''anyone'' could be the last Cylon. In particular, Tigh has a long and well-documented character history dating back to the first [[Cylon War]].

This article details [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad#Derived content|plausible speculation]] on which of the central and supporting characters in ''[[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Battlestar Galactica]]'' could be the final one.

==Clues from Official Sources==
During a Q&A session on the official Sci Fi channel Battlestar Galactica forum Ronald D. Moore notes that he already knows who the last Cylon is, and that he's already left clues as to who it is<ref>[http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2270103&st=0&p=3041263&#entry3041263 20 Answers - SCI FI FORUMS] Retrieved 03-27-2007</ref>.

[[Bradley Thompson]] was asked when the writers knew the identity of the final five:
:"Four of the five were recent. If memory serves, the fifth (which may change) we've been kicking around since about the end of Season One."<ref>[[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive8#Identity of the Final Five|BW:OC#Identity of the Final Five]]</ref>

==General factors for consideration==
In terms of narrative, to prevent an anti-climax it seems likely that the final Cylon would probably need to be a more prominent character than those of the Four. This centers the spotlight in the central "human" characters ([[Roslin]], [[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]], [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] and [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]]). However, there is still an entire season for characters to develop and gain significance with viewers.

With the Final Five being "fundamentally different" from the Seven, extrapolating any characteristics we learned of Cylons from the Seven (including physiology, loyalty or self-awareness) is of questionable validity.

Colonel Tigh has a well documented history stretching back at least to the first Cylon War. Also considering the [[Temple of Five]] it seems Final Five Cylons somehow significantly pre-date the Seven.

It has been seen that Cylons can start families, however it is unclear how the Five came to exist. Having known natural parents would ''seem'' to preclude one being any more than half-Cylon.

Of the 11 so far there have been only four female models. The final Cylon being female would serve to equalize this gender bias.

The [[first Hybrid]] gives a monologue about his knowledge of the Final Five in the extended version of "[[Razor]]". It states that "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering."

With the exception of [[Karl Agathon]] and [[Cally Tyrol]], who are confirmed to have half-Cylon, half-human children<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=hybridnick|timestamp=22:41|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>, any "human" character could be a Cylon.

In [[Revelations]], [[D'Anna Biers]], the [[Number Three]] who saw the [[Final Five]], mentions that there are only four of them in the fleet. If this is true, quite a few speculations in this article are wrong and every person mentioned here is unsuspicious. Assumed that the person is already known, possibly missed persons or such pronounced so dead could be the Final One, known by the Cylons as Tirkon, i.e. [[Louanne Katraine]], [[Ellen Tigh]], [[Helena Cain]], Admiral Adamas wife or President Adar. Ellen Tigh could be plausible, because her husband [[Saul Tigh]] saw her in the captured [[Number Six]]. Possibly Ellens consciousness was downloaded or at least connected to her.

==Main Characters==

===[[Laura Roslin]]===
[[Image:Laura_Roslin_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
The colonies' president has been unquestionably a boon to humanity's search for earth, indeed the two times she has been removed from office have been the two greatest setbacks in the journey.

Roslin has also experienced prophetic dreams and visions (those induced by [[chamalla]], and a dream she shared with the Cylons [[Caprica Six]] and [[Sharon Agathon]]). She fits very well the profile of the [[Sacred Scrolls|scroll's]] dying leader, the scrolls also having links to other more mystical elements of the series, including the [[Temple of Five]]. Additionally, Roslin was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

However her dying nature, from an aggressive form of breast cancer is also the biggest cause to doubt Roslin being a Cylon. It is unknown whether the Final Five can succumb to cancer, but Cylons seem to be generally tougher than humans. Baltar's cure in "[[Epiphanies]]" was probably designed based on the assumption that Roslin's physiology is human.

===[[William Adama]]===
[[Image:William_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
If William Adama were revealed to be a Cylon, it would be one of the biggest shocks the series could produce. Overall Adama appears to epitomize a very human set of strengths and weaknesses. Nevertheless, he does experience hallucinations in the fifth [[Razor Flashback]], although he sees and hears people in his environment instead of seeing himself in a different one. The experience could also be explained by stress or other factors, however. Adama was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

The Adama family is well documented. His father, [[Joseph Adama]], was known to [[Romo Lampkin]]. The proposed spin-off ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'', will feature the history of the Adama family, including a young William. This may be difficult to square with any revelation about William Adama being a Cylon.

{{spoiltext|A robotic duplicate of William Adama's sibling [[Tamara Adama]] is one of the first Cylons ([[Caprica|Caprica (series)]]). It is not implausible that William Adama could be a similar construct, although the forms of the Cylon prototypes are unknown and unlikely to be humanoid}}
William Adama experiences guilt for actions he believe may have triggered the war ([[Hero]]). This could be the "hungering for redemption" that the [[First Hybrid]] talks about (see above).

===[[Lee Adama]]===
[[Image:Lee_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
Could Lee's chronic angst be partly due to guilt at his Cylon nature? Was the [[Leoben]] who said "Adama's a Cylon" ([[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]) referring to Lee? (note: the writers hadn't decided on the identity of the final Cylon at that point). He might project in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", although this is more likely an oxygen deprivation induced hallucination.

In his defense, Lee is also a member of the well-documented Adama family. A "switched at birth" scenario could explain this.

Lee is characterised by near chronic angst for various reasons. Could he be the one "hungering for redemption"?

Lee is told that he is "a son trying to flee his father's shadow" by [[Romo Lampkin]]. This conceivably could link with the description of the final Cylon as "still in shadow, drawn toward the light."

Lee was in the fleet when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in it ([[Revelations]]).

===[[Gaius Baltar]]===
[[Image:Gaius_Baltar_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
{{mainarticle|Baltar as Cylon speculation}}
Baltar's vast intelligence, weak character and lack of loyalty to anyone but himself have made him ultimately humanity's (unwitting) betrayer. Baltar himself longs to be a Cylon as this would absolve himself, however comes to the conclusion that he is human after all. Baltar certainly has a lot to be guilty about, whether he has enough of a conscience to be truly "hungering for redemption" is questionable, however his confession to Roslin seems to indicate that this is the case ([[The Hub]]).

There are good reasons to suspect Baltar. He exhibits vast intelligence that may be superhuman in nature. His [[Virtual Six]], her precognitive abilities, and the apparently projected environments they often co-experience are suspicious, as well as the fact that both Virtual Six and later the [[Hybrid]] tell him that he is "chosen". Additionally, Baltar was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

In [[Caprica Six]]'s final vision in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" she sees the hooded figures of the final five staring at her from the upper level. Baltar is standing next to her in the vision as well.

===[[Kara Thrace]]===
[[Image:Kara_Thrace.jpg|right|90px]]
{{seealso|The Destiny}}
Kara Thrace's path towards her destiny has involved many strange, perhaps supernatural events. Whether this destiny involves her being a Cylon is a matter of speculation (indeed members of the [[Significant Seven]], who do not know who the final five are, tell Starbuck she has this destiny), but it is certain Thrace is ''something'' special.

Certainly Thrace exhibits phenomenal natural skill as a pilot, and manages to learn to fly a [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Raider]] exceptionally quickly ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). From childhood, Thrace has been drawing the mandala from the [[Temple of Five]]. However she was also physically abused as a child and still carries the scars; Cylons seem to be more robust than humans and possibly may not carry such long-term injuries. The same may be said of the knee injury which put a stop to Thrace's [[Pyramid (RDM)|Pyramid]] playing ambitions.

Most strikingly, the ace pilot apparently dies in "[[Maelstrom]]" but returns ([[Resurrection (RDM)|resurrected]]?) in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]". Furthermore, not being on ''Galactica'' at the time, Thrace is the only major "human" character who has a reason for not reacting to the [[The Music|music]] which, to the "four", reverberates around the ship. However the final Cylon may, for some reason, not have heard it, or may have ignored it.

Thrace has engaged in combat with [[Raider (RDM)|Raiders]] on many occasions without any incident similar to the one which occured between Anders and the Raider during the [[Battle of the Ionian Nebula]], however it is possible that the Raider was only able to identify Anders because he had already been "activated".

[[Katee Sackhoff]] was apparently told she is not a Cylon<ref>[http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8547/redeye3copyci7.jpg See this magazine cutting.]</ref>.

{{spoilli|According to [http://roadrunnerdm.livejournal.com/84288.html this source] as of "[[Sometimes a Great Notion]]", Kara Thrace believes herself to be a Cylon, whilst Katee Sackhoff believes otherwise.}}

===None of the above?===

The January 2008 edition of [[w:Entertainment Weekly|Entertainment Weekly]] showcases a two-page photo of the cast for [[Season Four]] posed in a manner similar to Leonardo DaVinci's ''[[w:The Last Supper (Leonardo)|The Last Supper]]'' with an explanation of each character's pose/position provided by Ron Moore. Near the far left of the table a space is left vacant and a cup sits on the table marking the absent character's intended place. Moore tells EW that "We have not yet revealed the final [unknown] Cylon." and when asked if there was a possibility that the final Cylon was indeed ''not'' seated at the table Moore notes "You ferreted that out pretty slyly. I didn't really want to give that away."<ref>{{cite_news|first=|last=|url=http://community.livejournal.com/battlestar_blog/814818.html#cutid1|title=What does this picture mean? Try to crack the 'BSG' code.|publisher=Entertainment Weekly|page=40, 41|date=January 11, 2008|accessdate=English|language=}}</ref> William Adama, Laura Roslin, Lee Adama, Gaius Baltar, and Kara Thrace are all present in the picture, as are [[Final Five]] Cylons Saul Tigh, Galen Tyrol, and Samuel Anders.

However, the importance of this photo is seriously put to question given [[Aaron Douglas]]' comments on the photo. According to the actor, he was unsure that Moore had anything to do with the photo, given that Moore was not present for the shoot. Additionally, the photo shoot had at least six different setups and the actors had changed places during the photo shoot, thus contending that there is no hidden meaning for the photo.<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://community.livejournal.com/aarondouglas/55289.html|title=The Chief's Deck: BSG Last Supper Photo|date=8 January 2008|accessdate=9 January 2009|last=|first=|format=|language=}}</ref>

==Others==

===[[Tom Zarek]]===

[[Image:Zarek.jpg|right|90px]]
Based upon the mutterings of the Hybrid in "Razor", as well as Ron Moore's claim that he has already left clues to the final Cylon, one could assume Tom Zarek is the last Cylon to be found.

Tom Zarek likes to move from second-line positions, is not big on being in charge but always craving to be noticed and understood, is constantly trying to make people understand why he did the things he spent time in jail for, and has the "cleanest" past (no known relatives, etc.). His criminal background and political ambitions fit with someone "hungering for redemption."

===[[Virtual beings]]===

The virtual beings (possibly including the [[virtual Leoben]]) may actually be a single entity, the final Cylon being more spiritual than corporal. Virtual Six claims to be an angel from the Cylon God, which could be roughly correlated with the "the five priests devoted to the one whose name cannot be spoken" from [[Pythia]]. The overall actions of these beings seem to be neither pro-Cylon or pro-human, which fits with the Final five being a third party in the dynamic of the battle.

None of the other final five have shown similar characteristics to this, and there is no particular reason to suggest the final Cylon is greatly different from his or her four "siblings". When Number Three sees her vision of the final five in the [[Opera House]] (a vision repeated for other characters, thus not simply in her mind) they are five humanoid figures in white robes, at least one of which is known to her.

===More Esoteric ideas===

*The last Cylon is on [[Earth (RDM)|Earth]] or the entire population of Earth are copies of the final Cylon. In "[[Faith]]" the Hybrid does say that the Final Five have been to Earth.
*The final Cylon is dead.
*The final Cylon is a deceased character known to the audience.
*[[God (RDM)|God]], or some other divine entity.
*A single, somehow distinct, copy of a known Cylon.
*A character to be featured in ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'' such as [[Zoe Graystone]] or [[Tamara Adama]].
*The final Cylon is not yet born: it is the child of Tigh and Caprica Six. This would be in line with what the First hybrid said: "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering." It is still lingering in the womb, waiting to be born.

==References==
<references/>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Cylons]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Humanoid Cylon speculation

2008-06-18T01:06:28Z

Tirkon: /* General factors for consideration */

{{plausible speculation}}
The [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon]] evolution into twelve distinct [[Humanoid Cylon|humanoid models]] introduced a serious problem for the remnants of humanity in the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]]. Early into the search for [[Earth]], it seemed that anyone could be a Cylon, raising doubt and suspicion within the human populace ("[[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]").

Fans of the show are rife with speculation about who could be a Cylon infiltrator in the Fleet. Viewers were introduced to the "[[Significant Seven]]" over the course of the miniseries and the first two season, but the nature of each of these characters was revealed shortly after that character's introduction.

In season three the speculation by both characters and fans turned to the [[Final Five]], enigmatic, almost-mystical figures who seem to have a [[The Temple of Five|link]] to ancient Colonial history. The nature of the five, according to [[Ron D. Moore|Moore]], is "fundamentally different" from the other seven models<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=ffdifferent|timestamp=19:05|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>.

At the conclusion of "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" four recurring characters are revealed to be Cylons. The revelation that long standing characters such as Colonel [[Saul Tigh|Tigh]] and Chief [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] are Cylons blows the field wide open; if they could be "[[toaster]]s," then ''anyone'' could be the last Cylon. In particular, Tigh has a long and well-documented character history dating back to the first [[Cylon War]].

This article details [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad#Derived content|plausible speculation]] on which of the central and supporting characters in ''[[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Battlestar Galactica]]'' could be the final one.

==Clues from Official Sources==
During a Q&A session on the official Sci Fi channel Battlestar Galactica forum Ronald D. Moore notes that he already knows who the last Cylon is, and that he's already left clues as to who it is<ref>[http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2270103&st=0&p=3041263&#entry3041263 20 Answers - SCI FI FORUMS] Retrieved 03-27-2007</ref>.

[[Bradley Thompson]] was asked when the writers knew the identity of the final five:
:"Four of the five were recent. If memory serves, the fifth (which may change) we've been kicking around since about the end of Season One."<ref>[[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive8#Identity of the Final Five|BW:OC#Identity of the Final Five]]</ref>

==General factors for consideration==
In terms of narrative, to prevent an anti-climax it seems likely that the final Cylon would probably need to be a more prominent character than those of the Four. This centers the spotlight in the central "human" characters ([[Roslin]], [[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]], [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] and [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]]). However, there is still an entire season for characters to develop and gain significance with viewers.

With the Final Five being "fundamentally different" from the Seven, extrapolating any characteristics we learned of Cylons from the Seven (including physiology, loyalty or self-awareness) is of questionable validity.

Colonel Tigh has a well documented history stretching back at least to the first Cylon War. Also considering the [[Temple of Five]] it seems Final Five Cylons somehow significantly pre-date the Seven.

It has been seen that Cylons can start families, however it is unclear how the Five came to exist. Having known natural parents would ''seem'' to preclude one being any more than half-Cylon.

Of the 11 so far there have been only four female models. The final Cylon being female would serve to equalize this gender bias.

The [[first Hybrid]] gives a monologue about his knowledge of the Final Five in the extended version of "[[Razor]]". It states that "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering."

With the exception of [[Karl Agathon]] and [[Cally Tyrol]], who are confirmed to have half-Cylon, half-human children<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=hybridnick|timestamp=22:41|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>, any "human" character could be a Cylon.

In [[Revelations]], [[D'Anna Biers]], the [[Number Three]] who saw the [[Final Five]], mentions that there are only four of them in the fleet. If this is true, quite a few speculations in this article are wrong and every person mentioned here is unsuspicious. Assumed that the person is already known, possibly missed persons or such pronounced so dead could be the Final One, known by the Cylons as Tirkon, i.e. [[Louanne Katraine]], [[Ellen Tigh]], [[Helena Cain]], Admiral Adamas wife or President Adar. Ellen Tigh could be plausible, because her husband [[Saul Tigh]] saw her in the captured [[Number Six]]. Possibly Ellens consciousness was downloaded to her.

==Main Characters==

===[[Laura Roslin]]===
[[Image:Laura_Roslin_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
The colonies' president has been unquestionably a boon to humanity's search for earth, indeed the two times she has been removed from office have been the two greatest setbacks in the journey.

Roslin has also experienced prophetic dreams and visions (those induced by [[chamalla]], and a dream she shared with the Cylons [[Caprica Six]] and [[Sharon Agathon]]). She fits very well the profile of the [[Sacred Scrolls|scroll's]] dying leader, the scrolls also having links to other more mystical elements of the series, including the [[Temple of Five]]. Additionally, Roslin was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

However her dying nature, from an aggressive form of breast cancer is also the biggest cause to doubt Roslin being a Cylon. It is unknown whether the Final Five can succumb to cancer, but Cylons seem to be generally tougher than humans. Baltar's cure in "[[Epiphanies]]" was probably designed based on the assumption that Roslin's physiology is human.

===[[William Adama]]===
[[Image:William_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
If William Adama were revealed to be a Cylon, it would be one of the biggest shocks the series could produce. Overall Adama appears to epitomize a very human set of strengths and weaknesses. Nevertheless, he does experience hallucinations in the fifth [[Razor Flashback]], although he sees and hears people in his environment instead of seeing himself in a different one. The experience could also be explained by stress or other factors, however. Adama was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

The Adama family is well documented. His father, [[Joseph Adama]], was known to [[Romo Lampkin]]. The proposed spin-off ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'', will feature the history of the Adama family, including a young William. This may be difficult to square with any revelation about William Adama being a Cylon.

{{spoiltext|A robotic duplicate of William Adama's sibling [[Tamara Adama]] is one of the first Cylons ([[Caprica|Caprica (series)]]). It is not implausible that William Adama could be a similar construct, although the forms of the Cylon prototypes are unknown and unlikely to be humanoid}}
William Adama experiences guilt for actions he believe may have triggered the war ([[Hero]]). This could be the "hungering for redemption" that the [[First Hybrid]] talks about (see above).

===[[Lee Adama]]===
[[Image:Lee_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
Could Lee's chronic angst be partly due to guilt at his Cylon nature? Was the [[Leoben]] who said "Adama's a Cylon" ([[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]) referring to Lee? (note: the writers hadn't decided on the identity of the final Cylon at that point). He might project in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", although this is more likely an oxygen deprivation induced hallucination.

In his defense, Lee is also a member of the well-documented Adama family. A "switched at birth" scenario could explain this.

Lee is characterised by near chronic angst for various reasons. Could he be the one "hungering for redemption"?

Lee is told that he is "a son trying to flee his father's shadow" by [[Romo Lampkin]]. This conceivably could link with the description of the final Cylon as "still in shadow, drawn toward the light."

Lee was in the fleet when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in it ([[Revelations]]).

===[[Gaius Baltar]]===
[[Image:Gaius_Baltar_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
{{mainarticle|Baltar as Cylon speculation}}
Baltar's vast intelligence, weak character and lack of loyalty to anyone but himself have made him ultimately humanity's (unwitting) betrayer. Baltar himself longs to be a Cylon as this would absolve himself, however comes to the conclusion that he is human after all. Baltar certainly has a lot to be guilty about, whether he has enough of a conscience to be truly "hungering for redemption" is questionable, however his confession to Roslin seems to indicate that this is the case ([[The Hub]]).

There are good reasons to suspect Baltar. He exhibits vast intelligence that may be superhuman in nature. His [[Virtual Six]], her precognitive abilities, and the apparently projected environments they often co-experience are suspicious, as well as the fact that both Virtual Six and later the [[Hybrid]] tell him that he is "chosen". Additionally, Baltar was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

In [[Caprica Six]]'s final vision in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" she sees the hooded figures of the final five staring at her from the upper level. Baltar is standing next to her in the vision as well.

===[[Kara Thrace]]===
[[Image:Kara_Thrace.jpg|right|90px]]
{{seealso|The Destiny}}
Kara Thrace's path towards her destiny has involved many strange, perhaps supernatural events. Whether this destiny involves her being a Cylon is a matter of speculation (indeed members of the [[Significant Seven]], who do not know who the final five are, tell Starbuck she has this destiny), but it is certain Thrace is ''something'' special.

Certainly Thrace exhibits phenomenal natural skill as a pilot, and manages to learn to fly a [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Raider]] exceptionally quickly ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). From childhood, Thrace has been drawing the mandala from the [[Temple of Five]]. However she was also physically abused as a child and still carries the scars; Cylons seem to be more robust than humans and possibly may not carry such long-term injuries. The same may be said of the knee injury which put a stop to Thrace's [[Pyramid (RDM)|Pyramid]] playing ambitions.

Most strikingly, the ace pilot apparently dies in "[[Maelstrom]]" but returns ([[Resurrection (RDM)|resurrected]]?) in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]". Furthermore, not being on ''Galactica'' at the time, Thrace is the only major "human" character who has a reason for not reacting to the [[The Music|music]] which, to the "four", reverberates around the ship. However the final Cylon may, for some reason, not have heard it, or may have ignored it.

Thrace has engaged in combat with [[Raider (RDM)|Raiders]] on many occasions without any incident similar to the one which occured between Anders and the Raider during the [[Battle of the Ionian Nebula]], however it is possible that the Raider was only able to identify Anders because he had already been "activated".

[[Katee Sackhoff]] was apparently told she is not a Cylon<ref>[http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8547/redeye3copyci7.jpg See this magazine cutting.]</ref>.

{{spoilli|According to [http://roadrunnerdm.livejournal.com/84288.html this source] as of "[[Sometimes a Great Notion]]", Kara Thrace believes herself to be a Cylon, whilst Katee Sackhoff believes otherwise.}}

===None of the above?===

The January 2008 edition of [[w:Entertainment Weekly|Entertainment Weekly]] showcases a two-page photo of the cast for [[Season Four]] posed in a manner similar to Leonardo DaVinci's ''[[w:The Last Supper (Leonardo)|The Last Supper]]'' with an explanation of each character's pose/position provided by Ron Moore. Near the far left of the table a space is left vacant and a cup sits on the table marking the absent character's intended place. Moore tells EW that "We have not yet revealed the final [unknown] Cylon." and when asked if there was a possibility that the final Cylon was indeed ''not'' seated at the table Moore notes "You ferreted that out pretty slyly. I didn't really want to give that away."<ref>{{cite_news|first=|last=|url=http://community.livejournal.com/battlestar_blog/814818.html#cutid1|title=What does this picture mean? Try to crack the 'BSG' code.|publisher=Entertainment Weekly|page=40, 41|date=January 11, 2008|accessdate=English|language=}}</ref> William Adama, Laura Roslin, Lee Adama, Gaius Baltar, and Kara Thrace are all present in the picture, as are [[Final Five]] Cylons Saul Tigh, Galen Tyrol, and Samuel Anders.

However, the importance of this photo is seriously put to question given [[Aaron Douglas]]' comments on the photo. According to the actor, he was unsure that Moore had anything to do with the photo, given that Moore was not present for the shoot. Additionally, the photo shoot had at least six different setups and the actors had changed places during the photo shoot, thus contending that there is no hidden meaning for the photo.<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://community.livejournal.com/aarondouglas/55289.html|title=The Chief's Deck: BSG Last Supper Photo|date=8 January 2008|accessdate=9 January 2009|last=|first=|format=|language=}}</ref>

==Others==

===[[Tom Zarek]]===

[[Image:Zarek.jpg|right|90px]]
Based upon the mutterings of the Hybrid in "Razor", as well as Ron Moore's claim that he has already left clues to the final Cylon, one could assume Tom Zarek is the last Cylon to be found.

Tom Zarek likes to move from second-line positions, is not big on being in charge but always craving to be noticed and understood, is constantly trying to make people understand why he did the things he spent time in jail for, and has the "cleanest" past (no known relatives, etc.). His criminal background and political ambitions fit with someone "hungering for redemption."

===[[Virtual beings]]===

The virtual beings (possibly including the [[virtual Leoben]]) may actually be a single entity, the final Cylon being more spiritual than corporal. Virtual Six claims to be an angel from the Cylon God, which could be roughly correlated with the "the five priests devoted to the one whose name cannot be spoken" from [[Pythia]]. The overall actions of these beings seem to be neither pro-Cylon or pro-human, which fits with the Final five being a third party in the dynamic of the battle.

None of the other final five have shown similar characteristics to this, and there is no particular reason to suggest the final Cylon is greatly different from his or her four "siblings". When Number Three sees her vision of the final five in the [[Opera House]] (a vision repeated for other characters, thus not simply in her mind) they are five humanoid figures in white robes, at least one of which is known to her.

===More Esoteric ideas===

*The last Cylon is on [[Earth (RDM)|Earth]] or the entire population of Earth are copies of the final Cylon. In "[[Faith]]" the Hybrid does say that the Final Five have been to Earth.
*The final Cylon is dead.
*The final Cylon is a deceased character known to the audience.
*[[God (RDM)|God]], or some other divine entity.
*A single, somehow distinct, copy of a known Cylon.
*A character to be featured in ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'' such as [[Zoe Graystone]] or [[Tamara Adama]].
*The final Cylon is not yet born: it is the child of Tigh and Caprica Six. This would be in line with what the First hybrid said: "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering." It is still lingering in the womb, waiting to be born.

==References==
<references/>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Cylons]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Humanoid Cylon speculation

2008-06-18T00:40:41Z

Tirkon: /* General factors for consideration */

{{plausible speculation}}
The [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons']] transformation into twelve distinct [[Humanoid Cylon|humanoid forms]] introduces serious problems for the remnant of humanity known as the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]] to identify Cylon operative from human. At the beginning of their journey it seemed that anyone could be a humanoid Cylon, causing doubt and suspicion within the human populace (as evidenced in "[[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]").

In the real world speculation about who could be a Cylon infiltrator in the Fleet has also been rife among fans of the show. Over the course of the miniseries and the first two seasons viewers were introduced to the "[[Significant Seven]]", however the natures of each of these characters were all revealed shortly after the characters' introductions.

In season three the nature of speculation for both the characters and the fans turned to the [[Final Five]], enigmatic, almost-mystical figures who seemed to have a [[The Temple of Five|link]] to ancient Colonial history. The nature of the five, according to [[Ron D. Moore|Moore]], is "fundamentally different" from the other seven models<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=ffdifferent|timestamp=19:05|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>.

At the conclusion of "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" four recurring characters are revealed to be Cylons. The revelation that long standing characters such as Colonel [[Saul Tigh|Tigh]] and Chief [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] were Cylons blew the field wide open, if they could be "[[toaster]]s," then ''anyone'' could be the last Cylon. In particular, Tigh has a long and well-documented character history dating back to the first [[Cylon War]].

This article details [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad#Derived content|plausible speculation]] on which of the central and supporting characters in ''[[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Battlestar Galactica]]'' could be the final one.

==Clues from Official Sources==
During a Q&A session on the official Sci Fi channel Battlestar Galactica forum Ronald D. Moore notes that he already knows who the last Cylon is, and that he's already left clues as to who it is<ref>[http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?showtopic=2270103&st=0&p=3041263&#entry3041263 20 Answers - SCI FI FORUMS] Retrieved 03-27-2007</ref>.

[[Bradley Thompson]] was asked when the writers knew the identity of the final five:
:"Four of the five were recent. If memory serves, the fifth (which may change) we've been kicking around since about the end of Season One."<ref>[[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive8#Identity of the Final Five|BW:OC#Identity of the Final Five]]</ref>

==General factors for consideration==
In terms of narrative, to prevent an anti-climax it seems likely that the final Cylon would probably need to be a more prominent character than those of the Four. This centers the spotlight in the central "human" characters ([[Roslin]], [[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]], [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] and [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]]). However, there is still an entire season for characters to develop and gain significance with viewers.

With the Final Five being "fundamentally different" from the Seven, extrapolating any characteristics we learned of Cylons from the Seven (including physiology, loyalty or self-awareness) is of questionable validity.

Colonel Tigh has a well documented history stretching back at least to the first Cylon War. Also considering the [[Temple of Five]] it seems Final Five Cylons somehow significantly pre-date the Seven.

It has been seen that Cylons can start families, however it is unclear how the Five came to exist. Having known natural parents would ''seem'' to preclude one being any more than half-Cylon.

Of the 11 so far there have been only four female models. The final Cylon being female would serve to equalize this gender bias.

The [[first Hybrid]] gives a monologue about his knowledge of the Final Five in the extended version of "[[Razor]]". It states that "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering."

With the exception of [[Karl Agathon]] and [[Cally Tyrol]], who are confirmed to have half-Cylon, half-human children<ref>{{cite_rdm_podcast|episode=Frak Party Q and A|act=|id=hybridnick|timestamp=22:41|totalrunning=78:27}}</ref>, any "human" character could be a Cylon.

In [[Revelations]] the [[Number Three]], who saw the [[Final Five]], mentions that there are only four of them in the fleet. If this is true, quite a few speculations in this article are wrong and every person mentioned here is unsuspicious. Assumed that the person is already known, possibly missed persons or such pronounced so dead could be the Final One, known by the Cylons as Tirkon, i.e. [[Louanne Katraine]], [[Ellen Tigh]], [[Helena Cain]], Admiral Adamas wife or President Adar -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 00:40, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

==Main Characters==

===[[Laura Roslin]]===
[[Image:Laura_Roslin_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
The colonies' president has been unquestionably a boon to humanity's search for earth, indeed the two times she has been removed from office have been the two greatest setbacks in the journey.

Roslin has also experienced prophetic dreams and visions (those induced by [[chamalla]], and a dream she shared with the Cylons [[Caprica Six]] and [[Sharon Agathon]]). She fits very well the profile of the [[Sacred Scrolls|scroll's]] dying leader, the scrolls also having links to other more mystical elements of the series, including the [[Temple of Five]]. Additionally, Roslin was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

However her dying nature, from an aggressive form of breast cancer is also the biggest cause to doubt Roslin being a Cylon. It is unknown whether the Final Five can succumb to cancer, but Cylons seem to be generally tougher than humans. Baltar's cure in "[[Epiphanies]]" was probably designed based on the assumption that Roslin's physiology is human.

===[[William Adama]]===
[[Image:William_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
If William Adama were revealed to be a Cylon, it would be one of the biggest shocks the series could produce. Overall Adama appears to epitomize a very human set of strengths and weaknesses. Nevertheless, he does experience hallucinations in the fifth [[Razor Flashback]], although he sees and hears people in his environment instead of seeing himself in a different one. The experience could also be explained by stress or other factors, however. Adama was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

The Adama family is well documented. His father, [[Joseph Adama]], was known to [[Romo Lampkin]]. The proposed spin-off ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'', will feature the history of the Adama family, including a young William. This may be difficult to square with any revelation about William Adama being a Cylon.

{{spoiltext|A robotic duplicate of William Adama's sibling [[Tamara Adama]] is one of the first Cylons ([[Caprica|Caprica (series)]]). It is not implausible that William Adama could be a similar construct, although the forms of the Cylon prototypes are unknown and unlikely to be humanoid}}
William Adama experiences guilt for actions he believe may have triggered the war ([[Hero]]). This could be the "hungering for redemption" that the [[First Hybrid]] talks about (see above).

===[[Lee Adama]]===
[[Image:Lee_Adama_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
Could Lee's chronic angst be partly due to guilt at his Cylon nature? Was the [[Leoben]] who said "Adama's a Cylon" ([[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]) referring to Lee? (note: the writers hadn't decided on the identity of the final Cylon at that point). He might project in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", although this is more likely an oxygen deprivation induced hallucination.

In his defense, Lee is also a member of the well-documented Adama family. A "switched at birth" scenario could explain this.

Lee is characterised by near chronic angst for various reasons. Could he be the one "hungering for redemption"?

Lee is told that he is "a son trying to flee his father's shadow" by [[Romo Lampkin]]. This conceivably could link with the description of the final Cylon as "still in shadow, drawn toward the light."

Lee was in the fleet when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in it ([[Revelations]]).

===[[Gaius Baltar]]===
[[Image:Gaius_Baltar_promo.jpg|right|90px]]
{{mainarticle|Baltar as Cylon speculation}}
Baltar's vast intelligence, weak character and lack of loyalty to anyone but himself have made him ultimately humanity's (unwitting) betrayer. Baltar himself longs to be a Cylon as this would absolve himself, however comes to the conclusion that he is human after all. Baltar certainly has a lot to be guilty about, whether he has enough of a conscience to be truly "hungering for redemption" is questionable, however his confession to Roslin seems to indicate that this is the case ([[The Hub]]).

There are good reasons to suspect Baltar. He exhibits vast intelligence that may be superhuman in nature. His [[Virtual Six]], her precognitive abilities, and the apparently projected environments they often co-experience are suspicious, as well as the fact that both Virtual Six and later the [[Hybrid]] tell him that he is "chosen". Additionally, Baltar was among those on the rebel baseship when D'Anna stated that only four of the final five were in the fleet ([[Revelations]]).

In [[Caprica Six]]'s final vision in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]" she sees the hooded figures of the final five staring at her from the upper level. Baltar is standing next to her in the vision as well.

===[[Kara Thrace]]===
[[Image:Kara_Thrace.jpg|right|90px]]
{{seealso|The Destiny}}
Kara Thrace's path towards her destiny has involved many strange, perhaps supernatural events. Whether this destiny involves her being a Cylon is a matter of speculation (indeed members of the [[Significant Seven]], who do not know who the final five are, tell Starbuck she has this destiny), but it is certain Thrace is ''something'' special.

Certainly Thrace exhibits phenomenal natural skill as a pilot, and manages to learn to fly a [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Raider]] exceptionally quickly ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). From childhood, Thrace has been drawing the mandala from the [[Temple of Five]]. However she was also physically abused as a child and still carries the scars; Cylons seem to be more robust than humans and possibly may not carry such long-term injuries. The same may be said of the knee injury which put a stop to Thrace's [[Pyramid (RDM)|Pyramid]] playing ambitions.

Most strikingly, the ace pilot apparently dies in "[[Maelstrom]]" but returns ([[Resurrection (RDM)|resurrected]]?) in "[[Crossroads, Part II]]". Furthermore, not being on ''Galactica'' at the time, Thrace is the only major "human" character who has a reason for not reacting to the [[The Music|music]] which, to the "four", reverberates around the ship. However the final Cylon may, for some reason, not have heard it, or may have ignored it.

Thrace has engaged in combat with [[Raider (RDM)|Raiders]] on many occasions without any incident similar to the one which occured between Anders and the Raider during the [[Battle of the Ionian Nebula]], however it is possible that the Raider was only able to identify Anders because he had already been "activated".

[[Katee Sackhoff]] was apparently told she is not a Cylon<ref>[http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8547/redeye3copyci7.jpg See this magazine cutting.]</ref>.

{{spoilli|According to [http://roadrunnerdm.livejournal.com/84288.html this source] as of "[[Sometimes a Great Notion]]", Kara Thrace believes herself to be a Cylon, whilst Katee Sackhoff believes otherwise.}}

===None of the above?===

The January 2008 edition of [[w:Entertainment Weekly|Entertainment Weekly]] showcases a two-page photo of the cast for [[Season Four]] posed in a manner similar to Leonardo DaVinci's ''[[w:The Last Supper (Leonardo)|The Last Supper]]'' with an explanation of each character's pose/position provided by Ron Moore. Near the far left of the table a space is left vacant and a cup sits on the table marking the absent character's intended place. Moore tells EW that "We have not yet revealed the final [unknown] Cylon." and when asked if there was a possibility that the final Cylon was indeed ''not'' seated at the table Moore notes "You ferreted that out pretty slyly. I didn't really want to give that away."<ref>{{cite_news|first=|last=|url=http://community.livejournal.com/battlestar_blog/814818.html#cutid1|title=What does this picture mean? Try to crack the 'BSG' code.|publisher=Entertainment Weekly|page=40, 41|date=January 11, 2008|accessdate=English|language=}}</ref> William Adama, Laura Roslin, Lee Adama, Gaius Baltar, and Kara Thrace are all present in the picture, as are [[Final Five]] Cylons Saul Tigh, Galen Tyrol, and Samuel Anders.

However, the importance of this photo is seriously put to question given [[Aaron Douglas]]' comments on the photo. According to the actor, he was unsure that Moore had anything to do with the photo, given that Moore was not present for the shoot. Additionally, the photo shoot had at least six different setups and the actors had changed places during the photo shoot, thus contending that there is no hidden meaning for the photo.<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://community.livejournal.com/aarondouglas/55289.html|title=The Chief's Deck: BSG Last Supper Photo|date=8 January 2008|accessdate=9 January 2009|last=|first=|format=|language=}}</ref>

==Others==

===[[Tom Zarek]]===

[[Image:Zarek.jpg|right|90px]]
Based upon the mutterings of the Hybrid in "Razor", as well as Ron Moore's claim that he has already left clues to the final Cylon, one could assume Tom Zarek is the last Cylon to be found.

Tom Zarek likes to move from second-line positions, is not big on being in charge but always craving to be noticed and understood, is constantly trying to make people understand why he did the things he spent time in jail for, and has the "cleanest" past (no known relatives, etc.). His criminal background and political ambitions fit with someone "hungering for redemption."

===[[Virtual beings]]===

The virtual beings (possibly including the [[virtual Leoben]]) may actually be a single entity, the final Cylon being more spiritual than corporal. Virtual Six claims to be an angel from the Cylon God, which could be roughly correlated with the "the five priests devoted to the one whose name cannot be spoken" from [[Pythia]]. The overall actions of these beings seem to be neither pro-Cylon or pro-human, which fits with the Final five being a third party in the dynamic of the battle.

None of the other final five have shown similar characteristics to this, and there is no particular reason to suggest the final Cylon is greatly different from his or her four "siblings". When Number Three sees her vision of the final five in the [[Opera House]] (a vision repeated for other characters, thus not simply in her mind) they are five humanoid figures in white robes, at least one of which is known to her.

===More Esoteric ideas===

*The last Cylon is on [[Earth (RDM)|Earth]] or the entire population of Earth are copies of the final Cylon. In "[[Faith]]" the Hybrid does say that the Final Five have been to Earth.
*The final Cylon is dead.
*The final Cylon is a deceased character known to the audience.
*[[God (RDM)|God]], or some other divine entity.
*A single, somehow distinct, copy of a known Cylon.
*A character to be featured in ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'' such as [[Zoe Graystone]] or [[Tamara Adama]].
*The final Cylon is not yet born: it is the child of Tigh and Caprica Six. This would be in line with what the First hybrid said: "...the fifth is still is in shadow, drawn toward the light, hungering for redemption, that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering." It is still lingering in the womb, waiting to be born.

==References==
<references/>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Cylons]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

User:Thwidra

2007-04-22T12:05:12Z

Tirkon: New page: de:Benutzer:Thwidra

[[de:Benutzer:Thwidra]]

Collaborators

2006-10-29T22:27:36Z

Tirkon: /* Questions */

{{Episode Data
| title= Collaborators
| image=JammerCollaborators.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 5
| guests=
| writer= [[Mark Verheiden]]
| story=
| director= [[Michael Rymer]]
| production= 305
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-27
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population= 41,435
| prev= [[Exodus, Part II]]
| next= [[Torn]]
}}

== Overview ==
:''[[The Circle]], a secret tribunal on ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'', decides the fate of [[James Lyman|Jammer]] and other Colonials who aided the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons]] during the occupation of [[New Caprica]].

== Summary ==
=== On ''[[Galactica]]'' ===
* [[James Lyman]] (Jammer) is brought before [[The Circle]]. He is found guilty of treason, the punishment for which is death. Despite his pleas and an attempt to convince [[Galen Tyrol]] to spare him, for Lyman freed [[Cally Tyrol]] from the Cylon death squad ([[Precipice]]), The Circle carries out Lyman's punishment and ejects him from ''Galactica'' by depressurizing the [[launch tubes|launch tube]] where he is held.
* After Lyman's execution, Tyrol talks to his wife about how she escaped. While she claims to not have thought about the incident since, Cally Tyrol tells him that she thinks one "[[New Caprica Police|of those goons]]" set her free.
* On ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Laura Roslin]] asks [[Tom Zarek]] of his plans as the new President. Zarek plans to reconvene the Quorum of Twelve, put Roslin's name in for nomination to vice president and then step down, returning the presidency to her. Roslin assumes that this act requires something in return for Zarek, who he asks not be left on the outside of government affairs. For his actions in standing up to Gaius Baltar on New Caprica, she promises him the Vice Presidency.
* [[Felix Gaeta]] enters the still-damaged [[CIC]] to help with repairs to communication. [[Saul Tigh|Colonel Tigh]] sees him and vocally demands for him to leave, accusing him of being a collaborator. [[Helo]] tells Tigh that Gaeta is there on the Admiral's orders, but Tigh continues to protest loudly until Admiral Adama appears. The admiral takes him out of the room to talk to him about resting so he will be ready, something that Tigh thinks he doesn't need.
* The Circle reconvenes, now under a three-day time limit to dole out justice. As they run through the cases, they eventually they come to the file on Gaeta, with four of the members voting guilty. Anders refuses to vote and leaves the Circle, tired of the continuous killing he has done. Chief Tyrol refuses to vote if they do not have a sixth member as required for the Circle.
* In the mess hall, Gaeta is treated as ''[[Wikipedia:Persona non grata|persona non grata]]'', eating alone until [[Kara Thrace]] sits at his table. She talks, kindly at first, then insults him for his supposed cowardice. Gaeta counters by bringing up his status as the informant, mentioning the dog dish being flipped over as his signal to the resistance.
* Lee and Bill Adama talking about the status of the fleet. Lee Adama brings up the fact that over the past few days, 13 people have mysteriously disappeared, after being confirmed as survivors of the Exodus. As he leaves he reveals that has lost "[[Wikipedia:Stone (weight)|half a stone]]" in weight. Bill tells him to keep jumping rope.
* The Circle brings in Kara Thrace as the replacement vote of the jury. All vote guilty on Gaeta, except for Tyrol once more. Anders comes in and requests time to talk with his wife. The scene splits, with the other members of the Circle trying to convince Tyrol of Gaeta's guilt, and Anders trying to explain that what the Circle does isn't justice. Thrace rebuffs him, her pain from incarceration lashing at anyone, even her husband. Thrace tells Anders that they must separate. The Chief eventually folds and votes guilty.
* Gaeta is captured and brought to a launch tube, told that this is an official trial under authority from the President of the Colonies, and that if he has anything to say to explain himself he should say it now. Gaeta replies that he has already told his story and refuses to beg. Kara Thrace's anger lashes out at Gaeta, telling him to beg, while taunting him with the idea that he was an informant for the insurgency, and mentioning the [[Jake (New Caprica)|dog bowl]]. When the Chief hears this, he reveals that Gaeta could not know about the signal unless he was the one leaving the dead drops, then he releases Gaeta from his bonds. The other members of the Circle realize Gaeta's innocence, that he was in fact the secret source inside the Baltar Adminstration. Colonel Tigh stands speechless in the revelation, confused between his own certainty and the facts before him.
* Laura Roslin is re-inaugurated as the President of the Twelve Colonies, and issues a decree of amnesty against all alleged collaborators, after it is privately revealed that Zarek authorized the trials and sentences conducted by the Circle in an attempt to protect Roslin from having to deal with months of public trials which could destroy the unity of the Fleet through highly publicized "witch hunts." In place of the trials, Roslin announces a commission on "truth and reconciliation", to record the history of the occupation for posterity.
* Still outcast, Gaeta is reinstated in the Colonial Fleet as an officer. In the mess hall, Chief Tyrol sits with Gaeta. Both eat in silence as the other crew members are taken aback by the act.

===On a [[Basestar (RDM)|basestar]]===
* [[Gaius Baltar]] seems to be on ''Colonial One'', sitting in a chair in front of Tigh, Roslin, and Admiral Adama as they talk about how there was little he could do with the situation he had on New Caprica.
* As the group forgives him, the [[Cylon-Related Hallucinations|virtual Six]] appears and claims the group is too lenient. Admiral Adama actually seems to hear her. Laura Roslin begins to tell Baltar how much she wants him in a provocative manner when Baltar realizes he is dreaming, waking up as Roslin kisses him.
*Baltar finds himself naked on a red [[Wikipedia:Chaise longue|chaise longue]] inside an unrecognizable room. When a [[Cylon Centurion]] guard appears at the doorway, Baltar realizes that he is imprisoned in the room with only a robe to wear. The scene turns to outer space where we see several Cylon basestars surrounding a [[Resurrection Ship]].
* A [[Number Three]] visits Baltar. She tells him that 3 days have elapsed since his arrival, and offers him a bottle of pills. She tells him that his presence on the basestar has caused a conflict between seven of the models. With three voting for him to be allowed to remain, while three vote for him to be removed. The only model that hasn't come to a consensus are the Sixes.
* [[Caprica Six]] visits Baltar and explains how wrong she was to let her feelings get in the way of her duties as a Cylon. Baltar tries to convince Six that she is more then just a Cylon and that she loves him. As she walks out he belatedly tells her that he needs her as well.
*Later, Baltar awakens to find Caprica-Six setting his clothes in his room.

== Questions ==
* Will there be an illegal organization in the Fleet that will continue where [[The Circle]] left off?
* Since Tigh has been reinstated into the Colonial Fleet, where does this leave Galactica's chain of command? Specifically, what are the roles of Tigh, Helo, and [[Aaron Kelly|Kelly]] now?
* What of [[Lee Adama]], [[Anastasia Dualla]] and other officers of ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]''? How will these redundacies be dealt with?
* Given that there are civilians aboard ''Galactica'' from the Second Exodus, and previous sabotage events that plagued ''Galactica'' prior to colonization of New Caprica, are they restricted to certain areas?
* Has [[Samuel Anders]] become a member of ''Galactica's'' crew, or is he only allowed onboard because of his relationship with Thrace?
* Will any of The Circle's members or Zarek face charges, or will they be pardoned by Roslin's government for what they had done?
**It's probably in the best interests of both Roslin's administration and the Circle to simply sweep the whole thing under the rug.
* Now that the Cylons seem to have accepted Gaius Baltar, at least begrudgingly, what will happen to him?
* What happened to those who were left behind on [[New Caprica]]?
* Which Cylon models are in favor of allowing Baltar to stay with them (besides Three, who proposed it in the first place) and which are not in favor?
* Does Caprica-Six setting Baltar's clothes on his bed indicate that the Cylons have chosen to allow him to remain?
* What became of Zarek's deal with Roslin to become Vice-President after his order authorizing the Circle came to light? Did he become Vice-President, or is he back on the outside?
* How could [[The Circle]] operate in ''Galactica's'' launch tube without William Adama's notice?

== Analysis ==
*The flight from New Caprica is referred to as "The Second Exodus", implying that the "First Exodus" was from the Colonies to New Caprica.
*Three states that three models are in favor of keeping Baltar around and three are against it, with Six's vote needed to break the stalemate. This indicates that the remaining five models are, for whatever reason, not participating in the vote.
**{{spoilli|According to an [http://www.aintitcool.com/node/30381 interview] with Aaron Douglas and Tamoh Penikett, the remaining five models may have all been [[Boxing|boxed]].}}
* This is the first time viewers have seen a living interior of a Cylon basestar. The only time an interior shot of a basestar was ever seen was in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]" when [[Sharon Valerii (Galactica copy)|Boomer]] encounters her [[Number Eight|sisters]].
* Lee Adama mentions that he lost "half a stone" refering to his weight. A stone is a unit of weight used mostly in the United Kingdom and Ireland that is equivalent to 14 pounds or 6.34 kg.
* ''Galactica's'' living spaces and hallways appear much more crowded than in the first two seasons, reflecting the expanded size of her crew. There also appear to be civilians mixed in with ''Galactica'''s crew complment, which is likely the result of overcrowding and the loss of some of the ships during the colonization and occupation of New Caprica.
* The exterior of ''Galactica'' is visibly damaged from the [[Battle of New Caprica]].
* The only two [[Cylon agent]]s to appear are Number Three and Number Six.
*On the disposition of the ''Pegasus'' crew and separated military personnel:
**Saul Tigh has resumed service as ''Galactica's'' XO. However, his experiences on New Caprica are hindering his ability to perform his duties.
**Lee Adama is performing bookkeeping work. He still wears his ''Pegasus'' uniform and Commander insignia, but his position on ''Galactica'' is unclear.
**Kara Thrace has retreived her uniform from storage, but it is not clear whether she has been recomissioned.
**Louanne Katraine is not seen. Presumably she continues to serve as ''Galactica's'' CAG.
**Karl Agathon is still working in ''Galactica's'' CIC.
**Anastasia Dualla is not seen.
**Felix Gaeta has been asked to help repair communication systems damaged during ''Galactica's'' atmospheric insertion in "[[Exodus, Part II]]". He is later seen in uniform in the mess hall.
**Galen Tyrol is back in uniform, and has presumably re-enlisted.
**Cally Tyrol is briefly seen caring for her son. It is not clear whether she has re-enlisted.
**Seelix is on ''Galactica'' and serves as a member of the Circle, but is not seen in uniform.
**Jammer has been executed by [[The Circle]] for his actions as a member of the [[New Caprica Police]].
*The glowing red strip on the wall in Baltar's room resembles the eye of a [[Cylon Centurion]] or [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Raider]]. While it could be decoration, there's a good chance that it's a surveillance system.

== Notes ==
* This episode marks the resumption of the [[Survivor count]]. There has been a net loss of 8,115 people since the beginning of "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]."
**Survivor count for this episode is 41,435.
* Laura Roslin resumes the Presidency in this episode.
* Kara Thrace has kept her surname, unlike most other married women shown or referenced thus far (including Caroline Adama, Ellen Tigh, Sesha Abinell, Cally Tyrol and Sharon Agathon).
* The Circle is the name used by the Bajoran [[MemoryAlpha:Alliance for Global Unity|Alliance for Global Unity]] in [[MemoryAlpha:Star Trek: Deep Space Nine|Star Trek: Deep Space Nine]] ("[[MemoryAlpha:The Homecoming|''The Homecoming'']]", "[[MemoryAlpha:The Circle|''The Circle'']]", and "[[MemoryAlpha:Siege|''The Siege'']]").
*This is the third time Six, after a fashion, has used the "You wouldn't like me when I'm angry" threat against Baltar. The quote "You wouldn't like me when I'm angry" is also a nod to ''[[w:The Incredible Hulk|The Incredible Hulk]]''.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==
*''After discussing the thirteen missing persons:''
:'''Commander Lee Adama''': I've got a date with a jump rope. Hey, I've lost half a stone.
:'''Admiral William Adama''': Keep jumpin'.

*''In Gaius Baltar's dream:''
:'''Number Six''': Don't make me angry, Gaius.
:'''Admiral William Adama''': You wouldn't like her when she's angry.

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==
*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon|Karl "Helo" Agathon]]
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Henderson Tyrol|Cally Tyrol]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]]
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Mark Verheiden]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Michael Rymer]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Laura Roslin

2006-10-27T15:16:11Z

Tirkon: german link

{{Character Data
|photo= Roslin3.PNG
|age=
|colony= [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Caprica]] (presumed)
|birthname= Laura Roslin
|callsign=
|seen= Miniseries
|death=
|parents=
|siblings=
|children=
|marital status=Unmarried, had an extramarital affair with President Adar (deceased)
|role= Teacher on [[New Caprica]], former interim President, [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|The Twelve Colonies of Kobol]] (serving remainder of [[Richard Adar|Richard Adar's]] term), Former Secretary of Education (Under President [[Richard Adar]] Cabinet)
|rank=
|actor= [[Mary McDonnell]]
}}

'''Laura Roslin''' is an unmarried<ref name="marital">According to the February issue of ''Sci Fi Magazine'', actress Mary McDonnell indicates that, according to the [[series bible]], Roslin has dated, but has never married. (Scans available on [http://www.livejournal.com/users/reedfem/158883.html Ramblings of a dorkish nature])</ref> woman with some 20 years of political experience. She serves as Secretary of Education for the Colonial [[Government]] at the time of the Cylon attack, later becoming president of the Twelve Colonies after the Cylon attack.
 

== Background ==
*Roslin, a former teacher, worked with [[Richard Adar]] when he was a mayor. Over the years, she herself has risen in political rank to the office of Secretary of Education.
*Adar, a married man, and Roslin are in a sexual affair<ref name="marital2>According to a December 2005 [http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Archives/dec05.html interview] with Mary McDonnell in TV Guide, President Adar, a married man, was having an affair with Roslin in the twilight of his term.</ref> during the events of a teachers strike that she is trying to mediate, to Adar's objection.
*Roslin learns that she, as did her mother, has breast cancer. Unfortunately, the diagnosis is grim, as the cancer has already spread.
*Roslin sat in the Government Plaza after her doctor's appointment, where she saw [[Gaius Baltar]], the famous scientist, walking and kissing an attractive blonde, but pays it little attention.
*Roslin successfully resolves the teachers strike crisis, but Adar vehemently disagrees with her method, and asks for her resignation. She asks him to defer the matter until she returns from the decommissioning ceremonies on battlestar ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]''.
*Despite being thrust into the role of President in highly unusual and stressful circumstances, Laura Roslin initially proves herself both tough and capable within the role. Initially in awe of Commander Adama, and worrying that he didn't hold her in high regard ([[Water]]), she quickly overcomes her doubts and fears to be able to make the required decisions at the right time, and also stand up to Adama himself ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]). She is always prepared to put the safety and destiny of the Fleet first, no matter what the cost of her actions ("[[Flesh and Bone]]," "[[Home, Part I]]," "[[Home, Part II]]," "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]") while remembering her limitations and fears.

==Character History at a Glance==

*Roslin is aboard the Colonial government cruiser ''[[Colonial Heavy 798]]'', having just attended the decommissioning ceremonies for the [[Galactica type battlestar|battlestar]] ''[[Galactica]]'', when the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies|information on the Cylon attack]] leaks through [[wireless]].
*Roslin attempts to serve as the government's representative to aid the ship's pilot in gaining more information. She manages to speak with [[Jack|one fellow official]] over wireless and hears the devastating news.
*The [[Case Orange]] automated beacon response assigns Roslin the role of President after Adar and other high-level government officials are dead or incapacitated.
*In the immediate aftermath of the attack, Roslin undertakes a rescue mission, using the now-renamed ''[[Colonial One]]'' to round-up all vessels that escape destruction and gathers as many survivors as possible together, hoping to save the remnants of humanity from total annihilation.
*Roslin successfully persuades ''Galactica'' commander [[William Adama]] away from his original intention of mounting a counter-attack against the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons]], and towards helping the new civilan fleet make its escape from occupied Colonial space.
*Since the exodus, Roslin establishes a fledgling civilian [[government]] within the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]], agrees to abide by civil law regarding her interim term of office, and reestabishes a new [[Quorum of Twelve]].
*Roslin has an uneasy understanding with Commander [[William Adama|Adama]]. Where she is responsible for all civil leadership issues among the surviving Colonials, Adama is responsible for all military decisions ([[Miniseries]]). However, the dividing line is not always clear between the two leaders.
*Roslin chooses [[Chamalla]] extract as an alternative to [[diloxin]], remembering her mother's malaise with that treatment.
* Her illness remains a secret until she relates her Chamalla-induced visions of [[Kobol]] to priestess [[Elosha]], who recognizes them as those prophesized by [[Pythia]], where a dying leader will find the path to [[Earth]]. After research, she determines that she may be able to substantiate Commander Adama's fictitious knowledge of the location of Earth with a true bearing to the world using ancient Colonial history.
*Roslin convinces [[Kara Thrace|Lt. Thrace]] to use the captured Cylon Raider to return to [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Caprica]] in search of the [[Arrow of Apollo]].
*Infuriated with Roslin's countermanding and with her refusal to resign as President, Commander Adama terminates her Presidency and stages a military coup. Despite the intervention of [[Lee Adama]], Roslin is arrested and incarcerated aboard ''[[Galactica]]'' ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]). With Vice President Baltar missing on the surface of Kobol, this effectively leaves the Fleet without any form of civil leadership, a situation worsened by an assassination attempt on William Adama himself immediately following Roslin's arrest ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]).
*From her cell, Roslin eventually tells the Quorum of Twelve, many of who are [[Gemenon]], of her role in the [[Sacred Scrolls]], and begins to gain significant underground civilian support for her cause.
*Roslin escapes ''Galactica'' and, with the help of rival [[Tom Zarek]], convinces over a third of the fleet to [[Laura Roslin faction|join her in the search for the Tomb]]. Roslin's ability to lead and command becomes stronger throughout this time, able to keep Zarek's ambitions at bay and deliver decisions faster than before.
*With the recovered Arrow, Roslin heads an hazardous expedition on Kobol to find the Tomb, with the aid of a second copy of [[Sharon Valerii (Caprica copy)|Sharon Valerii]] and priestess Elosha.
*The recovered Commander Adama gains refreshed insight on the need for the Fleet to stay united, and leaves to find Roslin's expedition on the surface of Kobol ([[Home, Part II]]).
*During the Kobol expedition, [[Elosha]] is killed. Roslin takes Elosha's blood-spattered copy of the Sacred Scrolls to guide her and to remember her friend.
*Commander Adama greets Roslin warmly on his arrival at her camp on Kobol. The two leaders have a heart-to-heart talk about her rebellion, which Adama forgives. Roslin thanks Adama, calling him "Bill" casually, though she notes that she didn't require permission for what she had to do. Roslin worries that, with talk of the [[Caprica Resistance]], that her insistence to Adama to leave the Colonial worlds behind was a mistake. Adama, also calling Roslin by her first name, firmly chastizes her, reminding Roslin that her decision was correct. If he had chosen to stay, Adama, his son, and all of humanity would be dead.
*Adama and Roslin's party later find the Tomb. With some teamwork, they discover and activate the Tomb's virtual hologram mechanism. Roslin's gamble on faith pays off big for humanity, and the group gains a map and guide to the true location of Earth.
*Back on ''Galactica'', Commander Adama introduces Roslin as President during a speech on the ship, and leads the audience in a rousing ovation on her return, publicly burying the hatchet between them.
*Adama and Roslin's respect for each other grew stronger and their leadership in managing fleet business became more cooperative, asking each other for advice and correcting each other as needed. They work together in getting reporter [[D'anna Biers]] corralled from her potentially disruptive tabloid expose' of the ''[[Gideon]]'' shootings by giving her almost-unlimited access to interview ''Galactica's'' crew. She creates a rousing documentary that meets her and Adama's approval ([[Final Cut]]).
*The military crew honors Roslin by christening a [[Blackbird|new experimental stealth fighter]] by the name, ''Laura'', a gesture that brings tears to the President.
*Despite the pleasure of the arrival of battlestar ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'', Roslin becomes concerned about Cain's abrupt command style and refusal to supply the civilian fleet.
*After a near-disasterous military confrontation between the two battlestar commanders, Roslin chastises them both and tells them to concentrate on [[Resurrection Ship|more important matters]]. Privately, Roslin tells Adama that Cain, whose power can radically affect the remnant of humanity both Roslin and Adama have strived so hard to protect, must be killed if Adama and the Fleet are to survive.
[[Image:Roslinadama.jpg|Roslin and Adama.|thumb]]
*After the battle, and Admiral [[Helena Cain|Cain's death]], Roslin, now more frail with her illness, promotes William Adama to Admiral. The new admiral gives the president a kiss.
*Roslin is miraculously saved by the injection of stem cells<ref>In the commentary track for "Epiphanies," Ron Moore states that a longer explanation of Roslin's cure was filmed that explained that the blood's stem cells cure Roslin. However, the scene was cut because he was afraid it would be too complicated and thought of as [[technobabble]]. The character's updated biography on the official Scifi.com site does confirm that stem cells from the hybrid were the actual cure. As such, Battlestar Wiki treats this data canonically as with information found in most deleted scenes.</ref> from the Cylon [[Hera|hybrid fetus]], which apparently eradicate her cancer ([[Epiphanies]]). In the hours prior to the cure, however, Roslin remembers her last days on Caprica, including the attractive blonde with Dr. Baltar, her vice-president. She now recognizes the woman as a copy of a [[Number Six|Cylon agent]].
*Roslin confronts Baltar on his association and later confesses the memory to William Adama ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]).
*Roslin dives into work with a dispassionate manner not unlike her predecessor, Richard Adar, including an attempt to stop the [[Black market (organization)|black market]] , handling the terrible loss of [[Billy Keikeya]], and the upcoming presidential election.
*Roslin's new aide, [[Tory Foster]], is an energetic young woman with a great deal of political drive.
*Complicating what may have been an easy re-election include Roslin's decision to enforce a no-abortion law to aid in repopulation while allowing a Gemenese girl [[Rya Kibby]] to have an abortion, angering Gemenon representative [[Sarah Porter]] and losing most support from Roslin's religious base.
*Expecting [[Tom Zarek]] to run for president, Roslin is shocked when her own vice president, Dr. Baltar, challenges Roslin for the presidency.
*Convinced that that the only way to keep the newborn Cylon-hybrid, [[Hera]], alive but out of the eye of Cylon agents, Roslin has the infant's death faked and hands the child over to a foster mother named [[Maya]] ([[Downloaded]]).
*Roslin easily leads Baltar in the election polls, but with the discovery of a habitable planet dubbed "[[New Caprica]]", Baltar finds the perfect wedge issue to use against Roslin. Despite the extreme difficulties of colonization, the people of the Fleet vote their extreme hopes over their rational fears and Roslin's voice of reason.
*Roslin gives Foster tacit approval to rig the election in order to save the Fleet from electing someone that she knows (in her heart) is a Cylon conspirator. But the fraud is discovered. Admiral Adama confers with Roslin and convinces her that rigging a democratic election was a line that they simply cannot cross. He indicates that the people have made the wrong decision to elect Baltar president, probably even a disastrous choice, but it was their choice.
*Roslin agrees to back down, and Adama announces a mistake in the vote count. A perturbed Baltar doesn't press further, content with having won the election, and orders colonization of New Caprica immediately after his swearing-in.
[[Image:2BATgyC05.jpg|Roslin as a teacher on New Caprica.|thumb]]
*A year passes on New Caprica, and Baltar's administration becomes the unmitigated, incompetent disaster that Roslin had feared. Meanwhile, Roslin returns to her old love of teaching, running the new settlement's school. Assisted by [[Maya]], who brings her infant adopted daughter [[Hera|Isis]] (the secreted Cylon hybrid), Roslin is more comfortable watching over the pair personally.
*380 days after settling on the planet, the Cylons discover the colony, as Roslin had warned, and occupy the settlement ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]).
*She is detained for a short period during which [[Baltar]] attempts to convince her to publically denounce the Resistance suicide bombings, but failing that, has her released. She is later collected in the round up of 200 suspected resistance members, including [[Tom Zarek]] and [[Cally]], for execution ([[Precipice]]).
*After being saved by the resistance, she assigns [[Samuel Anders]] to protect Maya and Isis ([[Exodus, Part I]]).
*Later, during the [[Battle of New Caprica]], she evacuates the planet onboard ''Colonial One'' which reunites with the Fleet along with the other previously grounded ships ([[Exodus, Part II]]).

==Notes==

*The character of Laura Roslin is unique to the Re-imagined Series. It shares no counterpart to the [[Original Series]], where its version of President [[Adar (TOS)|Adar]] is killed, but a presidential replacement is never made. (Of course, it could be argued that she is equivalent to the political/spiritual leader side of the original Commander Adama, whereas [[William Adama]] is representative of his military commander aspect.)

*Roslin's apparent cure in "[[Epiphanies]]" contradicts the "dying leader" clause of the [[Pythia|Pythian Prophecy]], despite the fulfillment of her role in the [[Tomb of Athena]] story arc. Indications from the creators of the show suggest that Roslin's health trials may not yet be over.

*Actress Mary McDonnell is perhaps best known for her role in the epic film, ''Dances with Wolves'', with Kevin Costner. She also played a First Lady in ''Independence Day'', another film which, in a far more campy way, depicts cocky human fighter pilots battling an enemy from outer space that attempts to exterminate mankind.

*In [[SDS|the Singer/DeSanto continuation]] of the [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|the Original Series]], a female president named [[Mara]] would visit ''Galactica'' in much the same way that Roslin did as part of that ''Galactica'''s decomissioning ceremony.

*The glasses her character wears are also her real glasses.<ref>{{cite_web|url=http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/video/index.php?cat=features&vid=37452|title=Mary McDonnell Q & A, Part 1|date=2006-10-13|accessdate=2006-10-14|last=|first=|format=VID|language=English}}</ref>

==References==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{start box}}
{{succession box|before=[[Richard Adar]]|title=[[Government|President of the Twelve Colonies of Kobol]]|after=[[Gaius Baltar]]}}
{{end box}}

{{Characters}}

[[Category:A to Z|Roslin, Laura]]
[[Category:Characters|Roslin, Laura]]
[[Category:Characters (RDM)|Roslin, Laura]]
[[Category:People from Caprica|Roslin, Laura]]
[[Category:RDM|Roslin, Laura]]

[[de:Laura Roslin]]

Talk:Kacey Brynn/Archive 1

2006-10-26T16:43:14Z

Tirkon: Kacey's Name

==Starting a page==
Perhaps I'm being rash in creating this page before we have more conclusive data, but I have to assume that this character will be rather important. Obviously the page needs to be fleshed out, but there's not much to go off of, and I tried to avoid veering into speculation.

If anyone has a picture, that'd be great. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 20:31, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

:You did just fine, Alpha. I'm sure we'll get a photo here in the next few days. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:43, 8 October 2006 (CDT)

::I've got one, but I'm not sure where to upload it. I'm painfully new at doing anything more than typo correction. --[[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 20:13, 16 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Down the left side of the page under the toolbox section, there is a link called "Upload File." Clicking this'll take you too the media wiki where you will have to register again just like you did here. Find the upload file on the left side of the wiki screen there and follow the instructions. To post the pic use [([Image Name|thumb|Image Desc])], just without the (), only the [[]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:40, 16 October 2006 (CDT)

==The actor's name==
The end credits for Exodus, Part 1 list her as Madeline Parker, with the letter "e" occuring twice, not three times.
--[[User:123home123|123home123]] 20:56, 15 October 2006 (CDT)

==Destroyed?==
Re: "Thrace's ovary was recovered from the remains of the farm that was destroyed by the Caprica Resistance (The Farm)." Was it destroyed? I got the impression that, aside from Starbuck wrecking Sue-Shawn's (sp?) unit, that it largely survived intact. I may have missed some dialog on that. --20:01, 16 October 2006 (CDT)
:In Precipice, Kara states that she blew the crap out of it. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 20:04, 16 October 2006 (CDT)

== Kacey's Name ==

Kacey = KAra thraCE-connoY ? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:43, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-26T16:34:42Z

Tirkon: /* Miniseries Standardization */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

:The [[Cylons (RDM)]] article seems as an introduction to the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] as well. Further I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:34, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, because everything will change then. But she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[Caprica-Three]], because she was introduced there? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:18, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-26T16:18:15Z

Tirkon: /* Special Number Three in third season */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

:I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:09, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, because everything will change then. But she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[Caprica-Three]], because she was introduced there? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:18, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-26T16:14:28Z

Tirkon: /* Special Number Three in third season */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

:I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:09, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, because everything will change then. But she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[New Caprica-Three]]? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:14, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-26T16:10:08Z

Tirkon: /* Miniseries Standardization */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

:I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:09, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, but she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[New Caprica-Three]]? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 10:54, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-26T16:09:30Z

Tirkon: /* Miniseries Standardization */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

I also think, that the term [[Cylon Agent]] is at the latest obsolete now. Caprica-Six, Galactica-Sharon and Caprica Sharon are the first examples against. Especially Caprica-Sharon could be called a "human agent" now. A Number Five shot Caprica Six because she helped Baltar. German version had the "mercy of the late birth" and did not use the term from the beginning ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:09, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, but she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[New Caprica-Three]]? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 10:54, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-26T15:54:29Z

Tirkon:

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:I've been aware of the growing issue. Scifi claims that they are the ones who wrote the original articles, such as the one on [[Edward James Olmos]]. Right now, I need help gathering evidence to the contrary -- please feel free to either e-mail me or post any evidence here. Since my time is now getting extremely limited, I need help in this. Thank you! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:20, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

:''Danke'', Tirkon and to everyone as well. Folks like yourself on the Internationalization project are some of our most remarkable contributors because you have to manage up to 3 separate versions, while us meager English users just have our place. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:49, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

== Miniseries Standardization ==

Of all the episode articles, the Miniseries article is most nonstandard, with much information that has been discussed ''ad nauseum'' in many other articles on Battlestar Wiki. As with any episode article, the content should reflect the parts aired, the significant summary of events, and brief questions and analysis generated by the initial broadcast (many of which has been answered).

The current format has extended analysis in the second part, most of which is painfully redundant with [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] and many, many other articles. I will be revising both parts to reflect their episodic nature, separating the events in each part, with questions and analysis for each episode. The articles will be renamed based on our current naming procedure in managing multi-part episodes. Both parts will avoid extended questions and analysis as much from the miniseries has been answered, but will point to the episodes and other articles that answer these questions. Any topics or sections that discuss the overall changes between the Re-imagined Series and Original Series will be moved to [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)]] if the item is not already present. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:28, 25 October 2006 (CDT)

== Special Number Three in third season ==

Since the third season we have one [[Number Three]] Character who played and will probably play in future a special role. If I remember correct, it was the same Three, who was slain by Six in [[Downloaded]]. We heard that the oracle said, she never should hold the child, but she did. The first consequence was, that she did not nuke the town. I think, now at the latest we should give her a special name. In the describtions it would be much easier, to identify her. What do you think? And what is about [[New Caprica-Three]]? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 10:54, 26 October 2006 (CDT)

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-10-21T19:30:26Z

Tirkon: /* Scifipedia */

{{Project|Wikipedian Quorum|image=BSG WIKI Quorum.png|shortcut=BW:WQ}}

[[Battlestar Wiki:Welcome, newcomers|Welcome, newcomers]] and baffled oldtimers! If you have a question about [[Battlestar Wiki]] and how it works, please place it '''at the bottom of the list''', and someone will attempt to answer it for you. (If you have a question about life, the universe and everything, go to the [[Battlestar Wiki:reference desk|reference desk]] instead.)

Before asking a question, check if it's answered by the [[Battlestar Wiki:FAQ]] or other pages linked from [[Battlestar Wiki:Help]].

Before answering a newcomer's question abruptly, consider rereading [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Please do not bite the newcomers|Please do not bite the newcomers]].

Questions and answers will not remain on this page indefinitely (otherwise it would very soon become too long to be editable). After a period of time with no further activity, information will be moved to other relevant sections of Battlestar Wiki (such as the FAQ pages) or placed in one of the Wikipedian Quorum archives if it is of general interest, or deleted. Please consider dating and titling your discussions so as to facilitate this.

{{newsection link}}

[[Category: A to Z]]

{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 01
| number = 1
| start = December 3, 2005
| end = April 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|01|Need help with a new article namespace}} {{archive-item|01|Colonel Tigh / Colonel Tye historical connection in TOS?}} {{archive-item|01|Cast Data infobox?}} {{archive-item|01|The Kitt Joke}} {{archive-item|01|When Earth is found...}} {{archive-item|01|A proposal}} {{archive-item|01|Server time is wrong}} {{archive-item|01|Wikipedia user box}} {{archive-item|01|Battlestar Galactica Model Kits}} {{archive-item|01|error on Battlestar Wiki:Help}} {{archive-item|01|Talk pages for actors?}} {{archive-item|01|Fatal error}} {{archive-item|01|The spam filter}} {{archive-item|01|Peabody award}} {{archive-item|01|BSG in the Comics}} {{archive-item|01|Season 2.0 and 2.5 DVD}} {{archive-item|01|Spoiler policy}}
|}}
{{archive-header
| archivenumber = 02
| number = 2
| start = April 15, 2006
| end = June 12, 2006
| items = {{archive-item|02|Screencaps}} {{archive-item|02|Can't find a picture}} {{archive-item|02|Sitenotice on Koenigrules vote}} {{archive-item|02|Battlestarwiki Deutsch}} {{archive-item|02|Main Page Redesign}} {{archive-item|02|Proposed Policies}} {{archive-item|02|Community Portal}} {{archive-item|02|An apology regarding spokesmanship}} {{archive-item|02|User Feedback}} {{archive-item|02|"Battlestar Wiki Friends" section}} {{archive-item|02|What is a policy?}} {{archive-item|02|Binomial nomenclature for ships}} {{archive-item|02|Requested Articles}} {{archive-item|02|"Relationships" Article}}
|}}

== Quorum Definintion ==

This should be for questions only and not ideas. If everything was "moderated" there would be no [[BW:BOLD]] or "Good Faith". This underminds the purpose of implemiting new ideas. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:01, 10 June 2006 (CDT)

:I think the idea is... "being bold" would be coming up with cool new data box/category/what have you that could go on every character page. You'd still "be bold" to go ahead an implement it for one character, to show how it would look. It would be "reckless" to go ahead an implement the new widget on every character page on the wiki without feedback. What happens if you post something here, or on the new widget's talk page, or elsewhere soliciting feedback and you don't get any? (I know that happens sometimes, and it can be frustrating.) Maybe try to actively engage some of the "regulars" on their talk page, inviting them to weigh in on a topic. Is it slower? Most definitely. However, in the process of building consensus you're bringing others "on board", investing them in the project. You'll likely have helping hands for implementing whatever gets sorted out (and it may even be exactly what you proposed). I think the main distinction falls between "implementing" the new ideas (creating the widgets, proposing formatting standards/changes, etc) and doing all the grunt work to make them happen. Energetic and active posters are vital to the health of the wiki. We just need to make sure that we use good judgement and establish consensus as to where we direct all that energy and activity. Together our potential is limited only by our imagination (and sometimes by whatever version of Mediawiki we're running). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:13, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

::What SV said. Besides, by alerting others to your idea, you might get some pointers to do it better or improve your idea...and even save a bit of work as the tasks are delegated. Very few articles (or components thereof) in our wiki are sole projects by one contributor. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:19, 12 June 2006 (CDT)

== DVD titles. ==

At the moment the DVD information pages are a little messed up and the content is confusing because they differ from America to Europe but sre still on the same pages in some cases.
Here is a list of all the DVD pages
*[[Miniseries DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 1 DVD]] Covers both the American and European versions on the same page
*[[Season 2.0 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
*[[Season 2 DVD]] Just the Region 1,4 Version for Europe and Australia
*[[Season 2.5 DVD]] Just the Region 1 American version
I think that a new naming convention should be in place. ''Season X DVD (Region #)'' eg ''[[Season 1 DVD (Region 1)]]'' for the American version of the first series DVD's. I think this would save a lot more confusion in the long term as some pages have information on two different sets of DVDs on one page whearas the 2.0, 2.5 and 2 have more specific information which I belive is better.

I therefor propose a new naming convention with linking pages to direct people with one page summarising all the DVD's together.

===Support===
*{{support}}: As explained above --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:25, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Oppose===
*{{oppose}}: No, I think our current DVD's should retain their current names, and a new separate page be made that says "Season 2 DVD (UK version) or something"--->My point being that it's not a widespread enough thing that it justifies giving the other DVD's confusing titles. I mean we've got "Scar" and then "Scar (Raider)" to set the two apart, because that's only 2 things, while there's nothing named just "Resistance" now but "Resistance (episode)", etc. because it's a big change. Long story short, I think we could make a UK DVD page but it's not worth moving around and changing the names on the current ones. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 07:39, 26 June 2006 (CDT)
:The UK version is the same as the Aussie version which is why I suggested putting the regions in brackets instead of (UK) or (US version). The season 1 dvd page is a mess right now --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 07:48, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

===Neutral===

== Archiving the Wikipedian Quorum ==

I think this page could do with a little bit of archiving. Theres a lot of old stuff here thats not relevant anymore and It could do with being a bit smaller to enable more up to date conversations to take place. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 04:31, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Featured Article and Featured Picture ==
We should probably figure out what we want to do as far as identifying a [[BW:FA|featured article]] and [[BW:FP|featured picture]] for July(ish). The picture appears to have a clear favorite, but we could use some more candidates/debate/revision regarding an article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:51, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

== Scifi.com ==

For the record, btw, as many of you may know from the messageboards, I think the Scifi.com is poorly run and (unlike Ron Moore) doesn't really try to "connect with the fans", as they ''claim'' (the messageboards are a laughingstock of poor moderating, the Battlestar website hasn't been updated in a full year, they only post up Ron's blog and podcasts but that's more Ron's doing than theirs...plus Mrs.Ron tells us that Ron has supplied ''several'' new podcasts to them that they simply haven't put up). Anyway, Scifi Weekly on their front page has a "review a website" thing and I mailed in a "Hey, why not review BattlestarWiki?" request. To be honest, I think they would view us as competition with their abortive, and, also pathetically laughable wiki attempt, Scifipedia (I can't even log in). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:03, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:As much as I fear and despise redundancy as a computer scientist, I really don't have a problem with the Scifipedia. One has only to type in a few basic search words (major characters, episode names, etc.) to see that it really isn't trying to compete with a specialized wiki like this one. They have one big summary article about BSG, and that's about it. I don't view it so much as a rivalry as an entity with an entirely different mission. They're trying to cover a much broader spectrum by covering "Scifi"... especially since that now apparently includes the world of professional wrestling. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:08, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Oh no I don't view them as a rival: I'd like it if they were up and running as a succesful wiki. The reason for my contempt is that the clowns at Scifi.com don't run it well and it's loaded with technical problems. Basically I couldn't log in (they have many log in problems) and their "response" was "well, if you want we could delete your current account"...um, I'm not giving up an over 4,000 post screename for that, and it wasn't much of a "solution". Only the latest in a long string of frustrations--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::My fear is that the "clowns" are just barely plural. What if the only people running the site are Admin and the much maligned Admin1. Maybe Scifi just underestimates how much manpower it takes to maintain an online presence in this day and age. I'd prefer to imagine their problems as being caused by massing staffing/funding shortages. I guess I just don't want to believe that a properly funded and staffed web team could run a site so poorly. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:16, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::Some people have said there's a marked difference between "Admin" and "Admin1", and alothough I realize that they are 2 separate people, I've not noticed a difference; there is?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 13:37, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::I've not had interactions with either, so I can't testify one way or the other. However the ip of "Admin" seems based out of NYC, while "Admin1" appears to hail from Seattle (I realize proxies can fool this, but most people don't bother). Also, the "note from the admin" (excerpted below) says you can pm either of them. They've just never seemed... responsive or communicative, which has really damaged the situation. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::"The Battlestar BBoard will be monitored by site administrators throughout the day. If you see a post that you feel violates the rules above, send a private message to "admin" or "admin1" and it will be reviewed. Our decisions regarding what constitutes a violation will be subjective, and will err on the side of free and open discussion, but we will not tolerate openly hostile or abusive behavior.

:::::As always, if you have any suggestions for how we can improve our message boards, we'd love to hear them. E-mail us directly at bboard@www.scifi.com."

:::::: Is that really what it says? "bboard@www.scifi.com"? That's... I mean--That doesn't look like a valid email address to ''me''. Now, granted, I'm not a piece of email-related software, so I could be wrong, but I've never see "www" in an email addy before. Weird. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:12, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I just copy and pasted. But yeah, that struck me as odd as well. Maybe "Admin" (who is the one that made that post) isn't that web-savvy.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:36, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::That email address is the default email address for any "webserver" running aphace webserver. It's sad. That email address gets not only reports from errors produced, but any error that occurs on the system. ''Maybe'' we should take advantage of the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Main_Page#If_there_was... situation]? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:44, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::::::::I'm not about to be run off of Skiffy just because of incompetant Administrators. The answer to trolls attacking you is ''never'' to simply ignore them: tell that to Czechoslovakia circa 1939. Not reacting to trolls, not punishing them, simply emboldens them. The answer is to fight back: get Moderators to step in, and if a website doesn't have Moderators, demand that Moderators get appointed until they are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 14:49, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::::::I seen that request on SciFi and it doesn't seem to be working, yet you all stay anyway. At least with a forum that we, as regular wiki users, could easily manage 1000 to 2000 users on a forum that we ran our selfs with rules that are more enforceable because it's user run. You arn't going to get it on SciFi.com unless they are willing to hire (paid employees) because it's a company website. I have yet to see any comapny allow any "user" run moderator on their "company" forums. Ok.. off for a a haircut. I'll be back. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 15:00, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::::If I wanted to use a "safe" BSG forum I could simply go to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5. What I want is Scifi.com: that's where Ron and Mrs.Ron are. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:02, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

:::::Merv, would you like to see an "active" use of the forums on how they can be setup? I would tell you think link, but I need assurance that the link not be given out to the public. I would send the link to you via email. Staying where Ron and Mrs. Ron are fine if you stay in contact with them to ask them questions. I am just offering another alternative to Ragnar Anchorage or HangarDeck5 or even SciFi.com "general" discussion. I would like our forum idea not to be dismissed based on the fact that it would be a startup. Being a webmaster and former server administrator I seen sites jump in activity just because of forums. Wouldn't that be nice? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:57, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::If we are to entertain an idea of setting up a forum, it should be different from Battlestar Wiki, period. I wouldn't mind helping set something up with Shane, but the forum and the Wiki must be two distinct, individual entities, seeing as they have mutually exclusive objectives. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

Maybe we should move the above discussion to the Quorum, since it's more general in nature (and really hasn't involved Spence at all)?--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:07, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
:Done.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:14, 13 July 2006 (CDT)
::Shouldnt the discussion about a forum go on the [[BW:TANK|Think Tank]]? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:30, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::I'm just discussing the general inadequacies of Skiffy here. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 09:22, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::Oh right. I dont use skiffy anymore. Not since they cancelled Invisible Man and havnt even been bothered to release it on DVD. Any questiones asked about it are deleted/ignored. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:34, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::To my knowledge, they released the first season of the Invisible Man on DVD in Region 2 almost two years ago, IIRC. (It, too, pisses me off that they can release crap shows on DVD, yet not release something of qualify such as IMan. Then again, there was a battle just to get ''MacGyver'' released on DVD, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised...) However, I fully agree with your sentiment, Mercifull. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:15, 14 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::I actually have the first season on DVD. Its rare to find, even in the UK. Id love to get the second series but it doesnt look like sci fi are in a hurry to please its "customers". I could go onto ebay and get a dodgy dvd from someone but it would never been the same quality as the real thing. Plus it would go againsy my stance of only having [http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/Mercifull real copies of films] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:02, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Were is the {{tl|rolleyes}} template when needed... :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 03:25, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::::::::http://www.darkwebz.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:38, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
:::::::::geek++ :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 04:24, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

== Seaon Three Teaser Images and other artwork? ==

I don't see any images for the Season Three article. I have a whole stack of screen caps made from a relatively high-resolution version of the teaser (I think it was the largest version that got uploaded to the net). Would these be useful and/or wanted?

On a related note, could someone take a look at my user talk page and check my art links. Is there anything there in the sample artwork I've got uploaded on my website right now that would be useful for the wiki? I've actually got quite a bit more, but most of it was for building reproduction props (engraving on Adama's lighter, the Galactica press passes, the two booze bottle labels I have links to). The only other thing from my drawings that I think might be useful for the wiki might be the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Blasphemy/SP/CubitCollection.html Cubit Collection]. Keep in mind that the only designs we have positive screen caps of are Caprican and Scorpian marked cubits (both silver and gold). It appears at is point that the obverse design is either the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/PhoenixSealLo.gif Pheonix seal] or a variant of the [http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/CouncilSealLo.gif Council seal].

I also have a scan of the photo that's hanging in the Pilots' Ready Room, the attack on Aerelon: 
[http://www.retro.com/employees/lee/Art/BSG/Aerelon.jpg]

[[User:Scotchfairy|Scotchfairy]] 07:47, 31 July 2006 (CDT)

== Question/idea ==

I'm toying an idea for some articles for the wiki.

Now, by "toying", I mean I'm incredibly busy and have other things to do but it's a topic of interest to me, which I may or may not ever get around to actually doing even if people wanted me to. I just want to be clear about that.

The premise of the show is genocide and the effects of it on the featured characters. I happen to have some expertise in the field of trauma (Ph.D. holding, licensed mental health professional with peer reviewed publications and about 15 years professional experience working with traumtized adolescents and adults.) I've been thinking about whether some historical articles on genocide, some pieces on the known psychological effects of genocide and the effects of major disasters would round out some of the more fictional aspects of the show. Given how Kara has been portrayed as the adult survivor of child abuse, maybe a piece on the effects of that would be in order.

This stuff would just be a way of rounding out the fictional elements with some factual pieces related to the series.

I'm not thinking dense academic tracts, but reader friendly overviews with appropriate academic citations.

Of course, I'm not even going to waste my time if there's no interest, which is why I'm throwing it out there.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 06:27, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

:Hmmm...well if you want to do something about talking about how the show accurately portrays Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, etc., I would suggest putting it in [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]; that might be a good spot. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 08:20, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

::I would want to be neutral regarding "accurate portrayal" in the show. The shows fiction, so it's not going to be totally accurate, which is fine. I'm thinking of the casual reader who wants to know more about whats known about reactions to catastrophies and such. It would be more along the lines of the physics of star trek, where the story becomes a point of departure for giving information about real life stuff.
--[[User:Cranky1c|Cranky1c]] 08:35, 5 August 2006 (CDT)

== Template: Episode Data ==

We use thie template alot, but when I look through, I notice that there is alot of extra stuff that we are putting in to make it harder for ourselfs to remember. I come up with a new format here: [[Template talk:Episode Data/Example Syntax]] - This would show you what you would enter to format an Episode.

Would like you to comment on [[Template talk:Episode Data]] page. The example "code" to be used is also on the page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:14, 6 August 2006 (CDT)

== The Hangerbay Comes to Life ==

The hangerbay has some new life in it. I have gotten images to work so that you can see it with images instead of nothing. The three most complete pages that are ont he hnagerbay are:

* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Main Page
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/Anastasia_Dualla
* http://www.battlestarwiki.org/hangarbay/index.php/33

Discuss the new look and colors on the [[BW:TANK]] page. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 21:20, 6 August 2006 (CDT)
==Wormholes==
There are a few instances where its been suggested colonial FTLs use worm holes to travel, could someone point me to the ep where this was mentioned because i dont think theyve said they do use worm holes.
Also maybe they have to close the "doors" so the inertia doesnt chuck the vipers out the back ;)? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 06:58, 13 August 2006 (CDT)

== DragonCon, Anyone? ==

I'll be attending '''DragonCon 2006''' this year in Atlanta. For those not in the know, DC is one of the largest SF cons in the country, with over 20,000 attendees. If you're attending this year, drop me a quick note here on my talk page or here, and what you'll be wearing if you happen to dig doing the costume thing. I may not make it to the first BSG forum, but you be assured that my face will be in others. Use my talk page pictures to find me. How many other black, bald men are you going to find in Atl...oh...wait... --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:37, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

== Image Taging! ==

After two days of work, image tagging is now working once more. Be sure to read the image templates on how to use them. Contact me on my user page for any question on how to use them! Remember... you have to change tme on the "[[:md:Main Page|Media Wiki]]". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:01, 24 August 2006 (CDT)

== [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] ==
Hello, I wanted to copy this [[Portal:Cylons/Current Cylon agents]] to the german page. But there seems to be a bug. If I watch it alone, everything is O.K. But as soon as I watch it in [[Portal:Cylons]] the pictures are at the wrong place. Is this only to my browser or can anyone confirm this? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:03, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:This happens in the english version as well as in the german. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:53, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Is this project an official Wikimedia project? ==
From here I can link to Wikipedia without using a weblink, but using simply [[Wikipedia:...]]. Does that mean, that this project is an offical Wikimedia project? If not, how is the real relationship? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:15, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:No its not a Wikimedia project but the Battlestar Wiki has enabled [[:Wikipedia:InterWiki|Interwiki]] links along with many other popular wikis so that we can easily and seemlessly go from one place to another. You can see a full list of Wkis to link to [http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Interwiki_map here] --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Only the ones in [[BW:INTER]] work. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:23, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Are you sure... ;) Try a few --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:40, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Pretty sure. :) /me goes to the database.. only 6 entries. looks like the same on [[BW:INTER]]. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Well it appears that they have all been removed then. I will add some wikis we should interlink to shortly. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:52, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Photo of human cylons of Galactica 1980 ==
Hello, does anybody have Photos of the human cylons of Galactica 1980? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:57, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
: If I recall correctly, there was only the one, [[Andromus]], and a picture of him ([[:Image:Andromus.jpg|Image:Andromus.jpg]]) is on that page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:14, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Wasn't there two? A man and a woman. And O'm sure i've seen a picture of them in a car together. Could be wrong mind, memory isnt what it used to be hehe --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:06, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Again, it's been years (thankfully) since I've watched the 1980 episodes. All I remember is Wolfman Jack, a microwave, and a bunch of Cylons busting some party. And even this is something I am attempting to remove from my long-term memory. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:22, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::: Don't forget the [[Quotes:08 31 | meatballs]]! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:30, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::That quote contains possibly some of the worst script EVER! --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 16:39, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Thanks for the photo, Joe. :o) Definitly there were three male humanoid aliens. The first indeed was Wolfman Jack ;o), the father of all DJs. And the other both were male humanoid cylons beside three centourios aboard an spatial. Thus the idea of human cylons is NOT!! an idea of the new Battlestar Galactica. But only one of the human and one of the centourios were alive the crashdown and later sitting in the car. Bye the way: Does anybody know the weight of a classic centourios? ;o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 17:50, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::I remember that my family was rolling on the floor laughing, when the spatial was going to crashdown on the earth. One of the two humanoid cylons stated: "Chance to be alive: humanoids about 60% .... centourios about 12%. Then the three centourios turned her "face" back to the humanoids = camera and looked a sight and sorrowful. Although this is more than 20 years ago, I never forget this sight to behold. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 02:07, 4 September 2006 (CDT)

:I've got all 10 hours worth of Galactica 1980 on my Tivo box (though I may have to build a Ghostbusters-style containment unit around that part of the hard drive to hold it). As soon as I upgrade my tivo's wireless adapter to a supported one (so that the Tivo won't reboot whenever I try to transfer shows) I hope to get some more screenshots for 1980. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:17, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

== Sandbox ==
O.K. Don't bite the newbee. ;o) I do not know, what a sandbox is in german. Could someone explane this term? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:05, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
:Sandbox is just a place to trest stuff out without having to worry about creating antoher page or messing up an live article. :) I have no idea on the translation of sandbox. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:19, 3 September 2006 (CDT)
::Aaaah! In german it is "[[wikipedia:de:wikipedia:Spielwiese]]" = "playground". Its the same as the test sides in my account. Thanks for explaning. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 18:42, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

Hot Topic now has Battlestar t-shirts. One has the seal of the "Vigilantes" squadron, and the other says "What the Frak?" with a Colonial emblem on the back. Do we want to add them to the merch section? Here's a link: [http://search.hottopic.com/search?p=Q&ts=custom&lbc=hottopic&w=battlestar Hot Topic Battlestar Galactica Shirts]--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 10:32, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm not sure if these are officially licensed products based on that link. Thanks to places like CafePress, creating stuff like this with trademarked logos without official licensing is too easy. I'd prefer that we not add this one as I cannot yet find an ''official'' product that comes close. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:02, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::To be honest, I don't think they are officially licensed. I'd rather not link them unless we have definitive proof that they are. Thoughts? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 16:20, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

:::I agree. Too iffy. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:37, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Concur. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:42, 11 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I don't care if they aren't officially licensed, I want one of those "What the frak?" shirts. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:43, 12 September 2006 (CDT)

There are also these shirts at the SciFi.com store, which I would assume are official. Should we add those to the merch? [http://www.nbcuniversalstore.com/index.php?v=nbuscinowbst&SESSID=71f3df2f2afdbce1063221a2b036318e Battlestar Merch at the SciFi.com Store]
--[[User:Thetruthseeker|Thetruthseeker]] 09:52, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
: The shirts from NBC-UNI are fine. We should probably create an article for them, something along the lines of [[Officially licensed t-shirts]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 11:40, 13 September 2006 (CDT)
::Raise your hand if you just put in an order for a "Frak Off" shirt! *raises hand* --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:45, 13 September 2006 (CDT)

== Do you see the ball? ==

The first time, Apollo landed on Galactica in the miniseries, he was asked: "Do you see the ball?". I never understood, what this "ball" is. Does anybody know? -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 22:26, 11 September 2006 (CDT)
:Naval aviation terminology.
:[http://forums.xbox.com/5290851/ShowPost.aspx Xbox forum thread]
:''"Call the ball" has to do with the glideslope you need to be on to land the plane on the carrier. There is a system on the left side of the carrier called an Optical Landing System and it shines lights to let the pilot know where he is in relation to the deck, also known as a "Meatball" because of the circle shaped and red lights. It works with the same idea as the crosshair on your HUD. So the carrier is just telling the pilot to confirm that he can see the lighting for the glideslope. Then, the pilot (if he see's it) will then say "I have the ball".''
:Terrestrial-based aviation also uses glideslope (VASI, etc.) but they don't look like a ball. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:21, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Or.. "[[wikipedia:Meatball#Cultural reference|Meatball]]" is another term used be the USN. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::And I think you see Galactica's "ball" when Kat lands during Final Cut. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 07:42, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::::PS: It's:

''"Viper four-five-zero, this is Galactica. Approach port landing bay, hands-on, speed one-zero-five. Checkers red, '''call the ball'''."''

--[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:48, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Request from FrakParty.com ==

http://frakparty.com/images/header.jpg

Hi folks! We are in awe of all that you've accomplished here.

We (a few friends and I) just launched [http://frakparty.com FrakParty.com]. We whipped it up as an afterhours project - would've liked to have had it done sooner, but so it goes.

This is a site to allow BSG fans to organize viewing parties. The idea is for people to invite their friends, but also to be able to meet other fans in their area. We're hoping that people will also arrange viewings in public places with big screens - bars, even theaters, etc...

Is there any where appropriate in the wiki to let people know about FrakParty? This is a non-commercial site just put up as a service for fans.

-Zack

: Awesome. Perhaps the [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Community_Portal/Fan_Sites&action=edit Community Portal Link Area]? Otherwise, the Quorum (where you currently have it) is a pretty good start. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:11, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::Love the hats, especially how Adama got the King hat and Six got the tiara. :) It's an intriguing idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:56, 15 September 2006 (CDT)

::: RDM mentioned Frak Party in his latest blog. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 19:27, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Copyright violations BY Wikipedia?! ==

I was scanning the various BSG articles on Wikipedia when I realized many articles there have directly lifted from Battlestar Wiki. We could consider this a form of flattery, or ask them to rewrite their own since our CC license isn't compatible with their GDFL license--or is it true in the reverse?

In any case, I marked their [[Wikipedia:Battlestar|Battlestar]] article as a copyvio as it's almost a direct lift from [[Galactica type battlestar]]. What's to be done, or does anything really need to be done? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 22:58, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:You are correct that the GFDL doesn't allow the inclusion of CC-BY-NC-SA content, and thus shouldn't be using our content. From a practical standpoint, however, I'm not particularly interested in pressing the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:14, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:You'll actually find that the [[Battlestar]] article does have some content which has been lifted from BSGWiki, however the majority is unrelated, i've removed the violation text while i rewrite it. I notice in the history youa re the primary contrib to the article for the RDM Galactica, If you wish you ould dual license your text under the GFDL allowing Wikipedia to reproduce any text you created. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:41, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

==Template works in Wikipedia, but not in Battlestar Wiki ... Why?==
Hello, "Template" means in German "Vorlage". I have a "Vorlage" on my Wikipedia User Page [[:wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. It is an episode list of one season, which can be expanded to all seasons and collapsed back. I think, it is clear, where its good for. I have copied this "Vorlage" to my Battlestar Wiki account [[:de:Benutzer:Tirkon/Test]]. But there the expanding and colapsing does not work. Does anybody know, why? Thank you for an answer. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 19:23, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:When importing templates from Wikipedia, one has to remember that there is a considerably foundation that many Wikipedia templates take advantage of. You'd not only have to copy over the code of the Navigation List, but also all the templates included in it, and all the templates that those templates include (and so on). Which is not to say that it is impossible, just sometimes tedious and time consuming. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::There is another "Vorlage" = template, which was included in Wikipedia. I have also copied this [[:de:Vorlage:EpisodeExpand]]. Could it be, that there are other templates in Wikipedia, which are needed but not visible in the text of the template? Sorry for silly questions, but I never before established templates. And I cannot ask in Wikipedia, because it is no problem there. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:40, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Shane will probably be able to respond more precisely once he comes online. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:49, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Thanks, the edit side of the included template in Wikipedia does not show any included templates. see here: [http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vorlage:Navigationsleiste&action=edit], They are normally mentioned under the edit-box. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 06:57, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, what I was mistaking for inclusions were actually parameters (with three brackets). It may be a CSS issue, with all the different classes being used (NavFrame,NavHead,NavContent and NavEnd), which is REALLY Shane territory. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:06, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Simple Answer, interactive java is disabled for now until 1.8. I'll revisit adding this then, but likly this will not be installed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:18, 29 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::: Thank you for your answers. Pity, it would also be a good solution for spoiltext, if it could be configurated that way, that it is always closed, if any page is opened. It could also hide pictures and wikilinks, which is a problem at present. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 13:12, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

==Standards and Conventions Adjustments==

Please visit [[Battlestar Wiki talk:Standards and Conventions]] to comment on film, TV and other citation formatting guidelines suggested for inclusion to the wiki policy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

==Fanwanking==

Seriously thinking about writing our own "essay" about it and why it should be avoid at all cost at Battlestar Wiki. Just something that can be referenced internally. Thoughts? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:46, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
: Good idea. Once you're done, dunk it in the Tank. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:39, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:By all means. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:16, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:Huh? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:11, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:: [[w:Fanwank|Here is what Frankie's referring to.]] -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:15, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::Oh, thanks Joe! And yeah, good idea Frankie. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:31, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
::::You're very welcome. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 22:38, 1 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Here's what I have so far [[User:Gougef/Fanwanking]]. I know it's "harsh." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:09, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Looks great so far, actually. I want to crosslink with this and the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad]] subsection on derived content to warn people not to confuse that with fanwankery, which is wholly unsubstantiated. I'll add a bit for that.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:46, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::It's going a little far to say that fanwaking is completely forbidden. A certain amount of speculation is appropriate (take, for example, [[Articles of Colonization]] - the simplest explanation would be that the producers messed up referred to article 21 instead of 23 by mistake. However, the situation was different enough that Tyrol could plausibly have been invoking different rights in each case). It only becomes problematic when we concoct patently inplausible scenarios to excuse what are obviously production errors. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:28, 2 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::::Want me to put it in the tink tank has a mutual proposal to be worked on? As a recovering fanwanker ;), I know I was probably being too harsh. Thanks for the great ideas. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:40, 2 October 2006 (CDT)

== Wiki up again ==

Just to let everyone know, the Wiki is up again. Basically had to restart the server since there was an error in MySQL; I don't know what exactly cause it, as of yet. If there are any other problems that may arise, please let me know. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:03, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

== Science in the Re-imagined Series Reorganization ==

Please see the [[Talk:Science in the Re-imagined Series]] article for information and to add your comments on a major reorganization planned by me for these article and various articles. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Scifipedia ==

It seems Sci Fi has set up their own wiki, and looking through there I saw some articles which were, while not text-for-text copies, strongly influenced by our setup here. Is this a problem, or can we just let it pass by? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:47, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:Which articles? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:53, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::[[Scifipedia:Aaron Douglas|Aaron Douglas]], for one. Let me find a few more. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:57, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::[[Scifipedia:Katee Sackhoff|Katee Sackhoff]] is eerily similar to ours, as well. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:00, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, at first, I was going to say they probably just used an appropriate license, but [[Scifipedia:SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use|SCIFIPEDIA:Terms of Use]] definitely means they don't. This is a problem, as the content there clearly infringes. The same user originated both of the example articles, and they show clear similarity in a way suggesting an attempt to disguise the copying or a very poor effort to paraphase. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Let's have Joe notified on this. They (in proxy) own the rights to talk about the show, but not to copy from other wikis if they are going to respect the MediaWiki process and the licensing. Oh, this isn't new: Wikipedia contributors have greatly boosted many articles from us as well. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:26, 18 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Yeah, I know it's not new, but I figured it should be brought up. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 17:21, 18 October 2006 (CDT)

== german Battlestar Wiki ==
Again german Battlestar Wiki was the first, who aired a german description of the new episode [[Exodus, Part II]]. Thank you to all of you, who aired the english description very fast and made this translation possible. :o) -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 14:30, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

Sharon Agathon

2006-10-19T19:50:12Z

Tirkon: german Link

:''This article concerns a copy of [[Cylon agent]] Number Eight, first seen on [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Caprica]], who marries [[Karl Agathon|Helo]] and becomes pregnant. For information on Sharon "Boomer" Valerii first seen on "[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]," the lover of [[Galen Tyrol]], see [[Sharon Valerii (Galactica copy)]]. For general information about these Cylon copies, see [[Number Eight]].''

{{Character Data|
|photo=CapShar.jpg
|age=
|colony=
|birthname=
|servicen=
|callsign=
|seen= 33
|death=
|parents=
|siblings=
|children= [[Hera]] (Human-Cylon hybrid)
|marital status= Married to [[Karl Agathon]].
|role= Colonial Officer on ''Galactica''.
|rank= Lieutenant
|actor= [[Grace Park]]
|cylon= y
|name=
}}

== Biography ==
When [[Karl Agathon|Helo]] is left on [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Caprica]], the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons]] use him in an elaborate experiment. Key to this experiment is another copy of Valerii, with copies of [[Aaron Doral]] and [[Number Six|Six]] acting as overseers for the experiment. This second Valerii "rescues" Helo from capture by [[Number Six|Six]] and [[Cylon Centurion]]s. Unaware of Valerii's true nature, Helo genuinely believes this Valerii copy to be the "Boomer" he knows from ''Galactica'', returning to rescue him. Following his rescue, Valerii leads Helo to "her" [[Raptor]], now surrounded by several [[Cylon Centurion]]s, convincing him that they have no direct way off of the planet ([[Water]]).

After receiving a "Colonial signal" on a radio receiver they carry, Valerii leads Helo to a city where they find a fully-equipped "fallout shelter" in which two people can live in reasonable security, hidden from above-ground Cylon operations, and with sufficient supplies to last a considerable period of time ([[Act of Contrition]]).

=== The Experiment ===

The purpose in establishing this "nest" is to elicit an emotional response in Helo towards Valerii. When this fails, as Helo continues to seek a way off Caprica, the Cylons arrange for Valerii to be "captured", concluding that if Helo does not seek to rescue her, the experiment has failed, and he must be killed ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]).

Helo does indeed "rescue" Valerii. Helo has always been fond of Valerii; his long-time affection for her (stilled by "her" relationship with [[Galen Tyrol]]) arises within him from the dramatic rescue, which leads to Helo and Valerii having sex ([[Six Degrees of Separation]]). Valerii later reports this achievement to Doral and Six. A new hideout, a cabin in the woods, is being constructed for Helo and Valerii. She is instructed to lead him there and have him stay with her - or kill him if he attempts to leave ([[Flesh and Bone]]).

But Valerii's human emotions begin to question the Cylon's overall goal. Realizing that she has herself fallen in love with Helo, Valerii disobeys her instructions and attempts to lead Helo to [[Delphi]], where they hope to steal a vehicle and get off the planet ([[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]). On the way to the spaceport, Valerii shows signs of being pregnant: she succumbs to a bout of morning sickness ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]]) and develops a ravenous appetite ([[Colonial Day]]).

=== Helo's Discovery ===
[[Image:Boomerhelokara.jpg|225px|Helo attempts to stop Kara from shooting Sharon, in the Delphi Museum.|thumb]]
On reaching Delphi, Valerii and Helo break into the Cylon facilities to reach the spaceport. When Helo encounters yet another copy of Valerii, he draws the initial conclusion that she is a human clone created by the Cylons, and goes on the run alone ([[Colonial Day]]). When Valerii catches up with him, her emotional condition is so confused that she challenges him to shoot her ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]]). Helo can only bring himself to wound her, and takes her with him to use her to somehow get off Caprica. While Helo keeps her at gunpoint, Valerii leads him to the [[Delphi Museum]]. Waiting out a storm in a nearby ruined building, Valerii tells Helo that her love for him is real and that she is pregnant with his child.

When she and Helo come across [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]], who lands near the museum to retrieve the [[Arrow of Apollo]], Thrace realizes on-sight that this Valerii is a Cylon (having left [[Sharon Valerii (Galactica copy)|"Boomer" Valerii]] behind with the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]]) and attempts to shoot her. Helo stops Thrace and reveals to her that Valerii is pregnant ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]). Starbuck, like Helo, also wrongly concludes that Caprica-Valerii must be a Cylon copy of the "real" Sharon Valerii on ''Galactica''. Valerii tries to convince her that she and "Boomer" Valerii are both Cylons but also just as "real" as the other. Valerii attempts to prove this by recollecting the first time she and Starbuck met, to no avail.

=== Valerii and The Resistance ===

While Thrace and Helo argue over Valerii, the confused and frightened Cylon escapes in Thrace's Cylon Raider to save herself and the life of her unborn child ([[Scattered]]). After tracking them for several days, Valerii returns to Helo and a human [[Caprica Resistance|resistance movement]] that had formed on Caprica. She offers her aid in finding the missing Thrace ([[The Farm]]).

After Thrace escapes to the outside of the hospital where she was imprisoned, Valerii arrives at the rescue scene in a stolen [[Heavy Raider]] and destroys several Centurions that attack the Resistance rescue party. Convinced that Helo's Valerii copy can be sufficiently trusted, or at least give useful information on Cylon activity, the humans allow Valerii to accompany them as they fly the Heavy Raider back to [[The Fleet (RDM)|the Fleet]].

When Valerii walks aboard the ''[[Astral Queen]]'', [[Lee Adama]] reacts violently. The son of Commander [[William Adama|Adama]] (shot by the sleeper Cylon agent "Boomer" Valerii) grabs this second Valerii and places his gun to her head. Helo draws his sidearm against Adama, forcing a standoff, but President Roslin urges both men enough to withdraw their weapons, and orders Valerii to be ejected out the airlock. Valerii pleads for her life, telling Roslin she knows the precise location of the [[Laura Roslin faction|faction's]] objective: The [[Tomb of Athena]]. Roslin reconsiders and places Valerii in the brig. Roslin later confirms that the Cylon is actually working on their side because Valerii wants her child and Helo to remain safe from what Roslin interprets as a mothering instinct.
[[image:sharonhome.jpg|235px|Sharon on Kobol, with Helo, Elosha, and Roslin.|thumb]]
Valerii accompanies Roslin's party to [[Kobol]]. Valerii recites the specific passages of the Tomb in the scriptures of the [[Sacred Scrolls]] and plots the group's path along a ridge nearby. As priestess [[Elosha]] examines a gravestone marker along the ancient trail, the handcuffed Valerii senses danger but is too late to warn anyone; two "[[Wikipedia:S-mine|Bouncing Betty]]"-style antipersonnel mines detonate, killing Elosha. At the same instant, a group of Centurions open fire. As others hide or return fire, Valerii vaults away, with Lee Adama in pursuit, believing she is trying to escape. Valerii scoops up a grenade launcher lying ahead, and just as Lee Adama thinks she is about to shoot him, she aims for the last Centurion and destroys it ([[Home, Part I]]). At camp, Adama and Thrace are perplexed that Helo still loves Valerii, despite his awareness of her true nature as a Cylon.

During the trek, Valerii casually tells Helo that their child is a girl. Not long after, Commander Adama's search party arrives at Roslin's camp. The warm reunion of the two leaders and family is interrupted when Adama sees this second copy of Sharon Valerii. Reacting as his son did, Commander Adama immediately tries to choke her to death. He releases her after experiencing terrible chest pains (probably the result of his recent surgery, or from anxiety), as she says "And you asked 'why'?" (mysteriously referencing what Commander Adama said over the dead body of "Boomer" Valerii).

[[Tom Zarek]]'s follower, [[Meier]], tries to convince Valerii to help him kill both Adamas as part of a power play by Zarek. Valerii believed her ''Galactica'' counterpart was being held in the [[brig]], but Meier informs her that she was killed. She expresses her outrage to Helo that [[Cally]] killed Boomer, receiving only a minor punishment. Valerii deduces that the Colonials don't see humanoid Cylons are people; she is a thing they may destroy once they no longer need her. Valerii appears to take up Meier's proposal to kill Commander Adama and Lee Adama, but after they all draw their weapons, she shoots Meier instead, saving the lives of both Adamas. She announces to Commander Adama that she is not the same Sharon Valerii that shot him, and that she is not a sleeper agent with hidden protocols waiting to activate; she makes her own choices. She surrenders the weapon to Commander Adama, to everyone's surprise.

=== The Cooperative Cylon ===

Subsequently, Valerii is brought aboard battlestar ''[[Galactica]]'' and imprisoned in a new reinforced cell designed to incarcerate "Boomer." The virtual [[Number Six]] tells Dr. Baltar that Valerii's baby will be born in that cell. Number Six considers Valerii's and Helo's biological child to be hers; she says that she will be its "mother" and Baltar will be its "father" ([[Home, Part II]]).

While in her cell, Valerii nearly has a miscarriage, and is rushed to [[Sickbay]] where Dr. [[Cottle]] succeeds in saving the fetus. [[D'anna Biers]], a reporter for the [[Fleet News Service]], stumbles upon Valerii while filming her documentary in Sickbay. Biers threatens to expose that Commander Adama is harboring a Cylon aboard ''Galactica'', but he confiscates what he believed was Biers' tape of Valerii. In reality, Biers secretly switches tapes and keeps the real one. This critical information was not broadcast in the final cut of her documentary distributed to the Fleet, but it was broadcast back to other Cylons on Caprica (by way of two Raiders that attack ''Galactica'' in order to get within transmission range). The Cylons on Caprica (including another copy of Biers and yet another Valerii copy) are surprised yet overjoyed that Helo's Valerii is still alive (they are apparently unaware that she had survived). They are incredibly concerned that her hybrid child survives, saying that it must be protected at all costs ([[Final Cut]]).

[[Image:Valerii_virus.jpg|thumb|left|Valerii in trance while disabling the Cylon logic bomb]]

When ''Galactica'' experiences mysterious computer failures and system malfunctions from a mutated version of a Cylon virus [[Valley of Darkness|thought eradicated]], Commander Adama orders Helo to show the incarcerated Valerii the strange Cylon code. Valerii identifies it as a very virulent [[Logic bomb]] that will take control of the ship and kill off the crew without her help. Reluctantly, on advice from President Roslin, Commander Adama brings Valerii to [[CIC]], where Valerii cuts her arm open and connects her body to a fiber optic line to communicate with ''Galactica's'' mainframe [[Computers|computer]] and communication channels. The process is painful both to Valerii and to the crew watching the spectacle. With Valerii now with access, she takes into her a portion of the logic bomb code, then instructs Lieutenant [[Felix Gaeta|Gaeta]] to wipe the hard drives of the system computers to erase all Cylon virus traces for good. ''Galactica'' is a sitting duck to a massive Cylon fighter force on the outskirts of [[DRADIS]] range while Valerii makes adjustments to the code. She resends the code out on the communication channels to the Cylon fleet. In a reversal of the events suffered by the Colonials in the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies|holocaust]], every Cylon fighter loses power and weapons. Adama's Vipers have a [[Great Cylon Turkey Shoot|free-for-all shooting]], destroying every Cylon fighter without a single Colonial casualty ([[Flight of the Phoenix]]).

=== The Cylon "Interrogator" ===

After ''Galactica'' reunites with battlestar ''Pegasus'', Admiral [[Helena Cain]] sends Lieutenant [[Alistair Thorne]] to inspect the incarcerated Valerii. He beats and sexually assaults her while his guards watch and hold her. Fortunately for Valerii, both Helo and Tyrol find out about Thorne and what was done to his previous [[Gina|prisoner]] and arrive in time to stop him. Tyrol accidentally kills Thorne in the process. Both he and Helo are arrested by the ''Pegasus'' guards and taken to Cain's battlestar, where Cain hastily convenes courts-martial for the men (without Adama's knowledge) and sentences Agathon and Tyrol to death.

Commander Adama sends a [[Marines|Marine]] force and his Viper squadrons out to retrieve his men. Valerii and all of the fleet await news on the survival of her "past" and current love as a military standoff between the battlestars begins ([[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]).

Valerii's attempted rape by Thorne results in a hairline fracture in one of her ribs and minor bruising. Still in shock for the incident, Commander Adama (who has reached a détenté with Admiral Cain over Helo's execution) personally appologizes to Valerii over the incident ([[Resurrection Ship, Part I]]). This is also the first time that Adama refers to Valerii as a 'her,' as opposed to as an 'it.'

Valerii is happily reunited with Helo and Tyrol when the two are released after Adama resumes full command of the Fleet, though she is more enthusiastic to see Helo than Tyrol. ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]).
[[image:Sharonheloephin.jpg|Sharon becomes distressed upon learning from Helo that ''Galactica's'' crew plans to abort her child.|thumb]]

===The Abortion Question===
Weeks later, President Roslin, on her deathbed, recommends that Valerii's fetus be aborted, fearing dire consequences for the Fleet.

On hearing this news, Helo is terrified, but Valerii, having cooperated fully to aid the Fleet to save herself and her child and to show that not all Cylons are dangerous, is enraged. Marines sent to inspect her and later to take her to [[sickbay]] for the procedure are forced to restrain the angry Cylon.

At the last minute (spurred by threats from his virtual [[Number Six]]), [[Gaius Baltar]] learns of an astonishing ability of the fetal blood of Valerii's baby: it destroys cancer cells. Taking a small blood sample, he injects it into the dying Laura Roslin. Moments later, her cancer is "gone," according to Dr. [[Cottle]]. The abortion procedure is cancelled.

The recovering Roslin visits Valerii in her cell and smiles at the sight of Valerii stroking her belly, just as a human female would ([[Epiphanies]]).

===The Birth===
[[Image:Sharondownloaded.jpg|thumb|Helo comforts Valerii as the doctors start to perform emergency surgery to help her give birth. ]]
Valerii begins to bleed; her placenta is detaching. An emergency [[Wikipedia:Cesarean section|birth procedure]] must to be performed by Dr. [[Cottle]] to save both the baby's and Caprica-Valerii's life. Helo and Valerii name the baby girl [[Hera]] and marvel at her as she lay in an incubator. Some time later, believing their baby is out of danger, the baby apparently dies due to her underdeveloped lungs and Dr. Cottle's failure to intubate her in time. In a state of shock, Valerii nearly strangles Cottle in grief before being subdued, and subsequently falls into a deep depression.

However, unbeknownst to Caprica-Valerii, Hera is still alive. In a move to not have to kill the baby but at the same time not have it raised by Valerii or risk having it captured by unseen Cylon agents, Valerii's baby was switched with another dead child. President [[Laura Roslin|Roslin]], Dr. Cottle and Presidental aide [[Tory Foster]] place Valerii's baby in the care of [[Maya]], a foster mother. Maya is told a cover story that disguises Hera's true identity ([[Downloaded]]).

Valerii's depression over losing her child only worsens. Helo convinces her to aid in the rescue of [[Samuel Anders|Anders]] and the other survivors on Caprica, in part to try and draw her out of her depression. Valerii's knowledge of Cylon FTL technology makes the rescue possible by acting as a conduit between the Colonial Raptors and the far more advanced FTL computer salvaged from a Heavy Raider ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]).

On Caprica, Thrace demonstrates a new level of trust for Valerii by throwing her a gun during a firefight with ambushing Centurions. Later, Valerii is as perplexed as everyone else when the Cylons disengage and apparently leave the planet for good. She ''is'' aware, however, that [[Cavil|Brother Cavil]], a man who approaches the group and loudly proclaims the end of the occupation to be a miracle, is a [[Cylon agent]]. She witholds this information from the others. On ''Galactica'', Cavil is exposed by Chief Tyrol (who realizes that a copy of Cavil was already present in the Fleet). Angered by Valerii's obvious withholding of Cavil's nature, Admiral Adama sends Valerii back to the brig along with Cavil. When asked by a distraught Helo why she didn't report this crucial fact, she replies "They killed my baby. Do you think I care about you, or us, or whether or not Adama trusts me anymore?" Valerii withdraws further, shutting Helo out completely. ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]).

===Trust===
[[Image:Adama_agathon.png|Sharon salutes Admiral Adama before going on her first mission as a Colonial Officer.|thumb]]
Four months after ''Galactica's'' retreat brings many changes. Sharon Agathon (now married to Karl "Helo" Agathon) is still in her special brig, but Admiral Adama has apparently taken to sitting down to tea and talking in confidence with her. Her cell now has a couch, table, and other amenities.

As part of a plan to rescue the people of New Caprica, Admiral Adama decides to commission Agathon into the Colonial Fleet as part of an insertion force that will serve as a liaison with a small weapons cache to aid in the resistance and form a plan. Now a Lieutenant, Agathon leads two Raptors in an intra-atmosphere Jump successfully and meets with [[Samuel Anders]] and his squad. Their planning is interrupted when an unknown number of [[Cylon Centurion]]s fire at the group ([[Precipice]]). Agathon and the Marines assigned to her anticipate such a greeting, thus the Marine contingent is able to neutralize the Cylon attackers.

Upon entering [[New Caprica City]], Agathon carries out her second duty to recover the Launch Keys for the grounded Colonial Ships. During this she encounters [[Number Three]], who tells Agathon that Hera is still alive. Agathon shoots her in the knees, thus disabling her so that she can escape, as she believes that Adama has been truthful about Hera's fate. After this, she asks Galen Tyrol if Hera had truly died and congratulates him on the birth of his son, [[Nicholas Tyrol]] ([[Exodus, Part I]]), also warning him not leave Nicholas alone.

==Notes==
*This Sharon Valerii is still referred to as the Caprica copy, even though she is now aboard ''Galactica'', because she was first encountered on Caprica. She is also sometimes called 'Helo-Sharon' by fans (as opposed to 'Tyrol-Sharon') or simply 'Sharon' (as opposed to 'Boomer', a nickname more commonly associated with Galactica-Sharon; although Baltar once called Caprica-Sharon "Boomer" in [[Home, Part II]], he is the only character to have done so).
*During Season 1, Caprica-Valerii parts her hair on the left side of her head, while "Boomer" Valerii parts her hair to the right.
*The emergency birth surgery performed on Valerii is known on the real-world Earth as a [[Wikipedia:Cesarean section|cesarean section]]. The term is derived from the name of Roman Emperor [[Wikipedia:Julius Caesar|Julius Caesar]], believed to have been birthed by this procedure. This term is not actually used in dialogue, although it is obvious that this procedure is the one in use. If the writers of the episode used the term, an awkwardness would develop, as this would suggest that a parallel of Caesar existed in the history of the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]].

==Questions==
*With Sharon now an official member of the fleet, has she revealed the identities of the other Cylons to Adama?
**{{spoilli|According to interviews with Grace Park, Dean Stockwell, and Tricia Helfer, the remaining Cylons are so secret that even the seven models known to the audience don't know who the last five are. See [[Talk:Precipice]] for more information.}}
**{{spoilli|According to an [http://www.aintitcool.com/node/30381 interview] with Aaron Douglas and Tamoh Penikett, the remaining five models may have all been [[Boxing|boxed]].}}
*Will Sharon decide to use the other Valerii's "Boomer" callsign, or will she obtain a unique one of her own?

{{Characters}}

[[Category:A to Z|Agathon, Sharon]]
[[Category:Characters|Agathon, Sharon]]
[[Category:Characters (RDM)|Agathon, Sharon]]
[[Category:Cylons|Agathon, Sharon)]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)|Agathon, Sharon]]
[[Category:RDM|Agathon, Sharon]]

[[de:Sharon Valerii (Caprica Kopie)]]

Exodus, Part II

2006-10-19T19:23:20Z

Tirkon: German Link

{{spoiler}}

{{Episode Data
| title= Exodus, Part II
| image=TighAdamaReunion.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 4
| guests=
| writer= [[Bradley Thompson]] [[David Weddle]]
| story=
| director= [[Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
| production= 304
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-20
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population= ?
| prev= [[Exodus, Part I]]
| next= [[Collaborators]]
}}

== Overview ==

:''Lee wrestles with his order to protect the civilian fleet as Adama launches his rescue mission. Meanwhile, on New Caprica, Col. Tigh confronts Ellen's betrayal. <ref>[http://www.tvguide.com TVGuide.com]</ref>''

== Summary ==

== Questions ==

== Analysis ==

== Notes ==

* There is also a comic named ''[[Exodus!]]''

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==
*[[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Bradley Thompson]]
[[Category:Episodes written by David Weddle]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
[[Category:RDM]]

[[de:Exodus, Part II]]

Exodus, Part I

2006-10-19T00:52:57Z

Tirkon:

{{Episode Data
| title= Exodus, Part I
| image=Roslinanders-Exodus.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 3
| guests= [[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
| writer= [[Bradley Thompson]] [[David Weddle]]
| story=
| director= [[Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
| production= 303
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-13
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population=
| prev= [[Precipice]]
| next= [[Exodus, Part II]]
| goof=Y
}}

== Overview ==

:''The [[Cylons]] have begun the brutal crackdown on [[New Caprica]]'s [[Resistance]] movement. Tyrol receives disturbing news from a secret source within Baltar's administration while Colonial detainees face a Cylon firing squad on New Caprica. With time running out for the colonists, Admiral Adama will launch his rescue attempt with only the battlestar ''[[Galactica]]'', while his son, Commander [[Lee Adama]], and the battlestar ''[[Pegasus]]'' remain to protect what is left of the human fleet and continue the search for Earth if the rescue fails.''

== Summary ==

*The final moments of "[[Precipice]]" are reshown as the captured detainees are being taken off the trucks. [[Cally Tyrol]] is freed, as the Centurions march up the hill. Tyrol continues to run as gunfire is heard. As the screen goes to black, the words "One Hour Earlier" are displayed.
*[[Galen Tyrol]] is frantically talking with [[Saul Tigh]] about a list of detainees he received from his [[Felix Gaeta|source]], Cally Tyrol is among the listed. Tigh snaps him back to his senses, noting that they can locate the people now that they cracked the Cylons' coordinate system.
*Chief Tyrol immediately gets to work, succesfully calculating the location of the execution, and gathers a team to rescue Cally and the others.
*Tyrol's team, including [[Seelix]], is able to catch up with the Cylons, and get in position as Cally Tyrol starts running. Tyrol rushes out and gets his wife out of the line of fire, as his team takes out the Centurions meant to execute the detainees. Others injured include some members of the [[NCP]] and the [[Cavil]] that accompanies the truck.
*Seelix leaves a wounded Cavil to death. After he downloads into a new body, the Cavil reports that he ended his own life, but is somewhat traumatized from the transfer process.
*At [[Breeders Canyon]], similar to the scene at the [[Pergamus Flats]], a flashback shows how [[marines]] move into position to defend the meeting there against a possible attack.
[[Image:Colonial RPG.jpg|thumb|150px|right|Colonial Marine with an RPG]]
*[[Sharon Agathon]] moves ahead to meet with [[Samuel Anders|Anders]] and the resistance. As Agathon and Anders discuss their plans, the Centurions attack, taking out some of the resistance fighters, but are soon destroyed by a marine RPG.
*After the attack, a map is recovered from one of the [[Cylon agent|'skinjobs']]. Anders recognizes it as the hand-drawn map passed on to [[Ellen Tigh]] to destroy in the heating fire within their tent. Anders immediately suspects Tigh in tipping off the Cylons.
*While sleeping in her bed on ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Number Three]] dreams of a tent near some odd rock edifices. The next image is of her holding [[Hera]]. She wakes up suddenly.
*Also on ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Gaius Baltar]] and [[Caprica-Six]] lie together in bed, but Baltar is fighting with impotence. Six is understanding, but Baltar shrugs off her sympathy.
*[[Kara Thrace]] is showing further affection for [[Kacey]] and apologizes for her getting hurt. [[Leoben Conoy]] watches from the background.
*Distrubed by her dream, [[Three]] visits [[Selloi]], a human [[oracle]] whose tent she saw in her dream, who tells her that [[Hera]] is still alive, but warns that holding the child will undo all that the Cylons have accomplished on the planet.
*On ''[[Galactica]]'', a combined crew of ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'' and ''Galactica'' crews ready for the rescue mission. [[Margaret Edmondson]] conducts a [[Salt Line Ceremony|ceremony]] to bind the people together, given the odds of the mission.
*[[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]] have a farewell of their own when Commander Adama leaves ''Galactica'' for ''Pegasus'', with orders to wait 18 hours for ''Galactica'''s return. Otherwise, ''Pegasus'' must continue the search for Earth with the surviving [[The Fleet (RDM)|members of the Fleet]].
*Three inquires with Dr. [[Cottle]], who is treating a Five wounded by a human attack, about Hera's alleged death.
*[[Laura Roslin]] orders Anders to guard [[Maya]] and [[Hera]] at all costs. He tasks two of his best men to protect her and see to her safe escape.
*Gunnery Sergeant [[Mathias]], the leader of Agathon's Marines, meets with Roslin, [[Tom Zarek]] and the resistance to discuss the rescue plan. She brings weapons for the upcoming fight and learns that the colonists conducted evacuation exercises under the guise of fire drills.
*A [[Cavil]] voices his despair at the continued bloodshed, [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] agrees. Many of the Cylons disagree significantly as to what to do to reestablish control. A [[Number Five]] says that, if the worse comes to worst, that they can just nuke the city.
*Saul Tigh learns of his wife's betrayal and is visibly shocked by it.
*Sharon Agathon heads into the [[New Caprica Detention Center]] and gets the [[launch key]]s for the Colonial ship. Three enters the secured room, immediately recognizes her, stops Agathon and tells her that [[Hera|her daughter]] is alive. Unwilling to consider this matter for now, Agathon shoots the Three in the legs: "Adama wouldn't lie to me."
*''Galactica'' is given word that the launch keys have been retrieved, and after a rousing speech by Admiral Adama, begins preparations for the jump to New Caprica.

== Questions ==

*Roslin and Zarek seem to have reconciled their differences and become friends. Given Saul Tigh's feeling that Roslin will resume the Presidency once humanity has left [[New Caprica]], and that Zarek used to be Baltar's vice president, will he assume the mantle of vice president under Laura Roslin?
**Or, will Zarek claim the presidency by legal succession if Baltar is removed from office?
*A Cavil mentions that he has different sensations after each download. He suffers a slight headache after the first and, after the third, a sensation like a white hot poker inside his skull. Is there damage to the consciousness during each downloading and is there a point where after so many downloads the consciousness is destroyed or corrupted?
**In the podcast for this episode, [[Ronald D. Moore]] reveals that the intent of Cavil's description was to show that there is a "cost" associated with downloading.
***Although [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Cylon Raiders]] are not sentient to same degree as humanoid Cylons, [[Sharon Agathon]] describes a similar traumatizing after repeated deaths of the berserking Raider known as [[Scar (Raider)|Scar]].
*[[Number Three]] had commented in "[[Downloaded]]" on feeling refreshed like starting a new life when describing her download experience. [[Caprica-Six]] expressed adjustment issues, including her [[Cylon-Related Hallucinations|visions]] of Gaius Baltar.
*Are the [[Religion in the Twelve Colonies#The Lords of Kobol|Lords of Kobol]] real? Why are they sending accurate dreams to a Cylon? Why is a human oracle helping Three interpret the dreams?
**The gods are "real," at least as historical entities that lived on Kobol, a fact that even the Cylons acknowledge. The Cylons (and a number of Colonials) dispute their actual divinity. The Colonials appear to have some foresight from the gods through their [[oracle]]s. The connection of the Lords of Kobol to the Cylons is a curious (and unexplained) event in the case of the dreams of Number Three.
*Why does Doctor Cottle work to heal critically injured Cylons instead of just letting them die and be resurrected?
**The Cylons might want to minimize the trauma of downloading into a new body, although comments from Number Three to Cottle dispute this.
**Cottle is a physician, and has likely taken a vocational pledge to aid. Allowing a sentient being to die, regardless of their ideology, is breaching this oath through omission of action. He helped [[Sharon Agathon]] through her pregnancy for similar reasons.
***At least in TV drama, doctors in wartime have an affinity for helping everyone. There are plenty of [[Wikpedia:M*A*S*H (TV series)|M*A*S*H]] episodes that illustrate this.
*Where is "[[Download City]]"?
**It is possible that [[Seelix|Seelix's]] use of the phrase "Download City" is merely a euphemism for the download process the humanoid Cylon models go through.
**Download City may also be a reference to a downloading facility present on New Caprica.
***The Cylons would likely keep such a facility hidden to all humans on the planet, no matter what their relationship is to the Cylon occupation. The destruction by suicide or planted bomb of a download facility on New Caprica would spell real death for all agents there if Basestars aren't actually used for this purpose (this isn't likely, else the [[Resurrection Ship]] would not have been protected ''by'' Basestars).
*Is there any possibility at all that Adama wasn't aware of Roslin's plans for Hera?
**There are no direct indications that Adama is aware of Roslin's conspiracy regarding the baby. Given the positive changes in his relationship with Sharon Agathon, that seems to now be based on complete mutual trust, it is unlikely that he would keep such a profound secret from her, if he was aware of it.
**Additionally, Adama was quite direct with Helo regarding the plans to abort the child. Whatever his relationship with Sharon, it seems unlikely that Adama would rob Helo of his paternal rights in this way, particularly after Helo [[Epiphanies|brings up their respective fatherhood]].
**Dr. Cottle is a military officer and his actions would have to have been cleared through Adama. There may well be other reasons why Agathon wasn't told, including keeping the information from the Cylons in the event she was captured or downloaded.
***In military parlance, the president's authority supersedes that of an admiral, and a military officer does not need to report back to his commanding officer orders that originated from the president.
****However, Adama and Roslin agreed that ''all'' military matters rested with the Admiral, whereas Roslin was the civilian leader of the fleet. It stands to reason that Adama would have known.
*****That unofficial agreement was broken in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]]" and there is no indication that they have restored it.
**The expression on Adama's face during his conversation with Sharon Agathon in "[[Occupation]]" suggests that he is aware of the conspiracy regarding Hera.
***Said expression may also be a reference to his guilt over the whole situation with Sharon Agathon/Boomer/Number Eight in general, and not a specific reference to Hera.
*What other operations are the Cylons busy with elsewhere in the universe, that are straining their resources for their experiment on New Caprica (also referenced to by Ron Moore in his podcast)?
*Will some humans refuse to leave once the escape begins?
*Will the escapees block proven or suspected collaborators from boarding the escaping ships?
**How many, if any, of the New Caprica Police are publically known, and once the escape begins, what will be their ultimate fate?
*Adama's plan to use only ''Galactica'' and the ships remaining on the ground on New Caprica seems a bit unrealistic given the fact that there are over 39,000 colonists on the planet. How will they find room for all of the evacuees?
**It is very reasonable to assume that the carrying capacity of the ships approximates the number of people on the planet, since it is very resource-intensive to move people around in the ''Battlestar Galactica'' universe. The attrition suffered by the Colonials only improves this probability.
**Will the Colonials find time to also evacuate much of their critically-rationed supplies and equipment as well as themselves during the chaos of evacuation?
*Is Maya suspicious about Roslin's protectiveness of her and Isis?
**As mentioned in "[[Downloaded]]", Isis is said to have been a child given up by a senior ranking officer for political reasons. Maya may have been told that Isis, should she be captured, would make for a very valuable kidnapping asset, given her (supposed) parentage.
*What exactly has Caprica-Six given up for Gaius?
**To an extensive degree, Caprica is mistrusted by the other Cylons and while not thought to be a traitor per se, is probably considered a [[Wikipedia:Quisling|Quisling]]. This is what she may have meant.

== Analysis ==
* The [[Number Three]] that has been having dreams about Hera saw [[Sharon Agathon]] and was able to tell that she was the copy that had been left with Helo on Caprica. She may have deduced this from the fact that Sharon was taking the launch keys, or she may have been able to sense her identity somehow.
* Roslin's line about [[Hera]], "She may well be the shape of things to come", echoes similar lines by Six in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]" and by Adama in "[[Valley of Darkness]]". "The Shape of Things to Come" is also the title of the orchestral music piece at the end of "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]".
*Anders seems to know, or at least suspect, what is so special about Maya's child.
*[[Caprica-Six]] has been [[Cylon rebirthing tank|redownloaded]] after her "death" in [[Precipice]]. She was not "boxed".
*The Cylons on New Caprica appear to not have any sort of attachment to the humans they rule as evidenced by their willingness to just nuke the colony if they can't make it work as desired. This conflicts with the decision that their earlier attempt at genocide was a mistake. This is additional evidence of fundamental contradictions and disconnects within the Cylon psyche that they are blind to. Based on their actions to date, skinjob behavior tends toward the sociopathic with the exception of Boomer, Sharon, and Caprica-Six.
*Baltar has become a suicidal drunk - his appearance has become slovenly and he appears to have given up on basic grooming. He is also having trouble performing the act of sex with Caprica-Six.
*The speech Admiral Adama gave to his crew is reminiscent of the choice given to Achilles by his mother before he left for Troy to do war. The option Achilles chose was to go to battle, and in doing so perform feats that allowed his name to live on through history. Adama states that his crew will receive similar immortality for their deeds, showing a common thread between the Colonies and the bronze age Hellenic culture their civilization is based upon.
**Bradley Thompson and David Weddle said that they have hardcover copies of ancient stories, like Homer's Iliad, and deliberately draw inspirations from them.

== Notes ==

* There is also a comic called ''[[Exodus!]]'', which covers the events of [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|the Original Series]]' episode, "[[Saga of a Star World]]" (Part 2).
* This is the first episode where viewers have seen an [[oracle]]. Oracles such as [[Pythia]] and [[Galen Tyrol]]'s mother have been mentioned but not seen.
* Tyrol inexplicably lost his beard before this episode. This was necessary because Aaron Douglas's scenes were shot weeks after the main part of the episode, when he had already shaved and it was felt that a fake beard would not be convincing.
*[[Chamalla]] is a bitter herb, and oracles sometimes use candy to sweeten it up.
*According to [[Ronald Moore]]'s podcast, in earlier drafts [[Jammer]] was going to die during the shootout at the execution site. However, he decided that the character would be used in later episodes of the season.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

*''As Chief Tyrol is about to leave Tigh's tent'':''
:'''Colonel Tigh''': Chief! Pull it together.. You won't do her any good if you get caught too.. Besides, the last thing your son wants is me and Ellen for parents..

*''Before Lee Adama departs ''Galactica'':''
:'''Admiral William Adama''': I'll see you at the rendezvous point.
:'''Commander Lee Adama''': Eighteen hours. Try not to be late.
:'''William Adama''': I'm getting old; I'm a little slow, but I'll be there.
:'''Lee Adama''': Gods, I wish I could talk you out of this...
:'''William Adama''': You can't. You tried.
:'''Lee Adama''': You know, Dad, um...
:'''William Adama''': Don't. Don't make me cry on my own hangar deck.

*''During the [[Salt Line Ceremony]] on the hangar deck:''
:'''Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson''': Their enemies will divide them, their colonies broken in the fiery chasm of space. The shining days renounced by a multitude of dark sacrifices. Yet still they will remain. Always together.

*''As Galactica prepares to return to New Caprica:''
:'''Admiral Adama''': This is the Admiral. You've heard the news. You know the mission. You should also know that there is only one way that this mission ends, and that's with the successful rescue of our people off of New Caprica. Look around you. Take a good look at the men and women that stand next to you. Remember their faces, for one day you will tell your children and your grandchildren that you served with such men and women as the universe has never seen. And together you accomplished a feat that will be told and retold down through the ages, and find immortality as only the Gods once knew. I'm proud to serve with you. Good hunting.

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==

*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon|Karl "Helo" Agathon]]
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Tyrol]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]] (credit only)
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Amanda Plummer]] as [[Oracle]] [[Selloi Dodona|Selloi]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]
*[[Donnelly Rhodes]] as Dr. [[Cottle]]
*[[Matthew Bennett]] as [[Number Five]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Dean Stockwell]] as [[Cavil]]
*[[Erica Cerra]] as [[Maya]]
*[[Luciana Carro]] as Lt. [[Louanne Katraine|Louanne "Kat" Katraine]]
*[[Brad Dryborough]] as Lt. [[Hoshi]]
*[[Leah Cairns]] as Lt. [[Margaret Edmondson|Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson]]
*[[Madeline Parker]] as [[Kacey]]
*[[Dominic Zamprogna]] as [[James Lyman|James "Jammer" Lyman]]
*[[Ty Olsson]] as Captain [[Aaron Kelly]]
*[[imdb:nm0669826|Eileen Pedde]] as [[Mathias]]
*[[imdb:nm0356501|Jennifer Halley]] as [[Seelix]]
*[[imdb:nm0730455|Ryan Robbins]] as [[Connor]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Bradley Thompson]]
[[Category:Episodes written by David Weddle]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
[[Category:RDM]]

[[de:Exodus, Part I]]

Exodus, Part I

2006-10-16T01:21:47Z

Tirkon: /* Analysis */

{{Episode Data
| title= Exodus, Part I
| image=Roslinanders-Exodus.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 3
| guests=
| writer= [[Bradley Thompson]] [[David Weddle]]
| story=
| director= [[Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
| production= 303
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-13
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population=
| prev= [[Precipice]]
| next= [[Exodus, Part II]]
| goof=Y
}}

== Overview ==

:''The [[Cylons]] have begun the brutal crackdown on [[New Caprica]]'s [[Resistance]] movement. Tyrol receives disturbing news from a secret source within Baltar's administration while Colonial detainees face a Cylon firing squad on New Caprica. With time running out for the colonists, Admiral Adama will launch his rescue attempt with only the battlestar [[Galactica]], while his son, Lee, and the battlestar [[Pegasus]] remain to protect what is left of the human fleet and continue the search for Earth if the rescue fails.''

== Summary ==

*The final moments of "[[Precipice]]" are reshown as the captured detainees being taken off the trucks. [[Cally Tyrol]] is freed, as the Centurions march up the hill. Tyrol continues to run as gunfire is heard. As the screen goes to black, the words "One Hour Earlier" are displayed.
*[[Galen Tyrol]] is frantically talking with [[Saul Tigh]] about a list of detainees he received from his [[Felix Gaeta|source]], Cally Tyrol is among the listed. Tigh snaps him back to his senses, noting that they can locate the people now that they cracked the Cylons' coordinate system.
*Chief Tyrol immediately gets to work, succesfully calculating the location of the execution, and gathers a team to rescue Cally and the others.
*Tyrol's team, including [[Seelix]], is able to catch up with the Cylons, and get in position as Cally Tyrol starts running. Tyrol rushes out and gets his wife out of the line of fire, as his team takes out the Centurions meant to execute the detainees. Others injured include some members of the [[NCP]] and the [[Cavil]] that accompanies the truck.
*Seelix leaves a wounded Cavil to death. After he downloads into a new body, the Cavil reports that he ended his own life, but is somewhat traumatized from the transfer process.
*At [[Breeder's Canyon]], similar to the scene at the [[Pergamus Flats]], a flashback shows how [[marines]] move into position to defend the meeting there against a possible attack.
[[Image:Colonial RPG.jpg|thumb|150px|right|Colonial Marine with an RPG]]
*[[Sharon Agathon]] moves ahead to meet with [[Samuel Anders|Anders]] and the resistance. As Agathon and Anders discuss their plans, the Centurions attack, taking out some of the resistance fighters, but are soon destroyed by a marine RPG.
*After the attack, a map is recovered from one of the [[Cylon agent|'skinjobs']]. Anders recognizes it as the hand-drawn map passed on to [[Ellen Tigh]] to destroy in the heating fire within their tent. Anders immediately suspects Tigh in tipping off the Cylons.
*While sleeping, [[Number Three]] dreams of a tent near some odd rock edifices. The next image is of her holding [[Hera]]. She wakes up suddenly.
*On ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Gaius Baltar]] and [[Caprica-Six]] lie together in bed, but Baltar is fighting with impotence. Six is understanding, but Baltar shrugs off her sympathy.
*[[Kara Thrace]] is showing further affection for [[Kacey]] and apologizes for her getting hurt. [[Leoben Conoy]] watches from the background.
*Distrubed by her dream, [[Three]] visits [[Selloi]], a human [[oracle]] whose tent she saw in her dream, who tells her that [[Hera]] is still alive, but warns that holding the child will undo all that the Cylons have accomplished on the planet.
*On ''[[Galactica]]'', a combined crew of ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'' and ''Galactica'' crews ready for the rescue mission. [[Margaret Edmondson]] conducts a [[Salt Line Ceremony|ceremony]] to bind the people together, given the odds of the mission.
*[[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]] have a farewell of their own when Commander Adama leaves ''Galactica'' for ''Pegasus'', with orders to wait 18 hours for ''Galactica'''s return. Otherwise, ''Pegasus'' must continue the search for Earth with the surviving [[The Fleet (RDM)|members of the Fleet]].
*Three inquires with Dr. [[Cottle]], who is treating a Cylon wounded by a human attack, about Hera's alleged death.
*[[Laura Roslin]] orders Anders to guard [[Maya]] and [[Hera]] at all costs. He tasks two of his best men to protect her and see to her safe escape.
*Gunnery Sergeant [[Mathias]], the leader of Agathon's Marines, meets with Roslin, [[Tom Zarek]] and the resistance to discuss the rescue plan. She brings weapons for the upcoming fight and learns that the colonists conducted evacuation exercises under the guise of fire drills.
*A [[Cavil]] voices his despair at the continued bloodshed, [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] agrees. Many of the Cylons disagree significantly as to what to do to reestablish control. A [[Number Five]] says that, if the worse comes to worst, that they can just nuke the city.
*Saul Tigh learns of his wife's betrayal and is visibly shocked by it.
*Sharon Agathon heads into the [[New Caprica Detention Center]] and gets the [[launch key]]s for the Colonial ship. Three enters the secured room, immediately recognizes her, stops Agathon and tells her that [[Hera|her daughter]] is alive. Unwilling to consider this matter for now, Agathon shoots the Three in the legs: "Adama wouldn't lie to me."
*''Galactica'' is given word that the launch keys have been retrieved, and after a rousing speech by Admiral Adama, begins preparations for the jump to New Caprica.

== Questions ==

*Roslin and Zarek seem to have reconciled their differences and become friends. Given Saul Tigh's feeling that Roslin will resume the Presidency once humanity has left [[New Caprica]], and that Zarek used to be Baltar's Vice, will he assume the mantle of Vice-President under Laura Roslin?
**Or will he claim the presidency in legal succession after Baltar has been removed from it?
*A Cavil mentions that he has different sensations after each download. A slight headache after the first and after the third a white hot poker in his skull. Is there damage to the consciousness during each downloading and is there a point where after so many downloads the consciousness is destroyed?
**Most likely there is some sort of mental trauma from dying and rebirth.
**Although not sapient, Sharon talks of a similar traumatizing due to repeated deaths in regard to [[Scar (Raider)|Scar]].
***In the podcast, [[Ronald D. Moore]] revealed that the intent was to show that there is a "cost" associated with downloading.
****Additionally, [[Leoben Conoy]] has been downloaded at least five times, possibly six if the "[[Flesh and Bone]]" death is counted seperately. Given that Conoy has not voiced the same problems, does the downloading process affect the various cylon models differently?
*****Conoy may merely be voicing it off-camera or not at all.
*****Also, [[Number Three]] had commented in "[[Downloaded]]" on feeling refreshed like starting a new life when describing her download experience. [[Caprica-Six]] expressed adjustment issues but this may have been more due to her Baltar effect.
*Are the Gods real? Why are they sending accurate dreams to the Cylons? Why is the oracle helping the Cylons interpret the dreams?
**The Gods are "real" as historical entities that did live on Kobol - their status as actual "gods" has not been determined. The Colonials are capable of prescient dreams and visions (usually with the aid of Chamalla), and the humanoid Cylons are based on human DNA.
*Why does Doctor Cottle work to heal critically injured cylons instead of just letting them die and be ressurected?
**The Cylons might want to minimize the trauma of downloading into a new body.
**Cottle is also a physician, and has taken an oath to do no harm. Allowing a Cylon to die, regardless of the download capability, is breaching this oath through omission of action.
*Where is "[[Download City]]"?
**It is possible that [[Seelix|Seelix's]] use of the phrase "Download City" is merely a euphemism for the download process the humanoid Cylon models go through.
**It may also be a reference to a possible downloading facility present on New Caprica.
*Is there any possibility at all that Adama wasn't aware of Roslin's plans for Hera?
**There are no direct indications that Adama is aware of Roslin's conspiracy regarding the baby. Given the positive changes in his relationship with Sharon, that seems to now be based on complete mutual trust, it is unlikely that he would keep such a profound secret from her, if he was aware of it.
**Dr. Cottle is a military officer and his actions would have to have been cleared through Adama. There may well be other reasons that Sharon wasn't told, including keeping the information from the Cylons in the event she was captured or downloaded.
***In military parlance, the president's authority supersedes that of an Admiral, and a military officer does not need to report back to his commanding officer orders that originated from the president.
**The expression on Adama's face during his conversation with Sharon in "[[Occupation]]" suggests that he is aware of the conspiracy regarding Hera.
***Said expression may also be a reference to his guilt over the whole situation with Sharon/Boomer/Number Eight in general, and not a specific reference to Hera.
*What other operations are the Cylons busy with elsewhere in the universe, that are straining their resources for their experiment on New Caprica (also referenced to by Ron Moore in his podcast)?
*Will some humans refuse to leave once the escape begins?
*Will the escapees block proven or suspected collaborators from boarding the escaping ships?
**How many, if any, of the New Caprica Police are publically known, and once the escape begins, what will be their ultimate fate?

== Analysis ==
* The [[Number Three]] that has been having dreams about Hera saw [[Sharon Agathon]] and was able to tell that she was the copy that had been left with Helo on Caprica.
* Roslin's line about [[Hera]], "She may well be the shape of things to come", echoes similar lines by Six in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]" and by Adama in "[[Valley of Darkness]]". "The Shape of Things to Come" is also the title of the orchestral music piece at the end of "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]".
*Anders seems to know, or at least suspect, what is so special about Maya's child.
*[[Caprica-Six]] has been [[Cylon rebirthing tank|redownloaded]] after her "death" in [[Precipice]]. She was not "boxed".

== Notes ==

* There is also a comic called ''[[Exodus!]]'', which covers the events of [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|the Original Series]]' episode, "[[Saga of a Star World]]" (Part 2).
* This is the first episode where viewers have seen an [[oracle]]. Oracles such as [[Pythia]] and [[Galen Tyrol]]'s mother have been mentioned but not seen.
* Tyrol inexplicably lost his beard before this episode. This was necessary because Aaron Douglas's scenes were shot weeks after the main part of the episode, when he had already shaved and it was felt that a fake beard would not be convincing.
*Chamalla is a bitter herb, and oracles sometimes use candy to sweeten it up.
*According to [[Ronald Moore]]'s podcast, in earlier drafts [[Jammer]] was going to die during the shootout at the execution site. However, he decided that the character would be used in later episodes of the season.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

*''Before Lee Adama departs ''Galactica'':''
:'''Admiral William Adama''': I'll see you at the rendezvous point.
:'''Commander Lee Adama''': Eighteen hours. Try not to be late.
:'''William Adama''': I'm getting old; I'm a little slow, but I'll be there.
:'''Lee Adama''': Gods, I wish I could talk you out of this...
:'''William Adama''': You can't. You tried.
:'''Lee Adama''': You know, Dad, um...
:'''William Adama''': Don't. Don't make me cry on my own hangar deck.

*''During the [[Salt Line Ceremony]] on the hangar deck:''
:'''Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson''': Their enemies will divide them, their colonies broken in the fiery chasm of space. The shining days renounced by a multitude of dark sacrifices. Yet still they will remain. Always together.

*''As Galactica prepares to return to New Caprica:''
:'''Admiral Adama''': This is the Admiral. You've heard the news. You know the mission. You should also know that there is only one way that this mission ends, and that's with the successful rescue of our people off of New Caprica. Look around you. Take a good look at the men and women that stand next to you. Remember their faces, for one day you will tell your children and your grandchildren that you served with such men and women as the universe has never seen. And together you accomplished a feat that will be told and retold down through the ages, and find immortality as only the Gods once knew. I'm proud to serve with you. Good hunting.

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==

*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon|Karl "Helo" Agathon]]
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Tyrol]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]] (credit only)
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Amanda Plummer]] as [[Oracle]] [[Selloi Dodona|Selloi]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]
*[[Donnelly Rhodes]] as Dr. [[Cottle]]
*[[Matthew Bennett]] as [[Number Five]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Dean Stockwell]] as [[Cavil]]
*[[Erica Cerra]] as [[Maya]]
*[[Luciana Carro]] as Lt. [[Louanne Katraine|Louanne "Kat" Katraine]]
*[[Brad Dryborough]] as Lt. [[Hoshi]]
*[[Leah Cairns]] as Lt. [[Margaret Edmondson|Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson]]
*Madeline Parker as [[Kacey]]
*[[Dominic Zamprogna]] as [[James Lyman|James "Jammer" Lyman]]
*[[imdb:nm0669826|Eileen Pedde]] as [[Mathias]]
*[[imdb:nm0356501|Jennifer Halley]] as [[Seelix]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Bradley Thompson]]
[[Category:Episodes written by David Weddle]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
[[Category:RDM]]

User:Tirkon

2006-10-10T21:35:42Z

Tirkon:

I am a probably the second active translator of the german Battlestar Wiki. ---> [http://de.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Benutzer:Tirkon My german user page].

My specialty is the nearly realtime translation of the episode-summaries, which were not broadcasted in Germany to make this Wiki to one of the first german sources for Battlestar Galactica.

Further I translated many old articles and helped to build up the first linking structure of the most important articles.
[[de:Benutzer:Tirkon]]

User:Tirkon

2006-10-10T21:29:54Z

Tirkon:

I am a probably the second active translator of the german Battlestar Wiki. ---> [http://de.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Benutzer:Tirkon My german user page].

My specialty is the nearly realtime translation of the episode-summaries, which were not broadcasted in Germany to make this Wiki the first german source for Battlestar Galactica.

Further I translated many old articles and helped to build up the first linking structure of the most important articles.
[[de:Benutzer:Tirkon]]

Talk:Occupation/Archive 1

2006-10-10T21:15:31Z

Tirkon: /* still missed in the summary */

:For discussions prior to October 3, 2006, [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Occupation&oldid=66799 click here].

__TOC__

== Sourcing Rules ==
I wonder if the desire to be "authoritative" here at Battlestar Wiki isn't getting twisted and perverted. We know a lot about Season 3 that is somehow not getting into print. For instance, we have photos of some episodes, casting "sides" from some of the scripts, and comments from some of the participants that amount to a pretty clear picture of some of the major plot points of the first few episodes, yet we are not writing what we clearly KNOW because the episodes have not aired and anything would therefore be "speculative." THIS IS RIDICULOUS. These are tougher sourcing rules than they have at the ''New York Times'' and the ''Washington Post'', and let's face it, that is now what people are coming to us for. They want to know what is going on with their favorite show, and god knows we have spoiler warnings everywhere to protect those who don't want to know. Most major newspapers have the "three source rule," which means all or part of what you write needs to be covered by three independent sources. We have that in many cases but are sitting on our hands and not writing the info. The "overview" section we do have for the episodes is not really an overview but a collection of speculation from various sources. If Ron Moore said something at a conference three months ago, we treat it as a grand pronouncement ex cathedra even though three months is a long time and a lot of things can change in TV at the last moment. But we have photos of scenes shot (and published!) and we are not writing what is clearly in them. Something is very screwed up here. No journalistic or editorial operation should be operating this way, being so skittish and chicken s--t about things that any reasonable person can conclude are true. We are a month from the start of Season 3, and Battlestar Wiki is lagging way behind other sources, on the Web and elsewhere, about what will be happening in the new season. We need to grow some brass ones, and write what we know. The whole rest of the world is writing about what will be happening starting Oct. 6. We have decided to wait until after it happens. That's not authoritative; that's stupid. --[[User:Elach|Elach]] 02:31, 6 September 2006 (CDT)
:I think you missed the point of what we are. We are guide to BSG. Not a news source. We collect, eveluate the source. We write only facual information on the show. Most of the information on this page has a cite along with it making it true. We knew a long time ago Anadama Plummer was a guest star because of the podcast link, but we didn't sepculate on the plot because production and recordings change sometimes days before airing. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:44, 6 September 2006 (CDT)

== First act up on scifi.com ==
The 1st act of this episode is on the website and some of the speculation is right and some is wrong from the transcript that got circulated earlier this year. Obvious an early draft. In any case, I think that things can be added from this cut from their website which I would like to start after I stop watching this thing over and over and over...and oh by the way, I gotta work to. Maybe I'll make my contributions in a few hours. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:47, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Did anyone else notice that the credits said Candice McClure and not Kandyse McClure? Apparently she had been credited as Candice in some roles earlier in her career but as far as I remember, she has always been credited as Kandyse on Battlestar Galactica. The Sci Fi site still lists her as Kandyse. What gives? Is this just another slip-up on the part of the people in charge of onscreen text? (Remember the problem with Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson in the end credits?) They also spelled Helo's full name incorrectly on the humorous video blog that showed the effect that the Peabody Award had on David Eick. Helo's real name was incorrectly shown as Karl Agation with an "i". [[User:123home123|123home123]] 18:09, 04 October 2006 (EDT)

:I'm going to have to look into that credit issue later. I put a summary in for what was shown on Scifi.com. I hope I did it in the most correct way. Feel free to make modifications where needed. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:53, 04 October 2006 (AST)

:Thanks to Shane, Peter Farago, Spencerian, and Noneofyourbusiness for editing my additions. This is my first time at adding major content to an episode page outside of the The Resistance Webisodes page so I was just letting it flow without worrying about format. Though, I am particularly happy that you all left my use of the terms "skinjobs" and "chromejobs". I felt that this was appropriate from the point of view of the characters involved. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 21:31, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Request that analysis section is deleted! The comments are not analytical and instead seem rather speculative, amounting to nothing which is noteworthy.-- [[User:jxh487|jxh487]]
:Committing an act of vandalism on the main page isn't going to help your case. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:06, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:Jxh487, since the episode has not yet aired, the information is the best official data available. This will last here for one more day in the US, where it will likely be replaced. As the previous user stated, don't vandalize a page to prove a point, please. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:14, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
::Yes, the episode(s) will probably prove or disapprove both points. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:26, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:::I want to add back the note telling about this act being played on the website before the airing on TV because I think it is a significant marketing innovation that should be documented, an innovation as important to record as the plot line in the summer. Thoughts?--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:43, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Speculation? ==

''It is worth noting that in "Exodus, Part II", Ellen betrays Saul in some fashion. Therefore, her motives are presently unknown.''

How can we put this up based on Overview? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:18, 6 October 2006 (CDT)
:We shouldn't. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:31, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

frak the cylons. the human race will ultimately survive. just seen the episode. pretty cool yet it not reveals ellens intentions so we shouldnt. 06:31, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Her intentions are pretty clear. She will protect Saul at all costs. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 06:54, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Oracle Selloi==

I didn't see Amanda Plummer at all in Occuprice, and her name wasn't in credits. Either her scene got deleted, or she'll be appearing in a later episode (more likely, I think). I'm taking her out as a "Special Guest." [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:25, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:From the teaser, it seems she'll be appearing in Exodus. BTW, "Occuprice" doesn't make much sense as Precipice ends on a "pice" instead of a "price". A better merger would be Occupice. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 21:05, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::I noticed that too. But the title comes from on high (ie Ron Moore's blog). I realize he probably just mistyped, but I've gotten used to calling it that. The "-pr-" has a better cadence, in my opinion at least. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 21:33, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

:::I'm hoping to see this character; we have so little information on the nature of [[oracle]]s. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Survivor count ==

Did anyone else notice the lack of a survivor count during the starting credits? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:23, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
:I'm guessing that they didn't want to bother, because the body count is moving too fast, and the humans are all split up to boot. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:: That's my assumption as well, right now. I imagine that after the exodus they might resume the count, at least in some form, provided Roslin ever becomes president again. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:04, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::: I think that the reason is they tell the story from a point of view of the characters not from a God-view (or gods-view in their case) of the overall story - meaning, somebody was keeping track of the population count and they just put that info up front for us. And the person who kept track of the population count was always Roslin. Remember, Roslin always kept the population count up on that wallspace and when Baltar became president he replaced it with his own portrait. Now, with the population split up and Roslin no longer in a place of central control, there's nobody keepin a hard track on the population count so that info isn't available to us because that info isn't available to the characters. That's my take.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 18:16, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Season 2 used a gods-eye-view population count - early on in the season, it reflected deaths on Kobol that Roslin couldn't possibly have known about. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::That might have been a flaw because it was my understanding that the survivor count was reflecting Roslin's survivor count.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:40, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Your understanding is incorrect. See [[Survivor Count]] for a detailed breakdown including several deaths of which Roslin could not have been aware.
::::::There were a total of four people killed on Kobol (Karma, Tarn, Socinus, and Crashdown). The survivors are recovered at the end of "Fragged", but the count in "Resistance" is only decremented by one — presumably Crashdown, who did in fact die in the previous episode. This, along with a single-person decrement between "Scattered" and "Valley of Darkness" in which nobody died except Tarn (who was on Kobol) suggests that the survivor count was omniscient.
::::::Also keep in mind that Roslin was separated from her whiteboard from the end of "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II" to the end of "Home, Part II", and would not have been privy to population statistics. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:52, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== still missed in the summary ==

Thanks to the people on the english side, our summaries of Occupation and Precipice were probably the first ones, which were released in the internet in german language :o) But there are some things still missing in this both episodes: the diary of Roslin, the discussions between the both Adamas and with Dualla (weak Apollo with fat ash, find somebody who can, Pegasus will not participate), the discussion between Admiral Adama and Sharon Agathon (centurions cannot differenciate the copies), and the discussion of the Cylons at Colonial One (decreasing humankind, the opposition of Galactica-Sharon and Caprica-Six,, WE!! agree), Galactica-Sharons discussions with several humans and the shooting of Caprica-Six. It would be helpful, if the native english speakers could add this to the summaries and point out the real important informations, which were given. Thank you. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 16:13, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

Talk:Occupation/Archive 1

2006-10-10T21:13:35Z

Tirkon: /* still missed in the summary */

:For discussions prior to October 3, 2006, [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Occupation&oldid=66799 click here].

__TOC__

== Sourcing Rules ==
I wonder if the desire to be "authoritative" here at Battlestar Wiki isn't getting twisted and perverted. We know a lot about Season 3 that is somehow not getting into print. For instance, we have photos of some episodes, casting "sides" from some of the scripts, and comments from some of the participants that amount to a pretty clear picture of some of the major plot points of the first few episodes, yet we are not writing what we clearly KNOW because the episodes have not aired and anything would therefore be "speculative." THIS IS RIDICULOUS. These are tougher sourcing rules than they have at the ''New York Times'' and the ''Washington Post'', and let's face it, that is now what people are coming to us for. They want to know what is going on with their favorite show, and god knows we have spoiler warnings everywhere to protect those who don't want to know. Most major newspapers have the "three source rule," which means all or part of what you write needs to be covered by three independent sources. We have that in many cases but are sitting on our hands and not writing the info. The "overview" section we do have for the episodes is not really an overview but a collection of speculation from various sources. If Ron Moore said something at a conference three months ago, we treat it as a grand pronouncement ex cathedra even though three months is a long time and a lot of things can change in TV at the last moment. But we have photos of scenes shot (and published!) and we are not writing what is clearly in them. Something is very screwed up here. No journalistic or editorial operation should be operating this way, being so skittish and chicken s--t about things that any reasonable person can conclude are true. We are a month from the start of Season 3, and Battlestar Wiki is lagging way behind other sources, on the Web and elsewhere, about what will be happening in the new season. We need to grow some brass ones, and write what we know. The whole rest of the world is writing about what will be happening starting Oct. 6. We have decided to wait until after it happens. That's not authoritative; that's stupid. --[[User:Elach|Elach]] 02:31, 6 September 2006 (CDT)
:I think you missed the point of what we are. We are guide to BSG. Not a news source. We collect, eveluate the source. We write only facual information on the show. Most of the information on this page has a cite along with it making it true. We knew a long time ago Anadama Plummer was a guest star because of the podcast link, but we didn't sepculate on the plot because production and recordings change sometimes days before airing. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:44, 6 September 2006 (CDT)

== First act up on scifi.com ==
The 1st act of this episode is on the website and some of the speculation is right and some is wrong from the transcript that got circulated earlier this year. Obvious an early draft. In any case, I think that things can be added from this cut from their website which I would like to start after I stop watching this thing over and over and over...and oh by the way, I gotta work to. Maybe I'll make my contributions in a few hours. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:47, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Did anyone else notice that the credits said Candice McClure and not Kandyse McClure? Apparently she had been credited as Candice in some roles earlier in her career but as far as I remember, she has always been credited as Kandyse on Battlestar Galactica. The Sci Fi site still lists her as Kandyse. What gives? Is this just another slip-up on the part of the people in charge of onscreen text? (Remember the problem with Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson in the end credits?) They also spelled Helo's full name incorrectly on the humorous video blog that showed the effect that the Peabody Award had on David Eick. Helo's real name was incorrectly shown as Karl Agation with an "i". [[User:123home123|123home123]] 18:09, 04 October 2006 (EDT)

:I'm going to have to look into that credit issue later. I put a summary in for what was shown on Scifi.com. I hope I did it in the most correct way. Feel free to make modifications where needed. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:53, 04 October 2006 (AST)

:Thanks to Shane, Peter Farago, Spencerian, and Noneofyourbusiness for editing my additions. This is my first time at adding major content to an episode page outside of the The Resistance Webisodes page so I was just letting it flow without worrying about format. Though, I am particularly happy that you all left my use of the terms "skinjobs" and "chromejobs". I felt that this was appropriate from the point of view of the characters involved. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 21:31, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Request that analysis section is deleted! The comments are not analytical and instead seem rather speculative, amounting to nothing which is noteworthy.-- [[User:jxh487|jxh487]]
:Committing an act of vandalism on the main page isn't going to help your case. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:06, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:Jxh487, since the episode has not yet aired, the information is the best official data available. This will last here for one more day in the US, where it will likely be replaced. As the previous user stated, don't vandalize a page to prove a point, please. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:14, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
::Yes, the episode(s) will probably prove or disapprove both points. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:26, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:::I want to add back the note telling about this act being played on the website before the airing on TV because I think it is a significant marketing innovation that should be documented, an innovation as important to record as the plot line in the summer. Thoughts?--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:43, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Speculation? ==

''It is worth noting that in "Exodus, Part II", Ellen betrays Saul in some fashion. Therefore, her motives are presently unknown.''

How can we put this up based on Overview? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:18, 6 October 2006 (CDT)
:We shouldn't. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:31, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

frak the cylons. the human race will ultimately survive. just seen the episode. pretty cool yet it not reveals ellens intentions so we shouldnt. 06:31, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Her intentions are pretty clear. She will protect Saul at all costs. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 06:54, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Oracle Selloi==

I didn't see Amanda Plummer at all in Occuprice, and her name wasn't in credits. Either her scene got deleted, or she'll be appearing in a later episode (more likely, I think). I'm taking her out as a "Special Guest." [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:25, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:From the teaser, it seems she'll be appearing in Exodus. BTW, "Occuprice" doesn't make much sense as Precipice ends on a "pice" instead of a "price". A better merger would be Occupice. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 21:05, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::I noticed that too. But the title comes from on high (ie Ron Moore's blog). I realize he probably just mistyped, but I've gotten used to calling it that. The "-pr-" has a better cadence, in my opinion at least. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 21:33, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

:::I'm hoping to see this character; we have so little information on the nature of [[oracle]]s. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Survivor count ==

Did anyone else notice the lack of a survivor count during the starting credits? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:23, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
:I'm guessing that they didn't want to bother, because the body count is moving too fast, and the humans are all split up to boot. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:: That's my assumption as well, right now. I imagine that after the exodus they might resume the count, at least in some form, provided Roslin ever becomes president again. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:04, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::: I think that the reason is they tell the story from a point of view of the characters not from a God-view (or gods-view in their case) of the overall story - meaning, somebody was keeping track of the population count and they just put that info up front for us. And the person who kept track of the population count was always Roslin. Remember, Roslin always kept the population count up on that wallspace and when Baltar became president he replaced it with his own portrait. Now, with the population split up and Roslin no longer in a place of central control, there's nobody keepin a hard track on the population count so that info isn't available to us because that info isn't available to the characters. That's my take.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 18:16, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Season 2 used a gods-eye-view population count - early on in the season, it reflected deaths on Kobol that Roslin couldn't possibly have known about. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::That might have been a flaw because it was my understanding that the survivor count was reflecting Roslin's survivor count.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:40, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Your understanding is incorrect. See [[Survivor Count]] for a detailed breakdown including several deaths of which Roslin could not have been aware.
::::::There were a total of four people killed on Kobol (Karma, Tarn, Socinus, and Crashdown). The survivors are recovered at the end of "Fragged", but the count in "Resistance" is only decremented by one — presumably Crashdown, who did in fact die in the previous episode. This, along with a single-person decrement between "Scattered" and "Valley of Darkness" in which nobody died except Tarn (who was on Kobol) suggests that the survivor count was omniscient.
::::::Also keep in mind that Roslin was separated from her whiteboard from the end of "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II" to the end of "Home, Part II", and would not have been privy to population statistics. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:52, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== still missed in the summary ==

Thanks to the people on the english side, our summaries of Occupation and Precipice were probably the first ones, which were released in the internet in german language :o) But there are some things still missing in this both episodes: the diary of Roslin, the discussions between the both Adamas and with Dualla (weak Apollo with fat ash, find somebody who can, Pegasus will not participate), the discussion between Admiral Adama and Sharon Agathon (centurions cannot differenciate the copies), and the discussion of the Cylons at Colonial One (decreasing humankind, the opposition of Galactica-Sharon and Caprica-Six), Galactica-Sharons discussions with several humans and the shooting of Caprica-Six. It would be helpful, if the native english speakers could add this to the summaries and point out the real important informations, which were given. Thank you. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 16:13, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

Talk:Occupation/Archive 1

2006-10-10T21:08:47Z

Tirkon: /* still missed in the summary */

:For discussions prior to October 3, 2006, [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Occupation&oldid=66799 click here].

__TOC__

== Sourcing Rules ==
I wonder if the desire to be "authoritative" here at Battlestar Wiki isn't getting twisted and perverted. We know a lot about Season 3 that is somehow not getting into print. For instance, we have photos of some episodes, casting "sides" from some of the scripts, and comments from some of the participants that amount to a pretty clear picture of some of the major plot points of the first few episodes, yet we are not writing what we clearly KNOW because the episodes have not aired and anything would therefore be "speculative." THIS IS RIDICULOUS. These are tougher sourcing rules than they have at the ''New York Times'' and the ''Washington Post'', and let's face it, that is now what people are coming to us for. They want to know what is going on with their favorite show, and god knows we have spoiler warnings everywhere to protect those who don't want to know. Most major newspapers have the "three source rule," which means all or part of what you write needs to be covered by three independent sources. We have that in many cases but are sitting on our hands and not writing the info. The "overview" section we do have for the episodes is not really an overview but a collection of speculation from various sources. If Ron Moore said something at a conference three months ago, we treat it as a grand pronouncement ex cathedra even though three months is a long time and a lot of things can change in TV at the last moment. But we have photos of scenes shot (and published!) and we are not writing what is clearly in them. Something is very screwed up here. No journalistic or editorial operation should be operating this way, being so skittish and chicken s--t about things that any reasonable person can conclude are true. We are a month from the start of Season 3, and Battlestar Wiki is lagging way behind other sources, on the Web and elsewhere, about what will be happening in the new season. We need to grow some brass ones, and write what we know. The whole rest of the world is writing about what will be happening starting Oct. 6. We have decided to wait until after it happens. That's not authoritative; that's stupid. --[[User:Elach|Elach]] 02:31, 6 September 2006 (CDT)
:I think you missed the point of what we are. We are guide to BSG. Not a news source. We collect, eveluate the source. We write only facual information on the show. Most of the information on this page has a cite along with it making it true. We knew a long time ago Anadama Plummer was a guest star because of the podcast link, but we didn't sepculate on the plot because production and recordings change sometimes days before airing. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:44, 6 September 2006 (CDT)

== First act up on scifi.com ==
The 1st act of this episode is on the website and some of the speculation is right and some is wrong from the transcript that got circulated earlier this year. Obvious an early draft. In any case, I think that things can be added from this cut from their website which I would like to start after I stop watching this thing over and over and over...and oh by the way, I gotta work to. Maybe I'll make my contributions in a few hours. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:47, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Did anyone else notice that the credits said Candice McClure and not Kandyse McClure? Apparently she had been credited as Candice in some roles earlier in her career but as far as I remember, she has always been credited as Kandyse on Battlestar Galactica. The Sci Fi site still lists her as Kandyse. What gives? Is this just another slip-up on the part of the people in charge of onscreen text? (Remember the problem with Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson in the end credits?) They also spelled Helo's full name incorrectly on the humorous video blog that showed the effect that the Peabody Award had on David Eick. Helo's real name was incorrectly shown as Karl Agation with an "i". [[User:123home123|123home123]] 18:09, 04 October 2006 (EDT)

:I'm going to have to look into that credit issue later. I put a summary in for what was shown on Scifi.com. I hope I did it in the most correct way. Feel free to make modifications where needed. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:53, 04 October 2006 (AST)

:Thanks to Shane, Peter Farago, Spencerian, and Noneofyourbusiness for editing my additions. This is my first time at adding major content to an episode page outside of the The Resistance Webisodes page so I was just letting it flow without worrying about format. Though, I am particularly happy that you all left my use of the terms "skinjobs" and "chromejobs". I felt that this was appropriate from the point of view of the characters involved. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 21:31, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Request that analysis section is deleted! The comments are not analytical and instead seem rather speculative, amounting to nothing which is noteworthy.-- [[User:jxh487|jxh487]]
:Committing an act of vandalism on the main page isn't going to help your case. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:06, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:Jxh487, since the episode has not yet aired, the information is the best official data available. This will last here for one more day in the US, where it will likely be replaced. As the previous user stated, don't vandalize a page to prove a point, please. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:14, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
::Yes, the episode(s) will probably prove or disapprove both points. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:26, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:::I want to add back the note telling about this act being played on the website before the airing on TV because I think it is a significant marketing innovation that should be documented, an innovation as important to record as the plot line in the summer. Thoughts?--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:43, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Speculation? ==

''It is worth noting that in "Exodus, Part II", Ellen betrays Saul in some fashion. Therefore, her motives are presently unknown.''

How can we put this up based on Overview? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:18, 6 October 2006 (CDT)
:We shouldn't. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:31, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

frak the cylons. the human race will ultimately survive. just seen the episode. pretty cool yet it not reveals ellens intentions so we shouldnt. 06:31, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Her intentions are pretty clear. She will protect Saul at all costs. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 06:54, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Oracle Selloi==

I didn't see Amanda Plummer at all in Occuprice, and her name wasn't in credits. Either her scene got deleted, or she'll be appearing in a later episode (more likely, I think). I'm taking her out as a "Special Guest." [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:25, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:From the teaser, it seems she'll be appearing in Exodus. BTW, "Occuprice" doesn't make much sense as Precipice ends on a "pice" instead of a "price". A better merger would be Occupice. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 21:05, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::I noticed that too. But the title comes from on high (ie Ron Moore's blog). I realize he probably just mistyped, but I've gotten used to calling it that. The "-pr-" has a better cadence, in my opinion at least. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 21:33, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

:::I'm hoping to see this character; we have so little information on the nature of [[oracle]]s. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Survivor count ==

Did anyone else notice the lack of a survivor count during the starting credits? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:23, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
:I'm guessing that they didn't want to bother, because the body count is moving too fast, and the humans are all split up to boot. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:: That's my assumption as well, right now. I imagine that after the exodus they might resume the count, at least in some form, provided Roslin ever becomes president again. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:04, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::: I think that the reason is they tell the story from a point of view of the characters not from a God-view (or gods-view in their case) of the overall story - meaning, somebody was keeping track of the population count and they just put that info up front for us. And the person who kept track of the population count was always Roslin. Remember, Roslin always kept the population count up on that wallspace and when Baltar became president he replaced it with his own portrait. Now, with the population split up and Roslin no longer in a place of central control, there's nobody keepin a hard track on the population count so that info isn't available to us because that info isn't available to the characters. That's my take.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 18:16, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Season 2 used a gods-eye-view population count - early on in the season, it reflected deaths on Kobol that Roslin couldn't possibly have known about. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::That might have been a flaw because it was my understanding that the survivor count was reflecting Roslin's survivor count.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:40, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Your understanding is incorrect. See [[Survivor Count]] for a detailed breakdown including several deaths of which Roslin could not have been aware.
::::::There were a total of four people killed on Kobol (Karma, Tarn, Socinus, and Crashdown). The survivors are recovered at the end of "Fragged", but the count in "Resistance" is only decremented by one — presumably Crashdown, who did in fact die in the previous episode. This, along with a single-person decrement between "Scattered" and "Valley of Darkness" in which nobody died except Tarn (who was on Kobol) suggests that the survivor count was omniscient.
::::::Also keep in mind that Roslin was separated from her whiteboard from the end of "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II" to the end of "Home, Part II", and would not have been privy to population statistics. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:52, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== still missed in the summary ==

Thanks to the people on the english side, our summaries of Occupation and Precipice were probably the first ones, which were released in the internet in german language :o) But there are some things still missing in this both episodes: the discussions between the both Adamas and with Dualla (weak Apollo with fat ash, find somebody who can, Pegasus will not participate), the discussion between Admiral Adama and Sharon Agathon (centurions cannot differenciate the copies), and the discussion of the Cylons at Colonial One (decreasing humankind, the opposition of Galactica-Sharon and Caprica-Six), Galactica-Sharons discussions with several humans and the shooting of Caprica-Six. It would be helpful, if the native english speakers could add this to the summaries and point out the real important informations, which were given. Thank you. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 16:08, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

Talk:Occupation/Archive 1

2006-10-10T21:07:36Z

Tirkon: /* still missed in the summary */

:For discussions prior to October 3, 2006, [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Occupation&oldid=66799 click here].

__TOC__

== Sourcing Rules ==
I wonder if the desire to be "authoritative" here at Battlestar Wiki isn't getting twisted and perverted. We know a lot about Season 3 that is somehow not getting into print. For instance, we have photos of some episodes, casting "sides" from some of the scripts, and comments from some of the participants that amount to a pretty clear picture of some of the major plot points of the first few episodes, yet we are not writing what we clearly KNOW because the episodes have not aired and anything would therefore be "speculative." THIS IS RIDICULOUS. These are tougher sourcing rules than they have at the ''New York Times'' and the ''Washington Post'', and let's face it, that is now what people are coming to us for. They want to know what is going on with their favorite show, and god knows we have spoiler warnings everywhere to protect those who don't want to know. Most major newspapers have the "three source rule," which means all or part of what you write needs to be covered by three independent sources. We have that in many cases but are sitting on our hands and not writing the info. The "overview" section we do have for the episodes is not really an overview but a collection of speculation from various sources. If Ron Moore said something at a conference three months ago, we treat it as a grand pronouncement ex cathedra even though three months is a long time and a lot of things can change in TV at the last moment. But we have photos of scenes shot (and published!) and we are not writing what is clearly in them. Something is very screwed up here. No journalistic or editorial operation should be operating this way, being so skittish and chicken s--t about things that any reasonable person can conclude are true. We are a month from the start of Season 3, and Battlestar Wiki is lagging way behind other sources, on the Web and elsewhere, about what will be happening in the new season. We need to grow some brass ones, and write what we know. The whole rest of the world is writing about what will be happening starting Oct. 6. We have decided to wait until after it happens. That's not authoritative; that's stupid. --[[User:Elach|Elach]] 02:31, 6 September 2006 (CDT)
:I think you missed the point of what we are. We are guide to BSG. Not a news source. We collect, eveluate the source. We write only facual information on the show. Most of the information on this page has a cite along with it making it true. We knew a long time ago Anadama Plummer was a guest star because of the podcast link, but we didn't sepculate on the plot because production and recordings change sometimes days before airing. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:44, 6 September 2006 (CDT)

== First act up on scifi.com ==
The 1st act of this episode is on the website and some of the speculation is right and some is wrong from the transcript that got circulated earlier this year. Obvious an early draft. In any case, I think that things can be added from this cut from their website which I would like to start after I stop watching this thing over and over and over...and oh by the way, I gotta work to. Maybe I'll make my contributions in a few hours. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:47, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Did anyone else notice that the credits said Candice McClure and not Kandyse McClure? Apparently she had been credited as Candice in some roles earlier in her career but as far as I remember, she has always been credited as Kandyse on Battlestar Galactica. The Sci Fi site still lists her as Kandyse. What gives? Is this just another slip-up on the part of the people in charge of onscreen text? (Remember the problem with Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson in the end credits?) They also spelled Helo's full name incorrectly on the humorous video blog that showed the effect that the Peabody Award had on David Eick. Helo's real name was incorrectly shown as Karl Agation with an "i". [[User:123home123|123home123]] 18:09, 04 October 2006 (EDT)

:I'm going to have to look into that credit issue later. I put a summary in for what was shown on Scifi.com. I hope I did it in the most correct way. Feel free to make modifications where needed. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:53, 04 October 2006 (AST)

:Thanks to Shane, Peter Farago, Spencerian, and Noneofyourbusiness for editing my additions. This is my first time at adding major content to an episode page outside of the The Resistance Webisodes page so I was just letting it flow without worrying about format. Though, I am particularly happy that you all left my use of the terms "skinjobs" and "chromejobs". I felt that this was appropriate from the point of view of the characters involved. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 21:31, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Request that analysis section is deleted! The comments are not analytical and instead seem rather speculative, amounting to nothing which is noteworthy.-- [[User:jxh487|jxh487]]
:Committing an act of vandalism on the main page isn't going to help your case. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:06, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:Jxh487, since the episode has not yet aired, the information is the best official data available. This will last here for one more day in the US, where it will likely be replaced. As the previous user stated, don't vandalize a page to prove a point, please. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:14, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
::Yes, the episode(s) will probably prove or disapprove both points. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:26, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:::I want to add back the note telling about this act being played on the website before the airing on TV because I think it is a significant marketing innovation that should be documented, an innovation as important to record as the plot line in the summer. Thoughts?--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:43, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Speculation? ==

''It is worth noting that in "Exodus, Part II", Ellen betrays Saul in some fashion. Therefore, her motives are presently unknown.''

How can we put this up based on Overview? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:18, 6 October 2006 (CDT)
:We shouldn't. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:31, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

frak the cylons. the human race will ultimately survive. just seen the episode. pretty cool yet it not reveals ellens intentions so we shouldnt. 06:31, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Her intentions are pretty clear. She will protect Saul at all costs. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 06:54, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Oracle Selloi==

I didn't see Amanda Plummer at all in Occuprice, and her name wasn't in credits. Either her scene got deleted, or she'll be appearing in a later episode (more likely, I think). I'm taking her out as a "Special Guest." [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:25, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:From the teaser, it seems she'll be appearing in Exodus. BTW, "Occuprice" doesn't make much sense as Precipice ends on a "pice" instead of a "price". A better merger would be Occupice. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 21:05, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::I noticed that too. But the title comes from on high (ie Ron Moore's blog). I realize he probably just mistyped, but I've gotten used to calling it that. The "-pr-" has a better cadence, in my opinion at least. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 21:33, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

:::I'm hoping to see this character; we have so little information on the nature of [[oracle]]s. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Survivor count ==

Did anyone else notice the lack of a survivor count during the starting credits? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:23, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
:I'm guessing that they didn't want to bother, because the body count is moving too fast, and the humans are all split up to boot. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:: That's my assumption as well, right now. I imagine that after the exodus they might resume the count, at least in some form, provided Roslin ever becomes president again. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:04, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::: I think that the reason is they tell the story from a point of view of the characters not from a God-view (or gods-view in their case) of the overall story - meaning, somebody was keeping track of the population count and they just put that info up front for us. And the person who kept track of the population count was always Roslin. Remember, Roslin always kept the population count up on that wallspace and when Baltar became president he replaced it with his own portrait. Now, with the population split up and Roslin no longer in a place of central control, there's nobody keepin a hard track on the population count so that info isn't available to us because that info isn't available to the characters. That's my take.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 18:16, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Season 2 used a gods-eye-view population count - early on in the season, it reflected deaths on Kobol that Roslin couldn't possibly have known about. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::That might have been a flaw because it was my understanding that the survivor count was reflecting Roslin's survivor count.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:40, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Your understanding is incorrect. See [[Survivor Count]] for a detailed breakdown including several deaths of which Roslin could not have been aware.
::::::There were a total of four people killed on Kobol (Karma, Tarn, Socinus, and Crashdown). The survivors are recovered at the end of "Fragged", but the count in "Resistance" is only decremented by one — presumably Crashdown, who did in fact die in the previous episode. This, along with a single-person decrement between "Scattered" and "Valley of Darkness" in which nobody died except Tarn (who was on Kobol) suggests that the survivor count was omniscient.
::::::Also keep in mind that Roslin was separated from her whiteboard from the end of "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II" to the end of "Home, Part II", and would not have been privy to population statistics. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:52, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== still missed in the summary ==

Thanks to the people on the english side, our summary of Occupation and Precipice were probably the first one, which was released in the internet in german language :o) But there are some things still missing in this both episodes: the discussions between the both Adamas and with Dualla (weak Apollo with fat ash, find somebody who can, Pegasus will not participate), the discussion between Admiral Adama and Sharon Agathon (centurions cannot differenciate the copies), and the discussion of the Cylons at Colonial One (decreasing humankind, the opposition of Galactica-Sharon and Caprica-Six), Galactica-Sharons discussions with several humans and the shooting of Caprica-Six. It would be helpful, if the native english speakers could add this to the summaries and point out the real important informations, which were given. Thank you. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 16:07, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

Talk:Occupation/Archive 1

2006-10-10T21:05:27Z

Tirkon: still missed in the summary

:For discussions prior to October 3, 2006, [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Occupation&oldid=66799 click here].

__TOC__

== Sourcing Rules ==
I wonder if the desire to be "authoritative" here at Battlestar Wiki isn't getting twisted and perverted. We know a lot about Season 3 that is somehow not getting into print. For instance, we have photos of some episodes, casting "sides" from some of the scripts, and comments from some of the participants that amount to a pretty clear picture of some of the major plot points of the first few episodes, yet we are not writing what we clearly KNOW because the episodes have not aired and anything would therefore be "speculative." THIS IS RIDICULOUS. These are tougher sourcing rules than they have at the ''New York Times'' and the ''Washington Post'', and let's face it, that is now what people are coming to us for. They want to know what is going on with their favorite show, and god knows we have spoiler warnings everywhere to protect those who don't want to know. Most major newspapers have the "three source rule," which means all or part of what you write needs to be covered by three independent sources. We have that in many cases but are sitting on our hands and not writing the info. The "overview" section we do have for the episodes is not really an overview but a collection of speculation from various sources. If Ron Moore said something at a conference three months ago, we treat it as a grand pronouncement ex cathedra even though three months is a long time and a lot of things can change in TV at the last moment. But we have photos of scenes shot (and published!) and we are not writing what is clearly in them. Something is very screwed up here. No journalistic or editorial operation should be operating this way, being so skittish and chicken s--t about things that any reasonable person can conclude are true. We are a month from the start of Season 3, and Battlestar Wiki is lagging way behind other sources, on the Web and elsewhere, about what will be happening in the new season. We need to grow some brass ones, and write what we know. The whole rest of the world is writing about what will be happening starting Oct. 6. We have decided to wait until after it happens. That's not authoritative; that's stupid. --[[User:Elach|Elach]] 02:31, 6 September 2006 (CDT)
:I think you missed the point of what we are. We are guide to BSG. Not a news source. We collect, eveluate the source. We write only facual information on the show. Most of the information on this page has a cite along with it making it true. We knew a long time ago Anadama Plummer was a guest star because of the podcast link, but we didn't sepculate on the plot because production and recordings change sometimes days before airing. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:44, 6 September 2006 (CDT)

== First act up on scifi.com ==
The 1st act of this episode is on the website and some of the speculation is right and some is wrong from the transcript that got circulated earlier this year. Obvious an early draft. In any case, I think that things can be added from this cut from their website which I would like to start after I stop watching this thing over and over and over...and oh by the way, I gotta work to. Maybe I'll make my contributions in a few hours. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:47, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Did anyone else notice that the credits said Candice McClure and not Kandyse McClure? Apparently she had been credited as Candice in some roles earlier in her career but as far as I remember, she has always been credited as Kandyse on Battlestar Galactica. The Sci Fi site still lists her as Kandyse. What gives? Is this just another slip-up on the part of the people in charge of onscreen text? (Remember the problem with Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson in the end credits?) They also spelled Helo's full name incorrectly on the humorous video blog that showed the effect that the Peabody Award had on David Eick. Helo's real name was incorrectly shown as Karl Agation with an "i". [[User:123home123|123home123]] 18:09, 04 October 2006 (EDT)

:I'm going to have to look into that credit issue later. I put a summary in for what was shown on Scifi.com. I hope I did it in the most correct way. Feel free to make modifications where needed. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:53, 04 October 2006 (AST)

:Thanks to Shane, Peter Farago, Spencerian, and Noneofyourbusiness for editing my additions. This is my first time at adding major content to an episode page outside of the The Resistance Webisodes page so I was just letting it flow without worrying about format. Though, I am particularly happy that you all left my use of the terms "skinjobs" and "chromejobs". I felt that this was appropriate from the point of view of the characters involved. -- [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 21:31, 04 October 2006 (AST)

Request that analysis section is deleted! The comments are not analytical and instead seem rather speculative, amounting to nothing which is noteworthy.-- [[User:jxh487|jxh487]]
:Committing an act of vandalism on the main page isn't going to help your case. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:06, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:Jxh487, since the episode has not yet aired, the information is the best official data available. This will last here for one more day in the US, where it will likely be replaced. As the previous user stated, don't vandalize a page to prove a point, please. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:14, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
::Yes, the episode(s) will probably prove or disapprove both points. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:26, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:::I want to add back the note telling about this act being played on the website before the airing on TV because I think it is a significant marketing innovation that should be documented, an innovation as important to record as the plot line in the summer. Thoughts?--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:43, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Speculation? ==

''It is worth noting that in "Exodus, Part II", Ellen betrays Saul in some fashion. Therefore, her motives are presently unknown.''

How can we put this up based on Overview? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:18, 6 October 2006 (CDT)
:We shouldn't. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:31, 6 October 2006 (CDT)

frak the cylons. the human race will ultimately survive. just seen the episode. pretty cool yet it not reveals ellens intentions so we shouldnt. 06:31, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Her intentions are pretty clear. She will protect Saul at all costs. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 06:54, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Oracle Selloi==

I didn't see Amanda Plummer at all in Occuprice, and her name wasn't in credits. Either her scene got deleted, or she'll be appearing in a later episode (more likely, I think). I'm taking her out as a "Special Guest." [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:25, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:From the teaser, it seems she'll be appearing in Exodus. BTW, "Occuprice" doesn't make much sense as Precipice ends on a "pice" instead of a "price". A better merger would be Occupice. [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 21:05, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::I noticed that too. But the title comes from on high (ie Ron Moore's blog). I realize he probably just mistyped, but I've gotten used to calling it that. The "-pr-" has a better cadence, in my opinion at least. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 21:33, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

:::I'm hoping to see this character; we have so little information on the nature of [[oracle]]s. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== Survivor count ==

Did anyone else notice the lack of a survivor count during the starting credits? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:23, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
:I'm guessing that they didn't want to bother, because the body count is moving too fast, and the humans are all split up to boot. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:19, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:: That's my assumption as well, right now. I imagine that after the exodus they might resume the count, at least in some form, provided Roslin ever becomes president again. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:04, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::: I think that the reason is they tell the story from a point of view of the characters not from a God-view (or gods-view in their case) of the overall story - meaning, somebody was keeping track of the population count and they just put that info up front for us. And the person who kept track of the population count was always Roslin. Remember, Roslin always kept the population count up on that wallspace and when Baltar became president he replaced it with his own portrait. Now, with the population split up and Roslin no longer in a place of central control, there's nobody keepin a hard track on the population count so that info isn't available to us because that info isn't available to the characters. That's my take.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 18:16, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Season 2 used a gods-eye-view population count - early on in the season, it reflected deaths on Kobol that Roslin couldn't possibly have known about. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::That might have been a flaw because it was my understanding that the survivor count was reflecting Roslin's survivor count.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 19:40, 9 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Your understanding is incorrect. See [[Survivor Count]] for a detailed breakdown including several deaths of which Roslin could not have been aware.
::::::There were a total of four people killed on Kobol (Karma, Tarn, Socinus, and Crashdown). The survivors are recovered at the end of "Fragged", but the count in "Resistance" is only decremented by one — presumably Crashdown, who did in fact die in the previous episode. This, along with a single-person decrement between "Scattered" and "Valley of Darkness" in which nobody died except Tarn (who was on Kobol) suggests that the survivor count was omniscient.
::::::Also keep in mind that Roslin was separated from her whiteboard from the end of "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II" to the end of "Home, Part II", and would not have been privy to population statistics. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:52, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== still missed in the summary ==

Thanks to the people on the english side, our summary of occupation and principe were probably the first one, which was released in the internet in german language :o) But there are some things still missing in this both episodes: the discussions between the both Adamas and with Dualla (weak Apollo with fat ash, find somebody who can, Pegasus will not participate), the discussion between Admiral Adama and Sharon Agathon (centurions cannot differenciate the copies), and the discussion of the Cylons at Colonial One (decreasing humankind, the opposition of Galactica-Sharon and Caprica-Six), Galactica-Sharons discussions with several humans and the shooting of Caprica-Six. It would be helpful, if the native english speakers could add this to the summaries and point out the real important informations, which were given. Thank you. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 16:05, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

Talk:Precipice/Archive 1

2006-10-09T16:53:35Z

Tirkon: /* Casey */

: For earlier discussions in this talk page prior to October 3, 2006, [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Precipice&oldid=81257 click here].

__TOC__

==Production Number==
What's up with "Episode 1.5"? Shouldn't this count as episode 2 of the season, even if it's being aired as a 2-hour premiere? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 03:53, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
:Thats what ive always said, but for some reason all the episode numbering is messed up. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 04:35, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
:The writers officially count "Occupation / Precipice" as one episode. Bradley Thompson said that there will probably be only one intro. So "Precipice" still belongs to episode 1 (hence 1.5) and Season 3 only has 19 episodes on paper --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 05:21, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
::However, in terms of budgeting and production, "Occupation/Precipice" was 3.01 and 3.02, while "Exodus, Part I" and "Exodus, Part II" were both 3.03. Clearly our numbering system shouldn't reflect the vagaries of production, or else both parts of "Resurrection Ship" would be episodes 2.11 and Season 2 would only have 19 episodes.
::At the same time, we should ask - were "Occupation" and "Precipice" truly edited into a single episode, or is SciFi simply airing two episodes back to back on premiere night? In the event of the former, there should be a single entry for both "Occupation" and "Precipice". In the latter, they should retain separate entries, and each should have their own episode number (and none of this "1.5" business). --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 05:34, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
:::FWIW, [http://www.scifi.com/schedulebot/index.php3?date=6-OCT-2006&feed_req SciFi's schedule] has the premiere listed as a single two-hour block under the title "The Occupation/Precipice". I'd lay good money on them splitting it into two episodes for syndication, though. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 05:37, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
::::Well, you could wait until the episodes have aired and edit it then. But I asked Mr. Thompson about just this, and he said "I have not seen the transition yet, but I believe it will be one episode. Which is why Episode 19 is the season 3 finale" in BW:OC. Good point about syndication though. Maybe the place where the break would be is cleary visible. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 05:43, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::Having given it considerable thoght, I think the best reason not to merge them into a single article is that I don't want to be citing ([[The Occupation/Precipice]]) as a single unit for the rest of time. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 06:15, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::One thing I think people aren't getting that that there ARE 20 episodes. "Occuprice" is episode 1, Exodus part 1 is episode 2, so on, totaling up to twenty. (I think) --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:13, 4 October 2006 (CDT)
::::::Whoops, scratch my previous comment that was here, I was wrong. For what it's worth, my DirecTV guide has it as a single two hour airing. With a repeat right after. Methinks that'll be good if there's a podcast for em.--[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:13, 4 October 2006 (CDT)
:::::::There are twenty ''hours'', and (if Occupation/Precipice is counted as one episode) nineteen episodes. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:34, 4 October 2006 (CDT)

===Suggestion===
Here's a thought: Let's follow SciFi's lead with the podcasts. If they put up podcasts for two four-act shows, we'll keep it as two episodes; if they put up a single podcast for an eight-act show, we'll merge them into a single Occupation/Precipice article. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:38, 4 October 2006 (CDT)
:Ya know, so far this is the best suggestion in this whole conversation because I somehow get the feeling that they at scifi are themselves not yet certain about what to call these 2 opening 5 act pieces,but by the time the show starts on Friday, I'm sure they will have it figured out so let's not do their job for them and try to guess what they will do. --[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 16:08, 4 October 2006 (AST)
::I suggest we wait till they air, and see if there's an end between the two. For what it's worth, my DirecTV onscreen guide is showing one two hour block with a repeat right after it. That'll be nice for the podcasts, watch the episode, then right after watch it with commentary. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 20:21, 4 October 2006 (CDT)
Moore refers to the show as "Occupation/Precipice" in his [http://blog.scifi.com/battlestar/archives/2006/10/#a001414 latest blog entry]. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:04, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:RDM often will lead off each podcast with (outside the I'm RDM, etc.) "and this is episode X of season Y, 'Z'". That may provide some insight as well if he continues that practice. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:53, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/season03/ SciFi.com] gives the two-hour premiere production numbers 301 and 302. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:36, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Using the second content warning after the ''bombing'' as the start of ''Precipice''. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 06:43, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::RDM states this on the podcast too. Baltar/Roslin cell scene is the first of ''Precipice''. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 09:07, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Pic==
What's that gold thing on Helo's lapel/uniform? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:52, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:Here is a better pic [[:Image:Greys_Mini.JPG]]. I believe that it is a symbol for the twelve colonies. But Kat doesn't have it?? --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 13:11, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:It's a version of the Colonial seal with a smaller Phoenix in the center: http://bsgmedia.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=26&pos=81 --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 13:17, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
::If we don't have a pic here, we need it. :) --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 13:18, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
:::The best option is probably to make a high resolution screencap from DVD (if a suitable closeup is available). Episodes with dress grays: Miniseries, Act of Contrition, Home II --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 13:25, 5 October 2006 (CDT)
In the episode itself, Kat's Grays does have the lapel pin. I was specifically looking for it in the scene, it must be a mistake in this picture. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 10:12, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:Yeah, made sure I checked that too. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 10:14, 7 October 2006 (CDT)

==Casey==
I'd like to start a page for Kara's daughter, but I'm not really sure how to spell her name. Casey? Kasey? If it is Casey, we'll need to disambiguate, as there's already a pilot named that. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 13:47, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
:I don't suppose anybody was watching with captions on? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:22, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::The credits have it has "Kacey" in the credits. Also, spelled that way the RDM Chicago Tribune article. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 14:51, 7 October 2006 (CDT)
::I had the captions on, and it was "Kacey". --[[User:ThesposAZ|ThesposAZ]] 02:37, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
::I am a captions type of guy also. :) --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:39, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
Hey on the Answers thing for Kara's Duaghter says 16 months. That can't be right because it had to come to termm which would take nine months so two months after Baltar becomes the presisdent and the episode is 16 months subtract 2 months and she would be 14 months old and not 16 months old.- Best Snorkel378
:Incorrect. Baltar was elected c. Day 280. The one-year jump brought us to c. Day 660 by the end of LDYB2. Occupation began on the 134th day of the Cylon occupation, bringing us to c. Day 794 - roughly 27 months after the holocaust. Kara's ovary was removed during The Farm, which took place roughly 2 months after the holocaust. Add nine months for gestation and we get 27-(2+9) = 16. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:36, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
::To clarify - your problem is that you're rounding dates down and the error is accumulating. The jump forward in LDYB2 was 380 days, which is about 12 and 2/3 months. Then the jump between LDYB2 and Occupation is 134 days, which is 4 and 1/2 months. On top of it, the election in LDYB2 didn't take place exactly 270 days after the holocaust - the debates lasted about ten days, which is another 1/3 month, and the events of "Downloaded" were ''also'' said to be about 9 months post-holocaust, which pushes LDYB2 a few days forward to make everything fit. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:48, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
Does anyone think that Kacey might have been deliberately injured while Kara was out of the room, to force her sentiments? The Cylons have been shown to inflict wounds on one another for the purpose of emotional manipulation before, to encourage feelings of love between humans and Cylons (the Litmus episode). Since Kara's imprisonment seems to be one big mind game, I can't shake this feeling. --[[User:tt25|tt25]] 15:57, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
: I believe this to be likely. However, this is assuming that Kasey is Kara's biological child -- or even a hybrid at all. Kasey could just as easily be a child they picked up off the streets of New Caprica to mind-frak Kara. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:51, 8 October 2006 (CDT)
:: I think, the actress does not fit to Kasey's age of 16 month. Children do their first steps, when they are about one year old. Kasey trampolines on the sofa and runs around. Her behaviour is too safe. -- [[User:Tirkon|Tirkon]] 11:53, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

Precipice

2006-10-08T18:47:19Z

Tirkon:

{{Episode Data
| title= Precipice
| image=Season 3 - Promo - Epi 1 - 2 - C-Number Eight, Adama, Helo.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 1.5
| guests=
| writer= [[Ronald D. Moore]]
| story=
| director= [[Sergio Mimica-Gezzan]]
| production=
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-06
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population= ?
| prev= [[Occupation]]
| next= [[Exodus, Part I]]
}}

== Overview ==
:''After the suicide bombing, the [[Cylons (RDM) |Cylons]] institutes stricter controls on the human population on [[New Caprica]]. Aboard ''[[Galactica]]'', plans for the rescue from New Caprica move forward now that communication with the resistance has been established.

== Summary ==
*[[Gaius Baltar]] visits [[Laura Roslin]] (gathered up in detention apparently for his need) in her detention cell to discuss the suicide bombings, after which he releases her.
*After [[Duck]]'s suicide bombing in an effort to kill Baltar, the Cylons begin a crackdown and round up random civilians.
*[[Felix Gaeta]] continues to give information to the resistance, though [[Galen Tyrol]] is unaware that Gaeta is his source inside the presidency. Tyrol calls Gaeta a collaborator.
*Admiral [[William Adama|Adama]] swears in [[Sharon Agathon]] as a Colonial officer and sends her down to New Caprica to help the resistance.
*[[Saul Tigh]], Chief Tyrol, and [[Samuel Anders]] decide to meet Agathon in a canyon outside of town after she [[FTL|Jumps]] inside the planetary atmosphere.
*[[Ellen Tigh]], after being threatened with more harm to Colonel Tigh, gives the Cylons information on where the meeting is to take place.
*Another suicide bombing, attacking the power plant and causing severe damage, moves the Cylons to more drastic actions.
*The Cylons force Baltar to sign an execution order for 200 civilians, including [[Cally Tyrol]], Roslin and [[Tom Zarek]]. The detainees are transported outside the city.
*As Sharon Agathon and Anders formulate their plans, they are ambushed by Centurions.
*While stopping to ostensibly let the detainees stretch their legs, [[Jammer]] cuts Cally Tyrol's bonds and tells her to run from the area. As as she gets away, [[Cylon Centurion]]s show up to execute the detainees with Zarek pulling Roslin away from the front of the crowd. As Cally Tyrol runs through the forest, the sound of automatic gunfire rings out.

== Questions ==

*If [[Sharon Agathon]] is killed during her mission on [[New Caprica]], will she be able to download into a new body?
**Most likely yes, but she would be immediately captured as an intelligence source, along with any memories she has as of that download. It is feasible that these memories may be distributed to the rest of the Cylons.
*Is the [[Sharon Agathon]] that Anders meets up with the same one that flew the Raptor? Where are the Marines that were accompaning her?
**She tells the Marines to hang back and find cover when they reach the rendezvous point. Also, she uses passwords with Anders.
*Where will [[Cally Tyrol]] be able to run to? She was ordered to face execution by the Colonial Government.
*Why did the Cylons abandon their plan for a public execution? More importantly, if we are to assume that the gunfire at the end of the episode is not from the Centurions, then who is firing?
**There is the possibility, however remote, that it was the New Caprica Police who opened fire on the Centurions. However, story-wise that might be a cop-out, and it is unlikely that the NCP would take such action, Jammer's release of Cally not withstanding.
**Another possibility is that the gunfire we heard is somehow coming from Sharon/Anders and their rescue team. Of course they would've had to escape/defeat the ambush and somehow come upon the execution scene, and these events appear to be happening concurrently.
*What is the role of the five unseen Cylon models in the occupation? Are they present and simply remaining off-camera for the benefit of the audience? Have they attempted to hide themselves from the Colonials?
**{{spoiltext|*Grace Park, Dean Stockwell, and Tricia Helfer have indicated in interviews that the last five models are so secret that even the seven models known to the audience don't know who these five are.}}
*Why did no Leoben Conoy copies take part in the deliberation on Colonial One over whether or not to issue the execution order?
**Conoy's motives on New Caprica appear to be entirely selfish—he is there for Kara Thrace only.
***But what of other copies?
*[[Cally Henderson]] and [[Sharon Valerii (Caprica copy)]] both took their husbands' names upon marriage, as did [[Ellen Tigh]], [[Caroline Adama]] and [[Sesha Abinell]]. Are [[Anastasia Dualla]] and [[Kara Thrace]] now Anastasia Adama, and Kara Anders, respectively?
*What is the relationship between Caprica-Six's shooting and the reappearance of [[Cylon-Related_Hallucinations#Baltar.27s_Internal_Six |Baltar's Internal Six]]?
**It is possible that two events are not directly related. The reappearance was not immediate, but happened after [[Number Five]] and [[Cavil]] continued to threaten Baltar with death. Since Caprica-Six's support was gone, Baltar was under severe stress and thought that he might likely die. Internal-Six has shown a tendency to appear at those times, especially if Baltar's survival is at stake.
*Now that the Lt. Sharon Agathon has landed on the surface of New Caprica, how can she be distingushed from other [[Number Eight]]s there?
**Other than her [[flight suit]], it remains unclear how [[Sharon Agathon]] will be distinguished from other [[Number Eight]]s.
**As indicated by Adama earlier in the episode, Centurions are incapable of distinguishing each individual Cylon copy of a model (in this case, Number Eight), as they have limited sentience.
*If the Centurions are incapable of distinguishing between individual copies of a model, why would they fire on Sharon Agathon, who should be just another Eight to them?
**Sharon's back was turned to the Centurions most or all of the time before the shooting began. They may not have registered her presence in the group.
**As referenced above, her Colonial-issue flight suit may have given her away. No "legitimate" Eight on New Caprica would need to wear one.
* What will happen if Sharon Agathon discovers that [[Hera]]'s death was faked? Will she renege on her oath to Adama -- and how will this affect her sympathies to Adama, who would clearly be "in the know" regarding this hoax?
** Adama's complete lack of reaction during their conversation when she mentioned the loss of the baby may indicate that he don't know.
* Why didn't Duck tell Tyrol that Jammer had joined the New Caprica Police?
**He may not have known until the graduation ceremony, since the members of the police force are secretive about their identities.
*Did Kacey fall down the stairs or was she pushed?

== Analysis ==
*We learn a little bit more about the nature of the various humanoid Cylons here. Apparently a single copy is usually qualified to speak for its entire model. Interestingly, [[Caprica-Six]] was unable to dissuade her "sisters" from voting to execute the dissidents.
*As one of the Cavils notes, adherence to the Cylon creed has become increasingly perfunctory. The Cylons sought the President's signature as a mere formality.
*If [[Leoben Conoy]]'s story is true, [[Kacey]] can't be older than 16 months. As of this episode, it has been about 27 months since the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies|fall of the Colonies]]. Kara Thrace's incarceration at the [[Farms|Farm]] on Caprica took place about two months after the fall of the Colonies.
*Even if Ellen Tigh's actions are as reprehensible as ever, her motivations this time around are rather more laudable. These two episodes seem to indicate that she truly does care for her husband.

== Notes ==
*"Occupation/[[Precipice]]" was awarded the [[Awards and Honors|IGN.com Editor's choice award]], following a review in which it recieved a rating of 10/10.
*"[[Occupation]]" and "Precipice" is edited as one 2-hr episode with only one introduction. However, in the podcast, [[Ronald D. Moore]] indicates the "beginning" of "Precipice" as the scene with Baltar and Roslin in the detention cell.
*In the podcast, [[Ronald D. Moore]] states that references to "The Twist" and "The Swirl" are a homage to ''[[Wikipedia:Seinfeld |Seinfeld]]''. The episode in question is "[[Wikipedia:The Fusilli Jerry |The Fusilli Jerry]]."
*Felix Gaeta's given name, first revealed in "[[Final Cut]]," is spoken out loud for the first time.
*Caprica-Valerii has married Karl Agathon and taken his last name. She continues to be confined to her cell, but it has been decorated and furnished. Ironically enough, she still calls him "Helo."
*Sharon Agathon and William Adama have continued to develop the rapport which they established in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]." In this episode, he comissions her as a lieutenant and releases her from her cell.
*[[Number Three]]'s claim that Caprica-Six's assault on her was the first case of Cylon-on-Cylon violence in their history is not really true. Sharon Agathon shot and "killed" another Eight outside the Delphi spaceport on Caprica. The Cylons may not look on this in the same light because it was within one model. Alternatively, Number Eight may have been unable to identify her shooter. This is plausible because that copy was looking at Helo when she was shot, and afterwards could only stare up into the sky for a few seconds before dying and presumably downloading.
**Actually, Sharon Agathon also shot a Six previous to that, but we may presume that Six consented as part of the Cylons' plan for Helo.
*Ironically, a Five shoots Caprica-Six in the head shortly after Three's statement. Cavil indicates, however, that she won't be "boxed," as Caprica feared in "[[Downloaded]]."
*The shooting of the captives and Cally Tyrol's escape at the end of the episode are an homage to ''[[Wikipedia:The Great Escape|The Great Escape]]''.
*Baltar's Internal-Six appears only after Caprica-Six is killed.
*This episode has the second highest number of guest stars. Only the [[Miniseries]] had more credited stars.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==
*''Discussing suicide bombings:''
:'''Galen Tyrol''': This is crazy. You know, we'll need to figure out whose side we're on?
:'''Saul Tigh''': Which side are we on? We're on the side of the demons, Chief. We are evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the forces of death to spread devastation and destruction where ever we go. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

*''After being arrested, held without charge and carted to a remote location:''
:'''Tom Zarek''': Laura.. That election last year. You tried to steal it, didn't you?
:'''Laura Roslin''': Yes, Tom. I did.
:'''Tom Zarek''': (laughs) Ah... I wish you'd gone through with it.
:'''Laura Roslin''': So do I.

*''Talking in a cell:''
:'''Cally''': "...frak you Sharon, you stupid frakked-up toaster. How many times do I have to shoot you anyway?"

*''After being slapped by Roslin for accussing her of working for the Cylons:''
:'''Saul Tigh''': You see, little things like that they don't matter anymore. Fact, not too frakking much really matter anymore. I got one job here lady, and one job only. To disrupt the Cylons, make them worry about the ant hill they stirred up down here so they're distracted and out of position when the old man show up in orbit. The bombings, they got the Cylons' attention, they really got their attention. And I am not giving that up.
:'''Laura Roslin''': We are talking about people blowing themselves up.
:'''Tigh''': You know, sometimes I think that you've got ice water in those veins. And other times, I just think that you're just a naive little school teacher. I've sent men on suicide missions in two wars now, and let me tell you something. It don't make a godsdamn bit of difference whether they're riding in a Viper or walking out onto a parade ground. In the end they're just as dead. (pauses) So, take your piety, and your moralizing, and your high-minded principles, and stick 'em somewhere safe until you're off the rock and sitting in your nice, cushy chair on Colonial One again. (stands) I've got a war to fight (leaves).

*''As the Cylons try to force Balter to sign the execution order, following Number Five's shooting of Capirca-Six in the head:''
:'''Cavil''': "She'll be back..."
:'''Cavil''': "... but if he pulls that trigger now, you won't."

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==
*[[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
*[[Matthew Bennett]] as [[Number Five]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Rick Worthy]] as [[Simon]]
*[[Dean Stockwell]] as [[Cavil]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]]
*[[Luciana Carro]] as Lt. [[Louanne Katraine]] ([[Kat]])
*[[Leah Cairns]] as Lt. [[Margaret Edmondson]] ([[Racetrack]])
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon]] ([[Helo]])
*[[Christian Tessier]] as [[Tucker Clellan]] ([[Duck]])
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Henderson Tyrol]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Dominic Zamprogna]] as [[James Lyman]] ([[Jammer]])
*[[Brad Dryborough]] as Lt. [[Hoshi]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category: A to Z]]
[[Category: RDM]]
[[Category:Episodes written by Ronald D. Moore]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Sergio Mimica-Gezzan]]

[[de:Precipice]]

Occupation

2006-10-08T07:36:22Z

Tirkon:

{{Episode Data
| title= Occupation
| image=Season 3 - Promo - Epi 1 - 2 - Number Three talking.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 1
| guests=
| writer= [[Ronald D. Moore]]
| story=
| director= [[Sergio Mimica-Gezzan]]
| production=
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-10-06
| UK airdate=
| population= ?
| prev= [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]
| next= [[Precipice]]
}}

== Overview ==
:''The [[Cylons (RDM) |Cylons]] have occupied the human settlement of [[New Caprica]], and it's been three months since ''[[Galactica]],'' ''[[Pegasus]]'', and a handful of ships escaped into deep space. But the fight is not over. On New Caprica, a resistance has begun — and despite having only a handful of untested pilots at his command, [[Admiral Adama]] is committed to risking everything on a daring attack to rescue the people he left behind.'' <ref>[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/episodes/ SciFi Episode Guide]</ref>

== Summary ==
*The episode begins with a series of cut scenes. Light flashes over [[Saul Tigh]]'s face. He is in a prison cell, his missing eye patched over with a gauze bandage, and has scratched notches into a calendar on the wall. His wife, [[Ellen Tigh]], is having sex with one of the Cavils. [[Laura Roslin]] lights a candle and prays to the [[Religion in the Twelve Colonies#Lords of Kobol|gods]]. [[Galen Tyrol]] and [[Samuel Anders]] are planting a bomb using [[G-4]] and an [[A-type detonator]] within a building space.
*[[Kara Thrace]] is inside a neatly decorated room, setting a table.
*Admiral [[William Adama]] tries to strategize a rescue plan with a series of various models of fighters, support vehicles and other civilian ships in the [[Situation Room]]'s plot table, but becomes frustrated and hurls a model across the table.
*A Cavil walks into Tigh's cell and taunts him as he attempts to hide the calendar that he has scratched in the wall. A copy of [[Leoben Conoy]] walks into the room where Thrace sits at table, carrying her dinner. He sits and prays to [[God|"The Heavenly Father."]]
*Thrace coyly asks the Conoy copy for a knife for her steak, but Conoy takes his knife and cuts her steak himself.
*Tyrol and Anders scatter away as a [[Heavy Raider]] lands near their bomb.
*After Ellen Tigh's liaison with her Cavil copy, she asks when will she gets what she asked for, suggesting a previous deal. The Cylon informs her that it should be happening right at that moment. At same time, the Cavil in the cell with Colonel Tigh releases him from prison in a very taunting way. Tigh exits the prison and his wife meets him at the gate.
*A group of '[[Cylon agent|skinjobs]]' including at least 3 [[Eight]]s, 3 [[Six]]es, and 2 [[Five]]s approach the Heavy Raider as several '[[Cylon Centurion|chromejobs]]' exit it. Tyrol and Anders set off the bomb. A great explosion ensues that is witnessed by the Conoy copy with Thrace from their apartment. He returns to the table, pushes his knife away from Thrace.
*As he comments on how beautiful she is, Thrace stabs him in the neck with metal chopsticks. As he dies (while Thrace repeatedly stabs his chest for good measure), he tells Thrace that he will see her soon. She tells him to take his time. Then, after wiping her hand on the carpet, she returns to the table and calmly resumes eating dinner.

<blockquote>''This is the end of the "FirstLook" sneak peak video provided on the official website of Scifi.com.''</blockquote>

== Questions ==
*How did Anders manage to recover from his pneumonia without the medical supplies Thrace was seeking in "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]"?
** It is possible his own bodily defenses fought it off or he received medical supplies from a Cylon.

*Is this episode further evidence that [[Jammer]] is another Cylon model? He was standing next to Duck when they assembled for the graduation, and it is unlikely that he would have survived the explosion at such close range.
**In the podcast, [[Ronald D. Moore]] states that Jammer just happens to survives, another issue with which he has deal. An unfilmed scene was to show him waking up, under bodies, and having to move body parts out of the way. It was to be shown where his flashback of Cally's arrest occurs.

== Analysis ==

* Given the dialogue during the scene and the marks on Ellen Tigh's face, it appears that Cavil has a penchant for "rough sex," adding to the sacrifice being made by Ellen to free Saul Tigh.
* During the episode, Conoy mentions that Kara has succeeded in killing Conoy five times prior to this airing.
**Upon his return from being downloaded, Conoy stated that it had been five times (including the killing that was shown).

== Notes ==
*"Occupation" and "[[Precipice]]" is edited as one 2-hr episode with only one intro. However, in the podcast, [[Ronald D. Moore]] indicates the "beginning" of "Precipice".
*The episode opens on the 134th day since the Cylon occupation.
*Crew changes in the year after settlement glimpsed in "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]" are confirmed here: Helo is serving as XO on ''Galactica'', with Kat as CAG. Dualla is serving as XO on ''Pegasus''.
* Apollo has gained roughly 40 pounds since the the fleet found New Caprica. The Admiral states that he is soft, both physically and mentally.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==
*[[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
*[[Matthew Bennett]] as [[Number Five]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Rick Worthy]] as [[Simon]]
*[[Dean Stockwell]] as [[Cavil]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]]
*[[Luciana Carro]] as Lt. [[Louanne Katraine]] ([[Kat]])
*[[Leah Cairns]] as Lt. [[Margaret Edmondson]] ([[Racetrack]])
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon]] ([[Helo]])
*[[Christian Tessier]] as [[Tucker Clellan]] ([[Duck]])
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Henderson Tyrol]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Dominic Zamprogna]] as [[James Lyman]] ([[Jammer]])
*[[Brad Dryborough]] as Lt. [[Hoshi]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category: A to Z]]
[[Category: RDM]]
[[Category:Episodes written by Ronald D. Moore]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Sergio Mimica-Gezzan]]

[[de:Occupation]]

Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance

2006-10-06T18:40:39Z

Tirkon: /* Episode 2 */

:''This page covers the webisode series titled "The Resistance," which follows the exploits of the [[New Caprica Resistance]]. For other meanings, see "[[Resistance]]".''

{{Episode Data
| image=Webisode Resistance - 1.jpg
| title=Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance
| series=
| special= Y
| season=
| episode=
| guests=
| writer=[[Bradley Thompson]] [[David Weddle]]
| story=
| director=[[Wayne Rose]]
| production=
| rating=
| US airdate= 2006-09-05 through 2006-10-05
| UK airdate= Not yet available in the UK<ref name="SkyOneWebisodes">"Unfortunately it seems like these webisodes are exclusives to scifi.com and Sky don't have any publishing rights to them just yet. We are working to aquire these sorts of extras but it's a work in progress..." - Sky One forum Administrator 09-07-2006</ref>
| dvd=
| population=
| prev= [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]
| next= [[Occupation]]
}}

'''''Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance''''' is an online series that aims to fill in the gaps between seasons [[Season 2 (2005-06)|two]] and [[Season 3 (2006-07)|three]] of the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Re-imagined Series]]. The webisodes can be viewed through the official [http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/video/webisodes/ web portal] at [http://www.scifi.com/ SciFi.com]. An official [http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/video/webisodes/faq.html FAQ] deals with availability and technical issues.

The webisode series was written by ''Battlestar Galactica'' veterans [[Bradley Thompson]] and [[David Weddle]], and directed by [[Wayne Rose]]. The entire series is 25 minutes long in total, divided into 10 episodes.

== Summary ==
===Episode 1===
* Running time: ~3:19
* Starts on the 67th day after [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]

Tyrol and Tigh organize the budding resistance movement on Cylon-occupied New Caprica, but they find recruiting new soldiers is becoming dangerous and difficult. The Cylons have instituted a curfew. Violators go to jail, which is the first thing the Cylons built on [[New Caprica]]. New Capricans are shot on the spot if weapons are found in their tents. A stash of weapons belonging to [[Longo]] was confiscated by the Cylons, but the resistance was able to retrieve some of them which were hidden underneath his latrine. The Cylons are also setting up a [[New Caprica Police|human police force]] to take over for the [[Cylon Centurion]]s, who are doing most of the police work.

===Episode 2===
*Running time: ~1:54
[[Duck]] has refused to work with the resistance, on the grounds of his relationship and intended child with [[Nora]]. Tyrol is highly displeased at this, particularly his reasons, as they parallel Tyrol's own situation; Jammer suggests respecting Duck's decision.

A ritual for protection of the crops from blight is said in the temple. As Sister [[Tivenan]] leaves, [[Jean Barolay]] abruptly shifts the conversation to the movement of the weapons stash into the [[temple]]; [[Jammer]] strongly objects, but he is overruled by Tigh.

===Episode 3===
*Running time: ~2:42
In the evening, Nora prays to Aphrodite to bless she and Duck with a child. He tells her his decision about joining the resistance. She is pleased that he refused Tyrol.

During the night, Tigh, Tyrol, Jammer, and Barolay move the weapons into the temple disguising them.

The next morning, Nora wakes Duck saying he will be late to work. She tries to convince him to go to temple after work with her. He refuses, saying he talks to the gods in his own way.

===Episode 4===
*Running time: ~1:57
[[Cally]] and [[Nora]] visit the temple. Nora is holding Cally's baby while Cally is performing a ceremony. At that moment [[Cylon Centurion|Cylon Centurions]] can be heard outside, and a [[Number Five]] announces that they will enter the temple. Several men try to block them, but the Cylons force their way in and gunfire can be seen and heard. While trying to run away Cally falls to the ground protecting her baby, but Nora is shot and killed when she tries to retrieve her bag.

===Episode 5===
*Running time: ~1:56
Tyrol, Cally and Jammer return Nora's bag to Duck, and inform him about the death of Nora. Duck is physically sickened by the news. He becomes angry and demands to know if there were weapons in the temple. Tyrol tries to avoid the question, but Duck doesn't relent until Tyrol admits the truth. At that point, Duck orders them out of his tent.

===Episode 6===
*Running time: ~1:37
Three days after the attack on the temple, Tigh, Barolay, and Jammer discuss the results of the attack, which has brought about positive effects for the resistance. The general population has started to side with the resistance and 1,000 people protested outside [[Colonial One]] over the attack on the temple. Since the attack, recruitment has become easier with 150 Colonials signing up. Tigh thinks that this was a good deal because the loss of a few weapons was worth the propaganda victory. However, Jammer is upset that the loss of 10 lives was not worth it. Tigh comes down hard on Jammer, stating that people die in war, nice people, and the resistance has no room for crybabies.

===Episode 7===
*Running time: ~1:58

[[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] and [[Saul Tigh|Tigh]] discuss the capture of [[Jammer]] by the Cylons. Tyrol insists that Jammer won't reveal the work of the resistance. Jammer is imprisoned in the [[New Caprica Detention Center]] and is visited by a [[Number Five]], who frees him of his bonds and says he wants to talk to him about what happened in the temple.

===Episode 8===
*Running time: ~3:56
[[Number Five]] proposes to [[Jammer]] that the massacre at the [[temple]] may have actually been planned by the [[Resistance]]. Number Five reminds Jammer of the good that has been accomplished by working together in peace. He offers Jammer the chance to stop further bloodshed by informing the [[Cylons]] of potentially life-threatening actions by the Resistance. Jammer balks at the idea of becoming a [[New Caprica Police|traitor]] to the Resistance, but accepts a key card which will let him enter the Cylon detention center to report the Resistance's secret plans if he chooses to become an informant.

===Episode 9===
*Running time: ~3:07
[[James Lyman|Jammer]] is released from the [[New Caprica Detention Center]] and is met outside by [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]]. Tyrol notes that he was informed of Jammer's arrest by [[Sharon Valerii (Galactica copy)|Boomer]], and then asks him what he told the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons]]. Jammer nervously explains that the Toasters questioned him about the [[temple]] massacre. Jammer reassures Tyrol that he did not tell the Cylons anything, but Tyrol appears doubtful.

Meanwhile, [[Tucker Clellan|Duck]] returns to his tent and begins to clean up the mess from his earlier outburst. He bursts into tears while gathering up a broken picture frame and an icon of the [[Lords of Kobol]].

===Episode 10===
*Running time: ~4:34
After the dedication ceremony for [[Galen Tyrol]] and [[Cally Henderson Tyrol]]'s [[Nicholas Tyrol|son]], [[Tucker Clellan|Duck]] approaches Tyrol in the temple. Duck informs Tyrol that he has joined the [[New Caprica Police]], in hopes of finding out who tipped the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons]] off and is responsible for [[Nora]]'s death.

Afterwards, Tyrol meets in the backroom with [[Saul Tigh]], [[James Lyman|Jammer]] and [[Jean Barolay]] to discuss their next move against the Cylons. Tigh suggests hiding explosives in the grain silo, which Jammer points out is across from the hospital. When Tigh shows a lack of concern for the patients' safety, Jammer excuses himself "to patrol the perimeter."

Outside, Duck is smoking and examining his new NCP patch. He puts it away when Jammer comes out, and the two friends share a smoke together. Jammer notices that Duck said he was going to quit, to which Duck says "What's the point?" and leaves. Once alone, Jammer sits quietly, and reaches into his pocket to find the Cylon device [[Number Five]] gave him. 

== Questions ==

== Analysis ==
*Jammer is unsurprised to hear that [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] and [[Sharon Valerii (Galactica copy)|Boomer]] have been speaking. Apparently they have resumed some sort of contact since the occupation. How does this sit with other members of the resistance?

== Notes ==
*The original title of the webisode series was "Crossroads"
[[Image:Chinese_characters.png|thumb|300px|The Chinese Characters behind Tyrol in Webisode 7]]
*Three [[Wikipedia:Chinese character|Chinese characters]] can be seen on a crate behind Tyrol at around 2:10 (in the countdown-style timer used by the SciFi.com Video Player) in the seventh episode. They are too blurry to readily identify. They are "盐","渍" or "溃", "姜" respectively.
*Currently, for legal reasons, attempting to view the webisodes from outside of the USA will present you with a frozen video player stating either of two messages:
** "Your video will begin playing after a brief advertisement." (in the case of the webisode splash page currently on scifi.com)
** "We're sorry, but the clip selected isn't available from your location. Please select another clip." (if the user opens the video on Sci Fi's Pulse website)
:Users outside of America will have to wait until a DVD release, television broadcast, or some other means becomes available to view them.
* Originally it was stated that new webisodes would be available midnight on Tuesday and Thursday. This no longer appears to be the case, but rather new webisodes appearing at noon [[Wikipedia:North American Eastern Time Zone|EDT]] on the appropriate day.
* In the sixth episode, Tigh states that 20 billion humans were "burned" by the Cylons. Also, he uses a new slang term for Centurions, "chrome jobs." This is likely inspired by the [[Caprica Resistance]]'s calling [[Cylon agent|cylon agents]] "skin jobs."
*[[Number Five]] uses Jammer's real name, [[James Lyman]].
*Episode Nine was made available Monday, October 2nd, 2006 at noon.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

'''''[[#Episode 6|Episode Six]]'''''

:'''[[Jammer]]''': What about the ten innocent people? Why don't you tell [[Duck]] what a bargain you got for Nora's life? 
:'''[[Saul Tigh]]''': You got that ass-backwards, sonny. We didn't shoot those people, the chrome jobs did... 
:'''Jammer''': Because we hid weapons there! 
:'''Tigh''': Hey! We're not playing pattycake here. These bastards burned up [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies|twenty billion]] of us, you gonna say that's our fault, too? Instead of bawlin' like a little girl, you should focus on getting some payback. 
:'''Jammer''': Is that all this is about to you? Blood for blood? 
:'''Tigh''': We're at war! War is messy! People get killed- good people, nice people. Get that through your head, or get out! We don't need any cry-babies in this outfit.

== Official Statements ==

When ''[[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques/Archive03#Webisode series|Battlestar Wiki asked Bradley Thompson]]'' about the webisode series, he said:

:"It's true that David Weddle and I wrote the webisodes. Ron Moore and David Eick assigned them to us during the production of Exodus. The ten short segments combine to tell one story, which takes place during the Cylon Occupation that ended Season 2. The webisodes plant seeds that come to fruition in Season 3. They were all directed by Wayne Rose, the veteran director who's been doing 2nd Unit and 1stAD work for the series. The original title of the story was "Crossroads." The running lengths will vary with what's necessary to tell each segment of the story. The first cut I saw of all ten ran about 25 minutes. The run plan we were told was that they'd put up one a week as a countdown to the season premiere -- but SciFi may have other ideas on that by now."

"Nora is played by Emily Holmes. Longo is spelled the way you have it." -- contents of September 5, 2006 message from [[Bradley Thompson]]

=== Contract Disputes and Production Delays===

According to Bradley Thompson, the webisodes were originally meant to be aired once a week, for the 10 weeks preceding the Season 3 premiere on October 6th. This would have resulted in the webisodes premiering in mid-August. However, their release was delayed due to a labor dispute between the Writer's Guild of America and NBC/Universal regarding extra pay for the writers doing the webisodes.

In August 2006, news began to leak out that the release of the webisodes would be delayed, though they were essentially finished at the time. NBC-Universal did not want to pay the writing team for webisodes content, holding that they were not actually covered under Guild contract, and were technically just promotional material. The ''Battlestar Galactica'' writing team embraced the new story opportunity, but other NBC-Universal series such as ''The Office'' felt that webisodes were nothing but extra filler they were being forced to crank out. According to Thompson, the writing team was given extra pay for vaguely described "extra work", but no long-term resolution was ever reached. The WGA is concerned about the long-term implications of online content: writers are not specifically compensated for their work on them, and NBC/Uni might argue that they have no claim on redistribution profits if they try to classify it as "promotional" material. In any event, by August 2006 the negotiations between the WGA and NBC/Uni broke down, and the WGA ordered all series producing webisodes (such as ''Battlestar Galactica'' and ''The Office'') to refuse to physically deliver the webisodes to NBC/Uni for distribution online. NBC/Universal, who produces both shows, has filed a complaint with National Labor Relations Board, claiming that this writing is included in the current WGA contract and urging the NLRB to make the series release the material.

However, several weeks later the finished webisodes were handed over to NBC/Uni. The first of ten webisodes is due to be released on Tuesday, September 5, 2006, and subsequent installments are scheduled for every Tuesday and Thursday until the Season 3 premiere on October 6, 2006.

== Cast ==
These are listed in the order they appeared during the 10 episodes.

{| class="messagebox" cellspacing="2" cellpadding="2"
! class="infoboxheader" | '''Cast Member'''
! class="infoboxheader" | '''Character'''
! class="infoboxheader" colspan="10" | '''Episode(s)'''
|-
| [[Nicki Clyne]]
| [[Cally Henderson Tyrol|Cally Henderson]]
| 1
|
|
| 4
| 5
|
|
|
|
| 10
|-
| [[Aaron Douglas]]
| [[Galen Tyrol]]
| 1
| 2
| 3
|
| 5
|
| 7
|
| 9
| 10
|-
| [[Christian Tessier]]
| [[Tucker Clellan|Tucker "Duck" Clellan]]
| 1
| 2
| 3
|
| 5
|
|
|
| 9
| 10
|-
| [[Dominic Zamprogna]]
| [[Jammer]]
| 1
| 2
| 3
|
| 5
| 6
| 7
| 8
| 9
| 10
|-
| [[Michael Hogan]]
| [[Saul Tigh]]
| 1
| 2
| 3
|
|
| 6
| 7
|
|
| 10
|-
| [[imdb:nm0391820|Emily Holmes]]
| [[Nora]]
| 1
|
| 3
| 4
|
|
|
|
|
|
|-
| [[Alisen Down]]
| [[Jean Barolay]]
|
| 2
| 3
|
|
| 6
|
|
|
| 10
|-
| [[imdb:nm0601003|Carmen Moore]]
| [[Tivenan|Sister Tivenan]]
|
| 2
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| 10
|-
| [[Matthew Bennett]]
| [[Number Five]]
|
|
|
|
|
|
| 7
| 8
|
|
|}

== Crew ==
In his September 6th 2006 [http://blog.scifi.com/battlestar/archives/2006/09/#a001251 official blog post], [[Ronald D. Moore]] recognized all the crew involved in the production of the webisodes.

Director: [[Wayne Rose]].
Writers: [[Bradley Thompson]] & [[David Weddle]].
Executive Producers: [[Ron D. Moore]] and [[David Eick]].
Producer: [[Harvey Frand]].
Co-Producers: Bradley Thompson & David Weddle.
Producer, Post Production work: Paul Leonard.
Director of Photography: John Drake.
Editors: Michael O'Halloran, Tim Kinzy, Ian Kezbaum, and Harry Jierjian.
Music: [[Bear McCreary]].

Visual Effects Supervisor: [[Gary Hutzel]].
Unit Production Manager: Boris Ivanov.
First Assistant Directors: Shirley-Anne Parsons and Alexia Droz.
Second Assistant Director: Mindy Heslin.
Set Costumes Supervisor: Keith Parent.
Make-up Artist: Ankara Eden.
Second Assistant, Make-up: Liz Raman Nair.
First Assistant, Hair Stylist: Jamie McKay.
Prop Assistants: Glenn Hilworth, Gerry Thompson, and Robert Stecky.
Sound Mixer: Mark Noda.

Boom Operators: Keith Henderson and Tony Wyman.
First Assistant Camera: Shannon Abbott.
Digital Imaging Technician: Tracy Sim.
Gaffer: Guy Patterson.
Best Boy, Electric: Paul Bougie.
Genny Operator: Murray Chysyk.
Lamp Operator: Blair McDonald.
Key Grip: Mark Leiterman.
Best Boy Grips: Dave McKinlay and Ron Baran.
Script Supervisor: Carol Green-Lundy.
Medic and Craft Services: Tim Gunderson.

''Battlestar Galactica'' Main Title Theme by [[Richard Gibbs]].

Scoring and Orchestral Engineer: Steve Kaplan.
Music Editor: Michael Baber.
Special Effects Coordinators: Al Collis and Kevin Andruschak.

Studio Executive: Richard Rothstein.
Studio Executive in Charge of Production: Todd Sharp.
Network Executives: Mark Stern and Erik Storey.

====Dedication====

Ron D. Moore added a special dedication to the credits:

<blockquote>''All of the above people worked above and beyond the call of duty to deliver these Webisodes to you and they did it while also working to deliver the regular episodes of the third season. They did it without any template of how these things were to be done and they did it in defiance of a limited budget and a extraordinarily truncated shooting schedule.''</blockquote>

<blockquote>''I'm proud of them and proud of their work. I hope you'll agree.''</blockquote>

== Guest Stars ==

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{sourcebox|One Million Streams}}

 

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Behind the Scenes]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Wayne Rose]]
[[Category:Episode Guide (RDM)|*]]
[[Category:Episodes written by Bradley Thompson]]
[[Category:Episodes written by David Weddle]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Battlestar Wiki:Galactipedians Quorum

2006-09-29T18:12:13Z