Battlestar Wiki - User contributions [en]

Talk:Crossroads, Part II/Archive1

2007-04-15T11:05:45Z

DedMed:

== Promo Pics ==
Are [http://pics.livejournal.com/drewcypher/gallery/000aaqbh here]. Hard believe that's the last for Season 3. However, they may release a few more for this episode. At least there's the 2-hr movie between seasons. --[[User:Gougef|FrankieG]] 20:03, 27 February 2007 (CST)

That promo pic of Six, Baltar, and Hera appears to be shot in the "Final Five" room. Anyone else notice this? [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 19:57, 28 February 2007 (CST)

: Yes, indeed I did. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:02, 28 February 2007 (CST)

::Baltar's been having visions of Six and Hera in the opera house since season 1, so it's not necessarily connected to the Final Five. Since this episode will reveal 1 or 4 of the Final Five depending on which interview you go by, there's a pretty good chance that it relates to them as well. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:16, 28 February 2007 (CST)

:::Am I completely off-base in thinking that that's Virtual Baltar alongside Virtual Six? Because the other photos of that episode show the "real" Baltar still quite disheveled with a thick beard while that Baltar is clean-shaven, not unlike Caprica's Baltar. Didn't Ron Moore say something about the two alter-egos being key figures in the last episodes of the season? --[[User:Kahran|Kahran]] 04:50, 3 March 2007 (CST)

::::Not really "off base", in fact I think that's the most popular theory in general. So unless we're all off base.....which is admitedly possible :P --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 07:37, 3 March 2007 (CST)

:::::If they are able to interact with eachother it would have significant implications regarding their nature. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 17:50, 7 March 2007 (CST)

::::::The virtual Baltar normally wears the unique pinstripe suit from the Miniseries, which I don't see here. I do believe this is a visualization and that is Virtual Six, for the Opera House doesn't exist. If the two alter-egos do somehow directly interact, some Serious Shit will ensure, but damned if I can really glean what. This is as big of a season stumper as season 2's cliffhanger. And, no, Kara Thrace will NOT be one of the Five. But it may be, in my guess, one of these three, although they don't realize it: Dualla, Tigh, or Gaeta. I still hold exception to the fact that what Three saw may be the five priests of the Temple of Five, who just so happen to have incarnations in the current timeline. (Note the monkey that exited my anus and is waving at you). --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:44, 13 March 2007 (CDT)

==Predictions==
Well, it's early, and I don't care to step on Slander's toes, but I have forseen an event in Crossroads, Part II. The top 5 American Idol contestants cameo as... '''THE FINAL FIVE!''' --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:06, 14 March 2007 (CDT)
*I'd like to make a motion that all Predictions in Talk pages be deleted as they are assinine and serve no other purpose than to promote the person making the prediction. Predictions should be in Forums and chatrooms or discussion groups, not here.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 12:29, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
**Dude... they're friggin' jokes. No need to be so uptight. You're reminding me of Merv. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:07, 15 March 2007 (CDT)
*** Motion denied. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 12:04, 19 March 2007 (CDT)

OK. The purpose of a talk page is for ''brief'' discussions and questions about the article. Generally, the humorous "predictions" in other talk pages have not detracted from the talk page's purpose or grown in size, and honestly have given me a chuckle, although my feelings on the matter aren't the sole vote about it. Provided that we don't get into numerous predictions from many users to the talk page in some way, I don't see a problem with it at this time. If there's still a problem about it, a silly page could have a bulleted series of such humor if approved by consensus (although I doubt this would work, [[BW:NOT|we're not a forum]]). Sometimes, predictions are fun ''and'' on-topic: See [[Talk:Exodus, Part II]] where I made a good guess. Now, what's considered "funny" is very subjective. I don't think BB's jest is nearly as humorous as, say, the shining white Final Five being revealed as the ''Jackson Five'' or something. Jokes are OK. If it's a bad one, ignore the poster. If a talk page gets too long, ask an admin to moderate if you can't get others to end a pointless or irrelevant topic. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 13:00, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
:Damn I should've thought of the Jackson Five... --20:10, 19 March 2007 (CDT)
::[http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v518/Slanderpanic/1tito.jpg Tito rules!] On a more serious note, if people object to my predictions, I'll stop doing them. Honestly, this sort of in-joke is inevitable when an Internet community develops. In my opinion, it's healthy for us to not take things ''too'' seriously, or we turn into a bunch of elitists. (If anyone in the history of anything has ever needed a collective wedgie, it's Wikipedia's editing community.) Anyway, as there are currently two "Predictions" topics on this Talk page, I think I'll take the rest of the year off, until it comes time to speculate about the DVD-movie and season four. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 14:19, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

==the commercial==

hey the commercial has anders voice syaing "yeah we're cylons" WTF --[[User:Snorkel378|Snorkel378]] 21:07, 19 March 2007 (CDT)Snorkel378
:I don't know whose voice it is, but the line is definitely "It's true, we're Cylons". -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 02:12, 20 March 2007 (CDT)
:At first, I thought it was Anders speaking, just because his face appeared at the same moment. {{spoilli|On subsequent viewing, I think it's...drum roll...Chief Tyrol!}} --[[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 12:26, 21 March 2007 (CDT)
::Read the thing linked below. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:41, 21 March 2007 (CDT)

==Predictions-part 2==

I was surfing on the internet, trying to find some spoilers (lol) for the 3rd season finale, and came across this baby: http://www.thetvremote.com/battlestar-galactica-season-finale-spoilers/ (huge spoilers, so don t go there if u don t wanna read em). So, the text reveals who are the 4 of the final 5. As we already know, without the websites help, some of the final five are living and working in the colonial fleet. The 4 that are in question have a past, and we even saw a few times their memories, and we know that they lived in the colonies for quite some time. That being said, the website isn’t really convincing. But then, we know that the final five are special. We don t know what they are, we could suppose that they are more than the other cylon models, much more. We could even think that they are some sort of gods, now that too being said, I can t help but to think that those final 5, being special could have been planted in the colonies before the attacks of the miniseries. There is also a thing about Starbuck and a thing about finding earth on the website. I don t know what are their sources but the text seems very interesting and gives some very interesting ideas. {{unsigned|DedMed}}

:Many of the spoilers fit with what occurred in "Crossroads, Part II," but it brings up many new questions, too. If true, the information completely wrecks or substantially modifies what we thought Cylons were and when they came about. It should be an interesting episode, to say the least. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 10:39, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

::HOLY FRAKKIN FRAK! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:54, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

:::The spoilers from part 1 were correct, adding some credibility. The really shocking part is that one of the alledged final five was around during the Cylon War (yes, you heard it right, the [[Galactica (RDM)|Galactica]] is a Cylon, I'm surprised no one made the connection when we've known that she has at least a dozen copies since the miniseries :D). -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 23:27, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

::I kind of wish I hadn't read them, but I couldn't help myself. Goddamit! --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 12:26, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Goddamnit is exactly the word. ''Goddamnit!'' --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 15:03, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I took my comments about the spoliers out... but just so you know. if that link is true... and it's implied in the video teaser for this episode. I'm starting to see the show in shark infested waters. But I imagine everything is not what it seems. Especially with my homedog Col. Tigh. If he really is (spolier)... then I'm gonna start to lose interest in BSG for real. But honestly I think that is all a "misunderstanding" or perhaps some link to the final five... who I insist are NOT CYLONS! --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 19:58, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

I'm sorry I can't resist posting again. Ok, the final Five, as I stated are not Cylons but are a third faction, some ancient group probably five prophets who orchestrated all of this. It's the only way I can deal with this: I will not be happy if certain persons are in actuality certain entities. Especially people who have been around too long, who lived before the first cylon attack. Sigh... I guess the Caprica TV show will possibly delve into it... but dammit, that show better be frakking good. This show is going too far into paranormal and starting to suffer from hollywood interference. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 20:23, 22 March 2007 (CDT)
:Dude... They're kinda definitionally cylons. They say there're 12 models. We've seen 7. There are 5 more. The Final Five. Done and done. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:28, 22 March 2007 (CDT)

No offense, but I do believe we have enough reason to totally disregard that conclusion. Firstly, and might I add, perfectly timed, the main page has a link to "Who is a cylon", with a website, blog, and a nice canon explanation of who is and likely is not a Cylon. Saul Tigh... Whom I call "The Tigh Dog"... but who is known also as "The Tigh Fighter" (YES!) can't possibly BE a cylon. And why? Just as I stated, he's been known by Adama for too long (at least prior to the FIRST war). Second, this leads to my speculation from the talk on Crossroads Part 1... Even if these guys are the Final Five... they still aren't cylons. The Final Five are not Cylons. That's what I have been suspecting ever since the Oracle gave prophecy to Biers... ever since The Hybrid gave prophecy to Baltar. That's when I remembered Shelly from "Six Degrees of Seperation". Tigh is so not a cylon. If Tigh is a cylon... I mean really a cylon... this show has jumped the shark. Yes I'm sure they THINK they are Cylons, just like the Cylons THINK the final five are Cylons. But Tigh is not a Cylon. As far as the Final five go, maybe he is, maybe not. The Final Five are perhaps a third... NON CYLON... faction, closely related to the oracles, the prophecies, and what not. Possibly some disgruntled 13th tribe members that wanted to get revenge... who knows... but NOT CYLONS! --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 21:04, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
:*sigh* Twelve Cylon Models. 7 have been seen. Five not. The Final Five. THE FINAL FIVE UNREVEALED CYLONS!!! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 21:07, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
:: I'm with you, BB... Final five will be revealed Sunday. Can't wait to see who, though I already suspect at least four of 'em. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 21:18, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
::: 4 of 5, and then it'll be the... hmm... damn... can't think of a word starting with O to go with One... --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 22:58, 23 March 2007 (CDT)
::::Only? Obfuscated? Omega? As for the Tigh rumor, it's plausible that humanoid Cylons date back to the war (they could've discovered a 2000 year old data archive, developed the technology themselves with a Cylon-constructed supercomputer). The term "Cylon" hasn't really been defined, if "Cylon" just means "artificial humanoid" or "self-aware artificial life form" then the Final Five could predate the [[Cylon Centurion|Centurions]] and still be Cylons. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 01:16, 24 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::Yeah! The Only One! --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 15:38, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Aw, come on guys. Firstly, you're buying into the notion that the Cylons are nearly omniscent. Isn't it probable that the Cylons themselves have been mislead? In addition, this stuff about Cylon models being created thousands of years ago makes no sense. There are only 12 models they know of. The encephalitus disease that knocked out a whole basestar of Cylons should debunk that long shot. If we are going to split hairs on what a Cylon is... then we need to reconsider who created them in the first place. I believe the 13th tribe left a faction, most likely the priesthood, behind. That priesthood wanted to fulfill some destiny or resolve some unresolved issue in the distant future and they were the invisible hand behind the first cylon war and the cause behind the Cylon visions (projections), the cylon rebirthing, and other spriritual technologies the Cylons have. In addition I believe the final five are actually the original five prophets that the Cylons mistakenly believe are "cylons". Even if I am wrong about that, to simply dismiss Tigh as a Cylon for the reasons above makes no sense. I bet during the fourth season the so called "revelation" that Tigh, Anders, and the others being cylons will turn out to be a Cylon (or Prophetic) hoax. And this... is where I think Six Degrees of Seperation will play a role. "What happened to Shelly"? She never really left, she has been manipulating things on the ship. It's a long shot, but I'm going to wait it out and see. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 21:34, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Here is my theory on the whole "Tigh is a Cylon" thing, Tigh (and the others) are NOT the Final Five Cylons (they will initally think that they are but are mistaken). They will discover that they are descendants of the Final Five models who intermarried with humans back on Kobol and that the "Final Five" were the first cylons who were created by "the Jealous God" (who is also the God worshiped by The Seven we have seen so far). Which will still leave room for Starbuck to be one of the Final Five. I have to admit that a lot of this is comming just from instinct and my imagination but it would make a lot more sense than Tigh being a Cylon since from what we have already heard that the Cylons are immortal (and is safe to assume that they DO NOT AGE, which Tigh would have done since the First Cylon War 40 years ago). [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 22:05, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

:: EXACTLY! See? Someone else understands what I have been trying to say, although I don't think the writers will put the jealous god angle in that way (but maybe they will). But I agree almost entiely with what you are saying. I just think the final five are some leftovers of the 13th tribe... Wait. I just realized something. The 13th tribe left and there was some war between the "gods" right? What if, the 13th tribe didn't leave on good terms with the other 12? Now if we can fit the Shelly angle into this, I will feel much better. Six degrees still hangs like a disowned child. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 23:54, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

:Why is it safe to assume that the humanoid Cylons do not age? Their physiology is close enough to that of regular humans to allow crossbreeding. Old age wouldn't be a problem, as they could just get resurrected in younger, more recently glown replacement bodies when they die of old age. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 23:44, 24 March 2007 (CDT)

Maybe a growing and aging body function interfers with the ressurrection ability. Exact copies, thus perfectly aligned brainwave patterns to reinsert into the new body. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 23:56, 24 March 2007 (CDT)
:Who says they have brainwaves? [[Silica pathways]], remember? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 00:32, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::So Tigh can't be a Cylon because Cylons don't age, Cylons don't age because ageing would interfere with the resurrection process, and we know that ageing would interfere with the resurrection process because there needs to be some reason for the Cylons not to age? This is a clear circular logic fallacy. There is '''no canonical evidence''' which rules the possibility of Cylons ageing. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 00:43, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::Point taken, but it would seem strange that the Cylons would neglect ageing when they went about making themselves into an IMPROVED version of Human. It would be an inconveinence for a cylon to be dying of old age and ressurecting in what would be (from their point of view) a constant stream for all time. Why is the idea that they found a way around that so strange to you? [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 00:57, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::All I'm saying is that there is currently no evidence for or against Cylon ageing, no evidence about whether or not Cylons have the technology for eternal youth and no conclusive proof that they would or would not use such technology if they had it. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 02:05, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::Agreed. To be honest, I feel the Cylons ''have'' to age, though it may be slower than your normal human. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 08:20, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::::Slowed ageing would explain why [[Hera Agathon]] doesn't seem to walk or talk even though she's about two years old now (although she could be walking and talking off-screen). -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 09:03, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
:::::::But to me it just doesn't seem to fit for something that is machine in origin to age, it throws the aesthetics off drastically. [[User:Mishakal|Mishakal]] 15:10, 25 March 2007 (CDT)
::::::::But they're no longer ''mechanical'' machines. They are more biological. Upon becoming human, which they effectively are, they have demonstrated becoming susceptible to a disease. Thus, with all that, they simply ''have'' to age, as any biologist worth their salt would tell you. The question of how quickly they age is another matter. (Which, as Gordon Ecker pointed out, is a very good reason why Hera hasn't aged so much as she should have. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 15:46, 25 March 2007 (CDT)

No. Cylons don't age because we see them in the ressurrection ship, and being ressurrected in the same exact age. You saw all of the copies of Sharon and six, not one was "younger" or "older". There has been no age variants (and im specifically pointing out scenes from the Cylon perspective, taking the "keep it a secret" response pointless. There is no cylon aging process. They are manufactured, not grown. If they age, it's from the time they are manufactured. Remember this goes back to a discussion about Saul Tigh. He ages normally. But here is a bigger piece of info I have to offer. Saul, Anders, and Tyrol never became succeptible to the encephalitis virus. That alone should end all of this nonsense. Humans are immune to it. Cylons are not. Saul Tigh being a cylon? If so, then the show has jumped... no... done a double reverse backflip over a whole school of sharks. If Saul is a Cylon (and if the final five are actually the bad guy cylon type of cylons) then I am done with this show. So I prefer to give the whole fourth season a chance to redefine "cylon" as Moore has stated. What is a cylon? Who cares. All I know is that the "final five"... if SAUL TIGH is irrefutably one... are some Earth-based 13th tribe faction that is somehow manipulating all of this, for some reason. Either that or they were bugged into thinking they are cylons. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:23, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Actually, ''everything'' ages and deteriorates. Aging is just that, a form of deterioration. To be honest, and getting back to reality, it's really a conceit on the part of the show, since they all use the same actor. Also, just because an older copy of a Sharon exists doesn't mean that the older Sharon must download into an older body. Take the instance of a hard drive: information from an older hard drive can be downloaded into a newer hard drive, without changing the actual data. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:53, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

== Runtime ==

Anyone care to adjust the runtime due to the fact that this episode came out only 2 minutes longer as opposed to the reported 5? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 01:53, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

== Podcast ==

Is it just me, or is there no podcast? Or did SciFi update it this morning and I just haven't checked yet? --[[User:Starsmore|Starsmore]] 12:39, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

: Well, it took SciFi until Tuesday morning to make this episode available on iTunes. So this doesn't surprise me. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 17:42, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

== Assumed to be Cylons? ==

Why is it assumed that Tyrol, Tigh, Foster and Anders are the final five (well, most of the final five)? Ok, so they _suspect_ that they are, but there's nothing concrete in my opinion. That's them simply rationalising why they all met.
It sounds a lot more of a lame idea now I've written it down, but there it is. [[User:FredTheDeadHead|FredTheDeadHead]] 14:35, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
: Ron Moore has confirmed they were Cylons in a press interview [http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm here]. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 15:36, 27 March 2007 (CDT)
::Also, in that same interview, Moore said that once they got to a certain point in space, the four of them became aware of the fact that they are Cylons. That means that they don't just ''suspect'' that they are Cylons, they ''know'' that they are. Tyrol even mentioned a switch that went off in their heads when they became aware of being Cylons. [[User:Dark Claw|Dark Claw]] 15:56, 27 March 2007 (CDT)

All four of our so called cylons were on New Caprica. And guess what... while we are all here trying to convince ourselves they are cylons, we fail to consider that they were bugged by the cylons. I have no doubt at some point all of them were put in jail or "processed" by the cylons at SOME point (even if a small bit of time). Someone, probably Cavil's line, biologically bugged them, and like the Olympic Carrier, made them beacons for the cylons to follow. Buzzz Buzzz, I hear music. I never heard it until after we all left New Caprica. I'll take a cylon biological experiment over cylons aging and a 40 year cylon model. And remember, I even made a point that if they are the "final five" then the "final" five are actually the "first" five. Which means they are either fooling the cylons or are not cylons. But I choose to believe these "final five" were bugged. And the Final Five certainly aren't cylons either way. Sorry Ron, I'm not falling for your double bluff --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:18, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Oh and another thing to remmeber, someone pointed out how the other cylons aren't even aware of these "cylons" right? Well... if they aren't humans being bugged... then why and how else is the cylon fleet able to track them? And why aren't these final five participating in any of the dreams that Roslin gets to have with Six and Athena? I am telling you, the final five are not cylons. I think Roslin and Starbuck are the final five, but these other four are just the first to be "Frak'd" (pun on Punk'd). One last time, making it clear: Anders, Tyrol, Tory, and TIGH are unwitting guinea pigs that were bugged with some undetectable biological tracking device by the cylons while on New Caprica. They bugged them in their sleep, they did it while they were in prison. The Cylons don't know about the final five, or who they are... so the Cylons can't possibly be following a signal sent by people they do not know. --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:36, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
:I don't necessarily see it like that Rather, I see it in that while they might be Cylons, that does not make them '''Cylons'''. Or, to put it another way, as Tigh succinctly put it: "Whatever else I am, whatever else it means, that's the man I want to be. And if I die today, that's the man I'll be." Silica pathways, nanite bloodcells, whatever - they, like Sharon Agathon (and maybe Caprica Six) have chosen to rise above their natures and embrace humanity; the exact opposite of Sharon Valerii. They aspire to be more than they are (or what they fear they are), and that is what defines them (at least in one sense) as human, regardless of the outcome.

:Which makes me curious: with Baltar's earlier Cylon detector, he discovered Boomer was a Cylon. While he gave everyone else a "clean bill of health", surely he'd have had to scan at least one of the four (Anders being the obvious exception) at one time or another. Why, assuming that he did, didn't their natures show up then?--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 00:42, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: As Caprica-Six explains in Crossroads, Part I, the Cylon fleet has been following the unique radiation leakage from the tylium refinery. Secondly, there is no evidence one way or the other that the four of them were ever "bugged", or even if the Cylons have that kind of technology. Also, the "Significant Seven" and "Final Five" actually parallel (to an extent) the Titans and the Olympians from Greek mythology, and given much of the Greek underpinnings of the series, I find this easily more believable than the Cylons taking a page out of Scorpius's manual and shoving a neural transponder in their heads, or some such. I would elaborate further, but again this isn't the place to discuss that. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:10, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Someone is going to reply that the final five aren't designed like the other seven, and that will explain the cylon detector, the encephalitis virus, and the cylons' inability to recognize them. What it won't explain is the lack of visionary, oracle, and prophetic relevance of these newly revealed final-frauds. The Final Five at the very least should be involved in the prophecies, have some interactions on a spiritual or psychic level (either via the oracles or via the visions), and should have some connection to the priesthood. Here is what happened. The cylon "phone home" bug became active when Tyrol was close to the Eye of Jupiter. The Cylons have some link to the prophecies. But remember, Cavil said that it would take them a longer time to find Earth without the prophecies. So the final five are either not helping or not cognizant regarding them. Ok, I'm done. By the way, where can one post about this stuff, if posting here is inappropriate? --[[User:Baltarstar|Baltarstar]] 00:56, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Tyrol, Tigh and Anders did not board the base ship. Also, Tigh was not XO during this incident as he was pretty much drinking himself in a stupor at that time. Tyrol is a NCO, so he wouldn't have any contact with the Cylons transferred from the baseship, and (from what can be inferred from the episode) the Colonials used quarantine procedures to transfer the boarding party to sickbay (so this removes him from being exposed that way as well). And Anders has no reason (or access) to the Cylon prisoners retrieved from the infected basestar. Also, clearly, the Significant Seven don't know who the Final Five are (consciously speaking), hence D'anna's search.

: As for the best place to discuss this, I would recommend a bulletin board, like Ragnar Anchorage or Scifi.com. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 06:10, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

== Song title ==

I'd just like someone who knows to put up the title of the Dylan song. Thx.--[[User:飞机|飞机]] 02:42, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
:It's All Along the Watchtower, but I'm having trouble making edits right now. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 04:14, 28 March 2007 (CDT)
::I just added it to the page. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 04:22, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

Can we post the lyrics without a copyright violation? There are some lines in the song that are certainly significant.

Oh, and regarding the arguments on this board about the finale...I think you're missing the real point, which is the fact that Bob Dylan is a Cylon. We should throw him out the airlock.-- [[User:Dallan007|Dallan007]] 18:24, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Very funny. ;-) However, the lyrics are posted on [[The Music|the page for "ze musak"]]. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:32, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

::Hey, I didn't say anything about the fact that Tory sings the line "I can't get no relief" while's she's in the ''bathroom''! I know it's significant!

:::Actually, they all four say a line from the song (although thanks...Tory's was the one I missed). I think this is worthy of being added to the signifcant quotes and the notes sections. I'll do it if everyone agrees. (I need to go back and pull them in context). BTW Joe, I like your "ze music" although it's awfully close to Dr. Zee. Something you wanna tell us? I guess I shouldn't speculate on what Joe knows. What is it when you speculate on stuff on a discussion page -- wikiwanking?--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 17:41, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

Stopping now... [[User:Dallan007|Dallan007]] 22:08, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

OK...I need some help regarding my statement above. All four of them, towards the end of the episode and in succession, recite the first verse, starting with Tyrol's "There must be some way out of here" and finishing with Tory's "I can't get no relief." This is NOT what I was referring to above. Two of the four (not three like a stated above) say lines from the song in conversational context. (see the quotes section of this article to see the exact quotes--I posted them). What I need help with is I find it odd the writers would have Anders and Tigh do this, but not Tory and Tyrol. But for the life of me I cannot find where they do it. I've watched the episode over and over again, but am worried I'm stil missing it. Anyone wanna take a crack at seeing if either of them do it? I even went back and skimmed [[Crossroads, Part 1]], but had no luck.--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:06, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

::Ok one correction...sort of. Tyrol, when talkng to Anders says a partial line: "Way outta here." I'm not sure this counts though becasue A.) He was actually referring to the lyrics. The other two were said as part of a different discussion. and B.) It's a partial line. I'm not sure if this qualifies or not.--[[User:RUSnooky|RUSnooky]] 21:11, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

I'd be interested to know who covers this version of the song. I've been looking around for this specific version and I can't find it. Anyone know? --[[User:Jamziz|Jamziz]] 06:27, 31 March 07 (UTC)
:I found the answer to my question, it's the band BT4. You can find their blog here [http://www.bearmccreary.com/html/blog/blogmain.htm BT4 Blog] or you can visit their [http://www.bt4online.com/ Main Page] --[[User:Jamziz|Jamziz]] 19:15, 31 March 2007 (CDT)

== Saul Tigh, Monotheist ==

I think there's a significant bit of Noteworthy Dialogue that should be added to the main page. In the scene where the four "new" Cylons meet, right after they hum a few bars of "All Along the Watchtower," Tigh shouts, "That's enough, God damn it!" What's significant about this line is that Tigh switches to a singular deity rather than his usual plural for this particular expletive, thereby cementing the fact that he really is a full-blown, monotheistic Cylon. [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 18:45, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

: Actually, it's really not ''that'' significant ... The Colonials have gone back and forth using the plural and singular forms various times. It might be worthy of a note at least, but the use of "God" by Tigh in this instance isn't all that damning. -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 19:35, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

::In a polytheistic society, using a reference to a single, unspecified god as an expletive could theoretically be considered less sacrilegious than using the name of a specific god. The Christian references can be written off as [[Wikipedia:minced oath|minced oaths]], but that's pretty far into [[Wikipedia:No-Prize|No-Prize]] territory. -- [[User:Gordon Ecker|Gordon Ecker]] 20:12, 28 March 2007 (CDT)

The discussion and dissection is moot anyway because he says "god''s''damnit". Both me and the closed caption hear it. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 01:32, 29 March 2007 (CDT)

: Well, you're right. I listened to it again and the plural is there. [[User:Paulmooreparks|Metalnose]] 07:13, 29 March 2007 (CDT)
::Ive seen the whole episode twice and the last 10 minutes about 4 times. He clearly said god'''s'''. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 15:39, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

== Removed analysis ==

*Tigh states that if he dies today, he will be remembered as a human officer of the fleet and a patriot. But if death for the Final Five is similar to that of the other humanoid cylon models, if he dies he will be downloaded into a new body, surrounded by cylons intending to manipulate him to their side or box his consciousness, and should he ever come in contact with those who knew him as a human they would instantly regard him as a cylon and therefore an enemy.
<s>**Maybe not. The Cylons don't even know what the [[Final Five]] look like so I doubt that they'd have new bodies for them to download into. The only one who knew one of the [[Number Three]]s ended up [[boxed]] along with her entire model line.</s>

I removed the struck bullet point because
# it's not written in encyclopedic language, but in "I think", "I doubt", etc. language
# the parent bullet point says "'''if''' death for the Final Five is similar to that of the other humanoid Cylon models..."

If you think there's some information in the removed bullet point you can merge into the parent one while being encyclopedic and not redundant, feel free to do so. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]]([[User talk:Catrope|Talk to me]] or [[Special:Emailuser/Catrope|e-mail me]]) 07:10, 30 March 2007 (CDT)

== The 5th ==

Don't read if you don't want to see any spoilers.

I was watcihng some BSG bloops/gags on the google video. And at some point Starbuck says that she's a cylon and that she is going to die at the end of the sason.
''Battlestar Galactica: Season 3 Gag Reel'' is the name of the video (details : Sci Fi Channel
13 min 1 sec - Jan 5, 2007 ). She says that around : 2m 47s.
Please if someone could verify that, and say if that is a genuine comment that she made. [[User:DedMed|DedMed]] 20:45, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

: It was a joke... -- [[User:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|Joe Beaudoin]] [[User talk:Joe Beaudoin Jr.|So say we all]] - [[Battlestar Wiki:Site support|Donate]] 20:48, 14 April 2007 (CDT)

: Yeah thought so too, but the thing that is puzzling me is that she said that she is going to die well before that episode and we know how she wanst supposed to do that. Having in mind that that part of her ''interview'' carried out, it might be logical to conclude that the other part could be true as well. Kinda explains her appearance at the end of Crossroads. Nevertheless i can't deny the fact that all of this is under the atmosphere of a joke, and that..well...probably is a joke. [[User:DedMed|DedMed]] 06:05, 15 April 2007 (CDT)

Talk:Crossroads, Part II/Archive1

2007-04-15T01:45:28Z

DedMed:

Talk:Crossroads, Part II/Archive1

2007-03-20T13:03:35Z

DedMed:

Talk:The Eye of Jupiter/Archive3

2007-01-28T18:35:48Z

DedMed:

I wonder if it has to do with that big red spot... *rollseyes* --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:48, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

I'm more reminded of that Writer's Podcast thing, you know when they're saying "How many more times are we going to find an artifact like the Arrow of Apollo and have to search for them all? That feels like going back to the well too many times, I mean what are we going to say, "Athena has 10 sacred toenail clipping scattered across space, you have to find them all...?" :) --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 18:49, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
:i'm thinking along the lines of some jewelry. --[[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:57, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

::It sounds like a good plotline actually. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 19:05, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
:::Merv - you just made me spill forth mein coca cola whilst reading the section about the sacred toenail clippings - thats too much for 3am on a sunday morning! Still, plot looks good, just wish Season 3 would hurry up and AIR dammit! :) --[[User:Fordsierra4x4|Fordsierra4x4]] 21:08, 29 July 2006 (CDT)
::::No, really, they make a joke about "Athena's toenail clippings" in that writer's podcast thing. --[[User:The Merovingian|The Merovingian]] ([[Special:Contributions/The Merovingian|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/The Merovingian|E]]) 21:12, 29 July 2006 (CDT)

I have a few possible meanings for 'eye of Jupiter' --[[User:starryniteynite|starryniteynite]]

1) Relatively obscure name for NGC 3242, a planetary nebula (A ring of illuminated gas expanding out from a sun-like star that's exhausted its fuel, and has lost its outer layers) a few thousand light years from Earth. Most astronomers call this 'the Ghost of Jupiter' instead, though some Hubble images have used this name. Its not a very unique PN (tho it has some gas streamers we can't quite explain), but it could be used as a navigational marker like M8 (the lagoon nebula). It is a very pretty nebula :)

2) "Eye of Jupiter" was the Greek/Roman name for the sun, which lead to today's 'all seeing eye' symbol of the free masons and on the pyramid in US currency

3)Adama=Zeus=Jupiter...yes, they tend to use Greek vs. Roman names, but the titles are not always consistent with this convention, and we have also seen evidence for non Greek mythological names (Isis, for example). The rest of it could be wordplay too...'eye' might refer to someone acting as Adama's eyes, rather than his eyes literally (just as 'The captain's hand refereed to Lee acting as Gardner's XO, or his hand, rather than some captain's literal hand)

4)A reference to Jupiter's big red spot, a huge hurricane-like storm on the planet's surface. Just like the "bastille Day" title, this could reference something in the episode, but not directly...they might travel through a similar storm. This has actually been done before in the miniseries, when Galactica travels into the storm at Ragnar

5) The tried and true, ancient object meaning...just like the arrow of Apollo directly references a character, but has no link to the character himself, this could just be a pretty piece of bling..

Personally, I would love #1, but only because it'd make me 2/2 for BSG objects in my thesis and I'm a total, unabashed geek. I think its probably #2, however, and they find some sort of navigational means of finding Earth (like a picture of Earth w/ distances& directions to three pulsars or very unique objects

== Duelling Sharons ==

So did anyone else get a sense of animosity/jealousy between the two Sharons? While it seems that Boomer has accepted her place amongst the Cylons and no longer considers herself a part of the humans, it also seems that she's a bit jealous of Athena's "taking her place", if you could call it that. Likewise, it also seemed that aside from her duties as a Colonial officer, Athena's refusal to let Boomer in with Adama was also somewhat out of personal distrust, ironically the same distrust of the Cylons that her fellow Colonial colleagues have.

Also, while Boomer told Athena about Hera's condition out of possible concern of the child (possible strain of humanity left in her? Cylon imperative? Or something else?), seems to me that Boomer enjoyed bursting her "sister"'s bubble on that. Talk about sibling rivalry there.

It'll be interesting to see if there will be any further Sharon vs. Sharon confrontations in the series.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 23:55, 15 December 2006 (CST)

:It was a very, very interesting dynamic. In any other show, we would have had a knock-down dragout "catfight." You hit the nail on the head. This episode was prime stuff. And, we on the wiki should be commended: our ''Galactica'' nuke count is right on the money! (Either that, or the show is using ''us'' as a source! :) --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 00:20, 16 December 2006 (CST)

::Does that mean we can finally change the "Class-D Nuclear Warhead" to something completely different, since their nukes ''aren't'' Class-D? :P --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:42, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Image==
Let's find an image that actually occurs in this episode. Maybe the wide shot of Tyrol in the temple? --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 02:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)

Heh which one? to me it seems the Chief was a bit wide in ALL shots ; how could he gain weight while the fleet was starving? the chief definitely deserves the Lee Adama Fat-Ass trophy --[[User:Lordmutt|lordmutt]] 03:10, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:Maybe it was Chief, and not Dr. Cottle, that got all of Kat's energy bars from the last ep.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 12:25, 16 December 2006 (CST)

So... is someone with the means actually going to replace the image with one relevant to this episode? --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 21:12, 20 December 2006 (CST)

:Silly joking aside, I agree that the picture should be replaced. I'd do it, but I don't have a good screencap --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 17:34, 23 December 2006 (CST)

:I happen to have the episode, so, it's done. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 23:57, 23 December 2006 (CST)

::Well, I still see a thumbnail of the old image here and there (e.g. on the main page or on Mercifull's user page). -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 18:09, 27 December 2006 (CST)

:::You may need to purge your browser's image cache to see the new image. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 00:12, 28 December 2006 (CST)

::::I've just purged my Maxthon's image cache a moment ago and I still see an old thumbnail. Tried that also with Opera and Firefox -- all the same. -- [[User:Spike|Spike]] 04:27, 28 December 2006 (CST)

==Did Starbuck survive?==
Horray for the carelessness of adverts! Within ten minutes we knew the answer to that one. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:14, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Aside from that, it's going to continue the cycle of Soap Opera unease there, if Dee's the one sent to go get Starbuck back. Can't wait to see the uncomfortable stares on that one, especially if (as I suspect) Dee set up Starbuck to be the "eye in the sky" '''hoping''' the Cylons would shoot her down.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 11:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Who else was supposed to fly the mission? Looks like Lee and Kara are the only two qualified pilots on the ground and Lee is needed in overall command. --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 12:34, 16 December 2006 (CST)

==Nuking the Planet==

Does anyone else think that the nuclear missiles have the ability to be detonated remotely, before they reach their target? --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 10:44, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Not to mention abort code transmissions, etc. Makes you wonder if the missiles were set for "one shot, one kill" mode, where they could not be recalled.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 11:39, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Or perhaps the missiles can be aborted, until they reach a critical flight time. Could make for a ''very'' tense moment or two. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:51, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:Is it just me or didn't he actually give the order to fire. He said "release of nuclear weapons is now authorized". That might sound strange, but I took that to be a preliminary order to firing. For example that now even Tigh would be able to launch them on his say --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 15:03, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::No, you're correct on that; essentially all they were doing was opening the "barn doors". I was discussing the hypotheticals of the missiles, if they should be launched in the next ep.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 19:33, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:::Aye, we're just jumping the gun a little, and discussing possibles ways out of it, if Adama does indeed decide to launch :) --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 02:17, 21 December 2006 (CST)

::::Am I the only one who thinks he might be targeting the nukes for the Raiders on their way to the surface? --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 18:53, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:::::Then why this-
:::::'''Adama''':Load target package three-bravo. Set ground zero for the underground structure.
::::: -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 19:19, 29 December 2006 (CST)

:::::: Damn, I missed that. Consider me stumped, then. -[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 05:17, 30 December 2006 (CST)

I watched the episode for the first time last night. I had this theory after the show ended...If the star of this system is going to go supernova, as Gaeta has described,

("Gaeta: Could be tomorrow. Could be next year. There's no way of knowing for sure, sir. When it does happen, the only warning that we're likely to get is a fast helium flash, at which point we'll have to jump out of here before it obliterates the entire planetary system. Sir, I am not one to look for religious signs. But I can't get my head around these odds. That human and Cylon both converge on this planet at this exact moment just as the star's about to go supernova…")

there most likely is an abundance of solar phenomena being emitted from the sun, maybe an increase of solar flares even. Solar flares have the "energy equivalent to a billion megatons, traveling normally at about 1 million km per hour"..."They produce electromagnetic radiation across the electromagnetic spectrum at all wavelengths from long-wave radio to the shortest wavelength gamma rays:(solar flare wiki ref.) I know that Solar Flares can disrupt electronics on and orbiting earth, and I'm sure Galactica's systems are somewhat protected from bursts of electromagnetic energy...but somehow I had the idea that the nukes are probably not as well insulated. Since there is so much solar activity in the region, I had the idea that maybe something like a flare (not the helium flash Gaeta talked about) would happen just as the nukes were launched..causing them to blow in the upper atmosphere directly over the temple. This would allow for quite a light show, and perhaps could allow that light shaft in the Temple of Five to be intensified. On the BaseStar with Baltar and Three, the Hybrid mentions something about "the five lights of the apocalypse" here:

"Hybrid: ...I don't care if it rains or freezes, as long as… the five lights of the apocalypse rising... sins revealed only to those who enter the temple, only to the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, the chosen one, end of line. Until next time … the eye, the eye, the eye, look into the eye to know thyself."

Maybe this is the way the temple is activated, maybe this is how the eye of Jupiter (Jupiter/Zeus/Adama's nukes) appears over the temple and activates the key...and Hey, maybe the solar flare would take care of the Heavy Rader flight systems too...Who knows, just an idea I had wished to share.

"Chief: And the heavens opened up, and they saw the Eye. But where is that frakking Eye?"

--[[User:Gallion|Gallion]] 10:08, 3 January 2007 (CST)

:Holy crap that's a good theory. Wow. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 12:06, 3 January 2007 (CST)
:Nice theory indeed. Maybe the five lights of the apocalypse are actually five nukes? Nukes would qualify as lights of apocalypse, but then so would a supernova. Also, I revisited the Hybrid's prophecy: ("Find the hand that lies in the shadow of the light, in the eye of the husband of the eye of the cow"). The light is most likely the bright star cluster (although it could also be the nukes, the supernova or the helium flash), but "in the shadow" hasn't really been explained properly. Now I just realized that since the temple is an underground structure, it would be in the shadow all the time. Might be something, might not be something, we'll see. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 13:47, 3 January 2007 (CST)

== WTF moment ==

I was on the [[Karl Agathon]] page, updating it for this ep's news, when I came across [[:Image:Valley_of_Darkness-Starbuck_Helo.jpg|this old picture]]. Considering how Kara's painting looks and that she's religious (though not indoctrinated in any sort of clerical form, unlike Chief Tyrol's parentage), does anyone think that (in hindsight), this may have been a hint to the Eye itself?--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 12:37, 16 December 2006 (CST)
: It actually makes a lot of sense... Taking Zeus to mean Admiral Adama, and that Kara Thrace is the go-to pilot for reconnaissance missions, AND the paintings on the walls, we have a plausible theory in the works! —The preceding '''unsigned''' comment was added by {{User|Alcibiades}}.
: Are you kidding me?! They set this episode up a year ago! --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 19:39, 16 December 2006 (CST)
: I find it pretty hard to believe too, but that painting ''really really really'' looks like the art in the temple. --[[User:Saforrest|Saforrest]] 20:41, 16 December 2006 (CST)
::Maybe they though it would be a nice idea to take that painting, put it in the Temple more than a season later, and see if we notice. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:20, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::It's a painting in her room and part of the column in the temple. :) --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:31, 19 December 2006 (CST)
: So Starbuck is an artist. She paints The Eye of Jupiter. Is it a known symbol or is this the first time anyone else has seen it? If it's not well-known, what does that say about Starbuck? Doesn't it make her prescient? Maybe her true calling is as an oracle. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:29, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::I'm with Catrope here. If I'm remembering my "Valley Of Darkness" podcast correctly, Tahmoh and Katee painted the apartment themselves, without any direction from Ron or the rest of the show crew. It's quite possible that someone noticed that particular pattern and decided to make it significant. And, hey, maybe she ''is'' an Oracle who just hasn't realized that she has the gift. Give the girl some chamalla and see what she can do. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Starbuck found a spiritual calling to fill the enormous gaps in her soul that she tries to fill with sex, booze, speed, duty, and violence. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 13:33, 19 December 2006 (CST)
:A friend of mine told me he though the painting and the decoration looked a lot like a star or an explosion, and then brought up the word "supernova". Could this picture be some sort of reference to the star going supernova? (I must admit I'm contradicting myself here, because I said earlier I thought the similarity to be some sort of an inside joke. Of course it's possible that Sackhoff&Penikett accidentally painted something that looked like an explosion, and that's why the writers chose that particular painting.) --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:36, 22 December 2006 (CST)
::I've updated the [[Cylon agent speculation]] article on Thrace's entry with the two pictures in question. This is not a coincidence; there is some connection, but we have to wait to know what. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 15:45, 12 January 2007 (CST)
Well it turns out Mitsukai was right, and a lot of others were not!--[[User:Alcibiades|Alcibiades]] 05:43, 23 January 2007 (CST)
:Mitsukai was right, brilliantly found indeed, but don't forget about me and my friend :P (see comment above). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 07:30, 23 January 2007 (CST)
::Catrope, you were dead on. Ron Moore confirms on the podcast that Sackhoff painted it on the set and the writers, looking at that shoot sometime during the writing of this episode, decided to incorporate it. It's kind of scary how the parts fit together so neatly even though they ARE coming up with stuff by the seat of their pants. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 01:37, 24 January 2007 (CST)
:::Aye it is. Don't forget that the entire Starbuck-storyline pretty much goes back to [[Flesh and Bone]], when [[Leoben]] says she's special and she has a pre-written destiny. In [[The Farm]], [[Caprica-Sharon]] repeats it, meaning that it's not some of Leoben's usual crap. And now we finally get a clue as to what he meant. It all fits perfectly, yet Season 1 and 2 can hardly have been written with this episode in mind. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 03:34, 24 January 2007 (CST)

== 18 Casualties & Relevance to "The Passage" ==

If 18 people were lost from '''The Passage''' episode, that means that 17 (at most) were aboard those two lost civilian ships, right? I'm only bringing this up to clarify what transpired — from that, and what we saw, the Raptors would pair up with a civilian ship, and that ship's passenger complement would be transferred onto ''Galactica'' (more heavily shielded, combat FTL drive) for the ferry run through the cluster. The civilian ship would then be crewed by an absolute bare minimum number of crewers. Then, when the group reached the other side of the cluster, the passengers would be transported back to their ships (if they survived the passage), the ships would remain at "Algae-planet", and ''Galactica'' would turn around and go back to the original side to repeat the cycle over again for a new group of civilian ships?

Am I reading/viewing this right? -- [[User:Hawke|Hawke]] 13:53, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:The ships were manned by skeleton crews. That was even mentioned in "The Passage" --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 14:01, 16 December 2006 (CST)

: Don't forget that 14 days have transpired. there could have been more births in the fleet. I just came up with the difference from the two episodes--[[User:Quig|Quig]] 16:10, 16 December 2006 (CST)

== Humanoid Cylons recognize each other on sight ==

While back on New Craprica, Number 3 knew right away that it was Sharon Agathon. Of course, who else would be trying to remove the ship's launch keys?

This episode, we see that Athena knew on sight that this Number Eight was Boomer. Interesting.

Can Cylons tell on sight which of the copies they are? It's already established that the bulletheads can't.

Note in last weeks episode, Baltar was able to pick The D'anna number three out of the hallway on sight, even though there is an identically dressed number three in the same hallway. [[User:Belay-down-your-burdens|Belay-down-your-burdens]] 16:50, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Those two instances do prove that they do recognize one another, which was hinted at in the "[[Cylon Agent]]" page. I guess now it's more than a hint. --[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 16:54, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:I thought it could be something like recognizing a computer by its IP address, y'know, like the Cylons are all tied into one network and they've got like a special ID code on that network. --[[User:BklynBruzer|BklynBruzer]] 05:45, 24 January 2007 (CST)

==Names of marines==
Has anyone heard (or seen in close captions) the names of the marines that were with Starbuck and Dualla? I know one of them is [[Fischer]], but the other three? I heard something like: Criggs, Verek, Ditko. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 17:43, 16 December 2006 (CST)

:According to the caption, it's Griggs and Varrick; the spelling/pronouncation of the third lad is anyone else's guess. For some reason, the closed caption for this episode doesn't pick up everything for me. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:48, 17 December 2006 (CST)

::OK, we know that it's [[Fischer]], [[Griggs]], [[Varrick]], [[Henick]] and [[Ditko]]. Since after she says "Henick and Ditko" the camera centers first on the black guy and then on the bald guy, can we assume that the first one is Henick and the latter one is Ditko, and the one in a hat is Griggs? It's conjectural, but looks reasonable to me and it would be nice to add pictures to their articles. [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 14:46, 22 December 2006 (CST)

== Location of the Eye? ==

At the end of the episode, Tyrol says something about "the sky will open, and the eye will be revealed." Did that make anyone else think of the star going nova? -- [[User:Benabik|Benabik]] 22:15, 16 December 2006 (CST)
:Good idea, but is it possible that such a "blowup" could be predicted in the sacred scrolls thousands of years ago? -- [[User:SuperMMX|SuperMMX]] 01:15, 17 December 2006 (CST)
::Why not? A race of humans capable of traveling from Kobol to Earth probably knows at least as much about stellar evolution as the Colonials [[User:Xenophon10k|Xenophon10k]] 07:39, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:: The [[Sacred Scrolls]] have so far contained information about [[Laura Roslin]] being sick, [[Sharon Agathon]] helping them to find the [[Tomb of Athena]], and more... In addition to various prophetic dreams... Sure, they could have predicted it. -- [[User:Benabik|Benabik]] 11:26, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:When Tyrol commented about blowing up the Temple, I already thought "What if the Eye is INSIDE the pillar and they have to blow it up to get it out?" But surely an explosion destroying the entire system would destroy the Eye as well? And if it didn't, the Eye would not be easy to find between the debris of an entire planet. But blowing up a pillar doesn't exactly qualify as "the sky will open"... Maybe it refers to blowing up the roof or something like that... --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:04, 17 December 2006 (CST)
:: Note the shaft of light streaming across the central pillar in the final scenes of the episode. Perhaps something will be revealed when it becomes centered upon the prominent symbol seen there. --[[User:Spidey3|Spidey3]] 12:29, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::That was the way my mind was working. --[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 14:39, 18 December 2006 (CST)
I believe that the Sky Opening Up will be the explosion of the nuclear weaponry activating or destroying something which will then reveal the Eye. --[[User:Teal Thanatos|Teal Thanatos]]

== Boomer in the brig? ==

Did Boomer get thrown in the galactica brig once Athena pointed her out? Was she allowed to return to the Basestars? [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 01:49, 17 December 2006 (CST)

I doubt it because they probably would have it done right there rather than holding her outside first. I'm sure they let her leave with the others and advised her not to let the door hit on the arse on the way out. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 09:46, 17 December 2006 (CST)

:Besides, the least thing they need on ''Galactica'' right now would be Boomer to break out of the brig, throw on a uniform and have a "Guess the Sharon" contest. Aside from that, I expect that kind of trite plotwork I just mentioned from lesser sci-fi series, not this one.--[[User:Mitsukai|み使い]] ''[[User_talk:Mitsukai|Mitsukai]]'' 19:37, 18 December 2006 (CST)

== Summary ==

We really need a longer summary up there, the only point it currently mentions is kind of random -_- --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:58, 17 December 2006 (CST)

== D'anna's search for the five vs. the Temple of Five ==

I haven't seen much discussion on the connection between "the five" Cylons and the Temple of the Five. Since the Temple was built by the 13th tribe, a connection doesn't seem likely in a conventional linear timeline; but like the painting in Starbuck's apartment, it's hard to dismiss as a mere coincidence.

Such a connection does, however, clear up some verisimilitude issues for me – namely, the rate at which the Cylon's biological technology advanced in relation to both Cylon and Colonial conventional technology.

In less than 40 years' time, the Cylons were able to develop the Cylon Agents – and in such a way that made indiscernable from humans – and all of the ressurection technology that went with it. Meanwhile, their conventional, mechanical technology hasn't made nearly the same leaps. And Colonial technology hasn't advanced much at all. Pegasus was a much more formidable vessel than Galactica, but only in terms of size and firepower. Technologically speaking, they weren't that dissimilar. Everyone's still using nuclear missles as their most advanced form of weaponry.

Clearly, the Cylons have had a little help. Now, with dual references to a group of five that must not be named, we're starting to get an idea of from where that help may have come.

I'm not sure how that jibes with the Cylon's monotheistic religion (also established within those 40 years), versus the Colonies' polytheism, but I'm sure Mr.Moore has it worked out.

How great it is to have a show with a fleshed out story line already established, as opposed to the "make it up as we go" approach to shows like Star Trek (all incarnations), X-Files and Lost over our last 40 years. {{unsigned|Tylonius}}

:To ''Battlestar's'' credit, it did take a while to flesh out the story from a viewer's perspective, but what we know is quite intriguing. Their God and the Colonial gods may be one and the same, and may change how the Cylons treat the Colonials and vice versa. I don't think the five faces will be all shown, but we might see one. And yes, it is good to enjoy a show that makes a greater effort to maintain a consistent storyline. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:01, 18 December 2006 (CST)

::Time may not be an issue. Remember the Colonial Scriptures are full of prophecies, it wouldn't be too farfetched to assume that the Temple of Five could've been constructed for something before it happened, for the purpose of making it happen in due time.

::The Five could do whatever releated them to the temple much like Roslin is directly related to finding the tomb Athena, even though she lived thousands of years after everything else was set.

::This is all speculation, of course, but oh well....--[[User:Sauron18|Sauron18]] 13:59, 19 December 2006 (CST)

:::The Final Five are directly connected to the Temple of Five: http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2006/12/one_of_the_cent.html -- [[User:Noneofyourbusiness|Noneofyourbusiness]] 16:16, 20 December 2006 (CST)

::::“Essentially the Temple of the Five is directly connected to the five Cylons we have not seen.” - RDM
::::I've been thinking about the ambiguous ''sins'' the [[Hybrid]] mentions, that appear to be in regards to the Five. My working theory is that the five priests who served "The One Who Cannot Be..." and the Five Cylon Models who served the Cylon God both committed the ''sin'' of Rebellion, and that both dieties they rebelled against are one and the same. I also (big leap now), think that Model One is among the Rebel Five. Being rebel ''Angels of God'' (as Virtual-Six refers to herself), that would make One the RDM-equivalent to TOS-Lucifer, now wouldn't it? Chief and first of the (from the cylon perspective) "fallen" angels (as opposed to speculation that One ''is'' the Cylon God) --[[User:Viperetto13|Viperetto13]] 02:16, 23 December 2006 (CST)

== Human Nicknames ==
I cropped the following from the episode summary. Nothing against either point, just taking it off until somebody can figure out how to reconcile it into a single level deep bullet point (or points).
Cropped text:
*This is the first time the Cylons use "human" names on the basestar when not speaking to Baltar. D'Anna is named by Caprica-Six and another Number Three. Cavil's name is used by D'Anna.
**It is possible that these names are nicknames for the Cylons who've been amongst the humans (much like Caprica-Six), but it could also be the writers weaseling out of coming up with numbers for Cavil, [[Leoben Conoy|Leoben]] and [[Simon]]. In ''[[The Passage]]'', D'Anna even mentions having a discussion with "one of the Simons".
Thanks. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 08:51, 18 December 2006 (CST)

Err how about:
*This episode marks the first time the Cylons use "human" names when not speaking to Baltar: Caprica-Six and another Three call D'Anna by her human name, who in turn uses Cavil's name. These could be nicknames for Cylons who've been living among humans (cf. [[Caprica-Six]]).
*Once again, the writers have dodged the issue of [[Cavil]]'s, [[Leoben Conoy|Leoben]]'s and [[Simon]]'s numbers. In "[[Torn]]", Caprica-Six says "The ones you know as Leoben...", in "[[The Passage]]" Number Three mentions having a discussion with "one of the Simons" and in this episode a Three simply calls one of the Cavils "Cavil".

Please correct my style here, I didn't know exactly how to quote/paraphrase things like "one of the Simons" etc. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 09:12, 18 December 2006 (CST)

:One bullet point might be enough if the second part is connected with a word like "thus". However we shouldn't use "weasling". It sounds too negative and critical where criticism isn't really needed. Maybe something like "dodging the issue" or "circumventing"? That means the same and isn't as POV.
:Btw: episode names aren't italicized, but put in quotation marks --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 10:12, 18 December 2006 (CST)

Edit first post, episode titles quoted instead of italicized, second bullet point reprashed and "weaseling" changed to "dodged".
I don't think joining the bullet points with "this" between them is going to make this any clearer. I also don't think it's necessary, as both points may be related but analyse different things (the remaining numbers vs. Cylon naming convention). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:28, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:I think the writers are working with established names for convenience. They may not want to create a number yet to not confuse some viewers or there may be a grand scheme of introducing more numbers later in the season or another season that involves the 5 unknown cylon models. They could be maintaining flexibility for themselves in this case. They also know that the people who care the most are us die-hard fans and they can drag us through the mud without giving us more info, but I don't think so with as generous and courteous as Ngarenn is on BW:OC.--[[User:Straycat0|Straycat0]] 11:10, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::It wouldn't be too hard to introduce a new number though. We've heard plenty of statements like "We Threes think we can't take the risk.", ideal statements to introduce new numbers with. Of course these numbers aren't a big deal, but die-hard fans tend to like to know these details. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 11:37, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::True. Though the more detail the introduce, the more chances they have to get it wrong. Even with the few model numbers we have revealed RDM sometimes has [[Podcast:The_Passage#Act_1|difficulty keeping them straight]], confusing the Eight's (Sharons) with the Three's (D'annas). Either way, we'll be here, documenting. I sometimes wonder if we're (the die-hard detail documenters) aren't his worst nightmares (if we even bothers thinking about us). --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 14:52, 18 December 2006 (CST)
::::I always thought it was a nice nod to buckaroo banzai where all the villains had the same first name. [[User:Azselendor|Azselendor]] 22:05, 18 December 2006 (CST)
:::I believe it would make sense that there is a plan with rolling out the remaining agent numbers. For example, whether or not "One" is one of the missing Five has a great deal of bearing on the development of the cylon narrative, and so would be kept quiet until the episode revealing that fact. If He/She is one of the missing Five, but "Two" is not, then Two's identity ([[Cavil]], [[Leoben]], or [[Simon]]) also has a great deal of bearing on the narrative. Cavil has been shown using some leverage on Three. He's got my money for being Two. I think One is with the missing Five.--[[User:Viperetto13|Viperetto13]] 22:58, 25 December 2006 (CST)

== Question on article ==

*When did [[Sharon Valerii|Boomer]] go over to the [[Cylons (RDM)|Cylons']] way of thinking? In this episode she clearly doesn't seem to think of herself as human anymore like she did in "[[Downloaded]]."
:I had assumed that by LDYB, II that the Cylons had gone over to Boomer and Caprica-Six's way of thinking, hence their (C-six and Boomer) sudden rise to power as well as the sudden Cylon cease-fire. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 11:24, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::I think it's been established that somewhere along the way she realized that humans and cylons can't mix, and I believe she says something to that effect in Rapture. Where exactly this revelation came I'm not sure, or my memory is lacking, but she has had a lot of shit happen to her. On the latest podcast, Moore says they cut a lot of story on the basestar with Caprica, Hera and Boomer's surliness towards Tyrol. --[[User:Galactageek|Galactageek]] 02:19, 25 January 2007 (CST)

== Hera ==

I cannot believe that Adm. Adama has apparently no idea what happened to Hera. He was involved in this discussion in [[Downloaded]]. He should knew that Hera and her foster mother moved to [[New Caprica]]. I am very surprised that he became so angry after Roslin told him that she kept the child in her school. --[[User:Akagi|Akagi]] 17:21, 19 December 2006 (CST)
:Adama and Roslin only agreed in "[[Downloaded]]" that Sharon cannot be allowesd raise the baby. Maybe he assumed/was told that Hera was killed by Cottle? [[User:Ausir|Ausir]] 17:34, 19 December 2006 (CST)
::That they concluded at the discussion that the child should be killed would fit with this episode events and Baltars look at the end of "Downloaded" when being chided by his internal six. However that option was mentioned onscreen and the entire tone of the conversation at that point makes it seem somewhat unlikely that this would been the final decision. Given that Baltar was never in on the adoption-plot (he apparently didn't know Hera was alive on New Caprica) and we now know Adama didn't know about it either the discussion outcome must have been either to kill the child or to postpone the decision (with Heras apparent death solving the problem). I'm quite willing to buy that Adama believed the child had died a natural death, given that complication in a hybrid between man and machine were to exspected. But I have troubles with Roslin doing it all behind Adamas back (why did she have to do that?) and Adama not making a decision whatever immediately (in Downloaded). [[User:Nevfennas|Nevfennas]] 17:40, 21 December 2006 (CST)

== Recent Summary Reorganization Problems ==

I'm normally OK about reorganization of a summary, but the recent one handled by SgtPayne creates more work and confusion. Links previously added are missing, conventions once there are missing, and the narrative flow of the summary is extremely confusing. Normally we can break up events by location (events on Galactica, basestars, planets) because they are mostly separate events that don't directly connect, but this episode has both Cylons and Colonial events occurring in response to each other and in "real-time." I am ''this close'' to rolling back the summary and adding edits made afterwards to restore both narrative flow and conventions, but I wanted comments from others first. As an admin I would just roll it back because of all the wikilinking and convention breakage, but it's more than that. Comments? --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:36, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:This is one that I might suggest we do "Act" reporting summary. So the events are intertwined. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 09:56, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::::I believe that's exactly what the summary contained before that infamous edit: a chronological report of the events in this episode. Since everything and everyone interacts with eachother and is at the same place, that would be a logical choice. --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 10:03, 20 December 2006 (CST) (I hate edit conflicts)
:I haven't checked it for style and links, but I agree that the summary should be chronological. Splitting up the locations is fine if they aren't related. But as you said, here they are heavily interwined and dependent on each other --[[User:Serenity|Serenity]] 09:57, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:'''Revert.''' It looked better the way it was. The new split makes for a very confusing read. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 11:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)

I have reverted the article and restored relevant edits made after that reorganization. One persistant edit that I keep changing involves the "shaft of light" in the Temple as Tyrol is inspecting the symbology in the Temple. That "shaft" is Tyrol's flashlight beam. While that direct light ''might'' do something unexpected as it approaches the central target-shaped symbol, it's not coming from some mystic source within the structure. I've clarified this in the article. Contributors are always free to edit it, but its fairly clear, so analysis should be used to interpret what it might do. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 11:48, 20 December 2006 (CST)

In light of the recent reversion, I should drop my two cents in regarding the "reorganization". When I first read the article, I felt that it was too "narrative" rather than "summary", which is what the section suggests. The consolidation was an attempt to make the information as concise as possible. I also attempted to keep as many reference links as necessary. In regards to the location split, this was done in line with previous articles, which had definitive locations. My apologies if it confused readers, but it should be said that summaries are just that, and should not be play-by-play accounts of the episode. --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 12:18, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:The location split you introduced is good practice when there are multiple storylines that do not interfere with eachother. A nice example of that is "[[You Can't Go Home Again]]". In most episodes this is the case (end s1-begin s2 even had 3 or 4 separate storylines), but in this particular episode the three locations affect eachother so greatly that the split you introduced makes for extemely confusing reading: a bullet point in the basestar story references events told in the Galactica part, and viceverse. (Let's not even start about the Algae Planet part). --[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 12:45, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::You bring up a good point. In trying to put it together, there were some areas where I wasn't sure where to put it. On the whole, I was looking to clean it up a bit. Trying to read it line-for-line blurs out after a while... --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 14:22, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:::I've broken up the summary into acts. It seems to solve both problems. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 18:24, 20 December 2006 (CST)
::::aye. nice job. [[User:Shane|Shane]] ([[User_Talk:Shane|T]] - [[Special:Contributions/Shane|C]] - [[Special:Editcount/Shane|E]]) 18:34, 20 December 2006 (CST)
:::::I concur. It definitely cleans up the look of the page. --[[User:Sgtpayne|Sgtpayne]] 22:55, 20 December 2006 (CST)

==Missile Tubes==
Where exactly are they and shouldnt that be an article in "Galactica Areas" Snorkel378

:They are located on the dorsal side of the ship, slightly forward of the four guns ahead of the Colonial seal, and sit in two rows of six. And sure, why not create an article in that section? -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 19:12, 29 December 2006 (CST)

== More Nested Analysis ==
*The [[tylium]] planned for the mines could only come from their single Raptor. This supports the [[Substances in the Re-imagined Series#The Tylium Question|high energy yield of the fuel]] that, at the same time, would not sacrifice the Raptor's flight ability.
**It's also possible that the tylium used was fuel stored at the camp to power its generators and/or refuel the Raptors and other ships involved in the harvest.
Please resolve these into either one or two single-level bullets, then re-add to the article. --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:56, 21 December 2006 (CST)
:Done. I also updated the nuke count in this section. Admiral Adama orders launch tubes four through ten loaded, which means he's prepared seven nuclear warheads, not six. --[[User:Slander|Slander]] 09:05, 22 December 2006 (CST)
::Nicely done. Thanks! --[[User:Steelviper|Steelviper]] 09:51, 22 December 2006 (CST)

Major Point:
Note that Hera is the wife of Roman God Jupiter, the derivative of the Greek Zeus. {{unsigned|PhoenixFlight}}
:Yes, Hera's counterpart in the Roman pantheon is Juno. The association is noted over many episodes to date. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 14:22, 6 January 2007 (CST)

== Playing with the date? ==

In Kobol's Last Gleaming, they stated the ruins on Kobol were 2000 years old, "around the time of the exodus of the 13 tribes". When they found the beacon at the Lion's Head Nebula, they said it was 3000 years old, and now they're saying the Temple of Five is at least 4000 years old. Each time they give a new date a thousand years earlier, it seems to still coincide with the exodus date of the thirteenth tribe.

Am I the only one noticing this inconsistancy?

: My memory may be off, but I was under the impression that the 13th tribe left Kobol long before the other twelve. So... maybe the 13th tribe left 4k years ago, and the rest left 2k years later. Fanwankery? Spotty memory on my part? --[[User:Drumstick|Drumstick]] 02:08, 25 December 2006 (CST)

::Both, sort of. The date in "Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I" refers to all thirteen tribes collectively. In "A Measure of Salvation" and "The Eye of Jupiter", they refer to the thirteenth tribe alone.
::'''Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part I'''
:::Roslin: How old are the ruins?
:::Billy: We won't know for sure until they send a ground team, but the initial estimates have it on the order of approximately 2,000 years.
:::Elosha: That's around the time the thirteen tribes first left Kobol
::'''A Measure of Salvation'''
:::Adama: According to Cottle, the virus was an exact match to one reported over 3,000 years ago. Right around the time that the Thirteenth Colony left Kobol.
::'''The Eye of Jupiter'''
:::Tyrol: Our initial radiocarbon dating suggests that the temple's at least 4,000 years old, which lines up with the exodus of the Thirteenth Tribe.
::--[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 03:16, 26 December 2006 (CST)

:::Here's a thought. What if this isn't an accident? We've speculated already that humanity might have emigrated from Earth to Kobol before the thirteenth tribe returned. If the further away from Kobol we get, the older the artifacts we find, what does that tell us? That the thirteenth tribe was traveling not from Kobol to Earth, but from Earth to Kobol. --[[User:Peter Farago|Peter Farago]] 06:03, 28 December 2006 (CST)

::::Well, it may not be an accident, but the Colonials seem to think that the 13th tribe left Kobol for Earth. So why, upon finding that the artifacts get older as they journey further from Kobol/closer to Earth, would they conclude that the dating analysis confirms their scriptures? Put another way, if they dates say the tribe went from Earth to Kobol, but the scriptures say they went from Kobol to Earth, why aren't the Colonials confused? It's an interesting idea, nonetheless. --[[User:Drumstick|Drumstick]] 19:29, 31 December 2006 (CST)

:::::Okay, it could also be that we're giving the Colonials too much credit in their dating. Elosha is a priest. Maybe her date of 2,000 is based on scripture, not fact. Also, the date of 4,000 could just mean that it predates the time that they knew the other 12 colonies left Kobol, thus it had to be built by the 13th tribe. The 13th tribe may have had outposts all throughout the galaxy while still calling Kobol home. Furthermore, since there are apparently 21,000 years of recorded history, maybe to the Colonials a few thousand years of inaccuracy in dating don't really make a difference. You could compare it to modern day humans who confuse the 15th and 16th centuries. Of course, now I'm fully in the territory of fanwanking/making up excuses. The seven months/nine months disparity with regard to the Colonial election was never even acknowledged, so there is a good possibility these inconsistent dates are just a product of sloppiness. --[[User:Drumstick|Drumstick]] 19:40, 31 December 2006 (CST)

Nut we Don't know how long it took to get everyone from earth off of kobol because it would take awhile to get huge civilizations away from a planet.Snorkel378

== Dichotomy of Signs to Earth==

I find it rather interesting that the first real sign to Earth that they found was a satellite/probe (first found by the Cylons). This would represent the high tech sign-post to Earth. The second sign to Earth is this hidden "Temple of Five" which is plainly a spiritual sign. Anyone else thing this is very interesting? I wonder what was on the satellite. Too bad RDM didn't allow them to examine it. [[User:Bstone|Bstone]] 21:57, 26 December 2006 (CST)

==The G-4==
Hey how come in the summary it doesnt mention the G-4 about to go off right by Tyrol? Snorkel378

:*Unaware how events are escalating around and above him, Chief Tyrol illuminates the carved writings of the Temple with his flashlight and reads the inscriptions, trying to locate the actual resting place of the Eye. At one point, his flashlight's beam moves close to the target-shaped symbol in the center of the central spire.
:How about we make that:
:*Having strapped explosives to the central spire of the temple, Chief Tyrol...
:--[[User:Catrope|Catrope]] 06:17, 31 December 2006 (CST)

No I mean the activation light on 1 of the explosives is blinking which means it is going to detonate.The article does not mention that.
Snorkel378
:There is nothing to suggest that the blinking lights don't simply mean that it is armed rather than about to explode. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]])

Yes but the music can easily tell u what is happening and it has a danger coming sound to it-Snorkel378
:Thats fanwanking. We have seen nothing to suggest that the explosives are about to detonate. All we know is that the explosives are armed and the flashing light could simply be to note that fact. You may very well be right but so far there has been no aired information to say that you are and until the next episode airs we wont know. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:24, 3 January 2007 (CST)

You are right I geuss im some crazy kid huh :) Snorkel378

:The explosives set by Tyrol and Anders in Occupation have a light that blinks, but the explosives only go off when the detonator is activated. The light is in no way indicative of and impending explosion -[[User:Madbrood|Madbrood]] 15:51, 12 January 2007 (CST)

== Last name in the credits ==

Okay, after a month, I think I finally found the last remaining actor/character in the closing credits. Thanks to the inane sense of necessity in scrunching the credits (so they can apparently advertise the same things they do 23 times a day in normal commerical airtime) I was unable to read the last name, getting the first two through squinting and deduction. I skimmed one last time and believe I found the last, unreadable name. According to
[http://www.thelogbook.com/logbook/series/battlestar-galactica-new/newgalactica-season-3/page/2/ this site] it's [[Tygh Runyan]] as Pvt. [[Byers]]. I looked at the guy at IMDb and although he's not given the credit (no surprise), he ''can'' be spotted in the episode. Even [http://tv.yahoo.com/battlestar-galactica/show/the-eye-of-jupiter-part-1/episode/111786/castcrew Tv.Yahoo], a considerably more reliable source, has him listed (sans character name). Any disagreement in adding him? I'm sure someone here has clear visual access to the credit, but I'm going through a consensus since it hasn't been added by said "someone". --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 00:04, 16 January 2007 (CST)
:Do you have a screenshot for us to look at? Might be best to wait for it to air in HD then it will be much clearer. Alternatively ask on the [[Battlestar Wiki:Official Communiques]] page. --[[User:Mercifull|Mercifull]] ([[User talk:Mercifull|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Mercifull|Contribs]]) 03:27, 16 January 2007 (CST)
:: TYoJ Will be airing in HD over here in a few weeks, not sure about America though. [[User:MatthewFenton|MatthewFenton]] 03:32, 16 January 2007 (CST)
:::I have the iTunes copy of this: I've confirmed the same names and spelling. Do we know where he is (on the planet?). That would be enough to make a stub. --[[User:Spencerian|Spencerian]] 09:23, 16 January 2007 (CST)
I've only spotted him in one scene. It's at the start of Act 4 when Anders is dividing them up into two teams. He is among those Sam is talking to, wearing a cap and at one point, he's given an entire frame (with Anders' shoulder in the foreground). He appears mainly in a shot where he is at the very left, with Lee, Barolay, and Anders to his right. I hope that paints a good enough picture since I'm unable to get a screencap. --[[User:Mars|Mars]] 13:59, 16 January 2007 (CST)

== Music ==

Could some1 tell me what was that ''song'' at the end of the episode. There were no lyrics, just music, and it was a really good choice, it shows nicely how the tension grows at the end.
Plz if u know what song it is write it... TNX ;)