Battlestar Wiki - User contributions [en]

User talk:Jetstorm316

2006-09-06T08:31:27Z

Jetstorm316: /* AVI */

== Welcome to Battlestar Wiki! ==

Welcome to the Wiki, Jetstorm316. Feel free to tell us about yourself on [[User:Jetstorm316|your user page]]. Before you get started on other edits, please read the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions]], which details the policies we use in editing pages (this differs from many other wikis in consistent use of phrasing, abbreviations, format, and the like).

Thanks for your rapid submissions — we welcome enthusiastic contributors. While not always easy, it's important to search around a bit before creating new articles. While the patches you've uploaded are interesting, the new [[Colonial arm patches and insignia]] article you created conflicts in part with the existing [[Military Ranks (RDM)]] and [[Military Ranks (TOS)]] articles, which already have much of this information. As an administrator, I need to mark your article as a candidate for deletion, but I strongly encourage you to move the relevant patches to the appropriate Military Ranks articles. We'll keep your page up for a time while you transfer the relevant information. Keep in mind that your uploaded pictures (unless they are actual screenshots or other Universal/Sci-Fi-distributed information) must have a source and be allowed here under our Creative Commons license or under ''fair use'' guidelines. If the items are likenesses to items that have a ''de facto'' copyright (such as the patches), these should be OK under ''fair use''. You may want to read the project article [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad|on official and verifiable sources]] as well.

Also, if you have any questions or suggestions you wish to offer, please feel free to do so either on your user talk page, the [[Battlestar Wiki:Wikipedian Quorum|Wikipedian Quorum]] or [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Administrators' noticeboard]]. Remember to sign your posts on any talk pages using four tildes (~~~~)! We look forward to your contributions to the community! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:56, 20 February 2006 (EST)

== Don't Take it Personally ==
The Merovengian has a way of rubbing most people the wrong way. Don't take it personally. On the same note, it'd probably be wise not to make it personal with him, either. I don't think he's seen much (if any) of the [[Battlestar Galactica (TOS)|Original Series]], though he certainly isn't in the minority with that regard around here. Our uniforms page is in desperate need of some color (pictures), and the spirit of your contribution is definitely great. Some of the other editors are just worried about redundancy (which should generally be avoided) and copyright issues (which must be avoided at all costs). I'd reccomend working trying to work it out on that article's [[Talk:Colonial arm patches and insignia|talk page]], or the [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|Admin noticeboard]] before getting into a shooting match with Merv. It's likely that a way can be found to find a place for most/all of your contributions, all without having to pull out the BSG-o-meter to determine who the "biggest" fan is. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 16:54, 20 February 2006 (EST)

:Steelviper, I would like you to visit my [[User talk:The Merovingian|Talk page]], in which I make a full rebuttal to this. Done? Thanks. --->Long story short, you deleted many of his images, and all I actually did was remove several links to "patches and insignia" which it appears will soon be deleted. Because he is new and not familiar with how to use History pages (I assume), Jetstorm316 then ran to my talk page and made a rant blaming me for the loss of his images after "much hard work", etc.

However, I hasten to point out SteelViper that '''He openly admits that he got many of these images off a E-Bay, and several are obviously wrong''': case in point, he provided the following image: [[Image:Arm patch 1.jpg|right|300px]]

This is clearly not correct, despite his claims of hard work: Pegasus' Battlestar Group was 62, not 63. He would have noticed if he paid closer attention, as he claims. I do not want to assign blame, all I want to do is point out that '''I seriously doubt that any of these images are properly sourced, and as such, have much actual worth'''. Please check out my talk page for more details, and you shall see why his attack on me is really baseless. 5 by 5. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 20:19, 20 February 2006 (EST)

:The images I deleted were all unused duplicates (from the Special: Unususedimages.) I left the ones that he used. As for the BSG 63 vs. 62... I think it's pretty clear from Captain's Hand that it is BSG 62. I was just trying to keep it from getting personal. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:34, 20 February 2006 (EST)

== Jetstorm316 vs Merv ==
It is considered a breach in [[Wikipedia:WP:Wikiquette|Wikiquette]] to edit the talk postings of other users, as you did [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/en/index.php?title=User_talk:The_Merovingian&curid=2761&diff=33524&oldid=33505&rcid=31001 here]. Editing the talk page is fine, but try not to edit the content/arguments of others on those pages. The Merovengian has since restored the text that you removed from his post, but please refrain from doing so again in the future. Hopefully this situation can be resolved in a civil manner. There's no need for anybody to do anything rash. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:09, 21 February 2006 (EST)

What's the matter, did he come crying back to y'all "jetstorm told me off!". Tell him to file it under I for "I don't give a damn!". He got his butt waxed, end of discussion. If he's got something to add, bring it!--Jetstorm316

*I request that, the evidence speaking for itself, this user be banned RFN.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:33, 21 February 2006 (EST)

:Before doing anything rash, let's step back for a second and recap what's happened so far.
:# Jetstorm316 joins the site yesterday, contributing a new article.
:# Spencerian marks the new article for deletion, suggesting that the content might be merged with existing articles.
:# The Merovingian agrees, using his signature "[[Wikipedia:Gunboat diplomacy|diplomacy]]".
:# Jetstorm316 strikes back at Merv's comments about not recognizing the patches, sparking a personal exchange on talk pages.
:I don't think this situation has escalated to the "ban" category yet. (Other Admins are free to step in and correct me if I am wrong). If you look at the [http://www.battlestarwiki.org/en/index.php?title=Special%3ALog&type=block&user=&page= Block Log], you'll see that blocks are not done lightly. While I'll grant that 'Take this "Site", bend over and shove it! I'll start my own, you dumb yank!' is certainly inflammatory, it was also posted in the heat of the moment (something to which I'm sure you can relate). Call me naive, but it is still my hope that Jetstorm316 might be able to stick around and become a valuable contributor here. He's new to the place, but rather than trying to run him off right away, perhaps we should instead try to show him the ropes. Rather than expending energy in conflict with each other, perhaps our efforts would be better spent [[Talk:Colonial arm patches and insignia|over here]], discussing where Jetstorm316's contributions might best be placed. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:01, 21 February 2006 (EST)

:::"''How you survived this long, I will never know...''". You're a better man than I, SteelViper. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 00:23, 22 February 2006 (EST)

::I won't say that this situation cries out for a ban immediately, but editing other user's coments on talk pages and using childish potty language definitely puts him on thin ice in my book. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 12:10, 21 February 2006 (EST)

Can I bring Mr. Fargo's attention to point no.3 of Steelvipers comments on this matter. Besides, I've washed my hands of this matter and moved on. Childish potty language was designed to get his attention, which clearly worked. Remember, I do have the freedom to carry out my promise, should I be given sufficiant reason to..... --Jetstorm316

:There is no excuse for behaving that way, even when provoked. Don't do it again. That is all. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:16, 21 February 2006 (EST)

::Can ''I'' bring everyone's point of attention to something: No, he has not "washed his hands of this and moved on"; all of his recent posts were devoted to just this, and the brief Dress Uniform discussion on the Uniform page. That doesn't not ''seem'' like moving on to me; however, perhaps he meant "in attitude and intention" or something, that he personally has dropped the matter; I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, and if he accepts these Administrator chastisements and agrees to abide by our rules, all is well; I'm not like bearing a grudge or something, demanding punishment; simply, as Farago stated above; No, "potty language to get attention" is not welcome here, and you should not try to defend it on the grounds that it gets attention. I don't know. I leave this matter to the Administrators, and if it persists, I am sure they will do what they think is best. 5 by 5. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 00:31, 22 February 2006 (EST)

(Callmly put)Point proved. What? didn't think I'd expect this? Typical. TTFN..........--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]] Thead ends

== Mini Profile + Pic ==
The profile on my user page is the Character data template. The actual code that generates it is:
"<nowiki>
{{Character Data|
|photo=[[Image:Steelviper.jpg|200px]]
|age= 26
|colony=[[Earth]]
|birthname=Matt Williams
|callsign=Steelviper
|death=
|parents=
|siblings=
|children=
|marital status=Married
|role=Battlestar Wikipedian
|rank=Admin
|actor=
|cylon=
}}
</nowiki>"

(Without the quotes or the nowiki tags.) A cleaner look can be had by just hitting edit on my user page (or any other article that uses that template), and copy-n-pasting it to yours. Blank fields aren't shown (for the most part), but must be included or else ugly code shows through on display. I think I copy-n-pasted mine from [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] when I went to create mine. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:53, 21 February 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniforms RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B)Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C)Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D)Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E)Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas?
--[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:You might get more responses if you post this over [[Talk:Uniform|here]]. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:04, 21 February 2006 (EST)

Got a good communique going on uniform, consider this topic, redirected to relevent site--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

== Cylon Command Chain ==

Well, "Downloaded" has raised a few questions.

As far as we can gather:
D'anna Biers = 3
Aaron Doral = 5
Gina = 6 (or Caprica Six)
Shannon Valerii = 8

This still leaves Leoben Conoy and Dr "Simon" (The Farm) to be placed within the number chain.

"Who's number one?"

We all know that there are 12 Cylon models, 6 have been identified, with 6 to be shown.
[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

Basically, we get the impression that A) Cylons are based so much on unity that they don't quite have the same concept of a "hierarchical command chain" as we do, but at the same time B) the "older" (that is, earlier number) models like Number Three appear to have more authority/influence/responsibility, though this might not exactly be a "rank". Intruiging glimpses.
Yes. Who is Number One? You are Number Six!--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 14:01, 2 March 2006 (CST)

"I'm not a number, I'm a free man! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!" -''The Prisoner''-- [[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

Are the lower numbers older? I'm certainly not suggesting they were counting backwards (THAT would be a recipe for disaster... or for numbers 0 through -infinity), but I wonder if it was an incremental process or if they just decided to develop twelve different "flavors" at the same time. He's going to keep those unrevealed Cylon model numbers as an ace up the sleave, I imagine. ESPECIALLY model number 1, who even if they were all created at the same time would possess a numerical position of importance (at least in the eyes of the viewer). If humans were developing Cylons (the Cylon?... stupid plural) Number One would definitely be older, with the later models gaining the advantage of experience with the process. A machine might more readily be able to undertake the task to do them all at once. I have a hard time imagining the new toasters going from tearing apart some Colonials, to tree-planting, to "Hey lets make some biological models." The human model creation story will be an interesting one to see unfold. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:16, 2 March 2006 (CST)

realisticly, Older models, like 0005 or "TOASTERS", would be at the bottom of the command chain, then the subordinate newer Cylon Centurion, then the 12 models.

But, here's food for thought.....

Would a Human Cylon be created and implanted on every colony, hence Gina on Caprica,ect?......--[[user:jestorm316|jetstorm316]]

Oh it wasn't just Number Six with Baltar; she was the MAIN one, but the idea is that they were spread out all over the Colonies softening up Colonial targets. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 01:35, 3 March 2006 (CST)

That's my point exactly, it could have been Boomer on Picon, or Dr "Simon" on Vergon, and so forth. Gina took out the defence main frame, whereas D'anna Beirs could have interupted crutial communications between the fleet.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

"Gina" is just the one on Pegasus; the one on Caprica has been named "Caprica-Six" in hilarious reference to our fan-naming system.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 13:32, 3 March 2006 (CST)

Note in the mini series, Gina was on Caprica "First".

What Military purpose did she serve on Pegasus?

Answer - None
.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:No, "[[Gina]]" is "Pegasus-Six"; at the time of the attack, during the Miniseries, Pegasus was at Scorpion Fleet Shipyards, around Scorpion, which is an entirely different planet than Caprica. [[Caprica-Six]] was on Caprica "First". We don't know; they didn't tell use what she did on Pegasus, simply that she infiltrated it. Maybe she bombed something. We don't know, but it doesn't matter now. Maybe she gave away their position. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 17:43, 3 March 2006 (CST)

But, if you look at the professions of the cylons, the've infiltrated key possitions within the colonies. "Gina" probably did the same as Aaron Doral onboard Galactica.

Plus, "Gina", "Caprica Six" and "Pegasus Six" are all alias's used to identify one clone from another.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

...Are you agreeing with me or not? My understanding was, you were calling the Number Six on Caprica, "Gina", and I just pointed out that she was on Pegasus. I mean I'm not talking about what they were doing or nothing.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 01:58, 4 March 2006 (CST)

I agree that Gina is an alias used by Number Six, for all we know Caprica Six also uses the same alias before the war broke out. And yes, I did know Pegasus Six was on "Pegasus" she now lives on Cloud Nine.--[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]
:In the Miniseries novel, Caprica-Six's name is "Natasi." --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:15, 4 March 2006 (CST)

Hmmmm, yet another alias.--[[User:Jetsorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:Of course, we no longer consider that a canoncial name. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 14:26, 4 March 2006 (CST)

But one that has been used--[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

== Season 3 Episodes ==

Ok, bit of fun for y'all.
Whilst we are waiting for the fabled Season 3 to begin, I want to see what everyone else has to say about this topic.
If you had to write an episode for season 3, what would it be and why?--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:This is not a messageboard. Please check out my...extensive prognostications on Scifi.com--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 06:12, 12 May 2006 (CDT)

:I can see that Merv is speaking with his usual diplomatic balm, although he is correct in the sense that the Wiki makes for a poor message-thread board. Feel free to host your own discussion here about Season 3 episodes. But, to keep your page from growing (or not being noticed by others to comment), you might want to ask this question in a new or existing topic in a more specific article, perhaps the [[Occupation]] article (first ep of the Season 3). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:12, 12 May 2006 (CDT)

Trust Merv to spoil the fun. -- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

== AVI ==

I removed the AVI link because we don't link to pirtated matiral even though it is published on the SciFi website for all to see. I had removed it. [[BW:COPY]]. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:21, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:While your help was appreciated for people wanting to see the webisode outside of the wiki the limits have been put in place for legal and copyright reasons. The only people who are currently alowed legally to see it are those residents of the United States. Posting a link to the webisdoes not on the official SciFi site does not constitute "Fair Use" and thus cannot be posted. The link that Shane posted has some good information about out Image and media policies. If you have any other questions feel free to post on [[User talk:Mercifull|my talk page]] or bring it up on the [[BW:AN|administrators notice board]]. :) --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:27, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::So Scifi.com is doing location detection based on IP address or something? --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 13:53, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::If you arn't in the US it says that you arnt allowed to view it. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:56, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

"I'd call you a genius, but I'm in the room!"
So, how is that deemed "fair use" if other fans can't veiw it outside the F***ing good ol' USA? Why advertise it as "webisodes" if you can't watch them? Scifi may as well have tellevised them so ALL can watch them (Like the Clone Wars on Cartoon Network(least George Lucas isn't such a tight-arse like the rest of you).

My point is proved. --jetstorm316
::As someone who also lives in the UK I feel your frustration over all of this. Imo its all a bit of a frak-up but this site replies on its fair use material, all these images and transcripts ect. If Sci Fi force us to take all that off because we posted links which got around the protection they put in place then this site would practically be dead. Please understand the position the Battlestar Wiki is in, we mean no offence by removing your link. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 14:21, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

:I'm sorry that we can't link these as well, but as Mercifull said, to do that would violate SciFi/NBC's access restrictions. "Fair use" typically involves still materials such as photos, or retranscribed materials. Since the show is a video, fair use is NOT applicable to these items as we would be rebroadcasting them in a manner not licensed by NBC. "Fair use" involves US copyright law; sadly, non-US users will have to wait until the restrictions change. Battlestar Wiki would have no legal defense if we linked any of this material at this time, and could be sued or shut down. A few links aren't worth it. It doesn't stop you or anyone else from accessing them elsewhere for your personal use outside of the wiki, but such links just can't be done on a site that must, by the nature of what we are, play nice. No matter how much it sucks, that's going to have to be the way we do it. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:37, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

:the reason they must be doing this is because most of the rest of the world (outside North America) is either behind in seasons. Germeny is no where close to even finshing Season 2 on their Free TV. How would they be able to keep up with them knowing the "forced" spoilers to Season 3? --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 14:16, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

:::Jetstorm, I understand your frustration in not being able to view the webisodes, but your language and tone is inappropriate. Instead of attacking those who are upholding Wiki policies (and American copyright laws), you could have simply asked why the link was removed. Using vulgar language is unnecessary and uncivil. Should it happen again, you will be banned for a period of 48 hours. Thank you. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 18:06, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

so ban me then.......-jetstorm316

User talk:Jetstorm316

2006-09-05T19:13:45Z

Jetstorm316: /* AVI */

Talk:Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance/Archive 1

2006-09-05T18:42:37Z

Jetstorm316: /* Connectivity?!? */

I think the Webisodes are a great idea that may expand the BSG Audience. Anyway, I can hope. --[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 22:07, 27 May 2006 (CDT)

I really, REALLY dont like the idea of this. 'Caprica' was bad enough (but i'll begrudgingly watch it anyway cause you kinda have to) but the idea of filler really, REALLY sucks - why oh why cant RDM and Eick just put the events of whats happened into one/two/three regular episodes rather than put these up? No doubt there'll be wonderful nuggegts of info put into these eps, and references made to them in normal eps that people wont get unless they watch these little 'things'. Ron - if you're reading this - you're getting WAY too ahead of yourself - keep to writing BSG itself first, no fancy pants crap, drop Caprica cause its a dumb idea and focus on what people want more of - BSG itself, not a spinoff, not webisodes - JUST BSG!!! </rant> Grr! --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 03:47, 28 May 2006 (CDT)
:Actually it might work really well, they did a similar thing with Richard E Grant voicing Doctor Who a few years back on the BBC website --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 06:38, 28 May 2006 (CDT)
: The BBC is also doing the ''Doctor Who Confidential'' series in tandem with the new ''Doctor Who'', as well as the mini ''Tardisodes'' that you can get from BBC's site. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:41, 28 May 2006 (CDT)
::I know the Tardisodes are available - but for those of us without broadband (i will be sans broadband for a long time in the next month or so), web episodes arent a good idea. There are going to be plenty of people that dont want to be forced into watching something online, and with the Tardisodes that the BBC put up, they're totally self contained AFAIK, with no references made to them from other episodes, and they're non-important in terms of the overall storyline of DW, as well as being able to be viewed on the Digibox (digital terrestrial DVB-T or Digital Satellite set top box) by pressing 'the big red button'. BSG on the other hand, they're talking about a major part of the backstory which is hardly what i'd call trivial! Are they going to air the episodes on telly for those countries outside the US or will they just assume everyone has fast broadband and dont watch telly? --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 13:07, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

:: This is the future of TV within 2-3 years most if not all tv shows will have some online content similar to the webisodes. --[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 12:14, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

:::I just cant see why its necessary to split up a show into loads of different segments, have some aired on telly, some on the net - it just makes everything that more annoying - why oh *why* can't TV execs just get the idea into their thick skulls that people are happy watching telly AS IT IS!!! --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 13:30, 19 June 2006 (CDT)

:::: My guess is that it is a business decision. You can show an advertiser exactly how many viewers. Also, you get more opportunities to advertise per viewer. Due to the web, DVR's, etc., I don't see the current TV business model surviving.--[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 13:46, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

I have the feeling that the episode "Unfinished Business" will be a clip show of the webisodes, Just a guess. --[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 12:14, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

:No, they showed that it's different stuff: "Unfinished Business" deals with stuff *before* the Cylons came, the webisodes deal with stuff after that. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:52, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::Great more BSG content :D!! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 21:52, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

:I do hope that these get aired on telly, i really, really do :'( --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 13:29, 19 June 2006 (CDT)

:This is not a bad idea at all. It's like a side project. Something that more than likely will have no tie-in to the regular series. Otherwise, why not call them teasers instead of webisodes? It's not featuring any of the main cast as far as we have been told. All the more interesting. My only regret about it is it will be something only accessed on Galactica's SciFi site, and not available on iTunes.--[[User:AJFederation|AJFederation]] 01:41, 23 July 2006 (CDT)

==Add into Episode Guide template==

Right now, Season 2 ends and proceeds to Season 3 in the template at the bottom of the screen: where's the page where I can add this webisode series into the succession?: I think it should be put at the beginning of Season 3 (or at least, after LDYB II clicking "next" would lead here, not season 3 proper). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 18:13, 23 July 2006 (CDT)

In addition, I think the format of this page should be that of any one episode in the episode guide; that is, there won't be separate subpages linked for each of the 10 webisodes: ***Bradley Thompson, who co-wrote these, said he considers it one story, just broken up into 10 chunks, which I think is just like how a normal episode is broken up by commercial breaks. This really isn't a separate series, so much as a "special episode". It's not a separate series, but part of the series between Seasons 2 and 3 (we asked Thompson how we should consider it with that; waiting on answer). --->Originally I had thought this would be a parent series page that had episodes linked from it, but based on Thompson's comments it makes more sense just to put it in an episode format. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 19:44, 25 July 2006 (CDT)

==September Debut==

An BSG article in the October issue of SciFi Magazine says the Webisodes will start in September. Whether the WGA actions will affect this or not is unknown. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:21, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
:The WGA announcement was this Wednesday. I do know they were originally planned to be aired for 10 weeks (one each week) before the season premiere...in which case they would already have started two weeks ago. I think there was foot dragging where they hoped to ''vaguely'' "have them out in September or something" but that this broke down. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:24, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
:: The mag probably went to print assuming that everything will be ok, but it's not?? No word from Bradley yet?--[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:28, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
:::Nothing. I'd make a big deal about it if there was. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:36, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
::::I was just hoping for tidbit of the webisodes by now to feed my raging beast ;-). Thanks for being on top of it--[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:40, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
I'm confused about the last paragraph of the Contract Disputes... section. We say "several weeks" later from August, the tapes were handed over. (I assume that means at least 3 weeks.) The WGA/NBCU dispute became public on Aug. 12 and the NLRB greviance was filed on the 18th. It doesn't seem that three weeks have passed. Can that be clarified? Also, what changed or broke the stalemate? There has been nothing announced in Variety or elsewhere, at least in regard to The Office. How can the BSG producers turn over tapes without getting in trouble with the writers guild, of which Moore and Eick are presumably members. Can anyone explain?--[[User:Elach|Elach]] 13:42, 28 August 2006 (CDT)

== "Image" ==

When we do a picture for the Episode Data block and this is all done, we should take all 10 of the images and put them in a pattern so it would be a mossic image. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 20:39, 2 September 2006 (CDT)

:I like your idea, and I suggest 2 wide by 5 tall, as it must be either 1x10 or 2x5 (barring tomfoolery), and 5x2 would have unfortunate aspect ratio consequences. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 00:20, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Connectivity?!? ==

Is anyone else having problems watching the webisodes?
I've waited all this time for them to air and I can't watch a single one!

How shady is that?

Do Sci-Fi.com have availbility problems regarding this, and how hong is it going to take to fix?

Does anyone know if they are going to be released in any other format other than webisode? --Jetstorm316
:I just watched it not 20 minutes ago and it worked. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 05:32, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::You need the latest Flash player. You can get it from the Marrocmedia Website. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 08:42, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Any way to watch it if not from America? Wont let me watch here in the UK :( --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:21, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Tried several US proxies and it just wont load. can someone save it and upload to google video or youtube or summit? :( --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:40, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::This is bending the policy,but it is on you-tube (Watch this morning because it works better than the official site at lower speeds). Should be a link on skiffy board somewhere. Or gtalk or gmail me and I will find the link. gougef at gmail dot com. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 11:44, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Well said, Frankie. No hosting or linking to "illegal" copies... but like he said there's youtube links at sciffy (even though the admins appear to be trying to delete them). And the "flash player" official version was choppy even with ultra-broadband. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:00, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Thanks for your help anyway guys. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 12:13, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

Does any one have the link for the you tube version? My Flash player is upto date, but can't watch here in the UK........

Must be a Trans-Atlantic thing or something, but I hope they put it on 3.0 to compensate for people who are missing out.--Jetstorm316 19:12GMT 5 september 2006

EUREKA! Success at last! If you have a torrent client, go to this link,
<<removed link>>
Now, we can all watch it at our leasure --jetstorm316 19:34hrs GMT
:We don't host or link copies. Removed. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 13:18, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:Please do not link to the webisodes or clips of BSG on this Wiki that are copyrighted. Thank you --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 13:21, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

And thats the thanks I get for helping us all out who have connectivity problems? You know what, F*** the lot of you! I won't visit this site again!

This is the last entry for Jetstorm316

Goodbye and good F***ing luck to you bunch of F***ing losers!

Talk:Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance/Archive 1

2006-09-05T18:17:05Z

Jetstorm316: /* Connectivity?!? */

I think the Webisodes are a great idea that may expand the BSG Audience. Anyway, I can hope. --[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 22:07, 27 May 2006 (CDT)

I really, REALLY dont like the idea of this. 'Caprica' was bad enough (but i'll begrudgingly watch it anyway cause you kinda have to) but the idea of filler really, REALLY sucks - why oh why cant RDM and Eick just put the events of whats happened into one/two/three regular episodes rather than put these up? No doubt there'll be wonderful nuggegts of info put into these eps, and references made to them in normal eps that people wont get unless they watch these little 'things'. Ron - if you're reading this - you're getting WAY too ahead of yourself - keep to writing BSG itself first, no fancy pants crap, drop Caprica cause its a dumb idea and focus on what people want more of - BSG itself, not a spinoff, not webisodes - JUST BSG!!! </rant> Grr! --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 03:47, 28 May 2006 (CDT)
:Actually it might work really well, they did a similar thing with Richard E Grant voicing Doctor Who a few years back on the BBC website --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] 06:38, 28 May 2006 (CDT)
: The BBC is also doing the ''Doctor Who Confidential'' series in tandem with the new ''Doctor Who'', as well as the mini ''Tardisodes'' that you can get from BBC's site. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:41, 28 May 2006 (CDT)
::I know the Tardisodes are available - but for those of us without broadband (i will be sans broadband for a long time in the next month or so), web episodes arent a good idea. There are going to be plenty of people that dont want to be forced into watching something online, and with the Tardisodes that the BBC put up, they're totally self contained AFAIK, with no references made to them from other episodes, and they're non-important in terms of the overall storyline of DW, as well as being able to be viewed on the Digibox (digital terrestrial DVB-T or Digital Satellite set top box) by pressing 'the big red button'. BSG on the other hand, they're talking about a major part of the backstory which is hardly what i'd call trivial! Are they going to air the episodes on telly for those countries outside the US or will they just assume everyone has fast broadband and dont watch telly? --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 13:07, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

:: This is the future of TV within 2-3 years most if not all tv shows will have some online content similar to the webisodes. --[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 12:14, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

:::I just cant see why its necessary to split up a show into loads of different segments, have some aired on telly, some on the net - it just makes everything that more annoying - why oh *why* can't TV execs just get the idea into their thick skulls that people are happy watching telly AS IT IS!!! --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 13:30, 19 June 2006 (CDT)

:::: My guess is that it is a business decision. You can show an advertiser exactly how many viewers. Also, you get more opportunities to advertise per viewer. Due to the web, DVR's, etc., I don't see the current TV business model surviving.--[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 13:46, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

I have the feeling that the episode "Unfinished Business" will be a clip show of the webisodes, Just a guess. --[[User:Gougef|gougef]] 12:14, 28 May 2006 (CDT)

:No, they showed that it's different stuff: "Unfinished Business" deals with stuff *before* the Cylons came, the webisodes deal with stuff after that. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:52, 18 July 2006 (CDT)
::Great more BSG content :D!! --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 21:52, 18 July 2006 (CDT)

:I do hope that these get aired on telly, i really, really do :'( --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 13:29, 19 June 2006 (CDT)

:This is not a bad idea at all. It's like a side project. Something that more than likely will have no tie-in to the regular series. Otherwise, why not call them teasers instead of webisodes? It's not featuring any of the main cast as far as we have been told. All the more interesting. My only regret about it is it will be something only accessed on Galactica's SciFi site, and not available on iTunes.--[[User:AJFederation|AJFederation]] 01:41, 23 July 2006 (CDT)

==Add into Episode Guide template==

Right now, Season 2 ends and proceeds to Season 3 in the template at the bottom of the screen: where's the page where I can add this webisode series into the succession?: I think it should be put at the beginning of Season 3 (or at least, after LDYB II clicking "next" would lead here, not season 3 proper). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 18:13, 23 July 2006 (CDT)

In addition, I think the format of this page should be that of any one episode in the episode guide; that is, there won't be separate subpages linked for each of the 10 webisodes: ***Bradley Thompson, who co-wrote these, said he considers it one story, just broken up into 10 chunks, which I think is just like how a normal episode is broken up by commercial breaks. This really isn't a separate series, so much as a "special episode". It's not a separate series, but part of the series between Seasons 2 and 3 (we asked Thompson how we should consider it with that; waiting on answer). --->Originally I had thought this would be a parent series page that had episodes linked from it, but based on Thompson's comments it makes more sense just to put it in an episode format. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 19:44, 25 July 2006 (CDT)

==September Debut==

An BSG article in the October issue of SciFi Magazine says the Webisodes will start in September. Whether the WGA actions will affect this or not is unknown. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:21, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
:The WGA announcement was this Wednesday. I do know they were originally planned to be aired for 10 weeks (one each week) before the season premiere...in which case they would already have started two weeks ago. I think there was foot dragging where they hoped to ''vaguely'' "have them out in September or something" but that this broke down. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:24, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
:: The mag probably went to print assuming that everything will be ok, but it's not?? No word from Bradley yet?--[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:28, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
:::Nothing. I'd make a big deal about it if there was. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 20:36, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
::::I was just hoping for tidbit of the webisodes by now to feed my raging beast ;-). Thanks for being on top of it--[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:40, 19 August 2006 (CDT)
I'm confused about the last paragraph of the Contract Disputes... section. We say "several weeks" later from August, the tapes were handed over. (I assume that means at least 3 weeks.) The WGA/NBCU dispute became public on Aug. 12 and the NLRB greviance was filed on the 18th. It doesn't seem that three weeks have passed. Can that be clarified? Also, what changed or broke the stalemate? There has been nothing announced in Variety or elsewhere, at least in regard to The Office. How can the BSG producers turn over tapes without getting in trouble with the writers guild, of which Moore and Eick are presumably members. Can anyone explain?--[[User:Elach|Elach]] 13:42, 28 August 2006 (CDT)

== "Image" ==

When we do a picture for the Episode Data block and this is all done, we should take all 10 of the images and put them in a pattern so it would be a mossic image. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 20:39, 2 September 2006 (CDT)

:I like your idea, and I suggest 2 wide by 5 tall, as it must be either 1x10 or 2x5 (barring tomfoolery), and 5x2 would have unfortunate aspect ratio consequences. --[[User:CalculatinAvatar|CalculatinAvatar]]([[Special:Contributions/CalculatinAvatar|C]]-[[User talk:CalculatinAvatar|T]]) 00:20, 3 September 2006 (CDT)

== Connectivity?!? ==

Is anyone else having problems watching the webisodes?
I've waited all this time for them to air and I can't watch a single one!

How shady is that?

Do Sci-Fi.com have availbility problems regarding this, and how hong is it going to take to fix?

Does anyone know if they are going to be released in any other format other than webisode? --Jetstorm316
:I just watched it not 20 minutes ago and it worked. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 05:32, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::You need the latest Flash player. You can get it from the Marrocmedia Website. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 08:42, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::Any way to watch it if not from America? Wont let me watch here in the UK :( --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:21, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::::Tried several US proxies and it just wont load. can someone save it and upload to google video or youtube or summit? :( --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 11:40, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::This is bending the policy,but it is on you-tube (Watch this morning because it works better than the official site at lower speeds). Should be a link on skiffy board somewhere. Or gtalk or gmail me and I will find the link. gougef at gmail dot com. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 11:44, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
::::::Well said, Frankie. No hosting or linking to "illegal" copies... but like he said there's youtube links at sciffy (even though the admins appear to be trying to delete them). And the "flash player" official version was choppy even with ultra-broadband. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:00, 5 September 2006 (CDT)
:::::::Thanks for your help anyway guys. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 12:13, 5 September 2006 (CDT)

Does any one have the link for the you tube version? My Flash player is upto date, but can't watch here in the UK........

Must be a Trans-Atlantic thing or something, but I hope they put it on 3.0 to compensate for people who are missing out.--Jetstorm316 19:12GMT 5 september 2006

EUREKA! Success at last! If you have a torrent client, go to this link,

http://torrentspy.com/torrent/851572/Battlestar_Galactica_The_Resistance_Webisode1_avi

Now, we can all watch it at our leasure --jetstorm316 19:34hrs GMT

Talk:Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance/Archive 1

2006-09-05T17:55:35Z

Jetstorm316: /* Connectivity?!? */

Talk:Battlestar Galactica: The Resistance/Archive 1

2006-09-05T10:24:14Z

Jetstorm316: Connectivity?!?

User talk:Jetstorm316

2006-05-14T11:28:11Z

Jetstorm316: /* Season 3 Episodes */

User talk:Jetstorm316

2006-05-12T06:49:48Z

Jetstorm316: Season 3 Episodes

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-03-26T17:44:22Z

Jetstorm316: /* New Unknown Uniform */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

I took some pretty pics for this: [[Image:Senior_wings.jpg|150px]][[Image:Wings.jpg|150px]] --dancing_salad 19:01, 23 February 2006 (EST)

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:::What I figured happened was that Cain needed a deck chief so she assigned him to that job since he was an aeronautical engineer and gave him a rank commensurate with his position. As Cain would say, "I m a flag officer in detached service during a time of war. Regulations give me broad authority in these matters." --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 11:29, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::::Possible, due to the fact she lost 700 men, maybe her original deck chief was one of those casualties, hence Liards field promotion.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:::::Exactly my point. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:41, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Back to the original discussion, Point C), if you look at Talos's images Khaki OD dress, this is taken form the pilot episode as Tigh walks away from the CIC. To help everyone out a little, this is time index 8 mins 2 seconds. If you look at the right arm of the non-com, you will see a black armband, with 2 letters in yellow. If I can get a better/clearer shot of this, I would wager the armband reads "MP". Now tell me I don't know my millitary structures! Could anyone please help varify this (Pictorial)fact?
--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:The only problem is that's not khaki, thats OD. Khaki (color) is what Hadrian wears. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:19, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::It looks like any confusion is caused by me comparing the OD uniform to the Navy Service Khakis, an undress, working suitable uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:22, 22 February 2006 (EST)
[[Image:ODarmband2 Mini.JPG|thumb|OD with Armband ([[Mini-Series]]).]]
Talos, do you concure that the OD dress with armbard, has lettering?.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:It looks like the lettering on the OD armband says "SECURITY" or "SEC". It's clearer in the DVD and I'll see if I can get a clearer pic. That was just a picture of oppourtunity while I was looking for Blue duty pictures. There aren't that many of the OD with armband walking around, compared to ODs without like Dualla. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 19:08, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::The armband definatly says "SECURITY" as seen in this picture. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:22, 2 March 2006 (CST)

::...what does "OD" stand for?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 13:43, 2 March 2006 (CST)
:::Olive Drab. It's the "army green" color (not camo, just green). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:44, 2 March 2006 (CST)

Or "Off Duty" (as a second dress standard for all military types) See "Scar" for reference.[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Good examples, Talos. Well deserving of recognition. Why Don't you add them into the document as additional
supplement.--[[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I was planning too. I just wanted to show them here first. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

== New Uniform Pics ==
Sweet. Thanks, Talos! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:43, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:My pleasure. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:55, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:: i've been cutting off the concrete suits. maybe they can be introduced to the article that way:
:::*Commander - red line on outer edge, gold line on inner edge - [[:Image:Commander_uni.jpg|Example]]
::here are the pics: [[Image:Colonel_uni.jpg|70px]][[Image:Admiral_uni.jpg|70px]][[Image:JuniorOff_uni.jpg|70px]][[Image:Commander_uni.jpg|70px]]

:::well, i think nobody cares. If someone does, just recover. --dancing_salad 18:54, 23 February 2006 (EST)
::::Thanks for adding the pics to the uniform page. Good job on linking through text and not thumbnails, I keeps the page cleaner and less cluttered. Keep up the good work! --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 21:59, 23 February 2006 (EST)

== Latest Uniform Quibble (Marines) ==

It would appear that TPTB's (or costume dept's) use of the "digiprint"/MARPAT camo BDU's in Home for the featured cast was a one-time occurance, or, at least, an employment ''that is not typical of Marine uniforms''. Up until the Lay Down Your Burdens episodes, we had only seen combat Marines in their black BDU's. Here they were headed back to Caprica to recover as many survivors as possible, and what BDU's do they end up using? OD/green. The vests remained black, but each Marine on the recovery team was suited in OD/green. If the digiprint-camo BDU '''''was''''' part of the Marines' uniform rotation, then it goes without saying that it should have been in this event.

'''''But it wasn't.'''''

Now, that could be from several reasons that either exist inside of, or outside of, the storyline. The reason I'm provocating is that A) the digiprint/MARPAT-camo was indeed a one-time use, spurred by a "Hey! This will look cool!" by a production source, and it wasn't intended to be, nor was it originally, a part of the "series bible", B) The production staff realized they'd be tattooed on the forums for using black (and I'm sure that it would go against the training/knowledge of any military-types on the staff) uniforms to depict a planetside operation, C) The staff couldn't afford, nor justify, purchasing more digiprint/MARPAT BDU's, and "old" camo BDU's wouldn't look "unique" enough for this storyline, and D) They used ''what they had on hand'' (OD/green BDU's) ''knowing that it's an exceptionally minor detail that shouldn't affect the story.''

If my post has a twinge of hostility in it, it's in response to certain folks' repeated (perhaps they've let up recently) projections of real-life structure, regulations, etc. into this topic. Just because a couple of Shore Patrol dudes and the feature characters wore some cool-looking digiprint camo ''does not mean'' that it is standard-issue, regulation-grade uniform for the Marines, or for anyone else. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 13:40, 15 March 2006 (CST)
:I think the Digital BDUs aren't for the Marines, they've been consistently shown wearing solid color BDUs. My thinking is that the Digital Uniforms are a Fleet-only uniform. The colors are actually similar to the new Digital work uniforms the US Navy is experimenting with. They wouldn't be the best uniform for a mission in a woodland enviroment, is ODs are more appropriate. To be honest, they shouldn't have used those uniforms on Kobol, sticks out like a sore thumb. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 15:42, 15 March 2006 (CST)

==New Unknown Uniform==
[[Image:Unknowndressunif ActoCon.JPG|thumb|left|Funeral Detail ([[Act of Contrition]])]]
Here's an unknown uniform I saw while watching Act of Contrition. It's the same as the Dress Greys except the color of the coat is more black and less blue, the sash is blue, and there's an insignia shaped like a eagle (that's what it looks like to me) near where the sash and belt meet. Maybe it's one of the following:
*A Marine Dress Uniform, officer or enlisted
*A specific Honor Guard uniform

Any thoughts? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:34, 20 March 2006 (CST)

I would say its an honour guard dress, personally --[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

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== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:::What I figured happened was that Cain needed a deck chief so she assigned him to that job since he was an aeronautical engineer and gave him a rank commensurate with his position. As Cain would say, "I m a flag officer in detached service during a time of war. Regulations give me broad authority in these matters." --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 11:29, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::::Possible, due to the fact she lost 700 men, maybe her original deck chief was one of those casualties, hence Liards field promotion.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:::::Exactly my point. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:41, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Back to the original discussion, Point C), if you look at Talos's images Khaki OD dress, this is taken form the pilot episode as Tigh walks away from the CIC. To help everyone out a little, this is time index 8 mins 2 seconds. If you look at the right arm of the non-com, you will see a black armband, with 2 letters in yellow. If I can get a better/clearer shot of this, I would wager the armband reads "MP". Now tell me I don't know my millitary structures! Could anyone please help varify this (Pictorial)fact?
--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:The only problem is that's not khaki, thats OD. Khaki (color) is what Hadrian wears. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:19, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::It looks like any confusion is caused by me comparing the OD uniform to the Navy Service Khakis, an undress, working suitable uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:22, 22 February 2006 (EST)
Talos, do you concure that the OD dress with armbard, has lettering?.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Good examples, Talos. Well deserving of recognition. Why Don't you add them into the document as additional
supplement.--[[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I was planning too. I just wanted to show them here first. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

== New Uniform Pics ==
Sweet. Thanks, Talos! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:43, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:My pleasure. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:55, 22 February 2006 (EST)

User talk:Steelviper

2006-02-22T21:27:47Z

Jetstorm316: /* Amr patch 1 */

Welcome to the BSG Wiki, Steelviper! Be sure to fill in your User page sometime to introduce yourself! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:26, 26 October 2005 (EDT)
:User page created (albeit quite spartan). Thanks for the encouragement.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:52, 27 October 2005 (EDT)

== Rave Reviews! ==

Hey. [http://battlestarwiki.org/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Characters&curid=3315&diff=18646&oldid=17786 Nice work]. Probably we should rework that section, now, to simply be a note to leave the Unknown Delegate alone. However, it's 4:33am here and I don't feel like doing it just now. Anyway, welcome and glad to have you. --[[User:Day|Day]] 05:33, 3 December 2005 (EST)

== King of the TOS Pages! ==

Hey, Steel. I'm sure many of us are noticing you taking point in getting the TOS pages filled in and fortified. It's much appreciated. Someday, when I'm drunk, I'll buy my TOS DVDs and join in. (I'll need some crystal meth to go to get myself to watch Galactica 1980, but you gotta do what you gotta do.) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:08, 14 December 2005 (EST)

:Thanks! I agreed completely with your observation that our TOS deficiencies are pretty embarrassing. Actually, much of the progress stems from working the [[Special:Wantedpages]] as suggested by the "Original Series Article Development Project." That was the first I had heard of that page, and I love it! A lot of the bigger offenders were topics where there was plenty of information available, it was just spread out across the wiki. Hopefully it won't be too long before the front page of the "wanted" pages are all user pages. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:29, 14 December 2005 (EST)

==Screenshots==

First off, although I am not personally a fan of TOS, I want to commend you for your contributions to those pages here. I think our site has benifited immensely during the relatively short time you've been active here.

Secondly, I note that there is a quite a dearth of good illustrative screen captures from TOS episodes. To that end, I would like to offer to donate a copy of the TOS DVD box set to you via Amazon.com or somesuch. Let me know if this would be useful. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:30, 22 December 2005 (EST)

:Thanks! I appreciate the thought. "[[Imperious Leader|Santa Claus]]" already beat you to the punch, though. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:05, 28 December 2005 (EST) (Updated)

== Administrator Nomination ==

Seeing how you've just as obsessed with this place as many of us are, [[Battlestar_Wiki:Requests_for_adminship/Steelviper|I've nominated you as an administator.]] --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:44, 27 December 2005 (EST)

:Thanks! I'll get right on that. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:13, 27 December 2005 (EST)

== Congrats! ==

You are now an admin! If you have any questions, feel free to bring them to me or any of your fellow admins. So say we all. -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 21:24, 3 January 2006 (EST)

:Welcome to the clubhouse. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 21:37, 3 January 2006 (EST)

:Since you're the new kid, you have to do the mopping. Congrats! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 01:44, 4 January 2006 (EST)

::Thanks guys! I'll try not to make too big of a mess. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:01, 4 January 2006 (EST)

::: Yes. Congrats. Don't let my "neutral" vote imply that I'll point a gun at your head when you try to depose the President of the Colonies or anything. *wink* --[[User:Day|Day]] 10:34, 4 January 2006 (EST)

==Galactica 1980==

Hi Steelviper. Send me an email at weller43@cox.net so I can confirm for you that the site you mentioned is mine. - Mark Weller [[User:Mokwella|Mokwella]] 23:24, 3 January 2006 (EST)

:Since Joe, as host, is ultimately the liable party, it would probably be best to go directly to him. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:58, 4 January 2006 (EST)

::I didn't mean to stir anything up when I linked to your site. I just stumbled across it, as there isn't that much that comes up on a Google search for "Galactica 1980 dvd". Hopefully after you've emailed Joe everything will be clear. Sorry for any inconvenience. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:01, 4 January 2006 (EST)

== FLeet ==

Thanks for spotting these typos. It's an unusually common one with me. I'm getting better about catching them, but some still slip through. --[[User:Day|Day]] 15:01, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:You're welcome! Fortunately the consistency is what got them on my radar (they ended up on the "Wanted Page", which I tend to patrol). Thanks for doing all those, by the way! I was getting tired of linking to "The Fleet#Original Series|the fleet". The Fleet (TOS) is much more concise. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:15, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:: Oh, I didn't make [[The Fleet (TOS)]]. Someone else split up The Fleet into the RDM and TOS name-spaces. I'm just currently purging Fleet since nearly all of those should be double-redirects. I'm not done, either, but I'm getting there. --[[User:Day|Day]] 15:19, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:::I think Peter Farago and Spencerian were primarily responsible for making the change. I just saw you were doing a lot of Fleet redirect work.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:22, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:::: Heh. I forgot the links would be bad. Anyway... yes. --[[User:Day|Day]] 19:09, 16 January 2006 (EST)

Gah! I was about to start finishing this thing off but I kept finding them already fixed. I hit the refresh and they were GONE! ''*GASP*''! Thanks, man. I can cross that one off, then. --[[User:Day|Day]] 17:17, 18 January 2006 (EST)

:You're welcome. I saw it was almost done, and got in groove. Now I just need to figure out how to use scripts to do that (as Spencerian suggested on his talk page). Unfortunately a lot of times it takes a human eye to figure out which way a particular link needs to go (if I had just thrown a script at it I would have gotten the Eastern Alliance one wrong, unless it somehow could check the categories of the page). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 17:20, 18 January 2006 (EST)

:: Yeah. I was thinking about that. I don't think a script could be smart enough unless you took forever to write it, and then you're not being any more time efficient. I think hand-fixing things is the only way to do it, really. Now, the next project will be to go find all the links that go to "Last, First"-style character pages and fix those... A nit-pickers work is never done.--[[User:Day|Day]] 17:23, 18 January 2006 (EST)

== Humano-Cylon Naming Question ==

SV, when you have an opportunity, provide your two cents to the debate to "retire" the Humano-Cylon term on its talk page. I'm generally against it as it's rather pervasive and works fine for here. Peter is for the change, but the logic surprises me. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:54, 24 January 2006 (EST)

:Que? Oh. Well, I put in my two cubits (though I'm not sure how much that's worth with the conversion rates, inflation, etc.). Lots of interesting issues at hand. Hopefully more people will weigh in (unlike on the translation stuff). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:41, 24 January 2006 (EST)

== Glad to be of service ==

It's going to take me a week or two of doing this, and my Spanish will come back...in the mean time, bear with me and don't hesitate to correct anything if you see something blatantly wrong.

Glad to be of service, I assume this is mostly your project, I applaud the effort, and I'm glad to help. --[[User:Leoben Conoy|Leoben Conoy]]

:I never really intended it to be my project... I just mostly tried to start forging the translating pattern in the hopes that other people might join in. I am extremely pleased that people have! (Especially having two languages going at once!) I still don't have the whole picture of how everything will go (does Water/es:Water ever turn into Agua?), but I'm sure we'll figure things out. Joe might have a better concept of how the whole operation will work. I'll try to read over the Spanish work, but I expect that even your "blatantly wrong" will make more sense in Spanish than what I was doing. Also, if you want to sign your comments with your name/timestamp (all the cool kids are doing it), just use four "~"'s like this <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> (though we often prefix that with a couple of dashes, for style. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:08, 2 February 2006 (EST)

==Nuclear warhead==
I just added how he got it because it was mentioned later down the article, when he gives it to Gina. --[[User:DrBat|DrBat]] 08:57, 14 February 2006 (EST)
:Right on! I left in the part where she gets him to request the nuclear warhead. I'm just not sure it has been detailed that he actually used the warhead as part of the detector. It seems like he just requested it to placate Six. The details of the working Cylon detector remain (I think intentionally) a little fuzzy. If they explicitly mention that he actually uses the warhead in the detector, then go ahead and add it back in. It just just seems that he was flexing his scientific muscle, though.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:02, 14 February 2006 (EST)

==Thanks for the Welcome==

Hi, I don't know how much use I can be around the rest of the site (I'm not very tehnical-minded) but I love transcribing things (I must be mad) and so I'm happy to do as many of them as I can for you. Don't hesitiate to correct me if I mess something up too, like I said, I'm not brilliant with computers. Anyway thanks for saying hi. --[[User:Misco|Misco]] 15:40, 14 February 2006 (EST)

:You're welcome! Usually that job falls to [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]]. (In fact his initial greeting is still at the top of this page, as I don't get enough traffic to require archiving.) I jumped at the opportunity to welcome a new transcriber, though! I've tried doing it myself (though I managed to lose my work), but find that my OCD-like compulsion to get EVERY SINGLE sound (including the filler um's, ah's, sort of's) slows me WAY down. It amazes me when I get a chance to read transcriptions of people like yourself and [[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] that have excellent filters that clear out all that junk leaving only the good stuff. Feel free to contribute in whatever ways you are comfortable! As with any wiki, the more the merrier. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:47, 14 February 2006 (EST)

== Printed Media Copyrights ==

Did you catch who uploaded those Official Companion pictures? We need to make a note on their user page immediately. This is something we would get sued for, fast since this is a publication and not a broadcast. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 14:06, 16 February 2006 (EST)
:I believe it was [[User:Crashoveride]]. If you wouldn't mind making the note, you seem to have a better grasp at the applicable laws. When I spotted them, they felt a bit wrong, but I wasn't confident enought to outright delete them. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:10, 16 February 2006 (EST)

==Wanted List==
Cool! (sorry about the late response) :) --[[User:Blacklight|Blacklight]]

:Mas vale tarde que nunca. (Better late than never.) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:04, 16 February 2006 (EST)

== i'm really sorry... ==

... but i didnt know how to use a wiki.
well, i use to visit wikipedia for contents, but as i not expert on any camp, i haven't edited a wiki ever.
i didn't know who to contact o how to contact (no private msg's here?)
well, i just wanted to help with the spanish translation. i'm natural spanish speaker (i'm from spain) i use to watch galactica in originally soundtracked (i dl them for inet two days after is aired, it is legal in spain)
i'll be thankedif anyone helps me. just want to visit some galactica website on translate em to spanish.
have a nice day. --Dancing salad
:I left you a response on [[User talk:Dancing salad|your user talk page]]. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:23, 19 February 2006 (EST)
thanks, i'm glad u helped me - and so fastly!
i'll be doing my best on it. dancing_salad 15:30, 19 February 2006 (EST)

== RE: Colonial arm patches ==

Thank you for your recap, well deocumented, and by the looks of this topic, it's not the first time Merv has done something like this.

Could you advise me where best to show my article/images in the best way as all parties (including Merv before he jumps in again) can veiw them and admire them.

As you can tell, I've gone for a brisk walk to calm myself and picked up my 4yr old daughter from school. Yes, I made comments that were harsh, but if you made an article and someone "slaped it down", you'd be miffed too. Right now I'm trying to recover from sciatic nerve damage cause by over work, so I'm trying to keep myself occupied.

PS - Thank you for being a neutral party in this matter.(Damn your good for your age, I'm 27!) --Jetstorm316

:You have, I think, perhaps walked into a potentially huge "opportunity" (read pile of work). I'm not sure if there is a simple place to stick all of your contributions yet, as I think the current structure might not yet be where it needs to be. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] suggested the military ranks (RDM, and TOS). That might do for a start, but your article made me realize that we don't have a Uniforms (TOS) page describing (and displaying images related to) the Original Series uniforms. If a Uniforms (TOS) is warranted, then potentially the TOS patches and insignia could go in a patches and insignia section on that article, with RDM patches and insignia going in a new section of a (newly moved?) Uniforms (RDM). The existing Uniforms page is in desperate need of color (images) anyway, and having (verified) patches to display would be a potential way to start that process. That's just one guy's idea, though. I'd recommend asking this same question over at [[Talk:Colonial arm patches and insignia|the article talk page]] or on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|admin noticeboard]] to get the opinions of some others. I'm sure if we all put our heads together, we can come up with something. (Don't worry about your work "disappearing" suddenly. Spencerian wasn't ACTUALLY deleting yet, he was just trying to start THIS exact discussion. The article you created will not be deleted until we've figured out where everything should go and is everything is in place.) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:17, 21 February 2006 (EST)

*Need I point out, once again, that I am not the one that "slapped this article down", but that Spencerian and SteelViper were both deleting it, and I simply deleted some links to it? I do not want to argue, but I hope you can agree SteelViper, that I should not appreciate baseless accusations. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 00:35, 22 February 2006 (EST)

O.K. Heres the deal, I do my work, you concentrate on your own. Let other admistrators deal with my work and nothing more shall be said. I, also am a creul man, but I have a better way of saying it. Maybe all it should have took it to show me direction with purpose, like Spencerian, because, as Agent Smith stated "Without perpose, we have nothing".--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

: I don't know how you're not getting this point, Jetsotrm: Merv didn't destroy anything you created. And, anyway, entropy is just kind of the way that Wikis work, so no malice should be held about someone editing after you. Once you put something up it is no longer yours. It becomes ours (which includes anyone who logs in to edit). --[[User:Day|Day]] 05:02, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But as Author of a submission, I feel a sence of justice was needed. Besides I didn't blame him for deleting my work, I only raised question for not recognising all the patches I posted. A fan of both TOS and RMD would have recognised them and commended their usefulness to this site or recommended on where to post them correctly. I do admit I have to "compliment" the images with video stills on where they are shown, but that is a small matter to be delt with on my part.

:My "Pegasus" patch image, however, is a manufacturer/creator error, not mine. As I have conceeded, that Pegasus is "BSG 62", not "63".--[[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

== images? ==

''just trying to upload som nice images that i found to be neede on the [[Battlestar_Wiki:Requested_Images]], from starbuck cutting cylon spacecraft's brain and getting in, for the [[Cylon Models]] article, refering to the spacecraft.i can upload them to my own host, but i think the images shown in the articles are miniatures from bigger ones uploaded here, isn't it? i have 9 pretty ones, but just want one of them to be thumbnailed (you know, the way the it's done on wikis), and the other ones being watchable.''

oh men how ridicule i feel, just found the image uploading on the tools menu. thanks anyway dancing_salad 18:15, 21 February 2006 (EST)

:Glad to be of assistance. ;) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 18:37, 21 February 2006 (EST)

== Amr patch 1 ==

Could you please delete above image from this site, I will try to edit the image so it says "BSG 62" to correct a manufacturer error. I will show you first to get aproval of edit.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:By your command. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 16:26, 22 February 2006 (EST)
Cheers, bro. I owe you one..--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

User talk:The Merovingian

2006-02-22T21:26:42Z

Jetstorm316: Talk page uniform

''Why is a raven like a writing desk?''

== Regarding your RfA ==

Hi Ricimer, while your RfA did not pass, I firmly and wholeheartedly believe that you are fully capable of passing the RfA, should it come up again within, say, six months. If you have any concerns, feel free to address them with Peter, myself, or any of the other major contributors. Have a happy New Year! -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 12:31, 30 December 2005 (EST)

:I have yet to play my trump card. --[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 12:32, 30 December 2005 (EST)

:: Should I be afraid? *wink* --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:21, 31 December 2005 (EST)

== Battle Template ==

You're the guy who came up with this, right? Do you think that a) the thing could be made into an actual template (like the Character Data one with dissappearing/reappearing fields, etc) and b) it could be re-designed to look like the Character Data one (in terms of looking like the rest of the theme (the red/black is the default theme, isn't it?)? I don't know how these two things would be accomplished, but I thought I'd put this out there and see what you thought as far as feasability and also as far as ''should'' we do it. --[[User:Day|Day]] 17:00, 18 January 2006 (EST)

== User name change ==

Just letting you know that I changed your name from Ricimer to The Merovingian. Let me know if you encounter any issues, not that I'm expecting any but just in case Murphy's Law decides to come and play. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] 23:19, 7 February 2006 (EST)

: Also on this topic: You should probably update the first sentence of your User page to reflect the name change. If you want, I could probably get a decent screen-grab of the identically named character from the Matrix. Unfortunately, I don't have a DVD from which to grab pictures that stars any of the folks who founded Paris. --[[User:Day|Day]] 01:24, 8 February 2006 (EST)
::Yes, actually, that would help immensly. I need one of The Merovingian when he's in Club Hel, standing at the balcony looking imperiously down at Neo. A shot that shows his whole body instead of a closeup would be preferred. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 02:13, 8 February 2006 (EST)
:::You should watch "Revolutions" again. Merv isn't peering down at Neo but at Morpheus, Trinity, and Seraph (Neo never visits Club Hel in the movie series, although the Path of Neo video game takes him there while the Club is closed). I'll also try to get a screencap for you if time allows. My Matrix knowledge may be better than my BSG knowledge (note witty, illustrated user page; I've been almost tempted to change my user name to something more appropriate... ;) By the way, I like your revised user page. Merv is one of those characters whose deserved more exploration on the same level as the Oracle and the Architect. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:45, 8 February 2006 (EST)

:"Neo" just came out; I was thinking Seraph & Co., just typed the wrong thing. (''That little Judas! I'm going to have him killed and buried in a shallow grave, then dig him up and kill him again...'''That's the beauty of a shallow grave!''') ''--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 16:52, 8 February 2006 (EST)

::I actually took a philosphy class and my choice for a paper was on ''The Matrix''. Basically, I've made several of the more...insightful speculations about The Merovingian on his Wikipdia article. You see, Morpheus and Neo represent Socrates: wanting to get out of "The Cave" to the real world beyond, etc. However, I believe (and I'm the only person I know of who's thought of this; I didn't read it anywhere, but thought it up after reading ''Leviathan'') that The Merovingian is the embodiment of Thomas Hobbes in The Matrix. He spouts off Hobbesian thought all of the time. Hobbes said that "choice is an illusion" that the only constant is "cause and effect", and that the best thing we can do with our lives is kind of movie along with the flow of causality in such a way that we enjoy all of the *physical, transient* pleasures that we can, while we can. Live a life of comfornt and luxury, etc. The Merovingian *lives out* this ideal: He's living in complete luxury, like at Le Vrai, the Chateau, Club Hel (and he has affairds with women all the time, etc), he wields a great deal of physical power...yet recognizes that it's all just "a game" devoid of purpose; it's transient, etc. He's stopped seeing any higher meaning in anything. --->Hobbes was a big critic of Socrates, and his philosophy was the polar opposte of Socrates' thought. In the same way, The Merovingian opposes Neo and Morpheus' philoshpy of getting out of the Matrix.
:I hold with the theory that he's a former One, that got his brain pattern scanned into a computer to outlive the death of his body. But he got so disillusioned with all of the lies and how the quest for freedom was just a reset button, that he turned against all of this and became the master of the Exiles, living the complete opposite of all of this (note; he ''really hates'' the Oracle, and views everything Neo says about her with extreme sarcasm). Plus, the initials "LV" on the walls of "Le Vrai" are Roman numerals for "LV" = 55. Now, we've already seen 303= Trinity, 101= Neo. So there's something about The Merovingian and the number "5". On top of this, when we first meet him there are 5 glasses set out in front of him (and Persephone, his Trinity-analog, has 3 chocolates on her plate). --->There have been 5 "Ones" before Neo. I think the Merovingian is the ''first'' "One". --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 17:01, 8 February 2006 (EST)

:::Yeah, that theory and his Hobbes relationship (I think--it may be in a book I read) is on the Wikipedia article. I edited the article in dispute of Merv being a past One. It all comes down to some logic points. ''Why'' does he hate the Oracle so much? Because she succeeded where he failed. She stabilized the Matrix by adding true choice, where Merv was likely tapped by the Architect earlier to program basic cause-effect subroutines in the Matrix code as well as manage the root-programs in Matrix-beta-2 that could be used to help with these changes (these programs he now holds for his own purposes). The Architect realized the utopian flaw in beta-1 and thought that simple cause-effect (combined with the root-programs--the monsters of myth) would be sufficient to convince the human minds. He was wrong, of course. Remember that the Merovingian is big on cause-effect, and the Oracle states that he is one the oldest of them all, which makes his human origin very unlikely as the machines by then were fully distrustful of humanity and saw itself as a steward, not bothering to hear out humanity anymore than we would listen to the needs of an ant. The One is purely human; if the Merovingian were a "One", he would have been generated within beta-2, and, as a result, would not be like the Ones that base their power from true choice (particularly the power to ''dis''believe what they see and act otherwise). To add to that: Merv could also be very mad at the Oracle because, in the Oracle's version of the Matrix, any powers he may have had in beta-2 are practically non-existent. (You gave me a new take the character now from that...hmm.) Oh, and "La Vrai" means, "The Truth", which is just Merv's way of protesting of what's around him..vulgarities of "choice". Only in his establishments, by the name implication, will the populace understand the "truth" about what is illusion to him (choice) and real (cause and effect).

:::I wrote a paper about the origin of the One (with a bit on Merv) for a SF convention that will BLOW. YOUR. MIND. If you like, I'd be happy to send you a PDF of it. I've not published this as yet, so it's a unique read that incorporates the above. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:29, 8 February 2006 (EST)

::::I would like to BLOW. MY. MIND. as well... ''the preceeding, signed comment and small recommendation that Spence forward me a copy of his insightful paper on Merv was made by [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] on 17:47, 8 February 2006 (EST) :-)''

::::: Actually, Spence... Could you just, maybe, copy it to User:Spencerian/Matrix or something? It might save you from forwarding it to a billion people. If you don't like that idea, then put me on your forwarding list. --[[User:Day|Day]] 00:19, 9 February 2006 (EST)

:There, I must disagree with you. The Merovingian is not "the oldest of us" but "one of the oldest of us", which would still fit my interpretation. Further, in ''Leviathan'' Hobbes goes on a tangent where he says that because everything in life is "cause and effect", logically, we should '''in theory''' be able to predict the future, because life has no external factors (god, random choice, etc. Fate/causality rules all). But he adds that '''in practice''', this is impossible, simply because there are so many variants that the human mind cannot grasp at once--->it reminds me of discussions of ''psychohistory'' in "Prelude to Foundation"; hen Hari Seldon originally presented his first paper theorizing that psychohistory was ''possible'', he explained that he did not yet have a working model because his paper essentially just proved that you could actually analyze all of the "antecedants" of life in a computer model. I.e. if the universe is so compex that the only functional "model" of it is something as big and complicated as the universe itself, such a model is useless. However, he said that you ''could'' actually make a model smaller than the universe itself..
::Well, the point is that according to The Merovingian's own Hobbesian principles, he is in a possition SIMULTANEOUSLY A) He believes the world to be governed by nothing but causality, and therefore, he should be able to predict the future, but B) THE VERY SAME principles that idea is based on also state that predicting the future is ''Practically'' impossible. This might get a little annoying to him. --->So then there's The Oracle, who CAN predict the future, while he cannot (though in theory, he should). Therefore, this adds another level of hate for her, and he wants the "eyes of the Oracle" (which he's "Wanted ever since I came ''here'') because he's jealous. And who's to say the Machines would not want to tap the talen of the "grotesque" human mind in designing/running a more human world (beta-2)? I digress. P.S. Don't get me started on MXO's Agent Pace...--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 18:13, 8 February 2006 (EST)

:::Yes, Merv is one of the oldest, not the oldest. Merv was only half-right, which is why his Matrix worked only halfway. Predicting the future is not impossible if the events in the world ''work like a computer program does.'' He wanted to predict things logically--but, with choice involved, prediction becomes far less logical or predictable. When people in his Matrix version realized they, too, could guess the logical cause and effect, they lost believablity in their Matrix. The Oracle's Matrix has no such problem for the most part. Hey, you haven't an email address to send you my paper (Joe just got a copy). You can send me your address privately to my email if you care not to post it publicly. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 19:57, 8 February 2006 (EST)

:::: '''Tangent''': I once tried to start up a Matrix-themed MUSH which was to be placed in an unspecified previous iteration of the Matrix, only a few years after the death of the One that started the thing. We had some lengthy debates about how to implement the Oracle or make any sort of assertions that would A) be specific enough so as to be cool when they came true but, b) be vague enough so as to be possible in a roleplaying environment that included, well, ''choice''. Eventually, though, all the staffers got busy doing [http://www.guildwars.com other] [[Main Page|things]]. *wink* --[[User:Day|Day]] 00:19, 9 February 2006 (EST)

: Merovingian, eh? I must say I like it, much preferable to Ricimer - and I'm not a troll. [[User:Jzanjani|Jzanjani]] 02:33, 21 February 2006 (EST)

::Prove it. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 03:02, 21 February 2006 (EST)

==A ''Revelation'' I've Had==

[AgentSmith]Let me share a ''revelation'' I've had [/Agentsmith]. In case you are new, most here are of the consensus that my attitude towards edits is overall blunt/brusk, not "polite", etc. (it's just letters on a screen, so I just never gauged "politeness" much; not that I make personal attacks, just that I "cut through it" and say what I'm thinkin'). Anyway, '''Day''' summarized some of this pretty well on Talk:Perry when he said just now: "''your jumping off the cuff with aggressive language at people who simply disagree with you. It may be a matter that would be handled by inflection, were you interacting in real life, but you should realize that when you're dealing with text only, you have only very gross control over inflection: normal, bold and italics. And they can be construed as meaning many things. As a side note, I've noticed you like to use bold and such a lot and so, sometimes, you do combinations or all-caps or asterisks for further emphasis. I mean this in only an entirely constructive way, but... I have no idea how to interpret those passages except as very loud, so they're more confuysing to me, personally, than helpful.''". Well, I think I've '''finally realized what the crux of the problem was:'''

Loss of essence. A profound sense of fatiuge, a feeling of emptiness...caused by terrorists trying to sap and impurify our precious bodily fluids, through water fluoridation. It's incredibly obvious, isn't it? A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core terrorist works. He hold no value for human life, not even his own. Well, I can no longer sit back and allow terrorist infiltration, terrorist indoctrination, terrorist subversion and the international terrorist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.--->Hahaha, sorry. I can never resist a good plug for the old ''Dr. Strangelove'' routine.

But I digress.

No, seriously. I finally realized what the crux of all of this friction has been: As you know, I am a prolific poster on the official messageboard. '''I think the problem is, I've been posting on BattlestarWiki as if it were a messageboard'''. You see, messageboards aren't as formal and a lot of, well, yelling, arguing as part of debate, etc., is actually ''the norm'' there. Further, when it comes to '''my''' ''overuse'' of ''' ''**inflection**'' '''....I'm just *used* to typing that way because that's how you highlight and emphasize stuff on messageboard posts (it's sort of how you make up for not being able to see visible social cues, etc.) Also--->Posts on messageboards can sometimes fill an entire Microsoft word single-spaced document page. They can get really long. So you've really got to highlight the beginning of every new idea or paragraph like that to make your point, etc.

But on the whole, it's just a different atmosphere, more "pack-mentality" to establish dominance through a show of force (GREAT Farscape joke about that one in the first episode of the fourth season...but I digress.), and a fanatical amount of information, etc.

I realize it took me a while, but I've finally come to the full realization that '''My Talk page posts, etc. seem kind of rough because I'm just typing like these are messageboard posts'''. (Messageboard posts disappared practially after 5 minutes, so you try to have as big an impact as possible, while here they just stay there for long periods, etc.)

So, I've realized that that's what's been going on, and I realize now (from experience) just how different a wiki is from that, so I will alter my tone accordingly. (Of course, I'll still '''highlight''' stuff that might seem important, but not go overboard). --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 03:36, 10 February 2006 (EST)

:Excellent! That's an angle I hadn't considered. The signal to noise ratio is definitely much higher here than at some other places. Heck, the fact that people were still discussing a question I asked around the first of December is an excellent demonstration between the way things happen around here and the official board. I hope you have begun to see that the people here value what you have to say/contribute (without the need to clamor to be heard above the din). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:30, 10 February 2006 (EST)

:: That may be a very apt metaphor, SV. Reading Merv's posts is sometimes like listening to someone who thinks your in the other room, but really you're right behind them. Roughly, "Hey. I'm already ''listening'', '''Dude'''." *wink* Anyway, I hope this is exactly the issue at, uh... issue, here. --[[User:Day|Day]] 16:24, 10 February 2006 (EST)

== Recent Rollback ==

Hey. I rolled back your last edit on [[Louanne Katraine]] because we don't use quotes with single episode citations enclosed in parentheses. So, if I wrote an episode name when discussing an episode in this sentence that talks about, say, "[[Scar]]", it doesn't look like a citation like this ([[Scar]]). For consistancy we do quotes within parentheses in a string of episodes cited, with the exception of the Miniseries name, which is not an episode name per se ([[Miniseries]], "[[Scattered]]", "[[Fragged]]"). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:19, 10 February 2006 (EST)

:Yes, thank you. I was confused on this. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 17:22, 10 February 2006 (EST)

== Template Categories ==
What are you looking for for the writers and directors? A navigation template? Or a category (I ran into [[:Category:Directors]] after I created one)? I'd be glad to help, I just don't have a concept of what you're needing. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:19, 10 February 2006 (EST)

When I write pages about Sharon, Number Six, etc. I write at the bootom "Category:Cylons" (with double brackets around it). I think we need a Category set for "Writers" and "Directors" (in place of "Cylons"). However, one or two episodes split the "Writers" credit between "Teleplay" and "Story by" (see official site episode guide). I just put "Story by" into "Story by" slots in the guide, and Writer for who wrote the Teleplay: Regardless, I think both Teleplay and Story writers should fall under the "Writers" category, and I will make note of which was which on their individual pages.
----->Essentially, I realized we had no "At a Glance" method of seeing the past work of a writer or director. Essentially, I see that episode 3.12 is coming up, and I see "hmm, who is this? why, I'll click on his name and get a list of other episodes he's done.....oh no! He wrote the abysmal "Black Market"!...or..."Hmm, she wrote the wonderful "Resistance"...this should be interesting. I'm trying to make A) pages for all of the writers and directors, and B) lists on those individual pages of all the episodes they've worked on, so, logically--->C)We should have a more fully developed category system for "Writers" and "Diretors" (the rudiments of which are present on the main page, but which were never fully developed. I felt that now is a good a time as any.)--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 20:33, 10 February 2006 (EST)
:There's a directors category already, and a Category:Director: Michael Rymer, which is a subcategory of Michael Rymer. Thus if you tag an episode with Category:Director: Michael Rymer it should fall under the Michael Rymer category. The directors category would then just be a container for all those subcategories. So we just need a Category:Director: X where X is each director (and make sure that each of those has the category of Director, so that they show up as subcategories). We could then make a template, I guess, but since we're talking about just having to add one category tag at the bottom, I'm not sure it merits a template. I'll start up the Category:Writers, if you want, if you could list out which Directors and Writers we need to capture. We may want to consult with Farago on this, as he has a knack for categorization. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:44, 10 February 2006 (EST)
::Ah. There's already a Category:Writers as well. Looks like somebody planned ahead. It looks like we'd just need to make the subcategories then. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 20:47, 10 February 2006 (EST)

== Rollback ==

I rolled back your last edit on the Binary Star System article. "Battlestar" is not capitalized unless at the start of a sentence or when used in the show's name. The article referenced is [[Mercury class battlestar]] as shown and needed no capitalization. "Axis" to "column" (or spire) adds little to the edit, but it's a matter of taste there. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 00:15, 19 February 2006 (EST)

==Just to say==
Merv, I just wanted to say that I think you've been putting an excellent face forward recently. Keep it up. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 20:23, 19 February 2006 (EST)

''All is proceeding according to plan..''--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 21:07, 19 February 2006 (EST)

== Colonial arm patches and insignia ==

No offence, but call yourself a Battlestar Galactica fan?
Some Merovingian you are! you are an insult to both the name and the entire series of both past and present series of "Battlestar".
If you want to recognise these images in my document, which took me the better part of my morning (and life):
1)Watch the entirerity of Battlestar Galactica(1978) and Battlestar Galactica(2003) for all of said patches on the uniforms.
2)LOOK on EBAY! If they are so wrong, why are they selling them? They are free pictures from a public site of official merchandise! The rank structure is off this site!
I've been watching Battlestar Galactica since I could crawl when it was first aired!! You're just envious that I have done this amount of research in such a small space of time and used little devices called brain cells.
My advice, before you engage your keyboard, open your eyes and watch the damn program(s)! Only one person has left neutral feedback and spotted things even I missed!! Fair play to him.
Question) Why go to such lengths to put true fans of the program down?
Answer) Envy. --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:I suggest you reconsider your statements with a calmer head, and learn that, as "Merv" has, politeness goes a long way. Also, never assume malevolence when incompetence remains a possibility. ;) --[[User:Redwall|Redwall]] 16:47, 20 February 2006 (EST)

Thank you, Redwall, for defending me. There are several things you need pointed out which I believe your are unaware of Jetstorm316:

:'''1) I am not the person that deleted all of the images which you added to "Colonial arm patches and insignia"; that was Administrator SteelViper, who did so on February 20th, at 14:23.''' Please check the History page to confirm this, if you must.

:'''2) All I ever edited that you posted was on the [[Uniform]] page, and all I did was remove links to "Colonial arm patches"''', when it became apparent that
::A) SteelViper had already deleted most of the images from this page.
::B) As you can see now, Administrator Spencerian has already marked that page for deletion. '''All I have actually done is remove links to a page about to be deleted. I am not the one that deleted your images, or that is attempting to delete that page'''.
::C) There were also some minor factual corrections to "Uniform"; First: No, black arm bands are not worn only by "military police"; all Marines seen wearing the khaki uniform have black armbands. Does this mean they're Marines or Non-Coms? I don't know. Seemed a minor point. Second, despite your..."amount of research", it is false to say that "there is a grey arm patch on the left shoulder"; in fact, it is grey ''shoulder patches'' which I was referring to, not a single armpatch; I have since edited the article to be more specific

::'''''(Only because I pointed it out in the first Place "Dick Tracy" - Jetstorn316).'''''
:::Not really. I call those different colored patches "arm patches" because they're at the top of their arms; apparently you thought I was referring to a shoulder insignia, so I changed it to "shoulder patch" so you would not make this mistake in the future. You did not "point out" anything; "grey arm patch on left shoulder" (not both) is simply wrong. You didn't really....point out, much of anything.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 08:57, 21 February 2006 (EST)

:'''3)''' Your only real complaint against me is that I corrected the "Uniform" page: '''Your claims to having paid close attention to Original Series BSG are actually irrelevant in this matter, because the "[[Uniform]]" page deals entirely with Re-Imagined Series material.'''

So please, if you have a complaint about your images being deleted, please bring it to Administrator SteelViper, who deleted them.

I would hasten to point out that '''E-Bay should not be considered a reliable source of information, to put it mildly'''. One of your patches for Re-Imagined Pegasus was blatantly wrong, as it stated "BSG 63" instead of "BSG 62": "''My advice, before you engage your keyboard, open your eyes and watch the...program''". I think more of these problems might exist in the other images. Please provide reliable sources for them, following the rules of our [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad|Battlestar Wiki Citation Crusade]]. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 20:12, 20 February 2006 (EST)

: I concur, Merv. eBay is not a source sanctioned by the [[Battlestar Wiki:Citation Jihad|Citation Jihad]]. Just because something is sold there does not mean it is factual. Look at all the obviously wrong STar Trek stuff that sells on there. Or all the random, literally, ''trash'' that sells. Jetstorm, if you're reading this, we ''greatly'' prefer to use stills from the actual episodes for images when we can. If not, then we're much more likely to want drawn (whether by hand or electronically) images, rather than photos of fan-created props. What we would risk losing in accuracy from such fan-created works (artwork or, for instance, sewing) we'd gain in the ability to change some .psd on a regualr user's HD. It is quite bad form to flip out at someone for changing your edit to a page. It is ''quite'' bad form to do so at the wrong person. --[[User:Day|Day]] 00:05, 21 February 2006 (EST)

And which....program were you watching? Matrix or BSG? Did you pick the wrong one up from Blockbusters?

Yes, I Conceed the "BSG 62 point", as at the time of manufacture (look, research!), the manufacturer was under the assumption that it was "BSG 63". Small error, but what can we do? I do not claim to be perfect, nor assume I'm right. I've always got something new to learn.

:"What you can do" is pay attention. You just made a long tirade, berating me because you felt YOU paid "much more attention" to the series, when in fact actually watching the episodes, but more to the point, BOTHERING TO USE BATTLESTARWIKI's PEGASUS ARTICLE, would have alerted you do this error. Define "irony".--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:00, 21 February 2006 (EST)

Steelviper did contact me in regards to the images, and at the time I had trouble previewing them even though I uploaded them first, that is why there were duplicates. Clerical error. But at least he was man enough to tell me, via email!

:You do not understand how this works: according to our Standards and Conventions, the official way we alert each other of these problems is by posting on BattlestarWiki talk pages, not outside e-mail. Perhaps you are referring to the fact that SteelViper left a message on your own Talk page; this isn't called "e-mail". Moreover, '''I also left a message there''', which included a link to the discussion on THIS page; it is considered rude/redundant to just repeat the same discussion on two sets of Talk pages; instead, it is best to leave links to the primary discussion from the other Talk pages, etc. etc. which is exactly what I did.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:03, 21 February 2006 (EST)

But you are wrong on the rest of the discussion, "MERV".

Military Police or security personnel ARE the only people who wear black armbands. Starbuck, Cally, Dualla nor Tyrol wear one!
It is my guess that this is to seperate crew from Millitary law personnel in times of incursion or juditial period. The Khaki may be a universal uniform(off duty, planet ops, ect). Non-Coms and recriuts are the main users for this "Dress" code.
Marines wear Black Combat Gear and Black body webbing/armour.

:Again, no; we know very little about Marines, and we don't actually know any of this; as far as we can tell, ALL marines that don't wear Battle Dress Uniforms (Black Combat Gear, capitalized, is not a real term) also have the armband. Either way, it is the subject of much debate, and we haven't actually been able to conclusively figure this out because they feature the Marines so rarely. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:07, 21 February 2006 (EST)

Obviously, I'm dealing with an American intelect with very little Military knowledge. No wonder you lost Veitnam!

Ebay IS a good source, it's just a shame you never thought of it. Its just a matter of where to look. Film footage, in this case, is unreliable, as most of the images are blurred. In reference to your member [[User:Day|Day]], It's official merchandise otherwise EBAY would retract ALL sales of said merchance due to legalities. "DUH!"

:Um....No. Ebay is not a good source; they can sell anything, usually fan made stuff. It is not our policy to use it, plus it wouldn't make sense to use it. If film is blurred...we get a ''sharper image''. No, it is not simply "official merchandise"; besides, the cheap plastic Star Trek pins and insignia you see sold all the time on these are often quite wrong. They're just churning out stuff for us to buy, without regard to accuracy.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

[[User:Redwall|Redwall]], "Merv" is cocky and rushes headlong into matters that don't concern him. A tactical ploy which doesn't work with me. I've beaten guys like this before, and won! Politeness is something you EARN! In case you haven't noticed, Merovingian is another name for "Librarian". I added the links as a follow up segment, to show what he is describing.

'''Rush in? ''You'' Rushed to my Talk page to accuse me of making image deletions which I in fact did not, and made quite a long tirade about it without checking the facts first, which would reveal that I am not the person that did it. Since ''when'' is responding to a personal attack posted ON MY OWN TALK PAGE considered "matters that don't concern me"?'''--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:13, 21 February 2006 (EST)

"Merv" or should I say '''"Dick Tracy"''', the whole point of the article, is to show the difference between TOS and the Reimagined series. Go ahead, deleate the article, but did you not stop think that I wouldn't back it up on my HD? "Something that is lost can be replaced" is what my old C.O. used to say. This article is no exception. If you are "All-knowing" why didn't y'all see this coming? Unless you plan on breaking into my house (Unlikely), and destroying said articles and images, there's not a fat lot of good you can do!

:...you're really not paying attention. '''For the third time, *I* am not the person that was trying to delete these images, though I supported their deletion after the fact.''' You think we're like, trying to destroy these images at all points in time and space? Of course images still exist on E-bay and stuff. We can just delete it every time you try to add it into BattlestarWiki; and if you do so repeatedly in the face of deletion, such actions will be met with stern measures by the Administrators.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:16, 21 February 2006 (EST)

Tell you what, Ban me from this site for all I care! You sound like you spend too much time in your basement worriing about fact than what is wrong.

::"[[Wikipedia:Truthiness|Truthiness]]" --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:18, 21 February 2006 (EST)

True fans don't worry about this, just hope it makes good TV. If we did, the current "Pegasus" would(or should) have died at "Battle of the Resurrection Ship".

Take this "Site", bend over and shove it! I'll start my own, you dumb yank!

PS Never use the word "Jihad", you never know who is watching!--[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]], 21 Febuary 2006.

:Oh I will gladly have you banned; you contributed nothing of value, and have proven to be quite an irresponsible user. I will make sure your request is granted. '''I may be a cruel man, but I am a fair one.''' --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 09:19, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: We've debated the use of the term Jihad already, Jetstorm. We expect people to be watching. If you would follow the above-linked project page to it's Talk, you can see that discussion for your self. I don't feel the need to repeat it here. I don't feel that anything else that's been said since I last posted in this deserves a direct response, so that's all I'll say. --[[User:Day|Day]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Jetstorm, for the love of the Gods, if you want to survive here much longer, I suggest you ''shut the fuck up right now.'' --[[User:Redwall|Redwall]] 08:03, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Please, Redwall. This will solve nothing. Jetstorm does seem more willing to mellow out, now.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 08:33, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::Thank you, Merv. But a Note to Redwall, "Bully boy Tactics" have no effect on me, just makes me stronger! Myself and Merv have settled our "debate" in an honourable way, with much information shared, so we can both learn and grow, to co-exist as it were. I went for a brisk walk to sort myself out. I do regret things were said in the heat of battle and it proved noone really won anything. It made us look like school kids squabbling in a playground over nothing. Regretable, wouldn't you say?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

== Talk page uniform ==

please refer to the talk page for uniform, sections Dress Uniform RDM and Counterpoints. I do belive you'll find something of valuable notice.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

User talk:Steelviper

2006-02-22T21:18:21Z

Jetstorm316: Amr patch 1

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T21:09:33Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:::What I figured happened was that Cain needed a deck chief so she assigned him to that job since he was an aeronautical engineer and gave him a rank commensurate with his position. As Cain would say, "I m a flag officer in detached service during a time of war. Regulations give me broad authority in these matters." --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 11:29, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::::Possible, due to the fact she lost 700 men, maybe her original deck chief was one of those casualties, hence Liards field promotion.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:::::Exactly my point. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:41, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Back to the original discussion, Point C), if you look at Talos's images Khaki OD dress, this is taken form the pilot episode as Tigh walks away from the CIC. To help everyone out a little, this is time index 8 mins 2 seconds. If you look at the right arm of the non-com, you will see a black armband, with 2 letters in yellow. If I can get a better/clearer shot of this, I would wager the armband reads "MP". Now tell me I don't know my millitary structures! Could anyone please help varify this (Pictorial)fact?
--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Good examples, Talos. Well deserving of recognition. Why Don't you add them into the document as additional
supplement.--[[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I was planning too. I just wanted to show them here first. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

== New Uniform Pics ==
Sweet. Thanks, Talos! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:43, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:My pleasure. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:55, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T18:31:24Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:::What I figured happened was that Cain needed a deck chief so she assigned him to that job since he was an aeronautical engineer and gave him a rank commensurate with his position. As Cain would say, "I m a flag officer in detached service during a time of war. Regulations give me broad authority in these matters." --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 11:29, 22 February 2006 (EST)
::::Possible, due to the fact she lost 700 men, maybe her original deck chief was one of those casualties, hence Liards field promotion.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Good examples, Talos. Well deserving of recognition. Why Don't you add them into the document as additional
supplement.--[[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I was planning too. I just wanted to show them here first. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

== New Uniform Pics ==
Sweet. Thanks, Talos! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:43, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:My pleasure. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 12:55, 22 February 2006 (EST)

User talk:The Merovingian

2006-02-22T15:42:28Z

Jetstorm316: /* Colonial arm patches and insignia */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T12:59:20Z

Jetstorm316: /* Counterpoints */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Good examples, Talos. Well deserving of recognition. Why Don't you add them into the document as additional supplement.--[[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T12:42:01Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T12:41:37Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I have to go check out my DVDs but it looked like Laird had CPO pins on his uniform. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:13, 22 February 2006 (EST)
:: which were most probably given as a field promotion, due to his technical expertise in aeronautics--[[user:jetstorm316|jestorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T12:12:17Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

== Battle Dress Uniform ==

There seem to be two collar variations of the BDU's in Home pt. II, the normal collar like in any dress shirt worn by Apollo, and the Mandarin collar uniform worn by Adama. The Mandarin is the stand up collar that in the new generation uniforms is for comfort under body armor. You can see the difference in the screenshots for home on the reference link in the main article. The big two pics are the one of Apollo with the shouldered rifle and any of the Adama pics were he has the pepperbox aimed at Boomer's head.

:I agree. I'll make the change. Also, I may have been wrong about the flight suits. They could be plastic or vinyl instead of leather, opinions? Use this image as a reference. http://galactica.emedian.net/episode/1.06/imagepages/image2.html

I don't know, it looks like leather. I'll brainstorm on this. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

:The sleeves look like Vinyl. The vest looks like an unpolished leather. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 17:15, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:: To me, the suit bit (sleeve, pegs, under-vest, etc.) looks like some kind of ''rubber'' material to me. I've thought this for a while now. I imagine that it's some kind of Space-Age Technology that is super-insulative and air-tight that would help in the case of cabin depressurization while in a Viper. This is, after all, the flight suit. I agree that the vest thingie looks leather. --[[User:Day|Day]] 18:34, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

:::I agree with Day in that the flighsuit is probably a futuristic Space-Age material. I wonder what the actual costumes are made of (besides the vest, it is most likely unpolished leather). --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:21, 13 September 2005 (EDT)

If you are talking about the "Digital Urban Cammo" "BDU', which is actually known as a MARPAT...its not a collar variation, its the same collar. it can be worn like a madarin collar, or open like a standard butterfly collar.
My Question about the BDU's is what is the designation for the Khaki/Tan variant of the BDU's seen in the MiniSeries and the 1st Season?-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]
:There is no Urban MARPAT, only the Forrest and Desert versions since the Urban was never accepted. The BDUs they wear in Home look to be a commercial digital pattern based off the MARPAT like the ones you can get at UsCav. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 13:04, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::Yep. While MARPAT has become slang for digital camo, technically only the U.S. Marines can use [[Wikipedia:MARPAT|MARPAT]]. The Army countered with the [[Wikipedia:Army Combat Uniform|ACU]], which lacks the color black. The wikipedia ACU article talks about the whole "Mandarin" up/down style (like Strato said). Does anybody have captures of the older (1st season) camo pattern that Strato is talking about? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:31, 7 February 2006 (EST)
:
::I wasn't refering to a Camo Pattern when I refrenced the Khaki/Tan...but a BDU uniform that is of the same construction as the Olive Drab ones...only Khaki/Tan.
This is seen in the background a few times in the Mini-Series (once on a Deck Hand working at a bench in the hanger deck) but can be seen most clearly in the Episode "Litmus" on Sgt. Hadrian ( http://www.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Hadrian). Just curious if thats supposed to be a Marine BDU variant, or what it is. In the Miniseries the Marines wore OD plus an armband that simply stated "Security"...so I really don't know what the color difference is supposed to mean.( in my last post above I was refering to Digital Cammo as "MARPAT" in the same way we refer to Tissue Paper as "Kleenex" regardless of the brand...sorry if that was confusing)-- [[User:Stratohead|Stratohead]]

:::Um, as I have already said in the main article, "Marine NCO's (Non-Commissioned Officers) wear a khaki uniform"-->That's a Marine Non-Com uniform. Normal Marines don't wear it.--[[User:Ricimer|Ricimer]] 18:32, 7 February 2006 (EST)
::::It is just a khaki variant of the green service uniform that both the Non-coms and Officers wear. It may be missing the suede shoulders though, I need to go check out Litmus. Isn't it ironic that todays quote is from Litmus? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 20:20, 7 February 2006 (EST)

== Pictures ==

This article (as noted on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Standards and Conventions|Standards and Conventions]] page) is gonna need a lot of pictures. Do you guys think that we should create a 3- or 4-equals heading for each kind of uniform to better align tha pictures with the accompanying text? This would also help in finding the specific type of uniform a reader is loking for if they were looking for that, rather than just looking for all/any uniform information. --[[User:Day|Day]] 20:48, 12 September 2005 (EDT)

== Viper Pilot's Wings ==

What is the insignia that Colonial Officers wear on their uniform on the left side of their chest. It's diamond shaped, and some have sort of wings on the top, and some on the bottom. I have wondered what each signifies, or whether they are Viper Pilot's Wings, which I thought Kara mentioned in "You Can Never Go Home"(not sure of the name) [[User:Rocky8311|Rocky8311]] 21:12, October 17, 2005 (EDT)
:Apollo takes his off and pins it on Hotdog in "You Can Go Home Again." Just from the dialogue in that scene, I'd say they Wings. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:50, 17 October 2005 (EDT)
::See, that's what I'd say too, but I think Gaeta and others have the same insignia...it doesn't seem to me that it should be so common.

Adama, Tigh, Fisk, and Cain have the "wings-on-top" insignia, possibly designating a command role. Gaeta's counterpart aboard Pegasus also wears the wings. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 23:23, 23 January 2006 (EST)

On the Wings issue, I would suggest that Lee's are Standard Viper Aiviator Wings(VAW? could we get away with that?), and William and Sauls Pilot wings are Senior Viper Aviator Wings(SVAW)--[[user:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]] 21 Febuary 2006.

==Jacket==
I removed the line "[[Lee Adama|Apollo]]'s flight suit identifies that he is actually qualified to pilot both." A jacket, in military aviation, is a dossier that contains all the pilots qualifications, commendations, etc. Stinger was not referring to Apollo's flight suit but his record, which he would have recieved when Apollo was transferred under his command. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 22:51, 22 January 2006 (EST)

: Ahhh. Ha-ha! That makes much sense, then. I guess I can take off "scrutinize Lee's uniform for mention of a Raptor" of my list of things to do. Interesting. --[[User:Day|Day]] 08:43, 23 January 2006 (EST)

== Dress Uniform RDM ==

I know this has not been discussed much, but as far as I can see, Military Dress falls into these topics

A) Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned.

B) Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training.

C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown.

D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat.

E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? --[[User:Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

: Here is what I can add

: A) These are known as Dress Greys and fullfill the same role as the Full Dress Blues in the USN. 

: B) These are Blue with a different cut than the Greys. Except for Hoshi, all "Junior Officers" (Major and Below) wear the Diamond with the downturned wings and Colonel and up wear the larger spread wings. These are like the USN Service Dress Blue in that they can be worn on watch and are still formal enough for some ceremonies (like in Pegasus). 

: C) Mainly seen on Marines and a few random bridge and hallway extras. The OD uniform seems to be the standard uniform for the fleet and is like the Working Khaki in the USN. These can be worn be officers and non-coms alike and seem to be the most formal uniform available for the non-coms. For the officers, it's like an undress uniform. 

: D) There are also yellow uniforms of this type. Jammer wears one. 

: E) When have we seen DCUs?, all there have been is Black BDUs and Urban MARPAT copies. 
: --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 14:50, 21 February 2006 (EST)

: I'm inclined to be in Talos's camp, especially on item E. Why are you creating an issue out of a non-issue? Even mentioning it is pure speculation, fabrication, and over-think at this point. If TPTB depict a desert scene, and roll out a new uniform for it, then you've/we've got our topic to pursue and document. If they ''never'' do a desert scene, then that's their perrogative. Either way, any pursuit of this topic (item E) is a complete waste of time at this juncture.

: We also have to keep in mind... this is a ship/fleet with limited resources, under durress, and a fractured sense of protocol and structure. Yes, they (the military) will try their utmost to keep to standards, but as even Admiral Adama concedes... he's not one for demanding protocol at all times. They (the crew) might have limited caches of uniforms, of pins, of medals, of patches, and are ''making do with what they have on hand'' (which isn't much, considering one ship (''Galactica'') was destined to be interred as a museum piece, and the other (''Pegasus'') was in the midst of a refit). Certain crewers (Hoshi, for example) ''might'' have different pins because they are from different previous postings, now pressed into service at that post because of need, and there's no point in such a petty detail of changing a pin. -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 15:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)

I forgot about Jammer, thanks for that input, Talos, well brought up. Would this mean he'd have a different role on the hanger deck (Orange = Maintenance, Yellow =?) from Cally.
As for the desert Combat Dress(DCU), I may have got my wires crossed, but I can remember the security chief wearing a similar style in "Litmus". But you may very well be right on topic E).
Hmm, food for thought, but interesting non the less..-- [[user:Jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:Hadrian was wearing the khaki version of item C in both [[Act of Contrition]] and [[Litmus]]. --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 16:54, 21 February 2006 (EST)
::Also, on the same subject as Hawke, didn't Roslin have Adama's Admiral insignia made by a jeweler? --[[User:Talos|Talos]] 17:11, 21 February 2006 (EST)
But on that note, did Admiral Adama give his son Lee his old Commander Pips?--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]
:I like to imagine so, although it was probably for reasons of sentimental value instead of necessity--they had insignia for Fisk and Garner by some unknown means. [[User:Philwelch|Philwelch]] 03:16, 22 February 2006 (EST)
But why promote Lee? There are other Senior oficers that could do the job. Why the favoritism? Puzzling.......
But I wouldn't give the job to Saul Tigh, otherwise we'd be renaming the pegasus the "JIM BEAM" (HA HA!)--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:Please read Questions and Analysis on "[[The Captain's Hand]]" where this question was already asked, and possible answers given; my best-fit theory is that like on ''Star Trek'' and in the real US Navy, anyone who commands a ship is called "captain" even if they have a rank lower than "captain", right? Perhaps this is a continuation of this Navy terminology; Apollo is made "Commander" (their Captain equivalent) of Pegasus, therefore he is given the rank of "Commander"; why put him in charge at all? Well, Tigh never wanted his own command, and below that, there aren't many other high-ranking officers left.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:27, 22 February 2006 (EST)

True, but Kara Thrace is another possible "Candidate". A natural tactitian(like myself), and brilliant leader. A little rough around the edges, maybe more responsibility thrown upon her may mellow her.

:A) Kara is not the best of commanders, B) They've only got so many officers, and they need a Galactica-CAG, C) Apollo outranks her. 2 months ago she was a Lieutenant. Apollo is at least 3rd or 4th ranking on Galactica.

::What about "KAT"? as C.A.G?, It then frees up Kara to move up the command chain.

Question: Have the colonials setup a training camp to repalce losses?--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

:.....The episode "[[Act of Contrition]]", the episode "[[Scar]]"....Jetstorm316, I mean this out of genuine confusion: how much of the New Series of Battlstar Galactica have you seen so far?--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:54, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But thats for PILOTS. What about officer training facilities, boot camps for marines, ect? Recruiting instead of enslaving is a must considering current fleet status. They did so in TOS, replacing officers is also crucial or the command structure will crumble from the ground up.

:And to answer your above question: (ahem)ALL OF IT TO PRESENT DATE, ALL ON VCD, DOWNLOADED BY MYSELF, TO WATCH AT MY OWN LEASURE! I can't spend all day analising every episode, I have othe responsibilities to tend to, like a paying job.

I Can't wait until Saturday when I get the latest episode "Download", just to annoy my partner.--[[user Jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

:: "[[Epiphanies]]", [[Asha Janik]]; using some civilians to do grunt work in understaffed areas like assembling the ammunition they got in boxes from Ragnar.--[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 06:52, 22 February 2006 (EST)

But have they recruited to re-enforce their dwindiling Military? Asha is still civilian aswell as Peter Liard, a civilian deck chief on Pegasus, even though he was pressganged. "Pegasus" can only do so much.--[[user:jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

==Counterpoints==

Okay....I do not want this to get "ugly", however there are a *LOT* of problems with Jetstorm316's recent posting here in Talk; For starters, at first glance it doesn't look like he even bothered to read the write up '''already in the article''', but instead posted up his own observations. I'm not trying to insult, cast blame, whatever. I wash my hands of this. But I need to make the following counterpoints:

"A) ''Parade Dress - Normal Bridge uniform with a "leather like" sash with medals earned. ''"

:No. As you can see in the write up I did weeks ago for "Uniform" on the front page, a dress uniform is not "a bridge uniform" with some alterations: It is gray, lacks a pocket or shoulder patches, as well as the sash. Senior officers' uniforms also feature a dark gray bar around the neck, and epaulettes. No, it is not called "Parade Dress" (well, with capitals like an official name like that), they call them "Dress Grays", i.e. dress uniform. A point I forgot to make was that the Dress Uniform is actuall an overcoat of sorts; the Duty Uniform (below) just tucks into the belt.

"B)'' Bridge Officer - as above but without sash, with or without pilot wings, pending Viper Pilot Training. ''"

:A key point you didn't notice is that this is not a "Bridge Officer" uniform; it is a uniform for all Colonial Fleet officers: Apollo, Starbuck, and Boomer have been seen wearing them, as noted in that list there which denotes the differences in this uniform for different ranks. LSO Kelly also wears one. And as said above, it's really not like the dress uniform. As for the differences in those little Wing badges they have, I would greatly appreciate if someone could find the little differences between them; however it is definately not "pending Viper Pilot Training", as I do believe that even Raptor pilots or Gaeta have them.

"''C) Khaki - a universal standard, mainly adopted by colonial non-coms, a black armband if Military Police with MP shown. ''"

:No, this is also blatantly wrong. This is not a uniform for "Colonial Non-Coms". Chief Tyrol is the highest-ranking Colonial Fleet Non-Com on the ship, yet as you can see clearly in this Galacticastation pic: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap028.htm he does not wear a khaki uniform. He wears the green duty uniform, which other Colonial Fleet personel, such as Cally: http://www.galacticastation.com/Galactica%20Station/Screencaps/s1/103/bscap014.htm who is an enlisted crewman, also wears. So you see, '''this is not a "universal standard, mainly non-com uniform"'''. No, a black armband is not worn by just "the military police"; all people wearing this that we have seen had the black armband. Either way, we've pretty much confirmed that it is the Colonial Marine Corps Non-Com uniform, but is not used by the Colonial Fleet. (Still, we have not seen it featured much, and the black armband stuff needs more research/attention in future episodes.

"''D) Deck Crew - an orange jumpsuit with a black "hold-all" waist coat. ''"

:Correct; this is in the article, yeah no problem there; there are actually orange and yellow ones (notably Jammer), as has been stated above; on real world ships, color denotes task, but as I stated in the article, "orange" isn't a color used by the US Navy's color-coding system.

"''E) Desert Combats - whats the deal with this? any ideas? ''"
:....did you just count the Khaki uniform twice in your list? No, we have never seen a "desert combat" uniform in any episode.

I am sorry, and I have tried to keep this as close to the facts as possible, however this really needed correction. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 04:51, 22 February 2006 (EST)

:Well, we do agree on something after all, Point D).

As I have stated on Point E), I conceeded it wasn't "Desert" combats, but "Urban" style. Talos quite rightly pointed that mistake out, and I have made sufficiant note of this fact, to correct at a later date in my own files. Once again, point conceeded, no problems here.

Point C) is a tricky one, but I have not seen an episode other than "Litmus"where it was used. Yes, I AGREE more research is needed on this point, maybe pool resourses to define is proper use (I'm offering an "Olive Branch" here, not many get handed out from me), but once again, no problems.

A and B are too close together to seperate, but both uniforms do have similarities with each other.

I must admit, you do have some good points, but some do need redefining.--[[user:jetstorm316|Jetstorm316]]

I uploaded some pics as examples.

A)[[Image:Greys Mini.JPG|thumb|A) Dress Greys ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
B and D) [[Image:Bluesjumpsuit Mini.JPG|thumb|B and D)Blue duty uniform and jumpsuit ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
C) There are some people wearing the khaki without the armband and I'll get a better pic of both the OD and khaki when I get home from classes in about 4 hours. Here's a bad pic of the OD one with a security armband.
[[Image:ODarmband Mini.JPG|thumb|C) OD Uniform with security armband ([[Mini-Series]])]]
 
E) [[Image:Urban FotP.JPG|thumb|E) Urban camoflage uniform ([[Flight of the Phoenix]])]]
--[[User:Talos|Talos]] 07:01, 22 February 2006 (EST)

User talk:Steelviper

2006-02-22T11:12:29Z

Jetstorm316: /* RE: Colonial arm patches */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T10:59:17Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T10:56:06Z

Jetstorm316: /* Counterpoints */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T10:30:57Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T09:42:43Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T09:19:24Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RDM */

User talk:Steelviper

2006-02-22T08:31:33Z

Jetstorm316: /* RE: Colonial arm patches */

Welcome to the BSG Wiki, Steelviper! Be sure to fill in your User page sometime to introduce yourself! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 17:26, 26 October 2005 (EDT)
:User page created (albeit quite spartan). Thanks for the encouragement.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:52, 27 October 2005 (EDT)

== Rave Reviews! ==

Hey. [http://battlestarwiki.org/index.php?title=Battlestar_Wiki:Characters&curid=3315&diff=18646&oldid=17786 Nice work]. Probably we should rework that section, now, to simply be a note to leave the Unknown Delegate alone. However, it's 4:33am here and I don't feel like doing it just now. Anyway, welcome and glad to have you. --[[User:Day|Day]] 05:33, 3 December 2005 (EST)

== King of the TOS Pages! ==

Hey, Steel. I'm sure many of us are noticing you taking point in getting the TOS pages filled in and fortified. It's much appreciated. Someday, when I'm drunk, I'll buy my TOS DVDs and join in. (I'll need some crystal meth to go to get myself to watch Galactica 1980, but you gotta do what you gotta do.) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:08, 14 December 2005 (EST)

:Thanks! I agreed completely with your observation that our TOS deficiencies are pretty embarrassing. Actually, much of the progress stems from working the [[Special:Wantedpages]] as suggested by the "Original Series Article Development Project." That was the first I had heard of that page, and I love it! A lot of the bigger offenders were topics where there was plenty of information available, it was just spread out across the wiki. Hopefully it won't be too long before the front page of the "wanted" pages are all user pages. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 10:29, 14 December 2005 (EST)

==Screenshots==

First off, although I am not personally a fan of TOS, I want to commend you for your contributions to those pages here. I think our site has benifited immensely during the relatively short time you've been active here.

Secondly, I note that there is a quite a dearth of good illustrative screen captures from TOS episodes. To that end, I would like to offer to donate a copy of the TOS DVD box set to you via Amazon.com or somesuch. Let me know if this would be useful. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:30, 22 December 2005 (EST)

:Thanks! I appreciate the thought. "[[Imperious Leader|Santa Claus]]" already beat you to the punch, though. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:05, 28 December 2005 (EST) (Updated)

== Administrator Nomination ==

Seeing how you've just as obsessed with this place as many of us are, [[Battlestar_Wiki:Requests_for_adminship/Steelviper|I've nominated you as an administator.]] --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:44, 27 December 2005 (EST)

:Thanks! I'll get right on that. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:13, 27 December 2005 (EST)

== Congrats! ==

You are now an admin! If you have any questions, feel free to bring them to me or any of your fellow admins. So say we all. -- [[User:Joe.Beaudoin|Joe Beaudoin]] 21:24, 3 January 2006 (EST)

:Welcome to the clubhouse. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 21:37, 3 January 2006 (EST)

:Since you're the new kid, you have to do the mopping. Congrats! --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 01:44, 4 January 2006 (EST)

::Thanks guys! I'll try not to make too big of a mess. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:01, 4 January 2006 (EST)

::: Yes. Congrats. Don't let my "neutral" vote imply that I'll point a gun at your head when you try to depose the President of the Colonies or anything. *wink* --[[User:Day|Day]] 10:34, 4 January 2006 (EST)

==Galactica 1980==

Hi Steelviper. Send me an email at weller43@cox.net so I can confirm for you that the site you mentioned is mine. - Mark Weller [[User:Mokwella|Mokwella]] 23:24, 3 January 2006 (EST)

:Since Joe, as host, is ultimately the liable party, it would probably be best to go directly to him. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 00:58, 4 January 2006 (EST)

::I didn't mean to stir anything up when I linked to your site. I just stumbled across it, as there isn't that much that comes up on a Google search for "Galactica 1980 dvd". Hopefully after you've emailed Joe everything will be clear. Sorry for any inconvenience. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:01, 4 January 2006 (EST)

== FLeet ==

Thanks for spotting these typos. It's an unusually common one with me. I'm getting better about catching them, but some still slip through. --[[User:Day|Day]] 15:01, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:You're welcome! Fortunately the consistency is what got them on my radar (they ended up on the "Wanted Page", which I tend to patrol). Thanks for doing all those, by the way! I was getting tired of linking to "The Fleet#Original Series|the fleet". The Fleet (TOS) is much more concise. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:15, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:: Oh, I didn't make [[The Fleet (TOS)]]. Someone else split up The Fleet into the RDM and TOS name-spaces. I'm just currently purging Fleet since nearly all of those should be double-redirects. I'm not done, either, but I'm getting there. --[[User:Day|Day]] 15:19, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:::I think Peter Farago and Spencerian were primarily responsible for making the change. I just saw you were doing a lot of Fleet redirect work.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:22, 16 January 2006 (EST)

:::: Heh. I forgot the links would be bad. Anyway... yes. --[[User:Day|Day]] 19:09, 16 January 2006 (EST)

Gah! I was about to start finishing this thing off but I kept finding them already fixed. I hit the refresh and they were GONE! ''*GASP*''! Thanks, man. I can cross that one off, then. --[[User:Day|Day]] 17:17, 18 January 2006 (EST)

:You're welcome. I saw it was almost done, and got in groove. Now I just need to figure out how to use scripts to do that (as Spencerian suggested on his talk page). Unfortunately a lot of times it takes a human eye to figure out which way a particular link needs to go (if I had just thrown a script at it I would have gotten the Eastern Alliance one wrong, unless it somehow could check the categories of the page). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 17:20, 18 January 2006 (EST)

:: Yeah. I was thinking about that. I don't think a script could be smart enough unless you took forever to write it, and then you're not being any more time efficient. I think hand-fixing things is the only way to do it, really. Now, the next project will be to go find all the links that go to "Last, First"-style character pages and fix those... A nit-pickers work is never done.--[[User:Day|Day]] 17:23, 18 January 2006 (EST)

== Humano-Cylon Naming Question ==

SV, when you have an opportunity, provide your two cents to the debate to "retire" the Humano-Cylon term on its talk page. I'm generally against it as it's rather pervasive and works fine for here. Peter is for the change, but the logic surprises me. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:54, 24 January 2006 (EST)

:Que? Oh. Well, I put in my two cubits (though I'm not sure how much that's worth with the conversion rates, inflation, etc.). Lots of interesting issues at hand. Hopefully more people will weigh in (unlike on the translation stuff). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 12:41, 24 January 2006 (EST)

== Glad to be of service ==

It's going to take me a week or two of doing this, and my Spanish will come back...in the mean time, bear with me and don't hesitate to correct anything if you see something blatantly wrong.

Glad to be of service, I assume this is mostly your project, I applaud the effort, and I'm glad to help. --[[User:Leoben Conoy|Leoben Conoy]]

:I never really intended it to be my project... I just mostly tried to start forging the translating pattern in the hopes that other people might join in. I am extremely pleased that people have! (Especially having two languages going at once!) I still don't have the whole picture of how everything will go (does Water/es:Water ever turn into Agua?), but I'm sure we'll figure things out. Joe might have a better concept of how the whole operation will work. I'll try to read over the Spanish work, but I expect that even your "blatantly wrong" will make more sense in Spanish than what I was doing. Also, if you want to sign your comments with your name/timestamp (all the cool kids are doing it), just use four "~"'s like this <nowiki>~~~~</nowiki> (though we often prefix that with a couple of dashes, for style. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:08, 2 February 2006 (EST)

==Nuclear warhead==
I just added how he got it because it was mentioned later down the article, when he gives it to Gina. --[[User:DrBat|DrBat]] 08:57, 14 February 2006 (EST)
:Right on! I left in the part where she gets him to request the nuclear warhead. I'm just not sure it has been detailed that he actually used the warhead as part of the detector. It seems like he just requested it to placate Six. The details of the working Cylon detector remain (I think intentionally) a little fuzzy. If they explicitly mention that he actually uses the warhead in the detector, then go ahead and add it back in. It just just seems that he was flexing his scientific muscle, though.--[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:02, 14 February 2006 (EST)

==Thanks for the Welcome==

Hi, I don't know how much use I can be around the rest of the site (I'm not very tehnical-minded) but I love transcribing things (I must be mad) and so I'm happy to do as many of them as I can for you. Don't hesitiate to correct me if I mess something up too, like I said, I'm not brilliant with computers. Anyway thanks for saying hi. --[[User:Misco|Misco]] 15:40, 14 February 2006 (EST)

:You're welcome! Usually that job falls to [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]]. (In fact his initial greeting is still at the top of this page, as I don't get enough traffic to require archiving.) I jumped at the opportunity to welcome a new transcriber, though! I've tried doing it myself (though I managed to lose my work), but find that my OCD-like compulsion to get EVERY SINGLE sound (including the filler um's, ah's, sort of's) slows me WAY down. It amazes me when I get a chance to read transcriptions of people like yourself and [[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] that have excellent filters that clear out all that junk leaving only the good stuff. Feel free to contribute in whatever ways you are comfortable! As with any wiki, the more the merrier. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:47, 14 February 2006 (EST)

== Printed Media Copyrights ==

Did you catch who uploaded those Official Companion pictures? We need to make a note on their user page immediately. This is something we would get sued for, fast since this is a publication and not a broadcast. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 14:06, 16 February 2006 (EST)
:I believe it was [[User:Crashoveride]]. If you wouldn't mind making the note, you seem to have a better grasp at the applicable laws. When I spotted them, they felt a bit wrong, but I wasn't confident enought to outright delete them. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:10, 16 February 2006 (EST)

==Wanted List==
Cool! (sorry about the late response) :) --[[User:Blacklight|Blacklight]]

:Mas vale tarde que nunca. (Better late than never.) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:04, 16 February 2006 (EST)

== i'm really sorry... ==

... but i didnt know how to use a wiki.
well, i use to visit wikipedia for contents, but as i not expert on any camp, i haven't edited a wiki ever.
i didn't know who to contact o how to contact (no private msg's here?)
well, i just wanted to help with the spanish translation. i'm natural spanish speaker (i'm from spain) i use to watch galactica in originally soundtracked (i dl them for inet two days after is aired, it is legal in spain)
i'll be thankedif anyone helps me. just want to visit some galactica website on translate em to spanish.
have a nice day. --Dancing salad
:I left you a response on [[User talk:Dancing salad|your user talk page]]. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 15:23, 19 February 2006 (EST)
thanks, i'm glad u helped me - and so fastly!
i'll be doing my best on it. dancing_salad 15:30, 19 February 2006 (EST)

== RE: Colonial arm patches ==

Thank you for your recap, well deocumented, and by the looks of this topic, it's not the first time Merv has done something like this.

Could you advise me where best to show my article/images in the best way as all parties (including Merv before he jumps in again) can veiw them and admire them.

As you can tell, I've gone for a brisk walk to calm myself and picked up my 4yr old daughter from school. Yes, I made comments that were harsh, but if you made an article and someone "slaped it down", you'd be miffed too. Right now I'm trying to recover from sciatic nerve damage cause by over work, so I'm trying to keep myself occupied.

PS - Thank you for being a neutral party in this matter.(Damn your good for your age, I'm 27!) --Jetstorm316

:You have, I think, perhaps walked into a potentially huge "opportunity" (read pile of work). I'm not sure if there is a simple place to stick all of your contributions yet, as I think the current structure might not yet be where it needs to be. [[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] suggested the military ranks (RDM, and TOS). That might do for a start, but your article made me realize that we don't have a Uniforms (TOS) page describing (and displaying images related to) the Original Series uniforms. If a Uniforms (TOS) is warranted, then potentially the TOS patches and insignia could go in a patches and insignia section on that article, with RDM patches and insignia going in a new section of a (newly moved?) Uniforms (RDM). The existing Uniforms page is in desperate need of color (images) anyway, and having (verified) patches to display would be a potential way to start that process. That's just one guy's idea, though. I'd recommend asking this same question over at [[Talk:Colonial arm patches and insignia|the article talk page]] or on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Administrators' noticeboard|admin noticeboard]] to get the opinions of some others. I'm sure if we all put our heads together, we can come up with something. (Don't worry about your work "disappearing" suddenly. Spencerian wasn't ACTUALLY deleting yet, he was just trying to start THIS exact discussion. The article you created will not be deleted until we've figured out where everything should go and is everything is in place.) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:17, 21 February 2006 (EST)

*Need I point out, once again, that I am not the one that "slapped this article down", but that Spencerian and SteelViper were both deleting it, and I simply deleted some links to it? I do not want to argue, but I hope you can agree SteelViper, that I should not appreciate baseless accusations. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] 00:35, 22 February 2006 (EST)

O.K. Heres the deal, I do my work, you concentrate on your own. Let other admistrators deal with my work and nothing more shall be said. I, also am a creul man, but I have a better way of saying it. Maybe all it should have took it to show me direction with purpose, like Spencerian, because, as Agent Smith stated "Without perpose, we have nothing".--[[jetstorm316|jetstorm316]]

== images? ==

''just trying to upload som nice images that i found to be neede on the [[Battlestar_Wiki:Requested_Images]], from starbuck cutting cylon spacecraft's brain and getting in, for the [[Cylon Models]] article, refering to the spacecraft.i can upload them to my own host, but i think the images shown in the articles are miniatures from bigger ones uploaded here, isn't it? i have 9 pretty ones, but just want one of them to be thumbnailed (you know, the way the it's done on wikis), and the other ones being watchable.''

oh men how ridicule i feel, just found the image uploading on the tools menu. thanks anyway dancing_salad 18:15, 21 February 2006 (EST)

:Glad to be of assistance. ;) --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 18:37, 21 February 2006 (EST)

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-22T08:09:58Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RMD */

User:Jetstorm316

2006-02-22T07:47:29Z

Jetstorm316:

User talk:Jetstorm316

2006-02-22T07:46:55Z

Jetstorm316: /* Jetstorm316 vs Merv */

User talk:Jetstorm316

2006-02-21T20:32:35Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniforms RDM */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-21T20:28:37Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RMD */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-21T20:26:36Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RMD */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-21T19:33:29Z

Jetstorm316: /* Dress Uniform RMD */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-21T19:31:37Z

Jetstorm316: /* Viper Pilot's Wings */

Talk:Uniforms (RDM)/Archive2

2006-02-21T19:26:35Z

Jetstorm316: Dress Uniform RMD

User:Jetstorm316

2006-02-21T19:20:08Z

Jetstorm316:

"{{Character Data| |photo= |age= 27 |colony=[[Libra]] |birthname=Chris Butler |callsign=Jetstorm316 |death= |parents= |siblings= |children= 2, 1 Daughter, 1 on the way|marital status=Attached |role=Third Generation Soldier(Retired) |rank= |actor=N.I.N. (No Imitations Needed)|cylon= }}

As the profile Suggests, No Imitations Needed, I'm one of a kind.

I started my Sci-fi background eleven years ago, by joining a Star Trek club, known as SFC(Star Fleet Command).

I Stayed with them upto 3 years until a massive bust up over club polotics, split the club in two.

I then helped to setup another club at the age of 17, within my local area called "Phoenix". We then joined "The Collective" which is other fan based sci-fi clubs who helped with other resources, such as venues, events, ect.

Alas, Three years later, I got my first full time job, and I had to put my Sci-fi "carrer" on hold.

During my time with the Phoenix, I joined the military and had four distinguished years service.

I left the Military due to government cutbacks and settled down with my parner, Lisa, of 6 years.

Soon later, my first child arrived, Shannon.

I've been a fan of Battlestar Galactica for as long as I can remember, cronicaling the adventure of Apollo and co.

I'm also a massive soccer and wrestling fan.

I'm interested in chatting with other BSG fans, and exchanging views and oppinions.

Hope to chat soon.

Jetstorm"

User:Jetstorm316

2006-02-21T18:38:42Z

Jetstorm316:

" {{Character Data| |photo=[[Image:.jpg|200px]] |age= 27 |colony=[[Libra]] |birthname=Chris Butler |callsign=Jetstorm316 |death= |parents= |siblings= |children= 2, 1 Daughter, 1 on the way|marital status=Attached |role=Third Generation Soldier(Retired) |rank= |actor=N.I.N. (No Imitations Needed)|cylon= }} "