Talk:Number Six/Archive 1

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Another Number Six[edit]

Wasn't there another Number Six encountered and killed by Starbuck in Kobol's Last Gleaming, Part II? --Blacklight

There are many copies, of course, and because they are identical, it is impossible to know if a specific copy was killed. Six is everywhere! Best to mention the copy only when they do something distinctive or have a specific identity in an episode, such as Godfrey and Gina, or Baltar's Six. Spencerian 21:43, 1 October 2005 (EDT)

Actually that was one of the "standard" "Caprican Overseer Models" as evidenced by her black jacket. ---Ricimer, 10 October, 2005

Notes move[edit]

Spencerian - I put the notes back in their old position based on the conversation Day and I had at Battlestar Wiki talk:Characters/Archive01#Layout in Humano-Cylon Articles. As I said there, there are many cases where notes, points of analysis, etc. may be applicable only to individual copies of a particular humano-cylon, or to the entire model line. If you disagree, please re-open the conversation on the Characters talk page.--Peter Farago 11:48, 10 October 2005 (EDT)

Done. See the page. Spencerian 12:14, 10 October 2005 (EDT)

The Many Deaths of Six[edit]

Just having some fun on the talk page here; but it's fun to think of just how many times and ways Six has died (after seeing the part that said "copies have been destroyed in several episodes). Number Six has been killed by methods including:

Blown up by a Basestar that attacked Armistice Station.
By broken glass from windows exploding inwards from the shockwave of a distant nuclear blast.
Shot in the back by another humanoid Cylon, Caprica-Sharon.
Pushed off of a ledge and impaled on debris by Starbuck.
Brained over the head with a fire extinguisher by Starbuck. (not necessarily causing death)
Vaporized by a detonating nuclear bomb she was sitting right next to.

To quote Third Rock From The Sun, "We just kept hitting it, and hitting it, but it just wouldn't die!". --Ricimer, 10 October, 2005

They Keep Killing Six. -- Noneofyourbusiness 21:59, 3 March 2007 (CST)

Was Six killed on the Arrow, or was she impaled on debris on the floor where they landed? I'm pretty sure it was NOT the Arrow...worth looking again. We don't know that the "extinguished" Six was killed, but she was certainly knocked out. Spencerian 12:26, 11 October 2005 (EDT)

She was not killed by the arrow at all. If you go back and look at the season finale, you will see that Six had a marine style "Ka-Bar" knife sticking out of her torso. IIRC, starbuck actually has the arrow in her hand. --Shogunmoon 12:45, 4 November 2005 (EST)

The Leobon and Doral general articles had the Death line filled. User:Noneofyourbusiness 16:11, 7 march 2006 (EST)

Baltar's Six[edit]

This is admittedly farfetched, but might it be possible that both Baltar and Caprica Six uploaded, at least partially, into each other's brain? In the series, it has been repeatedly stated that Cylon and Human physiology are nearly identical until you get down to the cells. Though Cylons have silica pathways in their brains, it might be possible they still store memories chemically (perhaps only digitizing them upon upload), using these pathways only for the digital transference of memory. So, if memories of both species are stored the same, then the very method of transmission Caprica Six used to upload her consciousness might have inadvertently brought along a bit of Gaius, while transmitting a bit of her into his mind. The cause for this transference might well be the nuclear blast that she blocked with her body. Adding plausibility to this theory is the fact that this time period is still vague, as well, as nothing is shown of how exactly her shielding of Baltar saved him so completely, that he emerges dazed but relatively intact near the raptor piloted by Sharon. Crazy sounding, I know, but I'd love to hear the other theories out there. -- Ravriem 23:47, 12 March 2006 (CST)

That's actually possible- there's one flaw, though: if parts of themselves were uploaded into the other, why don't they behave like the originals? Baltar-Six behaves nothing like Caprica-Six, and her Baltar is fairly different from the original. Ragestorm 08:01, 13 March 2006 (EST)

Good point. My only explanation would be that the entire personality didn't get uploaded. Perhaps only a portion, with certain key information or memories from the real Baltar and Six, that becomes incorporated into the subconcious and becomes a sort of Freudian gateway to their own inner doubts and fears. Granted, this becomes rather convoluted, but it still remains the only way I can see for both of them to be having this phenomenom without either of them knowing how or why. --Ravriem 17:03, 13 March 2006 (CST)

I guess you're right- unless they descide to twist this into a Count Iblis/Ship of Lights arc, and Six is actually a demoness (would that make Baltar the angel?). I'm sorry to sound if I keep trying to burst your ballon, but why wouldn't Six have figured out that's how Gaius got in her head? She would probably know a fair amount the process if she intended to employ it. Ragestorm 07:39, 14 March 2006 (EST)

About shielding Baltar - I think perhaps the blast was quite far away, and she merely shielded him from the shattering glass of his windows. If this is the case, the circumstances of caprica-six's "death" are still wide open. --Mitchy 15:24, 14 March 2006 (CST)

This could lead us to a major debate: the glass was part of it, but so was the shockwave. Because Six has at least twice the strength of a normal human, she prevented Baltar from being thrown thrown through the wall and killed. The real mystery is what happened to her body... we should move this to the "Caprica-Six" talk page. Ragestorm 17:18, 14 March 2006 (EST)

One last note: so far as why she wouldn't know about it if she was the one who employed the method, I don't think she meant for it to happen, which is why she is so confused as well. Also, going to the blast, she seemed to have died instantly in the blast judging by her reaction at rebirth. If she were killed like that, how did she manage to stay upright to shield Baltar, anyway? And a shockwave of that force...I'm not a nuclear scientist, but wouldn't it still carry considerable radiation? The whole sequence is one of the most puzzling to me, so far...and I still believe that is the precise moment when this swapping of pseudo-personalities occurred.--Ravriem 00:34, 15 March 2006 (CST)

Well, it's definetly the most likely theory we've got so far. Again, we've got missing information (how far from Caprica City was Baltar's house, was is even near Caprica City? that might not have been a nuclear shockwave- even if it was, depending on distance, radiation would be negligible. Anyway, I think they want us to focus more on the question, "What the hell is Baltar-Six?" than "How EXACTLY did Caprica-Six die?" my policy is, if the actor doesn't obsess about it, fans shouldn't loss sleep over it. (Though making us wait till October is just plain sadistic- I'll have to move back to Britain this summer and see if SkyOne's airing them sooner...) :-P Ragestorm 07:43, 15 March 2006 (EST)

Natasi?[edit]

I've heard that "Natasi" is the name used in the mini-series novilization. However has the name been used anywhere else other than that? If so, we should be careful in the name's use... Otherwise I would make a note of it in the "Notes" section, but wouldn't introduce the name into the main article... Comments, questions or concerns anyone? -- Joe Beaudoin 14:04, 9 December 2005 (EST)

The fact that somebody had to comment on how it was pronounced ("Carver stated that he pronounces "Natasi" as "Nuh-TAH-see", though fans could really pronounce it any way they want.") would lead me to believe that it hadn't been spoken onscreen. Otherwise, it would be pretty evident. --Steelviper 14:13, 9 December 2005 (EST)

I'm the one that originally reported this here (I asked the question on GalacticaStation), and I don't think we should put it EVERYWHERE. All I wanted was a little footnote at the end of the "Baltar's original Six" entry. I don't think it should be casually used to refer to her; it's just a fun anecdote. --Ricimer 15:09, 9 December 2005 (EST)

I don't mind using it where relevant (and cited), as long as nothing contradicts it. It stands to reason that Baltar didn't spend two years calling her "Hey you, with the platinum hair in the miniskirt." I wonder if "Epiphanies" will shed any light on this. --Peter Farago 15:18, 9 December 2005 (EST)

I always figured he called her Sex-Bot 9000. ;) --Day 16:03, 9 December 2005 (EST)

According to James Callis in his Sci-Fi Magazine interview, what Baltar was initially calling her was something more like "Oh, gods! Oh...gods! Oh! My! GODS!" Seriously, however, since it appears in an official novelization, we could allow it, with suitable caveat that this is not aired content. --Spencerian 16:10, 9 December 2005 (EST)

Merv, please explain your objection to this. I see no problem with the use of that term until it's explicitly contracted on-screen. Is this the case as of "Downloaded"? --Peter Farago 22:27, 24 February 2006 (EST)

....I...did say, in the summary box on the dit; sorry, communication must remain short; just doing in im bursts at commercials more later.--The Merovingian 22:35, 24 February 2006 (EST)

Kuralyov is explaining the situation to me on Talk:Caprica Six.

Gina's Rank on Pegasus[edit]

Wouldn't it be fair to say that if Gina was eating in the same mess as Cain, that she was an officer? --Peter Farago 02:27, 7 January 2006 (EST)

I got the idea that it was a communal mess that everyone ate in. Cain would have probably eaten with the crew to improve the loyalty and comraderie between herself and the crew. Gina was probably just a civilian draftee like Laird that probably lied her way onto the Pegasus, claiming to have skills good enough to get her off the doomed ship that she used to be on. But then again, if Gina was an officer on Pegasus, that would make the betrayal even deeper, leading to her extremely harsh punishment.--Ltcrashdown 02:32, 7 January 2006 (EST)

According to the spoilers released before the episode, she was a civilian dockworker. The same spoilers mentioned Pegasus' unhooked computers as the reason it escaped the virus. Since that information is purported to be in the full-length Pegasus episode on the upcoming full-Season Two DVD, Gina's status may be on the DVD as well.--Noneofyourbusiness 13:07, 5 April 2006 (EST)

Sara?[edit]

I am going back over the episodes to scan them for this, but I distinctly remember Baltar referring to Number Six as "Sara", and it appears clearly in the closed captioning/subtitles. Has anyone else caught this? --ThesposAZ 16:47, 15 January 2006 (EST)

When? --Peter Farago 02:06, 16 January 2006 (EST)

It's in Home, Part II, when Baltar's Six is telling him he's crazy. Right after she explains he created her when his mind snapped over the guilt of helping the Cylons massacre humanity. According to the subtitles, he replies, "Well, I don't know what game you're playing anymore. But I'm not playing this stupid game, Sara. Now you've had your fun." However, I don't think the subtitles are right. His mouth moves slightly into shadow during "Sara" but it looks and sounds more like he says "...this stupid game, so, uh, now you've had your fun". Emrys 00:24, 14 August 2006 (CDT)

He does call her Sara in the subtitles. Not sure why. It might be a typo mistake in the subtitles or something because it sounds like he ends the sentence with "so... uhh" not "Sara". Can anyone confirm the name? CylonSpy 19:12, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

It's a mistake. --Sauron18 21:37, 22 April 2007 (CDT)

Shelly Godfrey[edit]

According to http://german.about.com/library/blvornamen05.htm the name "Godfrey" is listed as English related to Old German "Gottfried", meaning "God's peace". I wasn't certain how acceptible this was as a source, so I didn't make an edit, but I thought I would at least leave an answer for the Citation Jihad. --Corvus 07:26, 26 January 2006 (EST)

Why has the link to the Shelly article been removed from this page?--Noneofyourbusiness 22:49, 7 April 2006 (EST)

You yourself personally deleted it on March 20. --The Merovingian ^{(C - E)} 21:53, 7 April 2006 (CDT)

I did no such thing! --Noneofyourbusiness 0:07, 8 April 2006 (EST)

Caprica Six Separation?[edit]

I think it may be time to give Caprica Six her own article, since her character is even more developed than Shelley Godfrey or Gina who have their own. We now know more about her fate. We should, however, leave Mental Six in this article, with the standard sixes, or perhaps open a new article called "Cylon Related Hallucinations" which might include The Mentals (Six and Baltar) and all hallucinations related to them.--Sauron18 25 February 2006

I created the Hallucinations article, it has a copy of all the text in the Internal-Six section. Should we now turn that section into a link to the article?--Noneofyourbusiness 15:45, 14 March 2006 (EST)

Pics[edit]

This article has a lot of pictures. I'm concerned that this may make it difficult for users with low bandwidth to view this page. I'm also concerned that it could be pushing the boundaries of "fair use". I'm also concerned that it looks cluttered. I have my settings so allow 300px width on non-width-specified thumbnails in articles. This makes many of the images push the text into a very narrow column in the center. I think part of this, at least, is due to the aspect ratios. I really, really support the idea that, aside from template pics (character or ship, etc.) or pics included to demonstrate some detail (like rank insignia or whatever), we should try to have all other pictures be non-cropped wide-screen formatted snaps directly from the show. I kind of wish you could make the settings control make whatever the longest dimension of an image is be 300px, rather than simply controlling the width. Alas, this isn't how it works. Anyway... I think we either need to remove pics to unclutter this page and/or get full-screen shots for all these images. What do others think? --Day ^{(Talk - Admin)} 23:31, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

I added all the pictures in order to brighten up the article. I didn't know that the amount of pictures can interfere with viewing. Noneofyourbusiness 16:53, 6 June 2006 (CDT)

Pictures make a picture friendly, removing them would make the article seem too mechanical. --Sauron18 17:07 June 06 2006

There is such a thing as too many pictures. We should talk about how many is too many. However, this should probably be discussed on S&C. I'll bring it up when I get back into town (Monday or so) if no one else has by then. --Day ^{(Talk - Admin)} 23:29, 6 June 2006 (CDT)

I concur with Day. I think that we either need to figure out which pictures we need to remove from the page, or reduce the width of the images themselves. (At a higher resolution, the article doesn't flow well.) -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate} 08:01, 7 June 2006 (CDT)

I've already removed the pictures that Day was talking about. The situation is resolved. Noneofyourbusiness 21:55, 8 June 2006 (CDT)

Main Image[edit]

I was thinking about this article a while back and then realized something, that while the main image is perfect, it doesn't really illustrate a "Number Six" Cylon, it is, after all, Baltar's Mental Six. Now, this wouldn't matter too much if all the Six looked like her, but then I realize that they don't, not one Six other than Baltar's imaginary one goes around dressed like a Supermodel, they've all got unsuggestive clothing and don't have the great variety of outfits the other one has.

So I was thinking if anyone else thought it might be idea if we try to find a relatively good counterpart for a main picture, that really illustrates how the standard Number Six Cylon is (Normally Pants-Shirt-Jacket). I know it may seem picky, but when you really think about it, Sixes don't walk around like models all the time (in fact rarely). I'll try to find some good candidates, but I also wanted peoples' opinion on this matter.

PS: If we do decide to change it, but don't find any candidates, we could simply wait for Season 3 Promotional Photography, since they're more than likely to include a Standard Looking Six. --Sauron18 18:21, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

Well I think we should keep the main one we're using now, as it's one of the promotional images the official site uses alot when they say "This is Number Six", so it's kind of generic and they think so. --The Merovingian ^{(C - E)} 18:52, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

I know, and the perfect one will probably come along when the Season 3 batch comes out, but it's sort of like with the Number 8 article, we don't just put Sharon there, we tried to find the most common trend in the model and illustrate it with a good image. Sometimes it doesn't matter, since the 1 Cylon we've seen is exactly like the others (Doral, Cavil, Leoben, etc...) but for a Six, which is a model described as "hard core" by the Cylons themeselves, the picture of a seductress in an elegant dress doesn't exactly illustrate the generic model.

I'm just pointing it out, and trying to find a good generic Six, but it won't be perfect until the new batch comes. -- Sauron18 19:38, 6 July 2006 (CDT)

Now that the Season 3 Promotional Photos have been released, I believe there is a very good picture that better illustrates the Number Six:

What do you think? --Sauron18 23:39, 29 August 2006 (CDT)

Nice. Maybe we should just do this for every one... umm.. no spoilers are really spoiled so I don't see why not. Any other comments on this? --Shane ^{(T - C - E)} 23:49, 29 August 2006 (CDT)

Well then, I shall place it as such. I also updated Caprica Sharon's Page, since we got her first Promo Image. --Sauron18 00:02, 30 August 2006 (CDT)

I wanted to point out that a new image of Number Six has been revealed in very high resolution here [1]. Nonetheless, I vote that we keep the current one, not only because it is a better pose but because it is conveys the overall character of the entire model a lot more than the other one.--Sauron18 18:37, 24 September 2006 (CDT)

We have just about all of the Season 3 promo shots from there here in Shane's gallery at the media BSwiki. I should know, I uploaded them :). They are 25% size to keep the size down but are still high res. --Talos 19:17, 24 September 2006 (CDT)

Not all of them, there are a bunch of portraits that are not there. Anyways, the Six portrait I'm talking about was released either today or yesterday, and it's good, but I am putting this notice that despite it being good, the current image is better for this article. --Sauron18 19:23, 24 September 2006 (CDT)

Yeah, I like the one here, it fits well and looks good. I vote we keep it. --Talos 19:28, 24 September 2006 (CDT)

What I did was, I put that image on the Caprica-Six article, as I think that image was more representative of Caprica-Six than Number Six as a whole. --DrBat 20:55, 29 September 2006 (CDT)

Actually it is quite more representative of the Model than it is of the specific Caprica-Six. The Pose and Costume convey the simplicity and agressiveness of the Sixes, they are militaristic, strong and beautiful. The other picture, the one of Baltar's Phantom Six is really not a good representation of the Sixes, despite being a good picture in itself (as I had said a few months back), and I believe that the Standard Six is very well represented by the current image. --Sauron18 02:42, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

What about this image?--DrBat 13:11, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

Look at the last point I made (right above our discussion) ;) It's the same problem: Though it's a great image, and a great representation of Mental Six, it isn't a fair representation of the model, which has constantly proven itself to be a lot more different than Baltar's illusion. --Sauron18 16:19, 30 September 2006 (CDT)

Greek Astrology with personality types[edit]

does anyone know if there is any connection between the numbers of the cylon agents, and the numbers that certain astrological signs represent (i.e. six represents virgo). Because if the cylons only had "the scriptures" to base the personalities on, then the personalities and traits of various astrological signs may be relivant. i dont know anything about astrology though Acitcratna 00:40, 06 October 2006 (AWST)

Well, RDM has stated that the 12 models are based uponn archetypes of humanity. It's like the Cylons looked at humanity and said "Well, if you break it down, there're really only 12 of you, and these are them." --BklynBruzer 11:15, 5 October 2006 (CDT)

By astrological logic, Three would be Gemini, Five would be Leo, Six would be Virgo, and Eight would be Scorpio, but I don't think their personalities really fit with that. Noneofyourbusiness 11:22, 5 October 2006 (CDT)

well, Three is kind of supported by: "Using their communicative skills, Geminis adapt to any situation they encounter. Geminis have clever tongues and develop an amazing ability to obscure the facts with stimulating and imaginative chatter." (Being a reporter and all), and valerii is kind of supported by: "Scorpios stubbornly cling to emotional attachments. They rarely forget or forgive emotional rejection." (falling in love), but i dont think ive seen six's: To deflect attention away from themselves, Virgos will also focus on other people by praising their talents and virtues, or by criticizing faulty behavior or personal imperfection."... emphasis on kind ofAcitcratna 00:50, 06 October 2006 (AWST)

Here's the interview quote I was looking for. --BklynBruzer 11:36, 5 October 2006 (CDT)

Raven-haired Six[edit]

I'm surprised there isn't an entry for "Raven-haired Six". --Steelviper 13:41, 9 November 2006 (CST)

Well, all she did was explain stuff and die, nothing major as far as character is concerned. We could, however, mention that Cylons don't always keep the same type of hair, as we now have 2 examples where they died their hair different. --Sauron18 15:49, 9 November 2006 (CST)

Public Face[edit]

Should it be mentioned that for viewers at least, Number Six is something like the public representation of what a Cylon Agent is? Commander Mazien 15:28, 22 December 2006 (CST)

Pic of Six beating Sharon.[edit]

Should we perhaps exchange that pic of Six kicking the crap out of Sharon? The only reason I'm saying this is because the background is clearly not part of the set. You can see a crew member's chair and some scaffolding......haha...-- Helo87

Main Image Revisited[edit]

Although I absolutely love the season 4 promotional photography, and I think it's certainly the batch of pictures in which she has looked the best, I'm not so sure that the Six shown accurately portrays the model itself.

My suggestion would be that we use the picture currently in use as the one for Head Six's section in "Virtual Beings", while we leave the picture that was previously there as the main image.

This is mainly because we've never really seen an Six actually wearing that dress, so unless we get other pictures with a more accurate costume I'd suggest we leave the Season 3 promotional crop. --Sauron18 05:20, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Sonja[edit]

Since Sonja has been elected to the new Quorum, that justifies her having her own section; no less so than Lida. I used the spelling "Sonja" as that appears to be the one used in media coverage relating to the episode Someone to Watch Over Me and the character herself. If a different spelling is used in an official source, please fix. 23skidoo 14:54, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree with you. Sonja should have her own page, in much the same way Gina does. The spelling of "Sonja" is correct. -- Joe Beaudoin ^{So say we all - Donate - Battlestar Pegasus} 18:04, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Character Arc[edit]

Okay, I use "character" loosely because it's obviously many characters, but they are similarities between the versions of the model, but I find the arc of the character to be fascinating. At the start of the series, Number Six was portrayed as arguably the most menacing of the Cylons. Among other things, different versions of Six snap a baby's neck, use sex to gain the information that led to the deaths of billions of humans, collude with Number 4 in the farms (a disturbing concept, by the way), beats the crap out of Starbuck, attempts to use sex to destroy Pegasus, taunts Gaius from within his head, and beats up Sharon Agathon (along with a Number 5) as part of a conspiracy to further the Cylon race.

As the series progresses, however, Six becomes one of the "good" Cylons. The entire line is one of the first to suggest co-existence with humanity (although that ends in disaster). The entire line shows concern for the "lesser" Cylons: the Raiders and the Centurions and eventually joins with the humans. One copy gives her life to save a human crewmate aboard Galactica.

We see other models take differing arcs: the Eights but they're change isn't a complete 180, the Twos but they seem less menacing to begin with and we see less of their redeeming qualities because we see less of them (not to mention, there seems to be more uncertainty about them), even Number One (although in the other direction). However, Six seems to be the most dramatic shift.

TheUnknown285 03:00, 3 November 2011 (EDT)