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War Room

2007-11-22T00:51:47Z

Madbrood: /* Appearances in episodes */

[[Image:ResurrectionShip SituationRoom.jpg|right|thumb|''Galactica'''s Situation Room ([[Resurrection Ship, Part I]]).]]

The Situation Room is a tactical planning and strike operations center, located close to a battlestar's [[CIC]] ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]]).

The Situation Room has two functions:

*Monitoring and controlling large-scale operations which cannot be fully monitored or controlled from the CIC without interfering with shipboard operations
*Providing a dedicated planning and briefing center for the development of and execution of special operations under the control of a battlestar.

[[Image:Bsg-1-10.jpg|right|thumb|''Galactica'''s Situation Room ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]]).]]
The Situation Room comprises a large electronic map table that can be configured for a variety of uses, supported by a number of information-relay consoles (e.g. monitoring communications). The walls of the Situation Room can be used to project images to assist in the planning of strike or other missions. Blackboards are available to create pilot rosters for missions.

Around a dozen personnel staff the Situation Room during an operation, in addition to any command staff that may be in attendance.

== Appearances in episodes ==
*In "[[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]]", during the planning and execution of the [[Battle for the Tylium Asteroid]].
*In "[[Resurrection Ship, Part I]]", during the planning of the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship|attack on the Cylons]] and when Commander Adama recruits Kara Thrace to kill Admiral Cain.
*In "[[Occupation]]", when Admiral Adama attempts to come up with a plan to rescue the people on [[New Caprica]].

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas (RDM)]]
[[Category:Terminology]]
[[Category:Terminology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

CIC

2007-11-22T00:46:02Z

Madbrood: /* Tactical Station */

{{featured article}}
:''This article discusses the CIC of battlestar ''Galactica'' of the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Re-imagined Series]]. The CIC of the battlestar ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'' contained similar stations.''
:''For information on the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon]] counterpart in this series, see [[Basestar command]].'' 

[[Image:CIC Overview 1.jpg|300px|thumb|The Combat Information Center of ''Galactica''.]]
Colonial [[Battlestar|battlestars]] are centrally operated from the '''Combat Information Center''', or '''CIC''', the battlestar's nerve center. It performs both the functions of a bridge and the CIC in naval parlance, as the vessels are also steered from the CIC.

== Galactica ==

[[Image:CIC Overview 2.jpg|300px|thumb|The Combat Information Center of ''Galactica''.]]
''Galactica's'' CIC is a faintly-circular room located deep in the interior "alligator head" of the battlestar, where the main hull meets the midship section. From CIC, the battlestar's tactical and navigational operations are monitored and directed. CIC is a large, two-level complex with three bulkhead exits, which are closed during [[Action Stations|action stations]] alerts.

''Galactica's'' CIC is divided into several stations.

* '''Command and Control'''
* '''Communications'''
* '''Damage Control'''
* '''Navigation'''
* '''Helm'''
* '''FTL'''
* '''Tactical'''
* '''Weapons Control'''
* '''Engineering and Environment'''
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===Command and Control===
[[Image:Bsg-cic-2.jpg|thumb|The Command and Control station.]]

The '''Command and Control''' station is the primary station within CIC used by the Commanding and Executive Officers aboard a Colonial battlestar. The center comprises a large communications and a roughly hexagonal "information management" table, with a retractable information display tower bearing a number of LCD screens suspended above it. There are no chairs; the command staff are always standing.

Here, the battlestar's commander and [[Executive officer]] are on station, observing and plotting battle tactics, viewing transparent charts, and giving commands to others in CIC. Above the Command and Control Station are a cluster of monitors known as the [[DRADIS console]]. The DRADIS console descends from a cylindrical ceiling recess when required. From the Command and Control Station, the commander has a 360-degree view of the CIC. The DRADIS console contains DRADIS displays but also includes other navigation and tactical information available to the commander at a glance. The displays are capable of showing a wide range on information including:
* Countdowns ("[[33]]", "[[You Can't Go Home Again]]")
* [[DRADIS]] sensor readings relayed from the DRADIS console
* Battlestar management information, such as the vessel's spatial orientation (pitch, yaw & roll)
* Battle management information

A [[Cylon transponder]] was once mounted on the base of the DRADIS console ([[Miniseries]]), supposedly planted there by [[Aaron Doral]].

<div style="clear: both;"></div>

===Communications Center===
[[Image:Cic_commstation.jpg|right|thumb|The Communication station.]]

Adjacent to the Command and Control Center on the port side of CIC is the ''Communications Center''. Here, all communications to and from fighters and other ships are monitored, directed or relayed. In coordination with the Tactical Station, the Communications officer can also verify [[IFF|transponders]] that register as friendly, and alerts the Tactical Officer or commander if they pick up signals without transponders or recognized enemy transponders. The [[Communications Officer]] has a link to the [[Computers#Mainframe computer|mainframe computer]], where a library of Colonial recognition information resides.

<div style="clear: both;"></div>

===Damage Control Station===
[[Image:Dmgcontrolconsole.jpg|thumb|[[Galen Tyrol]] at DC panel after a nuclear strike on the port [[flight pod]] ([[Miniseries]]).]]

Situated in the far port side of CIC is ''Damage Control.'' This station, usually unmanned, contains the Damage Control computers, which connect to many sensors throughout the exterior and interior of the ship. A large display against the wall of the station shows damage through a series of lights that represent the [[Frame|frames]], or compartments of the battlestar that form the many segments of the ship.

[[Image:Cicdmgcontrol.jpg|left|thumb|The Damage Control station.]]
A commander can order a Damage Control officer to perform many actions to repair or mitigate the effects of an enemy attack through the controls here, including the venting of compartments, coordination of damage control teams, and the like. It is also likely that alternative damage control stations outside of CIC, such as the [[Aft Damage Control]] room contain similar controls to aid in repairs, control of fires and the like in the event that CIC's damage control is knocked offline or CIC staff are incapacitated.
<div style="clear: both;"></div>

[[Image:Cichelmcontrol.jpg|thumb|Helm Control.]]
===Helm Control===
Battlestars move through space much as a submarine navigates in an ocean. There are no windows, no viewscreens to see into space for helm control. While external cameras may be available, they are seldom used in navigation of a battlestar. Navigation is managed by spatial coordinates based on [[DRADIS]] and other sensor information. The helm crewmembers drive the battlestar through a series of controls and based on commands from the Executive officer or commanding officer.

<div style="clear: both;"></div>

===Tactical Station===
[[Image:Cictacticalstation1.jpg|thumb|left|The tactical station with tactical plot and table.]]

The Officer of the Watch/[[Tactical Officer]] is arguably the busiest officer in ''Galactica's'' CIC. Tasked with the monitoring of [[DRADIS]] and coordinating various command and control functionality, including [[Computers|computer control]], the Tactical Officer must relay changes in status and keep the commander updated continuously during the fluid events of battle. The Tactical officer is typically the first to know that an attack is imminent and will address the battlestar by the public address system to go to battle stations through [[Action Stations|Condition One or Two alerts]].

As ''Galactica's'' computers aren't networked, the Tactical officer must manually print or offload data from the various central computers he monitors (Fire control, Navigation, FTL, and mainframe computers) and relay this information to the other officers and staff in the room. Fortunately, many stations see the same information on displays similar to those at the Tactical Station, but it is the Tactical Officer who is charged with notifying the commander of the changes and interpreting the results. ''Galactica's'' Tactical officer also is the administrator for all central computers onboard and provides maintenance as required.

While the Helm officers drive the ship, it is the Tactical officer that plots [[FTL|FTL jumps]], the apparently instantaneous leap from one location in space to another location millions of kilometers away. The Tactical officer of ''Galactica'' not only has to provide Jump coordinates to the battlestar's helm, but is also responsible for relaying both scheduled sets and sets of [[emergency jump coordinates]] to over 70 other FTL-capable civilian ships that make up [[The Fleet (RDM)|the Fleet]] to ensure that all ships always stay close to ''Galactica's''' protective sphere.

Nearby the Tactical Station is a tactical board and table where the commander can meet with several officers and crew at once for advanced battle or strategy conferences. The Tactical Station is frequently manned by other specialists and officers that assist the Watch Officer.

<div style="clear: both;"></div>

===Weapons Control Room===

[[Image:Cicweaponscontrol1.jpg|thumb|left|The Weapons Control Room, left of the tactical station.]]
[[Image:Cicweaponscontrol2.jpg|thumb|right|Weapons Control Room.]]
Hidden away, next to the Tactical Station is the Weapons Control Room. Obscured from direct view during most episodes, the Weapons Control Room ostensibly is manned during [[Action Stations]]. The battlestar's gun [[Battery|batteries]] and other defensive controls are managed here.

In the event that the Weapons Control Room or CIC is knocked offline or its crew incapacitated, control of the ship's batteries can be managed at [[Auxiliary Fire Control]].

<div style="clear: both;"></div>
===The Core===

[[Image:CIC Core 2.jpg|thumb|left|Laura Roslin walking along the stations in the Core ([[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]).]]
[[Image:CIC Core 1.jpg|thumb|right|Roslin and Adama talking (Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down).]]
The second deck of the CIC, known only as the "Core", offers a bird's eye view of the busy command deck below. This narrow passageway, lined with a limited set of computers and consoles, extends in a semi-circle from just above the port hatch around the rear of the CIC, over Damage Control, the Communications Center and Helm Control, to just above the starboard hatch. There is also a small room with computers behind the consoles. Two sets of stairs lead up to the Core; one is next to the starboard hatch, and the other is just behind the Communications Center. They can be easily spotted by the blue lights behind them.

The Core often proves to be a conveniently private area of the CIC for [[William Adama]] to meet with his associates to discuss delicate affairs while on duty. In "[[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]" he meets here with [[Laura Roslin]] to discuss the creation of [[Gaius Baltar]]'s [[Cylon detector]], and again in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]" with [[Saul Tigh]] to discuss [[Kara Thrace]]'s desertion to retrieve the [[Arrow of Apollo]].

<div style="clear: both;"></div>
===FTL===
The FTL station is in the area behind the Tactical Station. It is not routinely manned, but can be manned by up to two crewmembers. All functions of the FTL drive and computer can be controlled from this station. While the engineering portions of the FTL drive are usually controlled and monitored by engineering staff, this station is sometimes staffed when more complex jumps must be made. This station is where the Tactical Officer plots and executes the jump. Sometimes the Tactical Officer inputs the jump coordinates himself, while other times the station is manned by two seated crewmen. However, the jump is always executed by the Tactical Officer himself. The FTL drive is engaged by inserting a blue "key" into a receptacle at the center of the console and turning it. This console folds down into a table when it is not being used.

== Pegasus ==

''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'s'' CIC is far smaller than ''Galactica's'', reflecting the [[Mercury class battlestar|advanced battlestar]]'s increased automation and reliance on computer networks. According to Admiral [[Helena Cain|Cain]], the ship is far larger, but requires only half the crew ([[Pegasus (Extended Version)|Pegasus]]).

The CIC has overall far less stations than ''Galactica's'' and occupies only one level, but the general layout is similar. A plotting table - with computer screens above - is located in the center, around which the main stations like Tactical, Helm and Communications are grouped, allowing the commanding officer to quickly address all officers.

While ''Galactica's'' CIC doors are solid bulkheads, ''Pegasus's'' CIC lies adjacent to a large hallway and can be accessed through a series of glass doors that pivot ninety degrees.

<gallery>
Image:PegasusInterior CIC1.jpg|''Pegasus'' CIC ([[The Captain's Hand]]).
Image:PegasusInterior CIC2.jpg|''Pegasus'' CIC (The Captain's Hand).
Image:PegasusInterior CIC3.jpg|''Pegasus'' CIC (The Captain's Hand).
Image:PegasusInterior CICHallway.jpg|Hallway and entrance to the CIC (The Captain's Hand).
</gallery>

==Notes==

* The destruction of other battlestars during the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies|Cylon attack]] hinged on the Colonial's dependence on complex networking within most CICs. It is likely that the battlestars that were destroyed required fewer crewmembers to operate it since they used networked computer systems that moved data around faster than the crew that literally ran between stations in ''Galactica's'' CIC with pen and paper or data cartridges to transfer messages and data.
* A [[Cylon agent]], probably the first copy of [[Aaron Doral]] encountered, installed a [[Cylon transponder]] at the base of the DRADIS console shortly before the Cylon attack ([[Miniseries]]). Dr. Baltar is aided by his virtual [[Number Six]] in identifying it to the CIC command staff. It is likely that the transponder is placed there to track ''Galactica'' should it escape the initial Cylon attack.
*According to [[Anastasia Dualla|Dualla]], in a deleted scene from "[[Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]", the ''Galactica'' CIC is staffed by roughly 50 people.
*The battlestar ''[[Valkyrie]]'' is a third CIC seen in the series. Being of an intermediate design between ''Galactica'' and ''Pegasus'', its CIC is similar to the latter vessel. Cinematically the set is a redress of the ''Pegasus'' CIC set.

==Cinematic Information==

* Cinematic realism on the CIC set is enhanced with the use of actual submarine hardware, such as thick phones with cords.
* Unlike the command centers of many science fiction space vessels, ''Galactica's'' CIC does not have a central viewing screen out into space. There isn't a single window looking out, in fact. Navigation is performed from sensor and spatial data not unlike a submarine.
* The CIC set used for the ''Pegasus'' are the modified remains of set hardware intended for use on a revival of the "Lost in Space" television series. When the series project was cancelled, the show's sets were refitted to form the CIC for this advanced battlestar. This is also the behind the scenes reason why the ''Pegasus'' CIC is not as large as the two-level ''Galactica'' CIC; the production team simply could not afford to make another set on the scale of the ''Galactica'' CIC, and were able to build the ''Pegasus'' CIC by purchasing the canceled "Lost in Space" sets for next to nothing.
* The Sci-Fi Channel official web site incorrectly names CIC as the "''Command'' Information Center." The correct name is verifiable from the center's name that is etched in the glass of the doors of the set.
*The Weapons Control Section is a rarely seen (in terms of use in episodes) and secluded part of CIC. The area was shown manned and in action during the closing moments of the [[Battle of Ragnar Anchorage]] ([[Miniseries]]), just before [[Anastasia Dualla]] reports that Starbuck and Apollo have not yet returned to ''Galactica.'' The area was likely built with the set budget before later restrictions would make building one impossible. The angle and enclosed area suggests that the area is used in production to allow film crew to hide off-camera without being off-set during filming.

==See Also==
*[[DRADIS]]
*[[Situation Room]], a room used for tactical and strategic planning, located near CIC.
*[[Senior Staff of Galactica]]
*[[Computers in the Re-imagined Series]], for pictures of the computers screens.

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas (RDM)]]
[[Category:Terminology]]
[[Category:Terminology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Galactica type battlestar/Archive 1

2007-11-05T18:26:36Z

Madbrood: /* Galactica-Class? */

:: Archive from [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/en/index.php?title=Talk:Galactica_type_battlestar&oldid=47676 April 17, 2006]
== Medical Capabilites of a Battlestar ==

Peter,

Your assertion of "unfound speculation" concerning my contribution is uninformed and unfounded. I am a military medical planner and a published author. My assertion of the potential medical capabilities and requirements of an intergalactic warship (modeled on a US aircraft carrier), while hypothetical, is informed. Keep in mind these are requirements that the ship would have originally been built (not the "as is" state). At this point in the story line, clearly Major Cottle is the only doctor on Galactica, however we have never seen the Pegasus medical bay or any of its medical personnel. With established industrial facilities on Pegasus (Viper production established in “Scar”), the Pegasus would have evn greater Occupational Health / Preventive Medicine than Galactica. And if you do a walk down of the ancillary services (pharmacy (camala extract), orthopedic and x-ray (Kara’s knee injury), optometry (ADM Adama’s glasses), etc, you will see they exist even if they are not portrayed. Additionally, it was an Intensive Care Unit (ICU) bed, complete with ventilator, which William Adama was in during his multiple surgeries (establishing an Operation Room (OR)).

Capital ships are designed to go into battle, which means they will take damage and casualties. Often it is the ability to regenerate / repair / refit in the quickest amount of time that determines the outcome of battles. General Nathan Bedford Forrest of the Confederate States of America is famous for the quote, “He who gets there the fastest with the mostest wins.” RDM makes reference to his experience onboard a Navy ship in podcasts, including “The Captain’s Hand”. Thus, there is an established framework present.

I provide you two active hyperlinks that back up my contribution. While dated, they are still relevant.

http://www.mfp.usmc.mil/TeamApp/G4/Topics/20040916154046/Med%20Cont%20Factbook.pdf

www.iiimef.usmc.mil/medical/ FMF/FMFE/FMFEref/fs_man/CHAPTER%2014.html

--[[User:Killerman|Killerman]] 20:26, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

:I have no doubt that you are well qualified to speak about the medical capabilities of an aircraft carrier. I dispute their relevance to BSG, however. while they might provide a good baseline for guesswork, I don't think that simple guesswork belongs on this site. We don't extrapolate armament details based on the capabilities of modern naval vessels, for example. If you wanted, I wouldn't object to something along the lines of "we may conjecture that the medical facilities of a colonial battlestar are roughly comparable to those of a modern aircraft carrier" with one of the links you provided above; but I will not agree to listing out detailed specifications based on no in-continuity data. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:37, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

::''At last I went to the artisans. I was conscious that I knew nothing at all, as I may say, and I was sure that they knew many fine things; and here I was not mistaken, for they did know many things of which I was ignorant, and in this they certainly were wiser than I was. But I observed that even the good artisans fell into error;--because they were good workmen they thought that they also knew all sorts of high matters, and this defect in them overshadowed their wisdom;''
:::''The Apology of Socrates'', Plato

::Sir, none of us doubt that you know what you are talking about when you list the medical capabilities of a modern aicraft carrier. But this does not grant you increased insight into the inner logic of the tv series: First, we have no idea how many medical staff are onboard, and comparing it to an aircraft carrier is just speculation. Second, we have no idea how many crewmen a Mercury class battlestar normally has, as has been asked in the "Questions" segment of the "[[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]" episode guide article: Pegasus has 1,750 crewmen when it encounters Galactica, but A) It was going into drydock, and some of the crew may have left to the port, B) 700 crewmen died in the initial attack C) Cain impressed civillians she encounteed into service and most importantly C) Cain was fighting a hit and run war against the Cylons for months, which wore down her crew numbers through attrition. But I digress. Yes, we should object to a statement like "we may conjecture that medical facilities of a colonial battlestar are roughly comparable to those of a modern aircraft carrier". --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:41, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

:::I guess you can object to that too, if you want. I was trying to compromise. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 21:48, 12 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I'm sorry Peter but this is a really good example of the speculation I don't think we should be inserting into this kind of article. There is nothing to be gained from such a compromise. I would if there were, and would like to, but I can't change facts. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:51, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

Peter,

As I am preparing to deploy for a year, please forgive me as I have packed all my BSG video. I grant you that the personnel numbers for a fully manned battlestar are informed speculation based upon a comparison to a modern aircraft carrier. I use these numbers as RDM has referenced a battlestar to a modern carrier, his experience in the Navy (podcast for The Captain’s Hand), Galactica type battlestar – article – dimensions’ jpg comparing a Battlestar to a CVN Image:Bsg-2-cvn.jpg on this very page. My professional training drives me to fill in unknowns with assumptions. That is what the personnel piece was intended and is consistent with other speculation within the Wiki, so long as it is said to be speculation (i.e. the actual working of an FTL drive). But sticking to the medical capabilities known from “in country (your term)” knowledge (i.e. seen on screen or in dialogue), we know much about Galactica. First, Galactica has a sickbay (Act of Contrition, Litmus). Exact bed count is not known, but is greater than seven (Act of Contrition). Based upon the burn victims (Act of Contrition) and treatment of William Adama (Scattered, Valley of Darkness, Fragged), we have seen Intensive Care Unit (ICU) beds, complete with ventilators, electrocardiograms (ECG), pulse / respiration / pulseox (shows percent of oxygen saturation dissolved in blood) monitors. We also have seen at least on operation room (OR) (Fragged), and subsequently confirm its existence with Kara Thrace’s knee surgery (Litmus) and Lee Adama’s chest surgery (Sacrifice). Concerning the radiology suite, we saw a Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI – incidentally, a very advanced piece of equipment) when Baltar had Dr. Cottle examine his head looking for an implanted chip (sorry, don’t remember the episode). We also saw conventional (chest) x-rays of Commander William Adama, during his surgery (Fragged, Scattered). We heard about Sharon’s ultrasound, as part of pre-natal health on Hera, where Dr. Cottle found an abnormality. And while not part of radiology, Hera, is placed in a Neonatal Intensive Care Unit (NICU) incubator, when is born prematurely. Next, we know it has a pharmacy. The President asked Dr. Cottle for Camala, the Viper pilots were taking “stims” (33, Final Cut) and Kara is taking pain killers for her knee surgery (Litmus) and latter asks Lee for antibiotics for Anders (Lay Down Your Burdens – Part II). Additionally, with the surgeries and burn victims, there are other pharmacological needs and a pharmacy is where these things dwell. Other areas that we have seen or know about are a morgue, where Galactica-Boomer was stored; a laboratory (to do support simple blood type and matching to support surgery), optometry with a fabrication lab (William Adama wears glasses and as stated in other areas of this site, battlestars are designed for sustained operations). We are also can infer that Galactica has some preventive medicine / occupational health capability because in “Water”, there was a discussion about water recycling (leading to potable water). It is Preventive Medicine that does this task.

I would like to add that RDM and SciFi do a heck of a job weaving into the background all these things. As an experienced health services officer with over 22 years in the health care field, there is a tremendous amount of detail that happens in the background. If I was a casual observer, I might miss or not care about some of these things. As someone headed into harms way, I assure you that our fighting forces moral is impacted combat health support. I absolutely belive we need to address the medical capabilities of a battle star. The propose the best way is start with what it would look like at full strenght / desired capability. Clearly, Season 3 will start with two grossly undermanned battlestars, with very limited offensive combat capability.--[[User:Killerman|Killerman]] 22:10, 16 April 2006 (CDT)

:The citations you've provided make it much easier to include this information, and I thank you for taking the time to write this all out. The addition should improve the article considerably. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:21, 16 April 2006 (CDT)

::I am sorry, but this doesn't change much: the above information was gleaned from things we've seen on screen, and is thus informative and useful. However, the original entry to this article he made (speculative medical numbers, etc.)...isn't supported by any of these citations. Basically, they're two separate issues and should be treated separately. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 00:48, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

:::Reverting to Killerman's last version isn't a good idea, but he (or we) can refactor his contribution using the points and evidence he raised above. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:57, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

::::Oh yes yes, something new and revised. Yes. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 01:24, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

== Manufacture vs. Assembly of Ammunition ==
The "assembly" activities that take place in [[Epiphanies]] would fall into the realm of "production", depending on how you look at it. It seemed like they were loading the casings (I thought RDM said they were going to use caseless ammo) with powder, seating the primer and inserting the bullet, turning the various components into a cartridge. Whether or not they produced the individual components (metal for bullets and casings would be easy, compounds for primers and powder probably harder to obtain), the act of putting those bits together would often be considered "manufacturing" ammunition. Not a big deal, and I didn't even change the text (since it's pretty debatable). An example of this use of the word is in this [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A4044-2004Jul21_2.html Washington Post Article]:

"''Israeli Military Industries said the ammunition will be manufactured in Israel but the raw materials, including propellants, projectiles and primers, come from U.S. sources.''
"

Once again, not trying to start a war, just wanted to weigh in on a subject I knew a little about (since they so rarely come up). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:02, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

== Picture of destroyed Galactica-type Battlestar ==
Though certainly a model of a Galactica-type was used for the shot, it's clearly mentioned at the very beginning of the miniseries that ''Galactica'' is the only ship of it's kind still in service. The story places the shot only hours after the beginning of the attack, so it should be impossible that another Galactica-type (museum or mothballed in a reserve-fleet) could be readied for battle. Shouldn't the destroyed battlestar be taken as one of a third class between the Galactica-Type and Mercury-class, still looking a lot like the Galactica-type? [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 13:39, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:That was my impulse. Story logic dictates that the destroyed hulk probably wasn't a Galactica type, but in the real world we can surmise that Zoic probably re-used the Galactica model. Of course, from that distance, we could fudge our interpretation either way. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 13:50, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::They don't necessarily mean that there are no Galactica type battlestars in service besides the Big-G, it could be taken to mean none like Galactica, eg. non-refitted, no networks, etc. The battlestar there could easily (and belivably) be a refitted Galactica type. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:22, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::I concur with Talos, and that has been my understanding. Besides, unless the ship was simply overwhelmed by Cylon military brawn, an old-Cylon War battlestar would put up the same level of fight as ''Galactica'' would have. Else, it was just as vulnerable as the new battlestars. I agree, cinematically, that that Galactica model was just reused.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 14:59, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:::[http://www.skyone.co.uk/programme/pgefeature.aspx?pid=3&fid=642 Something to ask] the big man himself? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 14:34, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I'll do that in a little bit, I have to pick up my brother from his band practice in a minute. The life of a college student living at home... --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:36, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I really doubt he's going to take the time to clarify such a niggling detail. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:39, 24 April 2006 (CDT)

It has always been my belief that Doral meant it was the only Galactica-type battlestar never refited. I always point to the ''U.S.S. Missouri'' (Mighty 'Mo) as an example of a ship with over 50 years of combat service that just kept getting refitted over time to the point that it was firing satellite-targeted cruise missiles at the end of its service. I think Galactica was just the only one that was never refitted. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:57, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:My point exactly. It's like the WWII era Essex class carriers. There were refits that were completly rebuilt but a few, essentially, originals survived until the early 1960s with the others serving thru Vietnam ([[Wikipedia:USS Oriskany (CVA-34)|USS Oriskany (CVA-34)]] for example). The [[Wikipedia:USS Lexington (CV-16)|USS Lexington (CV-16)]] was in service as a training ship until 1991! --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:26, 24 April 2006 (CDT)

::It's exactly the ''USS Missouri''-example why I believe that ''Galactica'' is the last of it's class: All four ''Iowa''-Class battleships were updated and they all were finally decommissoned (for now) between 1990 and 1992. If the ''Galactica'' is simply the only one not refitted one would have to ask why that wasn't done. Why would one refit three ''Iowas'' but not the last one? This usually only happens if a ship is somehow different from her sisters (e.g. having sustained heavy battledamage the refit is more expensive and not worth the effort). Also it could be that the fleet is being downsized, no longer needing all ships. An example for this would be the British [[Wikipedia:Illustrious class aircraft carrier|''Illustrious''-Class]] of World War II. Of these three carriers only one received an angled flight-deck, surviving the scrapping of the other two for twenty years. But in all these cases I find it hard to believe that anyone would describe one of the ships decommissioned first as ''the last of it's kind still in service'' if there others (refitted or not) still in action. Which ''Iowa'' would have been described that way prior to it's decommissioning: ''Iowa'' in 1990 or ''Missouri'' in 1992? Wasn't ''Lexington'' the last ''Essex''?
::What Doral says before and after that statement makes it quite clear that he's not talking about a certain detail (like ''last of it's kind without a network'' would have been). He starts with ''worldfamous Battlestar Galactica'', then ''last of her kind still in service'' followed by ''constructed 50 years ago as one of the first twelve battlestars, representing Caprica''. The only possible explanation for other Galactica-types this leaves would be ''Galactica'' being the last of the first twelve, with other Galactica-types coming from a second batch no longer representing specific colonys. But even then "last of her kind" is an usual choice of words to describe that. [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 17:13, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:::Well said. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:04, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I think it is still ambiguous, and we should wait for an RDM blog reply before changing anything. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:54, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:::::I doubt RDM will respond to this issue, and I think the safest course of action would just be to remove it. There's sufficient reason to doubt that the hulk isn't a galactica-type that we shouldn't take a firm position on the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:22, 25 April 2006 (CDT)
:::The motivation for no refit to ''Galactica'' could be nostaliga or historical preservation, explaining the odd wording; for such a purpose, only the unaltered version would count. ...Don't get the impression I believe that just because I said it. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 20:56, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:Not to mention Adama, "It's a computer network and I'll be damned if I'll let it aboard my ship while I'm in command." (Paraphrased)--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:01, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:We don't even know for sure if the destroyed battlestar was even in service. It could have been decommissioned earlier and be acting like a museum, just like Galactica was supposed to be. That would also explain its quick destruction. (It snapped cleanly in half). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:01, 13 January 2007 (CST)
::It could easily be in service still. In the Russian (and former Soviet) navy, there is a class of destroyers called the [[w:Udaloy class destroyer|Udaloy]]. The last of the class was heavily refitted and updated, bringing it up almost to Burke class levels. The important thing here is that there are still unrefitted ones in service (there was only enough money to upgrade one, the Admiral Chabenko). Then again, there is the Fletcher/Sumner class destroyers. The main differences were the gun armament (5x1 5" in Fletcher, 3x2 5" in Sumner), and the Sumner's twin rudders. Same hull and most of the superstructure. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 10:13, 13 January 2007 (CST)

== Crew numbers ==

How do we know a fully manned and equipped battlestar has a crew of 4,000 to 5,000? Was it said in some episode or where do these numbers come from? I'm updating the [[de:Kampfstern, Galactica-Typ|german battlestar article]] and I don't like to use data that seems to be made up out of thin air. The links and notes provided don't give any hint about the normal crew number of a battlestar of this type. We apologise for any inconvenience. -- [[User:Astfgl|Astfgl]] 16:03, 25 June 2006 (CDT)
:In the Miniseries, Tyrol says that there are over 2,000 people on Galactica. The ships seems very undermanned at the same time so I would think that 4-5,000 is a good estimate. I'm not sure if we've seen any concrete numbers though, maybe in the magazine. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:52, 25 June 2006 (CDT)

::Answer: in "Water" Baltar says how many civilians there are in the Fleet, and subtracting that from the total survivor population in that episode yielded the crew aboard Galactica as of "Water", at some number over 2,600 (I'd have to check). In several podcasts, Ron Moore keeps saying that while not on a skeleton crew, Galactica has about half the number of people on it that a fully crewed battlestar of its class would have. So, "between 4,000 and 5,000". --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 17:38, 25 June 2006 (CDT)
:::Thanks for the clarification, I'll take these numbers then. -- [[User:Astfgl|Astfgl]] 07:37, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Flight tube counts ==
I see (in [[:Image:Bsg-2-cvn.jpg]], e.g.) 20 slots that seem like they might each be divided in half along the side of ''Galactica''. I can see why it is likely they are launch tubes, but I can also see many other similarly sized openings around them. Although it's a fine guess and quite likely to be true, I'm left hestitant that this evidence is sufficiently strong to be canon. In any case, if consensus is that this is canon, we should certainly footnote it, as the truth of the statement is not patently clear. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 00:10, 10 August 2006 (CDT)

== Delivery of Nuclear weapons ==

Since the Cylon forces repeatedly use missiles as an effective delivery platform for their nuclear weapons, isn't ir relativel safe to assume- since, of course, the Cylons were created by the Colonials- that the method deployed by Colonial forces is also missile-based? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 09:22, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:It's a good idea, and I personally agree with it, but there is no aired proof, and thusly we cannot confirm how they do it. The two Galactica nukes we've seen thus far (Baltar's and the one Boomer uses to destroy the Basestar in Kobol's Last Gleaming Part II) have been removed from their delivery systems. (Although Boomer's did look like it was in a bomb casing). --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 09:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Fair point. Perhaps we'll get clarificaion in Season3, since Galactica herself still has three nuclear weapons aboard. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:06, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Well, we know now, good call on it being revealed in season 3, Although they haven't been used yet, I'm willing to bet they will be used in season 4 and we are going to have to update the articles again.--[[User:Tomglima|Tomglima]] 20:09, 23 October 2007 (CDT)
== Galactica-Class? ==

Please bear with me for a moment as I am citing a magazine many of you may consider illegitimate. In the September 2006 issue of Maxim Magazine, the "Fashion" section of Maxim Style features a photoshoot of the RDM Battlestar Galactica cast modeling various fashions. In one photograph, featuring James Callis and Tricia Helfer in a small corner alcove of the CIC (possibly weapons control or some other station), a center console features the text "GALACTICA-CLASS BATTLESTAR" in two places, easily readable to the viewer. I know it is general policy on television shows that whatever is aired in a given episode is canon, and what is not aired, non-canon. However, would this (i.e., "Galactica-class Battlestar") be considered canon since this console is occasionally seen in a given episode? Or am I just reading too much into a simple photoshoot? --[[User:Jonfucius|Jonfucius]] 09:30, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:Do you have a photograph of this? or a timestamp where we can check the DVD's? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:55, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
::I assume he means [http://bsg-cz.net/news/files/images/season_3/maxim_5.jpg this] but on that pic I can't really see it on the prinouts on the table. It does indeed look like the weapon's control room, though I can't recall the table there. The room can be seen very rarely. In the miniseries for example --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:06, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:::I can barely make it out. Though it isn't canon, unless we saw it on the show itself, or if someone from the show were to tell us that "yes, indeed, ''Galactica'' is a ''Galactica''-class battlestar". Then it's canon. However, by all means, we can certainly put something in the notes section regarding this. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:17, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
::::That's definitely the weapons control section of CIC. If we can get a clearer shot, that will remove all doubt; it does look like "Galactica class" to me. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:57, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Something for [[BW:OC]]? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:14, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::If I had access to a scanner I would provide a high-res image to examine; unfortunately, I am a relatively-poor college student (and how many aren't these days?) and the only scanner access I have is a public-use scanner in our bookstore. However, the image Mercifull provided is the one I indicated in my first post. In my copy of the issue, the text clearly reads "Galactica-class Battlestar". I know this is a minor detail among many in a show so richly layered by the writers and producers, but I wanted to make sure the Battlestar Wiki was as accurate as possible; I use the Wiki to enhance my experience of this incredible drama. Thank you all for your timely responses to my question. --[[User:Jonfucius|Jonfucius]] 11:39, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
I hate to dredge up an old topic, but here's some food for thought that might support the theory that ''Galactica'' is the class name. Now, we're told that Galactica herself represented Caprica, the de facto capital of the colonies. Surely it stands to reason that the first battlestar built would be the one to represent the primary colony- Galactica. I know this is fanwanking, but I just thought of it and figured I'd voice my idea. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 12:26, 5 November 2007 (CST)

== Actual class name? ==

I can purely speculate that the actual name of the original battlestar class (of which ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' is a member) is ''Onassis'', in honor of the wife of assassinated President [[Wikipedia:John F. Kennedy|John F. Kennedy]], [[Wikipedia:Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis|Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis]]. So, ''Galactica'' is considered as an ''Onassis''-class battlestar. The prototype of its class, battlestar ''Onassis'' is destroyed in the renewed [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon]] conflict. --[[User:Starkiller|Starkiller]] 21:06, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::LMAO at this troll.--[[User:Tomglima|Tomglima]] 20:11, 23 October 2007 (CDT)
:And there's ''nothing'' to back this up with? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 02:06, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:And how would Colonials know of the Kennedys? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 02:29, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
::Because they got information from Earth about these Kennedys before the Cylon Holocaust. Years before the [[Cylon War]], the battlestar prototype, ''Onassis'', is constructed, then ''Galactica'' itself. Therefore, we presume this original battlestar class (of which ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' is a member) is ''Onassis''. --[[User:Starkiller|Starkiller]] 04:20, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:I am ''very'' confused. There would have to be some serious cite for that change. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 05:10, 19 September 2006 (CDT)

I think that Starkiller is being absurd to prove a point, but, like others, I'm missing it. As per our convention, pure speculation is disallowed here without official sources to back it up. Since the picture of two BSG actors on an official set using props that match others with information cited as official and used here for articles (navigation charts) which indicates that ''Galactica'' is the first of her class, we should continue on this thread. Otherwise, Starkiller's comment is patent nonsense given that BSG is deliberately set so we don't know if the events occur in real-world Earth's past, present, or future. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 07:13, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:I've heard on several occasions that Galactica may be an "Atlantia-class" battlestar, but have found nothing to support this online. I've also heard that the original Galactica was a "Columbia-class". Is this true? If so, is it possible that the re-imagined Galactica is also a Columbia-class? I think this should head on over to [[BW:OC]]. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:46, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
::"Columbia-class" is common fan fiction. "Atlantia" class would make little sense: why would the fleet admiral use a old battlestar as his flagship? His ship would be Mercury class or something better (and more advanced--it was destroyed like the other [[CNP]] ships). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:34, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Then why does Adama choose Galactica as his flaghsip, and not Pegasus? There's nothing said on-screen to suggest that the Galactica-type battlestars were NOT re-fitted with computer networks. I'm just playing devil's advocate here. Besides, the Atlantia mentioned in the mini could easily have been Mercury-class, and the original may have been retired like the Big G was. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:54, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Commanders don't have to choose the best and biggest ship as their flagship as long as they can do their duty from another one. Don't know who but some guy in WWII chose a destroyer or maybe a battleship as his command post and not an aircraft carrier. As long as there are options, there is some personal choice involved.
::::And you're right about networks. The Mini gives the distinct impression that it was only Adama's doing that the Galactica
::::wasn't more automated -[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:08, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, Admiral Raymond Spruance chose the cruiser USS Indianapolis as his flagship when he had multiple carriers at his disposal. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:11, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
::::As shown in events during the second half of season 2, Adama doesn't likely trust ''Pegasus'' crew. To quote Adama: "I tend to go with what you know, until something better comes along." So the decision is logical; he trusts ''Galactica'' and her crew, thus he plants his flag there. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:52, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
::::An corollary to Joe's comments: It is very likely that there is a long-standing (but fading) tradition to keep ''Galactica'' from being refitted, just as our USS Constitution was never refitted as a steamer, in keeping with her (supposed) significancy in Colonial war history. Besides, to ''revert'' any ship from new to old technology is just weird and very unlikely. There may have been fewer commanders willing to assume command of ''Galactica'' in this tradition, but Adama, a man who knew all too well of the problems of technology (and had served on her in the last part of the war), chose ''Galactica'' willingly, I figure. This is reinforced with the arrival of ''Pegasus''. He could've moved his new admiral flag there, but he hasn't. He prefers to go with what he knows until something better shows up. The old battlestar ''Galactica'', in Adama's mind, is still best. ''Pegasus'' survived more on luck than inherent design. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:30, 20 September 2006 (CDT)

==Role==

As with the Mercury-class article, I've amended the class role to [[Wikipedia:Battlecarrier|battlecarrier]]. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:37, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:Madbrood, I can appreciate the use, but based on your link, I disagree. The term "battlestar" is a true carrier AND battleship in one, where the "battlecarrier" of our Earth is a rough amalgam that doesn't come close in size, fighter capacity, or firepower. Further, I wonder if we want to use complext Earth naval terms instead of what is given in the show to describe the ships using simple naval language. "Carrier/battleship" is less "smooth" than "battlecruiser", but is is also more accurate. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:44, 27 September 2006 (CDT)
::I agree. Battlecruiser is a nice term, but it really doesn't fit Galactica. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 08:35, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Fair enough. I just figured it sounded a bit more "military". --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 09:47, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I know. I'd love to put up "big, frakkin' warship/carrier with guns, lots of guns," but "warship/carrier" may have to do. Keeping it simple. :) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:33, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Battlestar Redirect ==
Battlestar (RDM) currently redirects here. The only reason this concerned me was I was actually linking to a more generic use of the word ("Adama had been on an another battlestar before ''Galactica''). Back when "big G" was the only one we knew of, it defintely made sense. Now that we have "''Galactica'' type", "Mercury class", and "''Valkyrie'' type" I was wondering if maybe we needed a more generic article to sit at battlestar (RDM) describing the aircraft carrier/battleship capital ship concept in more general terms, with ''Galactica'', ''Pegasus'', and ''Valkyrie'' being specific examples. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:45, 4 December 2006 (CST)
:That sounds good to me, a general article explaing what battlestars are, listing known ones, mentioning BSGs, missions, etc. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:30, 4 December 2006 (CST)
::Rather than that, why not redirect to the central [[Battlestar]] disambiguation? It already has listed all battlestars by show and type, and avoids extra work. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:26, 4 December 2006 (CST)
:::'''That''' is exactly what I wanted to link to. I just automatically tagged an RDM on the end of it. I'll go change that link, but I agree that we should just change Battlestar (RDM) to point to Battlestar (work smarter not harder). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:57, 4 December 2006 (CST)
::::Hah, I'd forgotten about that page. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:23, 4 December 2006 (CST)
::::Done. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 21:40, 4 December 2006 (CST)

== Life Support ==

How exactly do Galactica's life support systems work? I know their recirculation units replenish oxygen and remove carbon dioxide, but does this oxygen come from tanks or is it recycled from somewhere? The ISS uses electrolysis to split water into hydrogen and oxygen, so is is possible that Galactica-type ships do something similar to this?--[[User:Rapturous|Rapturous]] 13:52, 10 October 2007 (CDT)
: Other than the scrubbers, it's really never been explained. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [http://www.sanctuarywiki.org Sanctuary Wiki — ''New''] 14:03, 10 October 2007 (CDT)
::Theoretically, they could have a big room full of plants somewhere in the ship. Plants 'breathe in' carbon dioxide and 'breathe out' oxygen, the opposite of what we do. However, you would need some kind of imitation sun then, because the chemical reaction I just described can only occur in sunlight. Other (artifical) means of converting CO2 back to oxygen could also be used (scrubbers?), but like the plants they will also require energy to work. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 06:57, 11 October 2007 (CDT)
:::Have you ever seen the film [[w:Sunshine (2007 film)|Sunshine]] Catrope?
:::http://www.sunshinedna.com/wp-images/2005/09/2109_06a.jpg
:::They used an oxygen garden in that to produce the breathable air :D --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 07:37, 11 October 2007 (CDT)
::::Yep, I have. Spoilers for Sunshine follow: {{spoilli|In the scene where the ''Icarus II'' crew boards ''Icarus I'', you can see that her garden is still alive, because of the CO2 <-> O2 equilibrium between the plants and Captain Pinbacker who has lived there for seven years (having killed the rest of his crew).}} --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 07:58, 11 October 2007 (CDT)

Talk:William Adama/Archive 1

2007-11-05T18:25:46Z

Madbrood: New section: Disliking guesses

Just curious, but what's going on with the page? I thought it had more information than this... -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 19:59, 5 May 2005 (EDT)

: As it turns out, [http://battlestarwiki.joebeaudoin.net/index.php?title=Adama%2C_William&oldid=3457 it did]? Is this currently being revised? If so, that's great. -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 20:01, 5 May 2005 (EDT)

== Divorced? ==

Is there a source for his being divorced from Anne and a reason she is not mentioned in his "Marital Status" entry? --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 21:17, 28 December 2005 (EST)

:I don't believe Adama was divorced from Anne at all, but in any case no episode data confirms that status. Note he wears a wedding ring in the miniseries. Also note his sadness on announcing Caprica City's nuking, suggesting other loved ones (maybe Anne) was a victim, too. The only information we can confirm thus far is that Adama married twice. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:29, 17 January 2006 (EST)

== OK, NOT the Adama I Expected to Get Kissed ==

Wow. [[Resurrection Ship, Part II]] took me a bit by surprise at the end there. Not Cain getting shot, but Adama's little kiss with Roslin. That was an interesting turn. Not sure what to make of it, other than I was getting all girly-swishy watching it all like a soap opera. That should make the next episode more harder to watch with Roslin...well, don't want to spoil it. And damn, I'm glad the wiki's back up. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:32, 13 January 2006 (EST)

: I was ''incredibly'' impressed with Olmos' acting just after the kiss. After she turned away and his face fell... I could very easily sense the utter ''depth'' of sorrow the <s>Commander</s> Admiral was feeling. I've seen that face a few times in real life regarding real life sickness and loss and, well, as I said, I was impressed. --[[User:Day|Day]] 02:35, 14 January 2006 (EST)

::Another good bit of Olmos' acting was in the last episode. I didn't notice it until after I listened to the podcast, but Olmos wipes away a tear as he turns around to hear Roslin say one more thing as he leaves Colonial One in the scene before the battle plan scene. He's a damn fine actor--they all are. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 08:36, 14 January 2006 (EST)

::I thought that RDM said something in the podcast about Olmos spontaneously adding the kiss, which is why Roslin's reaction is so good. --[[User:Deadlygopher|Deadlygopher]] 14:55, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:::That's correct. I learned this later myself when someone else noted this from the podcast as well as well as from the podcast when I listened in, too. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:26, 17 January 2006 (EST)

== "Roll the hard six" ==

Does anyone know what "rolling the hard six" actually refers to? I know it has to do with the game of craps, but I don't know specifically what it means. It would help if i did, because I've started using it completley inadvertently in everyday speech, along with [[frak]]. My friends look at me like I'm insane, its pretty bad. --[[User:BMS|BMS]] 00:52, 29 January 2006 (EST)

:Dude...Six is the highest number on dice. "Rolling the hard six" means getting a high number, when your really need it in a difficult situation...as this is a statistically rare occurance, it is "hard" to do. This doesn't refer to anything specific at all; this is intuitive.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 01:01, 29 January 2006 (EST)

::First, I don't think you're right. I believe the reference is more specific than that.
::Secondly, It would have been a simple matter to phrase your response without a condescending tone. Instead of what you actually said, you could've said "I think 'rolling the hard six' simply refers to actually rolling a six on a die. Since six is the highest number on dice, it means getting a high number when you really need it, and since rolling a 6 is statistically rare, it is "hard" to do."
::Why is it necessary to be rude to other members of the wiki? It only encourages them to be rude back to you, and I know you've had problems with users flaming you in the past - well, this is why they did it. A less civilized person might decide to insult you every chance they get, after the several comments you've made at me.
::When you insult me or other frequent posters, it is merely an annoyance. However, when you insult those who are relatively new to the wiki, you are actually scaring them. I know if I got a comment like that on my first post, I might decide never to post again. This damages the wiki, as there may be quality posters waiting in the wings who you could be scaring off. Please, choose your words carefully and refrain from being rude - to everyone, from newbs to admins and everyone in between. --[[User:BMS|BMS]] 11:13, 29 January 2006 (EST)
:::This is not rude, it is blunt honesty, and should be taken as such.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 11:27, 29 January 2006 (EST)

:::: There're plenty of ways to be honest and even blunt, but not rude. In fact, I don't think you were very blunt at all. Blunt would have been more like: "Six is the highest number on dice. That is "hard" to roll." And BMS's sample would have been ''just'' as honest (read: truthful) as your post. Additionally, just because you intended something to be blunt and honest, but not rude, doesn't mean others must take it that way; the onus is on ''you'' to make sure your intent is clear in the words and phrases you choose. --[[User:Day|Day]] 13:05, 29 January 2006 (EST)

:In [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craps standard craps]], "hard six" specifically refers to the combination 3-3 on two dice. You can roll a six 5 different ways (1-5,2-4,3-3,4-2,5-1) only 1 of which is "hard". When a player needs a six, any of the combinations will do. The odds against making a ''hard'' six are 10-1, since only 1 outcome is favorable and 10 are unfavorable (namely, the other 4 ways to make a six, and all 6 ways to make a seven). So the symmetry and low frequency of 3-3 lead to its special designation. The same is true of hard 4, 8 and 10. There is no "hard 2" or "hard 12" for a variety of reasons including the obvious one (there's only one way to roll them anyhow). --[[User:JohnH|JohnH]] 12:40, 29 January 2006 (EST)
::Actually, the odds of rolling a hard six are ''36 to 1'' rather than 10 to 1. There are 36 (6x6) possible combinations with two dice, only one of which (3-3) is the one you need. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 15:48, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
:: Thanks, John. This has been bugging me for a long time, too. Now we all know. --[[User:Day|Day]] 13:05, 29 January 2006 (EST)

:::Yes, yes, thank you. I am quite sorry. Please, let's put this unpleasantness behind us.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 13:14, 29 January 2006 (EST)
::::That's what I thought it was. I've noticed that I've also been saying this in normal conversation. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:32, 29 January 2006 (EST)
:::::Thanks a ton John. That helps a lot, now I can actually explain it when someone asks. Talos: its pretty bad, isn't it? Doesn't mean I'm gonna stop doing it, though! --[[User:BMS|BMS]] 13:42, 29 January 2006 (EST)

::::::Hey, don't feel bad, I insert it into conversation ''on purpose''--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 14:16, 29 January 2006 (EST)

==Husker==
Say, is there a way to get the Character template to stop saying William "Husker" Adama? He has not been addressed as Husker, so it might be more of a confusion than anything to have it say that. As a Commander and now an Admiral, he has not been known as a Viper pilot for quite a while. Long before we became "acquainted" with him. [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 23:47, 24 February 2006 (EST)
:Yeah, I'm not a fan of it either (or anything on that template, for that matter) - but if we get rid of his callsign, should we also get rid of Lee's? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 23:59, 24 February 2006 (EST)

== Sources? ==

There are lots of things in this article that weren't stated in any of the shows. Shouldn't these things have notes as to their sources?

"At the outbreak of the first Cylon War, Adama was serving in the Colonial Fleet as a Viper pilot. He allegedly gained the call sign of "Husker" on account of his baritone "gravelled" voice. He proved to be a gifted pilot, shooting down his first Cylon on his very first mission. He racked-up his 1,000th deck landing while serving aboard the Battlestar Atlantia (Act of Contrition), when he held the rank of Lieutenant. "

Where is all that from? I can only imagine the Video Game, which is not a legitimate source (according to the Citation Jihad Project)

"before the pressures of Adama's career and the time he spent away from home of active service began to place a strain on their marriage."

Has it ever been stated why they divorced?

"but within a few years he had been discharged as the result of a reduction-in-force."

We don't know why he was discharged.

Just a few examples.

:<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> makes a magic signature thing, though you have to make your own dashes.
:We certainly know he was a gifted viper pilot, though the "in the First Cylon War" part might be based on deleted scenes. (The flashbacks to Adama and Tigh meeting, etc., certainly say it.) We know he had the callsign "Husker" as well, though, again, maybe just from deleted scenes (the flashbacks to Adama and Tigh meeting, etc., probably); I don't recall knowing why he got it. I don't recall the kill on first mission, either. The 1,000th deck landing thing is apparently referenced in [[Act of Contrition]], which fits with the celebration that was interrupted by the errant probe, but I admit not recalling the line; checking the transcripts would verify.
:I don't recall knowing the reason Adama is estranged from his wife, but I do recall that we do not know if they are divorced at all (see above section).
:I believe the reduction in force reason was at least heavily implied in deleted scenes (the flashbacks to Adama and Tigh meeting, etc.).
:So, the stuff I'd be worried about is the reason for the callsign, the kill on the first mission, and the reason for his estrangement from his wife. All seem reasonable (and the last almost certain), but that's not good enough; someone else can probably source them, though. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 15:02, 9 March 2006 (CST)

We know his callsign because it was printed by the cockpit of his Mark 2 viper in the miniseries.

We don't know wny adama is estranged from his wife, but we know he was divorced because in the miniseries, apollo says that she is getting remarried.

We don't know why Tigh and Adama ended up on a freighter. Maybe they quit after the war? Maybe they were tossed out as reduction in force. It's never said.

: Both Adama and Tigh were honorably discharged after the war. The only reason why Adama got in was because his "new wife" had pull in the Colonial Military. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] 17:26, 12 March 2006 (CST)

:You're right about the callsign, though I'd note I did say that we knew it.
:Popping in that DVD, indeed such a marriage is mentioned. (Though it did bring to mind my inability to recall mention that they were ever married.)
:While I was popping in DVD's, I confirmed the [[Atlantia]] location for Adama's 1000th landing. (Kara tells a story about it in [[Act of Contrition]].) --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 18:55, 12 March 2006 (CST)

Regarding the discharge of Adama and Tigh, I think that they were most likely honorably discharged, since the fleet eventually re-hired them. The issue here though is WHY were they honorably discharged? Did they themselves resign, or did the Fleet downsize them out of the service?

After World War II, the government didn't really have much problems with military size, as a great number of people merely did not reenlist.. and who could blame them? Did Adama and Tigh do the same thing? were they so sick of war that they got themselves out of the service, only to find civilian life unsatisfying?

We just don't know, and stating otherwise as fact probably isn't the best thing to do.

== Cleanup Required ==

This article is one of our longest. I wouldn't necessarily want to lose the central bio, but we should move the first season info into a subarticle, or severely condense it. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:51, 14 June 2006 (CDT)

This article now possesses the first truncated character bio for a major character. Discussions of the article appear in [[User talk:Spencerian/Shortbio]] and the original mock page is at [[User:Spencerian/Shortbio]]. In short, the goal of this adjustment to highlight the important notes of the character with a minimum of narrative or rehashing of episode data already present in other articles. In short, the bio page reflects more on who the character is, and less on what he's done that's not something of remarkable note and which hasn't been noted ''ad nauseum'' to another article. Truncated character bios also reduce the article size to prevent issues with older browsers and readers, and make it easier for all to edit and update since historical information can simply be added in a few bullets. We haven't set this format officially, so now is the time to comment and critique this live version. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:54, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

: I like. I went in and fixed some typos. I wonder if "background" might not be made to be even shorter. As it stands, it's nearly as long as the in-series stuff we've seen. Maybe that's just an artifact of his having a lot of background provided to us in the show (as opposed to the reletively equal amount of BG exposition each character received in the Mini). Anyway, I think this is a lot more wieldy. I would not be opposed to other lengthy character pages moving to a similar format. Maybe we should make some S&C regarding it, though, first. Not sure. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]]) 14:05, 13 July 2006 (CDT)

::Right. The bullets allow better condensing, so if there's more there that's really an episode comment rather than a distinguishing character comment, then it should be removed. The essense of ''what he is'' is different than how we need to talk about ''what he does''. I have [[Gaius Baltar]] next on my target for such a truncation once we approve the format, then Roslin. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:17, 14 July 2006 (CDT)

I am opposed to this use of bulleted list on a character page. I understand that it is to long, but it's not good this way. I'll work on it later. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 12:20, 19 July 2006 (CDT)

: I am, personally, fine with bullets, but don't feel married to them. A narrative format giving this same level of information is, to me, equally desirable. --[[User:Day|Day]] ([[User talk:Day|Talk]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin]] - [http://hiver.swordofthestars.com/ SotS]) 15:04, 19 July 2006 (CDT)

== Mum and Pop Adjustment ==

Since the authenticity of the character's parents was correctly called into question by Merv per Citation Jihad guidelines, Sky One information on the character's parents, specifically Evilyn Adama, has been removed as its official source cannot be verified. The brief character page for Ms. Adama has also been removed. We may likely know more once [[Caprica (series)|Caprica]] airs. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:44, 28 July 2006 (CDT)

== His service file in "Hero" ==

Here is the service file from "Hero":

- Born H5/21290 and raised in the colony of Caprica, in [Qualia], a small coastal community. 
- Mother Evelyn Adama, an accountant. 
- Father Joseph Adama, a prominent attorney who specialized in criminal defense and civil liberties. 

MILITARY SERVICE 
D6/21311 First commission: Battlestar Galactica fighter squadron 
E4/21312 Commendation for shooting down Cylon fighter in first combat mission 
D3/21314 Mustered out of service post armistice 
H5/21317 Served as Deck Hand in merchant fleet and as crewman aboard inter-colony tramp freighters 
D1/21331 Recommissioned to Fleet 
D2/21337 Major: Battlestar Atlantia 
R3/21341 Executive Officer: Battlestar Columbia 
C2/21345 Commander: Battlestar Valkyrie 
C2/21348 Commander: Battlestar Galactica 

What doesn't make sense is that he was XO on ''Valkyrie'' only 3 years ago. I got the distinct impression that he was on ''Galactica'' for a longer time. For example Gaeta, Starbuck and possibly Tyrol make statements that they served with him for 2-3 years on seperate occassions.
Given his stated service time of 45 years, it would put the current year at 21356. That would also put the Valkyrie mission 8 years back. So assuming that it was 8 instead of 3 years, everything would fit again --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 07:09, 18 November 2006 (CST)

== Is Adama a Cylon? ==

This might sound far-reaching, but I don't think it is. [[Leoben]] hinted at the possibility, and we see him in another episode (sorry, don't remember which one) crushing pecan shells (or walnuts?) with his bare hands. Who do we know has superhuman strength? The human-Cylons as evidenced by when Leoben rips apart a pipe at the Ragnar station, and when Kara is fist-fighting 6 on Caprica, along with some other shows of strengths by human cylons that I'm neglecting to mention.

He might be one of the Final Five. Perhaps the Final Five were a rebellious group trying to help the humans, and that's why the other seven don't talk about them.
-- [[User:Rhorn|supercheetah]] 05:41, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
:Adama has a son and served in the original Cylon War. He cannot be a Cylon. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:32, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
::Perhaps he was one of the first human-Cylons. Serving in the first Cylon War may have been a rebellion on his part. --[[User:Rhorn|supercheetah]] 20:44, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Not possible. The [[Cylon Centurion Model 0005|original Cylons]] were purely mechanical (identical in appearance to their [[Centurion (TOS)|Original Series versions]]), not humanoid as many are now. The humanoids weren't built until sometime between the end of the Cylon War and probably a short time before the second. William Adama has a child but also was the son of another [[Joseph Adama|mentioned-only character]], of which a new character, [[Romo Lampkin]], has studied under, which verifies Adama's humanity. Cylons are effectively infertile (with [[Sharon Agathon|one]] exception). Check out the articles "[[Humanoid Cylon speculation]]" for notable characters that are eligible for suspicion, and [[Characters eliminated from suspicion|a list of characters with virtually no possibility]] of being a Cylon for some additional insight. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:08, 15 March 2007 (CDT)

== Who here thinks Adama is a bad Commander==

In the origional series he was really a good commander, but here, all he did was get assigned to a bad ship and not get promoted to Admiral. I've looked at the episode in a whole and see how bad Adama is in the CIC. When they get attacked in the miniseries all he does is exchange pleasentries with his XO whole a nuke is imbound that is going to kill 85 of his men. I don't want to sound rude, but shouldn't the great hero be a little smarter than he is. His own son was a better commander than he was as he at least cripled a Baseship by maneuvering the Pegasus instead of just sitting there letting his Vipers do all the work while he is outmaneuvered, outgunned, and outmatched every time. --[[User:Sith Penguin Lord|Sith Penguin Lord]] 15:34, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
:Remember that Adama planned the Battle of New Caprica. Granted, Pegasus had to intervene, but the plan was a daring one. Also remember that, like Apollo said, "command is about people". Adama's crew trusts him, and he knows how to communicate with his crew and defuse issues. For an example of the latter, I refer to the scene in "[[Flight of the Phoenix]]" in which Tigh and Gaeta are arguing, and Adama approaches Gaeta in a friendly way and gets him to work. Also, when a nuke is gonna hit you in 10 seconds, it's too late to do anything but pray the Vipers will take it down. Weapon batteries are powered off (they're no use against just two Raiders), and maneuvering a mile-long ship in such a short time is also not doable. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 15:43, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

::The RDM Adama is more straightlaced but experienced military man, with his flaws that come with that. Bill Adama is also a ''cool cucumber'' in the heat of battle, with no dramatics like Captain Kirk would have. Character history shows that he does that purposely to show other crew an example of calm and discipline. [[Felix Gaeta]] emulates Adama often in season 1 with that same demeanor. The TOS Adama was more of a blend between the military Adama and [[Laura Roslin]]'s spiritual and civilian outlook. Adama and Saul Tigh have a rapport with each other that has kept them calm through experience: They both served in the Cylon War, which was horrific in the worst way. Perhaps they don't overreact because (1) they knew that a battlestar could take a nuke hit (it is designed to) and (2) they've seen worse.

::Don't discount Adama's strategy at the [[Battle of New Caprica]]. It ''worked'' and very well. But every strategy has its weaknesses, and Adama knew that if more than two baseships engaged ''Galactica'', they were in trouble. His son (who's learned to be a good battlestar commmander himself) showed equal thoughtfulness in (1) coming to the battle (2) leaving his Vipers behind as protection for the last of humanity just in case, and (3) realizing that sacrificing one battlestar against 4 baseships was worth it to keeping one battlestar alive. -- [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:54, 20 April 2007 (CDT) ([[User_Talk:Spencerian|Talk]] - [[Special:Contributions/Spencerian|Contrib Skillz]] - [[Special:Editcount/Spencerian|Edit Skillz]])

:I kinda like that he isn't really a man of action. Outwards, he is calm, reserved and contemplative. However he was very strong feelings and everyone now and then they shine through. Sometimes that's in private like him crushing the nuts in "Home" or slamming his desk in "Exodus, Part I". Sometimes, it's public ally, and that's when really bad things happen, like his decision to overthrow Roslin in "Kobol's Last Gleaming".
:He isn't prone to theatrics and doesn't forcefully show off his authority with barking dramatic orders all the time. That's somewhat unusual for SciFi leads. Jeffrey Sinclair from B5 comes to mind as well, but that character isn't offset with something else. But all in all, I wouldn't say that he's a bad commander. He makes some bad calls now and then when his feelings get the better of him, but also some good decisions.
:Lee is really more of an action figure, and maybe the writers want to contrast that. But good results now and then don't necessarily make a better leader. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:03, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
:Not that it matters very much, but I realized it just now: ''Pegasus'' is a much bigger, much more powerful and possibly more maneuverable ship than ''Galactica'', therefore taking out a basestar with ''Pegasus'' is not as much of an accomplishment as taking out a basestar with ''Galactica''. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 17:11, 20 April 2007 (CDT)
:[[BW:NOT|Battlestar Wiki is not a forum]]. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:13, 20 April 2007 (CDT)

== Disliking guesses ==

Anyone think that Adama's dislike of his officers guessing (Water) is an homage to Sir Arthur Conan Doyle?

''"I never guess. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."''

Just a thought :) --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 12:25, 5 November 2007 (CST)

Talk:Galactica type battlestar/Archive 1

2007-11-04T17:36:10Z

Madbrood: Thoughts on class name

:: Archive from [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/en/index.php?title=Talk:Galactica_type_battlestar&oldid=47676 April 17, 2006]
== Medical Capabilites of a Battlestar ==

Peter,

Your assertion of "unfound speculation" concerning my contribution is uninformed and unfounded. I am a military medical planner and a published author. My assertion of the potential medical capabilities and requirements of an intergalactic warship (modeled on a US aircraft carrier), while hypothetical, is informed. Keep in mind these are requirements that the ship would have originally been built (not the "as is" state). At this point in the story line, clearly Major Cottle is the only doctor on Galactica, however we have never seen the Pegasus medical bay or any of its medical personnel. With established industrial facilities on Pegasus (Viper production established in “Scar”), the Pegasus would have evn greater Occupational Health / Preventive Medicine than Galactica. And if you do a walk down of the ancillary services (pharmacy (camala extract), orthopedic and x-ray (Kara’s knee injury), optometry (ADM Adama’s glasses), etc, you will see they exist even if they are not portrayed. Additionally, it was an Intensive Care Unit (ICU) bed, complete with ventilator, which William Adama was in during his multiple surgeries (establishing an Operation Room (OR)).

Capital ships are designed to go into battle, which means they will take damage and casualties. Often it is the ability to regenerate / repair / refit in the quickest amount of time that determines the outcome of battles. General Nathan Bedford Forrest of the Confederate States of America is famous for the quote, “He who gets there the fastest with the mostest wins.” RDM makes reference to his experience onboard a Navy ship in podcasts, including “The Captain’s Hand”. Thus, there is an established framework present.

I provide you two active hyperlinks that back up my contribution. While dated, they are still relevant.

http://www.mfp.usmc.mil/TeamApp/G4/Topics/20040916154046/Med%20Cont%20Factbook.pdf

www.iiimef.usmc.mil/medical/ FMF/FMFE/FMFEref/fs_man/CHAPTER%2014.html

--[[User:Killerman|Killerman]] 20:26, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

:I have no doubt that you are well qualified to speak about the medical capabilities of an aircraft carrier. I dispute their relevance to BSG, however. while they might provide a good baseline for guesswork, I don't think that simple guesswork belongs on this site. We don't extrapolate armament details based on the capabilities of modern naval vessels, for example. If you wanted, I wouldn't object to something along the lines of "we may conjecture that the medical facilities of a colonial battlestar are roughly comparable to those of a modern aircraft carrier" with one of the links you provided above; but I will not agree to listing out detailed specifications based on no in-continuity data. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:37, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

::''At last I went to the artisans. I was conscious that I knew nothing at all, as I may say, and I was sure that they knew many fine things; and here I was not mistaken, for they did know many things of which I was ignorant, and in this they certainly were wiser than I was. But I observed that even the good artisans fell into error;--because they were good workmen they thought that they also knew all sorts of high matters, and this defect in them overshadowed their wisdom;''
:::''The Apology of Socrates'', Plato

::Sir, none of us doubt that you know what you are talking about when you list the medical capabilities of a modern aicraft carrier. But this does not grant you increased insight into the inner logic of the tv series: First, we have no idea how many medical staff are onboard, and comparing it to an aircraft carrier is just speculation. Second, we have no idea how many crewmen a Mercury class battlestar normally has, as has been asked in the "Questions" segment of the "[[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]" episode guide article: Pegasus has 1,750 crewmen when it encounters Galactica, but A) It was going into drydock, and some of the crew may have left to the port, B) 700 crewmen died in the initial attack C) Cain impressed civillians she encounteed into service and most importantly C) Cain was fighting a hit and run war against the Cylons for months, which wore down her crew numbers through attrition. But I digress. Yes, we should object to a statement like "we may conjecture that medical facilities of a colonial battlestar are roughly comparable to those of a modern aircraft carrier". --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:41, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

:::I guess you can object to that too, if you want. I was trying to compromise. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 21:48, 12 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I'm sorry Peter but this is a really good example of the speculation I don't think we should be inserting into this kind of article. There is nothing to be gained from such a compromise. I would if there were, and would like to, but I can't change facts. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:51, 12 April 2006 (CDT)

Peter,

As I am preparing to deploy for a year, please forgive me as I have packed all my BSG video. I grant you that the personnel numbers for a fully manned battlestar are informed speculation based upon a comparison to a modern aircraft carrier. I use these numbers as RDM has referenced a battlestar to a modern carrier, his experience in the Navy (podcast for The Captain’s Hand), Galactica type battlestar – article – dimensions’ jpg comparing a Battlestar to a CVN Image:Bsg-2-cvn.jpg on this very page. My professional training drives me to fill in unknowns with assumptions. That is what the personnel piece was intended and is consistent with other speculation within the Wiki, so long as it is said to be speculation (i.e. the actual working of an FTL drive). But sticking to the medical capabilities known from “in country (your term)” knowledge (i.e. seen on screen or in dialogue), we know much about Galactica. First, Galactica has a sickbay (Act of Contrition, Litmus). Exact bed count is not known, but is greater than seven (Act of Contrition). Based upon the burn victims (Act of Contrition) and treatment of William Adama (Scattered, Valley of Darkness, Fragged), we have seen Intensive Care Unit (ICU) beds, complete with ventilators, electrocardiograms (ECG), pulse / respiration / pulseox (shows percent of oxygen saturation dissolved in blood) monitors. We also have seen at least on operation room (OR) (Fragged), and subsequently confirm its existence with Kara Thrace’s knee surgery (Litmus) and Lee Adama’s chest surgery (Sacrifice). Concerning the radiology suite, we saw a Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI – incidentally, a very advanced piece of equipment) when Baltar had Dr. Cottle examine his head looking for an implanted chip (sorry, don’t remember the episode). We also saw conventional (chest) x-rays of Commander William Adama, during his surgery (Fragged, Scattered). We heard about Sharon’s ultrasound, as part of pre-natal health on Hera, where Dr. Cottle found an abnormality. And while not part of radiology, Hera, is placed in a Neonatal Intensive Care Unit (NICU) incubator, when is born prematurely. Next, we know it has a pharmacy. The President asked Dr. Cottle for Camala, the Viper pilots were taking “stims” (33, Final Cut) and Kara is taking pain killers for her knee surgery (Litmus) and latter asks Lee for antibiotics for Anders (Lay Down Your Burdens – Part II). Additionally, with the surgeries and burn victims, there are other pharmacological needs and a pharmacy is where these things dwell. Other areas that we have seen or know about are a morgue, where Galactica-Boomer was stored; a laboratory (to do support simple blood type and matching to support surgery), optometry with a fabrication lab (William Adama wears glasses and as stated in other areas of this site, battlestars are designed for sustained operations). We are also can infer that Galactica has some preventive medicine / occupational health capability because in “Water”, there was a discussion about water recycling (leading to potable water). It is Preventive Medicine that does this task.

I would like to add that RDM and SciFi do a heck of a job weaving into the background all these things. As an experienced health services officer with over 22 years in the health care field, there is a tremendous amount of detail that happens in the background. If I was a casual observer, I might miss or not care about some of these things. As someone headed into harms way, I assure you that our fighting forces moral is impacted combat health support. I absolutely belive we need to address the medical capabilities of a battle star. The propose the best way is start with what it would look like at full strenght / desired capability. Clearly, Season 3 will start with two grossly undermanned battlestars, with very limited offensive combat capability.--[[User:Killerman|Killerman]] 22:10, 16 April 2006 (CDT)

:The citations you've provided make it much easier to include this information, and I thank you for taking the time to write this all out. The addition should improve the article considerably. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:21, 16 April 2006 (CDT)

::I am sorry, but this doesn't change much: the above information was gleaned from things we've seen on screen, and is thus informative and useful. However, the original entry to this article he made (speculative medical numbers, etc.)...isn't supported by any of these citations. Basically, they're two separate issues and should be treated separately. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 00:48, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

:::Reverting to Killerman's last version isn't a good idea, but he (or we) can refactor his contribution using the points and evidence he raised above. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:57, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

::::Oh yes yes, something new and revised. Yes. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 01:24, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

== Manufacture vs. Assembly of Ammunition ==
The "assembly" activities that take place in [[Epiphanies]] would fall into the realm of "production", depending on how you look at it. It seemed like they were loading the casings (I thought RDM said they were going to use caseless ammo) with powder, seating the primer and inserting the bullet, turning the various components into a cartridge. Whether or not they produced the individual components (metal for bullets and casings would be easy, compounds for primers and powder probably harder to obtain), the act of putting those bits together would often be considered "manufacturing" ammunition. Not a big deal, and I didn't even change the text (since it's pretty debatable). An example of this use of the word is in this [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A4044-2004Jul21_2.html Washington Post Article]:

"''Israeli Military Industries said the ammunition will be manufactured in Israel but the raw materials, including propellants, projectiles and primers, come from U.S. sources.''
"

Once again, not trying to start a war, just wanted to weigh in on a subject I knew a little about (since they so rarely come up). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:02, 17 April 2006 (CDT)

== Picture of destroyed Galactica-type Battlestar ==
Though certainly a model of a Galactica-type was used for the shot, it's clearly mentioned at the very beginning of the miniseries that ''Galactica'' is the only ship of it's kind still in service. The story places the shot only hours after the beginning of the attack, so it should be impossible that another Galactica-type (museum or mothballed in a reserve-fleet) could be readied for battle. Shouldn't the destroyed battlestar be taken as one of a third class between the Galactica-Type and Mercury-class, still looking a lot like the Galactica-type? [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 13:39, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:That was my impulse. Story logic dictates that the destroyed hulk probably wasn't a Galactica type, but in the real world we can surmise that Zoic probably re-used the Galactica model. Of course, from that distance, we could fudge our interpretation either way. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 13:50, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::They don't necessarily mean that there are no Galactica type battlestars in service besides the Big-G, it could be taken to mean none like Galactica, eg. non-refitted, no networks, etc. The battlestar there could easily (and belivably) be a refitted Galactica type. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:22, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::I concur with Talos, and that has been my understanding. Besides, unless the ship was simply overwhelmed by Cylon military brawn, an old-Cylon War battlestar would put up the same level of fight as ''Galactica'' would have. Else, it was just as vulnerable as the new battlestars. I agree, cinematically, that that Galactica model was just reused.--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 14:59, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:::[http://www.skyone.co.uk/programme/pgefeature.aspx?pid=3&fid=642 Something to ask] the big man himself? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 14:34, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I'll do that in a little bit, I have to pick up my brother from his band practice in a minute. The life of a college student living at home... --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:36, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I really doubt he's going to take the time to clarify such a niggling detail. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 14:39, 24 April 2006 (CDT)

It has always been my belief that Doral meant it was the only Galactica-type battlestar never refited. I always point to the ''U.S.S. Missouri'' (Mighty 'Mo) as an example of a ship with over 50 years of combat service that just kept getting refitted over time to the point that it was firing satellite-targeted cruise missiles at the end of its service. I think Galactica was just the only one that was never refitted. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 15:57, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:My point exactly. It's like the WWII era Essex class carriers. There were refits that were completly rebuilt but a few, essentially, originals survived until the early 1960s with the others serving thru Vietnam ([[Wikipedia:USS Oriskany (CVA-34)|USS Oriskany (CVA-34)]] for example). The [[Wikipedia:USS Lexington (CV-16)|USS Lexington (CV-16)]] was in service as a training ship until 1991! --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:26, 24 April 2006 (CDT)

::It's exactly the ''USS Missouri''-example why I believe that ''Galactica'' is the last of it's class: All four ''Iowa''-Class battleships were updated and they all were finally decommissoned (for now) between 1990 and 1992. If the ''Galactica'' is simply the only one not refitted one would have to ask why that wasn't done. Why would one refit three ''Iowas'' but not the last one? This usually only happens if a ship is somehow different from her sisters (e.g. having sustained heavy battledamage the refit is more expensive and not worth the effort). Also it could be that the fleet is being downsized, no longer needing all ships. An example for this would be the British [[Wikipedia:Illustrious class aircraft carrier|''Illustrious''-Class]] of World War II. Of these three carriers only one received an angled flight-deck, surviving the scrapping of the other two for twenty years. But in all these cases I find it hard to believe that anyone would describe one of the ships decommissioned first as ''the last of it's kind still in service'' if there others (refitted or not) still in action. Which ''Iowa'' would have been described that way prior to it's decommissioning: ''Iowa'' in 1990 or ''Missouri'' in 1992? Wasn't ''Lexington'' the last ''Essex''?
::What Doral says before and after that statement makes it quite clear that he's not talking about a certain detail (like ''last of it's kind without a network'' would have been). He starts with ''worldfamous Battlestar Galactica'', then ''last of her kind still in service'' followed by ''constructed 50 years ago as one of the first twelve battlestars, representing Caprica''. The only possible explanation for other Galactica-types this leaves would be ''Galactica'' being the last of the first twelve, with other Galactica-types coming from a second batch no longer representing specific colonys. But even then "last of her kind" is an usual choice of words to describe that. [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 17:13, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:::Well said. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:04, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
::::I think it is still ambiguous, and we should wait for an RDM blog reply before changing anything. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:54, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:::::I doubt RDM will respond to this issue, and I think the safest course of action would just be to remove it. There's sufficient reason to doubt that the hulk isn't a galactica-type that we shouldn't take a firm position on the issue. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 01:22, 25 April 2006 (CDT)
:::The motivation for no refit to ''Galactica'' could be nostaliga or historical preservation, explaining the odd wording; for such a purpose, only the unaltered version would count. ...Don't get the impression I believe that just because I said it. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 20:56, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:Not to mention Adama, "It's a computer network and I'll be damned if I'll let it aboard my ship while I'm in command." (Paraphrased)--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:01, 24 April 2006 (CDT)
:We don't even know for sure if the destroyed battlestar was even in service. It could have been decommissioned earlier and be acting like a museum, just like Galactica was supposed to be. That would also explain its quick destruction. (It snapped cleanly in half). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:01, 13 January 2007 (CST)
::It could easily be in service still. In the Russian (and former Soviet) navy, there is a class of destroyers called the [[w:Udaloy class destroyer|Udaloy]]. The last of the class was heavily refitted and updated, bringing it up almost to Burke class levels. The important thing here is that there are still unrefitted ones in service (there was only enough money to upgrade one, the Admiral Chabenko). Then again, there is the Fletcher/Sumner class destroyers. The main differences were the gun armament (5x1 5" in Fletcher, 3x2 5" in Sumner), and the Sumner's twin rudders. Same hull and most of the superstructure. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 10:13, 13 January 2007 (CST)

== Crew numbers ==

How do we know a fully manned and equipped battlestar has a crew of 4,000 to 5,000? Was it said in some episode or where do these numbers come from? I'm updating the [[de:Kampfstern, Galactica-Typ|german battlestar article]] and I don't like to use data that seems to be made up out of thin air. The links and notes provided don't give any hint about the normal crew number of a battlestar of this type. We apologise for any inconvenience. -- [[User:Astfgl|Astfgl]] 16:03, 25 June 2006 (CDT)
:In the Miniseries, Tyrol says that there are over 2,000 people on Galactica. The ships seems very undermanned at the same time so I would think that 4-5,000 is a good estimate. I'm not sure if we've seen any concrete numbers though, maybe in the magazine. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:52, 25 June 2006 (CDT)

::Answer: in "Water" Baltar says how many civilians there are in the Fleet, and subtracting that from the total survivor population in that episode yielded the crew aboard Galactica as of "Water", at some number over 2,600 (I'd have to check). In several podcasts, Ron Moore keeps saying that while not on a skeleton crew, Galactica has about half the number of people on it that a fully crewed battlestar of its class would have. So, "between 4,000 and 5,000". --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 17:38, 25 June 2006 (CDT)
:::Thanks for the clarification, I'll take these numbers then. -- [[User:Astfgl|Astfgl]] 07:37, 26 June 2006 (CDT)

== Flight tube counts ==
I see (in [[:Image:Bsg-2-cvn.jpg]], e.g.) 20 slots that seem like they might each be divided in half along the side of ''Galactica''. I can see why it is likely they are launch tubes, but I can also see many other similarly sized openings around them. Although it's a fine guess and quite likely to be true, I'm left hestitant that this evidence is sufficiently strong to be canon. In any case, if consensus is that this is canon, we should certainly footnote it, as the truth of the statement is not patently clear. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 00:10, 10 August 2006 (CDT)

== Delivery of Nuclear weapons ==

Since the Cylon forces repeatedly use missiles as an effective delivery platform for their nuclear weapons, isn't ir relativel safe to assume- since, of course, the Cylons were created by the Colonials- that the method deployed by Colonial forces is also missile-based? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 09:22, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:It's a good idea, and I personally agree with it, but there is no aired proof, and thusly we cannot confirm how they do it. The two Galactica nukes we've seen thus far (Baltar's and the one Boomer uses to destroy the Basestar in Kobol's Last Gleaming Part II) have been removed from their delivery systems. (Although Boomer's did look like it was in a bomb casing). --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 09:31, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
::Fair point. Perhaps we'll get clarificaion in Season3, since Galactica herself still has three nuclear weapons aboard. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:06, 12 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Well, we know now, good call on it being revealed in season 3, Although they haven't been used yet, I'm willing to bet they will be used in season 4 and we are going to have to update the articles again.--[[User:Tomglima|Tomglima]] 20:09, 23 October 2007 (CDT)
== Galactica-Class? ==

Please bear with me for a moment as I am citing a magazine many of you may consider illegitimate. In the September 2006 issue of Maxim Magazine, the "Fashion" section of Maxim Style features a photoshoot of the RDM Battlestar Galactica cast modeling various fashions. In one photograph, featuring James Callis and Tricia Helfer in a small corner alcove of the CIC (possibly weapons control or some other station), a center console features the text "GALACTICA-CLASS BATTLESTAR" in two places, easily readable to the viewer. I know it is general policy on television shows that whatever is aired in a given episode is canon, and what is not aired, non-canon. However, would this (i.e., "Galactica-class Battlestar") be considered canon since this console is occasionally seen in a given episode? Or am I just reading too much into a simple photoshoot? --[[User:Jonfucius|Jonfucius]] 09:30, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:Do you have a photograph of this? or a timestamp where we can check the DVD's? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 09:55, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
::I assume he means [http://bsg-cz.net/news/files/images/season_3/maxim_5.jpg this] but on that pic I can't really see it on the prinouts on the table. It does indeed look like the weapon's control room, though I can't recall the table there. The room can be seen very rarely. In the miniseries for example --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:06, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:::I can barely make it out. Though it isn't canon, unless we saw it on the show itself, or if someone from the show were to tell us that "yes, indeed, ''Galactica'' is a ''Galactica''-class battlestar". Then it's canon. However, by all means, we can certainly put something in the notes section regarding this. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:17, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
::::That's definitely the weapons control section of CIC. If we can get a clearer shot, that will remove all doubt; it does look like "Galactica class" to me. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:57, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Something for [[BW:OC]]? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:14, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::If I had access to a scanner I would provide a high-res image to examine; unfortunately, I am a relatively-poor college student (and how many aren't these days?) and the only scanner access I have is a public-use scanner in our bookstore. However, the image Mercifull provided is the one I indicated in my first post. In my copy of the issue, the text clearly reads "Galactica-class Battlestar". I know this is a minor detail among many in a show so richly layered by the writers and producers, but I wanted to make sure the Battlestar Wiki was as accurate as possible; I use the Wiki to enhance my experience of this incredible drama. Thank you all for your timely responses to my question. --[[User:Jonfucius|Jonfucius]] 11:39, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
I hate to dredge up an old topic, but here's some food for thought that might support the theory that ''Galactica'' is the class name. Now, we're told that Galactica herself represented Caprica, the de facto capital of the colonies. Surely it stands to reason that the first battlestar built would be the one to represent the primary colony- Galactica. I know this is fanwanking, but I just thought of it and figured I'd voice my idea.

== Actual class name? ==

I can purely speculate that the actual name of the original battlestar class (of which ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' is a member) is ''Onassis'', in honor of the wife of assassinated President [[Wikipedia:John F. Kennedy|John F. Kennedy]], [[Wikipedia:Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis|Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis]]. So, ''Galactica'' is considered as an ''Onassis''-class battlestar. The prototype of its class, battlestar ''Onassis'' is destroyed in the renewed [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon]] conflict. --[[User:Starkiller|Starkiller]] 21:06, 18 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::LMAO at this troll.--[[User:Tomglima|Tomglima]] 20:11, 23 October 2007 (CDT)
:And there's ''nothing'' to back this up with? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 02:06, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:And how would Colonials know of the Kennedys? -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 02:29, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
::Because they got information from Earth about these Kennedys before the Cylon Holocaust. Years before the [[Cylon War]], the battlestar prototype, ''Onassis'', is constructed, then ''Galactica'' itself. Therefore, we presume this original battlestar class (of which ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' is a member) is ''Onassis''. --[[User:Starkiller|Starkiller]] 04:20, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:I am ''very'' confused. There would have to be some serious cite for that change. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 05:10, 19 September 2006 (CDT)

I think that Starkiller is being absurd to prove a point, but, like others, I'm missing it. As per our convention, pure speculation is disallowed here without official sources to back it up. Since the picture of two BSG actors on an official set using props that match others with information cited as official and used here for articles (navigation charts) which indicates that ''Galactica'' is the first of her class, we should continue on this thread. Otherwise, Starkiller's comment is patent nonsense given that BSG is deliberately set so we don't know if the events occur in real-world Earth's past, present, or future. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 07:13, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:I've heard on several occasions that Galactica may be an "Atlantia-class" battlestar, but have found nothing to support this online. I've also heard that the original Galactica was a "Columbia-class". Is this true? If so, is it possible that the re-imagined Galactica is also a Columbia-class? I think this should head on over to [[BW:OC]]. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:46, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
::"Columbia-class" is common fan fiction. "Atlantia" class would make little sense: why would the fleet admiral use a old battlestar as his flagship? His ship would be Mercury class or something better (and more advanced--it was destroyed like the other [[CNP]] ships). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:34, 19 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Then why does Adama choose Galactica as his flaghsip, and not Pegasus? There's nothing said on-screen to suggest that the Galactica-type battlestars were NOT re-fitted with computer networks. I'm just playing devil's advocate here. Besides, the Atlantia mentioned in the mini could easily have been Mercury-class, and the original may have been retired like the Big G was. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:54, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Commanders don't have to choose the best and biggest ship as their flagship as long as they can do their duty from another one. Don't know who but some guy in WWII chose a destroyer or maybe a battleship as his command post and not an aircraft carrier. As long as there are options, there is some personal choice involved.
::::And you're right about networks. The Mini gives the distinct impression that it was only Adama's doing that the Galactica
::::wasn't more automated -[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:08, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::Yeah, Admiral Raymond Spruance chose the cruiser USS Indianapolis as his flagship when he had multiple carriers at his disposal. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:11, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
::::As shown in events during the second half of season 2, Adama doesn't likely trust ''Pegasus'' crew. To quote Adama: "I tend to go with what you know, until something better comes along." So the decision is logical; he trusts ''Galactica'' and her crew, thus he plants his flag there. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:52, 20 September 2006 (CDT)
::::An corollary to Joe's comments: It is very likely that there is a long-standing (but fading) tradition to keep ''Galactica'' from being refitted, just as our USS Constitution was never refitted as a steamer, in keeping with her (supposed) significancy in Colonial war history. Besides, to ''revert'' any ship from new to old technology is just weird and very unlikely. There may have been fewer commanders willing to assume command of ''Galactica'' in this tradition, but Adama, a man who knew all too well of the problems of technology (and had served on her in the last part of the war), chose ''Galactica'' willingly, I figure. This is reinforced with the arrival of ''Pegasus''. He could've moved his new admiral flag there, but he hasn't. He prefers to go with what he knows until something better shows up. The old battlestar ''Galactica'', in Adama's mind, is still best. ''Pegasus'' survived more on luck than inherent design. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:30, 20 September 2006 (CDT)

==Role==

As with the Mercury-class article, I've amended the class role to [[Wikipedia:Battlecarrier|battlecarrier]]. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:37, 27 September 2006 (CDT)

:Madbrood, I can appreciate the use, but based on your link, I disagree. The term "battlestar" is a true carrier AND battleship in one, where the "battlecarrier" of our Earth is a rough amalgam that doesn't come close in size, fighter capacity, or firepower. Further, I wonder if we want to use complext Earth naval terms instead of what is given in the show to describe the ships using simple naval language. "Carrier/battleship" is less "smooth" than "battlecruiser", but is is also more accurate. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:44, 27 September 2006 (CDT)
::I agree. Battlecruiser is a nice term, but it really doesn't fit Galactica. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 08:35, 28 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Fair enough. I just figured it sounded a bit more "military". --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 09:47, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

::::I know. I'd love to put up "big, frakkin' warship/carrier with guns, lots of guns," but "warship/carrier" may have to do. Keeping it simple. :) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:33, 28 September 2006 (CDT)

== Battlestar Redirect ==
Battlestar (RDM) currently redirects here. The only reason this concerned me was I was actually linking to a more generic use of the word ("Adama had been on an another battlestar before ''Galactica''). Back when "big G" was the only one we knew of, it defintely made sense. Now that we have "''Galactica'' type", "Mercury class", and "''Valkyrie'' type" I was wondering if maybe we needed a more generic article to sit at battlestar (RDM) describing the aircraft carrier/battleship capital ship concept in more general terms, with ''Galactica'', ''Pegasus'', and ''Valkyrie'' being specific examples. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:45, 4 December 2006 (CST)
:That sounds good to me, a general article explaing what battlestars are, listing known ones, mentioning BSGs, missions, etc. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:30, 4 December 2006 (CST)
::Rather than that, why not redirect to the central [[Battlestar]] disambiguation? It already has listed all battlestars by show and type, and avoids extra work. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 16:26, 4 December 2006 (CST)
:::'''That''' is exactly what I wanted to link to. I just automatically tagged an RDM on the end of it. I'll go change that link, but I agree that we should just change Battlestar (RDM) to point to Battlestar (work smarter not harder). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:57, 4 December 2006 (CST)
::::Hah, I'd forgotten about that page. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:23, 4 December 2006 (CST)
::::Done. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 21:40, 4 December 2006 (CST)

== Life Support ==

How exactly do Galactica's life support systems work? I know their recirculation units replenish oxygen and remove carbon dioxide, but does this oxygen come from tanks or is it recycled from somewhere? The ISS uses electrolysis to split water into hydrogen and oxygen, so is is possible that Galactica-type ships do something similar to this?--[[User:Rapturous|Rapturous]] 13:52, 10 October 2007 (CDT)
: Other than the scrubbers, it's really never been explained. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [http://www.sanctuarywiki.org Sanctuary Wiki — ''New''] 14:03, 10 October 2007 (CDT)
::Theoretically, they could have a big room full of plants somewhere in the ship. Plants 'breathe in' carbon dioxide and 'breathe out' oxygen, the opposite of what we do. However, you would need some kind of imitation sun then, because the chemical reaction I just described can only occur in sunlight. Other (artifical) means of converting CO2 back to oxygen could also be used (scrubbers?), but like the plants they will also require energy to work. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 06:57, 11 October 2007 (CDT)
:::Have you ever seen the film [[w:Sunshine (2007 film)|Sunshine]] Catrope?
:::http://www.sunshinedna.com/wp-images/2005/09/2109_06a.jpg
:::They used an oxygen garden in that to produce the breathable air :D --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 07:37, 11 October 2007 (CDT)
::::Yep, I have. Spoilers for Sunshine follow: {{spoilli|In the scene where the ''Icarus II'' crew boards ''Icarus I'', you can see that her garden is still alive, because of the CO2 <-> O2 equilibrium between the plants and Captain Pinbacker who has lived there for seven years (having killed the rest of his crew).}} --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 07:58, 11 October 2007 (CDT)

Talk:Crossroads, Part II/Archive1

2007-04-16T20:45:53Z

Madbrood: /* Fleet Location */

== Promo Pics ==
Are [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000aaqbh here]. Hard believe that's the last for Season 3. However, they may release a few more for this episode. At least there's the 2-hr movie between seasons. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:03, 27 February 2007 (CST)

That promo pic of Six, Baltar, and Hera appears to be shot in the "Final Five" room. Anyone else notice this? [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 19:57, 28 February 2007 (CST)

: Yes, indeed I did. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:02, 28 February 2007 (CST)

::Baltar's been having visions of Six and Hera in the opera house since season 1, so it's not necessarily connected to the Final Five. Since this episode will reveal 1 or 4 of the Final Five depending on which interview you go by, there's a pretty good chance that it relates to them as well. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:16, 28 February 2007 (CST)

:::Am I completely off-base in thinking that that's Virtual Baltar alongside Virtual Six? Because the other photos of that episode show the "real" Baltar still quite disheveled with a thick beard while that Baltar is clean-shaven, not unlike Caprica's Baltar. Didn't Ron Moore say something about the two alter-egos being key figures in the last episodes of the season? --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 04:50, 3 March 2007 (CST)

::::Not really "off base", in fact I think that's the most popular theory in general. So unless we're all off base.....which is admitedly possible :P --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 07:37, 3 March 2007 (CST)

:::::If they are able to interact with eachother it would have significant implications regarding their nature. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 17:50, 7 March 2007 (CST)

::::::The virtual Baltar normally wears the unique pinstripe suit from the Miniseries, which I don't see here. I do believe this is a visualization and that is Virtual Six, for the Opera House doesn't exist. If the two alter-egos do somehow directly interact, some Serious Shit will ensure, but damned if I can really glean what. This is as big of a season stumper as season 2's cliffhanger. And, no, Kara Thrace will NOT be one of the Five. But it may be, in my guess, one of these three, although they don't realize it: Dualla, Tigh, or Gaeta. I still hold exception to the fact that what Three saw may be the five priests of the Temple of Five, who just so happen to have incarnations in the current timeline. (Note the monkey that exited my anus and is waving at you). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:44, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

==Predictions==
Well, it's early, and I don't care to step on Slander's toes, but I have forseen an event in Crossroads, Part II. The top 5 American Idol contestants cameo as... '''THE FINAL FIVE!''' --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:06, 14 March 2007 (CDT)
*I'd like to make a motion that all Predictions in Talk pages be deleted as they are assinine and serve no other purpose than to promote the person making the prediction. Predictions should be in Forums and chatrooms or discussion groups, not here.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:29, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
**Dude... they're friggin' jokes. No need to be so uptight. You're reminding me of Merv. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:07, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
*** Motion denied. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 12:04, 19 March 2007 (CDT)

OK. The purpose of a talk page is for ''brief'' discussions and questions about the article. Generally, the humorous "predictions" in other talk pages have not detracted from the talk page's purpose or grown in size, and honestly have given me a chuckle, although my feelings on the matter aren't the sole vote about it. Provided that we don't get into numerous predictions from many users to the talk page in some way, I don't see a problem with it at this time. If there's still a problem about it, a silly page could have a bulleted series of such humor if approved by consensus (although I doubt this would work, [[BW:NOT|we're not a forum]]). Sometimes, predictions are fun ''and'' on-topic: See [[Talk:Exodus, Part II]] where I made a good guess. Now, what's considered "funny" is very subjective. I don't think BB's jest is nearly as humorous as, say, the shining white Final Five being revealed as the ''Jackson Five'' or something. Jokes are OK. If it's a bad one, ignore the poster. If a talk page gets too long, ask an admin to moderate if you can't get others to end a pointless or irrelevant topic. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:00, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
:Damn I should've thought of the Jackson Five... --20:10, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
::[http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v518/Slanderpanic/1tito.jpg Tito rules!] On a more serious note, if people object to my predictions, I'll stop doing them. Honestly, this sort of in-joke is inevitable when an Internet community develops. In my opinion, it's healthy for us to not take things ''too'' seriously, or we turn into a bunch of elitists. (If anyone in the history of anything has ever needed a collective wedgie, it's Wikipedia's editing community.) Anyway, as there are currently two "Predictions" topics on this Talk page, I think I'll take the rest of the year off, until it comes time to speculate about the DVD-movie and season four. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 14:19, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

==the commercial==

hey the commercial has anders voice syaing "yeah we're cylons" WTF --[[User:Snorkel378|Snorkel378]] 21:07, 19 March 2007 (CDT)Snorkel378
:I don't know whose voice it is, but the line is definitely "It's true, we're Cylons". -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 02:12, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
:At first, I thought it was Anders speaking, just because his face appeared at the same moment. {{spoilli|On subsequent viewing, I think it's...drum roll...Chief Tyrol!}} --[[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 12:26, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
::Read the thing linked below. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:41, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

==Predictions-part 2==

I was surfing on the internet, trying to find some spoilers (lol) for the 3rd season finale, and came across this baby: http://www.thetvremote.com/battlestar-galactica-season-finale-spoilers/ (huge spoilers, so don t go there if u don t wanna read em). So, the text reveals who are the 4 of the final 5. As we already know, without the websites help, some of the final five are living and working in the colonial fleet. The 4 that are in question have a past, and we even saw a few times their memories, and we know that they lived in the colonies for quite some time. That being said, the website isn’t really convincing. But then, we know that the final five are special. We don t know what they are, we could suppose that they are more than the other cylon models, much more. We could even think that they are some sort of gods, now that too being said, I can t help but to think that those final 5, being special could have been planted in the colonies before the attacks of the miniseries. There is also a thing about Starbuck and a thing about finding earth on the website. I don t know what are their sources but the text seems very interesting and gives some very interesting ideas. {{unsigned|DedMed}}

:Many of the spoilers fit with what occurred in "Crossroads, Part II," but it brings up many new questions, too. If true, the information completely wrecks or substantially modifies what we thought Cylons were and when they came about. It should be an interesting episode, to say the least. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:39, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

::HOLY FRAKKIN FRAK! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:54, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

:::The spoilers from part 1 were correct, adding some credibility. The really shocking part is that one of the alledged final five was around during the Cylon War (yes, you heard it right, the [[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]] is a Cylon, I'm surprised no one made the connection when we've known that she has at least a dozen copies since the miniseries :D). -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 23:27, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

::I kind of wish I hadn't read them, but I couldn't help myself. Goddamit! --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 12:26, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Goddamnit is exactly the word. ''Goddamnit!'' --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 15:03, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I took my comments about the spoliers out... but just so you know. if that link is true... and it's implied in the video teaser for this episode. I'm starting to see the show in shark infested waters. But I imagine everything is not what it seems. Especially with my homedog Col. Tigh. If he really is (spolier)... then I'm gonna start to lose interest in BSG for real. But honestly I think that is all a "misunderstanding" or perhaps some link to the final five... who I insist are NOT CYLONS! --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 19:58, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I'm sorry I can't resist posting again. Ok, the final Five, as I stated are not Cylons but are a third faction, some ancient group probably five prophets who orchestrated all of this. It's the only way I can deal with this: I will not be happy if certain persons are in actuality certain entities. Especially people who have been around too long, who lived before the first cylon attack. Sigh... I guess the Caprica TV show will possibly delve into it... but dammit, that show better be frakking good. This show is going too far into paranormal and starting to suffer from hollywood interference. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 20:23, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
:Dude... They're kinda definitionally cylons. They say there're 12 models. We've seen 7. There are 5 more. The Final Five. Done and done. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:28, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

No offense, but I do believe we have enough reason to totally disregard that conclusion. Firstly, and might I add, perfectly timed, the main page has a link to "Who is a cylon", with a website, blog, and a nice canon explanation of who is and likely is not a Cylon. Saul Tigh... Whom I call "The Tigh Dog"... but who is known also as "The Tigh Fighter" (YES!) can't possibly BE a cylon. And why? Just as I stated, he's been known by Adama for too long (at least prior to the FIRST war). Second, this leads to my speculation from the talk on Crossroads Part 1... Even if these guys are the Final Five... they still aren't cylons. The Final Five are not Cylons. That's what I have been suspecting ever since the Oracle gave prophecy to Biers... ever since The Hybrid gave prophecy to Baltar. That's when I remembered Shelly from "Six Degrees of Seperation". Tigh is so not a cylon. If Tigh is a cylon... I mean really a cylon... this show has jumped the shark. Yes I'm sure they THINK they are Cylons, just like the Cylons THINK the final five are Cylons. But Tigh is not a Cylon. As far as the Final five go, maybe he is, maybe not. The Final Five are perhaps a third... NON CYLON... faction, closely related to the oracles, the prophecies, and what not. Possibly some disgruntled 13th tribe members that wanted to get revenge... who knows... but NOT CYLONS! --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 21:04, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
:*sigh* Twelve Cylon Models. 7 have been seen. Five not. The Final Five. THE FINAL FIVE UNREVEALED CYLONS!!! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:07, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
:: I'm with you, BB... Final five will be revealed Sunday. Can't wait to see who, though I already suspect at least four of 'em. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 21:18, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
::: 4 of 5, and then it'll be the... hmm... damn... can't think of a word starting with O to go with One... --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:58, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
::::Only? Obfuscated? Omega? As for the Tigh rumor, it's plausible that humanoid Cylons date back to the war (they could've discovered a 2000 year old data archive, developed the technology themselves with a Cylon-constructed supercomputer). The term "Cylon" hasn't really been defined, if "Cylon" just means "artificial humanoid" or "self-aware artificial life form" then the Final Five could predate the [[Cylon Centurion|Centurions]] and still be Cylons. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 01:16, 24 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::Yeah! The Only One! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 15:38, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Aw, come on guys. Firstly, you're buying into the notion that the Cylons are nearly omniscent. Isn't it probable that the Cylons themselves have been mislead? In addition, this stuff about Cylon models being created thousands of years ago makes no sense. There are only 12 models they know of. The encephalitus disease that knocked out a whole basestar of Cylons should debunk that long shot. If we are going to split hairs on what a Cylon is... then we need to reconsider who created them in the first place. I believe the 13th tribe left a faction, most likely the priesthood, behind. That priesthood wanted to fulfill some destiny or resolve some unresolved issue in the distant future and they were the invisible hand behind the first cylon war and the cause behind the Cylon visions (projections), the cylon rebirthing, and other spriritual technologies the Cylons have. In addition I believe the final five are actually the original five prophets that the Cylons mistakenly believe are "cylons". Even if I am wrong about that, to simply dismiss Tigh as a Cylon for the reasons above makes no sense. I bet during the fourth season the so called "revelation" that Tigh, Anders, and the others being cylons will turn out to be a Cylon (or Prophetic) hoax. And this... is where I think Six Degrees of Seperation will play a role. "What happened to Shelly"? She never really left, she has been manipulating things on the ship. It's a long shot, but I'm going to wait it out and see. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 21:34, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Here is my theory on the whole "Tigh is a Cylon" thing, Tigh (and the others) are NOT the Final Five Cylons (they will initally think that they are but are mistaken). They will discover that they are descendants of the Final Five models who intermarried with humans back on Kobol and that the "Final Five" were the first cylons who were created by "the Jealous God" (who is also the God worshiped by The Seven we have seen so far). Which will still leave room for Starbuck to be one of the Final Five. I have to admit that a lot of this is comming just from instinct and my imagination but it would make a lot more sense than Tigh being a Cylon since from what we have already heard that the Cylons are immortal (and is safe to assume that they DO NOT AGE, which Tigh would have done since the First Cylon War 40 years ago). [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 22:05, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

:: EXACTLY! See? Someone else understands what I have been trying to say, although I don't think the writers will put the jealous god angle in that way (but maybe they will). But I agree almost entiely with what you are saying. I just think the final five are some leftovers of the 13th tribe... Wait. I just realized something. The 13th tribe left and there was some war between the "gods" right? What if, the 13th tribe didn't leave on good terms with the other 12? Now if we can fit the Shelly angle into this, I will feel much better. Six degrees still hangs like a disowned child. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 23:54, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

:Why is it safe to assume that the humanoid Cylons do not age? Their physiology is close enough to that of regular humans to allow crossbreeding. Old age wouldn't be a problem, as they could just get resurrected in younger, more recently glown replacement bodies when they die of old age. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 23:44, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Maybe a growing and aging body function interfers with the ressurrection ability. Exact copies, thus perfectly aligned brainwave patterns to reinsert into the new body. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 23:56, 24 March 2007 (CDT)
:Who says they have brainwaves? [[Silica pathways]], remember? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 00:32, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::So Tigh can't be a Cylon because Cylons don't age, Cylons don't age because ageing would interfere with the resurrection process, and we know that ageing would interfere with the resurrection process because there needs to be some reason for the Cylons not to age? This is a clear circular logic fallacy. There is '''no canonical evidence''' which rules the possibility of Cylons ageing. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 00:43, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Point taken, but it would seem strange that the Cylons would neglect ageing when they went about making themselves into an IMPROVED version of Human. It would be an inconveinence for a cylon to be dying of old age and ressurecting in what would be (from their point of view) a constant stream for all time. Why is the idea that they found a way around that so strange to you? [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 00:57, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::All I'm saying is that there is currently no evidence for or against Cylon ageing, no evidence about whether or not Cylons have the technology for eternal youth and no conclusive proof that they would or would not use such technology if they had it. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 02:05, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::Agreed. To be honest, I feel the Cylons ''have'' to age, though it may be slower than your normal human. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:20, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::::Slowed ageing would explain why [[Hera Agathon]] doesn't seem to walk or talk even though she's about two years old now (although she could be walking and talking off-screen). -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 09:03, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::::But to me it just doesn't seem to fit for something that is machine in origin to age, it throws the aesthetics off drastically. [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 15:10, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::::::But they're no longer ''mechanical'' machines. They are more biological. Upon becoming human, which they effectively are, they have demonstrated becoming susceptible to a disease. Thus, with all that, they simply ''have'' to age, as any biologist worth their salt would tell you. The question of how quickly they age is another matter. (Which, as Gordon Ecker pointed out, is a very good reason why Hera hasn't aged so much as she should have. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:46, 25 March 2007 (CDT)

No. Cylons don't age because we see them in the ressurrection ship, and being ressurrected in the same exact age. You saw all of the copies of Sharon and six, not one was "younger" or "older". There has been no age variants (and im specifically pointing out scenes from the Cylon perspective, taking the "keep it a secret" response pointless. There is no cylon aging process. They are manufactured, not grown. If they age, it's from the time they are manufactured. Remember this goes back to a discussion about Saul Tigh. He ages normally. But here is a bigger piece of info I have to offer. Saul, Anders, and Tyrol never became succeptible to the encephalitis virus. That alone should end all of this nonsense. Humans are immune to it. Cylons are not. Saul Tigh being a cylon? If so, then the show has jumped... no... done a double reverse backflip over a whole school of sharks. If Saul is a Cylon (and if the final five are actually the bad guy cylon type of cylons) then I am done with this show. So I prefer to give the whole fourth season a chance to redefine "cylon" as Moore has stated. What is a cylon? Who cares. All I know is that the "final five"... if SAUL TIGH is irrefutably one... are some Earth-based 13th tribe faction that is somehow manipulating all of this, for some reason. Either that or they were bugged into thinking they are cylons. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:23, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Actually, ''everything'' ages and deteriorates. Aging is just that, a form of deterioration. To be honest, and getting back to reality, it's really a conceit on the part of the show, since they all use the same actor. Also, just because an older copy of a Sharon exists doesn't mean that the older Sharon must download into an older body. Take the instance of a hard drive: information from an older hard drive can be downloaded into a newer hard drive, without changing the actual data. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:53, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

== Runtime ==

Anyone care to adjust the runtime due to the fact that this episode came out only 2 minutes longer as opposed to the reported 5? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 01:53, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

== Podcast ==

Is it just me, or is there no podcast? Or did SciFi update it this morning and I just haven't checked yet? --[[User:Starsmore|Starsmore]] 12:39, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

: Well, it took SciFi until Tuesday morning to make this episode available on iTunes. So this doesn't surprise me. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 17:42, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

== Assumed to be Cylons? ==

Why is it assumed that Tyrol, Tigh, Foster and Anders are the final five (well, most of the final five)? Ok, so they _suspect_ that they are, but there's nothing concrete in my opinion. That's them simply rationalising why they all met.
It sounds a lot more of a lame idea now I've written it down, but there it is. [[User:FredTheDeadHead|FredTheDeadHead]] 14:35, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
: Ron Moore has confirmed they were Cylons in a press interview [http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm here]. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 15:36, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
::Also, in that same interview, Moore said that once they got to a certain point in space, the four of them became aware of the fact that they are Cylons. That means that they don't just ''suspect'' that they are Cylons, they ''know'' that they are. Tyrol even mentioned a switch that went off in their heads when they became aware of being Cylons. [[User:Dark Claw|Dark Claw]] 15:56, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

All four of our so called cylons were on New Caprica. And guess what... while we are all here trying to convince ourselves they are cylons, we fail to consider that they were bugged by the cylons. I have no doubt at some point all of them were put in jail or "processed" by the cylons at SOME point (even if a small bit of time). Someone, probably Cavil's line, biologically bugged them, and like the Olympic Carrier, made them beacons for the cylons to follow. Buzzz Buzzz, I hear music. I never heard it until after we all left New Caprica. I'll take a cylon biological experiment over cylons aging and a 40 year cylon model. And remember, I even made a point that if they are the "final five" then the "final" five are actually the "first" five. Which means they are either fooling the cylons or are not cylons. But I choose to believe these "final five" were bugged. And the Final Five certainly aren't cylons either way. Sorry Ron, I'm not falling for your double bluff --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:18, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Oh and another thing to remmeber, someone pointed out how the other cylons aren't even aware of these "cylons" right? Well... if they aren't humans being bugged... then why and how else is the cylon fleet able to track them? And why aren't these final five participating in any of the dreams that Roslin gets to have with Six and Athena? I am telling you, the final five are not cylons. I think Roslin and Starbuck are the final five, but these other four are just the first to be "Frak'd" (pun on Punk'd). One last time, making it clear: Anders, Tyrol, Tory, and TIGH are unwitting guinea pigs that were bugged with some undetectable biological tracking device by the cylons while on New Caprica. They bugged them in their sleep, they did it while they were in prison. The Cylons don't know about the final five, or who they are... so the Cylons can't possibly be following a signal sent by people they do not know. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:36, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
:I don't necessarily see it like that Rather, I see it in that while they might be Cylons, that does not make them '''Cylons'''. Or, to put it another way, as Tigh succinctly put it: "Whatever else I am, whatever else it means, that's the man I want to be. And if I die today, that's the man I'll be." Silica pathways, nanite bloodcells, whatever - they, like Sharon Agathon (and maybe Caprica Six) have chosen to rise above their natures and embrace humanity; the exact opposite of Sharon Valerii. They aspire to be more than they are (or what they fear they are), and that is what defines them (at least in one sense) as human, regardless of the outcome.

:Which makes me curious: with Baltar's earlier Cylon detector, he discovered Boomer was a Cylon. While he gave everyone else a "clean bill of health", surely he'd have had to scan at least one of the four (Anders being the obvious exception) at one time or another. Why, assuming that he did, didn't their natures show up then?--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 00:42, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: As Caprica-Six explains in Crossroads, Part I, the Cylon fleet has been following the unique radiation leakage from the tylium refinery. Secondly, there is no evidence one way or the other that the four of them were ever "bugged", or even if the Cylons have that kind of technology. Also, the "Significant Seven" and "Final Five" actually parallel (to an extent) the Titans and the Olympians from Greek mythology, and given much of the Greek underpinnings of the series, I find this easily more believable than the Cylons taking a page out of Scorpius's manual and shoving a neural transponder in their heads, or some such. I would elaborate further, but again this isn't the place to discuss that. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:10, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Someone is going to reply that the final five aren't designed like the other seven, and that will explain the cylon detector, the encephalitis virus, and the cylons' inability to recognize them. What it won't explain is the lack of visionary, oracle, and prophetic relevance of these newly revealed final-frauds. The Final Five at the very least should be involved in the prophecies, have some interactions on a spiritual or psychic level (either via the oracles or via the visions), and should have some connection to the priesthood. Here is what happened. The cylon "phone home" bug became active when Tyrol was close to the Eye of Jupiter. The Cylons have some link to the prophecies. But remember, Cavil said that it would take them a longer time to find Earth without the prophecies. So the final five are either not helping or not cognizant regarding them. Ok, I'm done. By the way, where can one post about this stuff, if posting here is inappropriate? --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:56, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Tyrol, Tigh and Anders did not board the base ship. Also, Tigh was not XO during this incident as he was pretty much drinking himself in a stupor at that time. Tyrol is a NCO, so he wouldn't have any contact with the Cylons transferred from the baseship, and (from what can be inferred from the episode) the Colonials used quarantine procedures to transfer the boarding party to sickbay (so this removes him from being exposed that way as well). And Anders has no reason (or access) to the Cylon prisoners retrieved from the infected basestar. Also, clearly, the Significant Seven don't know who the Final Five are (consciously speaking), hence D'anna's search.

: As for the best place to discuss this, I would recommend a bulletin board, like Ragnar Anchorage or Scifi.com. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:10, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

== Song title ==

I'd just like someone who knows to put up the title of the Dylan song. Thx.--[[User:飞机|飞机]] 02:42, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
:It's All Along the Watchtower, but I'm having trouble making edits right now. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 04:14, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
::I just added it to the page. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 04:22, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Can we post the lyrics without a copyright violation? There are some lines in the song that are certainly significant.

Oh, and regarding the arguments on this board about the finale...I think you're missing the real point, which is the fact that Bob Dylan is a Cylon. We should throw him out the airlock.-- [[User:Dallan007|Dallan007]] 18:24, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Very funny. ;-) However, the lyrics are posted on [[The Music|the page for "ze musak"]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:32, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

::Hey, I didn't say anything about the fact that Tory sings the line "I can't get no relief" while's she's in the ''bathroom''! I know it's significant!

:::Actually, they all four say a line from the song (although thanks...Tory's was the one I missed). I think this is worthy of being added to the signifcant quotes and the notes sections. I'll do it if everyone agrees. (I need to go back and pull them in context). BTW Joe, I like your "ze music" although it's awfully close to Dr. Zee. Something you wanna tell us? I guess I shouldn't speculate on what Joe knows. What is it when you speculate on stuff on a discussion page -- wikiwanking?--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 17:41, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

Stopping now... [[User:Dallan007|Dallan007]] 22:08, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

OK...I need some help regarding my statement above. All four of them, towards the end of the episode and in succession, recite the first verse, starting with Tyrol's "There must be some way out of here" and finishing with Tory's "I can't get no relief." This is NOT what I was referring to above. Two of the four (not three like a stated above) say lines from the song in conversational context. (see the quotes section of this article to see the exact quotes--I posted them). What I need help with is I find it odd the writers would have Anders and Tigh do this, but not Tory and Tyrol. But for the life of me I cannot find where they do it. I've watched the episode over and over again, but am worried I'm stil missing it. Anyone wanna take a crack at seeing if either of them do it? I even went back and skimmed [[Crossroads, Part 1]], but had no luck.--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:06, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

::Ok one correction...sort of. Tyrol, when talkng to Anders says a partial line: "Way outta here." I'm not sure this counts though becasue A.) He was actually referring to the lyrics. The other two were said as part of a different discussion. and B.) It's a partial line. I'm not sure if this qualifies or not.--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:11, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

I'd be interested to know who covers this version of the song. I've been looking around for this specific version and I can't find it. Anyone know? --[[User:Jamziz|Jamziz]] 06:27, 31 March 07 (UTC)
:I found the answer to my question, it's the band BT4. You can find their blog here [http://www.bearmccreary.com/html/blog/blogmain.htm BT4 Blog] or you can visit their [http://www.bt4online.com/ Main Page] --[[User:Jamziz|Jamziz]] 19:15, 31 March 2007 (CDT)

== Saul Tigh, Monotheist ==

I think there's a significant bit of Noteworthy Dialogue that should be added to the main page. In the scene where the four "new" Cylons meet, right after they hum a few bars of "All Along the Watchtower," Tigh shouts, "That's enough, God damn it!" What's significant about this line is that Tigh switches to a singular deity rather than his usual plural for this particular expletive, thereby cementing the fact that he really is a full-blown, monotheistic Cylon. [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 18:45, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Actually, it's really not ''that'' significant ... The Colonials have gone back and forth using the plural and singular forms various times. It might be worthy of a note at least, but the use of "God" by Tigh in this instance isn't all that damning. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:35, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

::In a polytheistic society, using a reference to a single, unspecified god as an expletive could theoretically be considered less sacrilegious than using the name of a specific god. The Christian references can be written off as [[Wikipedia:minced oath|minced oaths]], but that's pretty far into [[Wikipedia:No-Prize|No-Prize]] territory. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:12, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

The discussion and dissection is moot anyway because he says "god''s''damnit". Both me and the closed caption hear it. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 01:32, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

: Well, you're right. I listened to it again and the plural is there. [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 07:13, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
::Ive seen the whole episode twice and the last 10 minutes about 4 times. He clearly said god'''s'''. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 15:39, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

== Removed analysis ==

*Tigh states that if he dies today, he will be remembered as a human officer of the fleet and a patriot. But if death for the Final Five is similar to that of the other humanoid cylon models, if he dies he will be downloaded into a new body, surrounded by cylons intending to manipulate him to their side or box his consciousness, and should he ever come in contact with those who knew him as a human they would instantly regard him as a cylon and therefore an enemy.
<s>**Maybe not. The Cylons don't even know what the [[Final Five]] look like so I doubt that they'd have new bodies for them to download into. The only one who knew one of the [[Number Three]]s ended up [[boxed]] along with her entire model line.</s>

I removed the struck bullet point because
# it's not written in encyclopedic language, but in "I think", "I doubt", etc. language
# the parent bullet point says "'''if''' death for the Final Five is similar to that of the other humanoid Cylon models..."

If you think there's some information in the removed bullet point you can merge into the parent one while being encyclopedic and not redundant, feel free to do so. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 07:10, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

== The 5th ==

Don't read if you don't want to see any spoilers.

I was watcihng some BSG bloops/gags on the google video. And at some point Starbuck says that she's a cylon and that she is going to die at the end of the sason.
''Battlestar Galactica: Season 3 Gag Reel'' is the name of the video (details : Sci Fi Channel
13 min 1 sec - Jan 5, 2007 ). She says that around : 2m 47s.
Please if someone could verify that, and say if that is a genuine comment that she made. [[User:DedMed|DedMed]] 20:45, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

: It was a joke... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:48, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

: Yeah thought so too, but the thing that is puzzling me is that she said that she is going to die well before that episode and we know how she wanst supposed to do that. Having in mind that that part of her ''interview'' carried out, it might be logical to conclude that the other part could be true as well. Kinda explains her appearance at the end of Crossroads. Nevertheless i can't deny the fact that all of this is under the atmosphere of a joke, and that..well...probably is a joke. [[User:DedMed|DedMed]] 06:05, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
::That interview is from before Season 2 aired. They shot the beginning of Season 3 at the time. "Maelstrom" wasn't even conceived by the writers back then. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 06:58, 15 April 2007 (CDT)

==Fleet Location==

There is some speculation over on "Big W" that the encounter at the end of the finale takes place in the Large Magellanic Cloud, here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxies_in_fiction#Large_Magellanic_Cloud

Can anyone verify what is said here at all? Or is this just another case of baseless speculation? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:01, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

:I'd remove that from Wikipedia. The zoom-out begins right at the edge of our galaxy and indeed in some blue cluster is stars, but the scale doesn't really fit for it to be one of our companion galaxies. The Milky Way is about 100.000 LY in diameter and the Large Magellanic Cloud is 160.000 LY distant. There would have to be a noticeable gap between the two. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 14:27, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

::Done. If it's questioned, I'll cite your reasoning. Thanks for clarifying :) -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:45, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

Talk:Crossroads, Part II/Archive1

2007-04-16T19:01:48Z

Madbrood:

== Promo Pics ==
Are [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000aaqbh here]. Hard believe that's the last for Season 3. However, they may release a few more for this episode. At least there's the 2-hr movie between seasons. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:03, 27 February 2007 (CST)

That promo pic of Six, Baltar, and Hera appears to be shot in the "Final Five" room. Anyone else notice this? [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 19:57, 28 February 2007 (CST)

: Yes, indeed I did. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:02, 28 February 2007 (CST)

::Baltar's been having visions of Six and Hera in the opera house since season 1, so it's not necessarily connected to the Final Five. Since this episode will reveal 1 or 4 of the Final Five depending on which interview you go by, there's a pretty good chance that it relates to them as well. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:16, 28 February 2007 (CST)

:::Am I completely off-base in thinking that that's Virtual Baltar alongside Virtual Six? Because the other photos of that episode show the "real" Baltar still quite disheveled with a thick beard while that Baltar is clean-shaven, not unlike Caprica's Baltar. Didn't Ron Moore say something about the two alter-egos being key figures in the last episodes of the season? --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 04:50, 3 March 2007 (CST)

::::Not really "off base", in fact I think that's the most popular theory in general. So unless we're all off base.....which is admitedly possible :P --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 07:37, 3 March 2007 (CST)

:::::If they are able to interact with eachother it would have significant implications regarding their nature. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 17:50, 7 March 2007 (CST)

::::::The virtual Baltar normally wears the unique pinstripe suit from the Miniseries, which I don't see here. I do believe this is a visualization and that is Virtual Six, for the Opera House doesn't exist. If the two alter-egos do somehow directly interact, some Serious Shit will ensure, but damned if I can really glean what. This is as big of a season stumper as season 2's cliffhanger. And, no, Kara Thrace will NOT be one of the Five. But it may be, in my guess, one of these three, although they don't realize it: Dualla, Tigh, or Gaeta. I still hold exception to the fact that what Three saw may be the five priests of the Temple of Five, who just so happen to have incarnations in the current timeline. (Note the monkey that exited my anus and is waving at you). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:44, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

==Predictions==
Well, it's early, and I don't care to step on Slander's toes, but I have forseen an event in Crossroads, Part II. The top 5 American Idol contestants cameo as... '''THE FINAL FIVE!''' --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:06, 14 March 2007 (CDT)
*I'd like to make a motion that all Predictions in Talk pages be deleted as they are assinine and serve no other purpose than to promote the person making the prediction. Predictions should be in Forums and chatrooms or discussion groups, not here.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:29, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
**Dude... they're friggin' jokes. No need to be so uptight. You're reminding me of Merv. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:07, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
*** Motion denied. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 12:04, 19 March 2007 (CDT)

OK. The purpose of a talk page is for ''brief'' discussions and questions about the article. Generally, the humorous "predictions" in other talk pages have not detracted from the talk page's purpose or grown in size, and honestly have given me a chuckle, although my feelings on the matter aren't the sole vote about it. Provided that we don't get into numerous predictions from many users to the talk page in some way, I don't see a problem with it at this time. If there's still a problem about it, a silly page could have a bulleted series of such humor if approved by consensus (although I doubt this would work, [[BW:NOT|we're not a forum]]). Sometimes, predictions are fun ''and'' on-topic: See [[Talk:Exodus, Part II]] where I made a good guess. Now, what's considered "funny" is very subjective. I don't think BB's jest is nearly as humorous as, say, the shining white Final Five being revealed as the ''Jackson Five'' or something. Jokes are OK. If it's a bad one, ignore the poster. If a talk page gets too long, ask an admin to moderate if you can't get others to end a pointless or irrelevant topic. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:00, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
:Damn I should've thought of the Jackson Five... --20:10, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
::[http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v518/Slanderpanic/1tito.jpg Tito rules!] On a more serious note, if people object to my predictions, I'll stop doing them. Honestly, this sort of in-joke is inevitable when an Internet community develops. In my opinion, it's healthy for us to not take things ''too'' seriously, or we turn into a bunch of elitists. (If anyone in the history of anything has ever needed a collective wedgie, it's Wikipedia's editing community.) Anyway, as there are currently two "Predictions" topics on this Talk page, I think I'll take the rest of the year off, until it comes time to speculate about the DVD-movie and season four. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 14:19, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

==the commercial==

hey the commercial has anders voice syaing "yeah we're cylons" WTF --[[User:Snorkel378|Snorkel378]] 21:07, 19 March 2007 (CDT)Snorkel378
:I don't know whose voice it is, but the line is definitely "It's true, we're Cylons". -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 02:12, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
:At first, I thought it was Anders speaking, just because his face appeared at the same moment. {{spoilli|On subsequent viewing, I think it's...drum roll...Chief Tyrol!}} --[[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 12:26, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
::Read the thing linked below. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:41, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

==Predictions-part 2==

I was surfing on the internet, trying to find some spoilers (lol) for the 3rd season finale, and came across this baby: http://www.thetvremote.com/battlestar-galactica-season-finale-spoilers/ (huge spoilers, so don t go there if u don t wanna read em). So, the text reveals who are the 4 of the final 5. As we already know, without the websites help, some of the final five are living and working in the colonial fleet. The 4 that are in question have a past, and we even saw a few times their memories, and we know that they lived in the colonies for quite some time. That being said, the website isn’t really convincing. But then, we know that the final five are special. We don t know what they are, we could suppose that they are more than the other cylon models, much more. We could even think that they are some sort of gods, now that too being said, I can t help but to think that those final 5, being special could have been planted in the colonies before the attacks of the miniseries. There is also a thing about Starbuck and a thing about finding earth on the website. I don t know what are their sources but the text seems very interesting and gives some very interesting ideas. {{unsigned|DedMed}}

:Many of the spoilers fit with what occurred in "Crossroads, Part II," but it brings up many new questions, too. If true, the information completely wrecks or substantially modifies what we thought Cylons were and when they came about. It should be an interesting episode, to say the least. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:39, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

::HOLY FRAKKIN FRAK! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:54, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

:::The spoilers from part 1 were correct, adding some credibility. The really shocking part is that one of the alledged final five was around during the Cylon War (yes, you heard it right, the [[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]] is a Cylon, I'm surprised no one made the connection when we've known that she has at least a dozen copies since the miniseries :D). -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 23:27, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

::I kind of wish I hadn't read them, but I couldn't help myself. Goddamit! --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 12:26, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Goddamnit is exactly the word. ''Goddamnit!'' --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 15:03, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I took my comments about the spoliers out... but just so you know. if that link is true... and it's implied in the video teaser for this episode. I'm starting to see the show in shark infested waters. But I imagine everything is not what it seems. Especially with my homedog Col. Tigh. If he really is (spolier)... then I'm gonna start to lose interest in BSG for real. But honestly I think that is all a "misunderstanding" or perhaps some link to the final five... who I insist are NOT CYLONS! --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 19:58, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I'm sorry I can't resist posting again. Ok, the final Five, as I stated are not Cylons but are a third faction, some ancient group probably five prophets who orchestrated all of this. It's the only way I can deal with this: I will not be happy if certain persons are in actuality certain entities. Especially people who have been around too long, who lived before the first cylon attack. Sigh... I guess the Caprica TV show will possibly delve into it... but dammit, that show better be frakking good. This show is going too far into paranormal and starting to suffer from hollywood interference. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 20:23, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
:Dude... They're kinda definitionally cylons. They say there're 12 models. We've seen 7. There are 5 more. The Final Five. Done and done. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:28, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

No offense, but I do believe we have enough reason to totally disregard that conclusion. Firstly, and might I add, perfectly timed, the main page has a link to "Who is a cylon", with a website, blog, and a nice canon explanation of who is and likely is not a Cylon. Saul Tigh... Whom I call "The Tigh Dog"... but who is known also as "The Tigh Fighter" (YES!) can't possibly BE a cylon. And why? Just as I stated, he's been known by Adama for too long (at least prior to the FIRST war). Second, this leads to my speculation from the talk on Crossroads Part 1... Even if these guys are the Final Five... they still aren't cylons. The Final Five are not Cylons. That's what I have been suspecting ever since the Oracle gave prophecy to Biers... ever since The Hybrid gave prophecy to Baltar. That's when I remembered Shelly from "Six Degrees of Seperation". Tigh is so not a cylon. If Tigh is a cylon... I mean really a cylon... this show has jumped the shark. Yes I'm sure they THINK they are Cylons, just like the Cylons THINK the final five are Cylons. But Tigh is not a Cylon. As far as the Final five go, maybe he is, maybe not. The Final Five are perhaps a third... NON CYLON... faction, closely related to the oracles, the prophecies, and what not. Possibly some disgruntled 13th tribe members that wanted to get revenge... who knows... but NOT CYLONS! --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 21:04, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
:*sigh* Twelve Cylon Models. 7 have been seen. Five not. The Final Five. THE FINAL FIVE UNREVEALED CYLONS!!! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:07, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
:: I'm with you, BB... Final five will be revealed Sunday. Can't wait to see who, though I already suspect at least four of 'em. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 21:18, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
::: 4 of 5, and then it'll be the... hmm... damn... can't think of a word starting with O to go with One... --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:58, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
::::Only? Obfuscated? Omega? As for the Tigh rumor, it's plausible that humanoid Cylons date back to the war (they could've discovered a 2000 year old data archive, developed the technology themselves with a Cylon-constructed supercomputer). The term "Cylon" hasn't really been defined, if "Cylon" just means "artificial humanoid" or "self-aware artificial life form" then the Final Five could predate the [[Cylon Centurion|Centurions]] and still be Cylons. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 01:16, 24 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::Yeah! The Only One! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 15:38, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Aw, come on guys. Firstly, you're buying into the notion that the Cylons are nearly omniscent. Isn't it probable that the Cylons themselves have been mislead? In addition, this stuff about Cylon models being created thousands of years ago makes no sense. There are only 12 models they know of. The encephalitus disease that knocked out a whole basestar of Cylons should debunk that long shot. If we are going to split hairs on what a Cylon is... then we need to reconsider who created them in the first place. I believe the 13th tribe left a faction, most likely the priesthood, behind. That priesthood wanted to fulfill some destiny or resolve some unresolved issue in the distant future and they were the invisible hand behind the first cylon war and the cause behind the Cylon visions (projections), the cylon rebirthing, and other spriritual technologies the Cylons have. In addition I believe the final five are actually the original five prophets that the Cylons mistakenly believe are "cylons". Even if I am wrong about that, to simply dismiss Tigh as a Cylon for the reasons above makes no sense. I bet during the fourth season the so called "revelation" that Tigh, Anders, and the others being cylons will turn out to be a Cylon (or Prophetic) hoax. And this... is where I think Six Degrees of Seperation will play a role. "What happened to Shelly"? She never really left, she has been manipulating things on the ship. It's a long shot, but I'm going to wait it out and see. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 21:34, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Here is my theory on the whole "Tigh is a Cylon" thing, Tigh (and the others) are NOT the Final Five Cylons (they will initally think that they are but are mistaken). They will discover that they are descendants of the Final Five models who intermarried with humans back on Kobol and that the "Final Five" were the first cylons who were created by "the Jealous God" (who is also the God worshiped by The Seven we have seen so far). Which will still leave room for Starbuck to be one of the Final Five. I have to admit that a lot of this is comming just from instinct and my imagination but it would make a lot more sense than Tigh being a Cylon since from what we have already heard that the Cylons are immortal (and is safe to assume that they DO NOT AGE, which Tigh would have done since the First Cylon War 40 years ago). [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 22:05, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

:: EXACTLY! See? Someone else understands what I have been trying to say, although I don't think the writers will put the jealous god angle in that way (but maybe they will). But I agree almost entiely with what you are saying. I just think the final five are some leftovers of the 13th tribe... Wait. I just realized something. The 13th tribe left and there was some war between the "gods" right? What if, the 13th tribe didn't leave on good terms with the other 12? Now if we can fit the Shelly angle into this, I will feel much better. Six degrees still hangs like a disowned child. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 23:54, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

:Why is it safe to assume that the humanoid Cylons do not age? Their physiology is close enough to that of regular humans to allow crossbreeding. Old age wouldn't be a problem, as they could just get resurrected in younger, more recently glown replacement bodies when they die of old age. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 23:44, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Maybe a growing and aging body function interfers with the ressurrection ability. Exact copies, thus perfectly aligned brainwave patterns to reinsert into the new body. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 23:56, 24 March 2007 (CDT)
:Who says they have brainwaves? [[Silica pathways]], remember? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 00:32, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::So Tigh can't be a Cylon because Cylons don't age, Cylons don't age because ageing would interfere with the resurrection process, and we know that ageing would interfere with the resurrection process because there needs to be some reason for the Cylons not to age? This is a clear circular logic fallacy. There is '''no canonical evidence''' which rules the possibility of Cylons ageing. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 00:43, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Point taken, but it would seem strange that the Cylons would neglect ageing when they went about making themselves into an IMPROVED version of Human. It would be an inconveinence for a cylon to be dying of old age and ressurecting in what would be (from their point of view) a constant stream for all time. Why is the idea that they found a way around that so strange to you? [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 00:57, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::All I'm saying is that there is currently no evidence for or against Cylon ageing, no evidence about whether or not Cylons have the technology for eternal youth and no conclusive proof that they would or would not use such technology if they had it. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 02:05, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::Agreed. To be honest, I feel the Cylons ''have'' to age, though it may be slower than your normal human. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:20, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::::Slowed ageing would explain why [[Hera Agathon]] doesn't seem to walk or talk even though she's about two years old now (although she could be walking and talking off-screen). -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 09:03, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::::But to me it just doesn't seem to fit for something that is machine in origin to age, it throws the aesthetics off drastically. [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 15:10, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::::::But they're no longer ''mechanical'' machines. They are more biological. Upon becoming human, which they effectively are, they have demonstrated becoming susceptible to a disease. Thus, with all that, they simply ''have'' to age, as any biologist worth their salt would tell you. The question of how quickly they age is another matter. (Which, as Gordon Ecker pointed out, is a very good reason why Hera hasn't aged so much as she should have. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:46, 25 March 2007 (CDT)

No. Cylons don't age because we see them in the ressurrection ship, and being ressurrected in the same exact age. You saw all of the copies of Sharon and six, not one was "younger" or "older". There has been no age variants (and im specifically pointing out scenes from the Cylon perspective, taking the "keep it a secret" response pointless. There is no cylon aging process. They are manufactured, not grown. If they age, it's from the time they are manufactured. Remember this goes back to a discussion about Saul Tigh. He ages normally. But here is a bigger piece of info I have to offer. Saul, Anders, and Tyrol never became succeptible to the encephalitis virus. That alone should end all of this nonsense. Humans are immune to it. Cylons are not. Saul Tigh being a cylon? If so, then the show has jumped... no... done a double reverse backflip over a whole school of sharks. If Saul is a Cylon (and if the final five are actually the bad guy cylon type of cylons) then I am done with this show. So I prefer to give the whole fourth season a chance to redefine "cylon" as Moore has stated. What is a cylon? Who cares. All I know is that the "final five"... if SAUL TIGH is irrefutably one... are some Earth-based 13th tribe faction that is somehow manipulating all of this, for some reason. Either that or they were bugged into thinking they are cylons. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:23, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Actually, ''everything'' ages and deteriorates. Aging is just that, a form of deterioration. To be honest, and getting back to reality, it's really a conceit on the part of the show, since they all use the same actor. Also, just because an older copy of a Sharon exists doesn't mean that the older Sharon must download into an older body. Take the instance of a hard drive: information from an older hard drive can be downloaded into a newer hard drive, without changing the actual data. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:53, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

== Runtime ==

Anyone care to adjust the runtime due to the fact that this episode came out only 2 minutes longer as opposed to the reported 5? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 01:53, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

== Podcast ==

Is it just me, or is there no podcast? Or did SciFi update it this morning and I just haven't checked yet? --[[User:Starsmore|Starsmore]] 12:39, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

: Well, it took SciFi until Tuesday morning to make this episode available on iTunes. So this doesn't surprise me. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 17:42, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

== Assumed to be Cylons? ==

Why is it assumed that Tyrol, Tigh, Foster and Anders are the final five (well, most of the final five)? Ok, so they _suspect_ that they are, but there's nothing concrete in my opinion. That's them simply rationalising why they all met.
It sounds a lot more of a lame idea now I've written it down, but there it is. [[User:FredTheDeadHead|FredTheDeadHead]] 14:35, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
: Ron Moore has confirmed they were Cylons in a press interview [http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm here]. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 15:36, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
::Also, in that same interview, Moore said that once they got to a certain point in space, the four of them became aware of the fact that they are Cylons. That means that they don't just ''suspect'' that they are Cylons, they ''know'' that they are. Tyrol even mentioned a switch that went off in their heads when they became aware of being Cylons. [[User:Dark Claw|Dark Claw]] 15:56, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

All four of our so called cylons were on New Caprica. And guess what... while we are all here trying to convince ourselves they are cylons, we fail to consider that they were bugged by the cylons. I have no doubt at some point all of them were put in jail or "processed" by the cylons at SOME point (even if a small bit of time). Someone, probably Cavil's line, biologically bugged them, and like the Olympic Carrier, made them beacons for the cylons to follow. Buzzz Buzzz, I hear music. I never heard it until after we all left New Caprica. I'll take a cylon biological experiment over cylons aging and a 40 year cylon model. And remember, I even made a point that if they are the "final five" then the "final" five are actually the "first" five. Which means they are either fooling the cylons or are not cylons. But I choose to believe these "final five" were bugged. And the Final Five certainly aren't cylons either way. Sorry Ron, I'm not falling for your double bluff --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:18, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Oh and another thing to remmeber, someone pointed out how the other cylons aren't even aware of these "cylons" right? Well... if they aren't humans being bugged... then why and how else is the cylon fleet able to track them? And why aren't these final five participating in any of the dreams that Roslin gets to have with Six and Athena? I am telling you, the final five are not cylons. I think Roslin and Starbuck are the final five, but these other four are just the first to be "Frak'd" (pun on Punk'd). One last time, making it clear: Anders, Tyrol, Tory, and TIGH are unwitting guinea pigs that were bugged with some undetectable biological tracking device by the cylons while on New Caprica. They bugged them in their sleep, they did it while they were in prison. The Cylons don't know about the final five, or who they are... so the Cylons can't possibly be following a signal sent by people they do not know. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:36, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
:I don't necessarily see it like that Rather, I see it in that while they might be Cylons, that does not make them '''Cylons'''. Or, to put it another way, as Tigh succinctly put it: "Whatever else I am, whatever else it means, that's the man I want to be. And if I die today, that's the man I'll be." Silica pathways, nanite bloodcells, whatever - they, like Sharon Agathon (and maybe Caprica Six) have chosen to rise above their natures and embrace humanity; the exact opposite of Sharon Valerii. They aspire to be more than they are (or what they fear they are), and that is what defines them (at least in one sense) as human, regardless of the outcome.

:Which makes me curious: with Baltar's earlier Cylon detector, he discovered Boomer was a Cylon. While he gave everyone else a "clean bill of health", surely he'd have had to scan at least one of the four (Anders being the obvious exception) at one time or another. Why, assuming that he did, didn't their natures show up then?--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 00:42, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: As Caprica-Six explains in Crossroads, Part I, the Cylon fleet has been following the unique radiation leakage from the tylium refinery. Secondly, there is no evidence one way or the other that the four of them were ever "bugged", or even if the Cylons have that kind of technology. Also, the "Significant Seven" and "Final Five" actually parallel (to an extent) the Titans and the Olympians from Greek mythology, and given much of the Greek underpinnings of the series, I find this easily more believable than the Cylons taking a page out of Scorpius's manual and shoving a neural transponder in their heads, or some such. I would elaborate further, but again this isn't the place to discuss that. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:10, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Someone is going to reply that the final five aren't designed like the other seven, and that will explain the cylon detector, the encephalitis virus, and the cylons' inability to recognize them. What it won't explain is the lack of visionary, oracle, and prophetic relevance of these newly revealed final-frauds. The Final Five at the very least should be involved in the prophecies, have some interactions on a spiritual or psychic level (either via the oracles or via the visions), and should have some connection to the priesthood. Here is what happened. The cylon "phone home" bug became active when Tyrol was close to the Eye of Jupiter. The Cylons have some link to the prophecies. But remember, Cavil said that it would take them a longer time to find Earth without the prophecies. So the final five are either not helping or not cognizant regarding them. Ok, I'm done. By the way, where can one post about this stuff, if posting here is inappropriate? --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:56, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Tyrol, Tigh and Anders did not board the base ship. Also, Tigh was not XO during this incident as he was pretty much drinking himself in a stupor at that time. Tyrol is a NCO, so he wouldn't have any contact with the Cylons transferred from the baseship, and (from what can be inferred from the episode) the Colonials used quarantine procedures to transfer the boarding party to sickbay (so this removes him from being exposed that way as well). And Anders has no reason (or access) to the Cylon prisoners retrieved from the infected basestar. Also, clearly, the Significant Seven don't know who the Final Five are (consciously speaking), hence D'anna's search.

: As for the best place to discuss this, I would recommend a bulletin board, like Ragnar Anchorage or Scifi.com. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:10, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

== Song title ==

I'd just like someone who knows to put up the title of the Dylan song. Thx.--[[User:飞机|飞机]] 02:42, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
:It's All Along the Watchtower, but I'm having trouble making edits right now. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 04:14, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
::I just added it to the page. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 04:22, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Can we post the lyrics without a copyright violation? There are some lines in the song that are certainly significant.

Oh, and regarding the arguments on this board about the finale...I think you're missing the real point, which is the fact that Bob Dylan is a Cylon. We should throw him out the airlock.-- [[User:Dallan007|Dallan007]] 18:24, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Very funny. ;-) However, the lyrics are posted on [[The Music|the page for "ze musak"]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:32, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

::Hey, I didn't say anything about the fact that Tory sings the line "I can't get no relief" while's she's in the ''bathroom''! I know it's significant!

:::Actually, they all four say a line from the song (although thanks...Tory's was the one I missed). I think this is worthy of being added to the signifcant quotes and the notes sections. I'll do it if everyone agrees. (I need to go back and pull them in context). BTW Joe, I like your "ze music" although it's awfully close to Dr. Zee. Something you wanna tell us? I guess I shouldn't speculate on what Joe knows. What is it when you speculate on stuff on a discussion page -- wikiwanking?--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 17:41, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

Stopping now... [[User:Dallan007|Dallan007]] 22:08, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

OK...I need some help regarding my statement above. All four of them, towards the end of the episode and in succession, recite the first verse, starting with Tyrol's "There must be some way out of here" and finishing with Tory's "I can't get no relief." This is NOT what I was referring to above. Two of the four (not three like a stated above) say lines from the song in conversational context. (see the quotes section of this article to see the exact quotes--I posted them). What I need help with is I find it odd the writers would have Anders and Tigh do this, but not Tory and Tyrol. But for the life of me I cannot find where they do it. I've watched the episode over and over again, but am worried I'm stil missing it. Anyone wanna take a crack at seeing if either of them do it? I even went back and skimmed [[Crossroads, Part 1]], but had no luck.--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:06, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

::Ok one correction...sort of. Tyrol, when talkng to Anders says a partial line: "Way outta here." I'm not sure this counts though becasue A.) He was actually referring to the lyrics. The other two were said as part of a different discussion. and B.) It's a partial line. I'm not sure if this qualifies or not.--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:11, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

I'd be interested to know who covers this version of the song. I've been looking around for this specific version and I can't find it. Anyone know? --[[User:Jamziz|Jamziz]] 06:27, 31 March 07 (UTC)
:I found the answer to my question, it's the band BT4. You can find their blog here [http://www.bearmccreary.com/html/blog/blogmain.htm BT4 Blog] or you can visit their [http://www.bt4online.com/ Main Page] --[[User:Jamziz|Jamziz]] 19:15, 31 March 2007 (CDT)

== Saul Tigh, Monotheist ==

I think there's a significant bit of Noteworthy Dialogue that should be added to the main page. In the scene where the four "new" Cylons meet, right after they hum a few bars of "All Along the Watchtower," Tigh shouts, "That's enough, God damn it!" What's significant about this line is that Tigh switches to a singular deity rather than his usual plural for this particular expletive, thereby cementing the fact that he really is a full-blown, monotheistic Cylon. [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 18:45, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Actually, it's really not ''that'' significant ... The Colonials have gone back and forth using the plural and singular forms various times. It might be worthy of a note at least, but the use of "God" by Tigh in this instance isn't all that damning. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:35, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

::In a polytheistic society, using a reference to a single, unspecified god as an expletive could theoretically be considered less sacrilegious than using the name of a specific god. The Christian references can be written off as [[Wikipedia:minced oath|minced oaths]], but that's pretty far into [[Wikipedia:No-Prize|No-Prize]] territory. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:12, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

The discussion and dissection is moot anyway because he says "god''s''damnit". Both me and the closed caption hear it. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 01:32, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

: Well, you're right. I listened to it again and the plural is there. [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 07:13, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
::Ive seen the whole episode twice and the last 10 minutes about 4 times. He clearly said god'''s'''. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 15:39, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

== Removed analysis ==

*Tigh states that if he dies today, he will be remembered as a human officer of the fleet and a patriot. But if death for the Final Five is similar to that of the other humanoid cylon models, if he dies he will be downloaded into a new body, surrounded by cylons intending to manipulate him to their side or box his consciousness, and should he ever come in contact with those who knew him as a human they would instantly regard him as a cylon and therefore an enemy.
<s>**Maybe not. The Cylons don't even know what the [[Final Five]] look like so I doubt that they'd have new bodies for them to download into. The only one who knew one of the [[Number Three]]s ended up [[boxed]] along with her entire model line.</s>

I removed the struck bullet point because
# it's not written in encyclopedic language, but in "I think", "I doubt", etc. language
# the parent bullet point says "'''if''' death for the Final Five is similar to that of the other humanoid Cylon models..."

If you think there's some information in the removed bullet point you can merge into the parent one while being encyclopedic and not redundant, feel free to do so. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 07:10, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

== The 5th ==

Don't read if you don't want to see any spoilers.

I was watcihng some BSG bloops/gags on the google video. And at some point Starbuck says that she's a cylon and that she is going to die at the end of the sason.
''Battlestar Galactica: Season 3 Gag Reel'' is the name of the video (details : Sci Fi Channel
13 min 1 sec - Jan 5, 2007 ). She says that around : 2m 47s.
Please if someone could verify that, and say if that is a genuine comment that she made. [[User:DedMed|DedMed]] 20:45, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

: It was a joke... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:48, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

: Yeah thought so too, but the thing that is puzzling me is that she said that she is going to die well before that episode and we know how she wanst supposed to do that. Having in mind that that part of her ''interview'' carried out, it might be logical to conclude that the other part could be true as well. Kinda explains her appearance at the end of Crossroads. Nevertheless i can't deny the fact that all of this is under the atmosphere of a joke, and that..well...probably is a joke. [[User:DedMed|DedMed]] 06:05, 15 April 2007 (CDT)
::That interview is from before Season 2 aired. They shot the beginning of Season 3 at the time. "Maelstrom" wasn't even conceived by the writers back then. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 06:58, 15 April 2007 (CDT)

==Fleet Location==

There is some speculation over on "Big W" that the encounter at the end of the finale takes place in the Large MagellaniccCloud, here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galaxies_in_fiction#Large_Magellanic_Cloud

Can anyone verify what is said here at all? Or is this just another case of baseless speculation? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:01, 16 April 2007 (CDT)

Battery

2007-04-11T11:39:06Z

Madbrood:

[[Image:Railgun.jpg|thumb|right|One of ''Galactica's'' gun turrets]]

On Colonial warships, a '''battery''' is a group of large gun turrets working together. A battery may consist of any number of gun turrets and the arrangement varies from class to class.<ref>These are not [[w:Railgun|railguns ]]. No [[BW:CJ|official sources]] use this term to describe these weapons, and there is substantial evidence to the contrary.</ref>

[[Galactica type battlestar|Galactica type]] battlestars are armed with 24 gun turrets, with 2 gun barrels each. It is likely that the term "battery" refers to several of these turrets acting in concert.

On [[Mercury class]] battlestars, on the other hand, four forward guns are grouped to a battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]). <ref name="battery">''Pegasus's'' bow battery can be seen to consist of four gun turrets when she engages a Cylon basestar.</ref> In addition, many smaller, 2-barelled turrets are located along the sides of the [[flight pod]]s. Unlike ''Galactica's'' rapid-fire [[Weapons in the Re-imagined Series#Point_defense_guns|point defense guns]], these have a slower rate of fire and are also used for offensive action ("[[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

*It should be noted that, in modern day naval nomenclature, a vessel's "main battery" is its primary ''offensive'' weapon. Since the battery of four two-barreled gun turrets at the bow of Pegasus has been referred to as such on several occasions, it is likely that this battery- presenting the battlestar's smallest profile to the enemy- is used primarily for offensive actions, while the others could be adapted for use as per mission parameters.

[[Image:PegasusForeBatteries.jpg|thumb|right|''Pegasus'' firing her main battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]).]]

==Ammunition==

[[Image:Flakfield.jpg|thumb|right|The flak field from ''Galactica's'' large turrets ([[Scattered]])]]

The large turrets found on Colonial [[battlestar|battlestars]] fire several types of ammunition, depending on the objective:

*Flak ammunition: this ammunition employs [[w:shrapnel|exploding metal fragments]] at high velocity, creating a defensive barrier around the battlestar which can shear enemy fighters or incoming missiles. This, along with the point-defenses, keep the enemy at a distance, allowing the battlestar's [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] forces to safely deploy and engage ([[Scattered]]).

*Offensive ammunition: in this configuration, salvos from the main cannons are extremely lethal to the unarmored Cylons [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]], which furthermore posess no such weapons or point-defense themselves. As such, this is a battlestar's main weapon against other capital ships ("[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

It should be noted that the massive recoil caused by firing these flak rounds makes it impossible for the cannon to have a fast rate of fire like the battlestar's point-defense turrets. These shells are also too large to be loaded quickly and efficiently by crew members, and as such are loaded by mechanical hoists ([[33]]).

==Firing Solution==

[[Image:Pegasus Hi-Res 5a.jpg|thumb|right|''Pegasus's'' flight pod batteries ([[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]).]]

When engaging enemy targets over any kind of distance, a '''firing solution''' must be obtained. This requires several pieces of information to be input to a battery's fire-control computer, including the target's speed, course, and range; and the firing platform's speed and course. The velocity of the shells would be known, and is constant, given that there is no air friction in the vacuum of space. The resulting computation would allow the gun captains to accurately aim their weaponry to such a degree that firing will result in a probable hit.

==Operation==

[[Image:TheEnemysGateIsDown.jpg|thumb|right|The devastating effect Colonial batteries can have on a Cylon basestar ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])]]

As with modern naval cannon, Colonial gun batteries have several modes of operation.

*Salvo Fire: this calls for a battery, or elements of a battery, to fire simultaneously at a single target. ([[The Captain's Hand]])
*Full Attack Mode: a battery's commander (Gun captain, [[33]]) will target and engage targets of oppertunity. <ref name="attack">During the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], batteries are called to "fire at will".</ref>

On [[Mercury class battlestar|Mercury-class battlestars]], gun batteries can be set to one of several automatic firing modes ([[Exodus, Part II]]). It is unknown if the gun batteries on [[Galactica type battlestar|older battlestars]] have this capability as well. There are likely other modes of operation for these batteries, but none have been explicitly stated on screen.

At least on ''Galactica''-type battlestars, the turrets appear to be manned and manually fired.

==Limitations==

Since its turrets are relatively slow to traverse, a battlestar's main guns would be a poor choice for engaging [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|enemy fighters]] which are small, fast and extremely maneuverable. They would also be impractical for defending against enemy missile attacks, which would be more suceptible to attack from [[Weapons in the Re-imagined Series#Point_defense_guns|point defense weapons]] or Vipers.

The turrets' slow rate of fire also means that a single turret, if left to operate alone - either due to damage, power failure or any other events - may not be a very effective method of attack. It is for this very reason that the turrets are grouped in batteries.

== See Also ==

[[Weapons in the Re-imagined Series]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (TOS)]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Romo Lampkin/Archive 1

2007-03-13T12:46:04Z

Madbrood: Suggestion re spoiler boxes on google

I bet you 50 cubits that this fellow is a Cylon.
--[[User:Volostheguardian|Volostheguardian]] 23:15, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:I certainly hope he isn't. --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 23:56, 9 December 2006 (CST)
::Cylon or not he'll most likely be a "baddie", cus the actor always is. lol --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:49, 10 December 2006 (CST)
:::Actually it's '''Romo Lampkin'''.
:::http://www.sidesexpress.com/se_index.cfm?locid=5&task=type&l=5&c=battlestar#sr
:::--[[User:Deus|Deus]] 07:00, 10 December 2006 (CST)
::::Yeah, I was only about 90% certain about the exact pronunciation of his name when I listened to the podcast. That's why I didn't feel I should create this page and only posted it on [[The Son Also Rises]]--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 10:39, 10 December 2006 (CST)

:Sauron18... a "lawyer" would be a perfect fit for a Cylon. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:24, 6 January 2007 (CST)

:Well, does he look like any of [[:Image:Final_Five.jpg|these guys]]? Anyway, it's certainly not a bet I'd take! Though I think it would be cooler if, as a force of evil, he was human but somehow in cahoots with the Cylons, rather like Morden from Babylon 5. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 19:57, 26 February 2007 (CST)
::Please please please ignore what the final five look like in that picture! They are only standins used for the promotional image and are never seen on screen. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:53, 27 February 2007 (CST)
:::My apologies. I knew those five were only stand-ins; I should have qualified that so as not to lead anyone astray. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 08:32, 5 March 2007 (CST)
Hey, page authors: spoilers from hidden fields on this page are showing up in Google right now! If you Google "Romo Lampkin" you'll see them, even though they're not visible on this page. And Google searches don't have spoiler warnings so guys, maybe you should get rid of those hidden fields altogether and wait till the facts have been revealed? I've already been spoiled now myself but I'm not mad. I'm not removing the fields because it's really up to you. But I thought you should be aware. --[[User:njgreen|njgreen]] 06:45, 12 March 2007 (EST)
:Interesting. However, please refer to our [[BW:SP|spoiler policy]], which should address your questions on the subject. Typically any "spoilers" are pretty well sourced, so the facts are revealed, per se, just not in the episode itself. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:02, 12 March 2007 (CDT)
::Thanks for pointing me at the policy page. I am a little new here so apologies for any misunderstanding on my part. My concern is that these spoilers are in HTML hidden fields, so it seems that they may not be intended to be visible to anyone, even to page viewers who have been warned. Meanwhile, anyone doing a casual Google search on Lampkin will see the spoiler right away (it's only the 6th result on the page). In other words, you can see spoilers on Google that page viewers themselves can't see (without a view source anyway). If that is still consistent with the policy, fine - as I said I'm not particularly exercised about it but I just thought you should know. Love the site, by the way.--[[User:njgreen|njgreen]] 07:57, 12 March 2007 (EST)
:::Boy do I feel silly now! Those so-called "spoilers" appear in hidden fields on EVERY character page! If I believed them, then every character is both a "humanoid cyclon" and "an original series cylon." So I was making a fuss about what is essentially hidden boilerplate text. Thanks for being patient with me throughout this funny little situation.--[[User:njgreen|njgreen]] 14:15, 12 March 2007 (EST)
::::No problem, njgreen! :-) Actually, this is interesting... We'll have to look into it, to see what we can do about it. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 14:06, 12 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::I know Matt Cutts at Google is head of the department that basically ensures we all get the information we need out of our searches through various search algorithms, etc.. I wonder if dropping him and his team an email would be of benefit? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 07:46, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

== Parallels to real world? ==

Given the similarities in name and role as a crusader for the undefended/undefendable I can't help but think Romo's character is, at least to some extent, inspired by the real world Raphael Lempkin [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raphael_Lemkin] whose plight is extensively documented in Samatha Power's book: A Problem From Hell: America in the Age of Genocide[http://www.amazon.com/Problem-Hell-America-Age-Genocide/dp/0060541644].

Kara Thrace

2007-03-13T12:42:26Z

Madbrood: /* Background */

:''This article discusses the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Re-imagined Series]] character with the pilot callsign of "Starbuck." For information on Kara Thrace's counterpart in the [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|Original Series]], see [[Starbuck (TOS)]].''

{{Character Data
|photo= Starbucks.jpg
|age=
|colony= [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Caprica]]
|birthname= Kara Thrace
|callsign= Starbuck
|seen= Miniseries
|death= [[Maelstrom]]
|parents= [[Socrata Thrace]] (mother)
|siblings=
|children=
|marital status= Married to [[Samuel Anders]] (formerly engaged to [[Zak Adama]]†)
|role= Squadron leader (formerly: Commander Air Group), battlestar ''Galactica''
|rank= Captain
|actor= [[Katee Sackhoff]] Erika-Shaye Gair (child)
|cylon=
}}
'''Kara "Starbuck" Thrace''', serial number 462753, is a gifted [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] pilot — and knows it. This leaves her with an attitude that has at times thwarted her career advancement. However, thanks to [[William Adama]], Thrace's skills in battle have extended beyond the cockpit to greatly aid the Fleet.

== Background ==
*In an unhappy childhood, Thrace was so frequently beaten by her mother [[Socrata Thrace]], that she came to accept pain as a way of life ([[Flesh and Bone]]).
*Her father was a pianist ([[Valley of Darkness]]).
*Thrace left home to join the [[Colonial Fleet|military]].
*One of her first postings prior to being a flight instructor was aboard the battlestar ''[[Triton (RDM)]]''.
* She was a very talented [[pyramid]] player ([[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]), and received a scholarship to the Fleet Academy to play pyramid. During this time, she injured her knee and was no longer able to play pyramid at a professional level. During that time, however, she discovered a passion and skill at being a fighter pilot ([[Podcast:The Hand of God]]). On graduating from Colonial Flight School, she undertook a period of active duty before returning to flight school as an instructor.
*Thrace fell in love with a young recruit, [[Zak Adama]]. Despite his mediocre performance, she passed him on his final flight examination, despite failing three of the required maneuvers ([[Act of Contrition]]).
*Thrace's engagement to Zak Adama ends when he was killed during a routine mission shortly after graduating. At the time, [[Lee Adama]], Zak's elder brother, blamed their father for Zak Adama's death. In her guilt, Thrace did little to alter this idea. She did, however, meet [[William Adama]] shortly after the accident, and the two struck up such a strong rapport that they stood together at the funeral ([[Act of Contrition]]).
*Thrace resigned from flight school as a instructor and transferred as an operational pilot aboard [[Galactica type battlestar|battlestar]] ''[[Galactica]]'' under the command of William Adama, where she served for some two years prior to the [[Fall of the Twelve Colonies|Cylon attack]] on the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]]. Before the Cylon attack, she was second in command of the remaining pilots, subordinate to the [[CAG]], [[Jackson Spencer]].
*At the time of the Cylon attack she has an run-down apartment in [[Delphi]] that overlooks a parking lot and a Colonial version of a [[Wikipedia:Humvee|Humvee]] which she and Helo use to escape the city and get to the country where she meets her husband-to-be Anders. She rarely used the dilapidated apartment. She was also a very avid painter, and her apartment was cluttered with her paintings and a [[Starbuck's Poem|poem]] is written on a wall ([[Valley of Darkness]]).
*Despite her reckless approach to life, Thrace hides the fact that she is deeply spiritual. She frequently prays (or talks) to the [[Lords of Kobol]], particularly [[Aphrodite]] and [[Artemis]] in times of need ([[Miniseries]], "[[Flesh and Bone]]", "[[You Can't Go Home Again]]").

==Character History at a Glance==
*Thrace's attitude quickly runs her afoul of Colonel [[Saul Tigh]], ''Galactica's'' [[Executive officer]]. Their open mutual dislike of one another leads to the point where blows are exchanged, with Thrace ending up in the brig. After the Cylon attack she is released from the brig and returns to duty as ''Galactica's'' Viper pilot.
*Thrace manages to keep two of three nuclear missiles from striking ''Galactica'' in their first Cylon sortie, and saves Captain Adama from doom in an innovative maneuver in the [[Battle of Ragnar Anchorage]].
*Her skills in saving Apollo brings her grudging respect from Colonel Tigh, but she is unable to accept his offer of the olive branch - an act that will have repercussions for her later ([[Miniseries]]).

[[image:Bastille_Day-Starbuck_Boxey.jpg|thumb|left|[[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]] as acting [[CAG]] with [[Boxey (RDM)|Boxey]] as assistant ([[Bastille Day]]).]]
*Thrace participates in a hostage rescue mission aboard the ''[[Astral Queen]]''. Following the successful mission, Thrace tries to mend fences between herself and Colonel Tigh with a toast (consisting of water), apologizing in much the same way as Tigh himself had tried after their initial escape from [[Ragnar Anchorage]]. But Tigh rejects Thrace's apology, stating that her flaws are professional, while his flaws were personal ([[Bastille Day]]).
*Thrace eventually admits her secret about Zak Adama to William Adama himself, an act that brings their close friendship almost to the breaking point ([[Act of Contrition]]).
*During a surprise encounter with Cylons during [[nugget]] training, Starbuck destroys several Cylon Raiders, but her ship is damaged and tumbles towards a small red moon with an unbreathable atmosphere. With her Viper in a fatal flat-spin, Starbuck is forced to eject from her Viper ([[You Can't Go Home Again]]).
*Thrace (nursing a damaged knee) repairs the downed Cylon Raider found on the inhabitable moon and returns to ''Galactica'', giving the Fleet a vital piece of Cylon fighter technology for study and use.
*The recovering Thrace, off flight status, is asked by Commander Adama to plan a special attack on a Cylon [[tylium]] refinery. The tactical planning role is not something she relishes, and she frequently shows resentment towards others for her condition ([[The Hand of God (RDM)|The Hand of God]]).
*During Thrace's undesired interrogation of a Cylon prisoner, a copy of a known [[Humanoid Cylon]] named [[Leoben Conoy]], she uses some drastic acts to try to extract the information from the Humanoid Cylon ([[Flesh and Bone]]).
[[image:Starbuck-Kobols_Last_Gleaming_pt2.jpg|thumb|right|'''Starbuck''' retrieves the [[Arrow of Apollo]] ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]).]]
*Thrace is assigned to plant a nuclear device on board a [[Basestar (RDM)|basestar]] in orbit around [[Kobol]]. Disobeying orders to retrieve the [[Arrow of Apollo]] by President Roslin's request, disillusioned by Commander Adama, she Jumps to Caprica ([[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]]), landing in [[Delphi]].
*In the [[Delphi Museum of the Colonies]] with the Arrow, she is violently attacked by a copy of [[Number Six]]. Despite being heavily outmatched in the fight, Thrace luckily defeats the Cylon.
*At the museum, she reunites with [[Karl Agathon|Helo]], whom she thought dead, and discovers a second copy of [[Sharon Valerii]], realizing instantly that the woman is a Cylon.
*Valerii, fearing for her child, steals Thrace's Raider. In exasperation, Starbuck could only mutter: "Bitch took my ride" ([[Scattered]]). Like Helo, Starbuck was left with no way to return to the Fleet unless she could find her Raider or another Cylon spacecraft, as enemy FTL engines were the only ones sufficently powerful to reach the Fleet.
*Starbuck berates Helo's love for the Caprica copy of Valerii. Thrace finds the keys of her surplus military utility vehicle in her old jacket in her old apartment. Thrace has a ride again, if only to move more efficiently about Caprica ([[Valley of Darkness]]).
*Thrace and Helo meet a [[Caprica Resistance|resistance movement]] on Caprica. Thrace and [[Samuel Anders]] strike up a rapport as fellow [[pyramid (RDM)|pyramid]] players and end up as lovers.
*During planning to steal a [[Heavy Raider]], Thrace is shot in a military action, waking up in a hospital on Caprica. Thrace is told by her doctor, [[Simon]], that Anders died from wounds he suffered in getting Thrace to safety.
*Thrace discovers that Simon is working with a [[Number Six|known Humanoid Cylon]]. She overhears that the next day he plans to extract her ovaries for use in the Cylon's attempts to study and create a hybrid Cylon/human embryo. Simon also makes the mistake of calling Thrace by her callsign, Starbuck, which she had never revealed.
*Staggering and in pain, Thrace kills Simon and escapes the hospital, but not before clocking a Six copy with a fire extinguisher and destroying the local farm power supply, mercy-killing [[Sue-Shaun]] and several other women in the facility.
*Another Simon copy appears just as the Resistance attacks the facility. The second Simon, now revealed as a Humanoid Cylon himself, is immediately killed by the Resistance, but a squad of [[Cylon Centurion]]s appear and pins the Resistance down. Luckily, Helo's [[Sharon Valerii (Caprica copy)|copy of Sharon Valerii]] swoops in with a stolen [[Heavy Raider]], destroys the Centurions and flies the Resistance and Thrace out of harm's way.
*Thrace promises to Anders that she'll [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I|return with a rescue mission]] for the remaining survivors. Anders returns the Arrow of Apollo to Thrace, which he hid on the resistance grounds for safekeeping ([[The Farm]]).
*Thrace, Helo and the pregnant Valerii land on the ''[[Astral Queen]]'' in the Heavy Raider. Finding the [[Laura Roslin faction]] in orbit of [[Kobol]], Thrace is reunited with Lee Adama. He kisses her impulsively, catching Thrace by pleasant surprise, but a tense standoff follows when Adama discovers that another Valerii copy has returned with them. Roslin helps defuse the situation, and Thrace delivers the Arrow of Apollo to the President.
*Temporarily removed from miltary protocol, Lee Adama playfully teases Thrace by stealing a pyramid ball she took from Caprica. Adama senses her depression about Caprica and tells her that he'd be happy to hear about any problems she had. He also let slip that he loved her, which brightened Thrace's mood to the point where she teased him back about his slip.
*With a team led by Laura Roslin, Lee Adama, and, later, joined by the recovered Commander Adama, Thrace enters the [[Tomb of Athena]] and successfully uses the Arrow of Apollo to activate a hologram that shows constellations of the Twelve Colonies' ancient symbols.
*Thrace realizes that they are on a recreation of Earth. Together with Lee Adama, they locate the Lagoon Nebula, a celestial body known to Commander Adama and Lee Adama, and gather sufficient information to begin an actual course to Earth ([[Home, Part II]]).
*Thrace shows off the impressive stealth abilities in the new [[Blackbird]] fighter in her maiden flight ([[Flight of the Phoenix]]).
*With the arrival of ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'', Admiral [[Helena Cain]] summarily assigns Thrace (and Lee Adama) to ''Pegasus'' after digesting the reports of ''Galactica'''s officers.
*[[Cole Taylor|The ''Pegasus'' CAG]] removes Thrace from the Cylon recon mission. Lee Adama secretly tells her to use the [[Blackbird]] to take recon photos of the Cylon Unknown ([[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]).
*Returning from her very successful mission, the [[Blackbird]]'s lack of a Colonial transponder is mistaken for a Cylon [[Raider]] on [[DRADIS]], and Starbuck is nearly confronted and shot at by Vipers from ''Pegasus'' and ''Galactica''. After narrowly avoiding certain death by declaring herself a friendly, Thrace transmits her recon photos to ''Pegasus''.
*Admiral Cain is very impressed with Starbuck's performance and promotes her to Captain and ''Pegasus'' CAG.
*Thrace is assigned the task of planning the joint attack on the Resurrection Ship, but successfully asks to have Lee Adama on her team, restoring him to flight status.
*After she briefs Cain and Commander Adama on her battle plan, Adama asks Thrace privately to assassinate Cain after the battle is complete. Adama fears that if Cain continues to command, the Fleet would be in mortal jeopardy from Cain's draconian command ([[Resurrection Ship, Part I]]).
*Thrace's battle planning, as before on the [[tylium]] [[The Hand of God (RDM)|mine]], works to near-perfection, with the Resurrection Ship destroyed and its supporting basestars.
*As a result of the battle events, Thrace is left without backup as she walks to the ''Pegasus'' CIC to shoot Cain, obviously afraid and apprehensive. When Commander Adama calls, Thrace slowly moves her hand to her sidearm but, to her relief, Adama does not give the kill order and cryptically instructs her to stand down ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]).
*Starbuck and [[Kat]] are involved in the protection of a mining operation from periodic Raider attacks. One Raider, nicknamed [[Scar (Raider)|Scar]], fuels an intensive rivalry for the pilot's "top gun" honor. Thrace, still depressed over her inability to convince Fleet command to initiate a rescue for Samuel Anders and his resistance, drinks heavily and obsesses over removing Scar from the sky, even at the cost of her life. Fortunately, Starbuck realizes the futility of her actions, and works together with Kat to destroy the remarkably dangerous Raider ([[Scar]]).
*A few weeks later, Thrace takes leave on ''[[Cloud Nine]]'' when she was dragooned into rescuing Lee Adama and several other ''Galactica'' crew and residents after terrorists take them hostage in exchange for the incarcerated [[Sharon Valerii (Caprica copy)|Sharon Valerii]]. Thrace gathers intel on the situation, but her cover is blown. In the retreating firefight, Lee Adama is caught in the crossfire. After the situation is resolved, Thrace intended to sit at Adama's bedside, only to discover that Dualla beat her there ([[Sacrifice]]).
*Later, Thrace is assigned to ''Pegasus'' as a flight trainer. Though the pilots like her, Commander [[Barry Garner]] does not, eventually confining her to quarters for "insubordination." Following the [[Battle of the Binary Star System|ill-fated rescue and retreat]] from a Cylon ambush (where Thrace leads the fighters), Thrace informs new ''Pegasus'' Commander Lee Adama that she was taking over his old CAG post aboard ''Galactica'' ([[The Captain's Hand]]).
*Thrace gets her wish: The Caprica rescue is approved, and she leads a large Raptor squadron to the planet. The group soon met up with Anders, who reports that their HQ had been destroyed and Thrace's timing was just perfect. A squad of Centurions ambush and pin down the group moments later ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]).
*Still pinned down from attack fire, Starbuck and Anders agree to kill each other to avoid capture and interrment at a [[Farms|farm]]. But the attack stops, and a [[Cavil|man]] appears, praising the [[Lords of Kobol|Gods]] as he announces that the Cylons not only have ceased fire, but are abandoning the Twelve Colonies. Starbuck isn't really surprised to discover that the man, known as Brother [[Cavil]], was a Cylon upon their return to the Fleet.
*Starbuck and Anders proceed to get drunk, and host a disastrous visitation with Lee Adama. This apparently led to a rift between the two comrades.
[[Image:Leobenkara.jpg|thumb|right|200px|Leoben with Kara.]]
*The evening of the founding of [[New Caprica]], Thrace slept with Lee Adama and proclaimed her love for him as she was uncertain regarding her feelings toward Anders. The following morning she quickly married Anders in a ceremonry near the river. This caused a rift between Kara and Lee that lasted for over a year.
*Life on New Caprica tempered Thrace, and she often behaved in ways Starbuck never would have, including hugging Colonel Tigh and pampering Anders during his bout with an illness.
*She watches in horror at the sudden arrival of hundreds of Cylon ships in the sky over New Caprica. A few of ''Galactica's'' former crew gather near Thrace, looking to her for guidance. Starbuck responds the only way she knows how: "Fight 'em until we can't" ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]).
*After Baltar's surrender of New Caprica, Conoy keeps Thrace prisoner in an apartment located within the Cylon-built [[New Caprica Detention Center]] in an attempt to convince Thrace that she loves him and also convert her to the [[Cylon Religion|Cylon monotheistic religion]]. She repeatedly kills Conoy a total of five times in an attempt to convince him to let her go ([[Occupation]], [[Precipice]]).
*Conoy introduces Thrace to a small child named [[Kacey]], who appears to be approximately two to three years in age, whom he claims is their biological daughter. He explains that the child was created using one of Thrace's extracted ovaries ([[The Farm]]) and his genetic material. Conflicted, Thrace leaves the child unattended, which later results in Kacey falling down the apartment's stairs ([[Precipice]]). After the fall, Thrace begins to change her attitude towards the child and begins to offer affection towards Conoy ([[Precipice]], [[Exodus, Part I]]).
*Upon her return to ''Galactica'' after Admiral Adama's daring rescue attempt, Thrace heartbreakingly discovers that Kacey was simply another manipulation on Conoy's part — Kacey is merely a human child whom the Cylons had abducted months ago ([[Exodus, Part II]]).
*Bearing the psychological scars of her four month ordeal with Leoben and Kacey, Thrace is recruited by [[Seelix]] as a last minute replacement juror in the [[Circle]] after [[Samuel Anders]]' resignation. She is the fifth vote to find Gaeta of treason and collaboration. Thrace's involvement in the Circle precipitates the breakup of her marriage with Anders. Later, when Gaeta is about to be sentenced and executed in one of ''Galactica's'' [[launch tubes (RDM)|launch tubes]], she demands him to beg for his life. Thrace physically assaults him and goes down the litany of "lies" that Gaeta told her earlier about him helping the [[New Caprica Resistance|insurgency]]. As she does so, [[Galen Tyrol]], one of the Circle's jurors and the sixth vote to convict, overhears this and confirms the story. In a sense of confusion after learning that Gaeta was telling the truth, Thrace leaves the launch tube ([[Collaborators]]).
*During a combat exercise between Vipers, Thrace breaks formation and collides with another pilot, forcing an end to the war games and causing Apollo to revoke her flight status. Later, at her bunk she is met by Kacey and her mother, whom she dismisses, telling Kacey's mother not to visit her again. In the pilots' rec room, Thrace and Colonel Tigh begin to sow dissent between the survivors of New Caprica and the crew that stayed behind on ''Galactica'', insinuating that those who stayed behind did not suffer like those on New Caprica did, and that the crew of ''Galactica'' took too long to organize a rescue. Admiral Adama, upon learning of this from [[Karl Agathon]], confronts Thrace and Tigh on their behavior. He challenges them to shoot him, as their constant complaining is tantamount to pulling the trigger. When neither do, Adama throws Thrace off her chair and demands that both she and Tigh shape up and move on with their lives. Spurred by Adama's words, Thrace cuts her hair and returns to duty. Later, in uniform, she visits Kacey and her mother on the [[Camp Oil Slick|converted hangar deck]] ([[Torn]]).
*Thrace enters an illicit affair with Lee Adama, rekindling their romance on New Caprica ([[Unfinished Business]]). Both Anders and Adama's wife, Lieutenant [[Dualla]], are more than vaguely aware of the pair's sexual tension. Major Adama soon ends the affair and reconciles, but Thrace refuses to give Anders any further attention than a periodic sexual fling.
*Starbuck is involved with the defense of the [[Temple of Five]] but is severely injured, leaving her rescuer, Dualla, to return them to ''Galactica'' ([[Rapture]]). Helo recognizes the strange circular [[Eye of Jupiter|mandala]] (created 4,000 years before) in the Temple and its resemblance to a symbol that Thrace painted in her apartment. When shown the symbol, the recovering Thrace is darkly reminded of Leoben's prophesy.
*During refueling operations above a gas giant, Starbuck is continually attracted to what she believes is a Cylon contact, which she chases to find a planetary storm that resembles the mandala. She dives into it, almost losing control before coming to her senses and returning.
*Command staff and Thrace question her competency to continue flying, but Major Adama volunteers encouragement and offers to fly as her wingman on her next [[CAP]].
*Starbuck finds herself attracted by another apparent Cylon contact. As she descended, her Viper is struck by debris and she, while unconscious, experiences a revelation about her mother, [[Socrata Thrace]], and guided through the vision by what looks to be a Leoben copy.
*Starbuck regains consciousness but chooses to continue her descent despite Apollo's desperate pleas to ascend. "I'll see you on the other side (...) Just let me go" were her last words as her Viper explodes. A grief-stricken Apollo tells [[CIC]] that he did not see any ejection ([[Maelstrom]]).

==Notes==
*On the Sci-Fi Channel's preview for season 2.5 (US), Katee Sackoff is quoted as saying that Starbuck is "the best Viper pilot...EVER."
*[[Wikipedia:Thrace|Thrace]] was a region in south-eastern Europe that was heavily influenced by the ancient Greeks and was eventually conquered by [[Wikipedia:Philip_II_of_Macedonia|Phillip II of Macedonia]]. Thracians were considered by most to be the most ferocious fighters and were often highly paid mercenaries for Greek kings.
*After auditioning for the role of [[Anastasia Dualla|Dualla]], [[Grace Park]] was asked by director [[Michael Rymer]] to audition for the role of Starbuck, and she was actually one of two finalists up for the role (the other being Katee Sackhoff, who got the part). Ultimately Park was cast as [[Sharon Valerii (Galactica copy)|Sharon "Boomer" Valerii]].
*In a TV Guide [http://online.tvguide.com/newsearch/detail.aspx?id=4371595&sourcetype=S&progseriesparentid=4371595&tvobjectid=191395&keyword=Battlestar+Galactica&referrer=search1 photo shoot] at the BSG studios, Katee Sackhoff explained that the [[tattoo]] that Starbuck bears on her left arm is a wing and a circle and has half of the constellation of Capricorn (a reference to [[Caprica]] obviously) and a small symbol of the planet as well. It matches a mirror image of the tattoo on Anders' right arm. When the two of them hold each other with their respective arms crossing, the 2 tattoos come together to form an image of a single ring with 2 wings that is supposed to represent their union. According to Sackhoff, Kara and Anders had the tattoos done around the time of their wedding.
*The license plate on Thrace's truck on Caprica is "FB 42 E3" ([[Valley of Darkness]]).
*In a [http://community.tvguide.com/thread.jspa?threadID=800009378 recent TV Guid interview], David Eick stated that ..."the events in episodes 16 and 19 will greatly impact the nature of their romance" when asked about the Starbuck/Apollo romance, which appears to support the theory that Starbuck somehow survived "Maelstrom".

==References==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{start box}}
{{succession box|before=[[Cole Taylor|Cole "Stinger" Taylor]]|title=[[Commander Air Group|Commander, Air Group]], ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]''|after=''(unknown)''}}
{{succession box|before=[[Lee Adama|Lee "Apollo" Adama]]|title=[[Commander Air Group|Commander, Air Group]], ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]''|after=[[Louanne Katraine|Louanne "Kat" Katraine]]}}
{{end box}}

{{Characters}}

[[Category:A to Z|Thrace, Kara]]
[[Category:Characters|Thrace, Kara]]
[[Category:Characters (RDM)|Thrace, Kara]]
[[Category:People from Caprica|Thrace, Kara]]
[[Category:RDM|Thrace, Kara]]
{{featured article candidate}}
[[de:Kara Thrace]]

Military Ranks (RDM)

2007-03-05T12:30:38Z

Madbrood: /* Insignia */

This rank structure for the [[Battlestar Galactica (RDM)|Re-imagined Series]] is derived from the [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|Original Series]] [[Military Ranks (TOS)|ranks]] as mentioned in [[Ronald D. Moore]]'s blog.

== Rank equivalencies ==

These ranks have been speculatively expanded in order to provide a rough rank equivalency with the United States Navy. Many aspects of the following table are speculative. 
Rank equivalencies in real life are usually established only when two organizations with differing rank structures have to work together and establish who outranks whom. As this obviously isn't happening between [[Colonial Fleet]] and the United States military, the following table exists mainly to improve understanding of Colonial ranks for those familiar with the US military and similarily structured organizations.

The officer ranks of the [[Colonial Marine Corps]] have yet to be established on screen or by official sources and thus are not listed here.

{| class="messagebox" style="width:100%" cellspacing="2" cellpadding="2" align="center"
|- class="infoboxheader"
! style="font-size:100%;" align="left" valign="middle" | '''Rank Equivilant'''
! style="font-size:100%;" align="left" valign="middle" | '''BSG Military Rankings''' ||
! style="font-size:100%;" align="left" valign="middle" | '''U.S. Navy Rankings'''
! style="font-size:100%;" align="left" valign="middle" | '''BSG Examples'''
|-
| class="infoboxheader" colspan="5" align=left style="font-size:95%;" | '''FLAG OFFICERS'''
|-
| [O-10]
| Admiral ||
| Admiral
| [[Nagala]], [[Corman]] <ref name="a">'''Admiral''': Corman wears the same Admiral insignia as Adama and Cain, but wears thick gold piping on his uniform.</ref>
|-
| [O-9]
| Vice Admiral ||
| Vice Admiral
|-
| [O-7/8]
| Rear Admiral ||
| Rear Admiral
| [[Helena Cain]], [[William Adama]] (Season 2.5+) <ref name="ra">'''Rear Admiral''':
*In the [[Pegasus (Extended Version)|Extended Version]] of the episode "Pegasus", Adama states "Fleet promoted her to Rear Admiral over half of the Commanders on the list." This could also indicate that Commander is not a flag rank in the BSG universe.
*A [[:Image:GalPegDradis.JPG|screen capture]] of ''Galactica'''s Dradis shows two stars next to ''Pegasus''. It is speculated that this denotes [[Helena Cain|Cain]] as a two-star Admiral.
*When Adama is promoted to Admiral in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]" his new rank insignia are identical to Cain's. They also have two gold bars on the sides, which could be equivalent to today's two stars of a Rear Admiral, Upper Half.</ref>
|-
| class="infoboxheader" colspan="5" align=left style="font-size:95%;" | '''COMMISSIONED OFFICERS'''
|-
| [O-6]
| Commander ||
| Captain
| [[William Adama]] (Miniseries-Season 2.5) <ref name="commander">'''Commander:''' The rank of Commander is somewhat unclear and encompassed duties of both modern Admirals and Captains. It may be analogous to the rank of "Commodore", which is no longer used in the US Navy.
</ref>
|-
|-
| [O-5]
| Colonel ||
| Commander
| [[Saul Tigh]], [[Jack Fisk]]
|-
| NA
| Major ||
| NA
| [[Jackson Spencer]], [[Cottle|Doctor Cottle]], [[Lee Adama]] (Season 3+)
|-
| [O-4]
| Captain ||
| Lieutenant Commander
| [[Lee Adama]] (Miniseries-Season 2.5), [[Kara Thrace]] (Season 2.5+), [[Aaron Kelly]], [[Karl Agathon]] (Season 3+)
|-
| [O-3]
| Lieutenant ||
| Lieutenant
| [[Kara Thrace]] (Miniseries-Season 2.5), [[Karl Agathon]] (Season 1-2) <ref name="helo"> Helo states his rank as "Lieutenant, Junior Grade" in "[[33]]", but he consistantly wears the rank insignia of a full Lieutenant.</ref>
|-
| [O-2]
| Lieutenant Junior Grade ||
| Lieutenant Junior Grade
|[[Sharon Valerii]], [[Felix Gaeta]], [[Louanne Katraine]] (Season 1-2)
|-
| [O-1]
| Ensign ||
| Ensign
| [[Davis]], [[Diana Seelix]] (Season 3+)
|-
| class="infoboxheader" colspan="5" align=left style="font-size:95%;" | '''NON-COMMISSIONED OFFICERS'''
|-
| || '''Fleet''' || '''Marines'''
|-
|[E-9]
| Master Chief Petty Officer || Sergeant Major
| Master Chief Petty Officer
|
|-
| [E-8]
| Senior Chief Petty Officer<ref name="SCPO and PO3">The ranks of Senior Chief Petty Officer and Petty Officer 3rd Class do not exist in the Colonial military, according to Ron Moore, but are included here due to matters of equivalency.</ref> || Master Sergeant
| Senior Chief Petty Officer
|
|-
| [E-7]
| Chief Petty Officer || Gunnery Sergeant
| Chief Petty Officer
| [[Galen Tyrol]], [[Erin Mathias]] ([[Marines|CMC]])
|-
| [E-6]
| Petty Officer 1st Class || Staff Sergeant
| Petty Officer 1st Class
| [[Hadrian|Hadrian]] ([[Marines|CMC]]) <ref name="hadrian"> In "[[Litmus]]" Sergeant [[Hadrian]] wears insignia listed here as 'Petty Officer, 1st Class'. While she is a [[Marines|Marine]], it is possible that some rank insignia are used in both services. Her rank is assumed to be 'Staff Sergeant' which equates to 'Petty Officer, 1st Class'. Placing her one rank lower or higher would create a conflict with the established insignia of 'Petty Officer, 2nd Class' and 'Chief Petty Officer' respectively.</ref>
|-
| [E-5]
| Petty Officer 2nd Class || Sergeant
| Petty Officer 2nd Class
| [[Anastasia Dualla]] (Miniseries-Season 2), [[Cally Henderson]] (Season 3+)
|-
| [E-4]
| Petty Officer 3rd Class<ref name="SCPO and PO3">The ranks of Senior Chief Petty Officer and Petty Officer 3rd Class do not exist in the Colonial military, according to Ron Moore, but are included here due to matters of equivalency.</ref> || Corporal
| Petty Officer 3rd Class
| [[Venner]] ([[Marines|CMC]])
|-
| class="infoboxheader" colspan="5" align=left style="font-size:95%;" | '''ENLISTED PERSONNEL'''
|-
| || '''Fleet''' || '''Marines'''
|-
| [E-3]
| Crewman Specialist || Lance Corporal
| Seaman
| [[Cally Henderson]] (Miniseries-Season 3), [[Socinus]], [[Prosna]]
|-
| [E-2]
| Deckhand || Private First Class
| Seaman Apprentice
| [[Scott Kelso]] ([[Marines|CMC]])
|-
| [E-1]
| Recruit || Private
| Seaman Recruit
| [[Sykes]], [[Stewart Jaffee]] (both [[Marines|CMC]])
|-
|}

==Insignia==

{| class="messagebox" cellspacing="2" cellpadding="2"
|-
| colspan="4" class="infoboxheader" | '''Senior Officers'''
|-
| [[Image:NBSG-ColonelPin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-CommanderPin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-AdmiralPin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-AdmiralPin1.jpg]]
|
|-
| '''Colonel'''
| '''Commander'''
| '''Rear Admiral''' <ref name="ra"/>
| '''Admiral''' <ref name="a"/>
|
|-
| colspan="4" class="infoboxheader" | '''Junior Officers'''
|-
| [[Image:NBSG-LTjgPin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-LTsgPin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-CaptainPin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-MajorPin.jpg]]
|-
| '''Lieutenant, JG/Ensign'''
| '''Lieutenant'''
| '''Captain'''
| '''Major'''
|-
| colspan="4" class="infoboxheader" | '''Non-Commissioned Officers'''
|-
| [[Image:NBSG-PO2Pin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-PO1Pin.jpg]]
| [[Image:NBSG-CPOPin.jpg]]
|
|-
| '''Petty Officer, 2nd Class'''
| '''Petty Officer, 1st Class''' <ref name="hadrian"/>
| '''Chief Petty Officer'''
|
|-
| colspan="4" class="infoboxheader" | '''Enlisted Personnel'''
|-
| [[Image:NBSG-SpecialistPin.jpg]]
|
|
|
|-
| '''Crewman Specialist'''
|
|
|
|}

These pictures were created by Jim Stevenson a.k.a. "137th Gebirg".
Insignia for the other ranks have yet to be shown on screen and thus aren't listed here.

Senior Officers' ranks can also be identified by the color of the piping on their [[Uniforms (RDM)|uniforms]].

==Notes==
*In a [http://blog.scifi.com/battlestar/archives/2005/02/index.html#a000020 blog entry] on February 19, 2005 Ronald Moore gave a little insight into the rank structure of Battlestar Galactica:
<blockquote>"What is the rank structure? It doesn't seem consistant with the Navy."

"The rank structure is derived from the original series. I didn't want to change Commander Adama to Captain Adama or Colonel Tigh to Commander Tigh, so I elected to simply embrace the co-mingled nature of the original rank structure. For our internal purposes, we've decided that the ranks are indeed a mixture of naval and army nomenclature and are basically as follows:

Officers:
*Admiral
*Commander
*Colonel
*Major
*Captain
*Lieutenant
*Lieutenant (junior grade)
*Ensign

Enlisted:
*Master Chief Petty Officer
*Chief Petty Officer
*Petty Officer (1st, 2nd Class)
*Specialist
*Deck Hand
*Recruit

Just to complicate matters further, there are also Marines aboard Galactica which conform more closely to the traditional enlisted Marine ranks, with Sergeants, Sergeant-Majors, etc. Unresolved is the question of whether the Marine officers would also adhere to the mixed rank structure (which sounds odd) or if they are strictly army equivalents (which makes no sense given that the "Navy" ranks seem oblivious to there being any such distinction). Aren't you glad you asked?"</blockquote>

==See Also==
* [[Uniforms (RDM)]] - Uniforms of the [[Re-imagined Series]].
* [[Military Ranks (TOS)]] - Ranks of the [[Original Series]].

==References==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Colonial]]
[[Category:Colonial Military]]
[[Category:Colonial Military (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Senior Staff of Galactica/Archive 1

2007-02-24T09:19:56Z

Madbrood:

Good, but needs some work.. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 23:05, 23 February 2007 (CST)
: Done working on it for tonight. Feel free to add or revise. [[User:Nwobkwr|Nwobkwr]] 23:39, 23 February 2007 (CST)

Helo isn't CIC staff anymore, he's back in his flight suit :) -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 03:19, 24 February 2007 (CST)

Senior Staff of Galactica

2007-02-24T09:16:50Z

Madbrood: /* Air Group */

=Present Senior Staff=
===CIC===
*Admiral [[William Adama]] - Commanding Officer
*Colonel [[Saul Tigh]] - [[Executive Officer]]
*Lieutenant [[Felix Gaeta]] - [[Tactical officer]], Senior Officer of the Watch
*Lieutenant [[Hoshi]] - [[Communications Officer]]
*Lieutenant [[Anastasia Dualla]]

===Air Group===
*Major [[Lee Adama]] - CAG ([[CAG|Commander, Air Group]])
*Captain [[Kara Thrace]]
*Captain [[Karl Agathon]]
*Lieutenant [[Margaret Edmondson]]
*Lieutenant [[Sharon Agathon]]

===Support===
*Major [[Cottle]] - [[Chief Medical Officer]]
*Captain Aaron Kelly - [[Landing Signal Officer]], Second Officer
*Chief Petty Officer [[Galen Tyrol]] - Chief of the Deck
*Gunnery Sergeant [[Erin Mathias]] - Senior [[Marine]] NCO

=Position Histories=
===Commanding Officer===
* Commander William Adama ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Scattered]])
* Colonel Saul Tigh - Assumed command after assasination attempt on Commander Adama ([[Scattered]] to [[The Farm]])
* Commander William Adama - Re-assumed command after recovering from injuries ([[The Farm]] to [[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])
* Admiral William Adama - Promoted by President [[Roslin]] ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]] to Present)

===Executive Officer===
* Colonel Saul Tigh ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Scattered]])
* Captain Arron Kelly - Assumed position upon Colonel Tigh assuming command ([[Scattered]] to [[The Farm]])
* Colonel Saul Tigh - Re-assumed postion after Commander Adama returned to duty ([[The Farm]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Captain Karl Agathon - Promoted by Admiral Adama after Colonel Tigh relocates to New Caprica ([[Occupation]] to [[Unfinished Business]])
* Colonel Saul Tigh - Re-assumed postion ([[The Passage]] to Present)

===Tactical officer===
* Lieutenant Felix Gaeta ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Captain Karl Agathon - Promoted by Admiral Adama after Lt. Gaeta relocates to New Caprica ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Unknown - Capatain Agathon is promoted to XO ([[Occupation]] to [[The Passage]])
* Lieutenant Felix Gaeta ([[The Passage]] to Present)

===Communications Officer===
*Petty Officer 2nd Class Anastasia Dualla ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Unknown - Petty Officer Dualla is promoted to XO of [[battlestar]] [[Pegasus (RSM)|''Pegasus'']] ([[Occupation]] to [[Exodus, Part II]])
*Lieutenant Hoshi ([[Collaborators]] to Present)

===Commander, Air Group===
* Major [[Jackson Spencer]] ([[Miniseries]])
* Captain Lee Adama - Promoted after the death of Major Spencer ([[Miniseries]] to [[The Captain's Hand]])
* Captain [[George Birch]] - Temporary replacement for Lee Adama ([[Home, Part I]])
* Captain Kara Thrace - Assumes position after Captain Adama is promoted to CO of battlestar ''Pegasus''([[The Captain's Hand]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Captain [[Louanne Katraine]] - Assumes position after Captain Thrace relocates to New Caprica ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]] to [[Collaborators]])
* Major Lee Adama]] ([[Torn]] to Present with the exception of demotion in [[The Passage]])
* Captain Louanne Katraine - Posthumous and symbolic promotion ([[The Passage]])

===Chief Medical Officer===
* Major Cottle ([[Miniseries]] to Present with the exception of his relocation to New Caprica)
* Unknown ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]] to [[Exodus, Part II]])

===Chief of the Deck===
* Chief Petty Officer Galen Tyrol ([[Miniseries]] to Present with the exception of his relocation to New Caprica)
* [[Peter Laird]] - Chief Tyrol replaced by battlestar ''Pegasus'' Deck Chief Laird by Admiral [[Helena Cain|Cain]] ([[Pegasus]] to [[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])
* Chief Petty Officer Galen Tyrol - Laird reassigned to ''Pegasus'' by Admiral Adama ([[Epiphanies]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Unknown - Relocates to New Caprica ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]] to [[Exodus, Part II]])
* Chief Petty Officer Galen Tyrol ([[Collaborators]] to Present)

Senior Staff of Galactica

2007-02-24T09:16:09Z

Madbrood: /* CIC */

=Present Senior Staff=
===CIC===
*Admiral [[William Adama]] - Commanding Officer
*Colonel [[Saul Tigh]] - [[Executive Officer]]
*Lieutenant [[Felix Gaeta]] - [[Tactical officer]], Senior Officer of the Watch
*Lieutenant [[Hoshi]] - [[Communications Officer]]
*Lieutenant [[Anastasia Dualla]]

===Air Group===
*Major [[Lee Adama]] - CAG ([[CAG|Commander, Air Group]])
*Captain [[Kara Thrace]]
*Lieutenant [[Margaret Edmondson]]
*Lieutenant [[Sharon Agathon]]

===Support===
*Major [[Cottle]] - [[Chief Medical Officer]]
*Captain Aaron Kelly - [[Landing Signal Officer]], Second Officer
*Chief Petty Officer [[Galen Tyrol]] - Chief of the Deck
*Gunnery Sergeant [[Erin Mathias]] - Senior [[Marine]] NCO

=Position Histories=
===Commanding Officer===
* Commander William Adama ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Scattered]])
* Colonel Saul Tigh - Assumed command after assasination attempt on Commander Adama ([[Scattered]] to [[The Farm]])
* Commander William Adama - Re-assumed command after recovering from injuries ([[The Farm]] to [[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])
* Admiral William Adama - Promoted by President [[Roslin]] ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]] to Present)

===Executive Officer===
* Colonel Saul Tigh ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Scattered]])
* Captain Arron Kelly - Assumed position upon Colonel Tigh assuming command ([[Scattered]] to [[The Farm]])
* Colonel Saul Tigh - Re-assumed postion after Commander Adama returned to duty ([[The Farm]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Captain Karl Agathon - Promoted by Admiral Adama after Colonel Tigh relocates to New Caprica ([[Occupation]] to [[Unfinished Business]])
* Colonel Saul Tigh - Re-assumed postion ([[The Passage]] to Present)

===Tactical officer===
* Lieutenant Felix Gaeta ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Captain Karl Agathon - Promoted by Admiral Adama after Lt. Gaeta relocates to New Caprica ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Unknown - Capatain Agathon is promoted to XO ([[Occupation]] to [[The Passage]])
* Lieutenant Felix Gaeta ([[The Passage]] to Present)

===Communications Officer===
*Petty Officer 2nd Class Anastasia Dualla ([[Mini-Series]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Unknown - Petty Officer Dualla is promoted to XO of [[battlestar]] [[Pegasus (RSM)|''Pegasus'']] ([[Occupation]] to [[Exodus, Part II]])
*Lieutenant Hoshi ([[Collaborators]] to Present)

===Commander, Air Group===
* Major [[Jackson Spencer]] ([[Miniseries]])
* Captain Lee Adama - Promoted after the death of Major Spencer ([[Miniseries]] to [[The Captain's Hand]])
* Captain [[George Birch]] - Temporary replacement for Lee Adama ([[Home, Part I]])
* Captain Kara Thrace - Assumes position after Captain Adama is promoted to CO of battlestar ''Pegasus''([[The Captain's Hand]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Captain [[Louanne Katraine]] - Assumes position after Captain Thrace relocates to New Caprica ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]] to [[Collaborators]])
* Major Lee Adama]] ([[Torn]] to Present with the exception of demotion in [[The Passage]])
* Captain Louanne Katraine - Posthumous and symbolic promotion ([[The Passage]])

===Chief Medical Officer===
* Major Cottle ([[Miniseries]] to Present with the exception of his relocation to New Caprica)
* Unknown ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]] to [[Exodus, Part II]])

===Chief of the Deck===
* Chief Petty Officer Galen Tyrol ([[Miniseries]] to Present with the exception of his relocation to New Caprica)
* [[Peter Laird]] - Chief Tyrol replaced by battlestar ''Pegasus'' Deck Chief Laird by Admiral [[Helena Cain|Cain]] ([[Pegasus]] to [[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])
* Chief Petty Officer Galen Tyrol - Laird reassigned to ''Pegasus'' by Admiral Adama ([[Epiphanies]] to [[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]])
* Unknown - Relocates to New Caprica ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]] to [[Exodus, Part II]])
* Chief Petty Officer Galen Tyrol ([[Collaborators]] to Present)

A Day in the Life

2007-02-19T20:37:08Z

Madbrood: /* Questions */

{{Episode Data
| title= A Day in the Life
| image= 3x15-AdamaAndWife-cropped.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 15
| guests=
| writer= [[Mark Verheiden]]
| story=
| director= [[Rod Hardy]]
| production=
| rating=
| US airdate= 2007-02-18
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population= 41,398
| prev= [[The Woman King]]
| next= [[Dirty Hands]]
}}

== Overview ==
:''[[William Adama|Adama]] faces the memory of his late wife and their marriage as he marks his wedding anniversary. Meanwhile Cally and Galen Tyrol are trapped in a depressurizing airlock with no way to leave it, and President Roslin is pushing ahead with Baltar's trial.

== Summary ==
===Teaser===
*[[Galen Tyrol]], looking haggard, is carrying a baby bottle to his small, but private accommodations for his wife, [[Cally Tyrol]] and their infant son, [[Nicholas Tyrol]].
*The Tyrols are beginning their day. While Cally was expecting a day off, Galen tells her of needed maintenance on an [[airlock]] that cannot wait. Cally is frustrated by Galen's insistance that she assist him instead of enlisting others from the deck crew.
*Admiral [[William Adama]] dreams of his late wife, [[Carolanne Adama]], at a home on [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Caprica|Caprica]]. When his quarter's intercom awakens him, Adama's grogginess shows him rising from his bunk, and Carolanne's image appears, asleep, in the bunk as well.
*Colonel [[Saul Tigh]] enters with papers to sign for needed maintenance on the ship. The XO notices the empty bunk and is quite aware that today is Adama's wedding anniversary with his [[Anne Adama|first]] wife.
*Private [[Stewart Jaffee|Jaffee]] arrives to drop off the admiral's coffee, and Adama, deep in thought with memories of his ex-wife, is unable to remember the crewman's name.
*Chief Tyrol arrives in a crew head to talk through the work schedules with his deck crew. He tells [[Seelix]] to join the Tyrols at airlock 12, an airlock located on the port aft side of ''[[Galactica|Galactica's]]'' "alligator head".
*The Tyrols enter the airlock; equipment and pallets are strewn about, and the observation deck has been unused for over a year. A previous [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylon attack]] had left this airlock unusable, and minor hull breeches here had been temporarily patched and left for a later repair.
*The Tyrols were to fix the gearing systems of the airlock's doors. As Cally tries to get Galen to discuss their marital problems, specifically Galen's desire to handle workloads as usual despite their marriage, a klaxon activates and the inner airlock doors quickly close. Seelix is confused; she didn't initiate the airlock close. She notifies the Chief of a pressure differential in the compartment; a leak has developed.
*Galen Tyrol, despite Cally's surprise, isn't fazed; he knows that the airlock closure is an automatic safety mechanism. He instructs his wife to search for the leak, knowing that the doors will open once the leak is again patched.

===Act 1===
*Adama envisions himself at his home on Caprica as Carolanne's image asks him if he is going to continue repeating events to exercise his memory.
*Carolanne's image accuses him of using his position to exalt himself and President [[Laura Roslin]].
*Roslin and Adama meet for a quick briefing. She admits that it could have been over [[wireless]] but she had to get off of [[Colonial One|her ship]]. Adama explains her mood as being "O.B.E." - overcome by events.
*Roslin suggests that [[Lee Adama]] lead the process in organizing the necessary resources for [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar's]] trial, nothing Lee's [[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II|past with just causes]] against the ''status quo'' as well as the Adama family history in [[Joseph Adama|law]]. Admiral Adama agrees to ask Lee about the matter.
*Roslin asks to stay aboard ''[[Galactica]]'' and tells Adama that she is going to the gym. Adama smiles and mentions something about the smell, to which Roslin laughs heartily.
*Pilots conduct their [[CAP]] briefing in their [[Pilot ready rooms|ready room]], chatting between themselves with some satisfaction that the Cylons haven't been seen for 49 days.
*[[Helo]] greets [[Hot Dog]], who complains about a strange rash as he scratches near his genitals. Helo smiles and, implying the questionable worthiness of a probable illicit (and inadvisable) sexual union by Hot Dog, moves a seat away from the scratching pilot. As Major [[Lee Adama]] steps up to begin his briefing, one [[Tattooed pilot|last pilot]] takes the seat next to Helo.
*Major Adama begins his pilot briefing, berating the pilots' celebration. He tells the pilots that the number "1" is all they need to remember, reminding them that it takes only 1 slip-up to begin a major disaster for the Fleet. Admiral Adama is outside of the ready room, and stands quietly and out of eyesight to anyone as he listens, with a faint level of pride appearing on his face, to his son's stern lecture.
*Carolanne's image reminds Adama to remind his son that he loves him, and not through veiled promotions and commendations.
*[[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]] sticks around for a few seconds after the pilots are dismissed to tease Major Adama about mimicking his father's ultimatum command style. The younger Adama replies that if he has to copy, it should be from the best. Admiral Adama enters the room as Starbuck leaves for her duties.
*Admiral Adama asks his son to head the legal organization processes for Baltar's trial. Major Adama is flattered and will consider the idea. He tells his father that, as a child looking through his grandfather's office and the various books strewn about, he considered a profession as a lawyer amongst his many other career considerations, something that his father never knew. The major notes that his [[CAG]] duties are 24/7 as it was, even with the Cylon down time.
*The Tyrol's patching of the breech appears to work initially, but when the pressure test is done, the new patches fail. The leak worsens greatly.

===Act 2===
*Admiral Adama has been alerted about the worsening airlock emergency with the Tyrols in airlock 12 and makes his way there with Colonel Tigh and their [[marines|marine]] escort in tow. He assesses the damage personally and later consults with his command staff in [[CIC]]. There is approximately 30 minutes of air in the lock, and the temperature is dropping considerably as frost begins to form inside the airlock.
*Major Adama notes extensive damage in the airlock that has damaged the redundancies that could manually open the door, leaving no way to open it. Tigh suggests blowing the glass in the airlock's observation deck, but Major Adama warns that the reinforced glass is designed to handle a [[tylium]] explosion, and that a detonation sufficient to blow the glass would kill the Tyrols as well. Admiral Adama is angered by the lack of options and demands more thought.
*The pilots prep for an extraordinary rescue attempt; to blow the external door, where the Tyrols, exposed to vacuum, will have to leap into [[Sharon Agathon|Athena's]] [[Raptor]]. Admiral Adama tells them what is about to happen shortly after the two don emergency breathing gear. After retrieving the Tyrols, it will take seven seconds to close the Raptor's external door and another 10 seconds to re-pressurize the rescue vessel.
*Admiral Adama, back in the observation deck, briefs the Tyrols on the rescue plan; Cally is visibly upset, and the Chief asks if a docking collar will be used, to which Adama states in the negative; there is not enough time. The Tyrols try to prep the area so that the evacuation of the airlock will not pummel them or their rescue ship with flying pallets or other equipment.
*Cally Tyrol worries who will take care of their [[Nicholas Tyrol|son]] if things go wrong. The Chief suggests that [[Anastasia Dualla]] and her husband would be suitable foster parents, but Cally knows of a reputation throughout the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]] of how orphaned children fare there. Fearing that pilots (with their hazardous life) would leave Nicky orphaned a second time, she asks Admiral Adama to give their son to [[Susan Deckler]], a civilian mother with one daughter.

===Act 3===
*The Raptor is in position, with Athena as pilot and Apollo and [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]] inside, ready to catch the two. Apollo warns everyone of shrapnel and other turbulence that will affect the mission.
*Galen Tyrol apologizes to his wife for being selfish in asking her to join him in the repair. The order was his way of wanting to have her companionship. He instructs her to hold tight as they prepare to leave the airlock.
*Admiral Adama orders the door blown. The Tyrols are flung from the airlock, and the Raptor manages to fend off debris from the door but catches the entwined Tyrols and re-pressurizes. Apollo notes the Tyrols were in rough shape but alive.
*Later, Admiral and Major Adama talk about Carolanne, who haunts the elder Adama's memory, accusing him of never being there, able to lead men but not his own family.
*Lee Adama tells his father that, after their divorce, Carolanne made many promises that she didn't keep, particularly once she took to drinking. Over time, she wouldn't apologize for her neglect in fulfilling the promises. The young Adama believes that, despite his love of his mother, he did not believe that she truly loved his father.

===Act 4===
*Seelix arrives in [[sickbay]] with baby Tyrol in her arms after retrieving him from day care. Galen Tyrol is in a bunk, resting, but exerts himself to stand and hold his son. He tells Seelix that Cally will be fine, although Dr. [[Cottle]] notes it will be some time before she is up to full strength. He slowly walks to Cally, who is recuperating inside a hyperbaric chamber to treat the effects of vacuum exposure.
*Cally Tyrol awakens to glimpse at her family. Her eyes show distress from the vacuum and she is too weak to smile, but holds her hand to the interior window. Galen presses his son's hand to the glass; Admiral Adama is nearby and has watched the entire event.
*Major Adama returns to his quarters to find his wife resting. She points to a box that his father had shipped to his quarters; the young Adama facetiously asks if the box is ticking. On inspecting it, he finds a library of Caprican criminal law books, the same ones he looked at from his grandfather's collection. The admiral leaves a note for his son.
*Admiral Adama completes yet another meeting with Laura Roslin. Adama steers the conversation back to New Caprica, specifically, their time together during then-President Baltar's [[Unfinished Business|groundbreaking ceremony and party]]. Roslin admits to [[New Caprican loco weed|feeling a little silly]] that evening.
*Adama fondly recalls her red dress and the good feelings each had that day. When Roslin laughs, Adama tells her how happy it is to see her do so. He asks her, if the Cylons hadn't attacked, if she would have built that cabin in the woods that she wanted.
*Roslin temporarily evades the question by answering that Baltar's inept leadership and New Caprica's terrain would have prevented such a building, but is pleased by Adama's attention. She asks if he would have stayed on ''Galactica'' or eventually settled himself, to which Adama evades an answer by stating that their questions were all hypothetical in any case.
*Adama, with a smile, states that the two of them have specific duties, apparently attempting to return a professional distance to what was becoming a very intimate conversation. Roslin replies, with another smile, to the affirmative.
*As she begins to leave, she tells Adama that, in a few days, she'll return to the battlestar, where they can return to their conversation and reminisce of their brief time on New Caprica and its possibilities. As she steps away, she tells Adama that she would have definitely built her cabin if time and circumstance would have allowed.
*Adama returns to his quarters, holding his wedding picture. He returns it to its storage until next year.

===Bonus Scene===
*The complete bonus scene (which was available on the [http://www.scifi.com Sci Fi Channel web site for U.S. viewers after the episode]) takes place just before Colonel Tigh visits Admiral Adama's quarters at the start of the episode.
*Lieutenants [[Felix Gaeta]] and Anastasia Dualla walk towards Adama's quarters for signatures of maintenance orders as part of their daily briefing. As he makes some notes on the orders, Gaeta volunteers the observation that President Roslin and Adama have had many meetings together recently.
*When Dualla asks what he's implying, Gaeta suggests that there might be something more intimate going on between the senior Fleet leadership. Dualla grimaces strongly at the possibility, replying that the idea of Roslin and Adama together in her head was not at all a desirable one to imagine.
*When the two think deeply and briefly of the two commanders together, both begin to laugh, and continue to do so when Colonel Tigh intercepts them and asks what was so funny.
*The two formally note their briefing, but Tigh takes the folder to deliver himself and dismisses the two back to CIC. Dualla and Gaeta's composure fails as they turn to CIC and begin laughing uncontrollably as Tigh heads to his friend's quarters, which connects to the original scene of his arrival.

== Questions ==
*Since it is not connected to the larger port [[flight pod]] and its [[hangar deck]], what would airlock 12 normally be used for?
**It is likely ''Galactica'' has a number of such airlocks for routine extra-vehicular activities such as hull repairs etc.

== Analysis ==

* The argument referenced in "[[Taking a Break From All Your Worries]]" between the Tyrols focuses on how Chief [[Galen Tyrol|Tyrol]] acts as is nothing has changed since marrying [[Cally Tyrol|Cally]], particularly as he ignores his family's needs over the needs of his job. Cally, on the other hand, is concerned about [[Nicholas Tyrol|Nicky]], and has apparently gone to great lengths to think about his future, notably when Cally asks Admiral [[William Adama|Adama]] to give Nicky to a civilian family whom she knows.
* There was much patchwork done to ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' after the [[Battle of New Caprica]]. Colonel [[Saul Tigh|Tigh]] notes that ''Galactica'' would need six months in dry dock "just for the dents", making it sound likely that ''Galactica'' would not survive another battle like New Caprica.
*The cinematic flashbacks or imaginary melding of Adama's memories of Carolanne, including recollections or imaginings of sitting with her and touching her, and what he believed she would say in the various situations of the day were curiously similar to how [[Gaius Baltar]] imagines his [[Cylon-Related Hallucinations|virtual Number Six]]. However, Adama's likelihood of being a [[Humanoid Cylon speculation|Cylon]] are practically refuted by the existence of his memories (as well as two characters, Lee Adama and Saul Tigh, who also share in the same memories).

== Notes ==
* "A Day in the Life" is also [[w:A Day in the Life|the title of a song]] by [[w:The Beatles|The Beatles]]. It is not known whether this has any particular meaning to the episode.

* There are two births that occurred between "[[The Woman King]]" and "A Day in the Life", as the population count after "The Woman King" was 41,396.

* A day care center exists on ''Galactica''.

* This is the first episode that [[Number Six]] ([[Tricia Helfer]]) and [[Gaius Baltar]] ([[James Callis]]) do not appear in any scene.

* The set used for the airlock - in particular the observation booth - is the same as for the [[Launch tube (RDM)|launch tubes]].

* In reality it is possible to survive in a vacuum for 10 to 20 seconds. The biggest danger is damage to the lungs, as the sudden pressure differential can burst the avioli. That is why a person should exhale and not hold his breath.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==

* [[Lucinda Jenney]] as [[Carolanne Adama]]
* [[Alessandro Juliani]] as Lt. [[Felix Gaeta]]
* [[Sebastian Spence]] as Lt. [[Noel Allison|Noel "Narcho" Allison]]
* [[Kandyse McClure]] as Lt. [[Anastasia Dualla]]
* [[Michael Hogan]] as Colonel [[Saul Tigh]]
* [[Aaron Douglas]] as Chief [[Galen Tyrol]]
* [[Nicki Clyne]] as Specialist [[Cally Tyrol]]
* [[Jen Halley]] as Specialist [[Seelix]]
* [[Bodie Olmos]] as Lt. [[Brendan Constanza|Brendan "Hotdog" Constanza]]
* [[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon|Karl "Helo" Agathon]]
* [[Leo Li Chiang]] as [[Tattooed pilot]]
* [[Don Thompson]] as [[Anthony Figurski]]
* Unknown as [[Nicholas Tyrol]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{Episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Mark Verheiden]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Rod Hardy]]
[[Category:RDM]]

The Woman King

2007-02-12T16:05:59Z

Madbrood: /* Questions */

{{Episode Data
| title= The Woman King
| image=TWK-1.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 14
| guests=
| writer= [[Michael Angeli]]
| story=
| director= [[Michael Rymer]]
| production= 314
| rating=
| US airdate= 2007-02-11
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population= 41,401
| prev= [[Taking a Break From All Your Worries]]
| next= [[A Day in the Life]]
}}

== Overview ==
:''[[Helo]] investigates the claims of Sagittarons that a doctor is discriminating against them by providing substandard medical care.

== Summary ==

== Questions ==
* What is the current status of the medical supplies for the Fleet?

* Were the stockpile of vaccines and medicines that ''Pegasus'' had before its destruction transferred over to the ships before the Battle of New Caprica?

* Why did Hera need the medication for a curable disease, while her blood was used to cure breast cancer for President Roslin?

* With the return of Caprica-Six's internal Baltar, does this hint that the internal Six and Baltar are deeply more connected?

* Will Caprica-Six's hallucinations of Baltar cause suspicion amongst the Colonials, who might mistake her communicating with the Cylons?

* How many civilian medical doctors are there in the Fleet?

* Where was Anders during the scene in Joe's bar?

* When did the hatred and bitterness towards the Saggitarons began in Colonial history?
**The Saggitarons had apparantly been discriminated against by the other eleven Colonies for centuries ([[Bastile Day]]).

* How different are the Saggitarons and Gemenons in regard to their religious beliefs?

* What traditions and ceremonies do the Saggitarons still practice that the rest of the Colonies had abandoned?

* Do the Saggitarons believe in the prospect of Earth and the thirteenth colony such as the Gemenons?

== Analysis ==
* This is the first major episode that featured Saggitarons in a more in-depth manner. We learn that Zarek and Dee are the exceptions to the stereotyped image of a Saggitaron.

* The Saggitarons' belief system appears to be modeled on various modern day religious sects that oppose the use of medical technology and/or are pacifist in their political views. Religious sects, such as the Jehovah Witnesses and Christian Scientists in the past have taken such views and had been highly criticized and persecuted.

* Mrs. King name possibly had been derived from Martin Luther King Jr. as Mrs. King was portrayed as an individual who wanted justice for the racism that she and her son received. It was her initial step of approaching Helo that caused the murders of her people to eventually cease.

* Similar to Baltar's internal-Six, Caprica-Six's internal Baltar appears at a moment of self-doubt and fear. Interestingly, this version of internal-Baltar seems opposed to Caprica-Six siding with the humans, while back in [[Downloaded]], he told her that he loved her so deeply once she made the decision to reach out to humanity.

* The Saggitarons appear to be the last human colony that still maintains most of its original roots from the founding of the colonies. According to the other characters such as Tigh, they still practice rituals and beliefs that are at least over 1000 years old. This may be the date when the other colonies began to let go of their religious convictions and origins.

== Notes ==
* The title doesn't literally refer to a king, but to a female character named [[King]].

* [[Bruce Davison]]'s character [[Robert|Dr. Robert]] may be a reference to a song by The Beatles entitled "Dr. Robert". The song is about a doctor who prescribes illicit drugs. The [[A Day in the Life|next episode]] also contains a Beatles reference in its title.

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==

*[[Bruce Davison]] as [[Robert|Dr. Robert]]
*[[Gabrielle Rose]] as [[King|Mrs. King]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{Episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:A to Z|Woman King, The]]
[[Category:Episode Guide|Woman King, The]]
[[Category:Episode Guide (RDM)|Woman King, The]]
[[Category:Episodes written by Michael Angeli]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Michael Rymer]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Venner/Archive 1

2007-02-09T11:46:59Z

Madbrood:

Did Roslin call Venner's name during the sequence when she threatens to have Baltar thrown out ''Galactica's'' airlock? I swear I heard her shout "Venner!" in the memorial gallery or whatever it's called right after Baltar told her about his lab assistant. [[User:Chris Buckey|Chris Buckey]] 05:33, 9 February 2007 (CST)
:Definitely sounds like Venner, but I can't see him there. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 05:46, 9 February 2007 (CST)

Talk:Taking a Break From All Your Worries/Archive 1

2007-01-30T12:39:34Z

Madbrood: /* Promo Pics */

Perhaps this episode will deal with Lee Adama's promise to build a bar for the pilots? [[User:Bochawa|bochawa]] 08:47, 12 August 2006 (CDT)Bochawa
:Then that would call for a cameo by Ted Danson. [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:07, 13 August 2006 (PDT)
:: I rather have "Norm" show up. "It's a dog eat dog world, and I'm wearing milkbone underwear." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 12:32, 19 August 2006 (CDT)

I'm glad to see EJO directing another episode. I loved Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:10, 5 October 2006 (CDT)

==Promo Pics==
Can be found [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000a3qwe here]. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:04, 7 January 2007 (CST)
:Looks like many of the scenes are in a '''bar'''. ''Ha!'' --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 18:42, 18 January 2007 (CST)
::Thoughts on the promo pics of Baltar in the Resurrection Tank? Dream? Real? Baltar going off in his own little world again?--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:41, 26 January 2007 (CST)
:::RDM said in an interview it was a dream or fantasy sequence --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 07:08, 27 January 2007 (CST)
::::Note the dead surrounding him. Yep, unless zombies are a new Cylon menace or Colonial weapon, I'd say fantasy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:59, 27 January 2007 (CST)
:::::Missed the Podcast...thanks Merciful. Maybe the Final Five are all zombies?! :)--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 17:31, 27 January 2007 (CST)
::::::ZOMBIES! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 23:59, 27 January 2007 (CST)
:::::There's been some discussion about whether the Final Five are [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Final_five mutilated]. Reminded me of that. Maybe it means something, maybe it's an in-joke, maybe they're zombies. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:16, 30 January 2007 (CST)
::::::That's exactly what I thought of when I saw that scene. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:39, 30 January 2007 (CST)

==Podcast Question==

So, these things involving Joe's Bar, Layne, and Sagitarrons, were they ideas proposed for the episode that got dropped in the writing phase, or did they film these scenes and they got cut? [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:51, 29 January 2007 (CST)

:I think most was dropped during rewrites before it was shot, but as you see there are some pieces of it left, that still work. For example Ishay is obviously shocked at what they do. Though if I recall correctly, the Sagittaron thing could become part of Baltar's trial later. I'd have to listen to it again. But so could you ;) --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 13:00, 29 January 2007 (CST)

== Baltar = Saddam ==

That was my character and visual connection.

Just a few other personal observations... The writing is hitting a new level. The last couple have seemed more sophisticated to me. One reason might be that the writers are catching the characters up on all the facts that the viewers have known for some time. The humans don't come off quite as clueless as they used to. Also, I assume that drastic time jumps are usually avoided due to fear that the viewer won't be able to keep up, but I've noticed that this episode skips over long exposition to get to the torture scenes and the finale of Rapture, the "rescue" from the planet's surface and the supernova, was all montage -- totally unusual but consistent with the stronger focus on characters.

:I don't see it. The closest historical parallel I'm aware of is [[Wikipedia:Philippe Pétain|Philippe Pétain]]. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:26, 29 January 2007 (CST)
::I just meant the look mostly, and the victim mentality. I wasn't making a historical comparison.--[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:04, 30 January 2007 (CST)
:::Visually, he sort of reminds me of The Falconer from SNL. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 01:39, 30 January 2007 (CST)

==Mary McDonnell==

Did anyone else just absolutely ''love'' her performance in this episode? Especially the "COLONEL TIGH, GET IN HERE!" part :D -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 23:42, 29 January 2007 (CST)
:She was frakkin scary. :) --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:05, 30 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:Taking a Break From All Your Worries/Archive 1

2007-01-30T05:42:38Z

Madbrood:

Perhaps this episode will deal with Lee Adama's promise to build a bar for the pilots? [[User:Bochawa|bochawa]] 08:47, 12 August 2006 (CDT)Bochawa
:Then that would call for a cameo by Ted Danson. [[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 15:07, 13 August 2006 (PDT)
:: I rather have "Norm" show up. "It's a dog eat dog world, and I'm wearing milkbone underwear." --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 12:32, 19 August 2006 (CDT)

I'm glad to see EJO directing another episode. I loved Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 13:10, 5 October 2006 (CDT)

==Promo Pics==
Can be found [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000a3qwe here]. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 18:04, 7 January 2007 (CST)
:Looks like many of the scenes are in a '''bar'''. ''Ha!'' --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 18:42, 18 January 2007 (CST)
::Thoughts on the promo pics of Baltar in the Resurrection Tank? Dream? Real? Baltar going off in his own little world again?--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:41, 26 January 2007 (CST)
:::RDM said in an interview it was a dream or fantasy sequence --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 07:08, 27 January 2007 (CST)
::::Note the dead surrounding him. Yep, unless zombies are a new Cylon menace or Colonial weapon, I'd say fantasy. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:59, 27 January 2007 (CST)
:::::Missed the Podcast...thanks Merciful. Maybe the Final Five are all zombies?! :)--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 17:31, 27 January 2007 (CST)
::::::ZOMBIES! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 23:59, 27 January 2007 (CST)

==Podcast Question==

So, these things involving Joe's Bar, Layne, and Sagitarrons, were they ideas proposed for the episode that got dropped in the writing phase, or did they film these scenes and they got cut? [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:51, 29 January 2007 (CST)

:I think most was dropped during rewrites before it was shot, but as you see there are some pieces of it left, that still work. For example Ishay is obviously shocked at what they do. Though if I recall correctly, the Sagittaron thing could become part of Baltar's trial later. I'd have to listen to it again. But so could you ;) --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 13:00, 29 January 2007 (CST)

== Baltar = Saddam ==

That was my character and visual connection.

Just a few other personal observations... The writing is hitting a new level. The last couple have seemed more sophisticated to me. One reason might be that the writers are catching the characters up on all the facts that the viewers have known for some time. The humans don't come off quite as clueless as they used to. Also, I assume that drastic time jumps are usually avoided due to fear that the viewer won't be able to keep up, but I've noticed that this episode skips over long exposition to get to the torture scenes and the finale of Rapture, the "rescue" from the planet's surface and the supernova, was all montage -- totally unusual but consistent with the stronger focus on characters.

:I don't see it. The closest historical parallel I'm aware of is [[Wikipedia:Philippe Pétain|Philippe Pétain]]. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:26, 29 January 2007 (CST)

==Mary McDonnell==

Did anyone else just absolutely ''love'' her performance in this episode? Especially the "COLONEL TIGH, GET IN HERE!" part :D -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 23:42, 29 January 2007 (CST)

Air Group

2007-01-26T17:46:33Z

Madbrood: Added tanker bird reference

An '''Air Group''' is composed of all [[Viper]] squadrons, [[Raptor]]s and [[Refueling tanker|support ships]] assigned to a [[battlestar]].

The Air Group is commanded by the battlestar's senior pilot who is known as the [[CAG|Commander, Air Group]], generally referred to as "CAG". The term Air Group is only used in the title of the CAG as in practise the Viper and Raptor force is called the Air Wing.

==See Also==
* [[Squadrons of Galactica]]
* [[Green Squadron]]
* [[Red Squadron (RDM)|Red Squadron]]
* [[Yellow Squadron]]
* [[Blue Squadron (RDM)|Blue Squadron]]

==Notes==
* The term Air Group is technically obsolete in the U.S. Air Force and Navy as Air Groups are now known as Air Wings. This is also reflected in ''Battlestar Galactica''.

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:RDM]]
[[Category:Terminology]]

Final Five

2007-01-25T16:35:48Z

Madbrood:

[[Image:Final Five.jpg|right|thumb|300px|D'Anna's vision shows five white-robed figures between each banner ([[Rapture]]) '''Note''': This picture is a production still and is in no way indicative of the identities of the Final Five.]]
The term "'''final five'''" collectively describes five of the twelve [[Cylon agent|humanoid Cylon models]] whose identity, knowledge, or existence has been deliberately or accidentally lost to the known existing seven Cylon agent models. Currently, only six of the twelve Cylon agent models are in use- the Number Three model was the first Cylon model to be [[boxed]] ([[Rapture]]). [[Caprica-Six]], when asked by Gaius Baltar about the five missing models, curtly replies that the other agents do not talk about the subject ([[Torn]]).

A [[Number Three]] copy, which [[Gaius Baltar]] calls by her human alias, [[D'Anna Biers]], repeatedly commits suicide to get glimpses of five white-cloaked beings that she believes are images of the final five. She attempts to draw what she has seen, but has difficulty in doing so ([[Hero]]).

One sketch shows what looks like two men and three women. One is a man with dark hair and a widow's peak, one is a middle aged woman with shoulder-length hair, one appears to be a woman with long hair, one appears to be a man with short, possibly thinning light hair and one appears to a young woman with very short hair. If this interpretation is accurate, that would make six male Cylon models and six female Cylon models in total ([[The Passage]]).

[[Image:FFSketches.jpg|thumb|left|Sketches of the Five.]]
Baltar's ability to see a virtual doppelganger of Caprica-Six (as well as enjoying her company in various pleasant environments) lead him to suggest that he might be using a Cylon technique known as [[projection]]. This suspicion, in turn, makes Baltar begin a personal inquiry into his own nature after allying himself with D'Anna-Three.

The two eventually make their way to the [[algae planet]], where a Colonial structure, the fabled [[Temple of Five]], awaits with possible answers ("[[The Passage]]", "[[The Eye of Jupiter]]"). When the system's dying star goes supernova a ray of light beams in through the temple. D'Anna steps into the light and suddenly finds herself back in the Opera House and before the five again. Upon seeing their faces she recognizes one of them in particular, saying in shock "YOU, forgive me I had no idea." She is then pulled back and collapses in Baltar's arms, dying before she could tell him what she saw. The identity of the person she recognized remains a mystery ([[Rapture]]).

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Cylons]]
[[Category:Cylons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Missile tubes

2007-01-24T12:31:30Z

Madbrood: /* Nuclear Ordnance */

[[Image:Missiletubes1.jpg|thumb|right|The outer doors opening on a Colonial battlestar]]

[[Galactica type battlestar|Battlestars of ''Galactica's'' class]] are armed with at least twelve '''missile tubes'''. These are located behind the bow of the battlestar, at the fore of the vessel's midsection, with the tubes' launch doors opening on the dorsal side of the hull. As the outer doors open, the missiles are moved forward into launch position by powerful hydraulic rams.

Once the missiles are loaded into the tubes and are ready to be fired, they must be armed with a target package and a point of aim. This is typically ordered by the vessel's [[William Adama|Commanding Officer]], with the order being relayed by the [[Tactical Officer]].

==Conventional Warheads==

It is likely that Colonial battlestars have the ability to launch missiles, either at ground targets or suitable spaceborne targets, armed with conventional, non-nuclear warheads.

While not strictly the same type of ordnance, [[Valkyrie|other battlestars]] have been seen to fire ship-to-ship missiles ([[Hero]]). From this point, it seems likely that other, non-nuclear missiles exist for orbital bombardments as well.

==Nuclear Ordnance==

[[Image:Galactica nukes.jpg|thumb|right|Nuclear Groundstrike Missiles being moved into firing position]]

With nuclear ground strike missiles loaded in the tubes and ready to launch with the appropriate target information, the command authority must then specifically authorize the release of such weapons.

Following authorization, the safety protocols on both the launch systems and the warheads themselves are disabled by the Tactical Officer, following the CO's order.

The two most senior officers aboard ship, usually the Commanding Officer and the [[XO|Executive Officer]], then input their firing codes. The final stage is for the firing key to be insterted into the master control console and turned, thus initiating the launch sequence. The order to fire is given by the CO.

== Notes ==

*While the release of biological and chemical weapons are normally illegal for the Colonial Fleet and requires a presidential mandate ([[A Measure of Salvation]]), the release of nuclear ordnance, even used against planets and not just in space, does not seem to require presidential approval ([[The Eye of Jupiter]]).

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Missile tubes

2007-01-24T12:29:04Z

Madbrood: Updated nuclear firing sequence

[[Image:Missiletubes1.jpg|thumb|right|The outer doors opening on a Colonial battlestar]]

[[Galactica type battlestar|Battlestars of ''Galactica's'' class]] are armed with at least twelve '''missile tubes'''. These are located behind the bow of the battlestar, at the fore of the vessel's midsection, with the tubes' launch doors opening on the dorsal side of the hull. As the outer doors open, the missiles are moved forward into launch position by powerful hydraulic rams.

Once the missiles are loaded into the tubes and are ready to be fired, they must be armed with a target package and a point of aim. This is typically ordered by the vessel's [[William Adama|Commanding Officer]], with the order being relayed by the [[Tactical Officer]].

==Conventional Warheads==

It is likely that Colonial battlestars have the ability to launch missiles, either at ground targets or suitable spaceborne targets, armed with conventional, non-nuclear warheads.

While not strictly the same type of ordnance, [[Valkyrie|other battlestars]] have been seen to fire ship-to-ship missiles ([[Hero]]). From this point, it seems likely that other, non-nuclear missiles exist for orbital bombardments as well.

==Nuclear Ordnance==

[[Image:Galactica nukes.jpg|thumb|right|Nuclear Groundstrike Missiles being moved into firing position]]

With nuclear ground strike missiles loaded in the tubes and ready to launch with the appropriate target information, the command authority must then specifically authorize the release of such weapons.

Following authorization, the safety protocols on both the launch systems and the warheads themselves are disabled by the Tactical Officer, following the CO's order.

The final stage is for the two most senior officers aboard ship, usually the Commanding Officer and the [[XO|Executive Officer]], to input their firing codes. With this completed, the missiles are ready for launch against their target.

== Notes ==

*While the release of biological and chemical weapons are normally illegal for the Colonial Fleet and requires a presidential mandate ([[A Measure of Salvation]]), the release of nuclear ordnance, even used against planets and not just in space, does not seem to require presidential approval ([[The Eye of Jupiter]]).

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas]]
[[Category:Galactica Areas (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Rapture/Archive 1

2007-01-24T12:23:59Z

Madbrood: /* Dualla's partner? */

== Photo ==

I think it's time to replace Universal logo with a promotional photo. The question is: with which one? My vote goes [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/pic/000t5fg5/g282 here]. -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 05:36, 23 December 2006 (CST)
:Ditto. Make sure it's uploaded to the Media wiki properly first. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:11, 23 December 2006 (CST)
::It already is. Its used on the [[Final five]] page. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:06, 23 December 2006 (CST)
:::Ever notice how prevalent the Universal logo is on all of their products? It's particularly annoying when watching the Season One DVDs. They finally started cutting it from in front of individual episodes on the 2.5 discs. The logo is down-right... universal. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 08:51, 8 January 2007 (CST)

(referring to the picture) So this is where some of the members of the Grey Council went after Delenn dissolved it... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 18:11, 31 December 2006 (CST)
:Yeah. Better gig. Far more lighting. Sexier minions to grovel at your feet, too. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 01:22, 1 January 2007 (CST)
::Mmm. Minions. The twenty-first cannot come soon enough. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 08:49, 8 January 2007 (CST)
:::13 days, 10 hours, 31 minutes :( --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 10:28, 8 January 2007 (CST)

== My Predictions ==

Here's what I think we'll see tonight:
*Helo kills Athena so she can download and get Hera from the Cylons.
*Dualla goes Starbuck-hunting with Anders. They fall for each other, thus neatly wrapping up the Starbuck/Apollo/Anders/Dee love rectangle.
*Bill Adama nukes the bejeezus out of the algae planet. Chief, Cally, Barolay, and Bendis die. Everyone else makes it out on a heavy raider.
*The Final Five: Starbuck, Anders, Billy, Johnny Five, and Galvatron.
*Guest appearances by the SuicideGirls.

All of the above predictions are pulled directly from the darkest reaches of my rectum and should not be taken seriously. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 14:17, 21 January 2007 (CST)
: 1st idea: might actually possibly work even though it won't happen. 2nd: Good idea, actually. 3rd: Naw. 4th: Bahahahahaha. 5th: I wish. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 14:34, 21 January 2007 (CST)
:As they say on the forums, Galvatron ftw. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 15:57, 21 January 2007 (CST)
:Slander, I have an idea to make it even better. Option 3, take the "it" out of the 3rd sentence. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 16:26, 21 January 2007 (CST)
::Anders and Apollo making out? Hey, it could happen. They're both very pretty and Bamber is English. That's close enough to being a girl. And, hey, we'd get to see the inside of a heavy raider. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 17:46, 21 January 2007 (CST)
:::HOLY FRAK, SLANDER! HOW DID YOU KNOW?! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:09, 21 January 2007 (CST)
::::Chamalla tastes good with Swiss Miss. (Also, the Final Five member that D'anna apologizes to? Totally Galvatron.) --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 08:34, 22 January 2007 (CST)
:::::Also also, how'd y'all like those SuicideGirls cameos? Eh? Eh? --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 08:36, 22 January 2007 (CST)
::::::The Final Five person D'anna talked to was Galvatron, the other 4 were SuicideGirls. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 08:42, 22 January 2007 (CST)
: I bow down to Slander. I bet the writers were cackling for weeks after they came up with that idea.--[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:46, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== Concerning religion of the cylons and the colonies ==

Keeping Ron Moore's twists and turns from the original series I would like to suggest that
the Lords of Kobol and the "jealous" god, are for all intensive purposes the Cylons. They
are modeled after and therefore more directly linked to the deities say than Adama is "being Zeus" among the humans.
So much so that specific units have become avatars, perhaps posessed of a lord or at the very least
evolving an actual soul in likeness of a lord.

12 cylons = 12 olympians
Final Five - Temple of Five

The mystery of the final five hints to them being something other
that the existing models. Perhaps these five could not be replicated
like the others because of their conflict with the cylon god.

Clearly a more human "being" is developing in Deana in her search for enlightenment,
in Caprica in her search for Love and in Sharon in her self acceptance.
With Deanna the search for enlightenment became so overpweing
the entire line was boxed. With Sharon it's almost as if the humanity
Boomer clung to has moved to Agathon. Boomer is not the woman that
would not leave her human apartment after resurrecting,
but both have in their own fashion esentially accepted who they are.
Caprica appears in a constant state of conflict that many humans will relate to,
while her etherial counterpart is the self assured herald of her cylon maker.

For all the pagan references in the original series we still had Count Iblis
and the ship of lights taking on very familliar christan concepts of angels
and satan. Nothing is ever quite that black and white in the reimagined series.

While the reference has been fleeting, the notion of a god outside the
Lords of Kobol is clear, and he would be the cylons god. Dodona Selloi seems to refer to the cylon god as nothing more or less than a lord of kobol.
My thought is that somehow this jealous god has sort of ensnared the likeness perhaps even conciousness of the lords
in creating the cylon race, so closely that single copies become avatars of the lords.
The final five could be so possesed that they are not part of the cylon race,
refusing the mechanations of the cylon god. Others an avatar is what we see developing
in Sharon, Deanna and Caprica.

And even the cylon god, the Count Iblis whose voice was that of the imperious leader in the original series
has a model: Brother Cavel. Cavel is horribly wicked, he is always urging his fellow cylons
to the most horrific of actions. He appears out of nowhwere all the time. And yet, strangely,
he seems to honor the importance of free will in his dealings with his brother cylons, something you would expect of an
Abrahamic god. He's not Satan then who would rather rule in hell than serve in heaven,
he is just far more satanic or evil than any characterization offered by a member of
a known pantheon of gods.

Yet another twist, If the Abrahmic god were competing with beings like himself (greek gods), how satanic might he appear?
An abrahamic god accepts free will: I can't make you worship me.
But is flawed like miltons Satan, if you don't worship me , your damned.
Satans flaw in paradise lost was saying better to rull in hell than serve in
heaven. What he should have said was better to live free on earth not rule in hell.
So Cavel is a marvelous blend of an Abrahamic God & Satan floating through
space in a base ship with 7 of 12 would be Olympians. Caprica Aphrodite, Sharon Athena
and Deanna Hestia?. Starbuck/Artemis is the next to come forward?
Adama and Laura and Zeus and Hera? two reason for two of the final five to stay where they are.
They have human avatars leading the fleet. Three male cylons just go with the flow,
well the male gods were always kind of boring anyway. At least if your a fan of Wonder Woman.

The twist from original series to re-imagined series are always surprising and wonderful
in many ways. In the world of Sci Fi televison, the original Galactica made huge advances
by considering the existence of higher beings. Where would the Ancients of Stargate or the Vorlons
of Babylon be without Battlestar Galactica? Will we see actual communion with higher beings
in the re-imagined series? I don't expect to. It would gnaw at the the gritty realism of the show.

The idea of this entire exodus from the colonies seeking earth, unifying to a new Kobol, then breaking off back to earth and the colonies
over and over seems entirely plausible. Gods are at the very least real in a metaphoirical sense and 12 cylon
models living in peace with a vast race of humans on new a Kobol in the end sounds far more believeable
than actual gods and godesses.
{{unsigned|Mevenstar}}

: The was a good read.--[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:48, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== Dualla's partner? ==

The summary mentions Dualla's partner being an unnamed civvie, but I thought it looked like Sergeant Fischer (Aleks Paunovic). I'll check the Sadgeezer transcript (as soon as it is posted). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:26, 23 January 2007 (CST)
:Not sure if it was Fisher, but I think he's one of the marines for sure --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 05:05, 24 January 2007 (CST)
::I'm pretty sure Dee says "Sarge?" after he gets shot. I could be wrong though. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:23, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== Sooner Rather Than / Or Later? ==

*The Cylons are relieved as well, but after the Three in the command room leaves in satisfaction, the others realize that the Cylon, a race predicated on consensus and not defiance or distinctive personality clashes, have a serious problem. A [[Cavil]] voices that the Threes are out of control, and that a decision regarding their actions must be made, sooner or later.

I recalled that line as "sooner, rather than later," implying that the other models were already considering boxing the Threes. Am I loosing my mind, or did I hear that right? --[[User:Saiboogu|Saiboogu]] 01:35, 24 January 2007 (CST)

::That's what I heard too. Or "maybe sooner, rather than later". --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:41, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== Multiple Cavil's? ==

Ron Moore mentions in the podcast that the fx crew were going to insert a shot of a Cavil in front of all of the Deanna pods. Just as he boxes her in the closeup all the others box all the other Deanna models in the long shot. But I don't believe there were any Cavil's in the long shot. Did anyone notice? --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:44, 24 January 2007 (CST)
: It looked like there were other Cavils doing the same thing to all the other Threes in the wide shot that ended the episode. It is rather interesting that Cavil's normally not among the models who participates in a post-resurrection midwifing, yet he's the only one there when a boxing takes place, no? --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 02:04, 24 January 2007 (CST)
:To me it looked like a lot of Cavil-activity too. If (as many people here believe) Cavil is Number Two, then his actions in this episode make perfect sense. He's the one who confronts D'Anna in the temple and almost kills her, he's the one who proposes boxing the Threes in the first place, and he's the one who ends up actually doing it. If Cavil is either Two or Four, he'd be the representative of the remaining Cylons and it would make sense for him to go on a boxing spree. Also, if Cavil is Two, he wouldn't want his 'leadership' status (as far as he has any; he didn't protest against the majority decision to attack the Colonies) threatened by the revelation of Number One (who I believe to be among the Final Five). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 03:39, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== Deanna Recognition ==

Which of the main characters has Deanna had significant interactions with? Other than Baltar.--[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:47, 24 January 2007 (CST)
: Fleet-D'Anna from Final Cut interacted with Roslin, Adama, Tigh, and Lee. As for Downloaded/Final Five-D'Anna, it's just been Baltar, Doc Cottle and Anders, who she was a righteous bitch to and nearly killed by the way. --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 02:07, 24 January 2007 (CST)
:: I thought Fleet-D'Anna was Final Five-D'anna --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 05:41, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== Boxing the Threes ==

There is discussion around here about just how they boxed the entire Three line, so here's my idea:
*Send all your Cavils to the Resurrection Ship's Three Deck.
*Reprogram the Centurions to forget the Threes are Cylons.
*Have the Centurions fire upon all Threes they can find in the fleet. (Resurrection Ship's gonna work overtime on that)
*Have your Cavils box the downloaded Threes.
Any alternative ideas, anyone? --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 03:44, 24 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:ITunes/Archive 1

2007-01-19T17:47:30Z

Madbrood: /* UK downloads? */

Where is Season Three on Itunes? {{unsigned|Micho norvan}}
:They probably will be a week or two behind the original aurdate on TV. Dont forget to sign your comments on talk pages using the four tildes <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 04:37, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== ITunes Statistics ==

Any statistics available about how many episodes are purchased from ITunes? [[User:Huh?|Huh?]] 11:52, 14 October 2006 (CDT)

:This information may be available as part of Apple's quarterly financial statement, coming next week. However, I doubt it will break out the individual purchases for ''Battlestar'' or any other product. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:38, 14 October 2006 (CDT)

==Rename and Expand==
See [[ITunes Videos/New]] for my initial changes. I feel that we should rename the article to be simply [[iTunes]] (is it possible now to have lowercase first letters in the title, [[w:iTunes|wikipedia does it]]) now that we are affiliated with them for the videos. I also feel that the page could be expanded to have a little more information and have a select few "download miniseries" small button type images. I also expect a "download episode" button to be placed on the episode pages but that goes beyond the scope of this article for the moment. Any furthar comments? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 10:55, 18 January 2007 (CST)
:Looks good. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:06, 18 January 2007 (CST)
::A redirect will do for it, I think, since either should best point a curious person. It does look good. You might want to also add the Original Series as well, which is now available. (No Galactica 1980, but that's probably out of mercy...) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:34, 18 January 2007 (CST)
:::Looks good. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 11:35, 18 January 2007 (CST)

Do they accept paypal? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 05:46, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:You can buy gift certificates using paypal which give you X amount of songs but as far as i know you cant buy individual songs on demand with it.--[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:17, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:Tell a lie... you can use paypal properly https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=xpt/general/UsePaypalOnITunes-outside --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:18, 19 January 2007 (CST)

==Images==
A template would be created something similar to this '''<nowiki>{{iTunes|imagetype|linkid}}</nowiki>''' so that the correct icon shows for whatever it is that you are linking to and the affiliate id is locked away in the template so people cannot mess with it. Here are my image ideas (also in use on /new/ page)
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Subscribe.png]] Used to subscribe to the entire podcast
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Get-podcast.png]] Used to link to individual poscasts
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Buy-series.png]] Used to purchase an entire series (Miniseries, TOS etc)
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Buy-episode.png]] Used on the episode pages in the infobox to link to individual episode purchase
--[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:55, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:We also need "Download episode" for free content. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 10:44, 19 January 2007 (CST)
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Get-episode.png]] Used for free video content
--[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:47, 19 January 2007 (CST)

== iTunes links ==

These links need to be verified first before being deployed. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 09:32, 19 January 2007 (CST)
: Oh, and yes, the episode links may be somewhat out of episode order... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:04, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:: What's the "code" pattern? [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:08, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::: Seems to be: <nowiki>http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%</nowiki> -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:11, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::::Oh, is that all? Wow. Would that be a field we'd need to manually update in the episode data box? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:14, 19 January 2007 (CST)
=== Podcasts ===

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewPodcast%253Fid%253D73329453%2526partnerId%253D30 Ron D. Moore's Podcast]
* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewPodcast%253Fid%253D73330558%2526partnerId%253D30 Alan Light - The Combat Information Center]
* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewPodcast%253Fid%253D193246391%2526partnerId%253D30 Galactica Watercooler]

=== Episodes ===

==== TOS ====

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477666%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 1]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477537%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Saga of a Star World, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477543%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Saga of a Star World, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477547%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Saga of a Star World, Part III]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477525%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lost Planet of the Gods, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477530%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lost Planet of the Gods, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477553%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Lost Warrior]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477549%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Long Patrol]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477532%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Gun on Ice Planet Zero, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477534%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Gun on Ice Planet Zero, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477556%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 the Magnificent Warriors]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477563%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Living Legend, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477565%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Living Legend, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477561%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Fire in Space]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477551%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Young Lords]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477644%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 War of the Gods, Part I]]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477664%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 War of the Gods, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477558%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Man with Nine Lives]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477666%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Murder on the Rising Star]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477671%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Greetings from Earth, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477714%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Greetings from Earth, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477676%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Baltar's Escape]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477683%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Experiment in Terra]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477690%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Take the Celestra]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477698%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Hand of God]

==== RDM ====

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232216%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 1]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232143%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 33]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232147%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Water]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232149%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Bastille Day]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232151%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Act of Contrition]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232154%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 You Can't Go Home Again]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232165%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Six Degrees of Separation]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232159%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Litmus]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232211%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Hand of God]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232202%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Flesh and Bone]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232205%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232216%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Colonial Day]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232241%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232252%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]
* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232318%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 2]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232256%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Scattered]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232258%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Valley of Darkness]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232260%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Fragged]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232304%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Farm]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232262%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Resistance]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232306%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Home, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232313%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Home, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232318%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Final Cut]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232345%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Flight of the Phoneix]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232347%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Pegasus] (broadcast version, which is the only version available through iTunes)
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D115069189%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Resurrection Ship, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D117738514%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Resurrection Ship, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119312572%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Epiphanies]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951212%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Black Market]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951238%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Sacrifice]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951236%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Scar]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951242%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Captain's Hand]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951257%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Downloaded]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951379%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951381%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931471%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 3]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D197746313%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 <s>Occupice</s> Occupation/Precipice]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D201951606%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Exodus, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D202744902%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Exodus, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203360080%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Collaborators]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931476%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 A Measure of Salvation]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931471%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Torn]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931491%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Hero]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D205359970%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Passage]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D205359967%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Unfinished Business]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D205359974%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Eye of Jupiter]

==UK downloads?==

Anyone have any idea when the episodes will be available on the UK iTunes? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:23, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:No idea. Apple havn't made any announcements about showing TV shows on the UK iTunes Store. They seem to be testing the waters with the Pixar short videos but there are no plans as yet to roll out TV shows properly like they do in the US. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:43, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::For '''frak's''' sake :( This upsets my calm. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:47, 19 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:ITunes/Archive 1

2007-01-19T17:23:20Z

Madbrood:

Where is Season Three on Itunes? {{unsigned|Micho norvan}}
:They probably will be a week or two behind the original aurdate on TV. Dont forget to sign your comments on talk pages using the four tildes <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 04:37, 9 October 2006 (CDT)

== ITunes Statistics ==

Any statistics available about how many episodes are purchased from ITunes? [[User:Huh?|Huh?]] 11:52, 14 October 2006 (CDT)

:This information may be available as part of Apple's quarterly financial statement, coming next week. However, I doubt it will break out the individual purchases for ''Battlestar'' or any other product. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:38, 14 October 2006 (CDT)

==Rename and Expand==
See [[ITunes Videos/New]] for my initial changes. I feel that we should rename the article to be simply [[iTunes]] (is it possible now to have lowercase first letters in the title, [[w:iTunes|wikipedia does it]]) now that we are affiliated with them for the videos. I also feel that the page could be expanded to have a little more information and have a select few "download miniseries" small button type images. I also expect a "download episode" button to be placed on the episode pages but that goes beyond the scope of this article for the moment. Any furthar comments? --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 10:55, 18 January 2007 (CST)
:Looks good. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 11:06, 18 January 2007 (CST)
::A redirect will do for it, I think, since either should best point a curious person. It does look good. You might want to also add the Original Series as well, which is now available. (No Galactica 1980, but that's probably out of mercy...) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:34, 18 January 2007 (CST)
:::Looks good. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 11:35, 18 January 2007 (CST)

Do they accept paypal? [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 05:46, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:You can buy gift certificates using paypal which give you X amount of songs but as far as i know you cant buy individual songs on demand with it.--[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:17, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:Tell a lie... you can use paypal properly https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=xpt/general/UsePaypalOnITunes-outside --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:18, 19 January 2007 (CST)

==Images==
A template would be created something similar to this '''<nowiki>{{iTunes|imagetype|linkid}}</nowiki>''' so that the correct icon shows for whatever it is that you are linking to and the affiliate id is locked away in the template so people cannot mess with it. Here are my image ideas (also in use on /new/ page)
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Subscribe.png]] Used to subscribe to the entire podcast
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Get-podcast.png]] Used to link to individual poscasts
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Buy-series.png]] Used to purchase an entire series (Miniseries, TOS etc)
* [[Image:Apple-iTunes-Buy-episode.png]] Used on the episode pages in the infobox to link to individual episode purchase
--[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 06:55, 19 January 2007 (CST)

:We also need "Download episode" for free content. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 10:44, 19 January 2007 (CST)

== iTunes links ==

These links need to be verified first before being deployed. Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 09:32, 19 January 2007 (CST)
: Oh, and yes, the episode links may be somewhat out of episode order... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:04, 19 January 2007 (CST)
:: What's the "code" pattern? [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 10:08, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::: Seems to be: <nowiki>http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%</nowiki> -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 10:11, 19 January 2007 (CST)
::::Oh, is that all? Wow. Would that be a field we'd need to manually update in the episode data box? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:14, 19 January 2007 (CST)
=== Podcasts ===

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewPodcast%253Fid%253D73329453%2526partnerId%253D30 Ron D. Moore's Podcast]
* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewPodcast%253Fid%253D73330558%2526partnerId%253D30 Alan Light - The Combat Information Center]
* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewPodcast%253Fid%253D193246391%2526partnerId%253D30 Galactica Watercooler]

=== Episodes ===

==== TOS ====

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477666%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 1]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477537%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Saga of a Star World, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477543%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Saga of a Star World, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477547%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Saga of a Star World, Part III]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477525%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lost Planet of the Gods, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477530%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lost Planet of the Gods, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477553%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Lost Warrior]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477549%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Long Patrol]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477532%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Gun on Ice Planet Zero, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477534%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Gun on Ice Planet Zero, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477556%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 the Magnificent Warriors]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477563%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Living Legend, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477565%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Living Legend, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477561%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Fire in Space]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477551%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Young Lords]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477644%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 War of the Gods, Part I]]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477664%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 War of the Gods, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477558%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Man with Nine Lives]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477666%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Murder on the Rising Star]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477671%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Greetings from Earth, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477714%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Greetings from Earth, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477676%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Baltar's Escape]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477683%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Experiment in Terra]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477690%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Take the Celestra]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D208477698%2526id%253D205801820%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Hand of God]

==== RDM ====

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232216%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 1]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232143%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 33]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232147%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Water]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232149%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Bastille Day]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232151%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Act of Contrition]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232154%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 You Can't Go Home Again]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232165%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Six Degrees of Separation]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232159%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Litmus]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232211%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Hand of God]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232202%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Flesh and Bone]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232205%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232216%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Colonial Day]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232241%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232252%2526id%253D102796450%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]
* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232318%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 2]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232256%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Scattered]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232258%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Valley of Darkness]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232260%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Fragged]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232304%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Farm]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232262%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Resistance]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232306%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Home, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232313%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Home, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232318%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Final Cut]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232345%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Flight of the Phoneix]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D102232347%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Pegasus] (broadcast version, which is the only version available through iTunes)
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D115069189%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Resurrection Ship, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D117738514%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Resurrection Ship, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119312572%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Epiphanies]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951212%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Black Market]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951238%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Sacrifice]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951236%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Scar]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951242%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Captain's Hand]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951257%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Downloaded]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951379%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D119951381%2526id%253D102808898%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]

* [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931471%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Season 3]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D197746313%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 <s>Occupice</s> Occupation/Precipice]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D201951606%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Exodus, Part I]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D202744902%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Exodus, Part II]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203360080%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Collaborators]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931476%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 A Measure of Salvation]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931471%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Torn]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D203931491%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Hero]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D205359970%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Passage]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D205359967%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 Unfinished Business]
** [http://click.linksynergy.com/fs-bin/stat?id=VWbyALbmqZY&offerid=78941&type=3&subid=0&tmpid=1826&RD_PARM1=http%253A%252F%252Fphobos.apple.com%252FWebObjects%252FMZStore.woa%252Fwa%252FviewTVSeason%253Fi%253D205359974%2526id%253D200852806%2526s%253D143441%2526partnerId%253D30 The Eye of Jupiter]

==UK downloads?==

Anyone have any idea when the episodes will be available on the UK iTunes? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:23, 19 January 2007 (CST)

Small arms

2007-01-15T20:36:33Z

Madbrood: Removed the SA-80's "another real weapon..." - they're ALL real weapons

{{NPOV}}

Not much description has been given about the small arms that are seen in the re-imagined ''Battlestar Galactica'', but, based on what is seen, some of the firearms that the Colonial forces carry are real firearms that are in current use.

==Handguns==
[[Image:Sidearm Flightofthephoenix.JPG|thumb|left|[[Lee Adama|Apollo]], [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]], and [[Brendan Constanza|Hotdog]] on the [[firing range]] with FN Five-seveNs]]
The standard-issue Colonial sidearm (seen used in the [[Miniseries]], etc.) is according to RDM's commentary supposed to be an exact replica of the (fictional) sidearm used in [[Wikipedia:Blade Runner|Blade Runner]] (also starring [[Edward James Olmos]]). The standard service handgun used by the Colonial forces appears to be a modernized version of the [[Wikipedia:LeMat|LeMat revolver]] of the US Civil War, with a revolver-like pistol grip and a large barrel beneath the primary barrel. From closer examination of the handgun, it appears that the handgun that was in the Miniseries and Season 1 of the re-imagined series of ''Battlestar Galactica'' was built around a [[Wikipedia:Smith & Wesson | Smith & Wesson]] K-Frame or L-Frame revolver. This sidearm is nicknamed the "Colonial Clamshell" by a propmaster in David Eick's 18th video blog.

It seems that, in the second season the original sidearms have been nearly completely replaced by the [[Wikipedia:Five-seveN|Fabrique Nationale Five-seveN]], also dressed up with an underbarrel explosive launcher. (This changeover allows for real semi-automatic fire and makes use of the existing stores of 5.7 x 28 mm (FN P-90) blank ammunition).

The [[Wikipedia:HK P9|Heckler & Koch P9]] is seen, along with an [http://www.weapon.envy.nu/gun/int.html Intratec Cat-9] ([[Colonial Day]]).

The [http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg54-e.htm Vektor CP1] has also made an appearence ([[Bastille Day]], [[Black Market]], [[Sacrifice]], etc.); this is odd given a safety recall issued in 2000.

Samuel Anders has been seen on with the [[Wikipedia:MK23 Mod 0|Heckler & Koch Mark 23]], a variant of the [[Wikipedia:Heckler & Koch USP|USP]], ([[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]) and the Israeli [[Wikipedia:Desert Eagle|Desert Eagle]] ([[Downloaded]]).

The Russian-made [[Wikipedia:Makarov PM|Makarov PM]] handgun and the Russian-made Stechkin APS handgun have made an appearance in the Season 2 episode "[[Sacrifice]]".

The [[Stallion]] appears in the episode, "[[Home, Part II]]". Based on the COP 357 Derringer <ref>{{cite_web|url=http://www.kitsune.addr.com/Firearms/Single-Shot-Pistols/COP_357.htm|title=COP 357 Derringer|date=|accessdate=|last=|first=|format=HTML|language=en}}</ref>, designed as a police off-duty/backup weapon, this four shot derringer fires .357 Magnum rounds. The name "Stallion" may be a production in-joke on the Marushin's model name, "COP 357", whose name is shared in part with the ubiquitous ''Colt'' .357 handgun.

==Submachine guns==

One of the real firearms that was seen on a regular basis in ''Battlestar Galactica'''s first season is the Belgian [[Wikipedia:FN_P90|Fabrique Nationale P90 submachine gun]] which is seen in the hands of the Colonal security forces and [[Marines]] of ''Galactica''. The weapon is notable for its unusual 5.7x28 round, designed to pierce body armor. Its unusual magazine placement and design (resting on top with rounds perpendicular to the barrel) means each cartridge is rotated 90 degrees as it is fed.

The FN P90 submachine gun has also been seen in other science fiction shows like [[Wikipedia:Stargate SG-1|''Stargate SG-1'']] and [[Wikipedia:Stargate Atlantis|''Stargate Atlantis'']] (which are also filmed in Vancouver alongside ''Battlestar Galactica'').

In season two, the P90 was replaced by a different weapon (see Rifles and Carbines).

[[Image:UMP Skorpion Resistance.JPG|thumb|Thrace's Skorpions and Anders's UMP ([[Resistance]])]]
Another real-life submachine guns that made an appearance is the German [[Wikipedia:HK UMP|Heckler & Koch UMP]]. In the episode "[[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]", [[Samuel Anders]] is seen armed with one. Other weapons seen this episode are the Czech [[Wikipedia:Skorpion|Skorpion machine pistol]], wielded akimbo by Starbuck, and the American [[Wikipedia:Ruger MP9|Ruger MP9]] being wielded by Helo when the two characters encounter Samuel Anders and his resistance fighters. 
The Skorpion is also carried by Chief Tyrol during the [[Battle of New Caprica]] ([[Exodus, Part II]]).

The [[Wikipedia:Beretta Model 12|Beretta Model 12]] submachine gun is used by Anders's resistance fighters.

In "[[A Measure of Salvation]]", both Major [[Lee Adama|Adama]] and Gunnery Sergeant [[Erin Mathias|Mathias]] appear to be armed with Heckler & Koch [[Wikipedia:MP7|MP7A1]] Personal Defence Weapons, mounted with ELCAN C79 optical sights. The MP7A1 and C79 sight are further examples of weaponry and equipment seen in ''Stargate SG-1''. Additionally, the fighters on the [[algae planet]], including [[Lee Adama]] and Anders, are equipped with the MP7 and sight combination ([[Rapture]]).

==Shotguns==

Another real firearm seen in the first season of the re-imagined series of ''Battlestar Galactica'' is the American [[Wikipedia:Mossberg 500|Mossberg 500]] pump-action shotgun, specifically a 12-gauge bullpup variant, seen in the episode "[[Bastille Day]]" in the hands of the prisoners on the prison ship ''[[Astral Queen]]'' after they overwhelmed the guards and took control of the ship. None of the bullpup variants are available anymore as of 2006.

The [[Wikipedia:DAO-12|Protecta/Striker shotgun]] is used in "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]", "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II|Part II]]" and "[[Home]]". This is the weapon with the drum magazine which Boomer uses to save Apollo's life on Kobol. It is frequently featured in many Hollywood movies due to its distinctive appearance.

A short-barrelled pump action shotgun (which closely resembles the [[Wikipedia:Ithaca 37|Ithaca Model 37 pump-action shotgun]]) with forward pistol grip is used by the bartender in the deleted flashback scenes in "[[Scattered]]".

==Rifles and Carbines==

The British [[Wikipedia:SA-80|SA-80 bullpup assault rifle]] is carried by a Colonial military honor guard at Zak Adama's funeral in "[[Act of Contrition]]". The [[Wikipedia:SA-80|SA-80]] is the current, standard-issue infantry rifle of the British armed forces and has been in British military service since 1985. 
The SA-80s in "Act of Contrition" appear to be without the standard, [[Wikipedia:British Army | British Army]] issue [[Wikipedia: SUSAT | SUSAT]] telescopic sight, and the iron foresight and rear-sight/carry handle are not in use despite the fact that SA-80s without the SUSAT sight are seen with the foresight and rear-sight/carry handle unfolded and in use. In "[[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]" and "[[The Farm]]", the resistance fighters on Caprica are armed with SA-80s alongside other firearms. The SA-80s used by the resistance fighters in these two episodes appear to have SUSAT sights fitted on the rifles.

[[Image:Cx4Storm.jpg|thumb|right|Baltar with a Beretta Cx4 Storm carbine ([[Fragged]]).]]
Starbuck uses an Italian [[Wikipedia:Beretta Cx4 Storm|Beretta Cx4 Storm carbine]] to shoot at [[Tom Zarek]] on the ''Astral Queen'' ([[Bastille Day]]). In "[[Fragged]]", [[Gaius Baltar]], Chief Tyrol, the others stranded on Kobol, and various Colonial Marines throughout the series are armed with them as well. (It is probable that the Cx4 has replaced the P-90 as the standard Colonial longarm in the series' production, most likely due to the P-90s already extensive usage on ''Stargate SG-1'' and ''Stargate Atlantis''). 
The Cx4s that are seen in ''Battlestar Galactica'' are fitted with specially-made accessories which go the length of the exposed barrel. Aside from this, the carbines are fitted with real-life tactical lights and AimPoint Red-Dot scopes.

Besides automatic and semi-automatic rifles, one of the resistance fighters on Caprica in the episode "Resistance" is armed with a bolt-action rifle. From the look of its action, the rifle appears to be an American [[Wikipedia:Remington 700|Remington Model 700]] fitted with a Choate Ultimate Sniper/Target tactical rifle stock and a third-party telescopic sight. It is possible that the bolt-action rifle is a standard-issue Colonial military sniper rifle (possibly [[Colonial Marine Corps]] issue) since Anders and his resistance fighters raided Colonial military armories on Caprica for firearms, ammunition and other weapons to fight the Cylons.

In the episodes "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]" and "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II|Part II]]", Starbuck is seen using a [[Wikipedia:Heckler & Koch G36|Heckler & Koch G36K]] while at the same time, a member of the resistance is using a [[Wikipedia:AK-47|Kalashnikov]]-type rifle. The Kalashnikov-type rifle that is seen in the hands of Anders' resistance fighters on Caprica in "Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II" and in a few episodes of Season 3 in the hands of one of the members of the New Caprica Resistance is a Chinese-made, NORINCO Type 84S rifle chambered in 5.56mm NATO/.223 Remington.

In the Miniseries, the Colonial security personnel on ''Galactica'' are armed with a bullpup assault rifle. It bears a resemblance to a short-barreled [[Wikipedia: FAMAS|FAMAS]] with a [[Wikipedia:Picatinny rail|Picatinny rail]] mount. This rifle was actually designed by Masamune Shirow for the Ghost in the Shell series, it is known as the [http://www.poseidon.co.jp/5F/9wepon/9wepon_1.html CZN-M22 "Nine-Weapon"].

The weapon possesed by [[Leoben Conoy]] at Ragnar Station is a fictional variant of the [[Wikipedia: AR-15 | AR-15]], known as the Close Quarters Battle Weapon Type Zero, aka the [http://www.poseidon.co.jp/2F/raisen/rai_1.html "Raisen"]. It is a model gun designed by Poseidon Industries of Japan (see link.)

Besides the military-issue rifles and carbines that have been seen in Season 2, civilian rifles have made an appearance. One example can be seen in "[[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]", when one of Anders's resistance fighters is armed with a semi-automatic, civilian hunting rifle fitted with a telescopic sight. From the look of the rifle, it appears that the rifle is a [http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/model_7400.asp Remington Model 7400] semi-automatic hunting rifle that had part of the rearsight removed in order for the telescopic sight to be fitted. This rifle may have come from either the hunters or survivalists that were picked up by the resistance after the Cylon attack.

==References==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:Weapons]]
[[Category:Weapons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Small arms

2007-01-15T20:34:12Z

Madbrood: Reworded P90 reference to reflect season 1 only

{{NPOV}}

Not much description has been given about the small arms that are seen in the re-imagined ''Battlestar Galactica'', but, based on what is seen, some of the firearms that the Colonial forces carry are real firearms that are in current use.

==Handguns==
[[Image:Sidearm Flightofthephoenix.JPG|thumb|left|[[Lee Adama|Apollo]], [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]], and [[Brendan Constanza|Hotdog]] on the [[firing range]] with FN Five-seveNs]]
The standard-issue Colonial sidearm (seen used in the [[Miniseries]], etc.) is according to RDM's commentary supposed to be an exact replica of the (fictional) sidearm used in [[Wikipedia:Blade Runner|Blade Runner]] (also starring [[Edward James Olmos]]). The standard service handgun used by the Colonial forces appears to be a modernized version of the [[Wikipedia:LeMat|LeMat revolver]] of the US Civil War, with a revolver-like pistol grip and a large barrel beneath the primary barrel. From closer examination of the handgun, it appears that the handgun that was in the Miniseries and Season 1 of the re-imagined series of ''Battlestar Galactica'' was built around a [[Wikipedia:Smith & Wesson | Smith & Wesson]] K-Frame or L-Frame revolver. This sidearm is nicknamed the "Colonial Clamshell" by a propmaster in David Eick's 18th video blog.

It seems that, in the second season the original sidearms have been nearly completely replaced by the [[Wikipedia:Five-seveN|Fabrique Nationale Five-seveN]], also dressed up with an underbarrel explosive launcher. (This changeover allows for real semi-automatic fire and makes use of the existing stores of 5.7 x 28 mm (FN P-90) blank ammunition).

The [[Wikipedia:HK P9|Heckler & Koch P9]] is seen, along with an [http://www.weapon.envy.nu/gun/int.html Intratec Cat-9] ([[Colonial Day]]).

The [http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg54-e.htm Vektor CP1] has also made an appearence ([[Bastille Day]], [[Black Market]], [[Sacrifice]], etc.); this is odd given a safety recall issued in 2000.

Samuel Anders has been seen on with the [[Wikipedia:MK23 Mod 0|Heckler & Koch Mark 23]], a variant of the [[Wikipedia:Heckler & Koch USP|USP]], ([[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]) and the Israeli [[Wikipedia:Desert Eagle|Desert Eagle]] ([[Downloaded]]).

The Russian-made [[Wikipedia:Makarov PM|Makarov PM]] handgun and the Russian-made Stechkin APS handgun have made an appearance in the Season 2 episode "[[Sacrifice]]".

The [[Stallion]] appears in the episode, "[[Home, Part II]]". Based on the COP 357 Derringer <ref>{{cite_web|url=http://www.kitsune.addr.com/Firearms/Single-Shot-Pistols/COP_357.htm|title=COP 357 Derringer|date=|accessdate=|last=|first=|format=HTML|language=en}}</ref>, designed as a police off-duty/backup weapon, this four shot derringer fires .357 Magnum rounds. The name "Stallion" may be a production in-joke on the Marushin's model name, "COP 357", whose name is shared in part with the ubiquitous ''Colt'' .357 handgun.

==Submachine guns==

One of the real firearms that was seen on a regular basis in ''Battlestar Galactica'''s first season is the Belgian [[Wikipedia:FN_P90|Fabrique Nationale P90 submachine gun]] which is seen in the hands of the Colonal security forces and [[Marines]] of ''Galactica''. The weapon is notable for its unusual 5.7x28 round, designed to pierce body armor. Its unusual magazine placement and design (resting on top with rounds perpendicular to the barrel) means each cartridge is rotated 90 degrees as it is fed.

The FN P90 submachine gun has also been seen in other science fiction shows like [[Wikipedia:Stargate SG-1|''Stargate SG-1'']] and [[Wikipedia:Stargate Atlantis|''Stargate Atlantis'']] (which are also filmed in Vancouver alongside ''Battlestar Galactica'').

In season two, the P90 was replaced by a different weapon (see Rifles and Carbines).

[[Image:UMP Skorpion Resistance.JPG|thumb|Thrace's Skorpions and Anders's UMP ([[Resistance]])]]
Another real-life submachine guns that made an appearance is the German [[Wikipedia:HK UMP|Heckler & Koch UMP]]. In the episode "[[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]", [[Samuel Anders]] is seen armed with one. Other weapons seen this episode are the Czech [[Wikipedia:Skorpion|Skorpion machine pistol]], wielded akimbo by Starbuck, and the American [[Wikipedia:Ruger MP9|Ruger MP9]] being wielded by Helo when the two characters encounter Samuel Anders and his resistance fighters. 
The Skorpion is also carried by Chief Tyrol during the [[Battle of New Caprica]] ([[Exodus, Part II]]).

The [[Wikipedia:Beretta Model 12|Beretta Model 12]] submachine gun is used by Anders's resistance fighters.

In "[[A Measure of Salvation]]", both Major [[Lee Adama|Adama]] and Gunnery Sergeant [[Erin Mathias|Mathias]] appear to be armed with Heckler & Koch [[Wikipedia:MP7|MP7A1]] Personal Defence Weapons, mounted with ELCAN C79 optical sights. The MP7A1 and C79 sight are further examples of weaponry and equipment seen in ''Stargate SG-1''. Additionally, the fighters on the [[algae planet]], including [[Lee Adama]] and Anders, are equipped with the MP7 and sight combination ([[Rapture]]).

==Shotguns==

Another real firearm seen in the first season of the re-imagined series of ''Battlestar Galactica'' is the American [[Wikipedia:Mossberg 500|Mossberg 500]] pump-action shotgun, specifically a 12-gauge bullpup variant, seen in the episode "[[Bastille Day]]" in the hands of the prisoners on the prison ship ''[[Astral Queen]]'' after they overwhelmed the guards and took control of the ship. None of the bullpup variants are available anymore as of 2006.

The [[Wikipedia:DAO-12|Protecta/Striker shotgun]] is used in "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]", "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II|Part II]]" and "[[Home]]". This is the weapon with the drum magazine which Boomer uses to save Apollo's life on Kobol. It is frequently featured in many Hollywood movies due to its distinctive appearance.

A short-barrelled pump action shotgun (which closely resembles the [[Wikipedia:Ithaca 37|Ithaca Model 37 pump-action shotgun]]) with forward pistol grip is used by the bartender in the deleted flashback scenes in "[[Scattered]]".

==Rifles and Carbines==

Another real firearm used in ''Battlestar Galactica'' is the British [[Wikipedia:SA-80|SA-80 bullpup assault rifle]] which is carried by a Colonial military honor guard at Zak Adama's funeral in "[[Act of Contrition]]". The [[Wikipedia:SA-80|SA-80]] is the current, standard-issue infantry rifle of the British armed forces and has been in British military service since 1985. 
The SA-80s in "Act of Contrition" appear to be without the standard, [[Wikipedia:British Army | British Army]] issue [[Wikipedia: SUSAT | SUSAT]] telescopic sight, and the iron foresight and rear-sight/carry handle are not in use despite the fact that SA-80s without the SUSAT sight are seen with the foresight and rear-sight/carry handle unfolded and in use. In "[[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]" and "[[The Farm]]", the resistance fighters on Caprica are armed with SA-80s alongside other firearms. The SA-80s used by the resistance fighters in these two episodes appear to have SUSAT sights fitted on the rifles.

[[Image:Cx4Storm.jpg|thumb|right|Baltar with a Beretta Cx4 Storm carbine ([[Fragged]]).]]
Starbuck uses an Italian [[Wikipedia:Beretta Cx4 Storm|Beretta Cx4 Storm carbine]] to shoot at [[Tom Zarek]] on the ''Astral Queen'' ([[Bastille Day]]). In "[[Fragged]]", [[Gaius Baltar]], Chief Tyrol, the others stranded on Kobol, and various Colonial Marines throughout the series are armed with them as well. (It is probable that the Cx4 has replaced the P-90 as the standard Colonial longarm in the series' production, most likely due to the P-90s already extensive usage on ''Stargate SG-1'' and ''Stargate Atlantis''). 
The Cx4s that are seen in ''Battlestar Galactica'' are fitted with specially-made accessories which go the length of the exposed barrel. Aside from this, the carbines are fitted with real-life tactical lights and AimPoint Red-Dot scopes.

Besides automatic and semi-automatic rifles, one of the resistance fighters on Caprica in the episode "Resistance" is armed with a bolt-action rifle. From the look of its action, the rifle appears to be an American [[Wikipedia:Remington 700|Remington Model 700]] fitted with a Choate Ultimate Sniper/Target tactical rifle stock and a third-party telescopic sight. It is possible that the bolt-action rifle is a standard-issue Colonial military sniper rifle (possibly [[Colonial Marine Corps]] issue) since Anders and his resistance fighters raided Colonial military armories on Caprica for firearms, ammunition and other weapons to fight the Cylons.

In the episodes "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]" and "[[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II|Part II]]", Starbuck is seen using a [[Wikipedia:Heckler & Koch G36|Heckler & Koch G36K]] while at the same time, a member of the resistance is using a [[Wikipedia:AK-47|Kalashnikov]]-type rifle. The Kalashnikov-type rifle that is seen in the hands of Anders' resistance fighters on Caprica in "Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II" and in a few episodes of Season 3 in the hands of one of the members of the New Caprica Resistance is a Chinese-made, NORINCO Type 84S rifle chambered in 5.56mm NATO/.223 Remington.

In the Miniseries, the Colonial security personnel on ''Galactica'' are armed with a bullpup assault rifle. It bears a resemblance to a short-barreled [[Wikipedia: FAMAS|FAMAS]] with a [[Wikipedia:Picatinny rail|Picatinny rail]] mount. This rifle was actually designed by Masamune Shirow for the Ghost in the Shell series, it is known as the [http://www.poseidon.co.jp/5F/9wepon/9wepon_1.html CZN-M22 "Nine-Weapon"].

The weapon possesed by [[Leoben Conoy]] at Ragnar Station is a fictional variant of the [[Wikipedia: AR-15 | AR-15]], known as the Close Quarters Battle Weapon Type Zero, aka the [http://www.poseidon.co.jp/2F/raisen/rai_1.html "Raisen"]. It is a model gun designed by Poseidon Industries of Japan (see link.)

Besides the military-issue rifles and carbines that have been seen in Season 2, civilian rifles have made an appearance. One example can be seen in "[[Resistance (episode)|Resistance]]", when one of Anders's resistance fighters is armed with a semi-automatic, civilian hunting rifle fitted with a telescopic sight. From the look of the rifle, it appears that the rifle is a [http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/model_7400.asp Remington Model 7400] semi-automatic hunting rifle that had part of the rearsight removed in order for the telescopic sight to be fitted. This rifle may have come from either the hunters or survivalists that were picked up by the resistance after the Cylon attack.

==References==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:Weapons]]
[[Category:Weapons (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Small arms/Archive 1

2007-01-15T20:32:03Z

Madbrood: /* standard pistol picture requested */

I'll get some screen captures of some of these later, tonight or tomorrow. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:14, 9 January 2007 (CST)

== "POV" in terms of voice ==

While the article is informative, it's voiced "out-of-universe" and so reads more like a behind-the-scenes article of props than a description of what the weapon might be able to do based on its real-world counterpart or on-screen action. When I run into articles like this, I usually use a References section to move the behind-the-scenes comments or sources out of the way of the main text so that article reads better. Thoughts? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 20:24, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:Concur. Super-informative, but TONS of real world references. However... without the real world references, is there really much worth commenting on? "The Colonials use various pistols, rifles, and submachine guns, sometimes equipped with various accessories such as grenade launchers." That may be oversimplifying just a tad, but ultimately most of the notability of the small arms is the fact that they use some (particular) real world weapons (or at least props that look like real world weapons). Should there be a split between a "Small arms" article and a "behind the scenes" category "Weapons used in the Series" type article? However, as is stated in the opening paragraph, there's not much canon regarding the small arms, so the in-universe articl would be considerably smaller. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:53, 10 January 2007 (CST)
::SV gives my thoughts exactly, I support splitting it into two articles, a small realworld one, which won't have much. It'd have info on the explosive rounds and such, stuff we know. Then a "Weapons Used in Battlestar Galactica" or somesuch for the real-world gear. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 11:01, 10 January 2007 (CST)
:As said, the only thing this article has going for it, is what real-life weapons are used. There is really nothing else to say. Having two articles would be alright, even if one will be very short --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:49, 10 January 2007 (CST)
::Optionally, we can create a new article, "Props used in Battlestar Galactica". This would discuss the many real-life objects and their origin as this page does with weapons, and add these items. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:58, 10 January 2007 (CST)
:::I don't know. Generally, it's a good idea, but the guns are relatively prominent in the series, so there is a lot of information about them. Maybe enough to warrant an own sub-article in addition to the other props. A way to seperate the "real-world" information a bit could be to create a "behind the scenes" tag like "silly" and "seperate continuity".
:::Alternatively, if an in-universe small arms section is pretty small, we could just keep that information on [[Weapons in the Re-imagined Series]] and add explosives and the RPG from "Exodus, Part I" to it. Then an own tiny article isn't needed and this one could be renamed/reworded to make out more "behind the scenes" --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 08:33, 11 January 2007 (CST)
::::I like it. Small paragraph or two in "Weapons" for in-universe, rename/recatogorize/etc. this article to indicate behind the scenes. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:49, 11 January 2007 (CST)
:::::Sounds like it generates the same effect I'd prefer to keep the voices right. Let's do that. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:55, 11 January 2007 (CST)
::::::So the voices are telling you that's the way it should be done? (Just don't talk back to the voices, they won't put up with sass.) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:02, 11 January 2007 (CST)

== SA-80 comments ==

Are the issues surrounding the SA-80 rifle really relevant to this article? Aside from the fact that they are not entirely accurate (The current A2 version is seen as a marked improvement), these issues are not really important to someone's viewing or understanding of BSG.--[[User:Cohnee|Cohnee]] 05:53, 15 January 2007 (CST)
:Right. I'll remove it --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 07:32, 15 January 2007 (CST)

== standard pistol picture requested ==

Does anyone have a really good picture of the standard Colonial pistol? Preferably the Miniseries/early Season 2 version, that was based on a revolver, before they switched to the FN Five-SeveN. I think it's the most "iconic" weapon on BSG and would be a good picture for the general weapons article too. I know there are pics out there of just the weapon, not really screencaps (and not even fan replicas). But the best I could find, is from "Fragged" where Crashdown threatens Cally and Tyrols fires at the Centurions. If nothing turns up I'll use that, but just the pure weapon would be cool. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 14:04, 15 January 2007 (CST)
:To be honest, I think it'd be best to have a pic of the pistol that's seen most often; ie, the Five-seveN. I know the LeMat version was seen thoughout the miniseries and season one, but I'm pretty sure, scene for scene, we've seen (not scene! :P ) the Five-seveN more often. Either way, I have a couple of caps of both kicking around, whatever we decide. Let me know :) -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:32, 15 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:The Eye of Jupiter/Archive3

2007-01-12T21:51:31Z

Madbrood: /* The G-4 */

I wonder if it has to do with that big red spot... *rollseyes* --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:48, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

I'm more reminded of that Writer's Podcast thing, you know when they're saying "How many more times are we going to find an artifact like the Arrow of Apollo and have to search for them all? That feels like going back to the well too many times, I mean what are we going to say, "Athena has 10 sacred toenail clipping scattered across space, you have to find them all...?" :) --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 18:49, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
:i'm thinking along the lines of some jewelry. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:57, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

::It sounds like a good plotline actually. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 19:05, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
:::Merv - you just made me spill forth mein coca cola whilst reading the section about the sacred toenail clippings - thats too much for 3am on a sunday morning! Still, plot looks good, just wish Season 3 would hurry up and AIR dammit! :) --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 21:08, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
::::No, really, they make a joke about "Athena's toenail clippings" in that writer's podcast thing. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:12, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

I have a few possible meanings for 'eye of Jupiter' --[[User:starryniteynite|starryniteynite]]

1) Relatively obscure name for NGC 3242, a planetary nebula (A ring of illuminated gas expanding out from a sun-like star that's exhausted its fuel, and has lost its outer layers) a few thousand light years from Earth. Most astronomers call this 'the Ghost of Jupiter' instead, though some Hubble images have used this name. Its not a very unique PN (tho it has some gas streamers we can't quite explain), but it could be used as a navigational marker like M8 (the lagoon nebula). It is a very pretty nebula :)

2) "Eye of Jupiter" was the Greek/Roman name for the sun, which lead to today's 'all seeing eye' symbol of the free masons and on the pyramid in US currency

3)Adama=Zeus=Jupiter...yes, they tend to use Greek vs. Roman names, but the titles are not always consistent with this convention, and we have also seen evidence for non Greek mythological names (Isis, for example). The rest of it could be wordplay too...'eye' might refer to someone acting as Adama's eyes, rather than his eyes literally (just as 'The captain's hand refereed to Lee acting as Gardner's XO, or his hand, rather than some captain's literal hand)

4)A reference to Jupiter's big red spot, a huge hurricane-like storm on the planet's surface. Just like the "bastille Day" title, this could reference something in the episode, but not directly...they might travel through a similar storm. This has actually been done before in the miniseries, when Galactica travels into the storm at Ragnar

5) The tried and true, ancient object meaning...just like the arrow of Apollo directly references a character, but has no link to the character himself, this could just be a pretty piece of bling..

Personally, I would love #1, but only because it'd make me 2/2 for BSG objects in my thesis and I'm a total, unabashed geek. I think its probably #2, however, and they find some sort of navigational means of finding Earth (like a picture of Earth w/ distances& directions to three pulsars or very unique objects

== Duelling Sharons ==

So did anyone else get a sense of animosity/jealousy between the two Sharons? While it seems that Boomer has accepted her place amongst the Cylons and no longer considers herself a part of the humans, it also seems that she's a bit jealous of Athena's "taking her place", if you could call it that. Likewise, it also seemed that aside from her duties as a Colonial officer, Athena's refusal to let Boomer in with Adama was also somewhat out of personal distrust, ironically the same distrust of the Cylons that her fellow Colonial colleagues have.

Also, while Boomer told Athena about Hera's condition out of possible concern of the child (possible strain of humanity left in her? Cylon imperative? Or something else?), seems to me that Boomer enjoyed bursting her "sister"'s bubble on that. Talk about sibling rivalry there.

It'll be interesting to see if there will be any further Sharon vs. Sharon confrontations in the series.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 23:55, 15 December 2006 (CST)

:It was a very, very interesting dynamic. In any other show, we would have had a knock-down dragout "catfight." You hit the nail on the head. This episode was prime stuff. And, we on the wiki should be commended: our ''Galactica'' nuke count is right on the money! (Either that, or the show is using ''us'' as a source! :) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 00:20, 16 December 2006 (CST)

::Does that mean we can finally change the "Class-D Nuclear Warhead" to something completely different, since their nukes ''aren't'' Class-D? :P --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:42, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Image==
Let's find an image that actually occurs in this episode. Maybe the wide shot of Tyrol in the temple? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 02:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)

Heh which one? to me it seems the Chief was a bit wide in ALL shots ; how could he gain weight while the fleet was starving? the chief definitely deserves the Lee Adama Fat-Ass trophy --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 03:10, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:Maybe it was Chief, and not Dr. Cottle, that got all of Kat's energy bars from the last ep.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 12:25, 16 December 2006 (CST)

So... is someone with the means actually going to replace the image with one relevant to this episode? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 21:12, 20 December 2006 (CST)

:Silly joking aside, I agree that the picture should be replaced. I'd do it, but I don't have a good screencap --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:34, 23 December 2006 (CST)

:I happen to have the episode, so, it's done. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:57, 23 December 2006 (CST)

::Well, I still see a thumbnail of the old image here and there (e.g. on the main page or on Mercifull's user page). -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 18:09, 27 December 2006 (CST)

:::You may need to purge your browser's image cache to see the new image. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 00:12, 28 December 2006 (CST)

::::I've just purged my Maxthon's image cache a moment ago and I still see an old thumbnail. Tried that also with Opera and Firefox -- all the same. -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 04:27, 28 December 2006 (CST)

==Did Starbuck survive?==
Horray for the carelessness of adverts! Within ten minutes we knew the answer to that one. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:14, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Aside from that, it's going to continue the cycle of Soap Opera unease there, if Dee's the one sent to go get Starbuck back. Can't wait to see the uncomfortable stares on that one, especially if (as I suspect) Dee set up Starbuck to be the "eye in the sky" '''hoping''' the Cylons would shoot her down.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 11:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Who else was supposed to fly the mission? Looks like Lee and Kara are the only two qualified pilots on the ground and Lee is needed in overall command. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:34, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Too good to be true==
When we Baltar's voice over ''Galactica'''s speaker, the closed caption actually identifies him as "Cylon over speaker". I know that's not really meant to be taken as anything, but with all the speculation, it seems like a shining goof, or maybe even someone taking a good piss out of the [[Baltar as Cylon speculation|whole thing]]. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:14, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Nuking the Planet==

Does anyone else think that the nuclear missiles have the ability to be detonated remotely, before they reach their target? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:44, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Not to mention abort code transmissions, etc. Makes you wonder if the missiles were set for "one shot, one kill" mode, where they could not be recalled.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 11:39, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Or perhaps the missiles can be aborted, until they reach a critical flight time. Could make for a ''very'' tense moment or two. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:51, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:Is it just me or didn't he actually give the order to fire. He said "release of nuclear weapons is now authorized". That might sound strange, but I took that to be a preliminary order to firing. For example that now even Tigh would be able to launch them on his say --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:03, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::No, you're correct on that; essentially all they were doing was opening the "barn doors". I was discussing the hypotheticals of the missiles, if they should be launched in the next ep.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 19:33, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:::Aye, we're just jumping the gun a little, and discussing possibles ways out of it, if Adama does indeed decide to launch :) --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 02:17, 21 December 2006 (CST)

::::Am I the only one who thinks he might be targeting the nukes for the Raiders on their way to the surface? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:53, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:::::Then why this-
:::::'''Adama''':Load target package three-bravo. Set ground zero for the underground structure.
::::: -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 19:19, 29 December 2006 (CST)

:::::: Damn, I missed that. Consider me stumped, then. -[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 05:17, 30 December 2006 (CST)

I watched the episode for the first time last night. I had this theory after the show ended...If the star of this system is going to go supernova, as Gaeta has described,

("Gaeta: Could be tomorrow. Could be next year. There's no way of knowing for sure, sir. When it does happen, the only warning that we're likely to get is a fast helium flash, at which point we'll have to jump out of here before it obliterates the entire planetary system. Sir, I am not one to look for religious signs. But I can't get my head around these odds. That human and Cylon both converge on this planet at this exact moment just as the star's about to go supernova…")

there most likely is an abundance of solar phenomena being emitted from the sun, maybe an increase of solar flares even. Solar flares have the "energy equivalent to a billion megatons, traveling normally at about 1 million km per hour"..."They produce electromagnetic radiation across the electromagnetic spectrum at all wavelengths from long-wave radio to the shortest wavelength gamma rays:(solar flare wiki ref.) I know that Solar Flares can disrupt electronics on and orbiting earth, and I'm sure Galactica's systems are somewhat protected from bursts of electromagnetic energy...but somehow I had the idea that the nukes are probably not as well insulated. Since there is so much solar activity in the region, I had the idea that maybe something like a flare (not the helium flash Gaeta talked about) would happen just as the nukes were launched..causing them to blow in the upper atmosphere directly over the temple. This would allow for quite a light show, and perhaps could allow that light shaft in the Temple of Five to be intensified. On the BaseStar with Baltar and Three, the Hybrid mentions something about "the five lights of the apocalypse" here:

"Hybrid: ...I don't care if it rains or freezes, as long as… the five lights of the apocalypse rising... sins revealed only to those who enter the temple, only to the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, end of line. Until next time … the eye, the eye, the eye, look into the eye to know thyself."

Maybe this is the way the temple is activated, maybe this is how the eye of Jupiter (Jupiter/Zeus/Adama's nukes) appears over the temple and activates the key...and Hey, maybe the solar flare would take care of the Heavy Rader flight systems too...Who knows, just an idea I had wished to share.

"Chief: And the heavens opened up, and they saw the Eye. But where is that frakking Eye?"

--[[User:Gallion|Gallion]] 10:08, 3 January 2007 (CST)

:Holy crap that's a good theory. Wow. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:06, 3 January 2007 (CST)
:Nice theory indeed. Maybe the five lights of the apocalypse are actually five nukes? Nukes would qualify as lights of apocalypse, but then so would a supernova. Also, I revisited the Hybrid's prophecy: ("Find the hand that lies in the shadow of the light, in the eye of the husband of the eye of the cow"). The light is most likely the bright star cluster (although it could also be the nukes, the supernova or the helium flash), but "in the shadow" hasn't really been explained properly. Now I just realized that since the temple is an underground structure, it would be in the shadow all the time. Might be something, might not be something, we'll see. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 13:47, 3 January 2007 (CST)

== WTF moment ==

I was on the [[Karl Agathon]] page, updating it for this ep's news, when I came across [[:Image:Valley_of_Darkness-Starbuck_Helo.jpg|this old picture]]. Considering how Kara's painting looks and that she's religious (though not indoctrinated in any sort of clerical form, unlike Chief Tyrol's parentage), does anyone think that (in hindsight), this may have been a hint to the Eye itself?--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 12:37, 16 December 2006 (CST)
: It actually makes a lot of sense... Taking Zeus to mean Admiral Adama, and that Kara Thrace is the go-to pilot for reconnaissance missions, AND the paintings on the walls, we have a plausible theory in the works! —The preceding '''unsigned''' comment was added by {{User|Alcibiades}}.
: Are you kidding me?! They set this episode up a year ago! --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 19:39, 16 December 2006 (CST)
: I find it pretty hard to believe too, but that painting ''really really really'' looks like the art in the temple. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 20:41, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Maybe they though it would be a nice idea to take that painting, put it in the Temple more than a season later, and see if we notice. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:20, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::It's a painting in her room and part of the column in the temple. :) --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:31, 19 December 2006 (CST)
: So Starbuck is an artist. She paints The Eye of Jupiter. Is it a known symbol or is this the first time anyone else has seen it? If it's not well-known, what does that say about Starbuck? Doesn't it make her prescient? Maybe her true calling is as an oracle. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:29, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::I'm with Catrope here. If I'm remembering my "Valley Of Darkness" podcast correctly, Tahmoh and Katee painted the apartment themselves, without any direction from Ron or the rest of the show crew. It's quite possible that someone noticed that particular pattern and decided to make it significant. And, hey, maybe she ''is'' an Oracle who just hasn't realized that she has the gift. Give the girl some chamalla and see what she can do. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Starbuck found a spiritual calling to fill the enormous gaps in her soul that she tries to fill with sex, booze, speed, duty, and violence. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 13:33, 19 December 2006 (CST)
:A friend of mine told me he though the painting and the decoration looked a lot like a star or an explosion, and then brought up the word "supernova". Could this picture be some sort of reference to the star going supernova? (I must admit I'm contradicting myself here, because I said earlier I thought the similarity to be some sort of an inside joke. Of course it's possible that Sackhoff&Penikett accidentally painted something that looked like an explosion, and that's why the writers chose that particular painting.) --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:36, 22 December 2006 (CST)
::I've updated the [[Cylon agent speculation]] article on Thrace's entry with the two pictures in question. This is not a coincidence; there is some connection, but we have to wait to know what. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:45, 12 January 2007 (CST)

== 18 Casualties & Relevance to "The Passage" ==

If 18 people were lost from '''The Passage''' episode, that means that 17 (at most) were aboard those two lost civilian ships, right? I'm only bringing this up to clarify what transpired — from that, and what we saw, the Raptors would pair up with a civilian ship, and that ship's passenger complement would be transferred onto ''Galactica'' (more heavily shielded, combat FTL drive) for the ferry run through the cluster. The civilian ship would then be crewed by an absolute bare minimum number of crewers. Then, when the group reached the other side of the cluster, the passengers would be transported back to their ships (if they survived the passage), the ships would remain at "Algae-planet", and ''Galactica'' would turn around and go back to the original side to repeat the cycle over again for a new group of civilian ships?

Am I reading/viewing this right? -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 13:53, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:The ships were manned by skeleton crews. That was even mentioned in "The Passage" --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 14:01, 16 December 2006 (CST)

: Don't forget that 14 days have transpired. there could have been more births in the fleet. I just came up with the difference from the two episodes--[[User:Quig|Quig]] 16:10, 16 December 2006 (CST)

== Humanoid Cylons recognize each other on sight ==

While back on New Craprica, Number 3 knew right away that it was Sharon Agathon. Of course, who else would be trying to remove the ship's launch keys?

This episode, we see that Athena knew on sight that this Number Eight was Boomer. Interesting.

Can Cylons tell on sight which of the copies they are? It's already established that the bulletheads can't.

Note in last weeks episode, Baltar was able to pick The D'anna number three out of the hallway on sight, even though there is an identically dressed number three in the same hallway. [[User:Belay-down-your-burdens|Belay-down-your-burdens]] 16:50, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Those two instances do prove that they do recognize one another, which was hinted at in the "[[Cylon Agent]]" page. I guess now it's more than a hint. --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 16:54, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Names of marines==
Has anyone heard (or seen in close captions) the names of the marines that were with Starbuck and Dualla? I know one of them is [[Fischer]], but the other three? I heard something like: Criggs, Verek, Ditko. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 17:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:According to the caption, it's Griggs and Varrick; the spelling/pronouncation of the third lad is anyone else's guess. For some reason, the closed caption for this episode doesn't pick up everything for me. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:48, 17 December 2006 (CST)

::OK, we know that it's [[Fischer]], [[Griggs]], [[Varrick]], [[Henick]] and [[Ditko]]. Since after she says "Henick and Ditko" the camera centers first on the black guy and then on the bald guy, can we assume that the first one is Henick and the latter one is Ditko, and the one in a hat is Griggs? It's conjectural, but looks reasonable to me and it would be nice to add pictures to their articles. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 14:46, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Location of the Eye? ==

At the end of the episode, Tyrol says something about "the sky will open, and the eye will be revealed." Did that make anyone else think of the star going nova? -- [[User:Benabik|Benabik]] 22:15, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Good idea, but is it possible that such a "blowup" could be predicted in the sacred scrolls thousands of years ago? -- [[User:SuperMMX|SuperMMX]] 01:15, 17 December 2006 (CST)
::Why not? A race of humans capable of traveling from Kobol to Earth probably knows at least as much about stellar evolution as the Colonials [[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 07:39, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:: The [[Sacred Scrolls]] have so far contained information about [[Laura Roslin]] being sick, [[Sharon Agathon]] helping them to find the [[Tomb of Athena]], and more... In addition to various prophetic dreams... Sure, they could have predicted it. -- [[User:Benabik|Benabik]] 11:26, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:When Tyrol commented about blowing up the Temple, I already thought "What if the Eye is INSIDE the pillar and they have to blow it up to get it out?" But surely an explosion destroying the entire system would destroy the Eye as well? And if it didn't, the Eye would not be easy to find between the debris of an entire planet. But blowing up a pillar doesn't exactly qualify as "the sky will open"... Maybe it refers to blowing up the roof or something like that... --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:04, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:: Note the shaft of light streaming across the central pillar in the final scenes of the episode. Perhaps something will be revealed when it becomes centered upon the prominent symbol seen there. --[[User:Spidey3|Spidey3]] 12:29, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::That was the way my mind was working. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:39, 18 December 2006 (CST)
I believe that the Sky Opening Up will be the explosion of the nuclear weaponry activating or destroying something which will then reveal the Eye. --[[User:Teal Thanatos|Teal Thanatos]]

== Boomer in the brig? ==

Did Boomer get thrown in the galactica brig once Athena pointed her out? Was she allowed to return to the Basestars? [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 01:49, 17 December 2006 (CST)

I doubt it because they probably would have it done right there rather than holding her outside first. I'm sure they let her leave with the others and advised her not to let the door hit on the arse on the way out. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:46, 17 December 2006 (CST)

:Besides, the least thing they need on ''Galactica'' right now would be Boomer to break out of the brig, throw on a uniform and have a "Guess the Sharon" contest. Aside from that, I expect that kind of trite plotwork I just mentioned from lesser sci-fi series, not this one.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 19:37, 18 December 2006 (CST)

== Summary ==

We really need a longer summary up there, the only point it currently mentions is kind of random -_- --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:58, 17 December 2006 (CST)

== D'anna's search for the five vs. the Temple of Five ==

I haven't seen much discussion on the connection between "the five" Cylons and the Temple of the Five. Since the Temple was built by the 13th tribe, a connection doesn't seem likely in a conventional linear timeline; but like the painting in Starbuck's apartment, it's hard to dismiss as a mere coincidence.

Such a connection does, however, clear up some verisimilitude issues for me – namely, the rate at which the Cylon's biological technology advanced in relation to both Cylon and Colonial conventional technology.

In less than 40 years' time, the Cylons were able to develop the Cylon Agents – and in such a way that made indiscernable from humans – and all of the ressurection technology that went with it. Meanwhile, their conventional, mechanical technology hasn't made nearly the same leaps. And Colonial technology hasn't advanced much at all. Pegasus was a much more formidable vessel than Galactica, but only in terms of size and firepower. Technologically speaking, they weren't that dissimilar. Everyone's still using nuclear missles as their most advanced form of weaponry.

Clearly, the Cylons have had a little help. Now, with dual references to a group of five that must not be named, we're starting to get an idea of from where that help may have come.

I'm not sure how that jibes with the Cylon's monotheistic religion (also established within those 40 years), versus the Colonies' polytheism, but I'm sure Mr.Moore has it worked out.

How great it is to have a show with a fleshed out story line already established, as opposed to the "make it up as we go" approach to shows like Star Trek (all incarnations), X-Files and Lost over our last 40 years. {{unsigned|Tylonius}}

:To ''Battlestar's'' credit, it did take a while to flesh out the story from a viewer's perspective, but what we know is quite intriguing. Their God and the Colonial gods may be one and the same, and may change how the Cylons treat the Colonials and vice versa. I don't think the five faces will be all shown, but we might see one. And yes, it is good to enjoy a show that makes a greater effort to maintain a consistent storyline. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:01, 18 December 2006 (CST)

::Time may not be an issue. Remember the Colonial Scriptures are full of prophecies, it wouldn't be too farfetched to assume that the Temple of Five could've been constructed for something before it happened, for the purpose of making it happen in due time.

::The Five could do whatever releated them to the temple much like Roslin is directly related to finding the tomb Athena, even though she lived thousands of years after everything else was set.

::This is all speculation, of course, but oh well....--[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 13:59, 19 December 2006 (CST)

:::The Final Five are directly connected to the Temple of Five: http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2006/12/one_of_the_cent.html -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 16:16, 20 December 2006 (CST)

::::“Essentially the Temple of the Five is directly connected to the five Cylons we have not seen.” - RDM
::::I've been thinking about the ambiguous ''sins'' the [[Hybrid]] mentions, that appear to be in regards to the Five. My working theory is that the five priests who served "The One Who Cannot Be..." and the Five Cylon Models who served the Cylon God both committed the ''sin'' of Rebellion, and that both dieties they rebelled against are one and the same. I also (big leap now), think that Model One is among the Rebel Five. Being rebel ''Angels of God'' (as Virtual-Six refers to herself), that would make One the RDM-equivalent to TOS-Lucifer, now wouldn't it? Chief and first of the (from the cylon perspective) "fallen" angels (as opposed to speculation that One ''is'' the Cylon God) --[[User:Viperetto13|Viperetto13]] 02:16, 23 December 2006 (CST)

== Human Nicknames ==
I cropped the following from the episode summary. Nothing against either point, just taking it off until somebody can figure out how to reconcile it into a single level deep bullet point (or points).
Cropped text:
*This is the first time the Cylons use "human" names on the basestar when not speaking to Baltar. D'Anna is named by Caprica-Six and another Number Three. Cavil's name is used by D'Anna.
**It is possible that these names are nicknames for the Cylons who've been amongst the humans (much like Caprica-Six), but it could also be the writers weaseling out of coming up with numbers for Cavil, [[Leoben Conoy|Leoben]] and [[Simon]]. In ''[[The Passage]]'', D'Anna even mentions having a discussion with "one of the Simons".
Thanks. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:51, 18 December 2006 (CST)

Err how about:
*This episode marks the first time the Cylons use "human" names when not speaking to Baltar: Caprica-Six and another Three call D'Anna by her human name, who in turn uses Cavil's name. These could be nicknames for Cylons who've been living among humans (cf. [[Caprica-Six]]).
*Once again, the writers have dodged the issue of [[Cavil]]'s, [[Leoben Conoy|Leoben]]'s and [[Simon]]'s numbers. In "[[Torn]]", Caprica-Six says "The ones you know as Leoben...", in "[[The Passage]]" Number Three mentions having a discussion with "one of the Simons" and in this episode a Three simply calls one of the Cavils "Cavil".

Please correct my style here, I didn't know exactly how to quote/paraphrase things like "one of the Simons" etc. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:12, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:One bullet point might be enough if the second part is connected with a word like "thus". However we shouldn't use "weasling". It sounds too negative and critical where criticism isn't really needed. Maybe something like "dodging the issue" or "circumventing"? That means the same and isn't as POV.
:Btw: episode names aren't italicized, but put in quotation marks --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:12, 18 December 2006 (CST)

Edit first post, episode titles quoted instead of italicized, second bullet point reprashed and "weaseling" changed to "dodged".
I don't think joining the bullet points with "this" between them is going to make this any clearer. I also don't think it's necessary, as both points may be related but analyse different things (the remaining numbers vs. Cylon naming convention). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:28, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:I think the writers are working with established names for convenience. They may not want to create a number yet to not confuse some viewers or there may be a grand scheme of introducing more numbers later in the season or another season that involves the 5 unknown cylon models. They could be maintaining flexibility for themselves in this case. They also know that the people who care the most are us die-hard fans and they can drag us through the mud without giving us more info, but I don't think so with as generous and courteous as Ngarenn is on BW:OC.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 11:10, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::It wouldn't be too hard to introduce a new number though. We've heard plenty of statements like "We Threes think we can't take the risk.", ideal statements to introduce new numbers with. Of course these numbers aren't a big deal, but die-hard fans tend to like to know these details. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 11:37, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::True. Though the more detail the introduce, the more chances they have to get it wrong. Even with the few model numbers we have revealed RDM sometimes has [[Podcast:The_Passage#Act_1|difficulty keeping them straight]], confusing the Eight's (Sharons) with the Three's (D'annas). Either way, we'll be here, documenting. I sometimes wonder if we're (the die-hard detail documenters) aren't his worst nightmares (if we even bothers thinking about us). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:52, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::::I always thought it was a nice nod to buckaroo banzai where all the villains had the same first name. [[User:Azselendor|Azselendor]] 22:05, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::I believe it would make sense that there is a plan with rolling out the remaining agent numbers. For example, whether or not "One" is one of the missing Five has a great deal of bearing on the development of the cylon narrative, and so would be kept quiet until the episode revealing that fact. If He/She is one of the missing Five, but "Two" is not, then Two's identity ([[Cavil]], [[Leoben]], or [[Simon]]) also has a great deal of bearing on the narrative. Cavil has been shown using some leverage on Three. He's got my money for being Two. I think One is with the missing Five.--[[User:Viperetto13|Viperetto13]] 22:58, 25 December 2006 (CST)

== Question on article ==

*When did [[Sharon Valerii|Boomer]] go over to the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons']] way of thinking? In this episode she clearly doesn't seem to think of herself as human anymore like she did in "[[Downloaded]]."
:I had assumed that by LDYB, II that the Cylons had gone over to Boomer and Caprica-Six's way of thinking, hence their (C-six and Boomer) sudden rise to power as well as the sudden Cylon cease-fire. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:24, 19 December 2006 (CST)

== Hera ==

I cannot believe that Adm. Adama has apparently no idea what happened to Hera. He was involved in this discussion in [[Downloaded]]. He should knew that Hera and her foster mother moved to [[New Caprica]]. I am very surprised that he became so angry after Roslin told him that she kept the child in her school. --[[User:Akagi|Akagi]] 17:21, 19 December 2006 (CST)
:Adama and Roslin only agreed in "[[Downloaded]]" that Sharon cannot be allowesd raise the baby. Maybe he assumed/was told that Hera was killed by Cottle? [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 17:34, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::That they concluded at the discussion that the child should be killed would fit with this episode events and Baltars look at the end of "Downloaded" when being chided by his internal six. However that option was mentioned onscreen and the entire tone of the conversation at that point makes it seem somewhat unlikely that this would been the final decision. Given that Baltar was never in on the adoption-plot (he apparently didn't know Hera was alive on New Caprica) and we now know Adama didn't know about it either the discussion outcome must have been either to kill the child or to postpone the decision (with Heras apparent death solving the problem). I'm quite willing to buy that Adama believed the child had died a natural death, given that complication in a hybrid between man and machine were to exspected. But I have troubles with Roslin doing it all behind Adamas back (why did she have to do that?) and Adama not making a decision whatever immediately (in Downloaded). [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 17:40, 21 December 2006 (CST)

== Recent Summary Reorganization Problems ==

I'm normally OK about reorganization of a summary, but the recent one handled by SgtPayne creates more work and confusion. Links previously added are missing, conventions once there are missing, and the narrative flow of the summary is extremely confusing. Normally we can break up events by location (events on Galactica, basestars, planets) because they are mostly separate events that don't directly connect, but this episode has both Cylons and Colonial events occurring in response to each other and in "real-time." I am ''this close'' to rolling back the summary and adding edits made afterwards to restore both narrative flow and conventions, but I wanted comments from others first. As an admin I would just roll it back because of all the wikilinking and convention breakage, but it's more than that. Comments? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:36, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:This is one that I might suggest we do "Act" reporting summary. So the events are intertwined. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:56, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::::I believe that's exactly what the summary contained before that infamous edit: a chronological report of the events in this episode. Since everything and everyone interacts with eachother and is at the same place, that would be a logical choice. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:03, 20 December 2006 (CST) (I hate edit conflicts)
:I haven't checked it for style and links, but I agree that the summary should be chronological. Splitting up the locations is fine if they aren't related. But as you said, here they are heavily interwined and dependent on each other --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:57, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:'''Revert.''' It looked better the way it was. The new split makes for a very confusing read. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 11:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)

I have reverted the article and restored relevant edits made after that reorganization. One persistant edit that I keep changing involves the "shaft of light" in the Temple as Tyrol is inspecting the symbology in the Temple. That "shaft" is Tyrol's flashlight beam. While that direct light ''might'' do something unexpected as it approaches the central target-shaped symbol, it's not coming from some mystic source within the structure. I've clarified this in the article. Contributors are always free to edit it, but its fairly clear, so analysis should be used to interpret what it might do. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:48, 20 December 2006 (CST)

In light of the recent reversion, I should drop my two cents in regarding the "reorganization". When I first read the article, I felt that it was too "narrative" rather than "summary", which is what the section suggests. The consolidation was an attempt to make the information as concise as possible. I also attempted to keep as many reference links as necessary. In regards to the location split, this was done in line with previous articles, which had definitive locations. My apologies if it confused readers, but it should be said that summaries are just that, and should not be play-by-play accounts of the episode. --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 12:18, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:The location split you introduced is good practice when there are multiple storylines that do not interfere with eachother. A nice example of that is "[[You Can't Go Home Again]]". In most episodes this is the case (end s1-begin s2 even had 3 or 4 separate storylines), but in this particular episode the three locations affect eachother so greatly that the split you introduced makes for extemely confusing reading: a bullet point in the basestar story references events told in the Galactica part, and viceverse. (Let's not even start about the Algae Planet part). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:45, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::You bring up a good point. In trying to put it together, there were some areas where I wasn't sure where to put it. On the whole, I was looking to clean it up a bit. Trying to read it line-for-line blurs out after a while... --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 14:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:::I've broken up the summary into acts. It seems to solve both problems. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 18:24, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::::aye. nice job. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:34, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:::::I concur. It definitely cleans up the look of the page. --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 22:55, 20 December 2006 (CST)

==Missile Tubes==
Where exactly are they and shouldnt that be an article in "Galactica Areas" Snorkel378

:They are located on the dorsal side of the ship, slightly forward of the four guns ahead of the Colonial seal, and sit in two rows of six. And sure, why not create an article in that section? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 19:12, 29 December 2006 (CST)

== More Nested Analysis ==
*The [[tylium]] planned for the mines could only come from their single Raptor. This supports the [[Substances in the Re-imagined Series#The Tylium Question|high energy yield of the fuel]] that, at the same time, would not sacrifice the Raptor's flight ability.
**It's also possible that the tylium used was fuel stored at the camp to power its generators and/or refuel the Raptors and other ships involved in the harvest.
Please resolve these into either one or two single-level bullets, then re-add to the article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:56, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:Done. I also updated the nuke count in this section. Admiral Adama orders launch tubes four through ten loaded, which means he's prepared seven nuclear warheads, not six. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 09:05, 22 December 2006 (CST)
::Nicely done. Thanks! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:51, 22 December 2006 (CST)

Major Point:
Note that Hera is the wife of Roman God Jupiter, the derivative of the Greek Zeus. {{unsigned|PhoenixFlight}}
:Yes, Hera's counterpart in the Roman pantheon is Juno. The association is noted over many episodes to date. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 14:22, 6 January 2007 (CST)

== Playing with the date? ==

In Kobol's Last Gleaming, they stated the ruins on Kobol were 2000 years old, "around the time of the exodus of the 13 tribes". When they found the beacon at the Lion's Head Nebula, they said it was 3000 years old, and now they're saying the Temple of Five is at least 4000 years old. Each time they give a new date a thousand years earlier, it seems to still coincide with the exodus date of the thirteenth tribe.

Am I the only one noticing this inconsistancy?

: My memory may be off, but I was under the impression that the 13th tribe left Kobol long before the other twelve. So... maybe the 13th tribe left 4k years ago, and the rest left 2k years later. Fanwankery? Spotty memory on my part? --[[User:Drumstick|Drumstick]] 02:08, 25 December 2006 (CST)

::Both, sort of. The date in "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I" refers to all thirteen tribes collectively. In "A Measure of Salvation" and "The Eye of Jupiter", they refer to the thirteenth tribe alone.
::'''Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I'''
:::Roslin: How old are the ruins?
:::Billy: We won't know for sure until they send a ground team, but the initial estimates have it on the order of approximately 2,000 years.
:::Elosha: That's around the time the thirteen tribes first left Kobol
::'''A Measure of Salvation'''
:::Adama: According to Cottle, the virus was an exact match to one reported over 3,000 years ago. Right around the time that the Thirteenth Colony left Kobol.
::'''The Eye of Jupiter'''
:::Tyrol: Our initial radiocarbon dating suggests that the temple's at least 4,000 years old, which lines up with the exodus of the Thirteenth Tribe.
::--[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 03:16, 26 December 2006 (CST)

:::Here's a thought. What if this isn't an accident? We've speculated already that humanity might have emigrated from Earth to Kobol before the thirteenth tribe returned. If the further away from Kobol we get, the older the artifacts we find, what does that tell us? That the thirteenth tribe was traveling not from Kobol to Earth, but from Earth to Kobol. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 06:03, 28 December 2006 (CST)

::::Well, it may not be an accident, but the Colonials seem to think that the 13th tribe left Kobol for Earth. So why, upon finding that the artifacts get older as they journey further from Kobol/closer to Earth, would they conclude that the dating analysis confirms their scriptures? Put another way, if they dates say the tribe went from Earth to Kobol, but the scriptures say they went from Kobol to Earth, why aren't the Colonials confused? It's an interesting idea, nonetheless. --[[User:Drumstick|Drumstick]] 19:29, 31 December 2006 (CST)

:::::Okay, it could also be that we're giving the Colonials too much credit in their dating. Elosha is a priest. Maybe her date of 2,000 is based on scripture, not fact. Also, the date of 4,000 could just mean that it predates the time that they knew the other 12 colonies left Kobol, thus it had to be built by the 13th tribe. The 13th tribe may have had outposts all throughout the galaxy while still calling Kobol home. Furthermore, since there are apparently 21,000 years of recorded history, maybe to the Colonials a few thousand years of inaccuracy in dating don't really make a difference. You could compare it to modern day humans who confuse the 15th and 16th centuries. Of course, now I'm fully in the territory of fanwanking/making up excuses. The seven months/nine months disparity with regard to the Colonial election was never even acknowledged, so there is a good possibility these inconsistent dates are just a product of sloppiness. --[[User:Drumstick|Drumstick]] 19:40, 31 December 2006 (CST)

Nut we Don't know how long it took to get everyone from earth off of kobol because it would take awhile to get huge civilizations away from a planet.Snorkel378

== Dichotomy of Signs to Earth==

I find it rather interesting that the first real sign to Earth that they found was a satellite/probe (first found by the Cylons). This would represent the high tech sign-post to Earth. The second sign to Earth is this hidden "Temple of Five" which is plainly a spiritual sign. Anyone else thing this is very interesting? I wonder what was on the satellite. Too bad RDM didn't allow them to examine it. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 21:57, 26 December 2006 (CST)

==The G-4==
Hey how come in the summary it doesnt mention the G-4 about to go off right by Tyrol? Snorkel378

:*Unaware how events are escalating around and above him, Chief Tyrol illuminates the carved writings of the Temple with his flashlight and reads the inscriptions, trying to locate the actual resting place of the Eye. At one point, his flashlight's beam moves close to the target-shaped symbol in the center of the central spire.
:How about we make that:
:*Having strapped explosives to the central spire of the temple, Chief Tyrol...
:--[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 06:17, 31 December 2006 (CST)

No I mean the activation light on 1 of the explosives is blinking which means it is going to detonate.The article does not mention that.
Snorkel378
:There is nothing to suggest that the blinking lights don't simply mean that it is armed rather than about to explode. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])

Yes but the music can easily tell u what is happening and it has a danger coming sound to it-Snorkel378
:Thats fanwanking. We have seen nothing to suggest that the explosives are about to detonate. All we know is that the explosives are armed and the flashing light could simply be to note that fact. You may very well be right but so far there has been no aired information to say that you are and until the next episode airs we wont know. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:24, 3 January 2007 (CST)

You are right I geuss im some crazy kid huh :) Snorkel378

:The explosives set by Tyrol and Anders in Occupation have a light that blinks, but the explosives only go off when the detonator is activated. The light is in no way indicative of and impending explosion -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:51, 12 January 2007 (CST)

Battlestar Wiki:Podcast Transcripts

2007-01-12T21:29:07Z

Madbrood: Scattered Verified act 4

{{project|Podcast Transcripts|image=BSG WIKI Podcast.png|shortcut=BW:POD}}
This project is meant to coordinate and standardize the transcription of [[Ronald D. Moore]]'s freely available episode podcasts. Our goal is to produce a searchable text repository for purposes of citation. At this time, we will only be transcribing freely available podcasts from [http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/ SciFi.com], not additonal DVD commentaries. Ron D. Moore and David Eick have recorded commentary tracks for the [[Miniseries]] (also including director Michael Rymer), "[[33]]", "[[Bastille Day]]", "[[Act of Contrition]]", and "[[You Can't Go Home Again]]". However, they have not been put up online for free but are only available in the Season 1 DVD set. Therefore, transcripts of these are not provided here, though relevant quotes may be found sourced in certain articles on Battlestar Wiki.

This project is a daughter of the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad|Citation Jihad]].

==Standards==

===Namespace===
Podcast transcripts should be named after the episode to which they correspond with the addition of the (podcast) namespace, for example, [[Podcast:Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]].

===Structure===
Begin each podcast article with the template:
:<nowiki>{{podcast|author=YourNameHere|emailAuthor2=|suffix=|additionalCopyright=}}</nowiki>

Use first-level headings to divide Teaser and Act breaks. Make each heading an offsite link to the appropriate podcast segment, e.g.

==[<nowiki>http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/109/bsg_ep109_1of5.mp3</nowiki> Teaser]==

Try to break up RDMs comments into paragraphs along topical lines.

For those podcasts that are not [[Ronald D. Moore]]'s, please refer to {{tl|podcastother}} for transcribing other podcasts.

===Transcription===
RDM frequently uses "uh", "um" and "y'know" as discourse particles. For readabilities sake, try to exclude these where they interrupt the flow of an otherwise grammatical sentence.

Where RDM interrupts himself, end the last word of the first statement with an emdash. You may include whatever discourse particles he uses to introduce the next thought. For example:

"I think it's a very good movie, one that I always thought was a— y'know, prime for us to do a riff on."

Generally, you may ignore emphasis except where RDM's tone is critical to the interpretation of a statement (e.g. sarcasm).

===Links===
Where RDM mentions a BSG episode or character, link to our own article. Where he mentions a television show or actor which we do not have (or need) our own article for, offer a link to the corresponding page on IMDB. If another resource such as Wikipedia or Memory Alpha has more comprehensive information, you may link there at your discretion. To avoid overlinking, only link once per act break.

===Corrections===
Except for simple spelling errors, do not offer a "correction" without first having listened to the relevant portion of the recording. Always leave a comment on the talk page explaining your change.

===Application===
[http://nch.com.au/scribe/index.html Express Scribe] is a piece of free software (they give it away in the hopes that you buy the tie-in products) that allows you to playback the podcasts with hotkey controls (so you can edit in the ''Battlestar Wiki'' window but still pause/rewind/play), as well as allowing for variable speed playback (so you can transcribe at a slower rate). Express Scribe also remembers where you left off when you open it, allowing you to resume work at the same spot. It is available for Windows and Mac OS X.

==Checkins==
When you begin work on a transcription, place your name beside the segment you are working on. When you've completed and uploaded it, mark your name next to "Transcribed". Afterwards, it would be helpful for a second user to verify the transcription.
=== Podcasts Needing Transcribing===
====Season 3 podcasts====
=== Transcription In Progress ===
====Season 3 podcasts====
==== Misc ====
[[Podcast:The Battlestar Roundtable]]
* Introduction (Transcribed: —. Verified: —.)
* Hour One (Transcribed: —. Verified: —.)
* Hour Two (Transcribed: —. Verified: —.)
* Hour Three (Transcribed: —. Verified: —.)

=== Verification Required ===

====Season 1 podcasts====
=====[[Podcast:Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II|Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]=====
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/113/bsg_ep113_1of5.mp3 Teaser] (Transcribed: [[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:41, 16 August 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:33, 17 August 2006 (CDT).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/113/bsg_ep113_2of5.mp3 Act 1] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:12, 17 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/113/bsg_ep113_3of5.mp3 Act 2] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:11, 20 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/113/bsg_ep113_4of5.mp3 Act 3] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 18:14, 20 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/113/bsg_ep113_5of5.mp3 Act 4] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:34, 17 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)

====Season 2 podcasts====
===== [[Podcast:Scattered|Scattered]] =====
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/201/bsg_ep201_1of5.mp3 Teaser] (Transcribed: [[User:Huh?|Huh?]] 11:15, 23 May 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:14, 23 May 2006 (CDT).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/201/bsg_ep201_2of5.mp3 Act 1] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:01, 29 September 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:02, 27 October 2006 (CDT).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/201/bsg_ep201_3of5.mp3 Act 2] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:41, 3 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 12:32, 27 October 2006 (CDT).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/201/bsg_ep201_4of5.mp3 Act 3] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:52, 4 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:PrePressChris|PrePressChris]] 13:26, 12 January 2007 (CST).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/201/bsg_ep201_5of5.mp3 Act 4] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:41, 5 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: —[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:29, 12 January 2007 (CST).)

===== [[Podcast:Valley of Darkness|Valley of Darkness]]=====
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/202/bsg_ep202_1of5.mp3 Teaser] (Transcribed: [[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:42, 28 September 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 06:31, 29 September 2006 (CDT).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/202/bsg_ep202_2of5.mp3 Act 1] (Transcribed: [[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:21, 9 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:33, 11 October 2006 (CDT).)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/202/bsg_ep202_3of5.mp3 Act 2] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:58, 21 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/202/bsg_ep202_4of5.mp3 Act 3] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:34, 21 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/202/bsg_ep202_5of5.mp3 Act 4] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:40, 21 November 2006 (CST). Verified: —.)

===== [[Podcast:Resistance|Resistance]] =====
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/204/bsg_ep204_1of5.mp3 Teaser] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:06, 12 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/204/bsg_ep204_2of5.mp3 Act 1] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:18, 12 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/204/bsg_ep204_3of5.mp3 Act 2] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:39, 13 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/204/bsg_ep204_4of5.mp3 Act 3] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:08, 13 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: —.)
*[http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast/mp3/204/bsg_ep204_5of5.mp3 Act 4] (Transcribed: [[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:34, 13 October 2006 (CDT). Verified: —.)

====Season 3 podcasts====

=== Transcription Complete ===
====Season 1 podcasts====
*[[Podcast:Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down|Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down]]
*[[Podcast:The Hand of God|The Hand of God]]
*[[Podcast:Colonial Day|Colonial Day]]
*[[Podcast:Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I|Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]]
====Season 2 podcasts====
*[[Podcast:The Farm|The Farm]]
*[[Podcast:Home, Part I|Home, Part I]]
*[[Podcast:Home, Part II|Home, Part II]]
*[[Podcast:Flight of the Phoenix|Flight of the Phoenix]]
*[[Podcast:Pegasus|Pegasus]]
*[[Podcast:Resurrection Ship, Part I|Resurrection Ship, Part I]]
*[[Podcast:Resurrection Ship, Part II|Resurrection Ship, Part II]]
*[[Podcast:Epiphanies|Epiphanies]]
*[[Podcast:Black Market|Black Market]]
*[[Podcast:Scar|Scar]]
*[[Podcast:Sacrifice|Sacrifice]]
*[[Podcast:The Captain's Hand|The Captain's Hand]]
*[[Podcast:Final Cut|Final Cut]]
*[[Podcast:Downloaded|Downloaded]]
*[[Podcast:Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I|Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I]]
*[[Podcast:Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II|Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II]]
====Season 3 podcasts====
*[[Podcast:Occupation|Occupation]]
*[[Podcast:Precipice|Precipice]]
*[[Podcast:Exodus, Part I|Exodus, Part I]]
*[[Podcast:Exodus, Part II|Exodus, Part II]]
*[[Podcast:Collaborators|Collaborators]]
*[[Podcast:Torn|Torn]]
*[[Podcast:A Measure of Salvation|A Measure of Salvation]]
*[[Podcast:Hero|Hero]]
*[[Podcast:Unfinished Business|Unfinished Business]]
*[[Podcast:The Passage|The Passage]]
*[[Podcast:The Eye of Jupiter|The Eye of Jupiter]]

==Disputes==
Members of Battlestar Wiki with experience in acoustic phonetics are listed below. They may be able to help with pronunciation issues.

*[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]]

[[Category: Podcasts]]

Podcast talk:The Battlestar Roundtable

2007-01-12T20:50:59Z

Madbrood: /* Transcript? */

===Transcript?===
So, who wants to try and transcribe this motherfracker? --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 23:53, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:lol. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 07:30, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::<nowiki>*cricket sounds*</nowiki> -[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:55, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::http://bitrot.net/images/blog/tumbleweed.jpg
:::--[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 08:01, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::: /me steps up to the bat - I'm on my lunchbreak just now, but I'll see if I can't get hour one done later on when I finish. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:25, 6 January 2007 (CST)

Okay! So, I didn't quite imagine how much work transcribing a podcast can involve- especially one with so many participants. I've made a start (up until about 1:20!) but unfortunately I have other pressing matters to attend to at the moment, so I shall continue later, unless someone else wants to help out... -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:35, 6 January 2007 (CST)
:That's great! Yeah, I feel your pain on the multiple participants. Crosstalk/interrupting is extremely challenging, as can be identifying who the heck is talking in the first place. I'm glad to have more transcribers on board, and we'll take whatever you'll give (pace-wise). Don't be pressured to go fast. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:33, 7 January 2007 (CST)
::I assume the regular podcasts are MUCH easier to transcribe than this behemoth. More to come tomorrow after I finish work :) -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:36, 7 January 2007 (CST)
::: I've got from where you've left off up to about 12:00 taken care of. --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 19:21, 8 January 2007 (CST)
::::Awesome! Yeah, vanilla RDM podcasts are easy by comparison. The difficult seems to increase exponentially based on the number of speakers involved (having done 2, 3, and 4 person podcasts). If you're still interested after this, I'd gladly let you have a crack at some of the normal ones. Kahran's contribution is really rather inspiring. If I don't get caught up in something else, I may join in for a bit. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 19:28, 8 January 2007 (CST)
::::: Shane, I've transcribed up to 0:12:12 of the Roundtable, that's the point where Jamie's imitating Micheal Rymer when he's suggesting that the cast play against their tiredness while filming 33. --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 22:33, 8 January 2007 (CST)
::::::How about we take turns at this? It makes much more sense than trying to do, say, an hour at a time. If we all take ten-minute chunks, for argument's sake? And yes, I'd be interested in doing other podcast transcripts after this :) I'm a bit of a detail nerd anyway! -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 23:35, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:::::::That's all I'm doing, 10 minutes at a time, so hey, why not. --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 00:21, 10 January 2007 (CST)
:(Unindenting)
Before starting on a chunk you may want to mark off in the transcript the block you plan on working. Then other people can check the transcript, and if somebody else is working on the "current" block they can mark off a subsequent block to work on. 10 minute blocks! That's amazing! In normal podcasts that's roughly an act (and 10 minutes of RDM podcast is MUCH easier than this one). I usually find myself doing about 3 minutes of a time for regular podcasts (roughly chopping acts into thirds or quarters). When the regular podcasts start back up you guys are going to think it's a joke... --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:43, 10 January 2007 (CST)

:Good idea, SV. Unfortunately, I'm going to be busy until mid-day Saturday (GMT), so if you guys want to mark off a couple of chunks, please do.
:I was also thinking, how about taking turns at the regular transcripts? I have a feeling that, after the first minute and twenty of the Roundtable, a regular podcast will be a walk in the park... -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:16, 11 January 2007 (CST)
::The nice thing about the regular transcripts is that there are discrete chunks which can be subdivided. So one approach might be everybody picking an act to work on and knocking that out. That way there's no edit conflicts either (since the acts are divided by separate headers). I wouldn't be opposed to having people do whole transcripts, but having done the ones that I have I know that I'd rather do an act or two a week rather than having to do a whole episode every third week (or however it'd work out). Thoughts? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 07:05, 11 January 2007 (CST)

:::I like your idea about doing an act each. That way, the whole transcript '''should''' be ready relatively quickly. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:50, 12 January 2007 (CST)

Podcast talk:The Battlestar Roundtable

2007-01-11T12:16:56Z

Madbrood: /* Transcript? */

Battery

2007-01-11T12:12:55Z

Madbrood: /* Colonial Fleet */

==Colonial Fleet==

[[Image:Railgun.jpg|thumb|right|One of ''Galactica's'' gun turrets]]

On Colonial warships, a '''battery''' is a group of large gun turrets working together. A battery may consist of any number of gun turrets. <ref>These are '''not''' [[w:Railgun|"railguns"]]. No [[BW:CJ|official sources]] use this term to describe these weapons.</ref>

On ''Pegasus'' four forward guns are grouped to a battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]). <ref name="battery">''Pegasus's'' bow battery can be seen to consist of four gun turrets when she engages a Cylon basestar.</ref> ''Galactica'' is armed with 24 gun turrets, with 2 gun barrels each. It is likely that the term "battery" refers to several of these turrets acting in concert.

[[Image:PegasusForeBatteries.jpg|thumb|right|Pegasus firing her forward batteries]]

===Ammunition===

The large turrets found on Colonial [[battlestar|battlestars]] fire several types of ammunition-

*Flak ammunition ([[Scattered]]). This ammunition employs [[w:shrapnel|exploding metal fragments]] at high velocity, creating a defensive barrier around the battlestar which can shear enemy fighters or incoming missiles. This, along with the point-defenses, keep the enemy at a distance, allowing the battlestar's [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] forces to safely deploy and engage. 

*Offensive ammunition. Salvos from the main cannons are extremely lethal to the unarmored Cylons [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]], which furthermore posess no such weapons or point-defense themselves ("[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

It should be noted that the massive recoil caused by firing these flak rounds makes it impossible for the cannon to have a fast rate of fire like the battlestar's point-defense turrets. These shells are also too large to be loaded quickly and efficiently by crew members, and as such are loaded by mechanical hoists ([[33]]). <ref name="flak">These have been referred to as railguns by some fan sources, but there is substantial evidence to the contrary.</ref>

===Firing Solution===

When engaging enemy targets over any kind of distance, a '''firing solution''' must be obtained. This requires several pieces of information to be input to a battery's fire-control computer, including the target's speed, course, and range; and the firing platform's speed and course. The velocity of the shells would be known, and is constant, given that there is no air friction in the vacuum of space. The resulting computation would allow the gun captains to accurately aim their weaponry to such a degree that firing will result in a probable hit.

===Operation===

[[Image:Flakfield.jpg|thumb|right|The flak field from ''Galactica's'' large turrets ([[Scattered]])]]

As with modern naval cannon, Colonial gun batteries have several modes of operation.

*Salvo Fire: this calls for a battery, or elements of a battery, to fire simultaneously at a single target. ([[The Captain's Hand]])
*Full Attack Mode: a battery's commander (Gun captain, [[33]]) will target and engage targets of oppertunity. <ref name="attack">During the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], batteries are called to "fire at will".</ref>

On [[Mercury class battlestar|Mercury-class battlestars]], gun batteries can be set to one of several automatic firing modes ([[Exodus, Part II]]). It is unknown if the gun batteries on [[Galactica type battlestar|older battlestars]] have this capability as well. There are likely other modes of operation for these batteries, but none have been explicitly stated on screen.

At least on ''Galactica''-type battlestars, the turrets appear to be manned and manually fired.

[[Image:TheEnemysGateIsDown.jpg|thumb|right|The devastating effect Colonial batteries can have on a Cylon basestar ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])]]

===Limitations===

Since its turrets are relatively slow to traverse, a battlestar's main guns would be a poor choice for engaging [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|enemy fighters]] which are small, fast and extremely maneuverable. They would also be impractical for defending against enemy missile attacks, which would be more suceptible to attack from [[Weapons in the Re-imagined Series#Point_defense_guns|point defense weapons]] or [[Viper|Vipers]].

The turrets' slow rate of fire also means that a single turret, if left to operate alone - either due to damage, power failure or any other events - may not be a very effective method of attack. It is for this very reason that the turrets are grouped in batteries.

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (TOS)]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Battery

2007-01-11T05:26:00Z

Madbrood: Rewording re Galactica's turrets

==Colonial Fleet==

[[Image:Railgun.jpg|thumb|right|One of ''Galactica's'' gun turrets]]

On Colonial warships, a '''battery''' is a group of large gun turrets working together. A battery may consist of any number of gun turrets. <ref>These are '''not''' [[w:Railgun|"railguns"]]. No [[BW:CJ|official sources]] use this term to describe these weapons.</ref>

On ''Pegasus'' four forward guns are grouped to a battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]). <ref name="battery">''Pegasus's'' bow battery can be seen to consist of four gun turrets when she engages a Cylon basestar.</ref> ''Galactica'' is armed with 24 gun turrets on her dorsal surface, with 2 gun barrels each. It is likely that the term "battery" refers to several of these turrets acting in concert.

[[Image:PegasusForeBatteries.jpg|thumb|right|Pegasus firing her forward batteries]]

===Ammunition===

The large turrets found on Colonial [[battlestar|battlestars]] fire several types of ammunition-

*Flak ammunition ([[Scattered]]). This ammunition employs [[w:shrapnel|exploding metal fragments]] at high velocity, creating a defensive barrier around the battlestar which can shear enemy fighters or incoming missiles. This, along with the point-defenses, keep the enemy at a distance, allowing the battlestar's [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] forces to safely deploy and engage. 

*Offensive ammunition. Salvos from the main cannons are extremely lethal to the unarmored Cylons [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]], which furthermore posess no such weapons or point-defense themselves ("[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

It should be noted that the massive recoil caused by firing these flak rounds makes it impossible for the cannon to have a fast rate of fire like the battlestar's point-defense turrets. These shells are also too large to be loaded quickly and efficiently by crew members, and as such are loaded by mechanical hoists ([[33]]). <ref name="flak">These have been referred to as railguns by some fan sources, but there is substantial evidence to the contrary.</ref>

===Firing Solution===

When engaging enemy targets over any kind of distance, a '''firing solution''' must be obtained. This requires several pieces of information to be input to a battery's fire-control computer, including the target's speed, course, and range; and the firing platform's speed and course. The velocity of the shells would be known, and is constant, given that there is no air friction in the vacuum of space. The resulting computation would allow the gun captains to accurately aim their weaponry to such a degree that firing will result in a probable hit.

===Operation===

[[Image:Flakfield.jpg|thumb|right|The flak field from ''Galactica's'' large turrets ([[Scattered]])]]

As with modern naval cannon, Colonial gun batteries have several modes of operation.

*Salvo Fire: this calls for a battery, or elements of a battery, to fire simultaneously at a single target. ([[The Captain's Hand]])
*Full Attack Mode: a battery's commander (Gun captain, [[33]]) will target and engage targets of oppertunity. <ref name="attack">During the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], batteries are called to "fire at will".</ref>

On [[Mercury class battlestar|Mercury-class battlestars]], gun batteries can be set to one of several automatic firing modes ([[Exodus, Part II]]). It is unknown if the gun batteries on [[Galactica type battlestar|older battlestars]] have this capability as well. There are likely other modes of operation for these batteries, but none have been explicitly stated on screen.

At least on ''Galactica''-type battlestars, the turrets appear to be manned and manually fired.

[[Image:TheEnemysGateIsDown.jpg|thumb|right|The devastating effect Colonial batteries can have on a Cylon basestar ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])]]

===Limitations===

Since its turrets are relatively slow to traverse, a battlestar's main guns would be a poor choice for engaging [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|enemy fighters]] which are small, fast and extremely maneuverable. They would also be impractical for defending against enemy missile attacks, which would be more suceptible to attack from [[Weapons in the Re-imagined Series#Point_defense_guns|point defense weapons]] or [[Viper|Vipers]].

The turrets' slow rate of fire also means that a single turret, if left to operate alone - either due to damage, power failure or any other events - may not be a very effective method of attack. It is for this very reason that the turrets are grouped in batteries.

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (TOS)]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Battery

2007-01-10T20:48:30Z

Madbrood: rewording

==Colonial Fleet==

[[Image:Railgun.jpg|thumb|right|One of ''Galactica's'' gun turrets]]

On Colonial warships, a '''battery''' is a group of large gun turrets working together. A battery may consist of any number of gun turrets. <ref>These are '''not''' [[w:Railgun|"railguns"]]. No [[BW:CJ|official sources]] use this term to describe these weapons.</ref>

On ''Pegasus'' four forward guns are grouped to a battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]). <ref name="battery">''Pegasus's'' bow battery can be seen to consist of four gun turrets when she engages a Cylon basestar.</ref> ''Galactica'' is armed with 24 gun turrets on her dorsal surface, with 2 guns each. It is likely, that the term "battery" refers to several of these turrets acting in concert.

[[Image:PegasusForeBatteries.jpg|thumb|right|Pegasus firing her forward batteries]]

===Ammunition===

The large turrets found on Colonial [[battlestar|battlestars]] fire several types of ammunition-

*Flak ammunition ([[Scattered]]). This ammunition employs [[w:shrapnel|exploding metal fragments]] at high velocity, creating a defensive barrier around the battlestar which can shear enemy fighters or incoming missiles. This, along with the point-defenses, keep the enemy at a distance, allowing the battlestar's [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] forces to safely deploy and engage. 

*Offensive ammunition. Salvos from the main cannons are extremely lethal to the unarmored Cylons [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]], which furthermore posess no such weapons or point-defense themselves ("[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

It should be noted that the massive recoil caused by firing these flak rounds makes it impossible for the cannon to have a fast rate of fire like the battlestar's point-defense turrets. These shells are also too large to be loaded quickly and efficiently by crew members, and as such are loaded by mechanical hoists ([[33]]). <ref name="flak">These have been referred to as railguns by some fan sources, but there is substantial evidence to the contrary.</ref>

===Firing Solution===

When engaging enemy targets over any kind of distance, a '''firing solution''' must be obtained. This requires several pieces of information to be input to a battery's fire-control computer, including the target's speed, course, and range; and the firing platform's speed and course. The velocity of the shells would be known, and is constant, given that there is no air friction in the vacuum of space. The resulting computation would allow the gun captains to accurately aim their weaponry to such a degree that firing will result in a probable hit.

===Operation===

[[Image:Flakfield.jpg|thumb|right|The flak field from ''Galactica's'' large turrets ([[Scattered]])]]

As with modern naval cannon, Colonial gun batteries have several modes of operation.

*Salvo Fire: this calls for a battery, or elements of a battery, to fire simultaneously at a single target. ([[The Captain's Hand]])
*Full Attack Mode: a battery's commander (Gun captain, [[33]]) will target and engage targets of oppertunity. <ref name="attack">During the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], batteries are called to "fire at will".</ref>

On [[Mercury class battlestar|Mercury-class battlestars]], gun batteries can be set to one of several automatic firing modes ([[Exodus, Part II]]). It is unknown if the gun batteries on [[Galactica type battlestar|older battlestars]] have this capability as well. There are likely other modes of operation for these batteries, but none have been explicitly stated on screen.

At least on ''Galactica''-type battlestars, the turrets appear to be manned and manually fired.

[[Image:TheEnemysGateIsDown.jpg|thumb|right|The devastating effect Colonial batteries can have on a Cylon basestar ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])]]

===Limitations===

Since its turrets are relatively slow to traverse, a battlestar's main guns would be a poor choice for engaging [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|enemy fighters]] which are small, fast and extremely maneuverable. They would also be impractical for defending against enemy missile attacks, which would be more suceptible to attack from [[KEW|point defense weapons]] or [[Viper|Vipers]].

The turrets' slow rate of fire also means that a single turret, if left to operate alone - either due to damage, power failure or any other events - may not be a very effective method of attack. It is for this very reason that the turrets are grouped in batteries.

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (TOS)]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Battery

2007-01-10T20:43:28Z

Madbrood: /* Ammunition */

==Colonial Fleet==

[[Image:Railgun.jpg|thumb|right|One of ''Galactica's'' gun turrets]]

On Colonial warships, a '''battery''' is a group of large gun turrets working together. A battery may consist of any number of gun turrets. <ref>These are '''not''' [[w:Railgun|"railguns"]]. No [[BW:CJ|official sources]] use this term to describe these weapons.</ref>

On ''Pegasus'' four forward guns are grouped to a battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]). <ref name="battery">''Pegasus's'' bow battery can be seen to consist of four gun turrets when she engages a Cylon basestar.</ref> ''Galactica'' is armed with 24 gun turrets on her dorsal surface, with 2 guns each. It is likely, that the term "battery" refers to several of these turrets acting in concert.

[[Image:PegasusForeBatteries.jpg|thumb|right|Pegasus firing her forward batteries]]

===Ammunition===

The large turrets found on Colonial [[battlestar|battlestars]] fire several types of ammunition-

* Flak ammunition ([[Scattered]]). These shells are too large to be loaded quickly and efficiently by crew members, and as such are loaded by mechanical hoists ([[33]]). <ref name="flak">These have been referred to as railguns by some fan sources, but there is substantial evidence to the contrary.</ref> This ammunition employs [[w:shrapnel|exploding metal fragments]] at high velocity, which can shear enemy fighters or incoming missiles. The point-defenses keep the enemy at a distance, allowing the battlestar's [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] forces to safely deploy and engage the enemy. 

*Offensive ammunition. Salvos from the main cannons are extremely lethal to the unarmored Cylons [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]], which furthermore posess no such weapons or point-defense themselves ("[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

It should be noted that the massive recoil caused by firing these flak rounds makes it impossible for the cannon to have a fast rate of fire like the battlestar's point-defense turrets.

===Firing Solution===

When engaging enemy targets over any kind of distance, a '''firing solution''' must be obtained. This requires several pieces of information to be input to a battery's fire-control computer, including the target's speed, course, and range; and the firing platform's speed and course. The velocity of the shells would be known, and is constant, given that there is no air friction in the vacuum of space. The resulting computation would allow the gun captains to accurately aim their weaponry to such a degree that firing will result in a probable hit.

===Operation===

[[Image:Flakfield.jpg|thumb|right|The flak field from ''Galactica's'' large turrets ([[Scattered]])]]

As with modern naval cannon, Colonial gun batteries have several modes of operation.

*Salvo Fire: this calls for a battery, or elements of a battery, to fire simultaneously at a single target. ([[The Captain's Hand]])
*Full Attack Mode: a battery's commander (Gun captain, [[33]]) will target and engage targets of oppertunity. <ref name="attack">During the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], batteries are called to "fire at will".</ref>

On [[Mercury class battlestar|Mercury-class battlestars]], gun batteries can be set to one of several automatic firing modes ([[Exodus, Part II]]). It is unknown if the gun batteries on [[Galactica type battlestar|older battlestars]] have this capability as well. There are likely other modes of operation for these batteries, but none have been explicitly stated on screen.

At least on ''Galactica''-type battlestars, the turrets appear to be manned and manually fired.

[[Image:TheEnemysGateIsDown.jpg|thumb|right|The devastating effect Colonial batteries can have on a Cylon basestar ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])]]

===Limitations===

Since its turrets are relatively slow to traverse, a battlestar's main guns would be a poor choice for engaging [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|enemy fighters]] which are small, fast and extremely maneuverable. They would also be impractical for defending against enemy missile attacks, which would be more suceptible to attack from [[KEW|point defense weapons]] or [[Viper|Vipers]].

The turrets' slow rate of fire also means that a single turret, if left to operate alone - either due to damage, power failure or any other events - may not be a very effective method of attack. It is for this very reason that the turrets are grouped in batteries.

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (TOS)]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Battery

2007-01-10T20:42:48Z

Madbrood: Merging the different ammunition explanations into the "ammo" section

==Colonial Fleet==

[[Image:Railgun.jpg|thumb|right|One of ''Galactica's'' gun turrets]]

On Colonial warships, a '''battery''' is a group of large gun turrets working together. A battery may consist of any number of gun turrets. <ref>These are '''not''' [[w:Railgun|"railguns"]]. No [[BW:CJ|official sources]] use this term to describe these weapons.</ref>

On ''Pegasus'' four forward guns are grouped to a battery ([[The Captain's Hand]]). <ref name="battery">''Pegasus's'' bow battery can be seen to consist of four gun turrets when she engages a Cylon basestar.</ref> ''Galactica'' is armed with 24 gun turrets on her dorsal surface, with 2 guns each. It is likely, that the term "battery" refers to several of these turrets acting in concert.

[[Image:PegasusForeBatteries.jpg|thumb|right|Pegasus firing her forward batteries]]

===Ammunition===

The large turrets found on Colonial [[battlestar|battlestars]] fire several types of ammunition-

* Flak ammunition ([[Scattered]]). These shells are too large to be loaded quickly and efficiently by crew members, and as such are loaded by mechanical hoists ([[33]]). <ref name="flak">These have been referred to as railguns by some fan sources, but there is substantial evidence to the contrary.</ref> This ammunition employs [[w:shrapnel|exploding metal fragments]] at high velocity, which can shear enemy fighters or incoming missiles. The point-defenses keep the enemy at a distance, allowing the battlestar's [[Viper (RDM)|Viper]] forces to safely deploy and engage the enemy. 
**It should be noted that the massive recoil caused by firing these flak rounds makes it impossible for the cannon to have a fast rate of fire like the battlestar's point-defense turrets.

*Offensive ammunition. Salvos from the main cannons are extremely lethal to the unarmored Cylons [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]], which furthermore posess no such weapons or point-defense themselves ("[[Resurrection Ship, Part II]]", "[[Exodus, Part II]]").

===Firing Solution===

When engaging enemy targets over any kind of distance, a '''firing solution''' must be obtained. This requires several pieces of information to be input to a battery's fire-control computer, including the target's speed, course, and range; and the firing platform's speed and course. The velocity of the shells would be known, and is constant, given that there is no air friction in the vacuum of space. The resulting computation would allow the gun captains to accurately aim their weaponry to such a degree that firing will result in a probable hit.

===Operation===

[[Image:Flakfield.jpg|thumb|right|The flak field from ''Galactica's'' large turrets ([[Scattered]])]]

As with modern naval cannon, Colonial gun batteries have several modes of operation.

*Salvo Fire: this calls for a battery, or elements of a battery, to fire simultaneously at a single target. ([[The Captain's Hand]])
*Full Attack Mode: a battery's commander (Gun captain, [[33]]) will target and engage targets of oppertunity. <ref name="attack">During the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], batteries are called to "fire at will".</ref>

On [[Mercury class battlestar|Mercury-class battlestars]], gun batteries can be set to one of several automatic firing modes ([[Exodus, Part II]]). It is unknown if the gun batteries on [[Galactica type battlestar|older battlestars]] have this capability as well. There are likely other modes of operation for these batteries, but none have been explicitly stated on screen.

At least on ''Galactica''-type battlestars, the turrets appear to be manned and manually fired.

[[Image:TheEnemysGateIsDown.jpg|thumb|right|The devastating effect Colonial batteries can have on a Cylon basestar ([[Resurrection Ship, Part II]])]]

===Limitations===

Since its turrets are relatively slow to traverse, a battlestar's main guns would be a poor choice for engaging [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|enemy fighters]] which are small, fast and extremely maneuverable. They would also be impractical for defending against enemy missile attacks, which would be more suceptible to attack from [[KEW|point defense weapons]] or [[Viper|Vipers]].

The turrets' slow rate of fire also means that a single turret, if left to operate alone - either due to damage, power failure or any other events - may not be a very effective method of attack. It is for this very reason that the turrets are grouped in batteries.

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

[[Category:A to Z]]
[[Category:Technology]]
[[Category:Technology (TOS)]]
[[Category:Technology (RDM)]]
[[Category:RDM]]

Talk:Final Five/Archive 1

2007-01-10T12:28:52Z

Madbrood: /* ID */

I took the image into photoshop (I do minor image tweaking at my job), did everything I could to enhance it, just for fun. And I'd like to make a grandiose speculation that the Five look, well, slightly mutilated...or mutated. Botched Cylon experiments, torutred and insane minds!!! I don't know, That one "fellow's" hand reaching to Three looks awefully stumpy...of course it could always be some foreshortening.--[[User:Gallion|Gallion]] 10:57, 3 January 2007 (CST)

Yup, totally convinced they are mutilated and grotesque, their faces, albiet shrouded are just a little odd and produce strange shadow tones.--[[User:Gallion|Gallion]] 11:17, 3 January 2007 (CST)

:It is also possible that the show is intentionally masquerading their faces to allow the show to cast anyone in these roles at a later time, rather than fixing the faces of the characters right away. In any case, any interpretations of these promo shots are too speculative to make a valid assessment. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:38, 3 January 2007 (CST)

We should get rid of the main picture - we don't know for sure that they are in fact the Final Five, they may be

A hallucation on the part of D'eanna when she resurrects/is boxed.
The five temple priests who are not Cylons.

Fact is, we don't know --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 06:26, 10 January 2007 (CST)

== ID ==

Looking at the high resolution picture, I can identify most of the actors in these robes. Whether they actually are the Final Five Cylons or whether this is just a dream sequence and they grabbed whoever was convenient is not clear. From the left to the right:

# Aaron Douglas, better known as Chief Tyrol. The stature and facial features are a perfect match.
# Tahmoh Penikett, better known as Helo. This isn't as certain, but the lower face and stature both match.
# Unidentified female
# Unidentified female
# The big, bald Asian pilot who's always in the rec room.

[[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 21:32, 9 January 2007 (CST)

No two cylons can have a child which makes Tahmoh Penikett wrong. Don't know about the others, though the "Chief" guy is certainly too short --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 06:21, 10 January 2007 (CST)

:Major kudos if you are correct, cause I cartainly can't see it myself :P -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:27, 10 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:Final Five/Archive 1

2007-01-10T12:27:41Z

Madbrood: /* ID */

I took the image into photoshop (I do minor image tweaking at my job), did everything I could to enhance it, just for fun. And I'd like to make a grandiose speculation that the Five look, well, slightly mutilated...or mutated. Botched Cylon experiments, torutred and insane minds!!! I don't know, That one "fellow's" hand reaching to Three looks awefully stumpy...of course it could always be some foreshortening.--[[User:Gallion|Gallion]] 10:57, 3 January 2007 (CST)

Yup, totally convinced they are mutilated and grotesque, their faces, albiet shrouded are just a little odd and produce strange shadow tones.--[[User:Gallion|Gallion]] 11:17, 3 January 2007 (CST)

:It is also possible that the show is intentionally masquerading their faces to allow the show to cast anyone in these roles at a later time, rather than fixing the faces of the characters right away. In any case, any interpretations of these promo shots are too speculative to make a valid assessment. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:38, 3 January 2007 (CST)

We should get rid of the main picture - we don't know for sure that they are in fact the Final Five, they may be

A hallucation on the part of D'eanna when she resurrects/is boxed.
The five temple priests who are not Cylons.

Fact is, we don't know --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 06:26, 10 January 2007 (CST)

== ID ==

Looking at the high resolution picture, I can identify most of the actors in these robes. Whether they actually are the Final Five Cylons or whether this is just a dream sequence and they grabbed whoever was convenient is not clear. From the left to the right:

# Aaron Douglas, better known as Chief Tyrol. The stature and facial features are a perfect match.
# Tahmoh Penikett, better known as Helo. This isn't as certain, but the lower face and stature both match.
# Unidentified female
# Unidentified female
# The big, bald Asian pilot who's always in the rec room.

[[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 21:32, 9 January 2007 (CST)

No two cylons can have a child which makes Tahmoh Penikett wrong. Don't know about the others, though the "Chief" guy is certainly too short --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 06:21, 10 January 2007 (CST)

:Even if this is correct, it is by no means indicative of who the Final Five are- it was likely done "just because". On a side note, major kudos if you are correct, cause I cartainly can't see it myself :P -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:27, 10 January 2007 (CST)

User talk:Serenity

2007-01-10T12:25:39Z

Madbrood: /* Congrats! */

We look forward to your contributions to the community!
! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 15:09, 1 September 2006 (CDT)

== Minor Edits ==

Thanks for the information! However, your contribuation to Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques was more than just a ''minor'' edit as you indicated by clicking the "<tt>'''[ ] This is a minor edit'''</tt>" checkbox is unchecked for these types of edits. Please read up on the [[BW:MARK#Minor_edits|guidelines]] refering to minor edits.
--[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 02:11, 14 September 2006 (CDT)
:Alright. I used it because I only added another comment to an existing one. In the future I shall only use for typos and formatting :) --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 02:17, 14 September 2006 (CDT)

== Gateworld ==
Gateworld is not consider a valid source. In this case, this episode info probably is from casting sides which may or may not be "interpreted" correctly and even the title could change. Just want you to know this is "SOP", and not being vindicative or the such. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 15:25, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:Oh noes /o\ While it's somewhat surprising to get such a relatively big summary, I thought they were pretty accurate in the past. Of course things can still change, but the pages can be edited then. Next time I won't post anything...--[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:30, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
::Don't know the link offhand, but find the "official sources", like interviews with the crew or cast, or from Sci-Fi, or Bradley's page, episode info from those sources are more than welcome. I know it's kinda strict, but you know how to do it now ;), so if you find official info, go for it. If you want to do the reverts, go ahead. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 15:36, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:::The sucky thing is that official info could come out and we have to it over again. Personally, the episode itself sounds kinda sucky (is sucky a real word?). Thanks for doing the reverts. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 15:45, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
::::I find the premise kinda interesting and have been waiting for something like that already. It's that Doctor King dude that sounds a bit iffy. Like "evil doctor with a horrible secret" I guess we could ask Bradley Thompson if there is some truth to it --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:50, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::The problem with using the Gateworld info is that this may not be the "main" plotline or another plotline adds to this story. However, it does add "realism" to the series, much like the need for food later in the first half of the season. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 15:57, 16 September 2006 (CDT)

== Google Talk ==
May I send you a google talk invite? Email me at gougef at gmail dot com . Thanks. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:04, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:I don't use that program :) In fact I don' t have any IM installed atm, but I used to use ICQ --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:17, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
::I can yell at u RA anyway :) just thought I'd ask because we had headed off into speculation (and spoilishism - new word I just made ;) ) No problemo. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:22, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:::If you have ICQ, that'd be an option. I don't have it installed right now, but it's a program I'd have more use for than Google Talk. And how about "spoilerism"? --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:31, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Google talk is a really simple program. unlike other chat software. When I get time we can try ICQ. We talk about a chat channel for the wiki before but never took it anywhere. Actually, spoilerism - addiction to spoilers :). --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 16:41, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::A chat would be cool. I don't think many people here have mIRC but I could set up a channel on a server if wanted. Some type of web-based Java applet would be better for new people though, even if more frustrating for IRC veterans --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:55, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::[[User:Shane | Shane]] is gone this weekend but gets back get with him about it, I think that he has experimented with all ready. However, probably need it take it to the think tank before doing much with it. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 17:08, 16 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::[[BW:IRC]] --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 17:46, 16 September 2006 (CDT)

== Rollback ==

I did a rollback to [[Occupation]] from Peter's last version. Alot of the changes were discussed before you edit. Plus the population is something that was know we can't keep track. Our edits where merged during my rollback so I will go back threw it and make sure nothing was removed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:10, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

:I didn't do that intentionally. That was a complete accident. I wanted to edit something and - I think - used a link from the comparison page and thus edited an older version. Or something. Stupid n00b mistake :( --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 16:14, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

::Tis ok. We are only human. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:21, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

:::Didn't there used to be some kind of edit conflict warning when you submitted an edit from an old diff? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 16:23, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

::::Not during "rollback". --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 16:26, 10 October 2006 (CDT)

== Thanks ==

Hi, just saw that you moved a comment of mine from Exodus Part II to Part I for me, per my mistake. Nice to see someone not just make the easy correction, to revert, but to make sure the information gets to the right place. - [[User:Keithustus|Keithustus]] 12:17, 21 October 2006 (CDT)

==New Caprica==

Thanks for your help cleaning up [[New Caprica]]. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:36, 29 October 2006 (CST)
:No problem. I thought that the last part was kind of a duplicate of the "Battle of New Caprica" article, but wasn't sure how far to cut it down --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 18:48, 29 October 2006 (CST)
::Feel free to cut it down further, if you want. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:07, 29 October 2006 (CST)

== RFA ==
I created an RFA for you [[Battlestar Wiki:Requests for adminship/Serenity|here]]. Please drop by to either accept it or decline it. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:38, 2 January 2007 (CST)
:Sorry, I thought that counted as acceptance instead of vote... --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:38, 2 January 2007 (CST)
::No problem. I knew what you meant. And we don't really have these things often enough for people to really get "used" to them. So it's always a learning experience around here (and always has been). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:41, 2 January 2007 (CST)

== Congrats! ==

Congrats! You are now an administrator! You may want to read over the [[w:Wikipedia:Administrators' how-to guide|Wikipedia:Administrators' how-to guide]] from Wikipedia to learn more about the tools in the janitor's closet, headquarters for the [[Mop Boy]]. Obviously, if you have any questions or need to confer with your fellow administrators, do feel free to do so. Thank you for taking on the task! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:06, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:Congrats!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 19:40, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::Ha-ha! A new [[Mop Boy]]! And just in time for mid-season cleanup! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 19:55, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:::Congrats, Serenity. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:34, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::::Well deserved! Congratulations! --[[User:JubalHarshaw|JubalHarshaw]] 01:28, 10 January 2007 (CST)
:Good timing, gratz :) --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:06, 10 January 2007 (CST)
::Congratulations, my friend :) -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 06:25, 10 January 2007 (CST)

Podcast talk:The Battlestar Roundtable

2007-01-10T05:35:38Z

Madbrood: /* Transcript? */

Talk:The Passage/Archive 1

2007-01-09T19:54:02Z

Madbrood:

== I cried ==
When I watched the episode tonight, I cried at the end. It was a really sad ending. If an episode makes me cry, that means ''it'' was '''really''' good. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 00:31, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:I was just left in shock. What a way to die...and to do it knowingly while saving a civilian ship... [[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 07:46, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:You weren't the only one, Shane. You weren't the only one. Note to Self: When an episode summary says "we'll learn more about a character in this episode," prepare for mourning. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 08:42, 9 December 2006 (CST)
::I love Kat, I also shed a tear. :'( --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 12:14, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:::I saluted her picture as Starbuck hung it up, with tears in my eyes. This is one of the few episodes I've watched this season while not having a few beers in me, and I'm glad I did so. I'd have probably been Weepy McEmo all night otherwise. You can bet that, next Friday, I'll be pouring one out for Kat. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 14:28, 11 December 2006 (CST)

== Tether? ==

Why didn't Galactica just tether the Raptors to their ships? Or use the magnetic clamps that Raptors have to literally attach to the ships? They wouldn't lose any ships, it would save time, and be safer all at the same time. - [[User:Linaf|Linaf]] 09:21, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:Jumping is precise, but not that precise. We don't know if a Jump between tethered ships, if they didn't occur simultaneously, would be a fatal move, or do nothing. In any case, the intense heat and buffeting in the cloud would likely make a tether snap or melt and be worthless. Magnetic clamping might have been possible given that Vipers that perform combat landings hold themselves fast within Galactica. However, performing a Jump while ''outside'' of another ship (which is also Jumping) is probably a Bad Idea. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:06, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:Likely for the same reason Galactica has to close flight pods: Each ship's ftl drive is only capable of allowing it to jump, dragging a raptor along likely is no more possible the for galactica to jump with deployed flight pods. --[[User:Ghilz|Ghilz]] 21:07, 9 December 2006 (CST)

I'm sorry but this part of the story still doesn't make sense to me. Why did the raptors have to be outside of the ships to give them jump coordinates? If radiation would fry the civilian ship computers why not simply park a raptor in their landing bays and let their computers do the work.--[[User:Boonton|Boonton]] 20:15, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:Likely because the Raptor's sensors cant operate from inside a metal, radiation shielded landing bay... They werent designed for that type of use. Also, it may be very likely that many ships lack a landing bay, instead relying on airlocks to connect to other ships. --[[User:Ghilz|Ghilz]] 21:07, 9 December 2006 (CST)

:It still doesn't make sense to me. Why not weld the raptor directly to the out hull of the civilian ships? If the rapter's computers are so well shielded why not just wrap the computers of the civilian ships in protective armour. Clearly the jump computers are small enough to be contained in a small rapter so the amount of material necessary to harden them couldn't be all that much

::Simple answer: it wouldn't have been very dramatic from a storytelling point of view, would it? The fact that the civilian ships relied on the Raptors and their pilots- who, clearly, are fallible- increases the tension exponentially. It hits our characters that bit harder when ships are lost, because they feel it is their fault. By giving the civilian ships the same capabilities of the Raptors, you take away the whole point of having the episode :) --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 12:18, 10 December 2006 (CST)

:: Dramatic presentations aside, many civilian ships could have carried a Raptor in their cargo hull until after the first jump. Then they could launch their Raptor and make the second jump. Colonial One, a ship actually small enough to land in Galactica's landing bay, is shown with a Raptor in it's hull during the mini-series. Colonial One also rescued Apollo's Viper when he had an emergency. [[User:Belay-down-your-burdens|Belay-down-your-burdens]] 18:38, 10 December 2006 (CST)

::: It seems to me to be a poor idea to open your landing bay in the middle of that radiation storm, whatever it was. That could be a good excuse for not doing that one. --[[User:Larrik|Larrik]] 22:38, 12 December 2006 (CST)

::Welding the raptors would have taken more time than the fleet could have really afforded. Plus, though it seems like a good idea, the intense heat inside that star cluster seems to indicate that if they were to try that, the raptor and the ship would become inseparable because of the melding of the metal. Every raptor that came back was charred and smoking, not sure if they would have been able to pull each attached raptor off the ships. --[[User:LifeStar|LifeStar]] 10:28, 12 December 2006 (CST)

==Did Kat Die?==
I know this is a stupid question but why did starbuck a picture of her in the memorial hall? Snorkel378
:Yes, she died because she received a twice-fatal dose of radiation --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:10, 9 December 2006 (CST)

Then WHy did Adama Still MAke Her CAG? WHo would make someone who is dead Be A CAG. And We never saw her die. snorkel378
:It's glaringly obvious that she died. We didn't need to see her last breath to know it. She received two fatal doses. She was dying in sickbay. Kara gave her pills if she wanted to comitt suicide, because dying from radiation poisoning is extremly ugly.
:The promotion is a honorary and morale thing. It was merely posthumous, but Apollo is still the acting CAG. Adama thought that Kat's leadership and bravery are a good example for the crew --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:19, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:Kat does die; there is no way for her to survive extreme radiation poisoning. However, the show's writers do not show this to enhance the drama of the moment. (Oh, Snorkel, to make an automatic signature, place four tilde characters (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) at the end of your entry.) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:24, 9 December 2006 (CST)
::I'd say it's better that we didn't see her actual death. Death scenes ''can'' a clicé if not done right. Just showing its impact on the other character was far better and more effective IMO --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:27, 9 December 2006 (CST)

U guys know that this is a thery, we would have to ask the writer. Come on what if she is still insickbay some later episode in rehab? then waht would you guys say. OO and KAra gave Kat Skin rebuilds she even said that in the scene. So u might be alive but we should not be so quick to say she died because there is no ground proof. Snorkel378 P.S. i dont give a damn about an automatic signature
:She gave her an overdose of sleeping pills. And I haven't listened to the podcast yet, but it probably "confirms" her death --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:37, 9 December 2006 (CST)

::Yep, the podcast confirms that Kat died. Just got done listening. And Snorkel, there's no need to get ratty, we just try to help :) --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:41, 9 December 2006 (CST)

:While the podcast does make it explicit, the story as aired makes it clear.
:* We're told that flying after the tag turns black is lethal. Kat's turns black twice
:* Kara gives her "sleeping pills ... enough"
:* When Adama tells Kat he's promoting her, she asks him herself if he knows that she's not making it out of sick bay. He does.
:* Kat isn't present when her promotion is announced. This would only happen if not only she wasn't available at the time but she never would be. If she will recover, you wait until she can be present.
:* Finally, Starbuck posts her picture on the memory wall.
:So, the answer to the question "Why did Starbuck put her picture on the wall?" is "so the audience would know that she died".
:What makes the show so appealing to me is the quality of the writing. They take the time to tell the story through the character interaction, the emotional moments. They could have had her die on screen when she collapsed and made it explicit. But instead, they write it more powerfully. --[[User:Brons|Brons]] 11:45, 9 December 2006 (CST)

::Excellent points, Brons. Another example of writing that sets BSG above other shows. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:49, 9 December 2006 (CST)

She was A good Character, Snorkel378

:Agreed. She was one of my favourite characters :( --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:37, 9 December 2006 (CST)
::Poor Kat :( *wipes away tears* --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 12:07, 9 December 2006 (CST)

No doubt, Kat's dead. All the reasons above. The wall is a memorial for those who are dead, not those who are sick. And it was even in the news a former Russian spy just got wacked (assasinated by Russia) a couple weeks ago with just a small dose of radiation. Most people don't realize how dangerous radiation is because we don't deal with it on a day-to-day basis, but just a little bit can kill you. I feel that all those pilots were getting more than a small dose, other than just Kat. There could be reprocutions for all of them in the future as their health deteriorates over time.

Kat dying in this way, they could have nixed the B side story to flesh out her story. Kat was a very compelling character and her going out, well, the whole D'Anna dying over-and-over thing and the Baltar 3-way is getting boring and tedious so they could have spent more time with the Kat story. Even thus, They still did a good job of making a dramatic finish even if the story could have used a few more details.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 13:01, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:The Baltar and Three storyline is neither boring nor tedious and had only four short scenes in this episode. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 14:18, 9 December 2006 (CST)
::That's all opinion. Everybody's entitled to their own. But I wanted to see more of the Kat storyline and I felt the B side D'Anna story was getting in the way.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 00:28, 10 December 2006 (CST)

What if they Findsome healing artifact do u think they would bring her back along with others? Snorkel378
:This isn't Star Trek. When people are dead they are dead. Just like in real life. Only the Cylons cheat death --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:40, 10 December 2006 (CST)

== Anti-Radiation Meds ==

Part of the summary here suggests that there were no anti-rad doses to go around for any of the pilots. I thought that at some were given to the skeleton crews of the civilian ships. Am I right on this one? [[User:Steel viper|Steel viper]] 18:38, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:RDM mentioned in the podcast that the cockpits of the civilian ships might be the most heavily shielded areas. That makes sense to save some money. So the crew could have been shielded, but not the rest of the ship --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 05:30, 10 December 2006 (CST)

Perhaps this section should be titled just radiation rather than anti-radiation meds. I'm not sure why the returning rapters & pilots were subject to decontamination washing. I was under the impression the cluster had intense radiation because of so many stars so close together....not because it was filled with radioactive material. A ship inside the cluster would be exposed to intense radiation but as soon as it jumped out it would be fine. I've read the neutron bombs feed metal an intense amount of neutron s and metal objects like tanks could give off residual radiation up to two weeks after exposure. But washing wouldn't solve the problem. The 'hot' ships would have to be put aside until they cooled down.--[[User:Boonton|Boonton]] 20:22, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:I think that they were just trying to show that there was a decontamination process without getting into the real nitty-gritty details of it all. I would have preferred that they showed a little bit more realistic portrayal of a radiation decontamination, but at the same time I understand at this point in the season, they do cut corners where they can to recoup costs encured by the season opener. All this stuff isn't free and the research, props and everything... --[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 00:32, 10 December 2006 (CST)

::Anti-rad medicines (at least those we have) can only block some specific tissues from certain types of radiation damage. Nothing you can ingest or inject will protect you totally; only avoidance and shielding may do that. Washing does wipe away contaminated (irradiated) materials so that the non-irradiated materials are no longer exposed, but yes, washing is a basic concept to show that something was done. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:52, 11 December 2006 (CST)

== Fourth squadron leader ==

As we saw at the end of this episode, ''Galactica'' has four squadrons of pilots under the command of CAG. The squadron leaders were (before Kat's death, of course): Starbuck, Kat, Two Times and... Did anyone notice who was the fourth? -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 20:44, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:Two Times was the name of the third squad leader? Could only make out the word "Times" :) You've got better eyes then I do.
::It was Ricky "Two Times" Richardson. I'm currently completely updating the List of Pilots page. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:18, 9 December 2006 (CST)
:::I saw Richardson too but missed Ricky and Two Times. Does anyone have this episode yet on iTunes?--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 01:02, 10 December 2006 (CST)
::::I don't think that the camera ever pans over to where we can see the 4th leader. I got the ep on iTunes, but I have a season pass.
:::::I do too, it doesn't pan over to the first squadron, but judging by the fact that Showboat is in the fourth squadron, it has to be another Captain, maybe Stinger. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 06:47, 10 December 2006 (CST)

==Jupiter = Zeus==
I had the closed caption on and found it interesting that "Jupiter" was replaced by "Zeus". I was going to make post this as a note, but then I figured it would get shot down... because I have confidence issues. But still, this makes the debate over what the "Eye of Jupiter" is interesting (I'm leaning toward the god, not planet). Also, I got the impression from Three's line about "their gods and ours" that this is some kind of acknowledgement of Roman mythology? Or did I understand that wrong? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 08:59, 10 December 2006 (CST)

:It's not the first mention of Roman gods. We also have Mercury and Mars. The Eye of Jupiter is some kind of artifact they'll find down on the planet --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:03, 10 December 2006 (CST)

:: Maybe we're wrong, but my friends and I thought that the dialog implied that Jupiter was a separate entity from Zeus. Was it ever stated that the Lord of Kobol Hera was like the Greek Goddess, wife of Zeus and all that? It sounds like Hera isn't married to Zeus, but is married to another god named Jupiter.

:: Personally, I suspect that what happened is that they named the artifact (or whatever it is) the Eye of Jupiter, and then someone realized that was a Roman name, so now they've decided to make the pantheon diverge more from the Greeks. Perhaps Mercury and Mars are also Lords of Kobol. Have Ares and Hermes ever been mentioned? [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 12:13, 10 December 2006 (CST)
:Ares has been mentioned in the webisodes. I think that the names can just be used interchangably and that they aren't seperate entities at all. For example they mentioned Hera and Jupiter in the same sentence, even referring to their relationship I think. That points strongly towards the names meaning the same. A couple of thousands of years have passed, so it makes some sense that the mythology has been adapted --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:38, 10 December 2006 (CST)

:: Nevermind. I remembered that Selloi did say that Hera was wife to Zeus. Unless Hera had two husbands, Jupiter must be an alternate name for Zeus. [[User:Alpha5099|Alpha5099]] 19:20, 10 December 2006 (CST)

Hera's roman equivalent is Juno, but it's clearly stated that Hera and Jupiter were spouses. At the same time, Zeus has been referred to numerous times. I think it's safe to suppose that they're just alternate names. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 11:33, 11 December 2006 (CST)

Espenson shed some light on this: http://www.tvsquad.com/2006/12/11/jane-espenson-on-post-the-passage-questions/ -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:33, 11 December 2006 (CST)

I thought immediately that the eye of jupiter was a reference to what our solar system looks like from outside of it... Jupiter is the eye in the middle of it. No? --galactageek
:My first thought was it was related to the storm in Jupiter, the Great Red Spot. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:55, 15 December 2006 (CST)
::Yeah, that didn't occur to me but that's an even better connection. I imagine that and to a lesser extent Saturn would be the main visual markers. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 14:46, 15 December 2006 (CST)

I think most everyone thought about the planet. I'm iffy to think if it actually translates to that, though, because once they find even one planet in the solar system, it would take something really clever to delay finding Earth at that point. It's not like they'd have to search too far to see this orb. However, and I can't take credit for figuring this out, you can't deny the coincidence of the fact that Jupiter is the fifth planet in the system (excluding dwarfs). I'm thinking of waiting to see what the five Cylons are about to see if there's a connection. And in another probably-not-a-coincidence, which I can claim as my own conjecture, it's interesting that this all revolves around number Three. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:54, 16 December 2006 (CST)

== Hot Dog's name ==

Great episode. Sorry to see Kat go. Anyway, I noticed that Hot Dog's name was spelled as Brendan Costanza with one "N", not as Constanza. I believe it has always been spelled as Constanza but I think it was spelled as Costanza in one previous episode. --[[User:123home123|123home123]] 10:13, 10 December 2006 (CST)

== Hybrid's Quote ==

Anyone got down what the Hybrid told Gaius? Figured it'd look good in the quote section... --[[User:Ghilz|Ghilz]] 14:27, 10 December 2006 (CST)

Thanks for the quote, I put up something about it in the Analysis section. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 11:15, 12 December 2006 (CST)

==Carol-Anne?==

Did Bill Adama refer to his wife as Carol-Anne in the sickbay scene? That would clear things up immeasurably with regard to [[Caroline Adama|Caroline]] and [[Anne Adama]]. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:44, 10 December 2006 (CST)

:I thought the same thing, but he has such a gruff voice it's hard to be sure. Maybe someone will know what the subtitles said? --[[User:Pearse|Pearse]] 10:36, 11 December 2006 (CST)

:I heard Carol-Anne as well, and the recent work that Jamie Bamber submitted to the scifipedia (which admittedly had some errors) did mention her name as being Carolanne. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:43, 11 December 2006 (CST)

::He, the cc, and canon have her as "Caroline". --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 06:34, 13 December 2006 (CST)

==Three killing herself softly==
I'm having a tough time believing that no one is noticing that D'Anna is having herself killed, even if the centurion is wiping it's logs. At the very least, she must have some accomplices helping her in the resurrection chamber.[[User:Belay-down-your-burdens|Belay-down-your-burdens]] 18:54, 10 December 2006 (CST)
:Agreed, it seems unlikely. Perhaps she's being aided by other Threes? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 11:31, 11 December 2006 (CST)
::in [[Hero]], it was clearly shown as a Three, Five, Six, and an Eight. [[User:Belay-down-your-burdens|Belay-down-your-burdens]] 15:21, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:Centurions are always good accomplices. A Centurion could figure out where she'd download to and run there faster than a skinjob could. Three also made some drawings, and the most efficient way to do that is to have a Centurion ready with paper and pencils the second she ressurrects. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 11:25, 12 December 2006 (CST)

Another question is, is she resurrecting on the basestar? I thought they needed a resurrection ship to resurrect away from the home world. If she's resurrecting on the resurrection ship, and then travels back to the basestar, how can no one have noticed? It would seem like that would be time-consuming and her movements would be logged. I think maybe Caprica, and maybe a few others like Sharon, knows what D'Anna is doing, and because Caprica wants to know who the Final Five are as well, lets D'Anna continue without reporting her. --[[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 11:06, 12 December 2006 (EST)
:We believe that the Resurrection Ship contains the [[Cylon rebirthing tank]]s. Seems impractical to haul a body from the Rez Ship's storage over to a basestar for resurrection. They ''do'' have another Rez' Ship with them (see the episode [[Torn]]). In this episode, the other Cylons wonder what she is doing, but either can't or won't investigate (perhaps part of their collective block of knowledge of the Final Five). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:18, 15 December 2006 (CST)
::Right, so that definitely means that she has to travel back to the basestar where Baltar and Caprica Six are hanging out every time she is resurrected. You'd also think that a Cylon's death on a basestar when there are no hostilities would be suspicious in itself. I never considered that the Cylons have a collective block on thinking about the Final Five. It may explain why no one is trying to stop D'Anna. I always thought that they just don't talk about the Final Five with each other or Baltar, but that they do have substantial free will and free thought. Witness Sharon Agathon's repudiation of the Cylons, and Caprica Six & the other Sharon killing D'Anna and thinking outside the box about the Cylon-Human conflict. Such a theory raises many problems: (1) how did D'Anna get around this block? (2) if they all do have a block, then they can't stop someone like D'Anna? --[[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 12:21, 15 December 2006 (EST)
:::A Cylon dying aboard a baseship isn't that suspicious, someone could fall and die, or somehow get hurt severly enough to commit suicide. What the Cylons should be wondering is why there is a body of a dead Three with a Centurion bullet right through her head, while she has no other injuries whatsoever (i.e. no reason to commit suicide) and the Centurions' logs don't make mention of the incident. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:37, 15 December 2006 (CST)
:::Series history shows that other Cylon agents tend not to talk about other models until confronted with obvious evidence of their connection. "Boomer" Valerii, even after shooting Adama, did not claim herself as a Cylon. [[Sharon Agathon|"Caprica" Valerii]] didn't reveal [[D'Anna Biers]] or [[Cavil]] despite her increasing loyalty. This may also be a programming block. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:45, 15 December 2006 (CST)
:::: Okay, but then how did D'Anna get around this programming block? --[[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 13:56, 15 December 2006 (EST)
:::Spencerian a point there (such a programming block would be a very logical move, making it impossible to torture the identity of other Cylons out of known ones), but I don't think it's related. Baltar knows all 7 models revealed so far, and all Cylons know that, so there would be no reason not to talk about them, and no block to get around. Also remember that [[Caprica-Six]] is the one to tell Baltar that Three is "doing things". Your idea that the Cylons don't talk about her death trips may be true, but keep in mind that she was pretty authoritarian in ''Torn'' when ordering the basestar to jump while the other Cylons are still in discussion. The Threes seem to have some kind of authority over the other models, which could be related to her low number (Number One would be the big boss of course, so if One and Two are with the Final Five, Three would be "in command"). So if the Threes are really the surpreme model or the commanders of this particular basestar, the others might not be eager to speak foul of one of the Threes because they fear consequences. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 13:17, 15 December 2006 (CST)
::::This is possible even without a hierarchical structure, as well. Culturally the feeling might be "That's none of our business," or along the lines of giving her the benefit of the doubt that whatever she's doing is for the good of the Cylons. They don't really have the concept of traitors within their own society (Sharon Agathon excluded), so the idea of keeping close tabs on someone may be culturally taboo. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:21, 15 December 2006 (CST)
:::::Wait a second, what about Caprica Six and Boomer Sharon killing a Three? --[[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 14:34, 15 December 2006 (EST)
::::::True. Though they DID believe at the time they were doing it for the greater good of the Cylons. It wasn't an act of treason against the Cylons (like Sharon Agathon's taking of the colonial oath and theft of the launch keys) so much as a regrettable action taken in order to serve the greater good. Which, as it turns out Three would be begging to be killed (repeatedly) a little over a year later, which has to take at least a little of the sting out of that particular little "betrayal". --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:46, 15 December 2006 (CST)
:::::Steelviper has a good point here, it could just be a "Don't mind other models' business?"-thing. Now Three killing herself over and over again may be odd to the others, but at least it's not harmful or treason or whatever (like 6&8 killing that 3), so they'll probably think like "if she wants to be crazy, let her, as long as she does no harm". --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 17:33, 15 December 2006 (CST)

== Slip? ==
I removed the following from the Analysis:
* One of D'Anna's sketches in particular appears to depict the profile of a mustached and bearded male with long hair—a possible reference to Baltar; later in the episode after Baltar communes with the hybrid, D'Anna says "Could there be a connection between their gods and ours?" where "their" refers to the polytheistic human pantheon and "ours," the Cylon single god, a possible slip on her part indicating that she believes Baltar to be a Cylon, or that D'Anna believes Baltar has accepted the Cylon religion, and so no longer counts him as following human beliefs.

Feel free to put it back if you can figure out how to get it into a single bullet point. Part of the reason I pulled it was I interpreted the "ours" to refer to the Cylon (collectively) god and their to be the Colonials... regardless of who was standing there. It's more of an us vs them thing, in general, but I don't think she slipped or is implying anything from that necessarily, other than maybe an increased closeness that he MAY be considered as being on the side of "us". But mostly, let's just keep these things free of nested comments. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:13, 11 December 2006 (CST)

That's actually why I described it as a "possible slip," though I think it's considerably less likely tha Baltar would have accepted the Cylon religion with no evidential plot nods or development in that direction. We do, on the other hand, have Baltar asking D'Anna if he's one of the final five in this episode, making it an issue "at-hand" and her pronoun usage potentially premonitory (it's either that, or a fantastic red herring). I think it's thus at least a remotely tenable possibility worth sharing in the Wiki's analysis as educated speculation. --[[User:Mattpeckham|Mattpeckham]] 10:27, 11 December 2006 (CST)
:I don't really disagree. I was just hoping somebody could come up with a way to work in that nested bullet. In fact... I think I have an idea. I'll edit above, and see what you all think. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:39, 11 December 2006 (CST)
:: It's good. I've re-introduced it into the analysis portion of this guide page. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 18:16, 12 December 2006 (CST)

== Boxey? ==

Near the end of the episode, when Kara goes to put Kat's picture on the wall, did anyone else notice the "MISSING" poster? I swear Boxey was in the picture on it. A sly in-joke?--[[User:Kross|Kross]] 09:54, 11 December 2006 (CST)
:I'll check when I get home. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 10:02, 11 December 2006 (CST)
:Looks like a woman in a baseball cap to me. --[[User:Kidsafe|Kidsafe]] 13:22, 11 December 2006 (CST)
:Same here. Personally, I think the Hybrid's lines just before Baltar sticks his hand in her tank are a far better in-joke. "''Throughout history the nexus between man and machine has spawned some of the most dramatic, compelling and entertaining fiction''." aka "WHERE'S MY GODDAMN EMMY?!" --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 23:31, 11 December 2006 (CST)

== Arguing with thyself ==

The "Carol-Anne" vs. "Caroline" subject should probably be hashed out here (and probably brought to [[BW:OC]]) before we re-introduce it to this page. Here's what was removed:

*William Adama refers to his ex-wife as Carol-Anne. [[Zak Adama]]'s mother was named as "Caroline" in "[[Act of Contrition]]", but in a flashback in "[[Scattered]]", Adama refers to his wife as "Anne", whom Tigh calls Adama's "new wife". This new information suggests that both "Caroline" and "Anne" are variants of a single person's name.
**In summary, Adama had two wives. His first wife was Caroline who was the mother of both Lee and Zak. However, because of his dedication to the service, his marriage was strained and eventually led to divorce. Afterwards, while he was in the merchant fleet, he met his second wife Anne and married her. It was this marriage that eventually led him back to the military.

Thanks! -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 18:14, 12 December 2006 (CST)

:The first bullet point was mine, and I will defend it as-is. The second represents my older opinion, and is by no means a re-wording of the above point. If it is to stay I think it needs to present new argumentation. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:43, 15 December 2006 (CST)

*So is the info in the William Adama wiki page here inaccurate? The article makes the distinction between Caroline and Anne. Which is right? --[[User:LifeStar|LifeStar]] 13:17, 18 December 2006 (CST)

*It seems that may be possible, though it's distinctly unclear which is correct... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 13:23, 18 December 2006 (CST)

== How does the Hybrid know where earth is? ==

That's pretty much my question. Is the Hybrid connected to God? Or, is the location actually somewhere in the Cylon databases that only she can access (which would make a connection with the final five, if they know where earth is already)?-- [[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 11:03, 14 December 2006 (EST)
:We don't have these answers yet. We do know that the other Cylons know the Hybrid has remarkable insight on the nature of the universe as she is, in effect, the basestar itself. However, they treat her more of an "it" than a "her" and consider her babbling insane, except perhaps for [[Leoben Conoy]]. Obviously, the one Hybrid touched by Baltar discovered ''something'' in its travails, either by way of information from the dying basestar and its Hybrid that discovered the Lion's Head nebula and the human probe left there by the 13th tribe. The Eye of Jupiter data is possibly gleaned from that. The problem with being a Hybrid (a computer) is that, for the most part, you can't just speak on your own; somebody has to ask you for your input, which Baltar did by touching the Hybrid. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:15, 15 December 2006 (CST)
::Right. But why did she react the way she did to Baltar? Either (1) Baltar is a human, and his human-ness triggered Earth-related knowledge in the Hybrid, (2) Baltar is one of the Final Five. According to at least one theory on the Final Five, they know where Earth is, and are somehow connected to it, so his Final-Fiveness triggered Earth-related information in the Hybrid. Another question: does the ''Hybrid'' know who the Final Five are and what they are, exactly? Can D'Anna ask the Hybrid? Is the Hybrid one of the Final Five (since she doesn't look like any of the 7 models we've seen)? Is she a Cylon at all, or a purely organic being? Is she a human? -- [[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 12:30, 15 December 2006 (EST)
:The Hybrid may be a sort of an oracle. We've seen an oracle on New Caprica in Exodus Part II, and she was right in stating that Hera lived. There are also striking similarities between the two scenes: both concern prophecies, both concern Number Three and Hera, and both imply some kind of connection between the Colonial pantheon and the Cylon god (at the very least the oracle scene in Exodus seems to confirm the existence of the Cylon god). This leads me to thing that the Hybrid knows all this because it has the gift op prophecy ("She experiences life very different from us, Gaius. She swims in the heavens." - Number Six, Torn). And as to the nature of the Hybrid: there is a shot of the Hybrid in Torn that seems to show the Hybrid having an 'open' back, i.e. you see a lot of flesh where its back should be, and there are a lot of plugs exiting it there. That's probably why they call it a Hybrid, since it's some kind of combination between an organic being and a machine (even more than the Raiders). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:37, 15 December 2006 (CST)
:::As stated in the [[Hybrid]] article, it is a Cylon, but not a [[Cylon agent]] and certainly (since it appears in all basestars) not a Five member. We can guess all we want, but it's too speculative until we get more gems tonight in the mid-season cliffhanger. While it is possible that the Hybrid can have prescience like an oracle, the Cylons are too dumb to ask it, despite their encyclopedic knowledge of the [[Sacred Scrolls]] (which pretty much patterns out what the Colonials are probably doing).--[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:45, 15 December 2006 (CST)
::::I don't think the Cylons are too dumb to ask it. It has nothing to do with "dumb." For one, maybe they have asked it, but they can't decipher her cryptic responses. Secondly, if Baltar is a Final-Five Cylon, he's just shown that he's not too dumb to ask it. Maybe it's a plot thing: if a Cylon asks it, and it just says "oh it's at these coordinates," the show is over. -- [[User:Yaneh|Yaneh]] 13:54, 15 December 2006 (EST)
:::::The Cylons, as a race, are extremely young (probably no less than 75 years old). Therefore, they likely don't know how to ask or even how to interpret any answers, since they don't have a history of their own that doesn't directly tie in to human history. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:38, 15 December 2006 (CST)
::::::What Joe said, which clarifies my earlier comment. The Cylons are intelligent, no doubt. But they lack the ''context'' to understand all the data in front of them, while, to humans, context is easy to grasp. Note the difference in how both races felt about the Lion's Head probe. The Cylons thought (and still continue to believe, it seems) it was a ruse for the virus, while the Colonials understood its significance immediately. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:54, 15 December 2006 (CST)

== Logic Holes. ==

So was the impenetrable radioactive gas Cloud slash Star Cluster Thingee that they absolutely ''had'' to go through (which they somehow could detect an algae-rich planet through), completely enveloping the entirety of the solar system, like a shell? Because, if it wasn't, no matter how big it was, they could've just gone around without, you know, people having to die. And there is not much of an excuse for not going around (cannot be circumnavigated? -- space is three dimensional) considering the vast amounts of space they have crossed in the past, even just getting to that point. Yeah, they haven't much food left, but folks can survive a few extra days without food; they can't eventually eat their protein mush if half the ships are dead or lost in a rather unpleasant... uh... Cloud Thing.

:There are many very plausible explanations. For example: They got to the star cluster and then their food got contaminated, reviewed astrometric logs and noticed that the algae planet was there, but oops, it's too late to go around.[[User:TaKometer|TaKometer]] 02:58, 4 January 2007 (CST)

And the one that really got to me... They needed the raptors to calculate the jumps and guide the civilian ships through the Unpleasant Radioactive Hot Death Field of Pain, but, the Bad Cloud of Yellow Ouch made stuff hard to see, causing lost ships and dead people. So, why not just attach the raptors to the ships, or hell, ride inside? They would know exactly where their target ship was because they would be in/on it, and they could safely, quickly, calculate the jump through the Big Bad Chernobyl Cloud to the Algea Smothered Planet of Infinite Convenience and Coincidence. Just a thought. --[[User:Jeffrey O. Gustafson|Jeffrey O. Gustafson]] [[User_Talk:Jeffrey O. Gustafson|<*>]] 06:45, 22 December 2006 (CST)
:As discussed elsewhere on this page, the extreme heat would melt the Raptors to the ships if they tried an attach-move. Also not all ships have landing bays able to harbor a Raptor. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 08:07, 22 December 2006 (CST)

==Clue to The Fleet's location?==

So, am I right in saying that our intrepid fugitives just travelled through a [[Wikipedia:Globular cluster|globular star cluster]]? If so, according to the info on Wikipedia, doesn't that give us a hint as to where in the galaxy they might be- "orbits the galactic core as a satellite"? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 13:54, 9 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:Battery/Archive 1

2007-01-09T18:33:46Z

Madbrood: /* Cleanup */

== Rails ==

David Templar writes:
:"If the rails mount on the guns serve any real functional purpose, it is probably heat dissipation; due to the lack of any medium to draw heat away from objects in space, disgarding waste heat would be a serious issue for the show's apparently chemical-propelled projectile weapons."

This seems like making up excuses for a production error, to me. If the intent of those rails really is heat dissipation, they would be much wider to provide a larger surface to radiate heat on. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:15, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:I concur. They just like the word "railgun" because it sounds cool. Distinctions between various slightly different kinds of hypothetical weaponry probably never occured to them. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 20:26, 31 March 2006 (CST)

::I never said it wasn't an excuse for production error, though I doubt it was so much error as "it looked cool". However, since the show's full of production errors to explain away (I'd love for someone to explain to me why they bothered dressing up guns in the miniseries but stopped in the TV series as anything other than laziness) and we have been explaining them away all over this wiki, I don't understand why this one should be any different. =P --[[User:David Templar|David Templar]] 21:28, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:::[[Wikipedia:Fanwank|It]] might be widespread, but I don't have to be happy about it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:21, 31 March 2006 (CST)

::::Haha, fair enough. Believe me when I say I prefer tight scripts over fanwanking any day, despite my ability to fanwank with the best of them. That unfortunate skill came from the nightmarishly long 7 years of Voyager and not nearly short enough 4 years of Enterprise... And with RDM's aversion to technobabble and reluctance to keep military/tech advisors on hand, BSG is a series destined to go down the path of fanwankery. Hell, even trying to stay consistent between episodes would cut down on the fanwank, they don't need a tech advisor for *that*. --[[User:David Templar|David Templar]] 22:37, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:::::What makes this case especially egregious is that the cannons have never even been referred to as "railguns" in any canon source. I don't think you can get much worse than ''[[Wikipedia:fanon (fiction)|fanon]]'' fanwank. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:50, 31 March 2006 (CST)

::::::I shamefully admit my own involvement in that unfortunate incident. I didn't start it, but had a part in continuing it for a time. --[[User:David Templar|David Templar]] 23:14, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:::::::You know, if we were talking about a land-assault vehicle instead of a space ship, that would make this whole thing a case of fanon cannon battletank fanwank. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 23:34, 31 March 2006 (CST)

==Cleanup==
Thoughts on what cleanup should be done to this article? [[User:JubalHarshaw|JubalHarshaw]] 07:32, 9 January 2007 (CST)

:The first thing, based on the earlier comments here, is to rename this article to something like "Point defense cannons," with the original name redirecting here. Probably, the article's information is otherwise correct in describing their function. I'll take a looksee on the article and then move it--it's had enough time in committee. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:47, 9 January 2007 (CST)

::OK, I looked. This is full of [[BW:FANW|fanwanking]] and [[technobabble]] based on the incorrect name. I will make a major rewrite of this article based on what we have seen these cannons do since the miniseries. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:49, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::: Point defence cannons? They appear to be primarily offensive rather then defensive. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 11:17, 9 January 2007 (CST)

::::The article has been rewritten with extreme fanwanking prejudice, removing all unsourced information. "Railgun" will redirect to this article. The weapons are both offensive as ship-to-ship broadside cannons (as used in "Resurrection Ship, Part II" as well as defensive anti-aircraft batteries (Miniseries, 33, et al). Battlestars appear to rely more on their fighters in most engagements than taking the ship fully into a battle, thus the name. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:21, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::::: I still wouldn't call them Point defence cannons, the smaller gun turrets I would call point defence however, but still even destroying Raiders seems an offensive move, I suggest moving to Main gun batteries or Kinetinc energy weapons [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 11:50, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::::::Agreed. They aren't point defense weapons. Those are the small turrets along the pods. These are called "main batteries" numerous times on the show. Technically, a battery is a group of cannons. They are used for offense and not just defense. One single turret or gun could be called "main gun" maybe. But that's something I'd rather set up as redirect. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:03, 9 January 2007 (CST)

Looks great, thanks! [[User:JubalHarshaw|JubalHarshaw]] 11:27, 9 January 2007 (CST)

:These are definitely cannons in that they fire slower than the side guns, but they are multi-use, and I agree on the use of the smaller guns, although they don't seem to aim (what is that article or their naming?). Other name suggestions? "Flak cannons?" (that's definitely what they deliver). A generic "Central batteries" or something? Anything but "railgun" or "gun" is fine with me; I'm not married to this new term. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:12, 9 January 2007 (CST)

::What about the [[Battery]] article? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 12:20, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:::Good catch. Totally forgot about that one. I think they should be combined. The battery article is pretty good --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:30, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:::: (/me bows) That was one of my "christ-I'm-bored" efforts, with some excellent edits by some of the "big guns" (forgive the pun) on the wiki -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 12:33, 9 January 2007 (CST)

Talk:Battery/Archive 1

2007-01-09T18:21:40Z

Madbrood: /* Cleanup */

Talk:Battery/Archive 1

2007-01-09T18:20:36Z

Madbrood: /* Cleanup */

== Rails ==

David Templar writes:
:"If the rails mount on the guns serve any real functional purpose, it is probably heat dissipation; due to the lack of any medium to draw heat away from objects in space, disgarding waste heat would be a serious issue for the show's apparently chemical-propelled projectile weapons."

This seems like making up excuses for a production error, to me. If the intent of those rails really is heat dissipation, they would be much wider to provide a larger surface to radiate heat on. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 18:15, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:I concur. They just like the word "railgun" because it sounds cool. Distinctions between various slightly different kinds of hypothetical weaponry probably never occured to them. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]] 20:26, 31 March 2006 (CST)

::I never said it wasn't an excuse for production error, though I doubt it was so much error as "it looked cool". However, since the show's full of production errors to explain away (I'd love for someone to explain to me why they bothered dressing up guns in the miniseries but stopped in the TV series as anything other than laziness) and we have been explaining them away all over this wiki, I don't understand why this one should be any different. =P --[[User:David Templar|David Templar]] 21:28, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:::[[Wikipedia:Fanwank|It]] might be widespread, but I don't have to be happy about it. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:21, 31 March 2006 (CST)

::::Haha, fair enough. Believe me when I say I prefer tight scripts over fanwanking any day, despite my ability to fanwank with the best of them. That unfortunate skill came from the nightmarishly long 7 years of Voyager and not nearly short enough 4 years of Enterprise... And with RDM's aversion to technobabble and reluctance to keep military/tech advisors on hand, BSG is a series destined to go down the path of fanwankery. Hell, even trying to stay consistent between episodes would cut down on the fanwank, they don't need a tech advisor for *that*. --[[User:David Templar|David Templar]] 22:37, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:::::What makes this case especially egregious is that the cannons have never even been referred to as "railguns" in any canon source. I don't think you can get much worse than ''[[Wikipedia:fanon (fiction)|fanon]]'' fanwank. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 22:50, 31 March 2006 (CST)

::::::I shamefully admit my own involvement in that unfortunate incident. I didn't start it, but had a part in continuing it for a time. --[[User:David Templar|David Templar]] 23:14, 31 March 2006 (CST)

:::::::You know, if we were talking about a land-assault vehicle instead of a space ship, that would make this whole thing a case of fanon cannon battletank fanwank. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 23:34, 31 March 2006 (CST)

==Cleanup==
Thoughts on what cleanup should be done to this article? [[User:JubalHarshaw|JubalHarshaw]] 07:32, 9 January 2007 (CST)

:The first thing, based on the earlier comments here, is to rename this article to something like "Point defense cannons," with the original name redirecting here. Probably, the article's information is otherwise correct in describing their function. I'll take a looksee on the article and then move it--it's had enough time in committee. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:47, 9 January 2007 (CST)

::OK, I looked. This is full of [[BW:FANW|fanwanking]] and [[technobabble]] based on the incorrect name. I will make a major rewrite of this article based on what we have seen these cannons do since the miniseries. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:49, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::: Point defence cannons? They appear to be primarily offensive rather then defensive. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 11:17, 9 January 2007 (CST)

::::The article has been rewritten with extreme fanwanking prejudice, removing all unsourced information. "Railgun" will redirect to this article. The weapons are both offensive as ship-to-ship broadside cannons (as used in "Resurrection Ship, Part II" as well as defensive anti-aircraft batteries (Miniseries, 33, et al). Battlestars appear to rely more on their fighters in most engagements than taking the ship fully into a battle, thus the name. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:21, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::::: I still wouldn't call them Point defence cannons, the smaller gun turrets I would call point defence however, but still even destroying Raiders seems an offensive move, I suggest moving to Main gun batteries or Kinetinc energy weapons [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 11:50, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::::::Agreed. They aren't point defense weapons. Those are the small turrets along the pods. These are called "main batteries" numerous times on the show. Technically, a battery is a group of cannons. They are used for offense and not just defense. One single turret or gun could be called "main gun" maybe. But that's something I'd rather set up as redirect. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:03, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:::::::What about the [[Battery]] article? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 12:20, 9 January 2007 (CST)

Looks great, thanks! [[User:JubalHarshaw|JubalHarshaw]] 11:27, 9 January 2007 (CST)

:These are definitely cannons in that they fire slower than the side guns, but they are multi-use, and I agree on the use of the smaller guns, although they don't seem to aim (what is that article or their naming?). Other name suggestions? "Flak cannons?" (that's definitely what they deliver). A generic "Central batteries" or something? Anything but "railgun" or "gun" is fine with me; I'm not married to this new term. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 12:12, 9 January 2007 (CST)

Exodus, Part I

2007-01-09T18:19:37Z

Madbrood: Linking to combat jump

{{Episode Data
| title= Exodus, Part I
| image=Roslinanders-Exodus.jpg
| season= 3
| episode= 3
| guests= [[Lucy Lawless]] as [[Number Three]]
| writer= [[Bradley Thompson]] [[David Weddle]]
| story=
| director= [[Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
| production= 303
| rating=1.6
| US airdate= 2006-10-13
| UK airdate=
| dvd=
| population=
| prev= [[Precipice]]
| next= [[Exodus, Part II]]
| goof=Y
| podcast=Y
}}

== Overview ==

:''The [[Cylons]] have begun the brutal crackdown on [[New Caprica]]'s [[Resistance]] movement. Tyrol receives disturbing news from a secret source within Baltar's administration while Colonial detainees face a Cylon firing squad on New Caprica. With time running out for the colonists, Admiral Adama will launch his rescue attempt with only the battlestar ''[[Galactica]]'', while his son, Commander [[Lee Adama]], and the battlestar ''[[Pegasus]]'' remain to protect what is left of the human fleet and continue the search for Earth if the rescue fails.''

== Summary ==

*The final moments of "[[Precipice]]" are reshown as the captured detainees are being taken off the trucks. [[Cally Tyrol]] is freed, as the Centurions march up the hill. Tyrol continues to run as gunfire is heard. As the screen goes to black, the words "One Hour Earlier" are displayed.
*[[Galen Tyrol]] is frantically talking with [[Saul Tigh]] about a list of detainees he received from his [[Felix Gaeta|source]], Cally Tyrol is among the listed. Tigh snaps him back to his senses, noting that they can locate the people now that they cracked the Cylons' coordinate system.
*Chief Tyrol immediately gets to work, succesfully calculating the location of the execution, and gathers a team to rescue Cally and the others.
*Tyrol's team, including [[Seelix]], is able to catch up with the Cylons, and get in position as Cally Tyrol starts running. Tyrol rushes out and gets his wife out of the line of fire, as his team takes out the Centurions meant to execute the detainees. Others injured include some members of the [[NCP]] and the [[Cavil]] that accompanies the truck.
*Seelix leaves a wounded Cavil to death. After he downloads into a new body, the Cavil reports that he ended his own life, but is somewhat traumatized from the transfer process.
*At [[Breeders Canyon]], similar to the scene at the [[Pergamus Flats]], a flashback shows how [[marines]] move into position to defend the meeting there against a possible attack.
[[Image:Colonial RPG.jpg|thumb|150px|right|Colonial Marine with an RPG]]
*[[Sharon Agathon]] moves ahead to meet with [[Samuel Anders|Anders]] and the resistance. As Agathon and Anders discuss their plans, the Centurions attack, taking out some of the resistance fighters, but are soon destroyed by a marine RPG.
*After the attack, a map is recovered from one of the [[Cylon agent|'skinjobs']]. Anders recognizes it as the hand-drawn map passed on to [[Ellen Tigh]] to destroy in the heating fire within their tent. Anders immediately suspects Tigh in tipping off the Cylons.
*While sleeping in her bed on ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Number Three]] dreams of a tent near some odd rock edifices. The next image is of her holding [[Hera]]. She wakes up suddenly.
*Also on ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Gaius Baltar]] and [[Caprica-Six]] lie together in bed, but Baltar is fighting with impotence. Six is understanding, but Baltar shrugs off her sympathy.
*[[Kara Thrace]] is showing further affection for [[Kacey]] and apologizes for her getting hurt. [[Leoben Conoy]] watches from the background.
*Distrubed by her dream, [[Three]] visits [[Selloi]], a human [[oracle]] whose tent she saw in her dream, who tells her that [[Hera]] is still alive, but warns that holding the child will undo all that the Cylons have accomplished on the planet.
*On ''[[Galactica]]'', a combined crew of ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'' and ''Galactica'' crews ready for the rescue mission. [[Margaret Edmondson]] conducts a [[Salt Line Ceremony|ceremony]] to bind the people together, given the odds of the mission.
*[[William Adama|William]] and [[Lee Adama]] have a farewell of their own when Commander Adama leaves ''Galactica'' for ''Pegasus'', with orders to wait 18 hours for ''Galactica'''s return. Otherwise, ''Pegasus'' must continue the search for Earth with the surviving [[The Fleet (RDM)|members of the Fleet]].
*Three inquires with Dr. [[Cottle]], who is treating a Five wounded by a human attack, about Hera's alleged death. She points out that it didn't make much sense for him to simply cremate the first ever human/Cylon hybrid, something that no one had ever seen before, without studying it first. Cottle states that it was President Roslin's decision.
*[[Laura Roslin]] orders Anders to guard [[Maya]] and [[Hera]] at all costs. He tasks two of his best men to protect her and see to her safe escape.
*Gunnery Sergeant [[Erin Mathias]], the leader of Agathon's Marines, meets with Roslin, [[Tom Zarek]] and the resistance to discuss the rescue plan. She brings weapons for the upcoming fight and learns that the colonists conducted evacuation exercises under the guise of fire drills.
*A [[Cavil]] voices his despair at the continued bloodshed, [[Gaius Baltar|Baltar]] agrees. Many of the Cylons disagree significantly as to what to do to reestablish control. A [[Number Five]] says that, if the worse comes to worst, that they can just nuke the city.
*Saul Tigh learns of his wife's betrayal and is visibly shocked by it.
*Sharon Agathon heads into the [[New Caprica Detention Center]] and gets the [[launch key]]s for the Colonial ship. Three enters the secured room, immediately recognizes her, stops Agathon and tells her that [[Hera|her daughter]] is alive. Unwilling to consider this matter for now, Agathon shoots the Three in the legs: "Adama wouldn't lie to me."
*''Galactica'' is given word that the launch keys have been retrieved, and after a rousing speech by Admiral Adama, begins preparations for the [[Combat Jump|jump]] to New Caprica.

== Questions ==

*Roslin and Zarek seem to have reconciled their differences and become friends. Given Saul Tigh's feeling that Roslin will resume the Presidency once humanity has left [[New Caprica]], and that Zarek used to be Baltar's vice president, will he assume the mantle of vice president under Laura Roslin?
**Or, will Zarek claim the presidency by legal succession if Baltar is removed from office?
*A Cavil mentions that he has different sensations after each download. He suffers a slight headache after the first and, after the third, a sensation like a white hot poker inside his skull. Is there damage to the consciousness during each downloading and is there a point where after so many downloads the consciousness is destroyed or corrupted?
**In the podcast for this episode, [[Ronald D. Moore]] reveals that the intent of Cavil's description was to show that there is a "cost" associated with downloading.
***Although [[Cylon Raider (RDM)|Cylon Raiders]] are not sentient to same degree as humanoid Cylons, [[Sharon Agathon]] describes a similar traumatizing after repeated deaths of the berserking Raider known as [[Scar (Raider)|Scar]].
***[[Number Three]] had commented in "[[Downloaded]]" on feeling refreshed like starting a new life when describing her download experience. [[Caprica-Six]] expressed adjustment issues, including her [[Cylon-Related Hallucinations|visions]] of Gaius Baltar.
****Number Three also said that following her first download she was klutzy for a time and frequently knocked things over or tripped.
*Are the [[Religion in the Twelve Colonies#The Lords of Kobol|Lords of Kobol]] real? Why are they sending accurate dreams to a Cylon? Why is a human oracle helping Three interpret the dreams?
**The gods are "real," at least as historical entities that lived on Kobol, a fact that even the Cylons acknowledge. The Cylons (and a number of Colonials) dispute their actual divinity. The Colonials appear to have some foresight from the gods through their [[oracle]]s. The connection of the Lords of Kobol to the Cylons is a curious (and unexplained) event in the case of the dreams of Number Three.
*Why does Doctor Cottle work to heal critically injured Cylons instead of just letting them die and be resurrected?
**The Cylons might want to minimize the trauma of downloading into a new body, although comments from Number Three to Cottle dispute this.
**Cottle is a physician, and has likely taken a vocational pledge to aid. Allowing a sentient being to die, regardless of their ideology, is breaching this oath through omission of action. He helped [[Sharon Agathon]] through her pregnancy for similar reasons.
***At least in TV drama, doctors in wartime have an affinity for helping everyone. There are plenty of [[Wikipedia:M*A*S*H (TV series)|''M*A*S*H'']] episodes that illustrate this.
*Where is "[[Download City]]"?
**It is possible that [[Seelix|Seelix's]] use of the phrase "Download City" is merely a euphemism for the download process the humanoid Cylon models go through.
**Download City may also be a reference to a downloading facility present on New Caprica.
***The Cylons would likely keep such a facility hidden to all humans on the planet, no matter what their relationship is to the Cylon occupation. The destruction by suicide or planted bomb of a download facility on New Caprica would spell real death for all agents there if Basestars aren't actually used for this purpose (this isn't likely, else the [[Resurrection Ship]] would not have been protected ''by'' Basestars).
****According to Bradley Thompson on [[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques]], Download City is simply Seelix's slang for whereever Cylon's go when they resurrect.
*Is there any possibility at all that Adama wasn't aware of Roslin's plans for Hera? ([[The Eye of Jupiter|Answer]])
**There are no direct indications that Adama is aware of Roslin's conspiracy regarding the baby. Given the positive changes in his relationship with Sharon Agathon, that seems to now be based on complete mutual trust, it is unlikely that he would keep such a profound secret from her, if he was aware of it.
**Additionally, Adama was quite direct with Helo regarding the plans to abort the child. Whatever his relationship with Sharon, it seems unlikely that Adama would rob Helo of his paternal rights in this way, particularly after Helo [[Epiphanies|brings up their respective fatherhood]].
**Dr. Cottle is a military officer and his actions would have to have been cleared through Adama. There may well be other reasons why Agathon wasn't told, including keeping the information from the Cylons in the event she was captured or downloaded.
***In military parlance, the president's authority supersedes that of an admiral, and a military officer does not need to report back to his commanding officer orders that originated from the president.
****However, Adama and Roslin agreed that ''all'' military matters rested with the Admiral, whereas Roslin was the civilian leader of the fleet. It stands to reason that Adama would have known.
*****That unofficial agreement was broken in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I]]" and there is no indication that they have restored it.
**The expression on Adama's face during his conversation with Sharon Agathon in "[[Occupation]]" suggests that he is aware of the conspiracy regarding Hera.
***Said expression may also be a reference to his guilt over the whole situation with Sharon Agathon/Boomer/Number Eight in general, and not a specific reference to Hera.
*What other operations are the Cylons busy with elsewhere in the universe, that are straining their resources for their experiment on New Caprica (also referenced to by Ron Moore in his podcast)?
*Will some humans refuse to leave once the escape begins?
*Will the escapees block proven or suspected collaborators from boarding the escaping ships?
**How many, if any, of the New Caprica Police are publicly known, and once the escape begins, what will be their ultimate fate?
*Adama's plan to use only ''Galactica'' and the ships remaining on the ground on New Caprica seems a bit unrealistic given the fact that there are over 39,000 colonists on the planet. How will they find room for all of the evacuees?
**It is very reasonable to assume that the carrying capacity of the ships approximates the number of people on the planet, since it is very resource-intensive to move people around in the ''Battlestar Galactica'' universe. The attrition suffered by the Colonials only improves this probability.
**Will the Colonials find time to also evacuate much of their critically-rationed supplies and equipment as well as themselves during the chaos of evacuation?
*Is Maya suspicious about Roslin's protectiveness of her and Isis?
**As mentioned in "[[Downloaded]]", Isis is said to have been a child given up by a senior ranking officer for political reasons. Maya may have been told that Isis, should she be captured, would make for a very valuable kidnapping asset, given her (supposed) parentage.
*What exactly has Caprica-Six given up for Gaius?
**To an extensive degree, Caprica is mistrusted by the other Cylons and while not thought to be a traitor per se, is probably considered a [[Wikipedia:Quisling|Quisling]]. This is what she may have meant.
* After Helo departs Admiral Adama's room after indicating that Sharon has the launch keys, Adama punches his desk, seemingly in frustration. Given that it is great news that Sharon has the keys and that they can now begin the rescue operation, why does Adama show anger/frustration? Is it his guilt over not being able to tell Helo and Sharon, who now has again proven her loyalty, that their daughter is alive?
** It can also be interpreted as Adama using the good news to break through the anger and frustration built up over the past several weeks of partly unsuccessful planning and training missions and not being able to do anything at the moment. Punching his desk can signify both anger and elation at the same time.
* If Cylon '[[skinjob|skinjobs]]' can share memories and experiences as implied in many previous episodes, why would Sharon believe that merely shooting Three in the knees would be sufficient to stop her warning the others?
** The sharing of memories and experiences may require access to a [[Cylon data port]], instead of being a wireless process.

== Analysis ==

* The [[Number Three]] that has been having dreams about Hera saw [[Sharon Agathon]] and was able to tell that she was the copy that had been left with Helo on Caprica. She may have deduced this from the fact that Sharon was taking the launch keys, or she may have been able to sense her identity somehow.
* Roslin's line about [[Hera]], "She may well be the shape of things to come", echoes similar lines by Six in "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]" and by Adama in "[[Valley of Darkness]]". "The Shape of Things to Come" is also the title of the orchestral music piece at the end of "[[Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II]]".
*Anders seems to know, or at least suspect, what is so special about Maya's child.
*[[Caprica-Six]] has been [[Cylon rebirthing tank|redownloaded]] after her "death" in [[Precipice]]. She was not "boxed".
*The Cylons on New Caprica appear to not have any sort of attachment to the humans they rule as evidenced by their willingness to just nuke the colony if they can't make it work as desired. This conflicts with the decision that their earlier attempt at genocide was a mistake. This is additional evidence of fundamental contradictions and disconnects within the Cylon psyche that they are blind to. Based on their actions to date, skinjob behavior tends toward the sociopathic with the exception of Boomer, Sharon, and Caprica-Six.
*Baltar has become a suicidal drunk - his appearance has become slovenly and he appears to have given up on basic grooming. He is also having trouble performing the act of sex with Caprica-Six.
*Admiral Adama's claim that his crew "will find immortality as only the Gods once knew" draws on [[wikipedia:Iliad#The story of the Iliad|the choice]] given to [[wikipedia:Achilles|Achilles]] by [[wikipedia:Thetis|his mother]] about joining the war in [[wikipedia:Troy|Troy]]: fight couragously and perish in battle, or be forgotten by history. Achilles chose to go to battle and is a legend. Adama's use of that theme strengthens the case for a link between the [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)|Twelve Colonies]] and the bronze-age [[wikipedia:Hellenistic civilization|Hellenistic culture]] of real Earth.
**[[Bradley Thompson]] and [[David Weddle]] deliberately draw inspirations from ancient stories like [[wikipedia:Homer|Homer]]'s [[wikipedia:Iliad|Iliad]]. Such references do not indicate whether there is such a link.
*There is a discontinuity between "[[Precipice]]" and this episode regarding the execution scene. First, Cally apparently changed direction between episodes for more dramatic effect. At the conclusion of "Precipice", Cally is shown jumping into a gully to the "left" of where the trucks are stopped, and is apparently shown running "down," toward the initial camera position. The camera shoots Cally from her right as she runs, showing a backdrop of trees and vines. In "Exodus, Part I", she is shown running to the "right," towards Tyrol and the other resistance fighters. The camera here is also from Cally's right, but this time she is running in front of a barren background. Secondly, the gunfire starts at a different time. At the conclusion of "Precipice", Cally is clearly shown running ''while'' the gunfire begins. In "Exodus, Part I", Tyrol throws her to the ground ''before'' it does.

== Notes ==

* There is also a comic called ''[[Exodus!]]'', which covers the events of [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|the Original Series]]' episode, "[[Saga of a Star World]]" (Part 2).
* This is the first episode where viewers have seen an [[oracle]]. Oracles such as [[Pythia]] and [[Galen Tyrol]]'s mother have been mentioned but not seen.
* Tyrol inexplicably lost his beard before this episode. This was necessary because Aaron Douglas's scenes were shot weeks after the main part of the episode, when he had already shaved and it was felt that a fake beard would not be convincing.
*[[Chamalla]] is a bitter herb, and oracles sometimes use candy to sweeten it up.
*{{spoilli|According to [[Ronald Moore]]'s podcast, in earlier drafts [[Jammer]] was going to die during the shootout at the execution site. However, he decided that the character would be used in later episodes of the season.}}

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

*''As Chief Tyrol is about to leave Tigh's tent'':''
:'''Colonel Tigh''': Chief! Pull it together.. You won't do her any good if you get caught too.. Besides, the last thing your son wants is me and Ellen for parents..

*''Before Lee Adama departs ''Galactica'':''
:'''Admiral William Adama''': I'll see you at the rendezvous point.
:'''Commander Lee Adama''': Eighteen hours. Try not to be late.
:'''William Adama''': I'm getting old; I'm a little slow, but I'll be there.
:'''Lee Adama''': Gods, I wish I could talk you out of this...
:'''William Adama''': You can't. You tried.
:'''Lee Adama''': You know, Dad, um...
:'''William Adama''': Don't. Don't make me cry on my own hangar deck.

*''During the [[Salt Line Ceremony]] on the hangar deck:''
:'''Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson''': Their enemies will divide them, their colonies broken in the fiery chasm of space. The shining days renounced by a multitude of dark sacrifices. Yet still they will remain. Always together.

*''As Galactica prepares to return to New Caprica:''
:'''Admiral Adama''': This is the Admiral. You've heard the news. You know the mission. You should also know that there is only one way that this mission ends, and that's with the successful rescue of our people off of [[New Caprica]]. Look around you. Take a good look at the men and women that stand next to you. Remember their faces, for one day you will tell your children and your grandchildren that you served with such men and women as the universe has never seen. And together you accomplished a feat that will be told and retold down through the ages, and find immortality as only the Gods once knew. I'm proud to serve with you. Good hunting.

== Official Statements ==

== Guest Stars ==
*[[Michael Hogan]] as [[Saul Tigh]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Tahmoh Penikett]] as Lt. [[Karl Agathon|Karl "Helo" Agathon]]
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as [[Cally Tyrol]]
*[[Alessandro Juliani]] as [[Felix Gaeta]] (credit only)
*[[Kandyse McClure]] as [[Anastasia Dualla]]
*[[Michael Trucco]] as [[Samuel Anders]]
*[[Amanda Plummer]] as [[Oracle]] [[Selloi Dodona|Selloi]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Callum Keith Rennie]] as [[Leoben Conoy]]
*[[Kate Vernon]] as [[Ellen Tigh]]
*[[Donnelly Rhodes]] as Dr. [[Cottle]]
*[[Matthew Bennett]] as [[Number Five]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Dean Stockwell]] as [[Cavil]]
*[[Erica Cerra]] as [[Maya]]
*[[Luciana Carro]] as Lt. [[Louanne Katraine|Louanne "Kat" Katraine]]
*[[Brad Dryborough]] as Lt. [[Hoshi]]
*[[Leah Cairns]] as Lt. [[Margaret Edmondson|Margaret "Racetrack" Edmondson]]
*[[Madeline Parker]] as [[Kacey]]
*[[Dominic Zamprogna]] as [[James Lyman|James "Jammer" Lyman]]
*[[Eileen Pedde]] as [[Erin Mathias|Mathias]]
*[[Jennifer Halley]] as [[Seelix]]
*[[Ty Olsson]] as Captain [[Aaron Kelly]]
*[[Ryan Robbins]] as [[Charlie Connor|Connor]]

== References ==
<div style="font-size:85%"><references/></div>

{{episode list (RDM season 3)}}

[[Category:Episodes written by Bradley Thompson]]
[[Category:Episodes written by David Weddle]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Félix Enríquez Alcalá]]
[[Category:RDM]]

[[de:Exodus, Part I]]

The Captain's Hand

2007-01-09T18:18:35Z

Madbrood: Linking to combat jump

{{Episode Data
| image = Adamas.jpg
| title= The Captain's Hand
| season= 2
| episode= 17
| guests= [[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
| writer= [[Jeff Vlaming]]
| story=
| director= [[Sergio Mimica-Gezzan]]
| production=
| rating= 1.7
| US airdate= 2006-02-17
| UK airdate= 2006-04-25
| dvd= {{Season 2.5 NTSC DVD release date}} '''US''' {{Season 2 PAL DVD release date}} '''UK'''
| population= 49,584
| prev= [[Sacrifice]]
| next= [[Downloaded]]
| podcast= Y
}}

== Overview ==

:''When two Raptors go missing after a training mission, new ''Pegasus'' commander [[Barry Garner]] challenges Admiral [[William Adama|Adama]]'s orders by sending his battlestar directly into the rescue zone — and a trap.''

== Summary ==
*Two [[Raptor]]s begin a training mission outside ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'', which is near a [[Wikipedia:Binary star system|binary star]] that causes [[Dradis|DRADIS]] and communications interference. Shortly after, contact with the Raptors is lost.

*On ''[[Galactica]]'', [[Galen Tyrol|Chief Tyrol]] and the deck crew are in the process of unloading containers, Chief Tyrol finds a pregnant teenager inside who asks for [[Cottle|Dr. Cottle]].

*[[Lee Adama]], now promoted to Major, arrives as acting [[Executive officer|XO]] on the [[Mercury class battlestar|battlestar]] ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'', where he runs into [[Kara Thrace]]. Both report to Commander Garner in ''Pegasus''' [[CIC]]. Garner argues with now-Captain Thrace over the disappearance of the Raptors.

*[[Barry Garner|Commander Garner]] and Major Adama talk in private about the discipline on ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]''. Garner thinks that [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]] is a huge part of the problem and that the virtues learned in his experience as an engineer would do the ship some good.

*On ''[[Colonial One]]'', [[Laura_Roslin|President Roslin]] is hounded by her new aide, [[Tory Foster]], about preparing for the coming election. Elsewhere, [[Tom Zarek]] discusses the idea of presidency. He concedes he's not able to garner support, but is willing to support someone more popular: [[Gaius Baltar|Dr. Baltar]].

*Back on ''Galactica'', Dr. [[Cottle]] & Admiral Adama discuss the fate of the young woman found in the container, [[Rya Kibby]]. Kibby mentions the fact that she doesn't want to keep the baby, but Admiral Adama (on request from the Gemenese delegate) is intent on sending her back to her family. Dr. Cottle suggests that she request asylum aboard ''Galactica''.

*News of Rya Kibby's asylum request raises a stir throughout the [[The Fleet (RDM)|Fleet]]. [[Laura Roslin|President Roslin]] discusses the issue with Admiral Adama, Tory Foster, and Delegate [[Sarah_Porter|Sarah Porter]] from [[The Twelve Colonies (RDM)#Gemonon|Gemenon]]. Delegate Porter states that abortion is a obscenity and demands that the girl be returned to her parents. Afterwards, President Roslin mentions she's not willing to even consider the idea of abortion in general, having fought for a woman's right to control her body for her entire career, but Admiral Adama reminds her that their population must increase in order to survive.

*While reviewing the last transmissions from the Raptors, [[Kara Thrace|Starbuck]] discovers the reason for the missing Raptors may be that they responded to a distress call. She attempts to bring this up with Commander Garner, who flatly rejects the theory. Additional search parties learn of the distress call that lured the first Raptors away. Commander Garner decides to start preparing the ''Pegasus'' for a jump.

*Over [[wireless]], [[Barry Garner|Commander Garner]], Major Adama, and [[William Adama|Admiral Adama]] discuss the missing Raptor situation. Commander Garner feels that ''Pegasus'' should [[FTL|jump]] to bring home the missing crews and ships, while the Admiral and Major believe it may be a trap and orders a 5-Raptor recon mission to ascertain the training mission's fate.

*Garner orders a [[Combat Jump|combat jump]] despite Admiral Adama's orders. [[SAR]] Raptors at the rescue site find both Raptors, but the crews are dead. At that moment, three [[Basestar (RDM)|basestars]] ambush ''Pegasus'' with conventional and nuclear missile barrages seconds after their arrival.

*''Pegasus''' [[FTL]] drive is disabled. Garner attempts to determine the FTL failure's cause from CIC., but the Engineering crew are confused from the attack. Commander Garner heads down to Engineering to assess the damage, and transfers command of ''Pegasus'' to Major Adama. Adama orders ''Pegasus'' to target one of the Basestars with its forward batteries, severely damaging the basestar and buying them more time.

*Garner's successful repair of their FTL system allows ''Pegasus'' to escape. Commander Garner, however, dies in the process due to vaccum exposure.

*In [[William Adama|Admiral Adama's]] quarters, the Admiral and [[Lee Adama|Major Adama]] review the reports from the incident on ''Pegasus''. After discussing the late ''Pegasus'' commander, the Admiral offers his son the job of commanding ''Pegasus'', along with a promotion to Commander.

*[[Gaius Baltar]] proclaims his candidacy for President of the Colonies in the Presidential election in the midst of a press conference called by [[Laura Roslin|President Roslin]] regarding abortion in the Fleet.

== Questions ==
*Why was [[Rya Kibby]] seeking an abortion? Who was the biological father to Rya's unborn child?
*Would Adama allow Dr. Cottle to be arrested, give that he is one of the few remaining Doctors? From the episode, he is of the opinion that he would do what is necessary.
*Was Baltar's report real, or was it just invented to produce the opportunity to drive his wedge?
*Who will replace Baltar as Roslin's Vice President?
**Can Roslin actually pick another Vice President, under Colonial law, if Baltar refuses to resign? One of the reporters at the end actually directly asks if Baltar would remain as Vice President. Perhaps Roslin cannot forcibly remove Baltar from his office just because he's running against her.
*How will Zarek position himself in the Baltar campaign? ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part I|Answer]])
*Will Tigh accept the fact that Lee Adama now outranks him and has command of a ship?
*What will happen to Rya now that she has been granted asylum on ''Galactica''?
*Had Garner been serving as XO to ''Pegasus's'' previous commander, the late [[Jack Fisk]]?
*Does the fact that the Cylons had such a large force waiting to ambush ''Pegasus'' indicate that they have a new [[Resurrection Ship]] in place?
*How does the double layer flight pod system on ''Pegasus'' operate? Just before the battlestar jumps away from the ambush, there is a short sequence of Vipers returning to the ship that shows them landing on two distinct levels of the flight pod, with Vipers landing on the lower level being upside down with respect to ''Pegasus''. Does it work with artificial gravity or do the flightpods always operate in zero-g? (For more on the use of artificial gravity, see the article, [[Science in the Re-imagined Series]]).
*How could abortion be legal and established throughout the Colonies despite being against the religious views of at least one planet? Does this indicate a strong central government, that can dictate laws against the wishes of large population groups, instead of a federal system with the planet's having more autonomy?
*What kind of equipment is available to fix small breaches such as the one in the ''Pegasus'''s engine room? [[Helo]] uses a hand-held pressure pad to seal a minor breach in the damaged Raptor during the [[Miniseries]] right after he receives his leg wound. Would such a device not help here?
*Now that Lee Adama is commanding ''Pegasus'', who does he have for an XO since it is apparent both battlestars are short field grade officers? Does he elevate Stinger to XO, or does he bring someone from ''Galactica''? ([[Lay Down Your Burdens, Part II|Answer, Post-LDYB, Part I]])

== Analysis ==
*When Baltar announces his candidacy for the Presidency, Number Six applauds with a slow clap. This action runs in parallel to how then-Commander William Adama led the entire crew in a long, drawn-out slow clap in respect of President Roslin when she was re-instated to her office in "[[Home, Part II]]".
*Survivor count is decremented by six from "[[Sacrifice]]", but seven people died in that episode - terrorists [[Sesha Abinell]], [[Vinson]], [[Page]] and [[Chu]], two unnamed marines, and civilian [[Billy Keikeya]]. At least one birth must have taken place to offset the population count between the two episodes.
*Based on the ''[[Colonial One]]'' whiteboard seen toward the end of the episode, only five people died as a result of the ambush on ''Pegasus'': [[Richard Bayer|Richard "Buster" Bayer]], [[Lyla Ellway|Lyla "Shark" Ellway]], the unnamed crew of [[Raptor 314]], and Commander [[Barry Garner]].
**This casualty figure is conspicuously low, considering that ''Galactica'' lost 85 crewmen as the result of a hit by a single nuclear missile in the [[miniseries]], while ''Pegasus'' is hit with no less than three in this episode.
**On the other hand, it is at least consistent with the surprisingly low number of casualties incurred in the [[Battle of the Resurrection Ship]], and may indicate that the hull armor on ''Pegasus'' is significantly stronger than on ''Galactica'', which has many conspicuously bare structural ribs.
**A large number of the casualties ''Galactica'' incurred were due to the firefighting crews failure to use breathing gear when Tigh ordered the flight pod vented. However, based on dialogue in this episode, it appears that the ''Pegasus'' firefighting teams did take this precaution.
* It seems clear now that the Cylons are again shadowing the fleet. They are doing so accurately enough to vector three basestars onto ''Pegasus''. Why do they not attack the fleet itself? The trap for ''Pegasus'' was somewhat laborious. This returns us to theories that the Cylons want the fleet to survive, even with ''Galactica'', but that the arrival of ''Pegasus'' throws some of their calculations out.
**The Cylons never stopped shadowing the Fleet, per "[[Scar]]" etc. They were just afraid to engage because the Resurrection Ship was destroyed. In the past, one Basestar was willing to simply wade into ''Galactica'' and its Vipers, but now they're resorted to both a sneak attack/trap, and ganging up on a battlestar using superior numbers. The Cylons set up the trap, so they knew where to jump and that's why it was so accurate. In no way does this support a theory that the Cylons want the Fleet to survive, and further, [[Ron Moore]] has repeatedly stated that the Cylons aren't doing that and truly want to destroy the Fleet (at least, before the season 2 finale).
*In the course of this episode's timeline, [[Lee Adama]] rises from the rank of Captain (CAG of ''[[Galactica]]'') to Major (No details are given on that posting except Adama was assigned to [[Pegasus (RDM)|''Pegasus'']]), to Commander and CO of [[Pegasus (RDM)|''Pegasus'']] in the wake of Commander [[Barry Garner|Barry Garner's]] death saving his ship.
**Major Adama's duty was intended as a temporary stint as ''Pegasus'' acting XO, to familiarize himself with the duties of a senior officer. In the opening scene, he tells [[Anastasia Dualla]] that he expects to return to ''Galactica'' "in a couple of weeks".
*Garner's decision to mount a rescue operation in contravention of his commanding officer's orders is an explicit parallel to "[[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]", down to the choice of words:
:'''Adama:''' "I'm getting my men."
:'''Garner:''' "I'm going to get our men."
*Kara Thrace's posting is finally clarified in this episode: she is now serving as CAG on ''[[Galactica]]''.
**She was transferred to ''Pegasus'' in "[[Pegasus (episode)|Pegasus]]" and then promoted to that ship's CAG over [[Cole Taylor|Cole "Stinger" Taylor]] in "[[Resurrection Ship, Part I]]". In "[[Epiphanies]]", it is made clear that Lee Adama regained his posting as ''Galactica's'' CAG. In "[[Epiphanies]]", Thrace is seen piloting one of ''Galactica's'' Mk. II Vipers with Kat; in "[[Scar]]" she is serving on Galactica, and appears to have assumed the majority of Adama's responsibilities as CAG, although she still takes orders from him.
**During this episode it's mentioned that she's only been on board ''Pegasus'' for four days before getting thrown in the brig: probably referring to the time she spent away on ''Galactica'' in "Scar" and in the Fleet on leave in "Sacrifice".
*Although there's no clear evidence of this, it's nice to imagine that when Admiral Adama promoted his son to Commander, he gave Lee his old Commander rank insignia.
**This is actually quite likely; the decision to bump Lee to Commander seemed to have been made immediately following Garner's debacle, and given that Billy had to search extensively for a jeweler to get Adama his Admiral's insignia, giving Lee his old rank insignia was probably as much practicality as it was sentiment.

== Notes ==
*Timeline-wise, Baltar says that he made an initial projection of the fleet's population "over seven months ago". This would have been before the arrival of ''Pegasus'', since he said he factored in the arrival of her crew subsequently.
*Baltar states that he added the crew of the ''Pegasus'' into his calculations, with the result of the end of the human race within 18 years at current attrition rates.
*It has been "almost a month" since Apollo was shot in "[[Sacrifice]]".
*The recap at the beginning of this episode includes two scenes that did not actually appear in any previous episode, but were constructed by redubbing existing footage.
**The scene where Colonel Tigh and Admiral Adama discuss Garner's promotion is constructed from the scene in "Black Market" when Adama and Tigh are telling Apollo to go to ''Pegasus'' on the hangar deck. The scene has been cleverly redubbed, so that Adama is saying entirely new lines when the camera is pointed at ''Tigh'' (not at Adama's face), and then Tigh says new lines when the camera is pointed at ''Adama''.
**The same technique is used when Baltar is talking to Gina: when the camera is pointed at Baltar, we hear [[Gina]] saying "You must betray Roslin and run for President in the upcoming election", but this was never heard in the aired version of "[[Epiphanies]]".
*From the podcast, it seems that the "previously" scene (above) was actually meant for "[[Black Market]]", but the original hangar deck scene had to be heavily edited due to the legal complications surrounding Commander Barry Garner's name. The character was originally named "Barry Trammel", but at the last minute it had to be changed for legal reasons when the production team found that there was a real person with that name.
*Captain [[Cole Taylor|Cole "Stinger" Taylor]] is still on''Pegasus'', mentioned by Kara Thrace as being in the brig for insubordination.
*The adjectival form of "Gemenon" is "Gemenese".
*Under Gemenese law, minors are the "property" of their parents.
*[[Mercury class battlestar]]s do not need to retract their flight pods prior to a jump, unlike the [[Galactica type battlestar|Galactica type]].
*The coolant pressure gauges on ''Pegasus'' measure in PSI, presumably [[Wikipedia:Pound-force per square inch|Pound-force per square inch]]. This is consistent with the use of customary units on the Viper Mk. II's altimeter, seen in "[[Act of Contrition]]".
*The distance between ''Pegasus'' and the lost Raptors is reported in "SU" units. This may be the Colonials' equivalent of the [[Wikipedia:Astronomical unit|Astronomical unit]] (AU); an AU is based on the distance between Earth and the Sun, so it would seem illogical for the planets of the Twelve Colonies to share this exact measurement.
*This is the fourth episode of the season in which [[Grace Park]] has not appeared as [[Sharon Valerii]].
*Writer Jeff Vlaming references [[Wikipedia:William Shakespeare|Shakespeare]]'s "[[Wikipedia:The Merchant of Venice|The Merchant of Venice]]" when he has [[Laura Roslin]] tell [[Quorum of Twelve]] delegate [[Sarah Porter]], "you have your pound of flesh".
*Sharon warned Admiral Adama in the previous episode, "[[Sacrifice]]", that the Cylons might try to lay ambushes near some pulsar stars ahead of their position, due to DRADIS interference.
*Based on the promo images for the episodes, it appears that in a deleted scene, Rya tried to kill herself by overdosing on pills when she was told she couldn't have an abortion, and she had to be resuscitated.
*This episode had the lowest [[Wikipedia:Nielsen Ratings|Nielsen Ratings]] figure that an episode of the Re-Imagined Series ever received, although the episode was well-received by critics and fans; this is possibly the backlash from what Ron Moore himself feels were the less desirable episodes "Black Market" and "Sacrifice".
*Several fans felt that in the final scene with Apollo and Starbuck embracing, Apollo whispered "forever" into Starbuck's ear (after his last line that "we're okay", etc.). However on repeat viewing it's just Starbuck sighing three short times in a row, which vaguely sounds like three syllables. When actor Jamie Bamber was [http://mboard.scifi.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=1833539&page=0&fpart=86&vc=1 asked] about this, he confirmed that he did ''not'' whisper "forever".

== Noteworthy Dialogue ==

*{{audio|The Captain's Hand - Lee's promotion.mp3|''Following the Cylon ambush of ''Pegasus'' and the death of Commander Garner.''}}
:'''Admiral Adama''': In your opinion, off the record, what was [[Barry Garner|Garner]]'s flaw?
:'''Major Lee Adama''': He was used to working with machines. Command is about people.
:'''Admiral Adama''': Remember that, as you take command of "The Beast" (''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]''). Garner was my decision; his failures, my responsibility. Don't let me fail a second time. Congratulations, Commander.

*{{audio|The Captain's Hand - Baltar's announcement.mp3|''Responding to President Roslin's decision to criminalize abortion.''}}
:'''Vice-President Baltar''': It is true in the light of recent events, the President may have lost support in some quarters. I would ask the people to understand that if this is an extreme decision, we live in extreme times. The decision has been made with good faith. I, however, cannot with good conscience support it. I am so sorry, Madame President, but the Cylon have no understanding the meaning of the word "freedom". How could they? They're programmed...machines. Every time you take away one of our freedoms, every time we restrict or curtail one of our rights, we become one step closer to being like them. As the Vice-President, I am bound to follow the administration's lead; as President, I should have no such strictures. Given the current situation, I'm afraid that I have no alternative but to announce that I am, as of now, a candidate for the Presidency.

== Guest Stars ==

*[[John Heard]] as Commander [[Barry Garner]]
*[[Richard Hatch]] as [[Tom Zarek]]
*[[Aaron Douglas]] as Chief [[Galen Tyrol]]
*[[Nicki Clyne]] as Specialist [[Cally]]
*[[Donnelly Rhodes]] as Dr. [[Cottle]]
*[[Rekha Sharma]] as [[Tory Foster]]
*[[Brad Dryborough]] as Lieutenant [[Hoshi]]
*[[Christian Tessier]] as [[Tucker Clellan|Tucker "Duck" Clellan]]
*[[Amber Rothwell]] as [[Rya Kibby]]
*[[Kavan Smith]] as Lt. [[Richard Bayer|Richard "Buster" Bayer]]
*[[Stephanie von Pfetten]] as Cpt. [[Marcia Case|Marcia "Showboat" Case]]
*[[Patricia Idlette]] as [[Sarah Porter]]
*[[Aaron Pearl]] as Ensign [[Abel Thornton]]
*[[Christina Schild]] as [[Playa Palacios]]
*[[Tammy Hui]] as ECO [[Lyla Ellway|Lyla "Shark" Ellway]]
*[[James Bell]] as Lt. [[Steve Fleer|Steve "Red Devil" Fleer]]
*[[Kurt Max Runte]] as Ensign [[Charles Bellamy]]
*[[Kimani Ray Smith]] as ''Pegasus'' Sergeant

{{episode list (RDM season 2)}}

[[Category:A to Z|Captain's Hand, The]]
[[Category:Episode Guide (RDM)|Captain's Hand, The]]
[[Category:Episodes written by Jeff Vlaming]]
[[Category:Episodes directed by Sergio Mimica-Gezzan]]
[[Category:RDM]]

[[de:Mensch und Maschine]]

Combat jump

2007-01-09T18:16:21Z

Madbrood: New page: A '''combat jump''' is an FTL jump in which the exit co-ordinates are likely to put the jumping vessel in harm's way, with a high probability of an armed exchange directly followin...

A '''combat jump''' is an [[FTL|FTL jump]] in which the exit co-ordinates are likely to put the jumping vessel in harm's way, with a high probability of an armed exchange directly following or soon after the jump. Preparation for a combat jump involves different procedures than a standard jump. These are likely to include things such as:

*Arming and posting of [[Colonial Marine Corps|Marine]] defence teams in order to repel potential boarding parties

*The loading of additional [[Vipers]] to supplement the [[Alert Fighters|alert fighters]]

The vessel's Commanding Officer will also likely call for [[Action stations|Condition One]] to be set, readying the ship for an immediate engagement following the jump.

==Notes==

The battlestar ''[[Pegasus (RDM)|Pegasus]]'' made a combat jump shortly before the [[Battle of the Binary Star System]]. ''[[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]]'' made a combat jump to initiate the [[Battle of New Caprica]]. It should be noted, however, that in both instances, the jump was not immediately followed by combat.

Talk:Swallow/Archive 1

2007-01-09T17:23:43Z

Madbrood: /* Heat Seeking? */

==Heat Seeking?==

How do we know missiles are heat-seeking? I know it's a minor point, but unless there's solid proof, I reckon this should be re-worded. -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:05, 9 January 2007 (CST)
:Changed from "heat-seeking" to "guided" .... you're absolutely right. Swallows seem to be more like an ECM package than a flare. [[User:JubalHarshaw|JubalHarshaw]] 11:09, 9 January 2007 (CST)
::Thanks :) I'd have changed it myself, but I wasn't sure if there WAS a source or not -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 11:23, 9 January 2007 (CST)