Battlestar Wiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:The Face of the Enemy/Archive 1

2009-02-04T07:41:04Z

Genji2000: /* Episode Chronology */ new section

=="The" Question==
Hi, since I'm not a native speaker I have a question. Is the name of the webisodes "The Face of the Enemy" as it says on the SciFi Wire or "Face of the Enemy" as you have it? Thanks :) -- [[User:Deus|Deus]] 06:41, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
: Could easily be both, and the script actually uses both variants (with and without "the"). However, since the cover page uses "The", I've moved it for now. (Also, really, the use of "the" is unnecessary as it is more or less implied had they simply said used the title "Face of the Enemy".) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [[bsp:|Battlestar Pegasus]] 15:25, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
:: So, it seems, there is no "The" after all... :) [http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/webisodes/] -- [[User:Deus|Deus]] 04:28, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
::: Sadly, the script's cover page uses the word "The"... Not that it matters much, since linking to "Face of the Enemy" will lead here anyway. ;-) -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [[bsp:|Battlestar Pegasus]] 05:03, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

== Names written down ==

Even though we don't know their importance is right now, I've tried compiling the bits of the list that are legible/seen:
Blue 
Roe, 
Hitchcock, Jasper 
Kim, Philip 
Hah, Crai-pny 
Ehile, Zahef 
Magrath, Shana 
Blue, Steven 
Fish, Stacy 
Rose, 
--[[User:DrWho42|DrWho42]] 18:36, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
: I have the full complete list. In fact, this piece of paper is important for two reasons. The first you'll learn in the webisode near the end. However, most importantly, this is the last prop to ever be shot in the series. :P
: Also, "Rose" should be "Rose, Wayne"—a deliberate nod by the actor/actress (who I won't name yet, you'll find that out in time) to the director of the webisodes. I should know, I was there when they shot it. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [[bsp:|Battlestar Pegasus]] 18:49, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
::Envy runs cold through my veins, Joe. :) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 02:49, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

== Commentary ==

Are the commentary accessible outside of the United States? I can't find it in the downloads section. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 05:29, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
: The Espenson commentaries are integrated into the streaming feed on SciFi.com. They aren't available as a separate MP3, I'm afraid. I'm sure if you searching on youtube, you might find something. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [[bsp:|Battlestar Pegasus]] 05:38, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

== Episode Chronology ==

Why is this episode positioned between 'Sometimes A Great Notion' and 'A Disquiet Follows My Soul' when 'Razor' is positioned between 'Razor Flashbacks' and 'He That Believeth In Me'? [[User:Genji2000|Genji2000]] 07:41, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Talk:Sometimes a Great Notion/Archive 1

2009-02-04T07:27:58Z

Genji2000: /* Previous and Next */ new section

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== Half-Season ==

Are we sure that Sometimes a Great Notion will be aired before the midseason break? I've seen the first half-season referred to as consisting of ten episodes. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 22:58, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
: It's not on the SFC schedule, so I've removed it. Someone must've been overzealous in their addition of the airdates. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [[bsp:|Battlestar Pegasus]] 03:35, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

== Writers ==

In the podcast for Revelations, RDM states that David Weddle and Bradley Thompson will be writing this episode. I though I should bring it up here rather than add it to the article as I'm a relatively new member here, and am still unfamiliar with the editing process.[[User:Pentagonal Deception|Pentagonal Deception]] 23:51, 12 July 2008 (UTC)
: That's all right, Pentagonal. Feel free to [[BW:BOLD|be bold]] take it upon yourself to add it, as long as it's [[BW:CJ|cited]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] - [[bsp:|Battlestar Pegasus]] 04:27, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
::Thanks for the encouragement, but it wasn't so much that I was apprehensive to edit the page, but more that i'm not quite sure how. I really haven't taken the time to learn how to use the editing software, (which is something I'm planning on doing shortly) so i thought it best to bring it up here and have someone willing and able add it.[[User:Pentagonal Deception|Pentagonal Deception]] 19:34, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
:::I added it. You can see the difference [http://en.battlestarwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Sometimes_a_Great_Notion&diff=165728&oldid=164802 here]. -- [[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 18:08, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
::::Many thanks.[[User:Pentagonal Deception|Pentagonal Deception]] 19:34, 13 July 2008 (UTC)

== Episode Title ==

''The title of the episode comes from the blues song "Goodnight, Irene," in which the singer contemplates suicide: "Sometimes I get a great notion / to jump in the river and drown."'' Is this a fact? There's no citation. It's also the title of a song by John Mellencamp. [[User:Genji2000|Genji2000]] 17:58, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
:And, though I don't know if it has to do with anything, the first line of the Mellencamp song, "Never give an inch," is a reference to ''Sometimes a Great Notion'', a novel by Ken Kesey. [[User:Capedia|Capedia]] 07:03, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
::The episode title is a reference to Ken Kesey's novel -- [[User:Hufnmouth|Hufnmouth]] 22:22, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

== Buried Centurion Head ==

Was it just me, or did that uncovered centurion head found in the anthropological dig look like the centurion pictured here:http://en.battlestarwiki.org/wiki/Image:DeSanto_Singer_Project_Cylon.jpg ? -- [[User:Davidkevin|Davidkevin]] 08:14, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
:Nope, that wasn't the head:Flatter face and no forehead ridge. -- [[User:Hufnmouth|Hufnmouth]] 22:23, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
::It wasn't identical, but was still pretty similar. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 21:51, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
:::Yes it is similar but the Eight in Baltar's lab made it clear that while similar, it is not one of their designs. [[User:Hunter2005|Hunter2005]] 03:25, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

==Guest stars==

As an avid credit watcher I thought I'd point out that as of the very beginning of season 4 Michael Hogan, Aaron Douglas, Tahmoh Penikett, Michael Trucco, Alessandro Juliani and Kandyse McClure have all been credited as starring cast members. I've removed them from the guest star section for this episode accordingly.--[[User:Opark 77|Opark 77]] 11:02, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
:Just need a second verification and we should edit [[Season 4 (2008)]] as well. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|talk]]) 13:21, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
::Uh, if you're an avid credit watcher, as you say, then you should know that those name (give or takes a few) have been like that since "33". And it's not just this show that has this sort of thing. Nor, is it a recent trend; I can date the post star/pre-guest star credit thing back to a show from 1989 and few since. That's always been a thorn in trying to figure that out. I will say that if they're stars, then they're names wouldn't come and go based on an episode-by-episode basis like that seeing as how all the ones in the main credits remain regardless (with the exception of Katee's, but that was only to sell the whole "Kara is dead" thing). Until someone can convince me otherwise, I say they're co-stars, who just get upfront credits for some sort of contractual reason. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 17:04, 18 January 2009 (UTC)
:::As I understand it, '''Mars''', it's really nothing more than a monetary issue. The main cast, whose names are credited every week during the main opening credits sequence, are paid regardless of whether or not they actually shoot any scenes for the episode. A recurring or supporting character would not be credited if they weren't used in a particular episode, so they wouldn't have to be paid, but they would be credited before guest characters. A good example of this outside of BSG would be Teryl Rothery ("Dr. Fraiser") on Stargate SG-1. --[[User:Antarctic Fox|Antarctic Fox]] 17:47, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

== Resurrection and the split of the 13th Tribe ==

The dialogue in this episode about the "Final Five"'s previous lives on Earth reminded me of what Virtual said to Baltar n [[Fragged]], about how anyone who was killed on Kobol was dead forever. At the time, it seemed like a throwaway bit of Virtual Six's usual religious zealotry, but after Ellen Tigh's remark in Tigh's vision/flashback about everything being "in place" for their rebirth after the holocaust, I'm no longer so sure.

So, here's a bit of speculation. We know from the advance buzz on ''[[Caprica (series)|Caprica]]'' that the origins of the Colonies' Cylons had to do with [[Daniel Graystone]]'s efforts to resurrect his daughter in an artificial body -- something that presumably would become a very, very controversial idea if applied on a large scale. Maybe that kind of controversy had something to do with the original departure of the Thirteenth Tribe from Kobol. Perhaps their resurrection system was outlawed on Kobol, leading to their exodus. The existence of the ancient probe in [[Torn]] supports the idea that resurrection technology may well have existed thousands of years ago; that episode really made the virus seem like a biological weapon, and the fact that it infected Cylons through the resurrection process may not have been accidental. Was it created to prevent the Thirteenth Tribe from ''leaving'' Earth to return to Kobol? (In that case, maybe what Ellen meant when she said "Everything is in place" was that some of the Thirteenth Tribe had figured out a way to circumvent the various defenses/mechanisms preventing them from rejoining the Twelve. {{unsigned|Argentla}}
:Hi Argentia. More people will hear about your thoughts in a place better built for it, so why not take your thoughts to [http://www.battlestarforum.com/showthread.php?t=2307 the Battlestar Forum episode thread?] (That way, the talk page is left free for questions about the formatting or proper interpretation of what should be in this article itself.) Lots of people are there to talk about it! --22:19, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

==Ron Moore's Commentary==
Ron's commentary accompanying SAGN is up on Hulu. He reveals a lot of the driving forces of the story - both in the mythology and in real-life. He also adds some commentary on the episodes framing which adds to the ugliness of the episode. Lastly, it appears Ron is partaking of some interesting "stuff" during the commentary. -- [[User:Hufnmouth|Hufnmouth]] 22:37, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

== Writer's Strike Ending ==

The little factoid that this episode could have served as series finale does not seem to be accurate, based on several other interviews with the cast and crew. Everyone else has referred to the midseason cliffhanger (Revelations) as being the last episode shot before the break, and the one that would make ''considerably'' more sense as a finale than this one. Can we correct what appears to be a numbering miscalculation? One such source: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/tvguide/396369_tvgif16.html. --[[User:Dharadvani|Dharadvani]] 00:02, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
:That does appear to be just a numbering SNAFU, as I too understood that Revelations was the last episode shot and it does make a lot more sense. I'd say swap it and source it. If there's disagreement, we can have a "source war" in the talk pages, but I'm guessing that the newsfeed referenced on the page is the only one pointing to this as the finale, and it's not even really a direct quote. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 00:13, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

:: RDM also mentioned in the podcast and the article referenced at [8] that this was the last episode shot before the strike. -- [[User:Raziel Anarki|Raziel Anarki]] 19:44, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
:::Right you are. It's right there in that article. I have listened to the podcast yet, as I generally only listen to them as I'm transcribing them, and I've been on a hiatus of transcription. I was kinda hoping people would verify some of my existing transcripts before I came back, but that may never happen. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 23:31, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

== Location of Tigh's Flashback ==

i dont think that this is an apartment building as it is stated in the article. im pretty sure it is a bank and that they are safety deposit boxes and not mailboxes. my first reason is that saul looks professional, like he is at a place of work and not at home. second that the sounds make it sound like much more of a public place and with the glass it looks like offices. and third, there is money falling through the air in the scene in front of the safety deposit boxes. [[User:Bubx2700|Bubx2700]] 02:13, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
:I thought it was a safety deposit box as well (which would lend well towards long term storage, if that's applicable. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:10, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
:They are mailboxes. Safety deposit boxes a) typically have two keyholes: one for the box owner and one for the banker; and b) are secured inside a vault, not in a room with glass windows and door. --[[User:Monupics|Monupics]] 03:28, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

== Mooching transcription services ==

Not to be a pest, but anytime people are documenting what RDM says in an episode podcast, if they could go ahead and transcribe that snippet (you know, word for word) in the episode podcast... or heck, anywhere on here, it'd save me (or whoever ends up doing the podcast) a little trouble later. You/they wouldn't have to get all the formal structure in place... just the words would help. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 21:24, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

== Opening Act Nomenclature ==

RDM still refers to the opening act of this story as "the tease". Should we switch the act titles back accordingly? --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 21:35, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

== Previous and Next ==

The Previous and Next episodes are messed up. Previous should be 'Face of the Enemy' and Next should be 'A Disquiet Follows My Soul'. [[User:Genji2000|Genji2000]] 07:27, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Talk:A Disquiet Follows My Soul/Archive 1

2009-02-04T07:25:45Z

Genji2000: /* Previous */ new section

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== Title ==

I know the episode's title was originally reported as "The Disquiet That Follows My Soul". The current title comes from Verheiden. SciFi.com says "The Disquiet That Follows My Soul" (episode guide and teaser), though. I'm not saying they are right, just thought I'd mention it. --[[User:Pedda|Pedda]] 12:49, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

:Well, according to the Sky TV planning preview thing, the next episode is going to be called "A Disquiet Follows My Soul", though I am confused myself as it seems like some places it call it one, and some others call it the other. -- [[User:Matthew R Dunn|Matthew R Dunn]] 00:20, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
::Never mind, seems they all call it the current title now. -- [[User:Matthew R Dunn|Matthew R Dunn]] 00:22, 23 January 2009 (UTC)

== Unlocking "Tom Zarek" ==

Tom Zarek plays an important part in "A Disquiet Follows My Soul," so updates to that article should appear there soon, but the article is still locked from the time "Sine Qua Non" aired! I apologize for posting this message here, but someone already posted a similar request at the Tom Zarek article--a request that hasn't been answered yet--and since most Wiki users will be focused on "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" over the next few days . . . Thanks. -- [[User:BlueResistance|BlueResistance]] 13:13, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
:I'm pretty sure that was just an oversight. It's unlocked now. I assumed when I read the topic that this was going to be about breaking Zarek out of his prison cell... --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 13:45, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
::Thanks again. -- [[User:BlueResistance|BlueResistance]] 17:10, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

== Unnamed characters ==

Was the female cultist sitting next to the child, with some speaking lines during Baltar's speech credited? And also, is it me or is it the same [[Unnamed Galactica and Pegasus crew (RDM)#Marine Lieutenant|Marine Lieutenant]] from "Escape Velocity" in Athena's raptor? And was Athena's ECO identified? [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 15:14, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

::Definetely looks like the LT to me. For that matter, who was Zarek's Marine guard? Could that have been [[Colin Corrigan]]'s character? It looked like he heard what Gaeta and Zarek were discussing, and Corrigan has said his marine plays a big role in the last episodes.--[[User:Colonial Marine NCO|Colonial Marine NCO]] 15:18, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
:::Looked older than Nowart (Corrigan's character) to me. The marine was also present in the rec room when Gaeta talked to Starbuck, and when he told people inside to look the door, as they need to talk, so by the time he's guarding Zarek he is a member of Gaeta conspiracy. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 15:25, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
::::Just when the Marines could've been doing something productive, too...ah, well.--[[User:Colonial Marine NCO|Colonial Marine NCO]] 15:42, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

== Questions (section 5) ==

''"Besides Tigh, Admiral Adama, and Lee Adama, who else in the Fleet knows that Ellen Tigh is the Final Cylon?"'' - in the Chicago Tribune interview Ron Moore says Laura has also been told, but no one else.[[User:Genji2000|Genji2000]] 22:25, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

"What is Tyrol's status in the Colonial Fleet? In this episode, he was seen wearing only civilian clothing and was advocating for the Cylons. Has Tyrol resigned from the Colonial Fleet? Has he chosen to live amongst the Cylons in the fleet permanently?" - in either the interview or podcast for "Sometimes a Great Notion", RDM said that there was originally a scene with Tyrol moving permanently to the baseship in that episode, but it was cut. Given his status in this episode, it's safe to assume that he did. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 00:01, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

== Episode chronology ==

Wouldn't it make sense to put "[[The Face of the Enemy]]" between "Sometimes a Great Notion" and "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" in the Episode Chronology section of the infobox? Yes, the webisodes were released before "Notion", but they take place between "Notion" and "Disquiet", and the episodes make most sense when viewed in that order. Currently, e.g. the population count is confusing, as it's not clear whether the change refers to "Sometimes" or "Face" as the previous episode. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 02:28, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

==Nick Tyrol==
Question, didn't Cally try and flush Nick out an airlock, because he was half Cylon in a Tie That Binds. So when did she get the paternity test? -[[User:Brucethespruce|Brucethespruce]] 17:37, 26 January 2009 (UTC).
:All she said is that she didn't want the Cylons getting their hands on her son. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 17:38, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
::Doesn't this beg the question; that as a full human child what interest would the Cylons have with Nick. Doesn't not resolve the GAPING plot hole, that is from the same season. -[[User:Brucethespruce|Brucethespruce]] 17:13, 28 January 2009 (UTC).
:::Tyrol didn't know Nicky wasn't his biological son. And all Cally knew was that she was married to a Cylon and a Cylon was raising her son, and the XO was a Cylon. Surely there was a dark purpose to all of this. In her state of mind, that meant 'remove me and Nicky from this nightmare'. BTW, you used a double negative, which resolves to a positive. -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 19:34, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

== Tyrol's dialogue flub. ==

Tyrol:...Our technology is way in advance of ours.
Tigh:Maybe you'd like a chart to keep it all straight?
Perhaps this bit, if it could be transcribed properly, should go in noteworthy dialouge? [[User:ZeldaTheSwordsman|ZeldaTheSwordsman]] 19:08, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
:A good suggestion. [[BW:BOLD|Be bold]]. If you have a recording of the episode, transcribe the scene and add it to the page. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 19:14, 28 January 2009 (UTC)
::It's done. Did you see my edit of Viper 8757?

== Previous ==

The previous episode to this was 'Sometimes A Great Notion', not 'Face of the Enemy'. [[User:Genji2000|Genji2000]] 07:25, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Talk:A Disquiet Follows My Soul/Archive 1

2009-01-25T22:25:28Z

Genji2000:

Talk:A Disquiet Follows My Soul/Archive 1

2009-01-25T22:24:06Z

Genji2000: /* Questions (section 5) */ new section

Talk:Sometimes a Great Notion/Archive 1

2009-01-11T17:58:36Z

Genji2000: /* Episode Title */ new section